Re: Sweedish Meatballs

[sf]

On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 14:28:01 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
wrote:

> Ikea's meatballs are way overrated.

They're downright awful. No idea why people rave about them.

--
I love cooking with wine.
Sometimes I even put it in the food.

[William]

On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 14:28:01 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
wrote:

>Ikea and Stouffer's can't touch my Swedish Meatballs. Beef broth, sour
>cream, black pepper, allspice, paprika, parsley, cornstarch slurry,
>and the magic kiss of oyster sauce. Meatballs are from
>Costco/Kirkland. The unopened sour cream expired 6 weeks ago - still
>perfectly fine.
>
>https://www.flickr.com/photos/sqwertz/28673408824/in/photostream/lightbox/
>
>Ikea's meatballs are way overrated. And Stouffer's doesn't quite
>taste as good as they used to.
>
>-sw

They look so good Steve. What is your primary occupation? You are
definitely more than just a home cook.

William

[Taxed and Spent]

I am not sure you can call grumpy curmudgeon an "occupation".

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 8/28/2016 5:30 PM, sf wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 14:28:01 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
> wrote:
>
>> Ikea's meatballs are way overrated.
>
> They're downright awful. No idea why people rave about them.
>

Probably never had anything to compare them to. Most people here have
been exposed to real food properly made, but just look at what the
majority buy in the supermarket. Prepared chemical laden foods.

[dsi1]

The preservatives, stabilizers, and processing, are what allows foods to be able be made in a place far from where a person lives to be eaten at a later time. We can be against these food additives but we we're in for a life filled with food spoilage and food toxins. Some folks just ain't satisfied with all that they have.

[Bruce]

In article <0820251d-68d6-4318...@googlegroups.com>,
dsi...@yahoo.com says...

I eat well without colorants, preservatives, flavour enhancers and God
knows what other crap. And I'm very satisfied with it. But if you prefer
to eat science projects, you should. Enjoy! :)

[dsi1]

On Sunday, August 28, 2016 at 5:40:02 PM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:
> In article <0820251d-68d6-4318...@googlegroups.com>,
> dsiyahoo.com says...

I sure will. My gospel is that we should enjoy our foods while we still can and I always practice what I preach.

The future of food is obvious. We'll be eating synthesized food in the not too distant future. The first revolution in foods happened a hundred years ago with the introduction of nitrogen fertilizers. This has allowed the earth's population to swell to a size not previously thought possible. The second revolution will have a similar effect. Foods will be produced/built/printed from basic materials from sustainable sources - beef and other meats will not be considered sustainable.

[Bruce]

In article <a95227a5-d9d7-4427...@googlegroups.com>,
dsi...@yahoo.com says...

That may be true, but so far I have the choice between real food and
prefab science project food. Given that choice, I'll avoid the latter as
much as I can.

[Jeßus]

God, I think I need a bucket...

[sf]

Commercial meatballs are horrible excuses for food. Swedish meatballs
are about half pork and allspice goes into the meat mixture. Done
well, they are delicious.

[dsi1]

On Sunday, August 28, 2016 at 7:32:11 PM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:
> In article <a95227a5-d9d7-4427...@googlegroups.com>,
> dsi10yahoo.com says...

I hearty endorse your your right to eat as you choose.

[Bruce]

In article <a6aa5509-c7e8-49c8...@googlegroups.com>,
dsi...@yahoo.com says...

Thank you, likewise :)

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:MPG.322e792e7...@News.Individual.NET...

========

We are all very lucky that we can choose. MrD's predictions make me glad I
live now and not in the future.



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Bruce]

In article <e2i9vs...@mid.individual.net>, OphEl...@gmail.com
says...

Yes, in a 100 years we might all have to re-evaluate our choices.

[Cindy Hamilton]

"We" meaning human beings, I suppose. I don't expect to see that in
my lifetime, of which I reckon I have about 30 years left.

Cindy Hamilton

[col...@gmail.com]

Swedes probably like them fine.

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:MPG.322eac263...@News.Individual.NET...

======

Well you might but I am sure I won't be around then:))



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[dsi1]

Most people don't think they'll see self driving/electric cars in their lifetime either. Ford's timetable is 5 years for autonomous cars but my guess is the majority of people working on this technology aren't as conservative.

3-D printing of food will be commonplace in a few years, mostly it's just an extrusion process. Building foods at a molecular level will take maybe 20 years or so? As they say, my guess is as good as yours. My guess is that people will find it hard to believe that animals were once raised and killed for food - perhaps in your lifetime.

[Ophelia]

"dsi1" wrote in message
news:7f485d2f-2feb-4a80...@googlegroups.com...

Most people don't think they'll see self driving/electric cars in their
lifetime either. Ford's timetable is 5 years for autonomous cars but my
guess is the majority of people working on this technology aren't as
conservative.

3-D printing of food will be commonplace in a few years, mostly it's just an
extrusion process. Building foods at a molecular level will take maybe 20
years or so? As they say, my guess is as good as yours. My guess is that
people will find it hard to believe that animals were once raised and killed
for food - perhaps in your lifetime.

==============================

Look here:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/jul/13/jaguar-land-rover-autonomous-vehicles-test-uk-2020

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Cindy Hamilton]

The cost is down to $80 per kilogram (from $325,000).

Cindy Hamilton

[dsi1]

Audi, Mercedes Benz, Volvo, BMW, are also working on this technology, the Americans too. It seems there's a lot of interest in autonomous cars and work is being done at an accelerated pace. I'm guessing we'll be seeing an iCar soon. :)

http://www.wsj.com/articles/apples-1-billion-didi-investment-revs-up-autonomous-car-push-1463154162

[dsi1]

Meat's gonna go down! People eating meat in the future will be seen as perverse and shunned. Pretty wild, eh?

[Ophelia]

"dsi1" wrote in message
news:428116ac-f026-45e2...@googlegroups.com...

==============

There are quite a few reports online so it is coming on:))



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Cheri]

"Ophelia" <OphEl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:e2jh2n...@mid.individual.net...

I will drive my own, and when I can't I'll take a bus. LOL

Cheri

[sf]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 13:50:52 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
wrote:

> On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 22:38:48 -0700, sf wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 19:09:09 -0400, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.net> wrote:
> >
> >> On 8/28/2016 5:30 PM, sf wrote:
> >>> On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 14:28:01 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Ikea's meatballs are way overrated.
> >>>
> >>> They're downright awful. No idea why people rave about them.
> >>>
> >>
> >> Probably never had anything to compare them to. Most people here have
> >> been exposed to real food properly made, but just look at what the
> >> majority buy in the supermarket. Prepared chemical laden foods.
> >
> > Commercial meatballs are horrible excuses for food.
>

> That's because you've only tried those cheap-assed meatballs that have
> a large proportion of textured vegetable protein rather than actual
> meat. It's hard to find a retail meatball that doesn't contain TVP.
>
> The Kirkland meatballs are better than anything you can make at home
> and don't contain any TVP or fillers except bread crumbs (which is
> typical of all meatballs). They're very convenient compared to making
> them from scratch.
>
You're wrong again. They were Costco's.

[Cheri]

"sf" <s...@geemail.com> wrote in message
news:l659sbt68nu3sghoa...@4ax.com...

I like the First Street brand that Smart and Final sells and buy them once
in awhile, but in my experience...homemade meatballs are better.

Cheri

[Cheri]

"Sqwertz" <swe...@cluemail.compost> wrote in message
news:dv80z9ys...@sqwertz.com...

> Jebus's Stepford pills seemed to have finally worn off.
>
> -sw

I agree that most of your food looks very tasty, it's your personality that
leaves a bad taste.

Cheri

[William]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 12:25:09 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 <dsi...@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>Audi, Mercedes Benz, Volvo, BMW, are also working on this technology, the Americans too. It seems there's a lot of interest in autonomous cars and work is being done at an accelerated pace. I'm guessing we'll be seeing an iCar soon. :)
>
>http://www.wsj.com/articles/apples-1-billion-didi-investment-revs-up-autonomous-car-push-1463154162

apparently, people have alot more to do on their Smartphone and they
want to do less steering the car.

William

[dsi1]

It's a major disruptive technology. The US stands to save tens of thousands of lives every year, it's going to turn the automobile insurance business on it's head, it'll probably cause an increase in being drunk in public, driving under the influence will no longer be a problem but alcoholism will, marriage infidelity will go up, taxi drivers will be out of a job, owning a car will seem like an unnecessary expense, the car companies will mostly sell to groups and organizations, it will cause some companies to go under, car culture will be dead, Hawaii drivers will be able to get more snooze time, disabled and elderly folks will be able to get out more. Self-driving cars will change our society - perhaps as much as the cell phone has. In the future, driving a car manually will be considered a crime against humanity. :)

[sf]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 13:08:33 -0700, "Cheri" <che...@newsguy.com>
wrote:

> I like the First Street brand that Smart and Final sells and buy them once
> in awhile, but in my experience...homemade meatballs are better.

Agree.

[Ophelia]

"Cheri" wrote in message news:nq24d...@news6.newsguy.com...

=============

Amen to that!!!!! There is No Way I would sit in a thing like that :)))



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[sf]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 15:19:25 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
wrote:

> What were Costco's? You only referred to Ikea's. Maybe you just
> don't like meatballs. I have tried all the "popular" meatball recipes
> at home and I still prefer Costco's. They kinda taste like that
> Kronos Gryocone(tm) meat, which I also love.

You're the one who muddied the water with Kirkland, not me. I
happened to have eaten both Kirkland meatballs and Ikea Swedish
meatballs (and disliked both). Maybe you need a better scorecard to
help you keep up with your own changing of subjects.
>
> I will admit that there's some sort of "grill flavoring" in Costco's
> meatballs that may not be to everyone's preference and can clash with
> some dishes. But it's kinda grown on me. The HEB brand I buy also
> has that same hint of flavoring. They are quite different than
> anything you can make at home.
>
> -sw

[dsi1]

On Monday, August 29, 2016 at 10:13:17 AM UTC-10, BigC300 wrote:
> On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 12:25:09 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 <dsiyahoo.com>

> wrote:
>
> >Audi, Mercedes Benz, Volvo, BMW, are also working on this technology, the Americans too. It seems there's a lot of interest in autonomous cars and work is being done at an accelerated pace. I'm guessing we'll be seeing an iCar soon. :)
> >
> >http://www.wsj.com/articles/apples-1-billion-didi-investment-revs-up-autonomous-car-push-1463154162
>
>
> apparently, people have alot more to do on their Smartphone and they
> want to do less steering the car.
>
> William

That sounds correct. The younger generation will be glad to have a car drive them around.

I tried out a VR headset. It was a 99 dollar Samsung model that used a cell phone as a display. The effect, even at this low level, made it obvious that this immersive technology will be a game changer. It might bring about the end of the movie theater, maybe even the end of ever leaving your home. I suspect that it might be a big help for the visually impaired. It's a brave new world for sure.

[sf]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 12:59:46 -0700, "Cheri" <che...@newsguy.com>
wrote:

> I will drive my own, and when I can't I'll take a bus. LOL

I live in a City. The streetcar is less than a block away and Uber is
literally only a 3 minute wait, so I'm thinking those driverless Ubers
will play a roll in my life when the time comes.

[dsi1]

I deal with a lot of elderly folks. The number one problem with them is coming in to see me. They have to wait for a family member or neighbor or the local Handivan service to get a ride. It's not a simple matter of hopping on a bus. Their hopping on a bus days are over. :(

[Ophelia]

"dsi1" wrote in message
news:b8ae7469-93a4-4355...@googlegroups.com...

=====================

Yes, that must be hard. I have to say though that as a driver, I could
never trust a non driver car.



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Jeßus]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 13:10:26 -0700, "Cheri" <che...@newsguy.com>
wrote:

Yes, that's the main point. Besides, there's many others here just as
good in the kitchen anyway.

[sf]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 16:05:35 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
wrote:

> Anybody who looks back at the conversation will see that I didn't
> muddle anything.
>
> You changed the subject to "all commercial meatballs", I then changed
> the subject to specifically Costco's (appropriately, because that's
> what I used). So I'm sorry if you can't follow the conversation
> (again).
>
> Anyway - never mind. Leftovers should be even better tonight with
> some musgovian corn on the cob.
>
You finally figured out where you went off the track. You're welcome.

[cshenk]

sf wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 14:28:01 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
> wrote:
>
> > Ikea's meatballs are way overrated.
>
> They're downright awful. No idea why people rave about them.

Harris Teters has a decent store brand. Then again, a lot of it is
what you do with them.

Carol

--

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 8/29/2016 4:43 PM, Ophelia wrote:

>> >
>> > There are quite a few reports online so it is coming on:))
>>
>> I will drive my own, and when I can't I'll take a bus. LOL
>>
>> Cheri
>>
>> =============
>>
>> Amen to that!!!!! There is No Way I would sit in a thing like that :)))
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk
>
> I deal with a lot of elderly folks. The number one problem with them is
> coming in to see me. They have to wait for a family member or neighbor
> or the local Handivan service to get a ride. It's not a simple matter of
> hopping on a bus. Their hopping on a bus days are over. :(
> =====================
>
> Yes, that must be hard. I have to say though that as a driver, I could
> never trust a non driver car.
>

But you may reach a point that you cannot trust yourself. Many elderly
end up driving through store windows or into crowds of people.

[Cheri]

"sf" <s...@geemail.com> wrote in message

news:rr69sb1l8k1n9e96r...@4ax.com...

> On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 12:59:46 -0700, "Cheri" <che...@newsguy.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I will drive my own, and when I can't I'll take a bus. LOL
>
> I live in a City. The streetcar is less than a block away and Uber is
> literally only a 3 minute wait, so I'm thinking those driverless Ubers
> will play a roll in my life when the time comes.

Yes, I'm sure they will play a role in many lives, just as computers have.

Cheri

[Cheri]

"Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.net> wrote in message
news:a8SdnahrkKCnTlnK...@giganews.com...

I am more afraid of teenage drivers than elderly drivers, and the statistics
back that up.

Cheri

Cheri

[Bruce]

In article <a8SdnahrkKCnTlnK...@giganews.com>, e...@snet.net
says...

Women might appreciate the parking help.

[cshenk]

Bruce wrote in rec.food.cooking:

Stasticaly, it's men who need that.

--

[Bruce]

In article <FtWdnep7vNIfRFnK...@giganews.com>, cshenk1
@cox.net says...

I have proof:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-SMeh0BB58

[Ed Pawlowski]

Thaat may be true, but we are getting closer to being the elderly driver
every day. Just a week ago I know a guy hit by a 92 year old driver who
still had his foot on the gas after hitting one car into a motorcycle.
That could be you are I in a couple more decades.

[Bruce]

In article <MJWdnaQwPIHWQ1nK...@giganews.com>, e...@snet.net
says...

Don't you think you'll be with it enough to know you shouldn't drive
anymore?

[Cheri]

"Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.net> wrote in message

news:MJWdnaQwPIHWQ1nK...@giganews.com...

I would like to be closer to being the teen driver every day, but... :-)
Seriously, I believe I will know when it's time to quit driving.

Old Joke:

A very elderly couple were at DMV where the husband was renewing his
license. The examiner asked him to respond to this scenario, "you are
driving down a long steep hill with a stop sign at the bottom, your wife is
dozing next to you, when all of a sudden your brakes fail, you look and see
cars coming from both sides of the busy street at the bottom of the hill who
have no stop signs, what is the first thing you would do?" He thought for a
second and said, "the first thing I would do is wake my wife up." The
examiner asked, "why would you wake her up when she can't help you?" He said
"because she ain't never seen a wreck like the one we're going to have. :)

Cheri

[Brooklyn1]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 17:34:26 -0700, "Cheri" <che...@newsguy.com>
wrote:

>

I'd neeed to see those statistics. I think there are too many
variables, teenage driver spans a very short window (16-19), three
years... depends what you mean by elderly drivers, a far wider window
(~50-90), about 40 years. There are plenty of middle age drivers who
are unfit to drive, most drivers over 65 shouldn't be on the roads,
they are unfit healthwise; physically/mentally. At 73 I know I can no
longer do the kind of driving I did from 30 to 50, these days I drive
less than 700 miles a year, and I pretty much stick to secondary rural
roads. I drive my tractor many more hours than I drive my car...
yesterday 8 hours and today six hours, brush hogging my five acre
wildflower meadow, all done at creep speed, about 1.3 mph... takes
tremendous patience to drive so many hours at that speed, but
necessesary to mow down 8' growth of tough stringy plants... but no
traffic, no pedestrians, no chance of an accident. My only malady was
a flat tire on my mower, wirery brush tore off a valve stem, but I
continued on three wheels, wheel is in the shop now, needs a new inner
tube. I hated to do it, the goldenrod was gorgeous, but needs to be
done each fall for the health of the land, next year the flowers will
be even better... had to take advantage of the dry spell. Anyway I
think on average most young people drive more safely than most older
people. Nowadays drivers of all ages are busier texting and cell
phoning than driving. Personally I have never texted driving or not,
and I have never cell phoned driving or not, and never will. I don't
want anyone phoning me while I'm driving... I have a cell phone but
only for me to use in an emergency, no one can phone me because my
cell phone is never turned on... no one has the number either. I have
the thing about two years and have yet to use it, hope I never need
to.

[Ed Pawlowski]

I hope so, but many don't.

[sf]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 20:28:43 -0400, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.net> wrote:

> But you may reach a point that you cannot trust yourself. Many elderly
> end up driving through store windows or into crowds of people.

The problem is they trust themselves far too long. So either they end
up in an accident, or they reach the point where they have to take a
behind the wheel driver's test and their license isn't renewed.

[sf]

On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 11:33:46 +1000, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

> Don't you think you'll be with it enough to know you shouldn't drive
> anymore?

No. I've heard story after story about elderly parents who shouldn't
be driving.

[dsi1]

There's no doubt that there will be some resistance to this mind-blowing technology but at least people will have that option available. My guess is self-driving cars will do somewhat better than humans beings.

For some mysterious reason, Americans are OK with a consumer product that kills about 30,000 people, and maims a lot more, a year. 2015 was a banner year for the killer automobile - it killed 38,000 Americans, the reason for such a large jump in deaths is not known at this time.

[Ophelia]

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:L6SdnQGBJNRtdFnK...@giganews.com...

============

In UK once we are 70, every 5 years we are have to confirm we are good to
drive. We can just do it on line. Weird I know but that is how it is
here:)



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ophelia]

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message

news:a8SdnahrkKCnTlnK...@giganews.com...

==========

If I don't trust myself to drive I will take a taxi.



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:MPG.322f83e4f...@News.Individual.NET...

=============

LOL don't push your luck. I am great with every kind of parking except
parallel parking! Back in the day that wasn't part of the test and I never
did get the hang of it properly. I only do it if I have no other choice:))


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ophelia]

"dsi1" wrote in message
news:4e6eecd7-0d2a-456e...@googlegroups.com...

==============

I don't suppose we will be much better.



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:MPG.322f8741a...@News.Individual.NET...

=============

OK I would have no problem in that space with no car in front:))


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Bruce]

In article <e2l01h...@mid.individual.net>, OphEl...@gmail.com
says...

Australians love angled parking, if that makes sense. 45 degrees to the
kerb. If you have wide roads, as we often do, you can fit more parked
cars that way. It's easier than parallel.

[Bruce]

In article <e2l01h...@mid.individual.net>, OphEl...@gmail.com
says...
>

I agree. That shouldn't have been a problem :)

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:MPG.323001816...@News.Individual.NET...

=========

I was wondering of that person was drunk!



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:MPG.323000f54...@News.Individual.NET...

-------------

I don't see much angled parking places. Our are usually straight so I can
usually reverse straight in.



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Bruce]

In article <e2l4e9...@mid.individual.net>, OphEl...@gmail.com

I know one thing: she wasn't a quitter.

[Bruce]

In article <e2l4e9...@mid.individual.net>, OphEl...@gmail.com

It hardly exists in the Netherlands either. Streets aren't wide enough
for it.

[Cindy Hamilton]

On Monday, August 29, 2016 at 4:23:06 PM UTC-4, dsi1 wrote:

> It's a major disruptive technology. The US stands to save tens of thousands
>of lives every year, it's going to turn the automobile insurance business on
>it's head, it'll probably cause an increase in being drunk in public, driving
>under the influence will no longer be a problem but alcoholism will, marriage
>infidelity will go up, taxi drivers will be out of a job, owning a car will
>seem like an unnecessary expense, the car companies will mostly sell to groups
>and organizations, it will cause some companies to go under, car culture will
>be dead, Hawaii drivers will be able to get more snooze time, disabled and
>elderly folks will be able to get out more. Self-driving cars will change our
>society - perhaps as much as the cell phone has. In the future, driving a car
>manually will be considered a crime against humanity. :)

Futurists have been predicting this, that, and the other for a long time.
We're still pretty much doing what we've done for 100 years. I believe
societal change will happen more slowly.

What do you want a self-driving car to do in this scenario: hit
an elderly pedestrian or a bus load of school children? The bus is
a hardened target, but you might kill a child. How will we program
the car's controller to make that sort of decision?

If they can do reliable self-driving cars by the time I'm ready to stop
driving, I'm all for it. I suspect, though, that I'll be taking a taxi
to my doctor appointments and the grocery store.

Cindy Hamilton

[Nancy Young]

An extreme example, but my fil's license was taken away as he
had Alzheimer's and wasn't fit to drive.

The doctor who reported him, you'd think they'd get it, but no.
My fil didn't remember he wasn't supposed to drive. He had
Alzheimer's. Luckily he was caught when he cut off a cop and
before he could hurt anyone. Imagine his surprise when he
couldn't find his license.

We had to disable his car.

nancy

[Nancy Young]

On 8/30/2016 4:49 AM, Ophelia wrote:

> LOL don't push your luck. I am great with every kind of parking except
> parallel parking! Back in the day that wasn't part of the test and I
> never did get the hang of it properly. I only do it if I have no other
> choice:))

Where I lived, your driving test was taken on local roads. I would
think it would be nerve wracking for the people who lived around
there, but we had to parallel park by their cars.

I was okay with it but it's been a long time and I wouldn't care
to attempt it on a busy road. It's all parking lots where I live now.

nancy

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:MPG.32300af2c...@News.Individual.NET...

===============

LOL ain't that the truth:)) Several times I thought she was going to drive
off, but no, back she came. Did she manage in the end? I didn't watch it
to the bitter end:))



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ophelia]

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:MPG.32300b2d4...@News.Individual.NET...

=========

Yes, from what I have seen they are narrow in comparison to the pictures of
streets in US.


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ophelia]

"Nancy Young" wrote in message news:pPexz.1076079$nP7....@fx28.fr7...

==============

Yes, the tests were taken in our local roads. Where did you live?:)))

I always get confused with 'parallel parking'. To me that is where cars
park long side on to the kerb ... nose to tail, yes?

My test was so long ago they hadn't got around to doing that. I suppose
there were no many cars around and parking spaces were not at a premium as
they are now:)

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Nancy2]

Ophelia, the driverless aspect doesn't mean you are at its mercy. The
occupant in the driver's seat can always override the automatic aspect.

The well-publicized death recently of a driver in a driverless car died
because the car couldn't identify a white truck and the driver wasn't paying
attention. If he had been, he could have taken the wheel and moved
out of the way.

N.

[Ophelia]

"Nancy2" wrote in message
news:25db04af-750b-473e...@googlegroups.com...

=========

Thanks, Nancy I did read that. I am still not sure I would trust that type
of car though. Who knows what kind of changes they might make.

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Brooklyn1]

Then what's the point of a driverless car. . . who knows what else the
electronics will miss. To me a driverless car on the same roads with
driver driven vehicles, especially trucks, is a death trap.

[dsi1]

About 1.3 million people die each year worldwide. Many more are injured.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 8/30/2016 4:49 AM, Ophelia wrote:

> LOL don't push your luck. I am great with every kind of parking except
> parallel parking! Back in the day that wasn't part of the test and I
> never did get the hang of it properly. I only do it if I have no other
> choice:))
>
>

Not hard if you practice. When I lived in a city, especially at my
grandmother's house I could get into a spot about an inch longer than my
car. When I moved here the need to parallel park went away and my skill
dropped with it. What I used to do multiple times a day is now every
couple of months.

[sf]

There are no moral dilemmas in a fully automated situation because all
the vehicles will be in full compliance with the law (such as not
passing a stopped school bus) and in full communication with each
other so they will sense hazards that mere mortals can't see.

[sf]

On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:48:29 -0400, Brooklyn1
<grave...@verizon.net> wrote:

> Then what's the point of a driverless car. . . who knows what else the
> electronics will miss. To me a driverless car on the same roads with
> driver driven vehicles, especially trucks, is a death trap.

What's the point of cruise control... a feature that's so popular with
old men?

[sf]

On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 09:49:29 +0100, "Ophelia" <OphEl...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> LOL don't push your luck. I am great with every kind of parking except
> parallel parking! Back in the day that wasn't part of the test and I never
> did get the hang of it properly. I only do it if I have no other choice:))

Parallel parking was the *only* parking that was tested back when I
got my license. Anyone who can do that can pull in head first.

[sf]

On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 11:10:43 +0100, "Ophelia" <OphEl...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I don't see much angled parking places. Our are usually straight so I can
> usually reverse straight in.

Shows you how few cars are on your roads compared to elsewhere. We
had straight slots until we needed another lane in the streets, then
the parking was angled to accommodate it without losing too much
sidewalk. There is too much traffic too accommodate the time it takes
for someone to back into a parking slot or the wide swings it takes to
do it.

[dsi1]

Ethical decisions like that are a bit of a red herring. Has anyone ever had to make such a choice? People don't care about an elderly pedestrian or a bus of school kids anyway. What people really want is to save their own miserable skins. Logically, we should place our lives in the hands of the machines and prevent a whole shitload of people from killing themselves. I just dig deep, cold, logic because it just makes things simple!

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/aug/22/self-driving-cars-moral-dilemmas

[sf]

On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 20:29:50 +1000, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

> In article <e2l4e9...@mid.individual.net>, OphEl...@gmail.com
> says...
> >
> > "Bruce" wrote in message
> > news:MPG.323000f54...@News.Individual.NET...
> >
> >

> > Australians love angled parking, if that makes sense. 45 degrees to the
> > kerb. If you have wide roads, as we often do, you can fit more parked
> > cars that way. It's easier than parallel.
> >
> > -------------
> >
> > I don't see much angled parking places. Our are usually straight so I can
> > usually reverse straight in.
>
> It hardly exists in the Netherlands either. Streets aren't wide enough
> for it.

I only remember parallel parking in Amsterdam (a residential area).
No room for anything else!

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 8/30/2016 6:46 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:

>
> What do you want a self-driving car to do in this scenario: hit
> an elderly pedestrian or a bus load of school children? The bus is
> a hardened target, but you might kill a child. How will we program
> the car's controller to make that sort of decision?
>
> If they can do reliable self-driving cars by the time I'm ready to stop
> driving, I'm all for it. I suspect, though, that I'll be taking a taxi
> to my doctor appointments and the grocery store.
>
> Cindy Hamilton
>

I think it will come in stages. First will be highways as they are
relatively easy to navigate compared to city street.

You ask if they will hit an elderly person or a bus load of children.
We have that technology and have been doing it for years. You may have
seen it on the news at times. We call it incompetent drivers.

Today I just drove home and one section of road has four different speed
limits in various section, steep hill, a bit of traffic. I set the
cruise control to a maximum of 50. In twelve miles all I did was steer.
The braking and speed changes were taken care of automatically as I
followed the rest of the cars.

I got on the highway for another 10 miles and set the cruise control to
a max of 75 and did the same. If I had a Tesla I could have let it steer
much of the time too.

[sf]

On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 12:38:13 -0500, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost>
wrote:

> On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 06:00:41 -0700 (PDT), Nancy2 wrote:
>
> > The well-publicized death recently of a driver in a driverless car died
> > because the car couldn't identify a white truck and the driver wasn't paying
> > attention. If he had been, he could have taken the wheel and moved
> > out of the way.
>

> People in driverless cars will never be be paying attention. They
> will be on their cellphones or putting on their makeup.
>
Brushing their teeth, shaving... all things I see now, so a driverless
car will only make it safer for the rest of us.

[Ed Pawlowski]

The driver was thought to be watching a movie at the time, A passing
driver was him watching a DVD player. As the technology stands, yes,
you still have to look out the window and possibly take control, but
this is how faults are founds and can be corrected.

[dsi1]

Not to worry!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAOJcv39CcM

[Ophelia]

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:YsWdncJXM668XFjK...@giganews.com...

=========

You are right. It is lack of practice but D can do it without thinking.
Like you he can get into very small spaces. :)))



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ophelia]

"dsi1" wrote in message
news:bc454fd1-0b4f-46a6...@googlegroups.com...

==========

We have those already, I've seen them on tv adverts:))



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Cindy Hamilton]

You sound like a person who has never had a computer (even an
embedded processor) misbehave.

We're going to have a period where some vehicles have drivers and
others have AIs at the helm. In any case, I didn't posit a stopped
school bus. Plus, if they're networked, someone will find a way to
hack in and cause mischief.

Yes, all the good stuff you say will happen someday. But it's going
to cost a ton of money, and people/governments don't like to spend it.
I remain dubious.

Cindy Hamilton

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 8/30/2016 1:32 PM, sf wrote:
> On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:48:29 -0400, Brooklyn1
> <grave...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>> Then what's the point of a driverless car. . . who knows what else the
>> electronics will miss. To me a driverless car on the same roads with
>> driver driven vehicles, especially trucks, is a death trap.
>
> What's the point of cruise control... a feature that's so popular with
> old men?
>

Hey, not just old me. I was about 30 when I first had a car with it.
Great feature that can save you from both fatigue and speeding tickets.

[Gary]

Here's a question for you then...what's the purpose of a driverless car
if you have to pay attention?

Isn't the whole idea is that you can program your car to take you
somewhere, then you can read a book or fall asleep or whatever.

[Gary]

I agree and that's what I just said. Not only that, you can shun the
driverless cars but you'll still be out on the highway with other people
using them. Almost as dangerous as riding in one yourself. And lets not
forget the hackers that could cause mayhem with computer controlled
cars.

[Gary]

Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> On 8/30/2016 4:49 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>
> > LOL don't push your luck. I am great with every kind of parking except
> > parallel parking! Back in the day that wasn't part of the test and I
> > never did get the hang of it properly. I only do it if I have no other
> > choice:))
> >
> >
>
> Not hard if you practice. When I lived in a city, especially at my
> grandmother's house I could get into a spot about an inch longer than my
> car.

No you couldn't. Get outta here. lol ;)

[Ophelia]

"Gary" wrote in message news:57C5E41B...@att.net...

===============

Perhaps if they ran on ... rails ....

heh

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Ed Pawlowski]

Tesla is not driverless car. Very advanced, it can go with no attention
for a while, but it is not meant to do it all just yet.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Well maybe a couple of inches. Some older cars had better visibility to
the rear also and that made it much easier to judge where your back
bumper is.

[Cheri]

"Ophelia" <OphEl...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:e2lcl7...@mid.individual.net...

> "Nancy Young" wrote in message news:pPexz.1076079$nP7....@fx28.fr7...
>

> On 8/30/2016 4:49 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>
>> LOL don't push your luck. I am great with every kind of parking except
>> parallel parking! Back in the day that wasn't part of the test and I
>> never did get the hang of it properly. I only do it if I have no other
>> choice:))
>

> Where I lived, your driving test was taken on local roads. I would
> think it would be nerve wracking for the people who lived around
> there, but we had to parallel park by their cars.
>
> I was okay with it but it's been a long time and I wouldn't care
> to attempt it on a busy road. It's all parking lots where I live now.
>
> nancy
> ==============
>
> Yes, the tests were taken in our local roads. Where did you live?:)))
>
> I always get confused with 'parallel parking'. To me that is where cars
> park long side on to the kerb ... nose to tail, yes?
>
> My test was so long ago they hadn't got around to doing that. I suppose
> there were no many cars around and parking spaces were not at a premium as
> they are now:)

I've always been a great parallel parker so I don't mind when I have to, but
I do prefer parking lots. :)

Cheri

[Gary]

sf wrote:
>
> On Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:48:29 -0400, Brooklyn1
> <grave...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> > Then what's the point of a driverless car. . . who knows what else the
> > electronics will miss. To me a driverless car on the same roads with
> > driver driven vehicles, especially trucks, is a death trap.
>
> What's the point of cruise control... a feature that's so popular with
> old men?

I've always considered cruise control a totally worthless feature.
Same with heated seats, remote control start your car.....the list is
endless.

I'm sure driverless cars will be the norm someday, but not in our
lifetimes. Right now we are living in the test time and they sound very
dangerous. Not just riding in one but also having them out on the roads.

[Ophelia]

"Cheri" wrote in message news:nq4pc...@news3.newsguy.com...

===========

When I did my test, we had emergency braking, reversing around corners, hill
start, 3 point turn and the usual driving in traffic but they are the only
manoeuvres I can remember.

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

[Bruce]

In article <25db04af-750b-473e...@googlegroups.com>,
ellor...@gmail.com says...

>
> Ophelia, the driverless aspect doesn't mean you are at its mercy. The
> occupant in the driver's seat can always override the automatic aspect.
>
> The well-publicized death recently of a driver in a driverless car died
> because the car couldn't identify a white truck and the driver wasn't paying
> attention. If he had been, he could have taken the wheel and moved
> out of the way.

If elderly people who are too old to drive, switch to driverless cars, I
wouldn't expect too much timely intevention from them. They're probably
looking for peppermints in their handbag while the accident happens.

[Nancy Young]

On 8/30/2016 4:05 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

> Tesla is not driverless car. Very advanced, it can go with no attention
> for a while, but it is not meant to do it all just yet.

I saw a guy on the news, someone took a video. He was napping
on the way to work in stop and go traffic ... in his Tesla.

nancy