I asked our HR lady today how much I'm making! THIRTY BUCKS AND HOUR! Wow!!

[John Kuthe]

For training too!

:-)

John Kuthe...

[GM]

John Kuthe wrote:

> For training too!
>
> :-)


Did you try to sexually molest her...???

--
Best
Greg

[Alex]

Strange company you work for.  I've never had an employee ask how much
they were making after they were hired.  Congrats, if it's true.

[Hank Rogers]

I bet she was happy to see your smiling face and helped you
calculate your paycheck.

Keep up the good work. I'm so proud of you.

[Hank Rogers]

GM wrote:
> John Kuthe wrote:
>
>> For training too!
>>
>> :-)
>
>
> Did you try to sexually molest her...???
>

You're thinking of Popeye!

[Ed Pawlowski]

Sounds like a fair wage you can live comfortably on. . Hope it works
out long term.

[jmcquown]

I don't understand why he didn't ask how much they'd be paying him in
the first place.

Jill

[Bruce]

On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 19:40:36 -0400, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
wrote:

If it's a set wage, you already have a rough idea and you want the job
regardless of whether it pays a bit more or a bit less than your rough
idea...

[John Kuthe]

I told them I expected "nursing scale". They knew how much they'd pay, and I figured it was better than I was making before!

There is a LOT you don't know about Alex! A LOT!!

John Kuthe...

[John Kuthe]

It's hard work, but I'm used to hard work. As nothing worth doing is easy!

John Kuthe...

[John Kuthe]

Because I figured it would be better than I was getting before the job, which was only my rental income. I am NOT OBSESSED with MONEY the way most are!

Money is such a gosh subject after all.

John Kuthe...

[Hank Rogers]

Probably didn't care, as he badly needed it and would have taken
the job regardless of the pay.

[John Kuthe]

SHUT UP Sock Puppet!!

John Kuthe...

[Hank Rogers]

SHUT UP Lunatic!!

[Cindy Hamilton]

In any event, the pay rate is always discussed at the on-boarding
interview.

Cindy Hamilton

[Bruce]

On-boarding... I wish Americans would stop inventing new words where
they're not needed. Moving forward, that is.

[Sheldon Martin]

Potty training.

[Sheldon Martin]

On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 19:40:36 -0400, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
wrote:

It's a Chinese nursing home and the abacus was on vacation.

[Hank Rogers]

And I wish dutch-australians would stop whining about americans.

[John Kuthe]

NO IT'S NOT!! Assumer!

John Kuthe...

[Alex]

Never heard of that.

[Alex]

Your simple mind might think that, but you just posted that "They knew
how much they'd pay", but you didn't bother to ask until after you were
employed.  Very unconventional on your part and theirs.

[Bruce]

"I want that job. I roughly know what it pays. I want it regardless
whether it pays a bit less or a bit more."

Is that so strange?

[Alex]

The jury is out on that based on your own statements.

[Alex]

No, money is in capital letters in your subject line.  Now who is not
obsessed with money?

[Alex]

Yes it is.  You are the sole exception, as usual.

[Sheldon Martin]

Nothing strange... Kootchie is making a big to do over his precise pay
as a distraction, simply because he wasn't hired, if he was hired he'd
know what he'd be paid. Kootchie is as loser, he has no job, no one
would hire that loser. Rich, RICH Kootchie is becoming poorer by the
minute. Won't be too long Kootchie will be sleeping on the streets

[Bob]

In the trades you will get union scale no matter who you work for in
that region.

[GM]

I *strongly* suspect that this is the exact scenario...too many "gaps" re: the whole bit of how much he was/is supposedly being paid. I've been in employment services for many years and even the lowest - IQ person I've encountered knows how much their pay is, no matter how menial the job...and they know this well *before* they start the job...

I've placed plenty in health care, ALL health care jobs, either a direct hire or placed via an agency, apprise applicants first thing what the pay/benefits will be...

Also, for someone who thinks it's headline nooze when he farts, K00kie is not very forthcoming with his usual barrage of tedious details about this particular employment sitch...'cuz it does NOT exist...

All the points that Sheldon and myself have outlined are PROOF that K00kie is a bald - faced and pussy - mouthed FIBBER...

Pinocchio has *nothing* on K00kie...Kookie's LYING noze is so long that it will soon reach the very distant Andromeda Galaxy...the Hubble Deep Space Telescope is in fact TRACKING his most recent "I'm a NURSE!" fabulation...the astronomers at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena are in fact in a state of sheer CREDULATION at what they are witnessing...

We should send K00kie to Judge Judy, she could POUND his straw - filled noggin with her GAVEL...

<LOL>

--
Best
Greg

[GM]

Alex wrote:

> John Kuthe wrote:
> > On Thursday, June 11, 2020 at 6:21:09 AM UTC-5, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> >> On Wednesday, June 10, 2020 at 6:59:27 PM UTC-4, Alex wrote:
> >>> John Kuthe wrote:
> >>>> For training too!
> >>>>
> >>>> :-)
> >>>>
> >>>> John Kuthe...
> >>> Strange company you work for.  I've never had an employee ask how much
> >>> they were making after they were hired.  Congrats, if it's true.
> >> In any event, the pay rate is always discussed at the on-boarding
> >> interview.
> >>
> >> Cindy Hamilton
> > NO IT'S NOT!! Assumer!
> >
> > John Kuthe...
>
> Yes it is.  You are the sole exception, as usual.

I have to tell ya, I know some pretty sleazy employers, such as security firms (Monterrey Security in Chicago), Swissport (airport services company), many temp firms (actually more along the lines of the old "day labor" places) and they ALL disclose pay right up front (now *receiving* that pay may be another matter, lol)...

ALL health care positions will disclose pay/benefits right up front, it is a very competitive field...

Perhaps K00kie is with a place run by his old "CHEAP Chinese Landlord!", so the details may of course be more "muddied"...

<chuckle>

--
Best
Greg

[Hank Rogers]

Did you tell the HR lady about your student living center, and your
gasoline free nissan leaf? and your anarchist stuff?

You should ask her for a date. Invite her over for a cuppa plus.
She's probably even smarter than April.

[Hank Rogers]

Not at all. Hell, he would have taken the job at $5 an hour.

[Hank Rogers]

Ah, if only poor kuth were a Filipino, Popeye would hire him as his
#1 house boy. Popeye sure loves gnawing on pineapples.

[John Kuthe]

There is a LOT you've never heard of Alex, believe me! ;-)

John Kuthe...

[John Kuthe]

Cite or STFU!

I never said "They knew how much they'd pay".....or YES I did!! When THEY asked me the GAMING QUESTION how much *I* expected to make and I did not name a figure but merely said "Whatever nursing scale was" because I knew THEY had a figure in mind that they would pay me.

Confused enough yet?

John Kuthe...

[John Kuthe]

Precisely! :-)

John Kuthe...

[Hank Rogers]

Not confusing at all. You would have taken $5 an hour, and you
would have been lucky to get it.

I don't blame you a bit. Later, after you have a little time
showing you really can work the job, you can get a better paying
job. But for now, you are damn lucky to have any job, and you'd
best try to hang onto it.

It won't take too many failed jobs until you will never be able to
get another job.

Good luck.

[Hank Rogers]

Careful, don't back up or turn suddenly. You might break Druce's nose.

[Ed Pawlowski]

I took a job with no discussion of salary. Stayed there for 27 years.

The general manager where I worked at one time left and started his own
business. A year or two later he needed help for a couple of weeks and
asked me so I went there. At the end he paid me well. He knew what was
fair. A few months later he asked me to come on board and I agreed but
again, we did not discuss wages but it was a bit more than the last gig.

Would not have stayed if not properly compensated.

[Leo]

On 2020 Jun 11, , Ed Pawlowski wrote

> > ..
> I took a job with no discussion of salary. Stayed there for 27 years.
>
> The general manager where I worked at one time left and started his own
> business. A year or two later he needed help for a couple of weeks and
> asked me so I went there. At the end he paid me well. He knew what was
> fair. A few months later he asked me to come on board and I agreed but
> again, we did not discuss wages but it was a bit more than the last gig.
>
> Would not have stayed if not properly compensated.

We had a secretary, I’m sorry, administrative assistant, at a company I
worked for. It closed but her husband was an entrepreneur who saw value in
me. Since his wife knew my salary, he hired me at that wage. I worked for
him for twenty one years, and I never considered asking for a raise.
All I had to do was my best to keep the company growing, and my
compensation grew. It helped that he was a no-nonsense, straight-arrow who
worked harder than any of us to make the company successful.
Then he sold it. Then it was sold again. Then I quit.

leo

[Cindy Hamilton]

I have never had a job where I didn't get a piece of paper on my first
day of work, in the interview with either HR or my supervisor, where I
did not get a piece of paper that stated my pay rate. It's a standard
CYA for employers.

Cindy Hamilton

[Gary]

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> I have never had a job where I didn't get a piece of paper on my first
> day of work, in the interview with either HR or my supervisor, where I
> did not get a piece of paper that stated my pay rate. It's a standard
> CYA for employers.

One of my part time jobs (only when he gets overloaded and needs
a little extra help occasionally) is a no discussion thing
about my pay. He never offered a price and I've never asked
for one. Years ago, we were neighbors and friends.

He always needs the work done in 3-4 days.
If I'm available, I let him know immediately that I'll do it.
So far, I've always been available for it and I get it done
within 1-2 days. Including testing on my part to make sure
it's right. Simple graphics work and minor coding.

No pay ever discussed but he always pays immediately and
more than I would have asked for. I've got no complaints.

It sure beats the hell out of painting houses. :)

[Cindy Hamilton]

I'm not talking about that kind of informal labor. Kuthe's working
for a real corporation with actual procedures and policies.

Cindy Hamilton

[Gary]

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> I'm not talking about that kind of informal labor. Kuthe's working
> for a real corporation with actual procedures and policies.

I know what you're talking about.

In many blue-collar trades though, it's often informal hiring.
Usually someone just calls up at night and asks for a job
or they show up on a job site asking for one.

Natually, they are always the best "painter" in the world.
But that remains to be seen. I would always talk to them a
bit to get a feel for the person. If it sounds good, I'd
offer them just a day or two of work to see how they do.

I did have 2 in the past that said they would need to be
paid in cash as they are on disability and would lose it
if they were caught working. lol. Instant fail!

[Sheldon Martin]

On Fri, 12 Jun 2020 10:27:32 -0400, Gary <g.ma...@att.net> wrote:

>Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>> I'm not talking about that kind of informal labor. Kuthe's working
>> for a real corporation with actual procedures and policies.
>
>I know what you're talking about.
>
>In many blue-collar trades though,

I've never heard the term "blue-collar trades". To my knowlege all
trades are blue-collar by default... however they are either skilled
trades; plumber, semi skilled trades; painter, or unskilled trades;
janitorial. If someone is operating their own painting buisness they
are technically an Entrepreneur. An Entrepreneur of a painting
business needs to know all aspects of painting including how to
engineer and price the jobs, not just how to apply/schmear paints.
Most people who work as painters for some entity are told specifically
what to do and are supplied with the materials to use, they wouldn't
be making decisions about their assignments other than when to take a
bathroom break.
White collar jobs do not necessesarily indicate a measure of skill
other than knowing how to knot their tie... many clerks wear a white
shirt and tie and haven't graduated from high school. With factory
workers only the toolmakers got to wear white denim shop aprons, all
others wore dark blue denim; jeans material.
My first wife's father was a janitor in a large office building in
NYC's garment district. He traveled to work by subway and was dressed
to the nines in a fancy suit and carried an expensive attache case.
When he arrived at work he changed to ratty coveralls, his attache
case contained his lunch. At the end of his day he changed back into
his traveling outfit. He always refered to the building where he
mopped the floors as "My Building"... thought he was impressing his
friends and neighbors. Took me months to wise up to his nonsense. A
lot of people who work in big cities do likewise... to hear them talk
you'd think they were big time stock brokers earning million$.

>Usually someone just calls up at night and asks for a job
>or they show up on a job site asking for one.
>
>Natually, they are always the best "painter" in the world.
>But that remains to be seen. I would always talk to them a
>bit to get a feel for the person. If it sounds good, I'd
>offer them just a day or two of work to see how they do.
>
>I did have 2 in the past that said they would need to be
>paid in cash as they are on disability and would lose it
>if they were caught working. lol. Instant fail!

A lot of workers are very skilled, when they show up and actually
perform, many don't show up. Some applicants are obviously worthless.
I interviewed aplicants for a toolmakers position and handed them a
couple of brand new pencils to fill out the forms... some had no idea
how to use the crank pencil sharpener in plain sight attached to the
wall right in front of their face.

[dsi1]

On Wednesday, June 10, 2020 at 2:16:08 PM UTC-10, John Kuthe wrote:

> On Wednesday, June 10, 2020 at 5:59:27 PM UTC-5, Alex wrote:
> > John Kuthe wrote:
> > > For training too!
> > >
> > > :-)
> > >
> > > John Kuthe...
> >
> > Strange company you work for.  I've never had an employee ask how much
> > they were making after they were hired.  Congrats, if it's true.
>

> I told them I expected "nursing scale". They knew how much they'd pay, and I figured it was better than I was making before!
>
> There is a LOT you don't know about Alex! A LOT!!
>
> John Kuthe...

I've never been too concerned about how much a job paid either. More important to me was if I could do the job and if it was worth spending my time to work at the place.

[John Kuthe]

Exactly, and this new smaller place is up north closer to me, and I only need part time really, Just something reasonable being earned on a regular basis. So I can pay my share of my Rent+Utils too!

Sharing a house's cost is great! I've lived in several and now own one, so my house pays me something too!

John Kuthe...

John Kuthe...

[Sheldon Martin]

It seems like the particulars of Gary's jobs were like a knotted
shoelace... that's usual with a sole proriator especially with no
regular employees. All the jobs I had were for good sized companies
and many major corporations. All issued an employee hand book and
gave everything about pay in writing... some were union jobs and all
pay particulars were in a separate book with charts and pay grades,
nothing to guess about. If Kootch is working for a hospital, even a
small hospital, they issue a handbook with all pay particulars
listed... he has to know his pay rate and he'll find out govt
deductions with his first pay check, that's when they will do the math
after they know how many hours he worked.
I still suspect Kootchie is telling us a story, he has no job or he'd
not be faking it about how much he's being paid... why should things
be different now, Kootchis has ALWAYS told us fairytales. I've
worked more jobs than I can remember and I always knew my pay rate
immediately upon being hired but they can't tell you exact witholding
in advance because tax laws can change by the minute. You can only
know your exact net pay upon receiving your pay check... payroll
doesn't do that math until the last minute... what difference if
Kootchie's pay is 18¢ more or less... can't believe a word he says, I
don't.

[Sheldon Martin]

On Fri, 12 Jun 2020 Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
>I have never had a job where I didn't get a piece of paper on my first
>day of work, in the interview with either HR or my supervisor, where I
>did not get a piece of paper that stated my pay rate. It's a standard
>CYA for employers.
>
>Cindy Hamilton

Me too.

[John Kuthe]

On Wednesday, June 10, 2020 at 6:40:40 PM UTC-5, jmcquown wrote:
> On 6/10/2020 7:30 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

> > On 6/10/2020 6:18 PM, John Kuthe wrote:
> >> For training too!
> >>
> >> :-)
> >>
> >> John Kuthe...
> >>
> >

> > Sounds like a fair wage you can live comfortably on.  .  Hope it works
> > out long term.
>
> I don't understand why he didn't ask how much they'd be paying him in
> the first place.
>

> Jill

Because I really didn't care, just something more than nothing, which is what I was earning before.

John Kuthe...

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

Why didn't you apply at a fast-food restaurant working drive-thru then? At
least you would be in a place where you had the privilege of eating and the
hours would not have been that long.

[Bruce]

What a weird question. Maybe he prefers nursing work to fast food
work. Maybe he has experience in nursing. Maybe you're a busybody :)

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

I'm sure he does prefer nursing over any other job. But his preceding
attempts at agencies did not go well.

If he doesn't want 'busybodies,' including you as you saw fit to jump
into the conversation and add your 2¢, commenting he needs to keep his
personal business personal and not share details. Details that you love
to comment on, too. Of course, you'll come back you were 'defending'
John, but the fact remains you jumped into the conversation as well and
are just as much a busybody as anyone else.

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message news:e5o7efhgtm4fadne7...@4ax.com...

===

lol

[jmcquown]

On 6/12/2020 9:55 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Friday, June 12, 2020 at 9:19:23 AM UTC-4, Gary wrote:
>> Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>>> I have never had a job where I didn't get a piece of paper on my first
>>> day of work, in the interview with either HR or my supervisor, where I
>>> did not get a piece of paper that stated my pay rate. It's a standard
>>> CYA for employers.
>>
>> One of my part time jobs (only when he gets overloaded and needs
>> a little extra help occasionally) is a no discussion thing
>> about my pay. He never offered a price and I've never asked
>> for one. Years ago, we were neighbors and friends.
>

(snippage)

> I'm not talking about that kind of informal labor. Kuthe's working
> for a real corporation with actual procedures and policies.
>
> Cindy Hamilton
>

Gary's comparing apples and oranges again. Even in the kind of pick-up
job Gary is describing, I'd certainly ask what I was going to be paid.
If nothing else, to make sure it was worth my time. And to make sure
the person wasn't going to come back later and say hey, I thought you
were just helping me out because we were friends/neighbors. Those are
the kinds of informal job arrangements that wind up on Judge Judy. Heh.

Jill

[Bruce]

On Fri, 12 Jun 2020 18:21:36 -0400, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
wrote:

I believe that terrible woman has retired.

[Bruce]

Oh dear, I guess I was wrong, my sincere apologies:

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/judge-judy-ending-25-seasons-new-show-judy-justice-works-1282015

MARCH 01, 2020 7:04pm PT by Kimberly Nordyke

'Judge Judy' to End After 25 Seasons; Sheindlin Says New Show, 'Judy Justice,' in the Works

"The court show will continue to air in reruns as the host takes on a new series. Judge Judy is coming to an end after 25 seasons, host Judy Sheindlin says. At the same time, she isn't ready to hang up her gavel just yet.

The syndicated court show host appeared on Monday's The Ellen DeGeneres, where she told DeGeneres that the 2020-21 season of Judge Judy will also be its last. The Hollywood Reporter confirmed that Judge Judy will end production after next season, which will be the show's 25th season on the air.

"I've had a 25-year-long marriage with CBS [Television Distribution, which distributes the show], and it's been successful," she said. "Next year will be our 25th season, silver anniversary, and CBS sort of felt, I think, they wanted to optimally utilize the repeats of my program," she said. "Because now they have 25 years of reruns. So what they decided to do was to sell a couple of years' worth of reruns. But I'm not tired, so Judy Justice will be coming out a year later."

It's unclear whether this will be another syndicated program or for a network or other outlet.

Asked by DeGeneres where viewers will be able to watch the new show, Sheindlin replied: "I can't tell you yet."

She expanded upon the news slightly: "Judge Judy, you'll be able to see next year — a full year, all new shows. ... The following couple of years, you should be able to catch all the reruns that CBS has sold to the stations that are currently carrying Judge Judy, and Judy Justice will be going elsewhere. Isn't that fun?"

Sheindlin is the highest-paid personality on TV, earning $47 million a year. She signed her current contract with CBS in 2015. That deal took the host through three more seasons, through 2020, and also included a first-look production deal with Queen Bee Productions, which is owned by Sheindlin.

Two years later, she signed a deal with CBS in which the company acquired the complete library to Judge Judy, paying close to $100 million for more than 5,200 hours of programming.

Judge Judy ranks as one of the top-rated syndicated programs, averaging roughly 9 million viewers a day, and is TV's most-watched court show...."

[Bruce]

On Fri, 12 Jun 2020 15:48:06 -0700 (PDT), Bruce
<gregorymorr...@gmail.com> wrote:

>I wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 12 Jun 2020 18:21:36 -0400, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On 6/12/2020 9:55 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>> >>
>> >(snippage)
>> >
>> >> I'm not talking about that kind of informal labor. Kuthe's working
>> >> for a real corporation with actual procedures and policies.
>> >>
>> >> Cindy Hamilton
>> >>
>> >
>> >Gary's comparing apples and oranges again. Even in the kind of pick-up
>> >job Gary is describing, I'd certainly ask what I was going to be paid.
>> >If nothing else, to make sure it was worth my time. And to make sure
>> >the person wasn't going to come back later and say hey, I thought you
>> >were just helping me out because we were friends/neighbors. Those are
>> >the kinds of informal job arrangements that wind up on Judge Judy. Heh.
>>
>> I believe that terrible woman has retired.
>
>
>Oh dear, I guess I was wrong, my sincere apologies:

Greg Sorrow.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Friday, June 12, 2020 at 5:48:10 PM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
>
> Oh dear, I guess I was wrong, my sincere apologies:
>
> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/judge-judy-ending-25-seasons-new-show-judy-justice-works-1282015
>

Judge Judy gets some real doozies in her court. Sometimes, by the way they
act in her courtroom, I think they just came straight from the Jerry Springer
show.

[Hank Rogers]

You do need to look for employment which provides perpetual room
and board, in addition to lucrative regular nursing pay. This way,
you will be covered and have a place to live, even if things go
wrong and should your student housing enterprise becomes insolvent.
I know it's a remote possibility, but you need to cover that
eventuality.

Not everyone in da Loo is as bright as you, and you need to protect
your ass from those less brilliant.

[Dave Smith]

I guess I must have had some strange work ethic embedded into me that
encouraged me to take a shitty job with shitty pay because it was better
than no job and now pay at all. It worked out on the long run because I
ended up in a good job that paid well.

[dsi1]

I can't comment on your work ethic. I can comment on mine - I ain't gonna work at no job that I hate. It don't matter how much they offer to pay me. Well, maybe I can hold for a year, if I want to be a soulless sell-out flunky.

[Hank Rogers]

Yes. That's almost exactly what I told you yesterday.

Then, you flew into a psychotic rage.

It may be possible for you to keep a job, even with your mental
problems, but it will not be easy.

You are balancing on a knife edge. Take a little bit of your anti
psychotic medication, and go back to the nice lady and get that
prescription refilled, before you run out.

If you go nutz, you may never get back to the happy life at the
student housing place on bellerive. If you do get committed, it
will likely not be 5 min from the university, or any other school.
No foxxy indian chicks ... no sexy bank tellers. Just hospital walls.

When they lead you through a door, You'll hear a distinct, positive
click when it closes behind you. It's just the high security locks.
You'll get used to it John. You're not in the old happy hippie pad
in da Loo, when you hear that solid CLICK.

[cshenk]

John Kuthe wrote:

> On Thursday, June 11, 2020 at 6:21:09 AM UTC-5, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> > On Wednesday, June 10, 2020 at 6:59:27 PM UTC-4, Alex wrote:

> > > John Kuthe wrote:
> > > > For training too!
> > > >
> > > > :-)
> > > >
> > > > John Kuthe...
> > >

> > > Strange company you work for.  I've never had an employee ask how
> > > much they were making after they were hired.  Congrats, if it's
> > > true.
> >

> > In any event, the pay rate is always discussed at the on-boarding
> > interview.
> >
> > Cindy Hamilton
>
> NO IT'S NOT!! Assumer!
>
> John Kuthe...

Wasn't at any of mine either.

[Alex]

Bruce wrote:
> On Thu, 11 Jun 2020 19:44:48 -0400, Alex <Xel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Bruce wrote:
>>> On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 19:40:36 -0400, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>

>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 6/10/2020 7:30 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

>>>>> On 6/10/2020 6:18 PM, John Kuthe wrote:
>>>>>> For training too!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John Kuthe...
>>>>>>

>>>>> Sounds like a fair wage you can live comfortably on.  .  Hope it works
>>>>> out long term.
>>>> I don't understand why he didn't ask how much they'd be paying him in
>>>> the first place.

>>> If it's a set wage, you already have a rough idea and you want the job
>>> regardless of whether it pays a bit more or a bit less than your rough
>>> idea...
>> Never heard of that.
> "I want that job. I roughly know what it pays. I want it regardless
> whether it pays a bit less or a bit more."
>
> Is that so strange?

Yes, very strange.  Particularly if you are confident in your skills and
have experience.

[Alex]

Sheldon Martin wrote:

> Nothing strange... Kootchie is making a big to do over his precise pay
> as a distraction, simply because he wasn't hired, if he was hired he'd
> know what he'd be paid. Kootchie is as loser, he has no job, no one
> would hire that loser. Rich, RICH Kootchie is becoming poorer by the
> minute. Won't be too long Kootchie will be sleeping on the streets

You might be right although his roof price has changed from post to post.

[Alex]

Bob wrote:

> On 6/11/2020 7:44 PM, Alex wrote:
>> Bruce wrote:
>>> On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 19:40:36 -0400, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 6/10/2020 7:30 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>> On 6/10/2020 6:18 PM, John Kuthe wrote:
>>>>>> For training too!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John Kuthe...
>>>>>>
>>>>> Sounds like a fair wage you can live comfortably on.  . Hope it works
>>>>> out long term.
>>>> I don't understand why he didn't ask how much they'd be paying him in
>>>> the first place.
>>> If it's a set wage, you already have a rough idea and you want the job
>>> regardless of whether it pays a bit more or a bit less than your rough
>>> idea...
>>
>> Never heard of that.
>

> In the trades you will get union scale no matter who you work for in
> that region.

It's not a union job or they would have hired him for a lot more,
despite his shortcomings, a long time ago.

[Alex]

John Kuthe wrote:

> On Thursday, June 11, 2020 at 6:44:57 PM UTC-5, Alex wrote:
>> Bruce wrote:
>>> On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 19:40:36 -0400, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 6/10/2020 7:30 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>> On 6/10/2020 6:18 PM, John Kuthe wrote:
>>>>>> For training too!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John Kuthe...
>>>>>>
>>>>> Sounds like a fair wage you can live comfortably on.  .  Hope it works
>>>>> out long term.
>>>> I don't understand why he didn't ask how much they'd be paying him in
>>>> the first place.
>>> If it's a set wage, you already have a rough idea and you want the job
>>> regardless of whether it pays a bit more or a bit less than your rough
>>> idea...
>> Never heard of that.

> There is a LOT you've never heard of Alex, believe me! ;-)
>
> John Kuthe...

Sure there is.  That can be said about ANYONE.  In this case I know a
lot.  I have been an employee at a few jobs and I am now an employer. 
You just lack common sense.

[Alex]

John Kuthe wrote:

> On Thursday, June 11, 2020 at 6:48:33 PM UTC-5, Alex wrote:
>> John Kuthe wrote:

>>> On Wednesday, June 10, 2020 at 5:59:27 PM UTC-5, Alex wrote:

>>>> John Kuthe wrote:
>>>>> For training too!
>>>>>
>>>>> :-)
>>>>>
>>>>> John Kuthe...

>>>> Strange company you work for.  I've never had an employee ask how much
>>>> they were making after they were hired.  Congrats, if it's true.

>>> I told them I expected "nursing scale". They knew how much they'd pay, and I figured it was better than I was making before!
>>>

>>> There is a LOT you don't know about Alex! A LOT!!
>>>
>>> John Kuthe...

>> Your simple mind might think that, but you just posted that "They knew
>> how much they'd pay", but you didn't bother to ask until after you were
>> employed.  Very unconventional on your part and theirs.
> Cite or STFU!
>
> I never said "They knew how much they'd pay".....or YES I did!! When THEY asked me the GAMING QUESTION how much *I* expected to make and I did not name a figure but merely said "Whatever nursing scale was" because I knew THEY had a figure in mind that they would pay me.
>
> Confused enough yet?
>
> John Kuthe...

Not as much as you.  Cite or STFU?  That's an odd lead in to the rest of
your contradictory drivel.  If you "knew THEY had a figure in mind" why
didn't you ask?  You had no basis for assuming anything.

[cshenk]

Leo wrote:

> On 2020 Jun 11, , Ed Pawlowski wrote
> > > ..
> > I took a job with no discussion of salary. Stayed there for 27
> > years.
> >
> > The general manager where I worked at one time left and started his
> > own business. A year or two later he needed help for a couple of
> > weeks and asked me so I went there. At the end he paid me well. He
> > knew what was fair. A few months later he asked me to come on board
> > and I agreed but again, we did not discuss wages but it was a bit
> > more than the last gig.
> >
> > Would not have stayed if not properly compensated.
>
> We had a secretary, I’m sorry, administrative assistant, at a company
> I worked for. It closed but her husband was an entrepreneur who saw
> value in me. Since his wife knew my salary, he hired me at that wage.
> I worked for him for twenty one years, and I never considered asking
> for a raise. All I had to do was my best to keep the company
> growing, and my compensation grew. It helped that he was a
> no-nonsense, straight-arrow who worked harder than any of us to make
> the company successful. Then he sold it. Then it was sold again.
> Then I quit.
>
> leo

I've never asked for a raise. I've always gotten one.

[Alex]

You contradicted yourself again.  You need money to pay your share of
rent and utilities yet your house pays you something.  Which is it?

[Ed Pawlowski]

I also notice that she often ask the people what they do for a living.
Seems to be a disproportionate amount that reply "I'm on disability"

[Gary]

Sadly for you, Jill, it worked out very well for me and it has
continued ever since that first time.

I trust old friends to treat me right until it's proven wrong.

In my old business of 20 years, very few customers asked for a
price. They trusted me to charge them fairly and I always did.
Even the ones that asked for a price, I would give them a
price and said...
"No higher than this price but I'll charge you less if the
job works out to be less." Sometimes it did cost them less.

[Gary]

Dave Smith wrote:
> I guess I must have had some strange work ethic embedded into me that
> encouraged me to take a shitty job with shitty pay because it was better
> than no job and now pay at all. It worked out on the long run because I
> ended up in a good job that paid well.

Same here, Dave. If I needed work, I'd take a low pay job to
fill in while I looked for a better one.

Low pay is better than no pay and sitting at home doing nothing.

[John Kuthe]

Yep! Some $$'s is better than no $$'s!

John Kuthe...

[Dave Smith]

I have to admit that sometimes I had to wonder. I always worked. I had a
paper route when I was a kid, part time jobs during the school year,
summer jobs, a couple temporary and contract positions. Meanwhile, I
would see people who never had to work and who had no work experience,
who held out for something better and got it.

I got into an entry level position the government, got several
promotions within the first two year and was then stagnant. There came a
point where my pension contribution would be locked in and felt a need
to move. The writing was on the wall for our department. The government
was contracting out a lot of its operations and ours was on the block.
I made a decision to get out of the department or out of the ministry by
the end of the year or I was going to quit. Luckily there were positions
in the Safety and Regulation branch. I lucked out with a placement there
and ended up with a much better job and within three years my pay tripled.

[jmcquown]

On 6/12/2020 6:53 PM, itsjoan...@webtv.net wrote:

I remember when her show first aired she used to chastise the way the
people dressed. Young women who came in wearing strappy little camisole
tops were sent out to get a sweater or a jacket with a stern warning,
akin to "Where did you think you were coming today? You're not at a
night club." LOL

That aside, a lot of the contract job/pay dispute cases came about
because no one bothered to get the scope of the job and the *pay* in
writing. "I thought he was just helping me out, didn't know he expected
to be paid" sort of thing. Kuthe is working for a company, not a
friend/neighbor.

Jill

[jmcquown]

I'm thrilled it's worked for you.

> I trust old friends to treat me right until it's proven wrong.
>

John Kuthe is working for a skilled nursing facility, not an occasional
piecework job offered by a friend.

> In my old business of 20 years, very few customers asked for a
> price. They trusted me to charge them fairly and I always did.
> Even the ones that asked for a price, I would give them a
> price and said...
> "No higher than this price but I'll charge you less if the
> job works out to be less." Sometimes it did cost them less.
>

You were a professional house painter, right? You're saying no one ever
asked you what it was going to cost to paint their house or even a few
rooms in their house? I find that very hard to believe.

Jill

[jmcquown]

Being in the Navy isn't the same thing as Kuthe getting hired to work in
a Skilled Nursing Facility as a nurse. Of course you knew that. :)

Jill

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Tuesday, June 16, 2020 at 10:13:18 AM UTC-5, jmcquown wrote:
>
> On 6/12/2020 6:53 PM, itsjoan...@webtv.net wrote:
> >
> > Judge Judy gets some real doozies in her court. Sometimes, by the way they
> > act in her courtroom, I think they just came straight from the Jerry Springer
> > show.
> >

> That aside, a lot of the contract job/pay dispute cases came about
> because no one bothered to get the scope of the job and the *pay* in
> writing. "I thought he was just helping me out, didn't know he expected
> to be paid" sort of thing. Kuthe is working for a company, not a
> friend/neighbor.
>
> Jill
>

My favorites were the people suing the idiots they had bailed out of jail
for their money to be returned. The defendant invariably always said, "I
thought it was a gift and I shouldn't have to pay the money back."
Or "returning the money was never discussed." Yeah right, I'm sure the plaintiff just loves bailing idiots out of jail and never expect to receive
a dime back.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

I find it unbelievable, too. "Go ahead and paint my house and when you're
done give me the bill and I'll gladly pay it."

[Ed Pawlowski]

Not for existing customers. If you have a tradesman you've used and
trusted they will treat you fairly. Not everyone falls into that
category, but some do.

At work, I used a plumber, electrician, phone guy and computer guy. I
could trust them to do the job the most expedient way and labor rate was
fair. If there were alternatives they would bring them up. They earned
a reputation and were careful to preserve it.

[jmcquown]

Well, sometimes they *are* the girlfriends who are stupid enough to
think the guy is worth it... until he dumps them and then they want
their money back.

Jill

[Sheldon Martin]

Gary is so full of shit that I don't believe he has ever did any house
painting... no one is going to have their house painted without first
getting a solid price and especially with which materials. I always
painted with Benjamin Moore, I don't want any flour paste slop paint,
yet the cheapest paint is what the majority of painting contractors
use, may as well be a finger paint job. Gary style painting is what
keeps Judge Judy in a job.
I began painting before I was ten years old, painting stoops and
porches in Brooklyn, with a brush and oil based paints, no schtinkin'
water based paints and faggoty rollers. After years of painting I
never got even one complaint. Brushed on paint is far superior to
rollered paint, looks better and lasts longer. There are probably
stoops and porches in Brooklyn I painted 65 years ago that still don't
need repainting. A properly painted Benjamin Moore job can easily
last 100 years. Benjamin Moore paints last like the pyramids.

[Hank Rogers]

Ahh, Its the finest paint in the universe Popeye.

And yoose the finest painter.

I bet yoose painted all those big ole navy ships too.

[Gary]

And that was my case. I didn't say that "no one" asked for a
price. I said "very few customers" did. And that was after I
had built up a clientele in the first few years. I did regular
work for these people plus they recommended me to their friends
and neighbors.

"Word of Mouth" advertising is the best form. That's the only
advertising that I did.

When I did give a price (or a range of price), I was always
happy to be able to charge less. I've never worked for
anyone else that would do that.

If they tell you, $5000 that's what they would charge even
if it worked out to cost less. If I told someone $5000
and it worked out to be $4600, that's what their bill
would be. I appreciated every job I got and I treated
my customers fairly.

Honestly, about 85% of my work was done with no price discussed.
The other 15% were new customers.

Funny: The only estimates that I gave and didn't get the
jobs were for newly married couples who said they always
did their own painting before. Hiring a professional was
quite a shock.

About 85% of a professional paint job is for labor.

[Sheldon Martin]

We have several tradespeople do work here, they all give their hourly
rate plus materials. The appliance repair person charges $65/hr +
parts, even if he completes the job in 15 minutes it's still $65 for
part of an hour, which obviously covers his travel. I can't expect a
price for a job over the phone when I call and explain the problem as
best as I can, he still needs to see the job. That's true for all
trades, the plumber needs to see the job before giving a price,
installing a toilet will be a different price depending on where.
If I'm happy with the work and price I'll call back and give a
recommendation, if not I'll never see him again.
No tradesman has given me a price after the job is completed, if they
know what they're doing they will be able to calculate cost before
starting. If you call a painter and he arrives to look at a job
without a tape measure it's best to write him off... that's true of
any tradesman, they all travel with a tape measure.

[Bruce]

On Wed, 17 Jun 2020 06:24:04 -0400, Gary <g.ma...@att.net> wrote:

I painted a few houses and nearly fell off a few ladders when I was
young, in order to finance holidays to France. I always quoted
customers a price for the whole job or worked at an agreed upon hourly
rate. Of course, Gary's a professional and I was an amateur, although
a more and more experienced one.

[Gary]

Sheldon Martin wrote:
>
> If you call a painter and he arrives to look at a job
> without a tape measure it's best to write him off...

You really are just as stupid as you pretend to be.
I thought your odd rants were due to Crystal Palace but
maybe you really are dumb as a clam in normal life.

If a painter shows up with a tape measure, best to
tell them nevermind. That's not any real experienced
painter.

Size doesn't matter. Many different conditions on any
job. A good experienced painter can mentally paint
a room and give an accurate price.

Measuring would only be to measure amount of paint
necessary and only a newbie would do that.

[Gary]

Sheldon Martin wrote:
>
> Gary is so full of shit that I don't believe he has ever did any house
> painting... no one is going to have their house painted without first
> getting a solid price and especially with which materials. I always
> painted with Benjamin Moore, I don't want any flour paste slop paint,
> yet the cheapest paint is what the majority of painting contractors
> use, may as well be a finger paint job. Gary style painting is what
> keeps Judge Judy in a job.
> I began painting before I was ten years old, painting stoops and
> porches in Brooklyn, with a brush and oil based paints, no schtinkin'
> water based paints and faggoty rollers. After years of painting I
> never got even one complaint. Brushed on paint is far superior to
> rollered paint, looks better and lasts longer. There are probably
> stoops and porches in Brooklyn I painted 65 years ago that still don't
> need repainting. A properly painted Benjamin Moore job can easily
> last 100 years. Benjamin Moore paints last like the pyramids.

I should print this out and post it in the paint stores.
All painting contractors would love to get a morning laugh
over this rant. lol

[Sheldon Martin]

Then for you all tradesmen who use tape measures are newbies.
All the tradesmen I've dealt with carried a tape measure, and a pad
with something to write down measurements. Those who show up without
a tape measure and paper and pencil are telling me that they can't do
basic math and are illiterate. Maybe all your painting is with cheapo
white that you stock by the truckload. Most people want different
colors for different rooms so a real painter would need to write down
the different colors and how much of each to arrive with.

[Gary]

I always carried pad of paper to write down stuff. Just not a
worthless tape measure. I can easily judge how much paint I
will need. That comes with experience, not a tape measure.

Not only that, the one thing that separated me from the
regular painters is that I can match any color exactly.
Not many can do that.

On those color charts you see, there are many shades inbetween
all of them. I always carried a box of color tints to
make it perfect.

[Ed Pawlowski]

The ones you did not get have no idea what a fair hourly rate is. They
expect you to work for $3 an hour.

If I had you paint a bedroom and it was $150, when I ask you to paint
the other two I'd expect it to be about $300 give or take for size
difference. Same color may be a few bucks cheaper but if I want one
wall a different color it would be more.

Our house has one color (white) throughout but for a different color
accent wall they wanted about $300.

[Hank Rogers]

Why, Popeye ... Yoose probably have the finest tape measure in the
universe. They wouldn't use their own inferior instrument!

[Hank Rogers]

I bet yoose were almost as good a painter as Popeye.

[Sheldon Martin]

They should be crying. I've known many people who hired so-called pro
painters and wished they hadn't. the vast bajority of "pro painters"
can't paint themselves out of a paper bag. Most are huxters looking
to rip people off. I don't cosider a house painter a skilled trade.
It really requires no skill whatsover to paint, house painting
requires no more skill than raking leaves... actually raking leaves
requires greater skill... both require the same brute labor.
I've proved many times that a ten year old can out paint any so-called
pro painter. Painting is no more a trade than floor sweeping.

[Hank Rogers]

Sort of like being a navy sailor, huh Popeye?

[cshenk]

No, as a contractor. They don't discuss pay until the offer. At most,
they may ask 'how much you expect' but not always.

I got one offer from a job that wanted 10+ years SQL (I do an exceeded
their skill set in several areas). In fact, for the senio position
that had just closed out but required a degree. So this was a
supervisiory middle management SQL job. They offered 36K and I laughed
and walked.

https://devskiller.com/sql-developer-salary/

[jmcquown]

(snippage)

"Until the offer" being the operative term. John had already accepted
the job offer, gone through orientation, had to sign a bunch of
documents (for tax purposes) and been told he'd be trained on the
charting software and paid for training. I'm pretty darn sure by that
point someone would have mentioned his hourly rate.

Jill

[Hank Rogers]

jmcquown wrote:
> On 6/17/2020 5:52 PM, cshenk wrote:
>> jmcquown wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/12/2020 7:56 PM, cshenk wrote:
>>>> John Kuthe wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thursday, June 11, 2020 at 6:21:09 AM UTC-5, Cindy Hamilton
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> On Wednesday, June 10, 2020 at 6:59:27 PM UTC-4, Alex wrote:
>>>>>>> John Kuthe wrote:
>>>>>>>> For training too!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> :-)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> John Kuthe...
>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Strange company you work for.  I've never had an employee ask
>>>>>>> how much they were making after they were hired.  Congrats,

>>>>>>> if it's true.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In any event, the pay rate is always discussed at the
>>>>>> on-boarding interview.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cindy Hamilton
>>>>>
>>>>> NO IT'S NOT!! Assumer!
>>>>>
>>>>> John Kuthe...
>>>>
>>>> Wasn't at any of mine either.
>>>>
>>> Being in the Navy isn't the same thing as Kuthe getting hired to
>>> work
>>> in a Skilled Nursing Facility as a nurse.  Of course you knew
>>> that. :)
>>>
>>> Jill
>>
>> No, as a contractor.  They don't discuss pay until the offer.  At
>> most,
>> they may ask 'how much you expect' but not always.
> (snippage)
>
> "Until the offer" being the operative term. John had already
> accepted the job offer, gone through orientation, had to sign a
> bunch of documents (for tax purposes) and been told he'd be trained
> on the charting software and paid for training.  I'm pretty darn
> sure by that point someone would have mentioned his hourly rate.
>
> Jill

They told him, but he didn't hear it because he was blabbering on
and on about his electric car, ripping, stuff in da Loo etc.