contra dance band questions
Barry Angell
I've been playing fiddle tunes with friends for a few years now,
and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
Please help us form the right band:
1. What is the necessary minimum instrumentation?
Are fiddle and guitar enough? Do we need a bass player?
It's easier to keep a small band together.
2. What tunes would be absolutely required?
We know plenty, but we may have missed some of the essentials.
3. How much can a band expect to take home from a dance?
We're doing this because we love the music (and the dance),
but we still need to buy gas, etc.
4. I'd especially like the names and phone numbers of callers,
even if they're not in my area,
so that I can chat about the process of landing jobs.
5. Any other advice is welcome.
Please e-mail responses. If you want a summary, send e-mail and I'll copy you.
Thanks
--
Barry Angell
Home 916-265-2983
Work 916-478-3749
Dan Pearl
>
> I've been playing fiddle tunes with friends for a few years now,
> and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
> Please help us form the right band:
I'm a caller. Not a musician, but I'll try.
> 1. What is the necessary minimum instrumentation?
> Are fiddle and guitar enough? Do we need a bass player?
> It's easier to keep a small band together.
It's easy, and it's hard. You could be like Wild Asparagus, with a consistent
core plus variable add-ons. You could be like Yankee Ingenuity, with a fairly
stable medium-sized band (which survived the departure of its lead fiddler,
years ago). With TWO musicians, you had better really like one another
because it takes only ONE upset person to destroy the band.
Musically speaking, it takes two: a melody instrument (usually fiddle), and
a rhythm instrument (typically piano or guitar). Being ON all the time might
make it exhausting work for a single lead instrument. Consider the halls you'll
want to play. In large halls with lots of dancers, two musicians often sound
thin. And forget about harmonies with a band of two.
> 2. What tunes would be absolutely required?
> We know plenty, but we may have missed some of the essentials.
The only essential tunes are the chestnuts: Chorus Jig, Rory O'More,
Hull's Victory, Petronella. If you play for singing squares, be sure to
know that material, too. You probably know Fair Jenny's Jig and
Dancing Bear; there are LOTS more tunes that you could learn. I like it
when dance bands discover their own material and really get the most out
of the tunes. The Fiddlehead's rendition of "Guns and Drums" comes to mind.
Listen, read, select, and form your own sound.
Don't learn Soldier's Joy.
>
> 3. How much can a band expect to take home from a dance?
> We're doing this because we love the music (and the dance),
> but we still need to buy gas, etc.
This is widely variable depending on the circumstances. As you start and
gain a reputation, be prepared to play for gas money alone.
> 4. I'd especially like the names and phone numbers of callers,
> even if they're not in my area,
> so that I can chat about the process of landing jobs.
You'll get more pertinent information by talking to local callers. I'm not
sure where you live but you might want to look up these people:
Flip Alpern, Ukiah
Charlie Fenton, S.F.
Eric Black, S.F.?
Jim Saxe, Palo Alto
> 5. Any other advice is welcome.
I hope that you have danced a lot. Continue to dance, and concentrate on
what makes for fun dance music.
Good luck!
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Pearl ** Stratus Computer, Inc. ** pe...@spectacle.sw.stratus.com
Gregory J. Sandell
writes:
>
> I've been playing fiddle tunes with friends for a few years now,
> and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
> Please help us form the right band:
I can answer this question with respect to Northern style music (Irish,
French Canadian, New England).
>
> 1. What is the necessary minimum instrumentation?
> Are fiddle and guitar enough? Do we need a bass player?
> It's easier to keep a small band together.
Fiddle & guitar or fiddle & piano will do it; bass player not necessary
(although delightful). If you are new to playing this kind of music, try
to find at least one "strong player" (good solid rhythm...either a melody
instrument or a backup instrument) to play in the band. Adding mandolin
or banjo to this mix will work. Avoid at all costs having both a piano
and guitar player in the same band unless one of them is a very quiet
player or if both of them are practically sleeping together. :-) Except
for when the two have a really strong musical partnership, these two
instruments will fight each other. Avoid putting a dulcimer player in
your band (ask your local experienced musician for why, I don't want to
touch that hot topic).
> 2. What tunes would be absolutely required?
> We know plenty, but we may have missed some of the essentials.
Hard to answer this. On the one hand you have tunes that callers may want
to hear for specific dances like Rory O'More, Chorus Jig, Petronella, Levi
Jackson Rag, which use tunes of the same title. On the other hand you may
want to know a "core" set of tunes that insure that you'll be able to play
with any random contradance musician who may join your band or sit in with
you. A few tunes that come to mind for me (and this is a tiny subset)
are: You Married My Daughter But You Didn't, Kesh Jig, Coleraine, Drowsy
Maggie, Morrison's Jig, Merry Blacksmith, Spootiskerry, Redwing. Of
course this is affected by regional tastes...here in California I'm
finding that not many people have heard Spootiskerry.
Another answer to this question is making sure you know a smattering of
different tune styles. Make sure to have more than just reels (4/4 time)
tunes...callers want jigs now and then (maybe 2-3 sets of jigs in one
night). Have some reels that really "cook" and some that are more
relaxed. Have a southern style tune around for squares. Know a polka and
hambo for couples dancing, and a waltz for the end (and work on getting
that waltz tempo RIGHT!...consult a dancer). Do tunes in both major and
minor.
A good way to learn the "basic tunes" is to get some of the classic
recordings (and sorry, I have no idea which are still in print and which
are not): Swallowtail's first two albums, the Kaynor's first (only?)
album, Yankee Inginuity's first album. (and sorry again for being no help
with titles here.)
> 3. How much can a band expect to take home from a dance?
> We're doing this because we love the music (and the dance),
> but we still need to buy gas, etc.
If the dance is a paying dance, you should never allow the gas
expenditures to exceed the payment, in my book. Apart from this, each
musician should get ca. $30 minimum, I think. On the other hand, if you
are in a small town (Grass Valley, CA?), they might not be charging enough
at the door or get enough attendance to support that...
Most dances pay a flat fee for the band (fewer players = more money per),
but in Chicago (and maybe some other places) they pay a flat fee for each
musician.
> 4. I'd especially like the names and phone numbers of callers,
> even if they're not in my area,
> so that I can chat about the process of landing jobs.
How about joining the Country Dance and Song Society? They probably have
a directory of callers. someone else on the net may have the address for
this organization...
>
> 5. Any other advice is welcome.
Have you been to any of the big dance festivals, or dance camps or dance
weekends? There's nothing like the catalyst of a major event like Neffa,
Port Townsend, Sugar Hill or Ashokan (did I cover enough of the country
here? :-) to galvanize you into wanting to learn as quickly as possible
and learning the "spirit" of contradance playing.
Form your tunes into "sets" of tunes (two or three) that make nice
contrasts and progressions. Try combining tunes in different
keys...staying in G or D can be as boring as staying on the same tune.
Try choosing sets of tunes where the last tune is really upbeat, often
major key. (The classic closing "upbeat tune" is Joys of Quebec.)
And now one of the biggest things that will affect whether you get hired
again: band togetherness and participation in the dance. Here are the
rules:
1) Start a dance right when the caller says she/he is ready. If there is
a lag between teaching and actual dancing you ruin whatever continuity she
has created, and make her look bad as a caller. Start picking your next
tune as soon as the previous dance is over.
2) Starting off with a clear, unmistakable "four potatoes" and having
everyone come in crisply.
3) Watch the caller carefully; all of you should be ready to end crisply
at his signal. Someone in the band should take the responsibility of
shouting "OUT!" (as loud as necessary, don't be shy) about 8-16 measures
before the ending.
Footnote: never tolerate a caller who:
(a) tells you to end at some time other than the end of the second "B"
(except for southern squares, where this is quite acceptable);
(b) gives you less than 16 measures (i.e. a whole "B" section) warning
that the dance is ending.
[ Regular violators of these two rules do not belong on the stage! ]
Good luck!
--
Greg Sandell
Research Fellow, Center for New Music and Audio Technologies (CNMAT)
san...@cnmat.cnmat.berkeley.edu or san...@garnet.berkeley.edu
Jonathan Robie
>I've been playing fiddle tunes with friends for a few years now,
>and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
>Please help us form the right band:
I play for contras at dance festivals in Germany, and I teach the
open band for our contra dances in Berlin.
If you have been playing fiddle tunes but not playing for dances there
are a few things you should watch out for:
1. Tempo Contra dances are generally played at a tempo between
112 and 120. There are regional variations and this
changes over the decades, but this is a good guideline.
Be ready to play anything anywhere between these two
speeds, depending on the time the caller set. Make
sure you can hold a steady tempo without speeding up
(OK, this is something we all struggle with...)
2. Phrasing Music for contra dances is usually *very* strongly phrased.
Watch the dance and try to complement the phrasing of the
dance. If there is a balance, lift the dancers off the
floor!
3. Starting and stopping
When you start or stop, do it cleanly. When some bands
start they sound like a bagpipe filling up with air, and
get solid during the first phrase. This leave the dancers
confused. When you stop, let the music clearly signal that
you are coming to an end so the dancers know when to stop.
Learn to take signals from the caller.
4. Playing for dance
This is an attitude rather than a technique. At a dance,
the only interesting criterion for music is how well it
supports the dance. A lot of fancy ornamentation, wild
solos, etc. can often distract from the strong phrasing
needed for contras. Some of the things that are lots of
fun for musicians muddy up the phrasing for the dancers.
I'm not saying you have to play plain vanilla, but you
do have to learn how to make your ornamentation and
improvisation complement strong, simple phrasing.
And remember that you are going to have lots of people
out on the dance floor stomping around. Subtle fingerpicking
won't be heard very well. You may have to change your playing
style to slice through the noise.
Incidentally, Berea has a workshop for dance musicians at their Christmas
school which focuses on the difference between playing music and playing dance
music. I attended this workshop twice and enjoyed it immensely. I assume that
other dance weeks have similer workshops.
>1. What is the necessary minimum instrumentation?
>Are fiddle and guitar enough? Do we need a bass player?
>It's easier to keep a small band together.
If you are rock solid and have a sound system then fiddle and guitar
may be enough. I find the extra sound and security of three players
much better. I have no problem keeping a band with three to five players
together. Ten is a bit harder. Incidentally, seating people close
together can help.
>2. What tunes would be absolutely required?
>We know plenty, but we may have missed some of the essentials.
This depends on your dance community. Only a few dances require particular
tunes. Dan mentioned some that are relevant to his area. As Dan says,
having your own distinctive tunes is nice.
Ask your local callers what tunes they find essential.
Jonathan
===========================================================================
Jonathan Robie jro...@netmbx.UUCP
Arnold-Zweig-Str. 44 jro...@netmbx.in-berlin.de
O-1100 Berlin
Deutschland Phone: +37 (2) 472 04 19 (Home, East Berlin)
+49 (30) 342 30 66 (Work, West Berlin)
--
Jonathan
===========================================================================
Paul Viscuso
|> In article <47...@gold.gvg.tek.com>, bar...@gold.gvg.tek.com (Barry Angell) writes:
|> >
|> > I've been playing fiddle tunes with friends for a few years now,
|> > and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
|> > Please help us form the right band:
|>
I'll add my two cents. I'm a contra dance band member (8 years experience).
Greg Sandell made some good points, and I played with Greg for 2 years (those
were the days).
|>
|> > 1. What is the necessary minimum instrumentation?
|> > Are fiddle and guitar enough? Do we need a bass player?
|> > It's easier to keep a small band together.
|>
I play piano accordian, and in a pinch, you can get by with just that. However,
you really don't want to do that except for an intimate crowd. You need a good
rhythm instrument and a good melody instrument, and both need to be heard. If
you have two or more people providing chords, they should make sure that they're
going to play the same chord at the same time. In some tunes, I like to play
different chords for the same measure, so it can be a problem with a piano player
who doesn't know me. Small bands can have difficulties - if you're headstrong,
don't expect it to last. A band is like a marriage - compromise and enjoy the
music.
|>
|> > 2. What tunes would be absolutely required?
|> > We know plenty, but we may have missed some of the essentials.
|>
I don't believe that you have to know any of the standard tunes. We've played
Klezmer music for contra dances, and the folks have loved it (usually). There's
a lot of wonderful music to be found that isn't "standard". One example is
Bayard's book on old Pennsylvania fiddle and fife music. The chestnuts are in
there, but so are a lot of good tunes that aren't standard chestnuts. Don't
limit yourself to what others play, be imaginative, be unique, be yourselves.
Some of the "old chestnuts" also aren't that old. There's a lot of people
writing wonderful tunes (e.g., Mike Bell in New Haven). Unless you plan on
playing with other bands, don't worry too much about what tunes to know.
|> >
|> > 3. How much can a band expect to take home from a dance?
|> > We're doing this because we love the music (and the dance),
|> > but we still need to buy gas, etc.
|>
I've played with bands where I got $0. I've also played at dances and got $100.
In general, it does depend, and many of the smaller dances simply can't afford to
pay much. In the beginning, you may find yourself subsidizing the band habit,
but eventually, it will start paying for itself if you're liked by the dancers.
At present, in the Ithaca NY area, we do okay if we make $20-30 a piece.
|>
|> > 4. I'd especially like the names and phone numbers of callers,
|> > even if they're not in my area,
|> > so that I can chat about the process of landing jobs.
|>
I agree with Dan Pearl, talk to your local callers. In some areas I've lived in,
dances are owned by the bands, so new bands find it difficult getting a foot in
the door (e.g., Amherst MA area). I hope you live in an area that's more open
minded.
|>
|>
|> > 5. Any other advice is welcome.
|>
If you dance, listen to the bands. Talk to band members during breaks or after
the dance, and after a while, you may even ask to sit in with some of the bands.
This is a great way to get new material, new ideas, and make valuable contacts.
I learned a lot sitting in with the Kaynors in Greenfield and Northfield, with
playing with a house band in Syracuse, and playing the Swallowtail fiddler when I
was at UMass (we both worked in the same department). You don't need to limit
yourself to only playing music with one band. Don't expect to get paid if you
sit in with a band, however. Good luck and have fun.
Paul Viscuso
Cornell Theory Center
vis...@tc.cornell.edu
Toby Koosman
that New England is not the only possible model. There are some communities
that have built a successful contra dance culture around regional music,
notably Birmingham, Bloomington, and perhaps Asheville; unfortunately not
Knoxville, which suffers from New England envy to such an extent that some
people have proposed paying bands that play jigs more than those that don't.
(I consider this thinly disguised cultural chauvinism, since the Southern
mountain repertoire contains no jigs).
By the way, as a caller my thumbs are down on "Drowsy Maggie" or any other
tune with non-repeating parts. Just because the music comes out right at the
end of the dance doesn't mean it fits: if the first and second half of the
dance have identical music it can easily confuse the caller and dancers, and
it's not what the choreographer intended. DON'T DO IT!! (Don't do it to me
anyway.)
Hey, Paul--where do you find 32-bar klezmer tunes?
Toby Koosman
University of Tennessee Knoxville, Tennessee USA
Internet: koo...@utkvx.utk.edu Bitnet: koosman@utkvx
John Chambers
> and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
> Please help us form the right band:
In recent years, I've been playing for many more Scottish dances than
for contras, but they're pretty much the same (which will probably get
me a bunch of flames ;-). So I'll toss out my $.02 worth ...
> 1. What is the necessary minimum instrumentation?
> Are fiddle and guitar enough? Do we need a bass player?
> It's easier to keep a small band together.
I'd strongly suggest either a bass with the guitar or a piano and no
guitar. The piano player has to be the sort that is happy playing
backup (bass line and chords), and not all piano players will accept
this (just the ones that have learned the joys of improvising good
bass lines). Most of the dancers don't hear the music; they only hear
the beat, and your sound will be judged 90% on how good a beat you
have. The other 10% will be your appreciative audience, but since they
are dancing, too, they will also need a good beat.
A lone fiddler can get really tired, and the sound gets boring unles
the fiddler is incredibly good. It's a *lot* more fun with two or
three different melody instruments. As hinted above, you are mostly
playing to each other (and to the few musicians among the dancers), so
you will have more fun if there are more musicians. You can trade off
the lead against unisons, play harmonies, etc. While the fiddle may be
the "standard" melody instrument, it's better to have variety. The
ideal would probably be three fiddlers, each of which plays one other
melody instrument (mandolin, clarinet, flute, concertina or accordion,
banjo, hammered dulcimer, ...). An occasional nothing-but-fiddles
passage is a really great effect, but it's most effective if used
sparingly.
> 2. What tunes would be absolutely required?
> We know plenty, but we may have missed some of the essentials.
It's a good idea to have a list divided up by type. I'd suggest at
least the five types (but note that some tunes fall into more than one
of these types):
1. Title tunes.
These are the only really "essential" tunes. Ask your callers, and
learn all the tunes for their favorite dances that have title
tunes. Insist that they warn you well ahead of time of any special
tune they will want, or they won't get it. This is especially true
for the "singing calls" dances, but it's always nice to start and
end a medley with a dance's title tune, if it has one. All the rest
of your tunes are up to you, though it can be useful to share tunes
with other musicians that you may meet. The other four classes here
are useful for matching the feel of a particular dance.
2. Fast "bouncy" reels.
The ones that are mostly quarter notes; marches and polkas will do
fine here. Jamie Allen, My Love is But a Lassie, Trip to Boston,
Farewell to Whiskey, Rose Tree, and all those Irish songs that are
great dance tunes. With such simple tunes, you must take care not
to play them too fast.
3. Slow "smooth" reels.
The ones that are mostly eighth notes. Soldier's Joy and Petronella
are prototypes (though most experiences players refuse to play
Soldier's Joy ;-), Mason's Apron, Devil's Dream, Flowers of
Edinburgh, Saint Anne's, Spootiskerry, Scollay's, Dancing Bear, Old
Grey Cat, Lady in the Lake, any "diddley" reels that you like, and
just about anything labelled "hornpipe".
4. Fast jigs.
The ones with mostly four notes per measure. Coleraine, Kesh, Aunt
Mary's, Morrison's, and nearly anything whose name ends with
"slide" or "quickstep". You may have to practice playing them slow
enough for the dancers.
5. Slow jigs.
The ones with mostly six notes per measure, so you won't get
carried away with the tempo. Fair Jenny's, Mouse in the Cupboard,
Swallowtail, Cowboy's, Maggie's Favorite, ...
Plus of course a few waltzes, and maybe polkas or hambos or shottishes
if your local dancers know them.
> 5. Any other advice is welcome.
Trying to know too many tunes isn't necessarily a good idea. Many
people think that dancers will get bored if they hear the same tunes
over and over. The opposite is true: Dancers and callers will enjoy
hearing tunes that they recognize, and with time, they'll request
tunes that they think you do well. You'll get bored with your tunes
before your audience will. All you really need is a large enough
repertoire to get through one dance, which means maybe a dozen tunes
of each of the above types. Learn them well, and add maybe a tune or
two each month. Quality (which starts with a good beat) is a better
goal than quantity.
It can be fun and very useful to frequently get together with as many
other musicians as possible, and learn all their favorite tunes. Try
to include various compatible non-contra (Scottish, Irish, old-timey,
bluegrass, Cajun, Danish, klezmer) musicians; their tunes will give
your group some interesting variety. You will repeatedly run into
requests to play at a dance, and half your band won't be able to make
it; it's really useful to have a list of musicians that you can call
who share a sizeable repertoire. This will give you a reputation as
someone that can always be called on to supply good music. When those
other musicians need help, you might be available. If you view each
other as colleagues and resources (rather than as competitors), you'll
all have a lot more fun.
An important piece of advice is that musicians who have been playing
music together for a while will usually play too fast for dancing.
This is especially true for those with bluegrass experience, but it
happens with almost everyone. You need to learn to watch the dancers
for signs of incorrect speed and adjust appropriately. Teach your
callers to give speed hints. (A common one is a horizontal hand;
palm-up for faster, and palm-down for slower.) Learn to hold your
tempo steady. Practice playing on the slow side. You can always get
faster, but it's much harder to slow down.
It's good to have a "tempo dictator", usually the bass or piano
player, who is the unquestioned controller of the speed, and who
watches the caller and dancers. Musicians at first often feel there's
a "correct" speed for a tune and they drift toward that speed. Don't
let it happen. The correct speed is *always* the speed that fits the
dance; you need to modify the tune to match the speed, or pick a
different tune. Even if you have to stop and start over, it's better
than playing at the wrong speed. Dancers will forgive a few false
starts; they won't forgive a wrong tempo. A bass player who is a good
dancer can be invaluable here. A dancer who "is interested" in
learning bass is a better prospect than a hot-shot bass player who
isn't a dancer. The dancer can learn some simple bass patterns in a
few weeks; the non-dancing bass player will just force you to the
wrong tempo (with fancy bass lines that obscure the beat).
A final comment: if you're in it for the money, you're wasting your
time. If you're after fun and honor (and groupies and free admission
to lots of dance parties and workshops and camps ;-), go for it. But
don't let anyone trick you into taking it too seriously. As the saying
goes, you probably won't get out of it alive. Fifty years from now,
you'll still be working on some great new tune ...
Gregory J. Sandell
> Greg Sandell made some good points, and I played with Greg for 2 years
> (those were the days).
Thanks, Paul! I miss the swell of the mighty "Titano" (Paul's brand of
accordian).
> I don't believe that you have to know any of the standard tunes. We've
> played Klezmer music for contra dances, and the folks have loved it
> (usually).
In article <23JUN199...@utkvx1.utk.edu> tako...@utkvx1.utk.edu
(Toby Koosman) writes:
> Hey, Paul--where do you find 32-bar klezmer tunes?
Hey, Paul, time to plug our tape! The world's greatest contra-klezmer
contradance band (and coincidentally, the only one, as far as I know),
FOOL'S GOLD, has a tape called "Contras From the Old Country." Listen in
disbelief as you hear tunes such as Morrison's Jig and Skrip, Klezmerl,
Skrip played side-by-side! You'll find quite a few 32-bar klezmer tunes
on that tape. Is Ted Crane (tedc...@theory.tc.cornell.edu) still selling
these, Paul?
- Greg
Jonathan Robie
>On the subject of choosing music, allow me to get on my hobby-horse and say
>that New England is not the only possible model. There are some communities
>that have built a successful contra dance culture around regional music,
>notably Birmingham, Bloomington, and perhaps Asheville; unfortunately not
>Knoxville, which suffers from New England envy to such an extent that some
>people have proposed paying bands that play jigs more than those that don't.
>(I consider this thinly disguised cultural chauvinism, since the Southern
>mountain repertoire contains no jigs).
Check out the McClain Family Band's "Country Dance Album" for contra music
with a Southern flavor. The now-defunct band is from Berea, Kentucky.
Richard Wexelblat
: >
: > I've been playing fiddle tunes with friends for a few years now,
: > and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
: > Please help us form the right band:
More important: how do you play, how do you work with a caller? I don't
have time to write an exposition here, but I'll provide a few pointers
and perhaps those more experienced than I (Dan, are you there) can
expand.
Rule 1. Constant tempo (unless the caller asks you to change)
Rule 2.
... 99. ...same as rule 1! Suppress your artistic instincts!
Rule 100. The sound system is on! Keep your remarks to yourself! A
mike live at the wrong time can guarantee you won't be hired
by that group again.
Rule 101. If you don't know a specific tune well, don't fake it.
Rule 102. Watch the dancers and the caller while playing.
Rule 103. Don't tune or practice while the caller is teaching. If you
need a once through to yourselves ask the caller's
permission.
Rule 200. Learn caller's terms. They'll want a "strong march" or
"bouncy minor jig" or "smooth reel."
Rule 300. Get your own sound. don't be a new Wild Vegetable or "Barely
Necessary"
Rule 400. Just because you're great at contras, don't assume you can
play for English, Scottish, or WSD. They have their own
styles that need to be learned and practised.
Rule 500. The sound person can be your best friend or your worst enemy.
Rule 501. Consider buying your own sound system (make sure it fits in a
space you normally have (car, van, truck, etc.).
Rule 999. The caller is right (even when 100% wrong). If you get told
to cut in mid phrase, just do it and smile. After the dance,
you can let the caller know what worked and what didn't work.
Rule 1000.If you do freebies, they won't respect you. You're a
(putative) professional and deserve to be paid for your work!
(Exceptions are valid fund-raisers, wedding and birthday
dances for friends, etc., and, sigh, the early ones needed to
help you build your reputation.)
--
--Dick Wexelblat (r...@ida.org) 703 845 6601
Death is Nature's way of telling you to slow down.
Dan Pearl
>(various rules on band/caller interaction)
I like these "rules", Richard. Of course there are LOTS more. Maybe I'll
repost a lengthy collection...
> Rule 102. Watch the dancers and the caller while playing.
Also, watch the walk-thru. Observe how the dance will fit the tune. This
is a good time to finalize tune selection. Also, knowing where the dance
sequence begins can give you confidence to repair errors such as omitting
an A part. Many callers have no musical sense, and it will help the conduct
of the dance if you could take care of this.
> Rule 103. Don't tune or practice while the caller is teaching. If you
> need a once through to yourselves ask the caller's
> permission.
In my 13 years of calling, no musician has ever asked permission. Just play
at low volume, off mic.
> Rule 200. Learn caller's terms. They'll want a "strong march" or
> "bouncy minor jig" or "smooth reel."
Caller's terms are, unfortunately, not universal. Although you'll find
words like "bouncy","smooth", "bold", "notey", "old-timey", "Irish",
"Canadian", "minor", etc.
> Rule 300. Get your own sound. don't be a new Wild Vegetable or "Barely
> Necessary"
I love it! It's funny because it's true.
> Rule 999. The caller is right (even when 100% wrong). If you get told
> to cut in mid phrase, just do it and smile. After the dance,
> you can let the caller know what worked and what didn't work.
If there's time, it's fine to discuss your misgivings with the caller.
"Uhhh...Sure we can play those two tunes as a medley, but they are in
incompatible keys, so the transition would be jarring". Try and establish
a supportive, cooperative relationship with the callers. But Richard is
right: if the caller says "Cut right here!", then do it the best you can.
Make sure you have the signals worked out ahead of time, though!
John Chambers
|>
|> On the subject of choosing music, allow me to get on my hobby-horse and say
|> that New England is not the only possible model. There are some communities
|> that have built a successful contra dance culture around regional music,
|> notably Birmingham, Bloomington, and perhaps Asheville; unfortunately not
|> Knoxville, which suffers from New England envy to such an extent that some
|> people have proposed paying bands that play jigs more than those that don't.
|> (I consider this thinly disguised cultural chauvinism, since the Southern
|> mountain repertoire contains no jigs).
That's pretty silly. You should definitely use local material, so that
you don't end up Just Another Band with the same sound as all the
others. On the other hand, it doesn't hurt to stretch a little. And
the Southern tradition does actually contain some jigs; they just hd
their rhythm mangled to fit the local tradition. For instance, have
you ever heard the English country-dance version of Greensleeves? It's
a really nice jig, and recognizably the same tune as the ballad. You
can get some really interesting reactions the first time you play it
for unsuspecting dancers. Similarly, in Ireland, Rosin the Bow is one
of the waltz/ballad tunes that is occasionally heard as a jig. The
tunes weren't all lost; just the jig rhythm.
|> Hey, Paul--where do you find 32-bar klezmer tunes?
You generally don't, but this problem also exists with a lot of tunes
from the British Isles that are used for contras. You just tinker with
the repeats. Here in the Boston area, some well-known tunes are Maggie
Brown's Favorite (jig), Trip to Duro (reel), and Scollay's Reel; all
had non-32-bar phrasing in the original form. (The latter is a rather
garbled form of the much better 48-bar Irish step-dance hornpipe tune
"King of the Fairies".) All three were 32-bar-ized partly by not
repeating the B phrase; Maggie Brown's also has its 4-bar A phrase
played 4 times. The English tune Yarmouth Reel has 3 8-bar phrases; it
regularly gets played AABC. Some other 3-phrase tunes are played ABAC;
Campbell's Farewell to Redcastle comes to mind. Or you can leave out a
phrase if the rest sounds ok without it.
The old contra standard, Chorus Jig, is always played AABBAACC; that's
just "how the tune goes".
As an example from another tradition, the international crowd here has
a recording of Zemer Atik that uses the klezmer tune Yoshke as an
alternate. Zemer Atik is a 32-bar dance; the recording uses only the
first two phrases of Yoshke. (I think they should have done it
AABBAACC, because the hird phrase is a nice one, but it's too late to
argue it, I guess. ;-)
The klezmer tradition is so freewheeling anyway that I don't think
anyone there would complain (or even much notice) if you "mangled" one
of their tunes into 32 bars. They do even worse things to their tunes
all the time, so feel free...
It's even more fun playing for Scottish dancing. They have a lot of
48-bar, and a few 40-bar dances (e.g., Mairi's Wedding). No problem;
you just have to think a bit about whether tune X would work in AABBAB
or AABBA or ABABA or ABACC or whatever form. Some do; some don't.
David M. Cottle
>: In article <47...@gold.gvg.tek.com> bar...@gold.gvg.tek.com (Barry Angell)
>: writes:
>: >
>: > I've been playing fiddle tunes with friends for a few years now,
>: > and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
>: > Please help us form the right band:
>
(stuff deleted)
I've been watching this discussion for a while, waiting for a moment
where my perspective might be worthwhile. I am a dedicated dance
gypsy, but professional musician and audio engineer. I have never
played in a band mainly because that would mean I couldn't dance. I
also help our local group with the sound. I'm just learning to call.
As for instrumentation, the most enjoyable, most dancable bands in my
opinion are small: 2 or 3 (I've danced to one fiddle; she knew
her stuff and it was wonderful!). More just adds clutter. My favorite
combination is fiddle, guitar and banjo (if all know how to play) with
a fiddle, wind instrument, and guitar in close second. I think piano
is pointless in a contra format (understandable bias from a guitarist,
but the percussive sound of a guitar fits better).
>... 99. ...same as rule 1! Suppress your artistic instincts!
Here, here. And while I am the first (of not many) who recognize and
appreciate a creative group it should be done judiciously, and not at
the expense of clarity. Innovation usually a) is wasted on an audience
whose primary interest is to dance and b) undermines the success
of the dance (one instance involved an accordian player who would
change tunes, dances and tempi every 20 seconds or so during a break
waltz -- pretty creative, but pointless in a dancing context.)
>Rule 300. Get your own sound. don't be a new Wild Vegetable or "Barely
> Necessary"
And while I think our local system is better than most of what I've
seen out there we do appreciate a band that brings their own stuff and
knows how to use it.
>Rule 500. The sound person can be your best friend or your worst enemy.
Talk things over, but if it looks like he knows what he's doing,
trust him. Also be aware that 80% of a good sound is the performer's
responsibility (knowing how to use a mic).
Dave Cottle
UIUC School of Music
Balo ergo sum
Dan Pearl
> I think piano
> is pointless in a contra format (understandable bias from a guitarist,
> but the percussive sound of a guitar fits better).
Hmmm... I guess this depends on what you've been raised to expect. For
my money, a contradance piano is perferable to a guitar.
Some fine contra dance pianists that you might want to listen closer to:
Bob McQuillen - A legend. Unornamented, straight-ahead style. Strong
left hand.
Peter Barnes - "The foundation on which Boston contra dance music is based".
Peter is simply a genius. Without sacrificing dancibility, Peter
adds interest, variety, and musical jokes to boot. Listen to
"Heating Up the Hall" on Flying Fish (I believe).
I also enjoy calling with a skilled guitarist, but there is something about
those four potatoes on the piano...I hear echoes of all contra pianists
there ever were...it's moving, and it's magic.
Toby Koosman
(John Chambers) writes...
>the Southern tradition does actually contain some jigs; they just had
>their rhythm mangled to fit the local tradition.
>The old contra standard, Chorus Jig, is always played AABBAACC; that's
>just "how the tune goes".
Huh, I thought Chorus Jig was played ABCD, no repeats. It's been a while
but I feel like I would be going down the center and back during "B", and
besides, where is "D"? Maybe there's some variation in the way it's played.
>
I'm not saying I wouldn't do it, but sometimes I find it unpleasant to dance
to a familiar tune that's been mangled to make it contradanceable. Trip
to Paris comes to mind. I agree with you though that forcing klezmer tunes
into 32-bars does no particular violence to them.
Robert Cromartie
cot...@cmp-rt.music.uiuc.edu (David M. Cottle) writes:
>> I think piano
>> is pointless in a contra format (understandable bias from a guitarist,
>> but the percussive sound of a guitar fits better).
and Dan Pearl replies:
>Hmmm... I guess this depends on what you've been raised to expect. For
>my money, a contradance piano is perferable to a guitar.
>
>Some fine contra dance pianists that you might want to listen closer to:
>
> (stuff in praise of Bob McQuillan & Peter Barnes deleted)
>
If you're ever down this (Piedmont N.C.) way, you may want to
check out Pete Campbell (Footloose, Moose Chowder, etc.), another fine
piano player with a strong left hand...wonderful to dance to.
We are also blessed with some fine guitar players of both the
Old Time/Southern/Bluegrass and the New England/Irish/French Canadian
persuasion (please excuse my coarse categorization). Two who come to mind
are Joe Newberry (Tar Heel Hot Shots, Dulcimer Dan and the Blue Skies Band,
etc.) and Jay Clifford (Jump Little Children). Both provide a super-solid
rhythm that's great for dancing, something that is sometimes missing from
bands (even talented ones) that don't have either a piano or a bass.
I would certainly hate to be forced to choose between piano and
guitar, either when I call or when I dance, just as I would hate to have
to choose a single style of music once and for all. Fortunately, around
here there's LOTS of musical variety and lots of dancing (:-), so I don't
have to.
On another subject, j...@sppip7.lkg.dec.com (John Chambers) writes:
>The old contra standard, Chorus Jig, is always played AABBAACC; that's
>just "how the tune goes".
and tako...@utkvx1.utk.edu (Toby Koosman) writes:
>>Huh, I thought Chorus Jig was played ABCD, no repeats. It's been a while
>>but I feel like I would be going down the center and back during "B", and
>>besides, where is "D"? Maybe there's some variation in the way it's played.
Eh? I've never heard Chorus Jig played any way except ABCB (my guess
is that John intends AABBAACC to represent 32 bars, in which I should write
AABBCCBB and Toby should write AABBCCDD, but I'm obviously confused).
David M. Cottle
>In article <BqD1s...@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, cot...@cmp-rt.music.uiuc.edu (David M. Cottle) writes:
>> I think piano
>> is pointless in a contra format (understandable bias from a guitarist,
>> but the percussive sound of a guitar fits better).
>
>Hmmm... I guess this depends on what you've been raised to expect. For
>my money, a contradance piano is perferable to a guitar.
Upon reflection I guess I will admit that most of my opinion is
probably based on pianists who just do block chords ("boom-chuck").
And most of the bands I hear have a guitar *and* a pianist and the
added support translates into muddle. While I have heard (and enjoy)
both guitarists and pianists in creative support and lead roles, not
many pianists know how to give interesting, but simple (felt, not
heard) back up. I guess you could say I prefer a mediocre guitar to
a mediocre piano. (Maybe I expect more from a pianist? :) ).
But in support of a quitar (from a musician's, not dancer's perspective):
You can tune it (excluding the hassle of an electric piano, you're
never sure of a local piano's integrety).
You can play an accoustic job (as opposed to an electric piano).
You can put it in the front seat of a compact car (a fiddle/guitar/
flute band can travel light and perform/practice/jam anywhere).
It has a wider variety of textures (depending on the guitarist).
Guitarists are more inclined to double.
Guitarists are easier to get along with (<- gratuitous deprecation).
A guitar/violin/banjo makes for a well balanced stage (<-stretching).
>Some fine contra dance pianists that you might want to listen closer to:
Which is part of my point. The primary reason for a dance band is to
communicate essential information, the second is to provide something
worthy of listening closer. It is a rare treat to have both.
Dave Cottle
UIUC School of Music
balo ergo sum
Jonathan Robie
>In article <1992Jun24.1...@IDA.ORG>, r...@IDA.ORG (Richard Wexelblat) writes:
>>(various rules on band/caller interaction)
>> Rule 102. Watch the dancers and the caller while playing.
And adapt the phrasing to the dance. Incidentally, sometimes it can be
fun to try to influence the dancers a bit -- playing with a very strong
bounce to add energy to a sahshay, playing a passage smoothly one time
through and bouncy the second time through to add variety to the feel of
the dance...
>> Rule 103. Don't tune or practice while the caller is teaching. If you
>> need a once through to yourselves ask the caller's
>> permission.
>In my 13 years of calling, no musician has ever asked permission. Just play
>at low volume, off mic.
I suspect most musicians will need a once through, and I would not want
to tell my musicians not to tune...but there is really no good time to
do either from the caller's perspective. As a dance musician, I find myself
asked to play tunes I have not played for a long time. Either the caller
wants them, or I am with other musicians who have a different repertoire...
but there is no good place to squeeze it in. I usually do exactly what
Dan suggests--play quietly off in a back corner of the stage.
You suggest that the caller should give permission. As a caller, I have
to say that most callers don't have a lot of attention to spend on the
band. There are only three times that the band could play through
the next piece:
1. Before teaching the dance, while dancers are
forming the sets. This is unusual but can be
workable. I am doing this with our open band
which is largely beginning musicians because they
really need to play together with full volume
once before the dance starts.
2. While the dance is being taught. This seems to
be the most common time, but you really have to play
quietly. This has the advantage that the dancers don't
have to wait for the band, and that can be important
for the pace of an evening. You want to squeeze as much
dancing into an evening as possible.
3. After the dance has been taught, before the dance.
Bad idea. It makes the dancers wait when they want to
be dancing.
>> Rule 200. Learn caller's terms. They'll want a "strong march" or
>> "bouncy minor jig" or "smooth reel."
>Caller's terms are, unfortunately, not universal. Although you'll find
>words like "bouncy","smooth", "bold", "notey", "old-timey", "Irish",
>"Canadian", "minor", etc.
Notey?
>> Rule 999. The caller is right (even when 100% wrong). If you get told
>> to cut in mid phrase, just do it and smile. After the dance,
>> you can let the caller know what worked and what didn't work.
>If there's time, it's fine to discuss your misgivings with the caller.
>"Uhhh...Sure we can play those two tunes as a medley, but they are in
>incompatible keys, so the transition would be jarring". Try and establish
>a supportive, cooperative relationship with the callers. But Richard is
>right: if the caller says "Cut right here!", then do it the best you can.
>Make sure you have the signals worked out ahead of time, though!
Please remember that the caller has to pay lots of attention to the
dancers. This makes it hard to pay much attention to the band during
a dance.
If the caller suggests something that would be disastrous, point it out:
"The Waltz you suggested is 48 bars, and the dance seems to be 32 bars..."
Toby Koosman
Cromartie) writes...
> I would certainly hate to be forced to choose between piano and
>guitar, either when I call or when I dance
all worlds: I don't have to choose, and he can only play one instrument
at a time there's no competition between the instruments. I don't see
anything wrong with boom-chuck piano playing, that's a legitimate way to
use it as a rhythm base in dance music. It's use for melody should be
sparing.
On warm-ups and once-throughs: when I'm calling I find it very distracting
and difficult to teach while the band is practicing the tune they're about to
play. If it's a pick-up band I don't think it can be avoided, but if you
know who you're going to play with in advance, for God's sake REHEARSE!!
Also, show up early and do a sound-check. Please.
>[discussion of whether Chorus Jig is played AABBAACC,ABCD,ABCB]
Oops, sorry, what I think of as "D" is identical to "B". And I think you're
correct in interpretting AA as 8, not 16 bars--I thought John was playing
AABB and AACC alternate times through the dance.
Richard Wexelblat
: By the way, as a caller my thumbs are down on "Drowsy Maggie" or any other
: tune with non-repeating parts. Just because the music comes out right at the
: end of the dance doesn't mean it fits: if the first and second half of the
: dance have identical music it can easily confuse the caller and dancers, and
: it's not what the choreographer intended. DON'T DO IT!! (Don't do it to me
: anyway.)
What's the matter with Drowsy Maggie? I don't remember having any
problem with it. Is it a 48 bar tune?
Dan Pearl
> tako...@utkvx1.utk.edu (Toby Koosman) writes:
> : By the way, as a caller my thumbs are down on "Drowsy Maggie" or any other
> : tune with non-repeating parts.
>
> problem with it. Is it a 48 bar tune?
Ah, yes. I got bit by Drowsy Maggie, and learned a lesson from it, too.
Drowsy Maggie is a 16-bar tune (AB).
When I alerted the band "ONE MORE TIME!", the band thought I meant "One
more time through the tune", and they went out after halfway through the
dance sequence. Uh oh!
As a result of that experience (fairly early in my calling career) I prefer
not to hear any 16-bar tunes. If I hear one, I need to be very clear with
the band how much more to play. Having the first tune of a medley being
a 16-bar tune can be a problem if the band plays it an ODD number of times.
Re: Drowsy Maggie: You COULD play it AABB (some bands
around here do just that) but it sounds awful.
John Chambers
|> Path: nntpd.lkg.dec.com!news.crl.dec.com!deccrl!decwrl!mcnc!borg!ganglion!cromarti
|>
|> On another subject, j...@sppip7.lkg.dec.com (John Chambers) writes:
|> >The old contra standard, Chorus Jig, is always played AABBAACC; that's
|> >just "how the tune goes".
|>
|> and tako...@utkvx1.utk.edu (Toby Koosman) writes:
|> >>Huh, I thought Chorus Jig was played ABCD, no repeats. It's been a while
|> >>but I feel like I would be going down the center and back during "B", and
|> >>besides, where is "D"? Maybe there's some variation in the way it's played.
|>
|>
|> Eh? I've never heard Chorus Jig played any way except ABCB (my guess
|> is that John intends AABBAACC to represent 32 bars, in which I should write
|> AABBCCBB and Toby should write AABBCCDD, but I'm obviously confused).
Actually, on thinking it thru, I think I got it wrong, but so did you
all. The A part is a 4-bar phrase in D (played twice). Then there's a
4-bar phrase in G, played twice; call it B. Then there's a 4-bar
phrase in D which is actually a variant of A, but it's an octave
higher and has a C instead of a C# in it, so let's call it a different
phrase, C. Then comes the fourth part, but it's identical to the B
part, so, let's not pretend it's different. The result is:
AABBCCBB
where each letter represents a 4-bar phrase.
This is a bit of an unusual phrasing for a contra-dance tune, though
it's fairly common in some other traditions. It's a good thing to do
if you happen to have a 24-bar tune that you'd like to use, and the B
phrase has a good ending (or has an easy transition to the A phrase
and the next tune in your medley). A lot of Shetland tunes have 4-bar
phrases, and some of them have three phrases, so this works for them.
A lot of klezmer tunes have three phrases, too, but they're usually 8
bars long (or 16 with no repeat), so if you do this, you end up with
once through the tune for twice through the dance, which is usually
ok. Also, you can usually get away with playing a 48-bar tune twice
for three times through the dance; few dancers would be bothered by
(or even notice) this if the tune has the right feel for the dance.
In any case, you shouldn't think that only true 8x2x2 tunes can be
good contra tunes. A lot of the traditional contra tunes originally
had some other phrasing, and have been modified to fit into 32 bars.
One of my favorite examples is Maggie Brown's Favorite, which started
life as an Irish (O'Carolan, actually) tune (Planxty Maggie Brown)
with one 4-bar phrase and one 16-bar phrase, each played twice.
Contra-dance musicians play it AAAAB, and think that this is the
normal way to play it. Well, for them, it is, and it works fine.
Another little-used source of tunes that can get an interesting
response is the mass media. Among older show tunes, Teddy Bear's
Picnic is a really good jig, as is the theme song from Leave It to
Beaver. Also, the Mickey Mouse Club Song works, and really gets a
reaction, so you don't want to use it unless the dancers are doing the
dance well and won't be confused by the distraction. The theme from Mr
Ed is very similar to the traditional Irish/Scottish tune Teviot Brig
(or Bridge); what's fun is to play the latter tune a few times, and
then start singing the Mr Ed theme. A gang I played with once used the
first three phrases from the Lone Ranger - oops; I mean the Wilhelm
Tell Overture - for a contra; played ABCA it worked pretty well. For
some time, I've been considering working up a few Grateful Dead tunes,
so that when someone says that we're having live music tonight, I can
say "No, we're not; we're playing Dead music."
Then there was the time that we announced the last waltz, and started
playing the Star Spangled Banner. That got everyone on their feet!
(But there were a bunch of Scand dancers there who realized that it's
really more of a hambo than a waltz ...)
Gregory J. Sandell
> >But Richard is
> >right: if the caller says "Cut right here!", then do it the best you
can.
Of course in general this is true. The caller is the leader of the whole
circus, and whatever he needs to have happen in the heat of a
moment...like ending a dance right here and now...should be heeded by the
band.
However, I have had the experience with a few callers who end at "strange
times" as a matter of some personal artistic preference. One caller I
knew wrote up a set of large flashcards that said things like "end on this
A" and "play 3 B's this time through"; he'd pull them out suddenly during
a dance and wave them for the band to see. The one dance I played with
him was annoying to play, although I have to admit it has led to many
mirthful "war stories" about nightmare-contradances-I-have-played.
Although I hate to jump on the "beware of innovation" bandwagon (I had to
hold my tounge during that exchange regarding innovation in contradance
music playing...sounded a little like reactionary conservatism to me), I
think it applies here...
Ending at some point in the tune other than the second "B" section
(presuming AABB 32-bar tunes) should be done for a practical reason, and
not for to attain some "effect." If a caller wants to innovate, she
should do it with the content of the dance, not by changing the basic
structure of the tune & dance.
In this light, I'd like to point out that the musicians deserve an equal
partnership in matters of taste and upholding the dance tradition. My
love of contradancing music is one of the big reasons I like to dance, and
obviously one of the reasons I like to play dances. The fact that a tune
goes AABB or AABBCCBB or whatever is part of the beauty of a tune that I
do not like seeing messed with lightheartedly. Callers like my
flashcard-using-friend should not only be surprised by getting resistance
from musicians (after the tune is over, of course), and should respect
their opinions. A caller who would respond to this with some sweeping
generalization about the absolute authority of the caller would probably
have to find another band next time he or she calls!
By the way, the fact that the PLAYING of contradance music has became a
major discussion in rec.folk-dancing is really cool. It's about time!
Gregory J. Sandell
> tako...@utkvx1.utk.edu (Toby Koosman) writes:
> : By the way, as a caller my thumbs are down on "Drowsy Maggie" or any
other
> : tune with non-repeating parts. Just because the music comes out right
at the
> : end of the dance doesn't mean it fits: if the first and second half of
the
> : dance have identical music it can easily confuse the caller and
dancers, and
> : it's not what the choreographer intended. DON'T DO IT!! (Don't do it
to me
> : anyway.)
>
>
> What's the matter with Drowsy Maggie? I don't remember having any
> problem with it. Is it a 48 bar tune?
Well, Toby said the first and second half of the tune are identical, then
it must be a 16-bar tune, right? And so it is with Drowsy Maggie.
And so it is with a number of other tunes: numerous Kerry Polkas and a
lot of Cape Breton tunes. In a *way* I agree with Toby that these tunes
are problematical for dancing, but that's no reason to exclude them from
dance music altogether. Tunes that have a hypnotic sound (i.e.
repetetive) can be very exciting for the dancers when put in the right
place. Notice that one of the most beloved "hypnotic tunes" of all,
Dancing Bear, is very nearly a 16-bar tune (the exception is that the B is
played an octave higher and accompanists usually change the chords for the
B)!
Gregory J. Sandell
writes:
> In article <1992Jun25.1...@IDA.ORG>, r...@IDA.ORG (Richard
Wexelblat) writes:
> > tako...@utkvx1.utk.edu (Toby Koosman) writes:
> > : By the way, as a caller my thumbs are down on "Drowsy Maggie"
> >
> > problem with it. Is it a 48 bar tune?
>
> Ah, yes. I got bit by Drowsy Maggie, and learned a lesson from it, too.
> Drowsy Maggie is a 16-bar tune (AB).
>
> When I alerted the band "ONE MORE TIME!", the band thought I meant "One
> more time through the tune", and they went out after halfway through the
> dance sequence. Uh oh!
Aha, so that's the problem with 16-bar tunes...I hadn't thought about
that.
I guess the caller needs to make sure in advance that the musicians are
saavy to this potential problem (really, all musicians should be following
the AABB sequence of the dance). If they don't know what you're talking
about then it might be time to request a tune replacement.
Toby Koosman
goat...
> Also, you can usually get away with playing a 48-bar tune twice
>for three times through the dance; few dancers would be bothered by
>(or even notice) this if the tune has the right feel for the dance.
written with a particular tune that's eccentrically structured are fine, but
common contras are written with a particular musical structure in mind, 32-bar
AABB, and you should respect that. It is arguable that a 16-bar tune is okay,
although I don't like it; a tune that takes three times through the dance
to match up is unacceptable. There's plenty you can do to make the music
interesting without violating the tune structure. As for the dancers not
noticing, I think you're wrong; some may not explicitly understand what's
going on, but if the music doesn't fit, it feels wrong, and it's also
confusing for new dancers struggling to get a feeling for it. Besides, some
of those dancers _are_ musicians. The hell they don't notice.
>
>In any case, you shouldn't think that only true 8x2x2 tunes can be
>good contra tunes.
within the formal limits, but if you really feel confined by those limits you
should perhaps branch out into playing for other dance forms, or perform for a
listening audience, rather than play for contras. The simplicity of the form
is part of the charm of this kind of dancing.
Yeah, I'm a reactionary. I think contra dance culture is getting carried
away with a perceived need for innovation, both in choreography and music.
I'm not suggesting we should play Soldier' Joy and call dances in which the
inactives compose minor novels while waiting for something to do. We're
modern urbanites who expect energetic dancing (although I have a theory
that the unequal contra will make a comeback when we all get somewhat
older). But I value the accessible, homegrown, unprofessional environment
that has been most of my contra experience. I'm happy to dance to a solid
band that plays appropriate music, they don't have to dazzle me with strange
and amazing tunes and gimmicks.
Gee, I started out arguing that you don't have to play the standards. I
do think any band naturally wants to find its own sound, not just imitate
whatever's trendy. But you've gotta keep danceability in the forefront:
dance music is functional, not decorative. (I don't mean to accuse anyone
here of ignoring that principle. John Chambers and I just don't agree on
the importance of a perfect fit between tune and dance length.)
Paul Viscuso
|> In article <1992Jun23....@tc.cornell.edu>
|> vis...@tiberius.tc.cornell.edu (Paul Viscuso) writes:
|> > Greg Sandell made some good points, and I played with Greg for 2 years
|> > (those were the days).
|>
|> Thanks, Paul! I miss the swell of the mighty "Titano" (Paul's brand of
|> accordian).
|>
For those who are skeptical about pianos in contra dance bands, I'll add to Dan
Pearl's list of people to listen to :
Greg Sandell (not only because we were in the same band, but because Greg is
quite inventive and really adds a lot to a band)
Mary Kay Brass (in the Northfield MA area, last time I knew )
Peter(?) Kaynor (Dave's dad) was fun to listen to (for me) when I lived in
Amherst MA
|> > I don't believe that you have to know any of the standard tunes. We've
|> > played Klezmer music for contra dances, and the folks have loved it
|> > (usually).
|>
|> In article <23JUN199...@utkvx1.utk.edu> tako...@utkvx1.utk.edu
|> (Toby Koosman) writes:
|>
|> > Hey, Paul--where do you find 32-bar klezmer tunes?
|>
|> Hey, Paul, time to plug our tape! The world's greatest contra-klezmer
|> contradance band (and coincidentally, the only one, as far as I know),
|> FOOL'S GOLD, has a tape called "Contras From the Old Country." Listen in
|> disbelief as you hear tunes such as Morrison's Jig and Skrip, Klezmerl,
|> Skrip played side-by-side! You'll find quite a few 32-bar klezmer tunes
|> on that tape. Is Ted Crane (tedc...@theory.tc.cornell.edu) still selling
|> these, Paul?
|>
Thanks Greg. Yes, the tape is still in existence, a delightful mix of Old World
and New. There are a few left, and are available from Ted Crane (correct e-mail
address above) or from me (vis...@tc.cornell.edu). Another source of Klezmer
music is "The Compleat Klezmer" available from YIVO Institute for Jewish
Research, 1048 5th Avenue, New York NY 10028, (212) 535-6700. I've also found
some good music from the old Jewish Theatre from the early part of this century.
Look around, and you may find. It might be harder in some parts of the country
than in others, but YIVO is a good bet. I've also transcribed a fair amount from
recordings (Klezmer Conservatory Band, Maxwell St. Band, etc.). By the way, the
Fool's Gold tape has been sent to at least 4 continents (Asia, North and South
America, and Europe). Last price was $7.50 direct from us, or $9(?) from CDSS.
|> - Greg
|> --
|> Greg Sandell
|> Research Fellow, Center for New Music and Audio Technologies (CNMAT)
|> san...@cnmat.cnmat.berkeley.edu or san...@garnet.berkeley.edu
Paul Viscuso
Cornell Theory Center
vis...@tc.cornell.edu
Daniel Steinberg
> I've been playing fiddle tunes with friends for a few years now,
> and we're ready to start playing in a band for contra dancing.
> Please help us form the right band:
I see you got lots of great suggestions and advice. Here's a couple
of ideas to augment those i've already seen posted:
- Listen. The best way to play in a band is to listen. This is true
for any band, but i mention it because it's easy to space out when
playing for dances, since nobody is really paying all that much
conscious attention to what you're playing. Make sure that you can
all hear each other on stage. If the sound system provided doesn't
include monitors, consider buying powered monitors to bring with you.
- Dance. To really understand what you are playing for, and to get a
better idea of what works and what doesn't, become a dancer (if you
aren't already).
- Watch. Keep an eye on the dancers. If you are a dancer, you will
probably somewhat quicker to detect when things are not quite right
on the dance floor (or in a particular line). If the dancers are
having trouble with the dance, there are several things you can do
that might help:
o provide a clearer beat (drop melodic variations, bang out a
cleaner oom-pa, whatever it takes to get them back in step)
o give strong musical cues (if the balances sound late or
untogether, play musical beats that clue the dancers back in,
or even drop out on the 4 beats of the balances so that the
dancers have to supply a better beat themselves)
o change tempo (this works both ways: some dances are awkward
if they are too slow; some are impossible if too fast)
o change tunes (perhaps the phrasing of the tune is not clear enough)
o change volume (if you are too loud, perhaps they can't hear the
caller; if you are too soft, perhaps they can't hear the beat)
- Make frequent eye contact....both with the caller and the other band
members. Any number of things could require a mid-course correction
(you may have dropped a second B part and not even noticed) and it's
much harder to straighten this out with someone who's not looking at you.
- Practice speeding up and slowing down. Most bands speed up without
trying. Few bands can speed up just a little and hold the tempo without
continuing to ramp up. Fewer bands can slow down effectively. All it
takes is practice. Working with a metronome or drum machine can be an
enlightening experience.
- Learn to run sound systems. Not many dances have people who can do good
sound...and they aren't always available. Knowing something about room
equalization, mic and speaker positioning, mic selection, etc. can come
in handy.
-daniel
PS to Greg: I recently played with a hammered dulcimer player who put
masking tape down the strings (over the bridges) that acted as a very
effective damper. It made all the difference in the world!
Deb Schwartz
>that New England is not the only possible model.
On the subject of non-standard contra music:
There's a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, wonderful,
wonderful x 2,000,000 (do I make myself clear? :-)) local band called
Boom Boom Room (consists of experienced musicians from other bands who
get together once in a while) who play afro-caribbean music for contra
dances. And it works!
At a dance camp I was at recently, someone called a contra dance while the
band was playing 'Purple Haze' (it was well past midnight - y'all know how
it gets).
--
Debbie Schwartz // d...@voodoo.boeing.com // or uunet!bcstec!voodoo!das
Barry Schlesinger
The world's greatest contra-klezmer
>contradance band (and coincidentally, the only one, as far as I know),
>FOOL'S GOLD
Here in the Washington D. C. area, there has been for several years an
annual Klezmer-Contra dance. I *think* the name of the band is
Klezmos. This year the Saturday night dance at the Washington Folk
Festival at Glen Echo was a contradance to klezmer music with the same
band.
Barry Schlesinger
j...@sppip7.lkg.dec.com (John Chambers) writes...
...
The Capital Quicksteps Quadrille Orchestra has been known to switch
into "March of the Marionettes" (the Alfred Hitchcock theme) during
Rory O' More.
Peter C. Gorman
Another danger with 16 bar tunes is the band switching out of the tune to
another when only halfway through the dance progression. I speak from
experience - we did that once with Drowsy Maggie, changing to some normal
reel. It took us a few (out of sync) times through the new tune to get
back to normal, by playing an extra A part or something. Afterwards, the
*caller* apologized to us for screwing up the progression, and remarked on
how great *we* were to notice it and fix it up! We, of course, graciously
accepted her apology :-)
Anyway, we now do Drowsy Maggie the way Swallowtail did it - AABC.
--
Peter Gorman
University of Pennsylvania
Library Systems Office
pe...@sysnext.library.upenn.edu
John Chambers
>
> In article <1992Jun25.1...@nntpd.lkg.dec.com>, John Chambers gets my
> goat...
> > Also, you can usually get away with playing a 48-bar tune twice
> >for three times through the dance; few dancers would be bothered by
> >(or even notice) this if the tune has the right feel for the dance.
> do think any band naturally wants to find its own sound, not just imitate
> whatever's trendy. But you've gotta keep danceability in the forefront:
> dance music is functional, not decorative. (I don't mean to accuse anyone
> here of ignoring that principle. John Chambers and I just don't agree on
> the importance of a perfect fit between tune and dance length.)
Well, now; I don't think we're in all that much disagreement. Note
that I said "you can usually get away with" it. Sometimes you can't.
I'd agree that the first rule is danceability. I've just learned that
this term is defined differently for different crowds. There are some
reactionaries that insist that you play *only* the *right* music for a
dance; no weird klez or Broadway or Greek tunes allowed. And some
Scottish leaders insist that you *must* play the title tune for every
dance. There are other crowds that will love a bizarre new tune, if it
fits the dance well. You just gotta learn which crowd is which. And of
course there are usually people of both kinds at any given dance. I
don't feel that either extreme is right or wrong; they're just
attitudes that you learn to deal with.
But the main rule is that it has to have the right feel for the dance.
This can bite you even if you are using the old contra standards,
since different dances have different feels. This is why it's a good
idea to work out some terminology with the callers. Dichotomies like
jig/reel and bouncy/smooth and simple/notey work well. Medleys should
keep about the same feel, even if the tunes sound very different. If
there's a title tune, that gives you a good clue, even when you don't
play it (gasp ;-).
There are a lot of Shetland tunes that work well for contras, but with
these, you have the problem that many have 4-bar phrases, so they are
mostly 16 or 24 bars long. Here in the Boston area, they are played a
lot (and probably wormed their way into the repertoire via the
Scottish Fiddle Club). Some are usually played AAAABBBB; others are
played AABB and must be played twice for once through the dance. The
3-phrase tunes will typically be played AABBAACC or AAAABBCC. I get
the impression that most dancers don't notice the difference. They
mostly fall into the "fast, simple, bouncy reel" category. Some have
syncopations that are rare in the usual contra repertoire. The
Shetland repertoire is a good source of slightly unusual tunes.
An anecdote I've liked to tell: A couple of years back, I was one of
two musicians playing at a Scandinavian dance that happened to fall on
St Patrick's day. We both knew a lot of Irish/Scottish music, and we
decided to see how many Irish tunes we could sneak in, in honor of the
occasion. About half the tunes we played that evening were Irish, and
most of the dancers didn't even notice until the last waltz, when we
played O'Carolan's Welcome, and there's no way to pass that tune off
as Scandinavian. We told the dancers what we'd done, and most of them
were favorably impressed that we'd gotten away with it so well. There
were a few ultraconservatives that were a bit pissed at us. (I suspect
it was mostly for having fooled them so easily. ;-) The rest thought
that it was a cute prank, and as long as the tunes worked, why not?
I'll admit that some of the tunes might have sounded a bit unusual to
an Irish musician.
Some years earlier, I was as a Scand dance with a gang of about a
dozen fiddlers, and some one hollered out "Can you play Arkansas
Traveller?" Not only could we, but we did, and it turned out to be a
real good snoa ...
Brad Levy
band named Chicken Soup, led by Dan Berkowitz (who has now moved on to
Arkansas). It was a wonderful combination! Of course, it helps that Dan
is an avid dancer, so he knows not to let the music impede the dancing.
I would say the estimates of percentage of contra dancers that pay attention
to the music is higher than the figures mentioned in the band-question thread,
but wholeheartedly agree that the music has to be dance-able first, then
worry about the frills. Some of the comments I've heard from dancers about
the music are specifically lauding the way some musicians knew how to
make the music be right there when the dancer's needed it.
edw...@yang.earlham.edu
All the discussion about contra band issues are very interesting. I
also agree with the assersions:
-That dancability of tunes is crucial.
-As a band we probably should be quieter during the teaching.
-The band better keep thier heads up and change tempo or tune if the
dancers need it. We especially rely on our piano player and caller for
sensitivity to whether we are too fast or too slow. It's our responsibility
to fix things if we drop part of the tune.
I too love shetland tunes, and am happy to try some of the suggestions
posted here for playing them at contras
This fall we will experiment with a tradition I read about in an
Irish set dance book from the '30's. They said that it is standard
for the band to play the tune completely once through with the
dancers starting the dance at the beginning of the second time through.
It sounds like it would make a good start to the dance, and especially if
the band is rough out of the blocks, it would be merciful to them.
Other thoughts: the caller and the band need to define beforehand
what the words "Last time" mean. Does it mean the band stops
at the end of the tune, or finish the tune and play it through
one last time. It is really nice to end a dance cleanly.
What to do about uninvited musicians? Unless its a special night,
we discourage musicians from dropping in and playing with no notice.
We have had more that one dance destroyed by overpowering and insensitive
musicians. It seems cold, but we have a responsibility to our dancers.
Our dancers enjoy hearing us experiment, so at christmas we play "Up on the
Rooftop" and "Jingle Bells" and everyone flows with it.
As for $$, I played 10 dances last year and made $40.00. Just enough
for gas.
------------------
What follows is the set list for our contra dance band. We play in
Oxford, Ohio. I keep the list up to date ( this is a few revisons old)
I keep track of the number of times we play a tune (votes) so we weed
out tunes that just don't get used much, or we try to aviod tunes we
play too often. The 5 musicians play piano, fiddle/mandolin,
fiddle/tenor banjo, english concertina , and flute. Some of the tunes
listed we do not play for dances, but we try to work them up for
weddings and other non-contra gatherings. Hope this is of interest.
The notation we worked out is to aid in the situation where one
says "Do you know the tune 'Moby Dick'?", And you say, "I can play it if
I can just hear the first few notes." This is much of what goes on
while the dancers are learning the next dance...
Full Moon Country Dance Orchestra
Last updated October 1991
Tune One (Key,starting notes) Tune Two Votes
------------------------ ------------------------- --------------
Bellmans Jig(D,F#DD,C#AA) Road To Lisdunvarna(D,EBBAF#EF#)
Box the fox(D,F#GAF#DF#AF#) Reel Foot Reel (D,DDDDDF#AC#)
Cat in the hopper (Bb,DGABbC) Fair jenny(D,F#F#EDE)
Chorus Reel(D,F#DF#ABAG) (Played ABCB)
Cuckoos nest Liberty
Dun the Brae Scotland the Brave
Farewell to whiskey(G,DGBAG) Stoney point(G,GG^EDED)
Freize Breeches(D,F#ED,EF#G) Haste To the Wedding(D,AF#A,AA^F#)
Gilderoy Lord Drumond(a-b
Girl I Left Behind(G,EDBG) Ennis Reel(G,DEDCBC)
The Gobby 'O(Em, ca,aga) Larry O'Gaff(D,DddF#ed)
The Gobby 'O Off She goes(D,F#agbabc#d)
Golden slippers(G,BBBAGA) Turkey In The Straw(G,BAGGGDB)
The Grand Chain The Newlywed Reel
Greedfields of America(A,ABC#DE)Folding Down the Sheets(D,agf#c#dec#)
Haste to the Wedding Kincora Jig
Hast to the Wedding (G,aaf#aa) The Wedding Day(G,Avbd,fed)
Hayden Fancy Larsons's Polka
Hunstmans chorus(G,dgdgabcdb) Temperance reel(G,ggf#gab)
Jackie Tar (D,EEDEF#GE) Joey's hornpipe (D,DAABAB)
Knole Park(D,abaf#ad^f#) Hayden Fancy(D,abdf#)
Loch Lavens Castle( Staten Island
The Meeting of the Waters Scotland the Brave
Merry Blacksmith(D,ddabaf#a) Reel De Junes Marie(D,df#af#ad^e)
Miss McLouds reel Fishers Hornpipe
Pig Ankle Rag Peacock Rag
Rakes of mallow (G,GBGB) Scollays (G,EF#GABCBG)
Rose tree Robinson County
St annes reel Morpeth Rant
Still they say she's kind of pretty Dancing Bear
Still they say she's kind of pretty Old Mother Flannigan
Sweeping the town Macklemoyles Reel
The Swallowtail Jig ???
Tobins Favorite(D Trippin up stairs
Whiskey before brfst Staten island
Year of Jubilo Wind That Shakes the Barley
TOONS PLAYED ALONE
-------------------
Harvest Home Hornpipe
Boys Of Bluehill Hornpipe
Cronins Hornpipe
Off to California Hornpipe
La Bastrange ( special dance )
The Black Nag ( special dance )
The Rights of Man
Cold Frosty Morning Dm
Petronella
The Butterfly Slip jig (9/8)
Sailors Hornpipe
Folding Down the Sheets Used for American Promenade (a-b tune)
Jack Broke Down the Prison Door ( a-b )
Plains Of Boyle Hornpipe ?
WALTZES
-------
Waltz in f Ashoken Shepherds wife Margarets
South Wind Midnight on the Water
The Star of the County Down Westfalia Tom Bigsby
Polkas
Jenny Lind ( Gobbyo first make a crazy combo )
Upper Lehigh Johnny I Do Miss You Maggie in the Wood
Scartaglen Polka Shetland Polka Dennis Murphys
Larsons's
TOONS THAT NEED MATCHES
------------------------
Dennis murphys slide jig
Kitchen girl
Over The Waterfall
Lassies fancy
Dover pier
Rosebud reel
Butterfly
Julanne Johnson
Rocky Mountain Goat
Coleraine
The Mountain Top ( Maid Behind the Bar )
Mc Mahons Reel
The Bishop
Gary Owen
Larry O'gaff
Da Underhill
Other Toons
Cooleys Hornpipe The Musical Priest
The Maid Behind the Bar(D,dbaf#ab) The Masons Apron
McMahons Reel (G,gdedeg) The Gaspe Reel
Don Tremaines Reel The Cameron Highlanders
The Mountain Top Hornpipe (Bb,dfbcd) The Sligo Maid
Sweeny's Polka Swingin' on a gate
Dover pier
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ed Delaney | Internet:
Associate Director, Administrative Computing | edw...@yang.earlham.edu
Box E-14 | Phone:
Earlham College | 317-983-1284
Richmond, IN 47374 | Yang is a Vax(VMS) if you care
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Toby Koosman
writes...
>Other thoughts: the caller and the band need to define beforehand
>what the words "Last time" mean. Does it mean the band stops
>at the end of the tune, or finish the tune and play it through
>one last time. It is really nice to end a dance cleanly.
My method: at the beginning of the second B during the penultimate time
through the dance I turn to the band, raise one finger, make eye contact
with as many players as possible, and yell "one more time!" which I
repeat into the mike just before the last time. You really shouldn't call
out the dance during the last time through if it can be avoided, but if
the band failed to catch on or I have some compelling reason to end now
I say something like "this is it!" or "take it out!" precisely because
"last time" is ambiguous. From the caller's vantage I think that's the
solution: don't use the words "last time" at all. If you're the musician all
you can do is point out the difficulty; a caller that really wants to control
when the dance ends will appreciate being made aware of the problem.
Dan Pearl
> This fall we will experiment with a tradition I read about in an
> Irish set dance book from the '30's. They said that it is standard
> for the band to play the tune completely once through with the
> dancers starting the dance at the beginning of the second time through.
> It sounds like it would make a good start to the dance, and especially if
> the band is rough out of the blocks, it would be merciful to them.
I think that this is ill-advised. It is changing the tradition where no
improvement is necessary. If it is to take the place of a pre-dance
rehersal, then FIND the time to reherse your starts. The caller will
have to admonish the dancers EVERY TIME to refrain from dancing. If the
music is dancible, people will want to dance, and it would kill the
energy of the evening to suppress that. It also assumes that you could
train your callers not to call the first time through; if they forget, and
call the dance, or if they forget to warn the dancers NOT to dance, there
could be chaos on the floor.
An alternate suggestion: assign one melody player to be the "primary
lead" for that tune. When the dance begins, the rhythm and the primary
lead take charge and attack the tune with confidence and gusto. Others can play
quietly and join in when confident (preferably at A1 or B1, or a few lead-in
notes before).
Just because they do it for Irish Set dances in the 30's doesn't make it
right for contras. I'd hate it if every contra began with a bow chord
because "that's how the Scottish dancers do it".
> Other thoughts: the caller and the band need to define beforehand
> what the words "Last time" mean. Does it mean the band stops
> at the end of the tune, or finish the tune and play it through
> one last time. It is really nice to end a dance cleanly.
Yup. Getting signals and words straight is important. Most bands
want a "ONE MORE TIME" signal during the B part of the next to last time.
Some bands benefit from a "two-" or "three-more-time" signal.
If I forget to give the "one more time" signal, I'll TELL the band
"THIS IS THE LAST TIME". Everyone understands that concept, just fine.
> What to do about uninvited musicians? Unless its a special night,
> we discourage musicians from dropping in and playing with no notice.
> We have had more that one dance destroyed by overpowering and insensitive
> musicians. It seems cold, but we have a responsibility to our dancers.
You don't need to give a mic to all sit ins. But in general this is a
problem. How do up and coming musicians get dance experience? If your
community is short on musicians, then allowing un-miked sit-ins is just
the ticket for developing them. On the other hand, if you have lots
of musicians, then you can afford a "no uninvited sit-ins" rule for
certain band combinations that values its purity of sound.
John Chambers
>
> In article <1992Jun29.1...@yang.earlham.edu>, edw...@yang.earlham.edu writes:
> > This fall we will experiment with a tradition I read about in an
> > Irish set dance book from the '30's. They said that it is standard
> > for the band to play the tune completely once through with the
> > dancers starting the dance at the beginning of the second time through.
> > It sounds like it would make a good start to the dance, and especially if
> > the band is rough out of the blocks, it would be merciful to them.
>
> I think that this is ill-advised. It is changing the tradition where no
> improvement is necessary.
Well, now, that depends on your tradition. At English country dances
(a very close relative of contras), this is quite conventional, and a
lot of English country dance recordings start with an extra time
through the first phrase. Similarly, Irish and Scottish step dancers
will usually stand through the first phrase, and expect you to play an
extra one. Quite a lot of square dance groups do the same thing. On
the other hand, the usual start of New England contras is a few
rhythmic chords from the piano, and Scottish country dancing has a
similar rhythmic chord at the start (and end) of a dance. If you want
to get a New England sound, you should probably stick to the standard
four potatoes.
If you have a dancers that are familiar with one of these (perhaps
because there's a very successful English or Scottish country dance
group in your area), why not? Alternatively, the last 4 or 8 bars of
the last phrase is used by some groups. The best thing is probably to
ask the caller, to see whether it is flatly rejected or encouraged or
whatever.
You could also try the Lawrence Welk intro ("a one and a two and a
three ...") for variety.
Jonathan Robie
>You don't need to give a mic to all sit ins. But in general this is a
>problem. How do up and coming musicians get dance experience? If your
>community is short on musicians, then allowing un-miked sit-ins is just
>the ticket for developing them. On the other hand, if you have lots
>of musicians, then you can afford a "no uninvited sit-ins" rule for
>certain band combinations that values its purity of sound.
We have a three hour rehearsal, and you have to attend if you want to
play. This works well for us. By the end of the rehearsal people know
how well they can keep up.
Note that many "open" bands have their own rehearsals which are closed,
and may not even provide notes. This means that newcomers need to pick
things up by ear on stage during the dance. Of course this leads to
problems!
If your band is supposed to be open you need to invest time and effort
in the newcomers. If you don't, then your band should probably be closed.
James Langdell
first phrase as an intro--there's too many false starts when dancers
don't know if
a. you're beginning immediately
b. you're playing the first phrase once for nothing
c. you're playing the first phrase twice as they usually hear in
during the dance
Usually I begin with the second phrase of one of the tunes in the set,
or compose an intro that sets up the first phrase without sounding
like a REAL beginning.
--James Langdell jam...@eng.sun.com
Sun Microsystems Mountain View, Calif.
Richard Gordon
We sometimes throw Creedence's Bad Moon Rising into a medley for
squares or contras..... Sometimes fun to see who notices.....
--
Richard Gordon ric...@brahms.udel.edu
CNS User Services, Smith Hall or gor...@udel.edu
University of Delaware or acs0...@udelvm.bitnet
Newark, DE 19716 USA (302-831-1717)
Richard Wexelblat
: > > Irish set dance book from the '30's. They said that it is standard
: > > for the band to play the tune completely once through with the
: > > dancers starting the dance at the beginning of the second time through.
: > > It sounds like it would make a good start to the dance, and especially if
: > > the band is rough out of the blocks, it would be merciful to them.
: > I think that this is ill-advised. It is changing the tradition where no
: > improvement is necessary.
: Well, now, that depends on your tradition. At English country dances
: (a very close relative of contras), this is quite conventional, and a
: lot of English country dance recordings start with an extra time
: through the first phrase.
Sounds like some confusion here. The original poster implies once
entirely through the tune (e.g. AABB). The first responder describes
that as a change in tradition. The second responder first disacgees
with the second and then goes on to mention first phrase (A or A/2)
In fact, having been doing English Dancing for upwards of 40 years, in
the U.S. and U.K., I have NEVER heard a tune played full-through as an
introduction at a social dance. Occasionally in a class, a leader will
have the musicians play a full through of a tune the dancers may never
have heard before, especially if it is particularly difficult to dance
to or especially interesting for some other reason. The most common
pickup is a strong up-beat or a half-phrase -- commonly the last half of
the B tune these days (from the New England tradition?)
BTW: having done a lot of social Irish dancing, though in much more
limited venues, I've never heard a full-through on the tune. With some
ceilidh bands, you're luck to get even an upbeat.
Deb Schwartz
>
>>You don't need to give a mic to all sit ins. But in general this is a
>>problem. How do up and coming musicians get dance experience? If your
>>community is short on musicians, then allowing un-miked sit-ins is just
>>the ticket for developing them. On the other hand, if you have lots
>>of musicians, then you can afford a "no uninvited sit-ins" rule for
>>certain band combinations that values its purity of sound.
>
There a weekly contra dance in Seattle that's an open mike for callers and
musicians. There are one or two experienced musicians, arranged in advance
- changes weekly - who are miked, then the rest of the band are unmiked
sit-ins, of various experience levels. There's one experienced caller, who
calls a few dances, then throws the mike open to whoever wants to call.
It works out very very well - there are always enough experienced muscicians
who show up so that the band sounds good, both musicians and callers gain
experience, and there's no cover charge, so there's always lots of dancers
(although there is a one minumum drink requirement, but then, the New Melody
is providing the place for free).
25656-o'keefe
edw...@yang.earlham.edu
Friends,
The idea of playing the tune thru once sounds like an extraordinarily
unpopular one. Though I really intended to say that a play thru
would be once thru the A part, it didn't come out that way. I'd
have to agree that dancers would be too confused/impatient to tolerate
it. Lets say we'll let that idea die a merciful death and get back
to practicing! ... or talking about Morris dancing? Now thats something
to shake a stick at!
Ed
David M. Cottle
>
>Friends,
>
>The idea of playing the tune thru once sounds like an extraordinarily
>unpopular one. Though I really intended to say that a play thru
But then, . . . I remember one of the most enjoyable dances I've ever
attended (Heartland? in Kansas with Wild Asparagus) and the band would
occasional doodle (usually a standard blues) while we were taught the
dance. I really enjoyed it! We sort of walked through with this bumpy
grindy blues, then once in a while they would simply segue into the
dance tune. Not many bands could do this, I know, but it made the walk
through much more fun without distracting a bit.
Dave Cottle
Balo ergo sum
Richard Gordon
Then there was the time the caller was having a hard time
getting people to get back on the floor after a food'n'drink
break. We started singing an impromtu, totally tasteless blues
the gist of which was we were gonna keep singing until we got 8
more couples -> 1 more couple on the floor tonight.
Fortunately, that's been the only time we've had to resort to
that terrorist tactic....no Wild Asparagus segue into the dance
tune tho'
:)