In article <4sphrg$...@hermes.cair.du.edu>, sfo...@odin.cair.du.edu (sgf) writes:
>-Stephanie
>ObFood: one of my fellow anthropology students did a study on the >culture of bars and learned as a sidebar to her research that the >pronunciation of "Coors" varied depending on how prosperous the community >was. Most prosperous: "Cooooors" Middling: "Cors" Least: "Curs"
Stephanie,
I'm familiar with a lot of legal terminology, but what is a Coors? And, if the judge orders Coors in the courtroom, is that good, or bad for the defendant?
> I once decided to go through the entire "h" section of my Webster's > New World Dictionary to see how many words there really are in the > (American version of the) English language that are intended to begin > with a silent "h." Admittedly, I was getting a little punchy near the > end, there, but I found a grand total of zero. This was done in > response to hearing "erb" earlier in the day, and then being reminded > by one of the Rockets' broadcasters, who insists on calling them the > "Yuston Rockets," talking about the characteristically high "yumidity" > outside the Summit, and proclaiming what a great "yuman being" Hakeem > Olajuwan is. (And yes, he used to be "Akeem" until he gently but > impressively corrected the PR department, as I heard it told.)
A British journalist mentioned this in a humorous aside a while back, after hearing a Texan talk about the Houston Symphony..."Wow. I'd been to Euston lots of times but didn't realize there was room in that tube stop"--read subway station--"for a whole symphony orchestra." It can't have been a particularly "yuge" one.
>And furthermore: "it's" means it is. "Its" means belonging to it.
>Don't get me started on "their", "there" and "they're".
>Joan
Don't get you started on 'their', 'there', and 'they're', that would be rich, considering 'dammit' is NOT a word in the English language. This cooking business is a riot run amok! ( amuk is a variant of amuck, therefore, one may consider this about food in some abstract sense ) Besides, frankly Joan, I don't give a damn! Out damn spot, out! An Im outta ere.
>> If you are British the "H" is said but if you are American then the "H" >> is silent. We say "erb" NOT "Herb" in the good, old USA.
>Unless your name is Julia Child. She uses what you call the British >pronunciation. Both pronunciations are used in the U.S., although non-silent >"H" is less common -- at least, that what my online Webster's says... >-- >James Harvey har...@iupui.edu Disclaimer: My opinions; I don't speak for IU.
And, yes, if you read my later article on this subject I stated the above. I was writing in general not specific terms when discussing how to pronounce herb.
Most people in the US say "erb" making the h silent. Not all but most. Either way is technically correct but again I was writing in general terms.
Now would you like to join me in writing about how to pronounce forte correctly?
I'm from PA, now living in TX. I know you wonderful RFC folks will find it in your hearts to forgive me if I'm kind of immune to some stuff involving pronunciation. I won't get started on the Texas dialect, but I will deposit these as I go: UMbrella, INsurance, tenny runners (if you don't know what they are, I can't say I blame you -- I was agog when I found out, myself). And, of course, there's CoCola, ballpoint pins, and other things that leave me embarrassed during conversations and asking quietly for translations. But then I've found myself saying "y'all" when I go home for Christmas. Blank stares returned. Blank stare reflected, and suddenly I realized that I'd been coopted.
Anyway, where I come from in PA, we say "crick." We say "ROdeeoh;" "Oregon," as far as I can remember, isn't pronounced the same way by everybody; and airplanes have engines. Motors are reserved for things like washing machines and solid-rocket boosters. (We also say "youze," as an obvious home-grown version of "y'all.")
I once decided to go through the entire "h" section of my Webster's New World Dictionary to see how many words there really are in the (American version of the) English language that are intended to begin with a silent "h." Admittedly, I was getting a little punchy near the end, there, but I found a grand total of zero. This was done in response to hearing "erb" earlier in the day, and then being reminded by one of the Rockets' broadcasters, who insists on calling them the "Yuston Rockets," talking about the characteristically high "yumidity" outside the Summit, and proclaiming what a great "yuman being" Hakeem Olajuwan is. (And yes, he used to be "Akeem" until he gently but impressively corrected the PR department, as I heard it told.)
Please, no flames, especially from Texas -- I *love* this country!!! If you *really* want to "hear" some strange things, I'd tell you about some things I used to hear in Rhode Island, but this keyboard won't let me transliterate effectively enough...
>>And furthermore: "it's" means it is. "Its" means belonging to it.
>>Don't get me started on "their", "there" and "they're".
>>Joan
>Don't get you started on 'their', 'there', and 'they're', that would be >rich, considering 'dammit' is NOT a word in the English language. This >cooking business is a riot run amok! ( amuk is a variant of amuck, >therefore, one may consider this about food in some abstract sense ) >Besides, frankly Joan, I don't give a damn! Out damn spot, out! An Im >outta ere.
> Don't get you started on 'their', 'there', and 'they're', that would be > rich, considering 'dammit' is NOT a word in the English language. This > cooking business is a riot run amok! ( amuk is a variant of amuck, > therefore, one may consider this about food in some abstract sense ) > Besides, frankly Joan,
>> This thread reminds me of several other pronunciations that >>suffer several interpretations'
>> A. Creek: East of the Rockies the unlettered call it creek >>(rhymes with peek. We in the west call it Creek but it rhymes >>with sick, pick, crick.
>Ah'm in good ol' Texas, East of the Rockies but West of the >Miss'ssip', and here most people say crick (Ah don't, but Momma >was born in New York an' Ah learned the word from her).
>> b. Easterners call a rodeo a ro-DAY-oh. God that is awful. >> Westerners call it a ro=DEE -oh (one exception here, the >> shopping center in Hollywood is properly pronounced ro-DAY-oh >> drive) but people who frequent rfc are not apt to be shopping >> there anyway. ( Very ritzy place.)..
>In Texas it's RO-dee-oh in all uses. Allatime.
>The one that gets me is people who say y'all when they're >talkin' to one person. It's the second person plural, dammit! >(Yankees usually make that mistake when they try to use the >word, poor things, but everyone I've ever met from Kentucky uses >it that way too.)
>-- > - Boggles, aka Jennifer Boggess bogg...@io.com > omo...@brewich.com > "I'm the one you're looking for; lay your burden down" > - Beans Barton
-- That's because they are replacing the Yankee colloquialism "youze" with the Southern "y'all." I'm not entirely certain, but think that "youze" could be construed to be either first person singular or second person plural, whereas "youze guys" is most definitely the second person plural. Perhaps these people are attempting to replace the greater "mankind" with "y'all."
What seems curious to me is my last name, "Thames." As Americans, we pronounce the "h" in the word, starting it with the "th" sound. In the past, my husband, Danny and I have received some excellent restaurant seatings because "Danny Thomas" was coming to dinner. We do frequently get queries as to pronunciation, but the really worst is when you try to help people spell it and state that it's spelled like the river. The return response? . . ."What river"?
FOOD: Tried to make the "cooked" version of the key lime pie yesterday, what I got was OK, but I was unable to get "key" lime juice in my area of Houston, TX! I've purchased it bottled in the past, but none of the local groceries seem to be carrying it now.
Oboy, pronounciation! Wait; if "Thames" is spelled "like the river" is it also pronounced like the river? But where the H did the "h" go? A helluva question. Like an earlier poster, I get impatient sometimes and put yarbs in my cookin. (Is it anal-retentive to put a hyphen in "cook-in"?) I grew up in PA too, near Harrisburg, and creeks were creaks except for one: The Crick, which flowed by us just down the block. I must've been 15 before it occurred to me that The Crick probably had a name, and so it does: Spring Creek. (Boing!) I find "y'all" entirely too useful and clarifying to relegate to a regionalism. Y'all can't keep it all to y'allselves anymore. "Y'all" for Standard English! And Texasisms. Yow. I had a Texan housemate who had very little of the accent left except for when she tartured the harses and went shopping at Woolsworth's. Though I think she says "INsurance" too, etc. ("ETcet'ra"?) There seems to be a certain perverse pride in mangling Spanish, especially in place names, in Texas and California, Loss Anj'lus being one example; how did that pretty Spanish word for "yellow" end up being "Aamurilluh" rhymes with "gorilla"?
: HH Struve (hhstr...@aol.com) wrote: : : : : ke...@cybercash.com says about Martha Stewart : : : : > That doesn't bother me too much...what REALLY bugs me is the way she : : > says Herbs. With a big "H" sound. HHHHHHHHHHerbs. ack. :) : : : : I took a short and very elementary course about growing and using herbs in : : which we watched a video. There was a section featuring Marcella Hazan and : : her cooking school which was the best thing in the course. Anyway, the : : narrator of the video I believe was British or Welsh? (the Richard Burton : : sound), and he pronounced herbs with the big "H" sound.
: Of course, because that _is_ the way to say it!
: --Geeta
not up here! in Canada, we primarily say " 'erb"--the French influence i've always assumed-- helen g. vancouver bc hgodo...@unixg.ubc.ca
In article <APC&1'0'567974ab'...@igc.apc.org>, ronsulli...@igc.apc.org says...
>I find "y'all" entirely too useful and clarifying to relegate to a >regionalism. Y'all can't keep it all to y'allselves anymore. "Y'all" >for Standard English! >And Texasisms. Yow. I had a Texan housemate who had very little of the >accent left except for when she tartured the harses and went shopping >at Woolsworth's. Though I think she says "INsurance" too, etc. >("ETcet'ra"?) There seems to be a certain perverse pride in mangling >Spanish, especially in place names, in Texas and California, Loss >Anj'lus being one example; how did that pretty Spanish word for >"yellow" end up being "Aamurilluh" rhymes with "gorilla"?
> On Jul 19, 1996 01:33:18 in article <Re: How to pronounce Herb?>, > 'bogg...@io.com (Jennifer Boggess)' wrote:
> >The one that gets me is people who say y'all when they're talkin' to one > >person. It's the second person plural, dammit! (Yankees usually make > >that mistake when they try to use the word, poor things, but everyone I've
> >ever met from Kentucky uses it that way too.)
> Same problem with incorrect usage of "youse," as in "youse guys."
> -- > Sue (tm) > Lead me not into temptation.... I can find it myself!
Actually, I learned after a trip to Nashville that Y'all is singular... Youse All is Plural!
In article <31F3B4A2.2...@pris.bc.ca>, jdeere.pris.bc.ca wrote: > Sue M. Ford wrote:
> > On Jul 19, 1996 01:33:18 in article <Re: How to pronounce Herb?>, > > 'bogg...@io.com (Jennifer Boggess)' wrote:
> > >The one that gets me is people who say y'all when they're talkin' to one > > >person. It's the second person plural, dammit! (Yankees usually make > > >that mistake when they try to use the word, poor things, but everyone I've
> > >ever met from Kentucky uses it that way too.)
> > Same problem with incorrect usage of "youse," as in "youse guys."
> > -- > > Sue (tm) > > Lead me not into temptation.... I can find it myself!
> Actually, I learned after a trip to Nashville that Y'all is singular... > Youse All is Plural!
Horse apples. Y'all is the second person plural. All Y'all refers either to a very large group of people or to a group of people about which you are speaking, when you're speaking to a subset of that group. If you're talking to Bob and Elyse Lanier, it's y'all. If you're talking to them about everyone who works in Houston's City Hall, or addressing that whole crowd of city officials at once, it's all y'all. The Nashvillians have obviously been corrupted by the Kentucky usage. ;)
-- - Boggles, aka Jennifer Boggess bogg...@io.com omo...@brewich.com "I'm the one you're looking for; lay your burden down" - Beans Barton
> Oboy, pronounciation! > Wait; if "Thames" is spelled "like the river" is it also pronounced > like the river? But where the H did the "h" go? A helluva question. > Like an earlier poster, I get impatient sometimes and put yarbs in my > cookin. (Is it anal-retentive to put a hyphen in "cook-in"?) > I grew up in PA too, near Harrisburg, and creeks were creaks except for > one: The Crick, which flowed by us just down the block. I must've been > 15 before it occurred to me that The Crick probably had a name, and so > it does: Spring Creek. (Boing!) > I find "y'all" entirely too useful and clarifying to relegate to a > regionalism. Y'all can't keep it all to y'allselves anymore. "Y'all" > for Standard English! > And Texasisms. Yow. I had a Texan housemate who had very little of the > accent left except for when she tartured the harses and went shopping > at Woolsworth's. Though I think she says "INsurance" too, etc. > ("ETcet'ra"?) There seems to be a certain perverse pride in mangling > Spanish, especially in place names, in Texas and California, Loss > Anj'lus being one example; how did that pretty Spanish word for > "yellow" end up being "Aamurilluh" rhymes with "gorilla"?
> obFood: Don't talk with your mouth full.
> ron
Well Ron,
I lived in PA for 20 years where I heard words like 'creaks' and 'cricks'. Then, I moved to New York and heard many other different pronounciations of the same words heard just 150 miles south of them. No matter where you go everyone has their own way of talking. Ever been to Long Island, The Bronx, or Brooklyn?? Now, I'm living in Texas. Sure they say "Y'all" but what exactly are you getting at? All this for the answer of the pronounciation of the word h-e-r-b. Do you own a dictionary...Webster said it's pronounced either way (with or without the H sound. And as for your invention of the word for yellow in spanish, it is "armarillo." Perhaps you should study your dictionary more and then you'll learn how to pronounce words and spell them correctly. I wonder how you're pronouncing these words as you read them, maybe to the Texans you sound like some dumb yankee. Maybe they're right??
In article <edrich.414.00208...@halcyon.com>, edr...@halcyon.com (Ed Rich) says:
>I >>PLEASE Orry-gun or alternatively Orry-g'n, but _never_ anything >>ending in "gone". It's a state, not a noble gas.
>>Yes you are absolutely right. As soon as I hit the "post" button I realized >my error and have spent a very sleepless night worrying about it. I deserve to >be thrashed with a strand of long spaghetti-al dente. It is ORY-GUN. >`````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` ````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` >Moosemeat: > If you think the creator didn't have a sense > of humor look at the person next to you.,
Well, you _seem_ repentent enough.
Now, repeat after me, "Willamette" and, "The Dalles".
Bob Brunjes Asterisk r...@oz.net Engineering (360) 293-0620 Communication
In article <4svr9k$...@tabloid.amoco.com>, PET <petha...@amoco.com> writes:
>FOOD: Tried to make the "cooked" version of the key lime pie >yesterday, what I got was OK, but I was unable to get "key" lime >juice in my area of Houston, TX! I've purchased it bottled in >the past, but none of the local groceries seem to be carrying it >now.
Why don't you try callilng Williams Somona (if you don't have one in your neck of the woods). and see if they can mail you some. Their 800 number is:
In article <4t5v7v$...@hermes.cair.du.edu> sfo...@odin.cair.du.edu (sgf) writes: >From: sfo...@odin.cair.du.edu (sgf) >Subject: Re: How to pronounce Herb? >Date: 24 Jul 1996 19:57:50 GMT >In article <31F3B4A2.2...@pris.bc.ca>, >Brent Washington <jdeere.pris.bc.ca> wrote: >>Actually, I learned after a trip to Nashville that Y'all is singular... >>Youse All is Plural! >Must be a combination of North and South there -- farther South, "ya" or >"y' "is singular and "y'all" is plural. I have never heard a Southerner >use "youse" in any way.
When I was working in OKC, y'all was singular OR plural.
: >There are other words in English which you can pronounce with a : >silent H, like hotel and history. To me it sounds contrived, but then I : am : >Danish, so who am I to say.
: Otel and istory? To me they sound contrived, but then I'm dying of the : heat, so who am I to say.
It was a fashion thing. For a period (typically, I can't even remember which century I'm about to talk about) it was very fashionable to pronounce words (mainly those borrowed from French) without the initial 'h'. Therefore we had 'otel, 'istory, 'erb, even 'ouse and so on. After a while the fashion changed, as fashions will, and the language users for whom this was fashionable grew older, so people started to pronounce the words as they were written, with an initial 'h'.
The first trend travelled to the States, the second didn't. 'erb is the normal American pronunciation, herb the British. However, lots of people still 'drop' the aitches - my Dad still says an 'otel.
BTW, I suspect that the fashion changed once the trend got to the 'bottom' of society. As soon as 'common' people started dropping the aitches the pronounced h came in. It was the same with the dropped 'g' in huntin', shootin' and fishin...
In article <31F3B4A2.2...@pris.bc.ca>, Brent Washington <jdeere.pris.bc.ca> wrote:
>Actually, I learned after a trip to Nashville that Y'all is singular... >Youse All is Plural!
Must be a combination of North and South there -- farther South, "ya" or "y' "is singular and "y'all" is plural. I have never heard a Southerner use "youse" in any way.
--Stephanie -- sfo...@odin.cair.du.edu <*> http://phoebe.cair.du.edu/~sfolse/ "Assiduous and frequent questioning is indeed the first key to wisdom ...for by doubting we come to inquiry; through inquiring we perceive the truth..." --Peter Abelard (..........I claim this .sig for Queen Elizabeth)
In article <4sruci$...@news.iwl.net> MJCint...@iwl.net (Mark J. Cintala) writes:
> ne of the Rockets' broadcasters, who insists on calling them the > "Yuston Rockets," talking about the characteristically high "yumidity" > outside the Summit, and proclaiming what a great "yuman being" Hakeem > Olajuwan is. (And yes, he used to be "Akeem" until he gently but
I thought this was a West Coast thing. I always remember Carl Sagan on _Cosmos_ referring to the 'yuman race' at least 10 times per episode.
I wasn't aware our species had originated in Yuma...
Miche
------------ michelle.campb...@stonebow.otago.ac.nz What I post is my opinion only. "Security and insanity are not the same thing!" - Alex, _Shallow Grave_
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