Alternatives to LPS-2
Ignoramus11220
nicely, and does not dry or harden over time. It also creeps and
penetrates well, so if, say, I spray it on top of a pile of metal
things, it will get to all the pieces in time.
The only minus of it is that it is expensive.
Does anyone know of a cheaper alternative that can be sprayed and does
not dry out.
Thanks
i
Pete C.
Check Kano Labs, makers of Kroil and lots of other good stuff, I'm sure
they have something suitable.
steamer
bottle to apply it..
--
"Steamboat Ed" Haas : Blue Cross socks us
Hacking the Trailing Edge! : $23,000/yr!! ...
www.nmpproducts.com
---Decks a-wash in a sea of words---
Steve Lusardi
I haven't found any good substitute to LPS2. It is a lot less expensive than the rust. I like the idea of gallon containers
though.
Steve
"Ignoramus11220" <ignoram...@NOSPAM.11220.invalid> wrote in message news:h8ednTh9gYzscBbW...@giganews.com...
Too_Many_Tools
Where the metal you are trying to protect?
Inside lots of things work...outside only a few things.
TMT
Stormin Mormon
any cheaper, though.
I'm told that LPS-1 "non oily" is good lube for
locks.
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.
"Ignoramus11220"
<ignoram...@NOSPAM.11220.invalid> wrote in
message
news:h8ednTh9gYzscBbW...@giganews.com...
Don Foreman
Used motor oil meets your criteria.
GeoLane at PTD dot NET
>
>Does anyone know of a cheaper alternative that can be sprayed and does
>not dry out.
I've never used LPS-2, so I can't make a direct comparison,
but take a look at Black Bear Par-AL-Ketone sold by
Aircraft Spruce. It is intended as a rust preventative and can be
diluted with mineral spirits, or denatured alcohol if you want it to
dry out faster. In discussions on the net many years ago, I recall
it was said that it was the same or similar to what was used in the
Rusty Jones rust proofing for cars. It's off lable use is as a bullet
lubricant ala Lee Liquid Alox.
RWL
sta...@prolynx.com
Look at what CRC offers. I've not used anything but their penetrant,
556, 356, 348 or one of them thread sizes. It worked OK. NAPA was
one source and I've seen it on real hardware store shelves. I like
the LPS line myself, but they seem to be really after the industrial
market, case lots, not the home shop onesies. I use more LPS 1 and 3
than 2.
Stan
William Wixon
<sta...@prolynx.com> wrote in message
news:038f9b2f-a5d1-4330...@g19g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
Stan
i keep having cans of any brand (LPS, CRC, etc.) of the waxy anti-rust stuff
leak out all the propellant. it sucks (because it's expensive). half full
cans of LPS 3 (and others) with no propellant left. one time i called LPS
and told them about it and they said they were going to send me replacements
and i waited a couple weeks and called them back and then they said they
weren't. i bought a bunch of the stuff from eastwood. they've got it in
metal cans, non-aerosol, like quart size. i put it in one of the plastic
containers (that come with the schutz gun) and the solvent evaporated
THROUGH the plastic container. now i have a SOLID container of wax
anti-rust stuff. gonna have to figure out a way to re-liquefy it. i don't
know how eastwood's prices compare to (what someone else suggested, gallon
non-aerosol).
http://www.eastwood.com/
http://www.eastwood.com/ew-heavy-duty-anti-rust-32oz.html
http://www.eastwood.com/rust-solutions/prevention.html
how do their prices compare?
b.w.
Bob Engelhardt
> i keep having cans of any brand (LPS, CRC, etc.) of the waxy anti-rust stuff
> leak out all the propellant. it sucks (because it's expensive). half full
You can re-pressurize aerosol cans with propane. I made an adapter for
recharging paint rattle cans:
http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/RattleCanAdapter2.jpg
It screws into the valve of a propane torch. I.e., in place of the
tube. Aerosol cans have different style valves & each style requires
its own adapter.
Bob
Michael Koblic
"Ignoramus11220" <ignoram...@NOSPAM.11220.invalid> wrote in message
news:h8ednTh9gYzscBbW...@giganews.com...
You might be interested in a trial I did:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/27683124@N07/sets/72157623384305382/
It is nothing original or definitive, I just wanted to know how things
behaved in my hands. Also I did not consider prices but these are easy to
find out.
In a nutshell: Nothing beat LPS3.
I was puzzled about the behaviour of WD40.
--
Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC
cl...@snyder.on.ca
<cayoung61**spamblock##@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Aerokroil is supposed to be good. Not sure it's
>any cheaper, though.
>
>I'm told that LPS-1 "non oily" is good lube for
>locks.
ATF
Don Foreman
I did that too. Mine looks amazingly similar to yours, Bob, except
that mine isn't nearly as shiney.
Jim Wilkins
> On Tue, 02 Mar 2010 17:54:08 -0500, Bob Engelhardt
>
> that mine isn't nearly as shiney.
I once found a purse-size hairspray can with a tapered insert <|=
pressed into the valve stem under the spray nozzle so it could be
refilled from a larger can by holding the stems together. Butane
lighter refills and starting fluid also worked with it as long as the
small can was in cold water.
I bought one hand-pump spray bottle of LPS3 and refilled it first from
the dead aerosol cans and then a gallon jug. It goes further, sprays
better and doesn't clog the nozzle if diluted about 1:4 with kerosine.
Shake before using because part of it precipitates out.
jsw
Bob Engelhardt
> Bob Engelhardt wrote:
...
>> http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/RattleCanAdapter2.jpg
...
> I did that too. Mine looks amazingly similar to yours, Bob, except
> that mine isn't nearly as shiney.
Oh, that means that yours is older than mine, which means that I
probably copied yours. Thanks, Don.
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
...
> I bought one hand-pump spray bottle of LPS3 and refilled it first from
> the dead aerosol cans and then a gallon jug. It goes further, sprays
> better and doesn't clog the nozzle if diluted about 1:4 with kerosine.
> Shake before using because part of it precipitates out.
The LPS3 that I have is also the hand-pump bottle. I found that even
that was spraying too much & I poured some into a bottle with a brush in
its lid. (I was still suffering sticker shock & trying to be as frugal
with it as possible <G>) Good for small things, not so for bigger ones.
Regarding diluting it: I think "1:4 with kerosine" means 1 part LPS3 & 4
parts kero, but that seems like it would be really thin. Or is it the
other way around?
Bob
Jim Wilkins
I dilute it roughly in half by eye when I refill the "MIXED" gallon
jug, and then in half again in the spray bottle, or use it as-is for
the needle oiler or to coat the inside of air compressor tanks. So
it's one part LPS-3 to perhaps 3 or 4 of kerosine. If the spray nozzle
clogs it needs more kerosine.
The needle oiler is for hardware on vehicles and garden equipment. 20
year old bolts loosen easily.
The thinned liquid seems to soak into rust better without leaving a
surface deposit to be lost to dust or rain or tire splash. In my
experience a coating I can barely feel is adequate for at least half a
year. Some machined parts on my front end loader are still shiny after
5 years.
jsw
Stormin Mormon
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.
<cl...@snyder.on.ca> wrote in message
news:6arro5loqtt31tvfq...@4ax.com...
Don Foreman
I think we probably both copied heads out of aerosol cans.
Larry Jaques
<dfor...@NOSPAMgoldengate.net> scrawled the following:
I missed the first part of this thread. What are these things for? It
looks like a propane-to-rattle-can adapter, maybe used to repressurize
flat spray cans.
--
An author spends months writing a book, and maybe puts his
heart's blood into it, and then it lies about unread till
the reader has nothing else in the world to do.
-- W. Somerset Maugham, The Razor's Edge, 1943
Jim Wilkins
> ...
> I missed the first part of this thread. What are these things for? It
> looks like a propane-to-rattle-can adapter, maybe used to repressurize
> flat spray cans.
Makes them round again.
If propane doesn't quickly dissolve into the contents it can
overpressure the can, that's why I used butane.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/propane-vapor-pressure-d_1020.html
Spray cans do not fail gracefully. I'd rather not post the details as
others might try and not be so lucky.
jsw
Don Foreman
<lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>On Wed, 03 Mar 2010 23:42:12 -0600, the infamous Don Foreman
><dfor...@NOSPAMgoldengate.net> scrawled the following:
>
>>On Wed, 03 Mar 2010 12:47:28 -0500, Bob Engelhardt
>><bobeng...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Don Foreman wrote:
>>>> Bob Engelhardt wrote:
>>>...
>>>>> http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/RattleCanAdapter2.jpg
>>>...
>>>
>>>> I did that too. Mine looks amazingly similar to yours, Bob, except
>>>> that mine isn't nearly as shiney.
>>>
>>>Oh, that means that yours is older than mine, which means that I
>>>probably copied yours. Thanks, Don.
>>>
>>>Bob
>>
>>I think we probably both copied heads out of aerosol cans.
>
>I missed the first part of this thread. What are these things for? It
>looks like a propane-to-rattle-can adapter, maybe used to repressurize
>flat spray cans.
Give that man a silver dollar.
William Wixon
"Bob Engelhardt" <bobeng...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:hmk4u...@news3.newsguy.com...
>
> You can re-pressurize aerosol cans with propane. I made an adapter for
> recharging paint rattle cans:
> http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/RattleCanAdapter2.jpg
>
> It screws into the valve of a propane torch. I.e., in place of the
> tube. Aerosol cans have different style valves & each style requires its
> own adapter.
>
> Bob
that's pretty cool bob (and don).
just curious, the obvious question, how do you know now much gas to put in
the aerosol can? it is a "by ear" thing or is it not possible to over
pressurize a paint can using a propane tank?
b.w.
Jim Wilkins
> ...
> ...how do you know now much gas to put in
> the aerosol can? it is a "by ear" thing or is it not possible to over
> pressurize a paint can using a propane tank?
> b.w.
The quick test is to dent the side in a little with your thumb. Try
that with a new can to get the feel.
jsw
RBnDFW
We obviously have some thrillseekers on the group <G>
Jim Wilkins
It's funny, among the most dangerous things I've done was UL safety
testing.
jsw
Larry Jaques
<kb1...@gmail.com> scrawled the following:
Ouch! Scratch that off my list of possible cool tools to have/make.
Don Foreman
The latter. Let it take all it will. The pressure won't (can't)
exceed the vapor pressure of propane. At 100 deg F the vapor pressure
of propane is 172 PSIG. Cans can handle considerably more than that.
Propane is used as propellant in some rattlecans.
Don Foreman
<lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>On Thu, 4 Mar 2010 04:44:57 -0800 (PST), the infamous Jim Wilkins
><kb1...@gmail.com> scrawled the following:
>
>>On Mar 4, 7:17�am, Larry Jaques <ljaq...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>>> ...
>>> I missed the first part of this thread. What are these things for? It
>>> looks like a propane-to-rattle-can adapter, maybe used to repressurize
>>> flat spray cans.
>>
>>Makes them round again.
>>
>>If propane doesn't quickly dissolve into the contents it can
>>overpressure the can, that's why I used butane.
>>http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/propane-vapor-pressure-d_1020.html
>>
>>Spray cans do not fail gracefully. I'd rather not post the details as
>>others might try and not be so lucky.
>
>Ouch! Scratch that off my list of possible cool tools to have/make.
And you gave me shit about shying from a 40-joule ICD mulekick when
TIG welding, you macho devil-may-care dawg!
Not knocking prudence, caution and dainty demurral, but note: it
takes about 150 PSIG to pop a plastic (PET) beverage bottle. Metal
cans are smaller and stronger than plastic bottles.
I don't know if dissolution into content lowers vapor pressure or not,
and if so what the time constant might be, I'll defer to Wilkins on
chemistry. That said, I can report that I have recharged and saved
many rattlecans with propane over a period of at least two decades
with no mishaps.
If a spraycan did fail ungracefully it'd make a pop and a mess but
it'd just rupture, no shrapnel. Wearing protective eyeware should be
SOP in the shop anyway and this is a shop activity, not one to be
practiced in milady's parlor.
Pick yer pony, take yer ride ... or walk behind far enough that you
feel safe. <G>
Jim Wilkins
> On Thu, 04 Mar 2010 21:26:15 -0800, Larry Jaques
>
>
>
>
>
> <ljaq...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
> >On Thu, 4 Mar 2010 04:44:57 -0800 (PST), the infamous Jim Wilkins
> ><kb1...@gmail.com> scrawled the following:
>
> >>On Mar 4, 7:17 am, Larry Jaques <ljaq...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
> >>> ...
> >>> I missed the first part of this thread. What are these things for? It
> >>> looks like a propane-to-rattle-can adapter, maybe used to repressurize
> >>> flat spray cans.
>
> >>Makes them round again.
>
> >>If propane doesn't quickly dissolve into the contents it can
> >>overpressure the can, that's why I used butane.
> >>http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/propane-vapor-pressure-d_1020.html
>
> >>Spray cans do not fail gracefully. I'd rather not post the details as
> >>others might try and not be so lucky.
>
> >Ouch! Scratch that off my list of possible cool tools to have/make.
>
> And you gave me shit about shying from a 40-joule ICD mulekick when
> TIG welding, you macho devil-may-care dawg!
>
> Not knocking prudence, caution and dainty demurral, but note: it
> takes about 150 PSIG to pop a plastic (PET) beverage bottle. Metal
> cans are smaller and stronger than plastic bottles.
You tried it? I'd read that they take 200. Never went over 100 myself.
> I don't know if dissolution into content lowers vapor pressure or not,
> and if so what the time constant might be, I'll defer to Wilkins on
> chemistry. That said, I can report that I have recharged and saved
> many rattlecans with propane over a period of at least two decades
> with no mishaps.
>
> If a spraycan did fail ungracefully it'd make a pop and a mess but
> it'd just rupture, no shrapnel. Wearing protective eyeware should be
> SOP in the shop anyway and this is a shop activity, not one to be
> practiced in milady's parlor.
I don't know the pressure ratings, and it definitely varies with
construction. Long ago I read that they were supposed to withstand
180F without rupturing. I checked because one of my lab manager tasks
was turning off soldering irons after everyone had left, and I found a
heat gun running near flux remover cans.
I tested them in a remote sandpit in a rural area where random
gunshots etc didn't attract attention. Some blew out fairly harmlessly
when an end seam unrolled, others ripped apart at the lengthwise seam,
flattened out and became flying saw blades. Thus the warning.
The safer test is to puncture the bottom, fill them with water, plug
the hole and freeze them, preferably outdoors instead of smelling up
the fridge.
jsw
Joseph Gwinn
Don Foreman <dfor...@NOSPAMgoldengate.net> wrote:
Dissolution has no effect on vapor pressure whatsoever.
More generally, if you take each ingredient and put it alone in the can and
measure the pressure one by one, all at the same pressure, the pressure of the
mixture is the sum of the individual partial pressures.
This is called Dalton's Law of Partial Pressures.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalton%27s_law>
Joe Gwinn
Jim Wilkins
> ...
> Dissolution has no effect on vapor pressure whatsoever.
> Joe Gwinn
Joseph Gwinn
Jim Wilkins <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote:
Ideal gas law versus real substances. How big is the deviation?
Joe Gwinn
Larry Jaques
<dfor...@NOSPAMgoldengate.net> scrawled the following:
>On Thu, 04 Mar 2010 21:26:15 -0800, Larry Jaques
><lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 4 Mar 2010 04:44:57 -0800 (PST), the infamous Jim Wilkins
>><kb1...@gmail.com> scrawled the following:
>>
>>>On Mar 4, 7:17�am, Larry Jaques <ljaq...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>>>> ...
>>>> I missed the first part of this thread. What are these things for? It
>>>> looks like a propane-to-rattle-can adapter, maybe used to repressurize
>>>> flat spray cans.
>>>
>>>Makes them round again.
>>>
>>>If propane doesn't quickly dissolve into the contents it can
>>>overpressure the can, that's why I used butane.
>>>http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/propane-vapor-pressure-d_1020.html
>>>
>>>Spray cans do not fail gracefully. I'd rather not post the details as
>>>others might try and not be so lucky.
>>
>>Ouch! Scratch that off my list of possible cool tools to have/make.
>
>And you gave me shit about shying from a 40-joule ICD mulekick when
>TIG welding, you macho devil-may-care dawg!
Har! That's a simple mulekick. I'm worried about paint or adhesive
embedded into all 400 boardfeet of Jarrah lumber in my shop. Cleanup
would exceed 2 full work-weeks, I'm sure.
I _would_ like to refill the little propane bottles from the 5gal
tank, though.
>Not knocking prudence, caution and dainty demurral, but note: it
>takes about 150 PSIG to pop a plastic (PET) beverage bottle. Metal
>cans are smaller and stronger than plastic bottles.
>
>I don't know if dissolution into content lowers vapor pressure or not,
>and if so what the time constant might be, I'll defer to Wilkins on
>chemistry. That said, I can report that I have recharged and saved
>many rattlecans with propane over a period of at least two decades
>with no mishaps.
I'd say that's a pretty good history.
>If a spraycan did fail ungracefully it'd make a pop and a mess but
>it'd just rupture, no shrapnel. Wearing protective eyeware should be
>SOP in the shop anyway and this is a shop activity, not one to be
>practiced in milady's parlor.
I've seen one go. They DEFINITELY are not pretty.
>Pick yer pony, take yer ride ... or walk behind far enough that you
>feel safe. <G>
Thass right! I bought one of the little refillable aerosol cans and
could puncture the spray can and drain it into that if needed. It
definitely does NOT work with latex paint, my original purpose. I
forgot to ask first. :(
cl...@snyder.on.ca
One H of a mess when a paint can splits though!!!!!!!
>
Jim Wilkins
> In article <c751ca82-3c30-469c-b11c-0339fc864...@q23g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
Enormous, order(s) of magnitude. Consider acetylene dissolved in
acetone:
http://chestofbooks.com/crafts/metal/Welding-Practice/Dissolved-Acetylene.html
"At atmospheric pressure and 15 deg. Cent, acetone dissolves 24 times
its volume of acetylene."
jsw
Joseph Gwinn
Jim Wilkins <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mar 5, 11:26�am, Joseph Gwinn <joegw...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > In article
> > <c751ca82-3c30-469c-b11c-0339fc864...@q23g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
> > �Jim Wilkins <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Mar 5, 9:42�am, Joseph Gwinn <joegw...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > > > ...
> > > > Dissolution has no effect on vapor pressure whatsoever.
> > > > ...
> > > > Joe Gwinn
> >
> > > �<http://www.chem.purdue.edu/gchelp/solutions/colligv.html>
> >
> > Ideal gas law versus real substances. �How big is the deviation?
> >
> > Joe Gwinn
>
> Enormous, order(s) of magnitude. Consider acetylene dissolved in
> acetone:
> http://chestofbooks.com/crafts/metal/Welding-Practice/Dissolved-Acetylene.html
> "At atmospheric pressure and 15 deg. Cent, acetone dissolves 24 times
> its volume of acetylene."
That's an interesting article on acetone storage of acetylene.
But something is perplexing me. In the above Purdue reference, the key sentence
echoes Dalton's Law of Partial Pressures:
"A volatile solute (i.e., a solute that has a vapor pressure of its own) will
contribute to the vapor pressure above a solution in which it is dissolved. The
vapor pressure above a solution containing a volatile solute (or solutes) is
equal to the sum of the vapor pressures of the solvent and each of the volatile
solutes."
I think I'll look this up in my Physical Chem textbook.
Joe Gwinn
Jim Wilkins
> In article <356f67c5-4f22-4877-8b92-2a49bb7f2...@t23g2000yqt.googlegroups.com>,
> Jim Wilkins <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 5, 11:26 am, Joseph Gwinn <joegw...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > > In article
> > > <c751ca82-3c30-469c-b11c-0339fc864...@q23g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
> > > Jim Wilkins <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Mar 5, 9:42 am, Joseph Gwinn <joegw...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > > > > ...
> > > > > Dissolution has no effect on vapor pressure whatsoever.
> > > > > ...
> > > > > Joe Gwinn
>
> > > > <http://www.chem.purdue.edu/gchelp/solutions/colligv.html>
>
> > > Ideal gas law versus real substances. How big is the deviation?
>
> > > Joe Gwinn
>
> > Enormous, order(s) of magnitude. Consider acetylene dissolved in
> > acetone:
> > "At atmospheric pressure and 15 deg. Cent, acetone dissolves 24 times
> > its volume of acetylene."
>
> That's an interesting article on acetone storage of acetylene.
>
> But something is perplexing me. In the above Purdue reference, the key sentence
> echoes Dalton's Law of Partial Pressures:
>
> "A volatile solute (i.e., a solute that has a vapor pressure of its own) will
> contribute to the vapor pressure above a solution in which it is dissolved. The
> vapor pressure above a solution containing a volatile solute (or solutes) is
> equal to the sum of the vapor pressures of the solvent and each of the volatile
> solutes."
>
> I think I'll look this up in my Physical Chem textbook.
>
> Joe Gwinn
Does it make sense to you if you think of the fraction in gas phase as
a gas and the fraction in the dissolved liquid phase as a liquid?
Liquids are 500 ~ 1000 times denser than gases.
Otherwise, sorry, chemistry isn't at all intuitive, at least until you
learn thermodynamics. An understanding of the fundamentals of
chemistry eluded Sir Isaac Newton despite his achievements in math and
physics, .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Newton's_occult_studies
jsw
Wild_Bill
commonly available compounds?
Other compounds.. canned air/duster products (difluoroethane)?
I realize that saving/recovering a bit of cheap product isn't worth a safety
risk, and I wouldn't have a pressing reason to recharge an aerosol can, but
if I did, I'd recharge it outdoors and use the contents at that time or not
take the can indoors.
I'm primarily just curious about propellants. Those heavy duty refillable
spray containers that are intended to be charged with compressed air don't
perform very well with compressed air.
For outdoor use, using one of those refillable sprayer gizmos might be more
practical than running a long air hose or portable air compressor with a
paint gun outdoors.
http://www.prodcatalog.com/catalog/ObjectServer?table=Images&id=30297&variant=Large+Product+Variant&mime=image/jpeg
http://weldwarehouse.securesites.com/cgi-bin/spider.pl?99532||1|451
--
WB
.........
"Jim Wilkins" <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:40e95982-51ce-4973...@g10g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
sta...@prolynx.com
> "Ignoramus11220" <ignoramus11...@NOSPAM.11220.invalid> wrote in message
>
> news:h8ednTh9gYzscBbW...@giganews.com...
>
> > LPS-2 is a great rust preventative, because it is light oil, sprays
> > nicely, and does not dry or harden over time. It also creeps and
> > penetrates well, so if, say, I spray it on top of a pile of metal
> > things, it will get to all the pieces in time.
>
> > The only minus of it is that it is expensive.
>
> > Does anyone know of a cheaper alternative that can be sprayed and does
> > not dry out.
>
> > Thanks
>
> You might be interested in a trial I did:
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/27683124@N07/sets/72157623384305382/
>
> It is nothing original or definitive, I just wanted to know how things
> behaved in my hands. Also I did not consider prices but these are easy to
> find out.
>
> In a nutshell: Nothing beat LPS3.
>
> I was puzzled about the behaviour of WD40.
>
> --
> Michael Koblic,
> Campbell River, BC
I'm not puzzled about WD40. Despite what folks say, it's good for one
thing, displacing water, that's what it was designed for. The stuff
is basically a light petroleum fraction with other crap dissolved that
will evaporate leaving the other crap coating the surface and it's NOT
a lubricant or rust-preventative. So if you try using it on a squeaky
hinge, the squeak comes back, sometimes worse. Performance on rusty
stuff is no better than using kerosene. LPS 1 is a far better
penetrant and the coating it leaves IS a lubricant. I use it on
padlock innards, usually good for several years in fully exposed
locks. Keeps the disc locks from bending or busting keys.
There's one thing better than LPS 3, but it's not made anymore. LPS
100 was a white grease that was supposedly good for a whole year under
sea water. Used to use it on antenna rotator bearings, usually lasted
longer than the attached antennas.
Stan
Ed Huntress
<sta...@prolynx.com> wrote in message
news:33bedf3e-8e88-4898...@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
On Mar 2, 6:17 pm, "Michael Koblic" <mkob...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Ignoramus11220" <ignoramus11...@NOSPAM.11220.invalid> wrote in message
>
> news:h8ednTh9gYzscBbW...@giganews.com...
>
> > LPS-2 is a great rust preventative, because it is light oil, sprays
> > nicely, and does not dry or harden over time. It also creeps and
> > penetrates well, so if, say, I spray it on top of a pile of metal
> > things, it will get to all the pieces in time.
>
> > The only minus of it is that it is expensive.
>
> > Does anyone know of a cheaper alternative that can be sprayed and does
> > not dry out.
>
> > Thanks
>
> You might be interested in a trial I did:
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/27683124@N07/sets/72157623384305382/
>
> It is nothing original or definitive, I just wanted to know how things
> behaved in my hands. Also I did not consider prices but these are easy to
> find out.
>
> In a nutshell: Nothing beat LPS3.
>
> I was puzzled about the behaviour of WD40.
>
> --
> Michael Koblic,
> Campbell River, BC
>I'm not puzzled about WD40. Despite what folks say, it's good for one
>thing, displacing water, that's what it was designed for.
<snip>
They should fly banners behind airplanes announcing that fact. It would save
a lot of mistreated machinery.
I'd like to know what happened to WD-39...
--
Ed Huntress
Jim Wilkins
> ...
> There's one thing better than LPS 3, but it's not made anymore. LPS
> 100 was a white grease that was supposedly good for a whole year under
> sea water. Used to use it on antenna rotator bearings, usually lasted
> longer than the attached antennas.
>
> Stan
This can of it is black, and very thick, the marks from scooping some
out maybe 20 years ago haven't slumped.
It's hard to apply unless thinned and doesn't soak through a rust film
so I don't use it much, except on bolt threads under the truck. Plus I
can't replace it.
It might be a slightly better lubricating grease than LPS-3, which
dries to a wax, but neither is good. Marine lower unit or trailer
wheel bearing grease let my home made roller wheel bearings spin
easier and seem to be enough protection.
IIRC it made the antenna rotator sluggish in very cold weather. I used
marine grease the second time. The antenna has lasted only because I
make new parts. I'm receiving HDTV on a dipole made of two 6" hex
standoffs jammed into plastic hose.
jsw
Ignoramus26053
company that makes PB Blaster). It is massively cheaper than LPS-2 and
is sold for $2.50 per can at Home Depot. The can is slightly smaller
than LPS-2, but the price difference more than makes up for it.
However, this PB-50 does not disperse widely, it shoots a jet of it.
So, there is no good alternative to LPS-2.
I agree with the opinion expressed here, that buying LPS-2 by the
gallon, and using spray bottles, is the best bet if I need to use a
lot of nondrying, easily sprayable, penetrating rust preventative.
This is what I will do. I have a large quantity of steel, tool steel
etc. I will sell some, but I will keep a lot and I want that steel to
stay clean and not rust.
i
Martin H. Eastburn
OBTW - remember the times :
Newton was a student of Elias Ashmole. Ashmole gathered during the purges in
England all of he science and 'occult' as the priest of the time held all of
this. Their time coming to an end, Elias decided to gather as much of what they
had before they were burned or otherwise killed. They agreed and he became the
most knowledgeable person in the science and occult world. Instruments, methods
and formula were saved in the worlds first public museum. He held the chair
that Newton later took. He was a Master Mason of the accepted type, not
building trade type.
cite - ISBN 0954330927 author of book Tobias Churton.
Martin
Jim Wilkins
> What about recharging various aerosol products' cans with freon or other
> commonly available compounds?
> Other compounds.. canned air/duster products (difluoroethane)?
>
> I realize that saving/recovering a bit of cheap product isn't worth a safety
> risk, and I wouldn't have a pressing reason to recharge an aerosol can, but
> if I did, I'd recharge it outdoors and use the contents at that time or not
> take the can indoors.
>
> I'm primarily just curious about propellants. Those heavy duty refillable
> spray containers that are intended to be charged with compressed air don't
> perform very well with compressed air.
> For outdoor use, using one of those refillable sprayer gizmos might be more
> practical than running a long air hose or portable air compressor with a
You are asking questions I hesitate to fully answer. I ran into the
welding instructor at the hardware store today and discussed teaching
people skills, hands-on vs verbally vs in print. In print we have no
control over what you do with the information and no feedback if you
misunderstand it.
As I wrote earlier I put aerosol LPS-3 and bug repellant into pump
sprayers that originally held them, because they dissolve paper label
glue and magic marker. Paint and cold galvanizing go in labelled jars.
I've had very little trouble with spray cans that are cleared after
use by spraying them upside down.
BTW, the welding instructor suggested two hex nuts held together as a
model for the 120 degree angle to hand-grind a drill bit.
jsw
Jim Wilkins
wrote:
> Jim Wilkins wrote:
> > ...
> >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Newton's_occult_studies
> > jsw
>
> OBTW - remember the times :
> Newton was a student of Elias Ashmole. Ashmole gathered during the purges in
> England all of he science and 'occult' as the priest of the time held all of
> Martin
I wondered where the odd name "Ashmolean" came from.
Alchemy included the body of practical chemical knowledge. The thousand
+ year old assaying and smelting methods of Theophilius, Biringuccio
and Agricola are still useful. We learned the blowpipe and charcoal
block technique, with which you can literally smelt ores into metals
in your hand.
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/1779750/blowpipe_analysis_for_prospectors.html
I used it with a candle to make little animals from splinters of a
broken milk glass light fixture, which turned a spotted brown when
overheated.
jsw
dca...@krl.org
Have you tried switching nozzles on the PB50 can?
I have used liquid floor polish to keep stuff from rusting. It is
inexpensive if you get it at moving sales.
Dan
Larry Jaques
sta...@prolynx.com scrawled the following:
>I'm not puzzled about WD40. Despite what folks say, it's good for one
>thing, displacing water, that's what it was designed for. The stuff
>is basically a light petroleum fraction with other crap dissolved that
>will evaporate leaving the other crap coating the surface and it's NOT
>a lubricant or rust-preventative. So if you try using it on a squeaky
>hinge, the squeak comes back, sometimes worse. Performance on rusty
>stuff is no better than using kerosene.
For hinges, pull the pins, wipe them off, run some coarse steel wool
over 'em, wipe 'em again, dip your finger in some moly wheel bearing
grease and put a thin coat on the full length and circumference of the
pin. Clean your finger off on the top of the female hinge opening, and
tap the pin in. That's good for about 30 squeak-free years in most
homes.
Well, STP changed their formula and so did WD-40. Both now contain
oil. WD has under 25%, but it's there now. WD hasn't even tried to
talk people out of the idea of using it as a lubricant because it
means that they'll have to buy _much_ more WD. I've amazed many a
mother when I took the squeak (and kept it out) from their kids'
bicycle and tricycle wheels. I'm truly glad that Big Wheels are no
longer an issue. DAMN, those things are LOUD! No way to lube plastic
tires on concrete or asphalt. <sigh>
>LPS 1 is a far better
>penetrant and the coating it leaves IS a lubricant. I use it on
>padlock innards, usually good for several years in fully exposed
>locks. Keeps the disc locks from bending or busting keys.
That has been more of a problem here in Oregon than it was for me in
California. I'll have to locate some LPS1.
>There's one thing better than LPS 3, but it's not made anymore. LPS
>100 was a white grease that was supposedly good for a whole year under
>sea water. Used to use it on antenna rotator bearings, usually lasted
>longer than the attached antennas.
What did you replace it with, spray lithium grease?
--
The blind are not good trailblazers.
-- federal judge Frank Easterbrook
Joseph Gwinn
Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
> On Sat, 6 Mar 2010 18:02:54 -0800 (PST), the infamous
> sta...@prolynx.com scrawled the following:
>
> >I'm not puzzled about WD40. Despite what folks say, it's good for one
> >thing, displacing water, that's what it was designed for. The stuff
> >is basically a light petroleum fraction with other crap dissolved that
> >will evaporate leaving the other crap coating the surface and it's NOT
> >a lubricant or rust-preventative. So if you try using it on a squeaky
> >hinge, the squeak comes back, sometimes worse. Performance on rusty
> >stuff is no better than using kerosene.
>
> For hinges, pull the pins, wipe them off, run some coarse steel wool
> over 'em, wipe 'em again, dip your finger in some moly wheel bearing
> grease and put a thin coat on the full length and circumference of the
> pin. Clean your finger off on the top of the female hinge opening, and
> tap the pin in. That's good for about 30 squeak-free years in most
> homes.
What I've found to work very well on cheap steel door hinges is 90-weight hypoid
gear oil, which is the consistency of honey and so will creep into all the nooks
and crannies.
To apply, I close the door, and one-by-one drive the hingepin out, butter coat
it with the hypoid oil, and reinsert. After a day or so, the oil has found its
way into the places where metal interferes with metal, and the grinding and
squeaking sounds are gone.
The smell of the hypoid oil goes away after a few days. Put a paper towel in
the gap between door and jam under the hinges to catch any drips - the oil will
stain things.
Joe Gwinn
Jerry Wass
Ed Huntress
"Jerry Wass" <wassb...@tds.net> wrote in message
news:W0Tkn.93$Sp1...@newsreading01.news.tds.net...
Very good! <g> There really was a WD-39, you know. And all the other
numbers. The one they finally produced was marketed under the same name they
used for it in the lab -- it was their 40th try to come up with a cheap
solution for displacing water.
--
Ed Huntress
Larry Jaques
>> "Ignoramus11220" <ignoramus11...@NOSPAM.11220.invalid> wrote in message
>>
>> news:h8ednTh9gYzscBbW...@giganews.com...
>>
>> > LPS-2 is a great rust preventative, because it is light oil, sprays
>> > nicely, and does not dry or harden over time. It also creeps and
>> > penetrates well, so if, say, I spray it on top of a pile of metal
>> > things, it will get to all the pieces in time.
>>
>> > The only minus of it is that it is expensive.
>>
>> > Does anyone know of a cheaper alternative that can be sprayed and does
>> > not dry out.
>>
>> > Thanks
>>
>> You might be interested in a trial I did:
>>
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/27683124@N07/sets/72157623384305382/
>>
>> It is nothing original or definitive, I just wanted to know how things
>> behaved in my hands. Also I did not consider prices but these are easy to
>> find out.
Great test. It helps rule out lots of products quickly and shows
which ones work under the nastiest conditions. That's salt and water
in your liquid cups, right?
I'd like to see how the expensive metal polishes (Everbrite and
Sharkskin), fare in this kind of test, too.
>> In a nutshell: Nothing beat LPS3.
Is it still available?
>> I was puzzled about the behaviour of WD40.
The rust probably combined with one of the additives, perhaps?
Larry Jaques
<ignoram...@NOSPAM.26053.invalid> scrawled the following:
The advertising boys in Tucker have been working late:
The can label says "LPS-2 Heavy-duty Lubricant"
The msds says: "Section 1 � Identification
Product Name: LPS 2�
Part Number: 00222, 02128, 00205, 00255, C00222, C02128, C00205,
C00255
Chemical Name: Petroleum Distillates
Product Use: An industrial lubricant designed to displace moisture
from mechanical and electrical equipment, provide light-duty
lubrication and short-term rust prevention. (What duty?)
Manufacturer Information: LPS Laboratories, 4647 Hugh Howell Rd.,
Tucker, GA, USA 30084"
I wonder which it is...
nob...@nowhere.org
Give that man a ceegar! WD40's most impressive feature is it's
marketing dept.
Newb
Bob Engelhardt
> I found another penetrating lubricant called PB-50 ...
>
> However, this PB-50 does not disperse widely, it shoots a jet of it.
>
> So, there is no good alternative to LPS-2.
Geez - this thread has been about LPS-*2*, but I've been thinking
LPS-*3* (although LPS-3 has snuck in).
Anyhow, LPS-2 & PB-50 are primarily lubricants, that rust protect too,
according to their manufacturers.
LPS-3 is primarily a rust preventer. Blaster has a competitive product
(I think) called Corrosion Stop
http://www.pbblaster.com/Corrosion_Stop.html
Has anybody used this? Like PB-50, it is much cheaper than the LPS version.
Bob
Bob Engelhardt
(re re-pressurizing with propane)
> What about recharging various aerosol products' cans with freon or other
> commonly available compounds?
...
> I'm primarily just curious about propellants. Those heavy duty
> refillable spray containers that are intended to be charged with
> compressed air don't perform very well with compressed air.
OH - Inspiration! How about charging those "Atomizer Aerosol Hand
Sprayers" with propane?! You're right that they "don't perform very
well with compressed air". Cause the pressure runs out too quickly &
varies too much. But propane doesn't. IIRC, my sprayer has a maximum
working pressure of 150 psi. Which would accommodate propane if I
didn't let it sit out in the sun for too long <G>. Weenie Warning: I'm
not recommending this.
Bob
Larry Jaques
<joeg...@comcast.net> scrawled the following:
>In article <agg7p5d5rmrg1805e...@4ax.com>,
> Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 6 Mar 2010 18:02:54 -0800 (PST), the infamous
>> sta...@prolynx.com scrawled the following:
>>
>> >I'm not puzzled about WD40. Despite what folks say, it's good for one
>> >thing, displacing water, that's what it was designed for. The stuff
>> >is basically a light petroleum fraction with other crap dissolved that
>> >will evaporate leaving the other crap coating the surface and it's NOT
>> >a lubricant or rust-preventative. So if you try using it on a squeaky
>> >hinge, the squeak comes back, sometimes worse. Performance on rusty
>> >stuff is no better than using kerosene.
>>
>> For hinges, pull the pins, wipe them off, run some coarse steel wool
>> over 'em, wipe 'em again, dip your finger in some moly wheel bearing
>> grease and put a thin coat on the full length and circumference of the
>> pin. Clean your finger off on the top of the female hinge opening, and
>> tap the pin in. That's good for about 30 squeak-free years in most
>> homes.
>
>What I've found to work very well on cheap steel door hinges is 90-weight hypoid
>gear oil, which is the consistency of honey and so will creep into all the nooks
>and crannies.
Oh my Crom! That stuff stinks worse than any crap I've ever shat out.
How could you stand that? I absolutely hate the smell of that stuff.
>To apply, I close the door, and one-by-one drive the hingepin out, butter coat
>it with the hypoid oil, and reinsert. After a day or so, the oil has found its
>way into the places where metal interferes with metal, and the grinding and
>squeaking sounds are gone.
>
>The smell of the hypoid oil goes away after a few days. Put a paper towel in
>the gap between door and jam under the hinges to catch any drips - the oil will
>stain things.
No it doesn't. I had a single drop of it in my kitchen and it stunk
for months, until I'd PineSol the shit out of it. It's horrible.
I still prefer my moly grease, which doesn't go anywhere and doesn't
have much of a scent at all, even right out of the can.
Ignoramus10008
I bought it at HD last week along with PB-50. It does seem to be a
very decent alternative to LPS-3. Leaves a waxy surface, but much
softer than LPS-3. Maybe I should say greasy surface.
I keep my anvil outside and will use this to prevent rusting. I used
LPS-3 and over the last so many months, the anvil has NO rust on it
whatsoever. (I cleaned it up prior to placing it). I re-apply rust
preventer after every use. The anvil may look dirty due to the dust
that it attracts, but not very dirty and inside, it is clean and
non-rusty.
i
Wild_Bill
materials.
The part I was wondering about would be the possible unexpected
consequences.
Such as the home-safety warning of "don't mix household cleaners".
I've used products that had propane or butane as propellants IIRC, but don't
remember what specific products they were, maybe fix-a-flat and a couple
others.
Clearing the dip tube of an aerosol product with the can inverted is the
best practice, and insurance that any unused product can be used at a later
time.
--
WB
.........
"Jim Wilkins" <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:29c5cbed-68aa-4b3e...@q16g2000yqq.googlegroups.com...
Tim Wescott
It also says "Acetone is fairly cheap, inert, and incombustible". I
used to work around acetone, and if there's anything it's _not_, it's
"incombustable". It's about as 'incombustable' as gasoline, in my
experience.
--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consulting
www.wescottdesign.com
Michael Koblic
"Larry Jaques" <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote in message
news:7mi7p5pn9q6ekdhoc...@4ax.com...
>>> You might be interested in a trial I did:
>>>
>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/27683124@N07/sets/72157623384305382/
>>>
>>> It is nothing original or definitive, I just wanted to know how things
>>> behaved in my hands. Also I did not consider prices but these are easy
>>> to
>>> find out.
>
> Great test. It helps rule out lots of products quickly and shows
> which ones work under the nastiest conditions. That's salt and water
> in your liquid cups, right?
And hydrochloric acid :-) That kind of shortens the duration of the trial...
>
> I'd like to see how the expensive metal polishes (Everbrite and
> Sharkskin), fare in this kind of test, too.
>
>
>>> In a nutshell: Nothing beat LPS3.
>
> Is it still available?
http://www.lpslabs.com/product_pg/corrosion_pg/lps3.html
I have a 10 year old can on the shelf. I only use it if I find a nice piece
of steel which I intend to use in a distant future and don't want it to rust
meanwhile. Otherwise it is a pain as it is so sticky.
>>> I was puzzled about the behaviour of WD40.
>
> The rust probably combined with one of the additives, perhaps?
That is what I thought. I wondered what the additive was though. The colour
of the rust notwithstanding, the protection WD40 offered was better than
some others. BTW at the end of the test there was a greasy layer on all the
spray compounds: G96, T9, WD40 and LPS3.
There is a tendency for shop workers, particularly woodworkers to recommend
paste wax as a rust protectant for unpainted surfaces of machine tools. In
this test it was shown to be no better than control. This is consistent with
other literature: Flexner, who wrote book on wood finishing, maintains that
wax does not pose any significant barrier to water or water vapour when
applied to wood. There is no reason why it should behave differently on
metal.
BTW WD40 is the recommended cleaning and oiling agent for VZ firearms :
http://www.czub.cz/navody/CZ_858_Tactical.pdf
(page 15)
Jim Wilkins
> ...
> BTW WD40 is the recommended cleaning and oiling agent for VZ firearms :
> http://www.czub.cz/navody/CZ_858_Tactical.pdf
> Campbell River, BC
I've heard that the Soviets used drain cleaner on the AK-47.
jsw
Wild_Bill
reading and participating in RCM. Definitely RCM's best feature.
There certainly are a lot of varieties of compressed gas products around
these days.
I wouldn't have thought that pressurized paintball guns in the hands of
kids, would be considered safer than yard darts, but whudda I know?
Anyone can walk into a store and buy R134a or any number of aerosol products
(which may contain propellants made in China, but packaged in North America)
that they can use in any way that they deem worthwhile (except huffing it,
because that would be bad.. and the drug companies produce what they really
need).
It's only when/if injury or property damage occur that anyone else
scrutinizes (or has to pay for) the unintended uses of those products.
Most of the regular participants in RCM involved in actual metalworking
activities can assess a situation involving risk, and if the body count is
under 3 or 4, probably be fairly easy to cover up (just so no animals are
needlessly inconvenienced, because that would be bad).
So, frostbite from misusing an aerosol product might not be the worst-case
scenario. One would probably not want to explain to the ER doctor what
happened, when they show up with a badly scorched arm and severe frostbite
on his balls (without thinking up a good story beforehand).
--
WB
.........
"Bob Engelhardt" <bobeng...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:hn17o...@news4.newsguy.com...
Martin H. Eastburn
public museum, The Ashmolean Museum in England.
Near Oxford where Elias sat in the same chair that his student made
super famous. He was the Kings science adviser and carried royal levels.
Martin
Joseph Gwinn
Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
It *is* a terrible smell. For a day or two.
> >To apply, I close the door, and one-by-one drive the hingepin out, butter
> >coat
> >it with the hypoid oil, and reinsert. After a day or so, the oil has found
> >its
> >way into the places where metal interferes with metal, and the grinding and
> >squeaking sounds are gone.
> >
> >The smell of the hypoid oil goes away after a few days. Put a paper towel
> >in
> >the gap between door and jam under the hinges to catch any drips - the oil
> >will
> >stain things.
>
> No it doesn't. I had a single drop of it in my kitchen and it stunk
> for months, until I'd PineSol the shit out of it. It's horrible.
That is not my experience. Perhaps brands differ?
> I still prefer my moly grease, which doesn't go anywhere and doesn't
> have much of a scent at all, even right out of the can.
I have tried various kinds of grease. The problem with grease is that it is
soon pushed and/or scraped out of the critical area, whereas heavy oil will
creep back into that same critical area, time after time. Until the oil dries
out.
Joe Gwinn
Larry Jaques
<joeg...@comcast.net> scrawled the following:
>In article <bu98p59rs7oa1i8f8...@4ax.com>,
> Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>> No it doesn't. I had a single drop of it in my kitchen and it stunk
>> for months, until I'd PineSol the shit out of it. It's horrible.
>
>That is not my experience. Perhaps brands differ?
Very possibly, as do our individual sniffers.
>> I still prefer my moly grease, which doesn't go anywhere and doesn't
>> have much of a scent at all, even right out of the can.
>
>I have tried various kinds of grease. The problem with grease is that it is
>soon pushed and/or scraped out of the critical area, whereas heavy oil will
>creep back into that same critical area, time after time. Until the oil dries
>out.
My experience has it running out the bottom and not creeping back.
YMMV.
----------------------------------------------------------
California's 4 Seasons: Fire, Flood, Drought, & Earthquake
--------------------------------------
www.diversify.com/shades2.html * NoteSHADE(tm) Laptop Glare Guards
Larry Jaques
<mko...@gmail.com> scrawled the following:
>
>"Larry Jaques" <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote in message
>news:7mi7p5pn9q6ekdhoc...@4ax.com...
>
>>>> You might be interested in a trial I did:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/27683124@N07/sets/72157623384305382/
>>>>
>>>> It is nothing original or definitive, I just wanted to know how things
>>>> behaved in my hands. Also I did not consider prices but these are easy
>>>> to
>>>> find out.
>>
>> Great test. It helps rule out lots of products quickly and shows
>> which ones work under the nastiest conditions. That's salt and water
>> in your liquid cups, right?
>
>And hydrochloric acid :-) That kind of shortens the duration of the trial...
Crom, you really like to light 'em up in there, don't you, Doc? <g>
>> I'd like to see how the expensive metal polishes (Everbrite and
>> Sharkskin), fare in this kind of test, too.
>>
>>
>>>> In a nutshell: Nothing beat LPS3.
>>
>> Is it still available?
>
>http://www.lpslabs.com/product_pg/corrosion_pg/lps3.html
>
>I have a 10 year old can on the shelf. I only use it if I find a nice piece
>of steel which I intend to use in a distant future and don't want it to rust
>meanwhile. Otherwise it is a pain as it is so sticky.
A lovely bit like Cosmolene In A Can, is it?
>>>> I was puzzled about the behaviour of WD40.
>>
>> The rust probably combined with one of the additives, perhaps?
>
>That is what I thought. I wondered what the additive was though. The colour
>of the rust notwithstanding, the protection WD40 offered was better than
>some others. BTW at the end of the test there was a greasy layer on all the
>spray compounds: G96, T9, WD40 and LPS3.
>
>There is a tendency for shop workers, particularly woodworkers to recommend
>paste wax as a rust protectant for unpainted surfaces of machine tools. In
>this test it was shown to be no better than control. This is consistent with
>other literature: Flexner, who wrote book on wood finishing, maintains that
>wax does not pose any significant barrier to water or water vapour when
>applied to wood. There is no reason why it should behave differently on
>metal.
I'm a Jeff Jewitt finishing fan. (So there, Flexner! ;)
I do a whole lot more woodworking than metalworking. I've found that
paste wax offers pretty good protection from the acid in my hands and
it's not too bad for rust protection in my dry shop. I should rewax
tools at least once a year but actually don't get around to doing the
whole stable until 4 or 5 years go by. (Hangs head in shame.)
Pros include making planes much easier to move on wood, too.
>BTW WD40 is the recommended cleaning and oiling agent for VZ firearms :
>
>http://www.czub.cz/navody/CZ_858_Tactical.pdf
>(page 15)
Those are mighty long pistols, aren't they? (BTW, do they have an
_English_ translation of that manual? I no speaka da Czech.) I'm
surprised that WD got the nod. (I wonder who bought the guy off?)
Larry Jaques
<kb1...@gmail.com> scrawled the following:
NOTHIN' can hurt those little sweeties.
Joseph Gwinn
Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
> On Sun, 07 Mar 2010 22:59:57 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
> <joeg...@comcast.net> scrawled the following:
>
> >In article <bu98p59rs7oa1i8f8...@4ax.com>,
> > Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>
> >> No it doesn't. I had a single drop of it in my kitchen and it stunk
> >> for months, until I'd PineSol the shit out of it. It's horrible.
> >
> >That is not my experience. Perhaps brands differ?
>
> Very possibly, as do our individual sniffers.
Where was the drop? If not on metal, yes the smell lingers. I am very
fastidious when carrying and applying the hypoid oil.
> >> I still prefer my moly grease, which doesn't go anywhere and doesn't
> >> have much of a scent at all, even right out of the can.
> >
> >I have tried various kinds of grease. The problem with grease is that it is
> >soon pushed and/or scraped out of the critical area, whereas heavy oil will
> >creep back into that same critical area, time after time. Until the oil
> >dries
> >out.
>
> My experience has it running out the bottom and not creeping back.
> YMMV.
I used to put a lot of oil in the hinge and let it drain, but now I put a
thinish layer on the pin. Enough oil stays in the hinge that I don't need to
reapply for some years.
Some kinds of grease also slowly drool oil, and these kinds of grease could work
on a hinge.
The advantage of hypoid oil is that it is designed to handle sliding
metal-to-metal contact, and has the additives to prove it.
There must be a way to use STP here.
Joe Gwinn
Larry Jaques
<joeg...@comcast.net> scrawled the following:
>In article <npu8p5dv7huv8irdi...@4ax.com>,
> Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>> Very possibly, as do our individual sniffers.
>
>Where was the drop? If not on metal, yes the smell lingers. I am very
>fastidious when carrying and applying the hypoid oil.
In a crack on the 30 y/o asphalt kitchen linoleum tiles. I think that
drip was the reason I went to Future acrylic floor "wax", and I've
used the wonderful stuff ever since.
>> My experience has it running out the bottom and not creeping back.
>> YMMV.
>
>I used to put a lot of oil in the hinge and let it drain, but now I put a
>thinish layer on the pin. Enough oil stays in the hinge that I don't need to
>reapply for some years.
My latest test has lasted 8 years without needing reapplication. I did
the doors when I moved in and none of them squeaks or catches in the
slightest yet. No fuss, no muss, no drips, no smell, no maintenance.
Works for me. I think it's StaLube moly wheel bearing grease, and I
haven't had a single callback for a squeak returning yet.
>Some kinds of grease also slowly drool oil, and these kinds of grease could work
>on a hinge.
Yes, probably, and they would cause extra maintenance from drips.
>The advantage of hypoid oil is that it is designed to handle sliding
>metal-to-metal contact, and has the additives to prove it.
Yes, those yummy smelling hypoid additives. Har! Most of my doors are
hollow and don't require much from a grease (surface loading is
guaranteed to be less than that on a differential gear) so I'll
continue to avoid hypoid, thanks. Besides, most squeaking comes not
from the rubbing between the pin and hinge leaf, but from the flaking
rust dropping into the wear areas. Both our lubes should prevent it.
>There must be a way to use STP here.
Oh, you're just a glutton for punishment, aren't you, Joe? <vbg>
Why don't we teflon-treat our door pins? "Folks, for only $499.95, we
can do yer doors. Lifetime guarantee." (We'll be out of bidness long
before that.) Or what about ball bearing hinges? That's the ticket!
Joseph Gwinn
Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
> On Mon, 08 Mar 2010 08:46:59 -0500, the infamous Joseph Gwinn
> <joeg...@comcast.net> scrawled the following:
>
> >In article <npu8p5dv7huv8irdi...@4ax.com>,
> > Larry Jaques <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote:
>
> >> Very possibly, as do our individual sniffers.
> >
> >Where was the drop? If not on metal, yes the smell lingers. I am very
> >fastidious when carrying and applying the hypoid oil.
>
> In a crack on the 30 y/o asphalt kitchen linoleum tiles. I think that
> drip was the reason I went to Future acrylic floor "wax", and I've
> used the wonderful stuff ever since.
>
>
> >> My experience has it running out the bottom and not creeping back.
> >> YMMV.
> >
> >I used to put a lot of oil in the hinge and let it drain, but now I put a
> >thinish layer on the pin. Enough oil stays in the hinge that I don't need
> >to reapply for some years.
>
> My latest test has lasted 8 years without needing reapplication. I did
> the doors when I moved in and none of them squeaks or catches in the
> slightest yet. No fuss, no muss, no drips, no smell, no maintenance.
> Works for me. I think it's StaLube moly wheel bearing grease, and I
> haven't had a single callback for a squeak returning yet.
Sounds like good stuff.
> >Some kinds of grease also slowly drool oil, and these kinds of grease could
> >work on a hinge.
>
> Yes, probably, and they would cause extra maintenance from drips.
But if slow enough would keep the interference zone oiled without dripping.
> >The advantage of hypoid oil is that it is designed to handle sliding
> >metal-to-metal contact, and has the additives to prove it.
>
> Yes, those yummy smelling hypoid additives. Har! Most of my doors are
> hollow and don't require much from a grease (surface loading is
> guaranteed to be less than that on a differential gear) so I'll
> continue to avoid hypoid, thanks. Besides, most squeaking comes not
> from the rubbing between the pin and hinge leaf, but from the flaking
> rust dropping into the wear areas. Both our lubes should prevent it.
>
>
> >There must be a way to use STP here.
>
> Oh, you're just a glutton for punishment, aren't you, Joe? <vbg>
> Why don't we teflon-treat our door pins? "Folks, for only $499.95, we
> can do yer doors. Lifetime guarantee." (We'll be out of bidness long
> before that.) Or what about ball bearing hinges? That's the ticket!
Actually, the hinges on some swinging windows in my 1929 house are interesting.
The staples are galvanized steel, and the pins are solid brass. This worked
while exposed to the elements and left unlubricated for 70 years. So, being HSM
types, we can make new brass hinge pins. (I'm guessing one cannot buy solid
brass hinge pins any more, only steel with a cosmetic thin bras plating layer.)
Joe Gwinn
Michael Koblic
Please! Windex!!!
It's good at removing the corrosive residue from the ComBloc ammo...
Stormin Mormon
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.
"Joseph Gwinn" <joeg...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:joegwinn-842E40...@news.giganews.com...
Where was the drop? If not on metal, yes the smell lingers.
I am very
fastidious when carrying and applying the hypoid oil.
The advantage of hypoid oil is that it is designed to handle
Michael Koblic
"Larry Jaques" <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote in message
>>And hydrochloric acid :-) That kind of shortens the duration of the
>>trial...
>
> Crom, you really like to light 'em up in there, don't you, Doc? <g>
>
Don't have time to p.ss about with this nonsense. 2 weeks is about all I am
prepared to devote to it.
> I do a whole lot more woodworking than metalworking. I've found that
> paste wax offers pretty good protection from the acid in my hands and
> it's not too bad for rust protection in my dry shop. I should rewax
> tools at least once a year but actually don't get around to doing the
> whole stable until 4 or 5 years go by. (Hangs head in shame.)
>
> Pros include making planes much easier to move on wood, too.
I get very forgetful with waxing the surfaces. No rust so far. I suspect the
wax is a placebo.
>>BTW WD40 is the recommended cleaning and oiling agent for VZ firearms :
>>
>>http://www.czub.cz/navody/CZ_858_Tactical.pdf
>>(page 15)
>
> Those are mighty long pistols, aren't they? (BTW, do they have an
> _English_ translation of that manual? I no speaka da Czech.) I'm
> surprised that WD got the nod. (I wonder who bought the guy off?)
Google is your friend, but just in case, do not follow the Google
translation if you buy one of these. It just might be teensy weensy bit
inaccurate as has been my experience in the past.
Also:
1) I suspect WD40 is not as bad as everybody makes out. I think I have
demonstrated that it is no worse than some of the more "sexy" products.
2) I have never been a soldier although I played one in the movies. Thus
although I fired my first fully automatic assault rifle at the age of 8 I
have no experience of what the actual regimes of cleaning weaponry are. If,
as I suspect, cleaning your weapon is a daily task it probably does not
matter *what * you clean with. The stories from Stalingrad suggest that
cleaning agents are not at all critical as long as they satisfy certain
overwhelming imperatives (I.e. in Stalingrad - not freezing!)
The RCMP to my knowledge use the G96 as one of their cleaning agents. There
is a trial they did on various agents on the net somewhere. The G96 did not
freeze and make guns fail in cold weather. However, if you look at their
cleaning regimen it is fairly frequent so a failure such as seen in my trial
is unlikely (I think they have mandatory re-cleaning after 20 discharges or
so - don't quote me on this!)
3) The military weaponry is built to *fight* with not to punch targets. Thus
it tends to be more resilient. Ask the AK crowd.
4) Even in the Czech republic the WD40 is likely to cost only a few crowns
unlike the other product. This maybe an overriding consideration and may be
in fact smart in terms of cost-benefit analysis.
5) I am prepared to accept that if you store your deer rifle in a damp
cabinet all year and take it out once in the hunting season a single
application of WD40 may be insufficient.
Larry Jaques
<mko...@gmail.com> scrawled the following:
>
>"Larry Jaques" <lja...@diversify.invalid> wrote in message
>news:3tu8p5l85rtqsgo5s...@4ax.com...
>
>>>And hydrochloric acid :-) That kind of shortens the duration of the
>>>trial...
>>
>> Crom, you really like to light 'em up in there, don't you, Doc? <g>
>
>Don't have time to p.ss about with this nonsense. 2 weeks is about all I am
>prepared to devote to it.
Thanks again for doing so and posting the results.
>> I do a whole lot more woodworking than metalworking. I've found that
>> paste wax offers pretty good protection from the acid in my hands and
>> it's not too bad for rust protection in my dry shop. I should rewax
>> tools at least once a year but actually don't get around to doing the
>> whole stable until 4 or 5 years go by. (Hangs head in shame.)
>>
>> Pros include making planes much easier to move on wood, too.
>
>I get very forgetful with waxing the surfaces. No rust so far. I suspect the
>wax is a placebo.
No, I had acid fingerprints in rust on my planes before learning to
wax 'em. I haven't seen one since.
>>>BTW WD40 is the recommended cleaning and oiling agent for VZ firearms :
>>>
>>>http://www.czub.cz/navody/CZ_858_Tactical.pdf
>>>(page 15)
>>
>> Those are mighty long pistols, aren't they? (BTW, do they have an
>> _English_ translation of that manual? I no speaka da Czech.) I'm
>> surprised that WD got the nod. (I wonder who bought the guy off?)
>
>Google is your friend, but just in case, do not follow the Google
>translation if you buy one of these. It just might be teensy weensy bit
>inaccurate as has been my experience in the past.
I already have a little $100 SKS. That's good enough for me...for now.
>Also:
>1) I suspect WD40 is not as bad as everybody makes out. I think I have
>demonstrated that it is no worse than some of the more "sexy" products.
Oh, WD-40 has lots of uses. Lubrication isn't one of its high points,
though.
>2) I have never been a soldier although I played one in the movies. Thus
>although I fired my first fully automatic assault rifle at the age of 8 I
>have no experience of what the actual regimes of cleaning weaponry are. If,
>as I suspect, cleaning your weapon is a daily task it probably does not
>matter *what * you clean with. The stories from Stalingrad suggest that
>cleaning agents are not at all critical as long as they satisfy certain
>overwhelming imperatives (I.e. in Stalingrad - not freezing!)
Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!
>The RCMP to my knowledge use the G96 as one of their cleaning agents. There
>is a trial they did on various agents on the net somewhere. The G96 did not
>freeze and make guns fail in cold weather. However, if you look at their
>cleaning regimen it is fairly frequent so a failure such as seen in my trial
>is unlikely (I think they have mandatory re-cleaning after 20 discharges or
>so - don't quote me on this!)
I'd never head of that product before your post.
>3) The military weaponry is built to *fight* with not to punch targets. Thus
>it tends to be more resilient. Ask the AK crowd.
Right, make sure it still fires after being dumped in the mud as you
fall down running from the overwhelming number of enemy soldiers on
your arse.
>4) Even in the Czech republic the WD40 is likely to cost only a few crowns
>unlike the other product. This maybe an overriding consideration and may be
>in fact smart in terms of cost-benefit analysis.
OK.
>5) I am prepared to accept that if you store your deer rifle in a damp
>cabinet all year and take it out once in the hunting season a single
>application of WD40 may be insufficient.
Egad! It would have grown and bloomed by then under those conditions.
<shudder>
--
Stay centered by accepting whatever you are doing. This is the ultimate.
-- Chuang-tzu
dca...@krl.org
> >I get very forgetful with waxing the surfaces. No rust so far. I suspect the
> >wax is a placebo.
>
> No, I had acid fingerprints in rust on my planes before learning to
> wax 'em. I haven't seen one since.
>
>
Wax works. I understand that Cosmoline is microcrystalline wax and
oil.
Dan