Obamas passport?
Gunner Asch
An interesting question/article I received in an email this morning:
"Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to
do is answer one Question
ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. PASS IT ON AND ON AND ON.
While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the
issue can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
Jakarta, and Karachi?
So how did a young man who arrived in New York in early June
1981,without the price of a hotel room in his pocket, suddenly come up
with the price of a round-the-world trip just a month later?
And once he was on a plane, shuttling between New York , Jakarta
and Karachi , what passport was he offering when he passed through
Customs and Immigration?
The American people not only deserve to have answers to these questions,
they must have answers. It makes the debate over Obama's citizenship a
rather short and simple one.
Q: Did he travel to Pakistan in 1981, at age 20?
A :Yes, by his own admission.
Q: What passport did he travel under?
A: There are only three possibilities�
1) He traveled with a U.S. Passport,
2) He traveled with a British passport, or
3) He traveled with an Indonesian passport.
Q: Is it possible that Obama traveled with a U.S. Passport in 1981?
A: No. It is not possible. Pakistan was on the U...S. State Department's
"no travel" list in 1981..
Conclusion:
When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a
British passport or an Indonesian passport.
If he were traveling with a British passport that would provide proof he
was born in Kenya on August 4, 1961, not in Hawaii as he claims.
And if he were traveling with an Indonesian passport that would tend to
prove he relinquished whatever previous citizenship he held, British or
American, prior to being adopted by his Indonesian step-father in 1967.
Whatever the truth of the matter, the American people need to know how
he managed to become a "natural born" American citizen between 1981 and
2008..
Given the destructive nature of his plans for America, as illustrated by
his speech before Congress and the disastrous spending plan he has
presented to Congress, the sooner we learn the truth of all this, the
better."
"Aren't cats Libertarian? They just want to be left alone.
I think our dog is a Democrat, as he is always looking for a handout"
Unknown Usnet Poster
Heh, heh, I'm pretty sure my dog is a liberal - he has no balls.
Keyton
hal
<gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>
> An interesting question/article I received in an email this morning:
>
>
>
>"Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to
>do is answer one Question
>
>ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. PASS IT ON AND ON AND ON.
>
>While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
>issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the
>issue can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
>
>What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
>Jakarta, and Karachi?
Oh, grow up you pathetic twisted little sociopath.
Steve B
<hal> wrote in message news:4b12e306...@news.newsguy.com...
Why does the following come to mind:
"THE TRUTH!? YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!"
Jack Nicholson
Ed Huntress
"Steve B" <desert...@dishmail.net> wrote in message
news:vj5bu6-...@news.infowest.com...
Because he was a loony and they put him in the brig? <g>
If Obama had a foreign passport from any of those countries and entered the
US, he needed a visa. Visa records are agency records, which means they're
public information under FOIA. If the writer of this nonsense was serious,
they could find out in short order.
But that still wouldn't mean he wasn't a US citizen. US citizens can have
foreign passports, and some do, particularly if they grew up outside of the
US.
--
Ed Huntress
Ned Simmons
>
>Conclusion:
>When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a
>British passport or an Indonesian passport.
Imagine my surprise that Snopes has seen this as well...
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/passport.asp
--
Ned Simmons
Gunner Asch
So which passport did he use?
Gunner
knews4...@yahoo.com
> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch
>
> <gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>
>
> >"Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to
> >do is answer one Question
>
> is required.
>
>
>
> >ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. PASS IT ON AND ON AND ON.
>
> >While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
> >issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the
> >issue can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
>
> >What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
> >Jakarta, and Karachi?
>
>
>
>
> >So how did a young man who arrived in New York in early June
> >1981,without the price of a hotel room in his pocket, suddenly come up
> >with the price of a round-the-world trip just a month later?
>
>
>
>
> >And once he was on a plane, shuttling between New York , Jakarta
> >and Karachi , what passport was he offering when he passed through
> >Customs and Immigration?
>
>
>
>
> >The American people not only deserve to have answers to these questions,
> >they must have answers. It makes the debate over Obama's citizenship a
> >rather short and simple one.
>
> you following someone who can't count to one and stop?
>
> Rest of rubbish snipped. Obama has proven that he is a US citizen to
> the satisfaction of the elections commission and the courts. He has
> no more to prove in that regard.
He hasn't "proven" anything with his stonewalling.
The courts have not ruled on the matter and won't touch it with a ten
foot pole on the mystical basis of "standing."
They are basically stonewalling too.
http://www.devvy.com/new_site/rodearmel_v_clinton_112209.html
Ed Huntress
<knews4...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:7c33804f-7c8b-4c7c...@v15g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
"Stonewalling" whom? Birther nutbags? Nobody cares about them, except the
nutbags themselves.
Bull-goose Birther Orly Taitz has been fined $20,000 and is facing
disbarment proceedings for this stuff. This is a very good idea: Fine the
nutbags for slander and libel, and we can make a big dent in the national
debt. d8-)
--
Ed Huntress
Mark Rand
>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 16:49:41 -0500, Ned Simmons <ne...@nedsim.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch
>><gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>>.
>>>
>>>Conclusion:
>>>When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a
>>>British passport or an Indonesian passport.
>>
>>Imagine my surprise that Snopes has seen this as well...
>>http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/passport.asp
>
>
>So which passport did he use?
>
>Gunner
>
The passport he has, which is a US passport. There was no reason why he should
not use a US passport to visit Pakistan in 1981.
Mark Rand
RTFM
Michael A. Terrell
Be careful what you ask for, eddie. You could find youself without
two cents with all the crap you spew.
--
The movie 'Deliverance' isn't a documentary!
Gunner Asch
wrote:
>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 14:11:20 -0800, Gunner Asch <gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 16:49:41 -0500, Ned Simmons <ne...@nedsim.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch
>>><gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>>>.
>>>>
>>>>Conclusion:
>>>>When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a
>>>>British passport or an Indonesian passport.
>>>
>>>Imagine my surprise that Snopes has seen this as well...
>>>http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/passport.asp
>>
>>
>>So which passport did he use?
>>
>>Gunner
>>
>
>
>The passport he has, which is a US passport. There was no reason why he should
>not use a US passport to visit Pakistan in 1981.
Do you have a picture of that passport? And any cites as to which
passport he actually used?
Or are you simply giving your opinion? Again.
Gunner
>
>
>Mark Rand
>RTFM
jbsl...@gmail.com
<gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 16:49:41 -0500, Ned Simmons <ne...@nedsim.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch
>><gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>>.
>>>
>>>Conclusion:
>>>When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a
>>>British passport or an Indonesian passport.
>>
>>Imagine my surprise that Snopes has seen this as well...
>>http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/passport.asp
>
>
>So which passport did he use?
>
>Gunner
>
A far more interesting question is: "If there is even a tiny chance
that you are correct why has there not been a concentrated effort by
the Republican Party to obtain this information?"
One would tend to believe that if it were possible to prove that an
election of a Democrat President was fraudulently that the Republicans
would want it publicized. Wouldn't one?
Regards,
J.B.
Ed Huntress
"Gunner Asch" <gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote in message
news:d366h5d864e6nok82...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 22:55:37 +0000, Mark Rand <ra...@internettie.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 14:11:20 -0800, Gunner Asch <gun...@lightspeed.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 16:49:41 -0500, Ned Simmons <ne...@nedsim.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch
>>>><gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>>>Conclusion:
>>>>>When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a
>>>>>British passport or an Indonesian passport.
>>>>
>>>>Imagine my surprise that Snopes has seen this as well...
>>>>http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/passport.asp
>>>
>>>
>>>So which passport did he use?
>>>
>>>Gunner
>>>
>>
>>
>>The passport he has, which is a US passport. There was no reason why he
>>should
>>not use a US passport to visit Pakistan in 1981.
>
> Do you have a picture of that passport? And any cites as to which
> passport he actually used?
>
> Or are you simply giving your opinion? Again.
>
> Gunner
Another birther on a fishing trip.
This is what I mean that it would make no difference if Obama walked around
downtown DC waving his long-form birth certificate. The birther nutbags
would just keep finding one more thing to question, world without end, amen.
What reason do you have to believe it wasn't a US passport, Gunner? Except
for the discredited ones you've come up with so far, that is.
--
Ed Huntress
cavelamb
>
> Or are you simply giving your opinion? Again.
>
> Gunner
>
Guns! Take a step back and breathe!
Bottom line - it doesn't matter anymore.
The guy IS the President of the United States, and yes,
he's not only a democrat, he's black.
Deal with it, man.
Gunner Asch
Have any idea how many times this question has been brought to court so
far?
33 times
And it never ever goes to trial or a jury.
Democrats make sure to put up such a fuss...that it is tossed out of
court. generally without "prejudice"...which means it can be opened
again.
And when it is...its again tossed without prejudice..and then again and
again.
Seems no court wants to be the one to upset the apple cart..or be the
first one to find a president there illegally.
Must scare the shit out any judge put in that position.
Gunner
>Regards,
>
>J.B.
HH&C
> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch
>
> <gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>
>
> >"Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to
> >do is answer one Question
>
> is required.
>
>
>
>
> >While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
> >issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the
> >issue can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
>
> >What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
> >Jakarta, and Karachi?
>
>
>
>
> >So how did a young man who arrived in New York in early June
> >1981,without the price of a hotel room in his pocket, suddenly come up
> >with the price of a round-the-world trip just a month later?
>
>
>
>
> >And once he was on a plane, shuttling between New York , Jakarta
> >and Karachi , what passport was he offering when he passed through
> >Customs and Immigration?
>
>
>
>
> >The American people not only deserve to have answers to these questions,
> >they must have answers. It makes the debate over Obama's citizenship a
> >rather short and simple one.
>
> you following someone who can't count to one and stop?
>
> Rest of rubbish snipped. Obama has proven that he is a US citizen to
> the satisfaction of the elections commission and the courts. He has
> no more to prove in that regard.
Prove that you are a Mall Cop.
HH&C
> <knews4u2c...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
First you have to convict. To convict you have to produce the birth
certificate.
Unless you're like the dynamic duo who wanted to hang Bush prior to
any trial.
> and we can make a big dent in the national
> debt. d8-)
>
> --
> Ed Huntress- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Gunner Asch
wrote:
Actually...he is only 6% black, 50% white, and 44% middle eastern, but
that really doesnt mean anything to me. What bothers me (and we are
drifting from the topic) is that he is a Marxist Community Organizer
with absolutely NO clue what he is doing as president. And Ill bet he
would admit that, if you got him high enough, or drunk enough.
Now..as to his passport...and is he Legally the President of the USA?
He may have been voted in..but frauds happen every day. Look at Wall
Street for an example.
>
>Deal with it, man.
I was simply asking questions. Shrug..if the Left doesnt like the
questions..then they should be able to answer it promptly and properly.
Their Opinions are like assholes..everyone has one..and they all stink.
Gunner
jbsl...@gmail.com
<gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
Do you really believe all this conspiracy stuff? Do you really believe
that there is not a single judge somewhere in this Brave Land, elected
in a good strong Republican jurisdiction (so he doesn't have to worry
about next year), that would hear the case?
Do you really believe that not only the Republican National Committee,
to say nothing of the Democratic National Committee and those
political neophytes, the Clintons, are somehow partners in a cover up?
Or do you believe it just might be possible that the reason the courts
haven't disqualified the President is because there isn't any
evidence, that will stand the light of day, to support these fantastic
theories.
Regards,
J.B.
Ed Huntress
"HH&C" <hot-ham-a...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:0d72c3f5-2d55-45d5...@f18g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
What are you talking about now, Croque? "Convict" whom, of what?
Orly has already been fined. She's appealing. Then she faces disbarment.
That probably will be the end of the nonsense for a while.
--
Ed Huntress
Gunner Asch
Time will tell eh. So when will Obama release his original Birth Cert
and his school records?
So far..they are locked securely away from the People.
Any idea why that is?
Hummmm?
Gunner
cavelamb
>
> Time will tell eh. So when will Obama release his original Birth Cert
> and his school records?
>
> So far..they are locked securely away from the People.
>
> Any idea why that is?
>
> Hummmm?
>
> Gunner
>
>
Best guess? About the same time you have to produce yours...
Edward A. Falk
Deucalion <som...@nowhere.net> wrote:
>
>That's three questions.
And therein lies the problem. No matter how thoroughly Obama proves
his citizenship -- birth cert., newspaper clippings, vouched for by
the governor of Hawaii -- there's always more demands from the
birthers. Now they want to see *another* birth cert. Now they want
to see his passport. If he were to produce those, they'd want to
see something else.
It would be a waste of time for Obama to appease the birthers any
more. The question has been asked and answered. It's time to
admit the earth is round and move on.
--
-Ed Falk, fa...@despams.r.us.com
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/
Richard the Dreaded Libertarian
> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch <gun...@lightspeed.net>
>
>>
>>"Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to do
>>is answer one Question
>>
>>ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. PASS IT ON AND ON AND ON.
>>
>>While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
>>issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the issue
>>can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
>>
>>What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
>>Jakarta, and Karachi?
>
> Oh, grow up you pathetic twisted little sociopath.
You must be a liberal. Instead of offering a credible rebuttal, you
name-call.
Thanks,
Rich
Ed Huntress
"Richard the Dreaded Libertarian" <freed...@example.net> wrote in message
news:pan.2009.11.30....@example.net...
You sound like the guy who came over from your NG a few years ago and
couldn't understand why we wouldn't debate the racist bigots who claimed
that "Negroes" were an inferior race that should all be deported. He said we
were being unfair by not listening to his "reasoning," which was of the same
caliber as that of the birthers.
There is no rebuttal worth making, Rich, just like there wasn't to them --
and for the same reason.
--
Ed Huntress
Joe AutoDrill
>>
>> You must be a liberal. Instead of offering a credible rebuttal, you
>> name-call.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Rich
>
> You sound like the guy who came over from your NG a few years ago and
> couldn't understand why we wouldn't debate the racist bigots who claimed
> that "Negroes" were an inferior race that should all be deported. He said
> we were being unfair by not listening to his "reasoning," which was of the
> same caliber as that of the birthers.
>
> There is no rebuttal worth making, Rich, just like there wasn't to them --
> and for the same reason.
In all fairness, he does have a point. No response would have been better
than Rich calling him a "pathetic twisted little sociopath", eh?
After all is said and done, there are a LOT of people on bopth sides of the
political fence with lots of opinions these days. To squelch any of them is
stupidity at best - even if their opinions are stupidity at best. Let the
mud identify itself.
Me personally, I'd actually like to see the whole birth certificate issue
investigated a bit further. There is simply too much smoke for fire to be
considered impossible in this case.
--
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://Production-Tapping-Equipment.com/
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill
V8013-R
rangerssuck
> On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 18:32:52 +0700, jbslo...@gmail.com wrote:
> >On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 20:22:01 -0800, Gunner Asch
> ><gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>
>
> >>>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 14:11:20 -0800, Gunner Asch
> >>><gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
>
When will gunner release his military service records? His employment
records? His educational records?
Get a life.
Ed Huntress
"Joe AutoDrill" <auto...@yunx.com> wrote in message
news:dkXQm.94031$gg6....@newsfe25.iad...
>>>> Oh, grow up you pathetic twisted little sociopath.
>>>
>>> You must be a liberal. Instead of offering a credible rebuttal, you
>>> name-call.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Rich
>>
>> You sound like the guy who came over from your NG a few years ago and
>> couldn't understand why we wouldn't debate the racist bigots who claimed
>> that "Negroes" were an inferior race that should all be deported. He said
>> we were being unfair by not listening to his "reasoning," which was of
>> the same caliber as that of the birthers.
>>
>> There is no rebuttal worth making, Rich, just like there wasn't to
>> them -- and for the same reason.
>
> In all fairness, he does have a point.
I don't think so. I think he has a subject for trolling.
> No response would have been better than Rich calling him a "pathetic
> twisted little sociopath", eh?
I'll have to leave that for you do decide, Joe. These characters tend to run
wild unless someone hammers them a little bit. Then it's a question of
whether you're dealing with a real troll, or a hobbyist. If it's the former,
you just get them going. If it's the latter, they'll give up after a short
while.
You'll have to decide for yourself how you want to handle them. From
experience, though, I'm with calling them what they are.
>
> After all is said and done, there are a LOT of people on bopth sides of
> the political fence with lots of opinions these days. To squelch any of
> them is stupidity at best - even if their opinions are stupidity at best.
> Let the mud identify itself.
Soon, we're hip-deep in it. The hobbyists seem to take a lack of hard
response as acquiescence.
It's not like they're having a real debate. The issues have been fully
aired. They're just going for throw-weight, like Gunner used to do when he
was here full time.
>
> Me personally, I'd actually like to see the whole birth certificate issue
> investigated a bit further. There is simply too much smoke for fire to be
> considered impossible in this case.
> --
The smoke is self-generated by the birther nutbags, like Richard the Loony
Libretardian. They're a self-propelled echo chamber, and your reaction is
exactly what they've been shooting for. To some degree, in other words,
they've been quite successful.
--
Ed Huntress
Dan
When you offer an argument, some will consider rebutting it.
When all you have is name-calling, expect the same in return.
Now, go do your homework.
Dan
ATP*
"Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:4b1450e9$0$4979$607e...@cv.net...
He's not here full time now?
>
>>
>> Me personally, I'd actually like to see the whole birth certificate issue
>> investigated a bit further. There is simply too much smoke for fire to
>> be considered impossible in this case.
>> --
>
> The smoke is self-generated by the birther nutbags, like Richard the Loony
> Libretardian. They're a self-propelled echo chamber, and your reaction is
> exactly what they've been shooting for. To some degree, in other words,
> they've been quite successful.
>
> --
> Ed Huntress
Soon the only smoke Gunner's going to be dealing with is from the 55 gallon
drum he's warming his hands over.
Ed Huntress
"ATP*" <waxwin...@azurepane.com> wrote in message
news:4b145451$0$31286$607e...@cv.net...
Oh, hell no. This is a pale version of Gunner at full chat.
>>
>>>
>>> Me personally, I'd actually like to see the whole birth certificate
>>> issue investigated a bit further. There is simply too much smoke for
>>> fire to be considered impossible in this case.
>>> --
>>
>> The smoke is self-generated by the birther nutbags, like Richard the
>> Loony Libretardian. They're a self-propelled echo chamber, and your
>> reaction is exactly what they've been shooting for. To some degree, in
>> other words, they've been quite successful.
>>
>> --
>> Ed Huntress
> Soon the only smoke Gunner's going to be dealing with is from the 55
> gallon drum he's warming his hands over.
Don't count on it. He has a good offer from Tom, and he may take it yet.
--
Ed Huntress
ATP*
benefactor- but it will make another interesting chapter in the saga of the
welfare/drama queen.
Richard the Dreaded Libertarian
> "Richard the Dreaded Libertarian" <freed...@example.net> wrote in
>>> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch <gun...@lightspeed.net>
>>>
>>>> An interesting question/article I received in an email this morning:
>>>>
>>>>"Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to
>>>>do is answer one Question
>>>>
>>>>ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. PASS IT ON AND ON AND ON.
>>>>
>>>>While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
>>>>issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the
>>>>issue can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
>>>>
>>>>What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
>>>>Jakarta, and Karachi?
>>>
>>> Oh, grow up you pathetic twisted little sociopath.
>>
>> You must be a liberal. Instead of offering a credible rebuttal, you
>> name-call.
>
> couldn't understand why we wouldn't debate the racist bigots who claimed
> that "Negroes" were an inferior race that should all be deported. He said
> we were being unfair by not listening to his "reasoning," which was of the
> same caliber as that of the birthers.
>
> There is no rebuttal worth making, Rich, just like there wasn't to them --
> and for the same reason.
Time to pull out the good ol' reliable race card, apparently.
Thanks,
Rich
Richard the Dreaded Libertarian
> Richard the Dreaded Libertarian wrote:
>> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 21:10:02 +0000, hal wrote:
>>> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch <gun...@lightspeed.net>
>>>
>>>> An interesting question/article I received in an email this morning:
>>>>
>>>> "Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to
>>>> do is answer one Question
>>>>
>>>> ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. PASS IT ON AND ON AND ON.
>>>>
>>>> While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
>>>> issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the
>>>> issue can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
>>>>
>>>> What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
>>>> Jakarta, and Karachi?
>>> Oh, grow up you pathetic twisted little sociopath.
>>
>> You must be a liberal. Instead of offering a credible rebuttal, you
>> name-call.
>>
>
> When all you have is name-calling, expect the same in return.
>
> Now, go do your homework.
>
"Liberal" is name-calling? That says a lot about their self-respect, or
lack thereof.
Cheers!
Rich
Ed Huntress
Having seen Tom here when he's wound up, I don't think I'd want the job
myself. d8-) However, you never know. It might work out for both of them.
--
Ed Huntress
Ed Huntress
"Richard the Dreaded Libertarian" <freed...@example.net> wrote in message
news:pan.2009.11.30....@example.net...
It's already been pulled, by the birthers. Can you imagine them going on
like this if he was white, with a name like John Macintyre or something?
HAHAHAHAhahahahooooo....!!
This is every closet racist's dream, Rich. They can express their bigotry
without having to admit it. They get to hate without being called a low-life
racist. What more could they ask for?
--
Ed Huntress
jbsl...@gmail.com
<gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote:
My understanding is that Obama's birth certificate has been physically
inspected and appears legitimate and that the applicable agency in
Hawaii has certified that it is a normal, legal birth certificate.
What more is there to do?
School records? Didn't he attend Harvard University? Or are you
referring to the "Moslem School" that he went to in Indonesia, which
everyone just knows is a "Moslem country", right?
You will note the inverted commas I hope.
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
But what difference does it make what passport he used? The
requirement is to be a born citizen of the U.S., i.e., not
naturalized.
How does the use of another passport invalidate that?
Dual citizenship is not illegal in the U.S. and in fact it is even
mentioned (in paragraph 14 of Important Information, page 6 and 7, of
the U.S. passport).
As added information, Indonesia, also recognizes dual citizenship.
Regards,
J.B.
Dan
name-calling.
I won't bother waiting.
Dan
Steve W.
*AP declared Obama �Kenyan-Born�*
(The Post & Email)
What most people know is that the Associated Press (AP) is one of the
largest, internationally recognized, syndicated news services. What
most people don�t know that is in 2004, the AP was a �birther� news
organization.
How so? Because in a syndicated report, published Sunday, June 27,
2004, by the Kenyan Standard Times, and which was, as of this report,
available at
http://web.archive.org/web/20040627142700/eastandard.net/headlines/news26060403.htm
The AP reporter stated the following:
*Kenyan-born US Senate hopeful, Barrack Obama, appeared set to take over
the Illinois Senate seat after his main rival, Jack Ryan, dropped out of
the race on Friday night amid a furor over lurid sex club allegations.*
**This report explains the context of the oft cited debate, between
Obama and Keyes in the following Fall, in which Keyes faulted Obama for
not being a �natural born citizen�, and in which Obama, by his quick
retort, �So what? I am running for Illinois Senator, not the
presidency�, self-admitted that he was not eligible for the office.**
**Seeing that an AP reporter is too professional to submit a story which
was not based on confirmed sources (ostensibly the Obama campaign in
this case), the inference seems inescapable:** **Obama himself was
putting out in 2004, that he was born in Kenya .**
The difficulty in finding this gem of a story is hampered by Google,
which is running flak for Obama: because if you search for �Kenyan-born
US Senate� you wont find it, but if you search for the phrase without
quotes you will find links which talk about it.
For those who believe what they see, here is the screen capture of the
page from the Kenyan Sunday Standard, electronic edition, of June 27,
2004 � Just in case that page is scrubbed from the Web Archive:
Readers should take note that this AP story, was syndicated world-wide,
so you should be able to find it in major newspapers, archived in
libraries world-wide. If any reader does this, please let *The Post &
Email*know, so that we can publish a follow up-story. You can scrub the
net, but scrubbing libraries world-wide is not so easy.
Hanen of *Sentinel Blog Radio* broke the public news of the existence of
this AP story at on October 14, 2009 at 12:31 pm. However, *The Post &
Email* can confirm that a professional investigator had uncovered this
story months ago, and that certified and authenticated copies of this
report, meeting Federal Rules of evidence, have already been prepared
and archived at many locations nationwide.
It should be noted that on January 8, 2006, the *Honolulu Advertiser*
also reported that Barack Hussein Obama was born outside the United States .
http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2006/Jan/08/ln/FP601080334.html
*A Chronology of Deceit*
One can now ask an important question which has not yet been emphasized
enough: �/Just when did Obama begin to publically claim he was born in
Hawaii ?� /This question is distinct from the question, /�Just where in
fact was Obama born?�/, and from the other question, /�What do official
documents say about where he was born?�/
Regarding his claims, we can summarize what is known:
1. As of Monday, Aug. 28, 2006, Obama�s Campaign was putting out that he
was born in Hawaii . This is known from the introductory speech given
by Prof. George A. O. Magoha, Vice-Chancellor of the University of
Nairobi , on the occasion of a speech given there by Senator Obama that
day. /(One presumes that the Vice-Chancellor was given notes from the
Obama campaign, as is customary on such occasions)/
2. From the newspaper reports above, it is clear that the Obama campaign
was putting out that he was born in Kenya , or overseas, during the
period of June 27, 2004, until January 8, 2006.
**3. In October of 2004, during the ABC Chicago Affiliate�s broadcast of
the Obama-Keyes debates, Obama openly admitted � he conceded � that he
was not a natural born citizen. /(C-Span aired the uncut version of the
debates, which contained this exchange, in the second half of April,
2005)/**
4. It is known from a classmate of Obama at Harvard University , that
while at Harvard, Obama at least on one occasion admitted that he was
born in Kenya . /(This friend went on record on a call in radio program
in Idaho in early July, 2009)/
If any reader can find a link which documents a claim to a birth
location before Aug. 28th, 2006, which differs from this timeline or
which supports it; please let *The Post & Email* know of it, by posting
it in the comment section below.
In a follow up report, *The Post & Email* has published a brief analysis
of the Google Newspaper archive, which shows that Obama�s story changed
after June 27,2004.
*Finally, that the AP did cover this story,* reprinted by the East
African Standard, *can be seen from the citation made to AP stories
about it *(Jack Ryan dropping out of the race), in the following
contemporary news articles, which however are incomplete:
June 25, 2004 � http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,123716,00.html
June 26, 2004 � Bellview News Democrat
June 26, 2004 � AP Online Story by Michael Tarm
June 25, 2004 � AP Syndicated Story by Maura Kelly Lannan
(Second Source on June 26, 2009, which cites Associated Press Special
Correspondent David Espo and reporter Dennis Conrad as contributors to
this report)
(Third Source, The Ledger, print edition of June 26, 2009: partial
republication)
October 16, 2009
Doug Miller
>Q: Is it possible that Obama traveled with a U.S. Passport in 1981?
>A: No. It is not possible. Pakistan was on the U...S. State Department's
>"no travel" list in 1981..
False. Travel to Pakistan was not prohibited in 1981.
Do you *ever* do *any* fact-checking on your own before posting crap like
this?
Ed Huntress
"Steve W." <csr...@NOTyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:hf1ppp$ok$1...@aioe.org...
>
>
>
> (The Post & Email)
>
> What most people know is that the Associated Press (AP) is one of the
> largest, internationally recognized, syndicated news services. What
> organization.
>
> How so? Because in a syndicated report, published Sunday, June 27,
> 2004, by the Kenyan Standard Times, and which was, as of this report,
> available at
>
> http://web.archive.org/web/20040627142700/eastandard.net/headlines/news26060403.htm
More lies. Don't you know how to use Snopes, Steve?
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/ap.asp
--
Ed Huntress
Steve B
"Gunner Asch" <gun...@lightspeed.net> wrote
>
> Time will tell eh. So when will Obama release his original Birth Cert
> and his school records?
>
> So far..they are locked securely away from the People.
>
> Any idea why that is?
>
> Hummmm?
>
> Gunner
I heard on those radical right wing talk shows that he and the DNC has spent
about $900,000 on the lawyers that are keeping this info from the public.
But you know, you can't believe all you hear on those right wing talk shows.
Steve
Steve B
<jbsl...@gmail.com> wrote
>
> My understanding is that Obama's birth certificate has been physically
> inspected and appears legitimate and that the applicable agency in
> Hawaii has certified that it is a normal, legal birth certificate.
>
> What more is there to do?
Show it to me and the American public, who, BTW ARE citizens. I just had to
show mine to a guy I didn't know at the post office to get a passport. Why
don't I have the right to see other people's birth certificates, especially
if it is someone working for me?
Steve
knews4...@yahoo.com
> In article <mkn5h5pmorkdgdj4a276r5sqj4p5itg...@4ax.com>, gun...@lightspeed.net wrote:
> >Q: Is it possible that Obama traveled with a U.S. Passport in 1981?
> >A: No. It is not possible. Pakistan was on the U...S. State Department's
> >"no travel" list in 1981..
>
> False. Travel to Pakistan was not prohibited in 1981.
>
Do you have a cite for this?
> Do you *ever* do *any* fact-checking on your own before posting crap like
> this?
?
Ed Huntress
"Steve B" <desert...@dishmail.net> wrote in message
news:rlceu6-...@news.infowest.com...
>
> <jbsl...@gmail.com> wrote
>
>>
>> My understanding is that Obama's birth certificate has been physically
>> inspected and appears legitimate and that the applicable agency in
>> Hawaii has certified that it is a normal, legal birth certificate.
>>
>> What more is there to do?
>
> Show it to me and the American public
He already has. You can see it online. Here are nine photos of it:
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
Is he supposed to bring it to your house and show it to you personally? And
who is this "American public"? Most of us are satisfied.
> ...who, BTW ARE citizens.
So are the rest of us. And we don't want him wasting any more time on it.
> I just had to show mine to a guy I didn't know at the post office to get a
> passport. Why don't I have the right to see other people's birth
> certificates, especially if it is someone working for me?
Because you don't. He's not your employee, anyway -- not that it would give
you the right to demand his birth certificate if he were.
--
Ed Huntress
Steve B
If his paycheck comes from my taxes, doesn't it follow he works for me? Why
did all this falderal occur in the first place when he was FIRST asked about
his birth certificate. Seems like any red blooded true American wouldn't
have a problem showing something that is required for holding an office in
the US.
I went to the site you posted. It all looks authentic. It must be true. I
mean, if it is on the Internet, or on television, or on radio, it HAS to be
true for those guys to put it out. Right? Even you said it was so, so it
HAS to be so.
Steve
Ed Huntress
>
> "Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote in message
> news:4b148987$0$31267$607e...@cv.net...
>>
>> "Steve B" <desert...@dishmail.net> wrote in message
>> news:rlceu6-...@news.infowest.com...
>>>
>>> <jbsl...@gmail.com> wrote
>>>
>>>>
>>>> My understanding is that Obama's birth certificate has been physically
>>>> inspected and appears legitimate and that the applicable agency in
>>>> Hawaii has certified that it is a normal, legal birth certificate.
>>>>
>>>> What more is there to do?
>>>
>>> Show it to me and the American public
>>
>> He already has. You can see it online. Here are nine photos of it:
>>
>> http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
>>
>> Is he supposed to bring it to your house and show it to you personally?
>> And who is this "American public"? Most of us are satisfied.
>>
>>> ...who, BTW ARE citizens.
>>
>> So are the rest of us. And we don't want him wasting any more time on it.
>>
>>> I just had to show mine to a guy I didn't know at the post office to get
>>> a passport. Why don't I have the right to see other people's birth
>>> certificates, especially if it is someone working for me?
>>
>> Because you don't. He's not your employee, anyway -- not that it would
>> give you the right to demand his birth certificate if he were.
>>
>> --
>> Ed Huntress
>
> If his paycheck comes from my taxes, doesn't it follow he works for me?
No. He's an elected official, not your employee.
> Why did all this falderal occur in the first place...
Good question. It apparently has several sources, all of them from people
who are looking for a way to cause trouble for the President, or to make
money for themselves (Corsi, professional liar, with his book). The rest is
the right-wing echo chamber working at full volume, repeating the lies until
some people have come to believe them. That, of course, was their intent.
Wikipedia has done a good job of keeping up with it, if you want to look
into it yourself.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories#Richard_Shelby
There also was a good, brief report from ABC news, which you can see here:
> ...when he was FIRST asked about his birth certificate. Seems like any
> red blooded true American wouldn't have a problem showing something that
> is required for holding an office in the US.
>
> I went to the site you posted. It all looks authentic. It must be true.
> I mean, if it is on the Internet, or on television, or on radio, it HAS to
> be true for those guys to put it out. Right? Even you said it was so, so
> it HAS to be so.
>
> Steve
It's been authenticated by so many sources now, including Snopes,
Politifact, Factcheck.org, the state of Hawaii, and others, that one has to
be a complete paranoid not to believe *any* of them.
Now I have two questions for you, Steve. First, what other president has had
people from the opposing party demand to see his birth certificate?
The second question is, if you doubt that Obama was born in Hawaii, WHY do
you doubt it?
--
Ed Huntress
HH&C
> f...@mauve.rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
>
> >Deucalion <some...@nowhere.net> wrote:
>
> >>That's three questions.
>
> >And therein lies the problem. No matter how thoroughly Obama proves
> >his citizenship -- birth cert., newspaper clippings, vouched for by
> >the governor of Hawaii -- there's always more demands from the
> >birthers. Now they want to see *another* birth cert.
>
> We haven't see the first one yet. We did see a modern document
> attesting that there was something in the state files. But the rules
> at the time allowed for several kinds of births to be recorded in a
> way that make them all appear the same today. They ARE essentially
> the same for ordinary citizens. They are not the same for the purpose
> of determining the citizenship of the guy that was elected president.
>
> >Now they want to see his passport.
>
> That's real nice and simple spin. But read the post. ANY passport he
> may have used EITHER was illegal OR proves he is not a citizen. If
> the original birth certificate is to be withheld, then we must look
> for something else to prove citizenship. Or not. Again, we have
> nothing from Obama and a lot of flash and spin from his droids.
>
> >If he were to produce those, they'd want to
> >see something else.
>
> I'll settle for the original Hawaii birth certificate. If it's there
> and legitimate, I will end my search for some sort of answer.'
>
> Put up or stop apologizing.
>
> >It would be a waste of time for Obama to appease the birthers any
> >more. The question has been asked and answered. It's time to
> >admit the earth is round and move on.
>
> He has yet to do ANYTHING to "appease" them. He has yet to prove he
> is a citizen in any of several ways that are open to him. Mr.
> Transparency only says "trust me".
>
> Nixon said "trust me"; Bush said "trust me" and you see where that
> got us.
You have to wonder, after the health care in crisis hoax, and the man
made global warming hoax, is the governor of hawaii being truthful
about Obama's birth certificate.
Steve B
Because his lips are moving.
Ed Huntress
You didn't answer this question.
>>
>> The second question is, if you doubt that Obama was born in Hawaii, WHY
>> do you doubt it?
>>
>> --
>> Ed Huntress
>
> Because his lips are moving.
There's the answer to your earlier question. That's where the falderal comes
from: Anything about him is believable as long as it's negative.
--
Ed Huntress
Hawke
>> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch <gun...@lightspeed.net>
>>
>>>
>>> "Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to do
>>> is answer one Question
>>>
>>> ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. PASS IT ON AND ON AND ON.
>>>
>>> While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
>>> issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the issue
>>> can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
>>>
>>> What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
>>> Jakarta, and Karachi?
>> Oh, grow up you pathetic twisted little sociopath.
>
> You must be a liberal. Instead of offering a credible rebuttal, you
> name-call.
>
> Rich
>
Actually he was being diplomatic. A proper rebuttal to the kind of
foolish drivel the "birthers" keep coming up with would more
appropriately be a simple, "go fuck yourself, asshole". But like I said.
He was more diplomatic than that.
Hawke
Gunner Asch
>On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 21:10:02 +0000, hal wrote:
>> On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 12:52:20 -0800, Gunner Asch <gun...@lightspeed.net>
>>
>>> An interesting question/article I received in an email this morning:
>>>
>>>"Whether the Obama Birthers are right or not, all the President has to do
>>>is answer one Question
>>>
>>>ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. PASS IT ON AND ON AND ON.
>>>
>>>While I've little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth
>>>issue, Paul Hollrah over at UTFSM did so yesterday and believes the issue
>>>can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
>>>
>>>What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York ,
>>>Jakarta, and Karachi?
>>
>> Oh, grow up you pathetic twisted little sociopath.
>
>You must be a liberal. Instead of offering a credible rebuttal, you
>name-call.
>
>Thanks,
>Rich
Of course hal is a liberal. Actually..he is a Useless Eater on the Left.
<VBG> and his name has been added to the Great Cull list by a number of
people.
And Ive been promised a tape of his final moments..or final hours as it
were.
<VBG>
Gunner
"Aren't cats Libertarian? They just want to be left alone.
I think our dog is a Democrat, as he is always looking for a handout"
Unknown Usnet Poster
Heh, heh, I'm pretty sure my dog is a liberal - he has no balls.
Keyton
Gunner Asch
They used to be Proud to be called Liberals. Then the world finally
understood what pieces of shit Liberals actually were. Now they use the
term Progressive as camoflage. Same pieces of shit..different name.
Shrug
Gunner Asch
wrote:
As I stated quite clearly..I simply passed it along.
And what passport did Mr Soretoro use? Hummmm?
Gunner Asch
wrote:
>Gunner Asch wrote:
>>
>> Time will tell eh. So when will Obama release his original Birth Cert
>> and his school records?
>>
>> So far..they are locked securely away from the People.
>>
>> Any idea why that is?
>>
>> Hummmm?
>>
>> Gunner
>>
>>
>
>Best guess? About the same time you have to produce yours...
Hell..I can produce my Miami Beach, Florida (Nov, 1953) birth cert in
about 5 minutes
Gunner Asch
wrote:
>
>"Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote in message
>news:4b1450e9$0$4979$607e...@cv.net...
>>
>> "Joe AutoDrill" <auto...@yunx.com> wrote in message
>> news:dkXQm.94031$gg6....@newsfe25.iad...
>>>>>> Oh, grow up you pathetic twisted little sociopath.
>>>>>
>>>>> You must be a liberal. Instead of offering a credible rebuttal, you
>>>>> name-call.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Rich
>>>>
>>>> You sound like the guy who came over from your NG a few years ago and
>>>> couldn't understand why we wouldn't debate the racist bigots who claimed
>>>> that "Negroes" were an inferior race that should all be deported. He
>>>> said we were being unfair by not listening to his "reasoning," which was
>>>> of the same caliber as that of the birthers.
>>>>
>>>> There is no rebuttal worth making, Rich, just like there wasn't to
>>>> them -- and for the same reason.
>>>
>>> In all fairness, he does have a point.
>>
>> I don't think so. I think he has a subject for trolling.
>>
>>> No response would have been better than Rich calling him a "pathetic
>>> twisted little sociopath", eh?
>>
>> I'll have to leave that for you do decide, Joe. These characters tend to
>> run wild unless someone hammers them a little bit. Then it's a question of
>> whether you're dealing with a real troll, or a hobbyist. If it's the
>> former, you just get them going. If it's the latter, they'll give up after
>> a short while.
>>
>> You'll have to decide for yourself how you want to handle them. From
>> experience, though, I'm with calling them what they are.
>>
>>>
>>> After all is said and done, there are a LOT of people on bopth sides of
>>> the political fence with lots of opinions these days. To squelch any of
>>> them is stupidity at best - even if their opinions are stupidity at best.
>>> Let the mud identify itself.
>>
>> Soon, we're hip-deep in it. The hobbyists seem to take a lack of hard
>> response as acquiescence.
>>
>> It's not like they're having a real debate. The issues have been fully
>> aired. They're just going for throw-weight, like Gunner used to do when he
>> was here full time.
>
>He's not here full time now?
>>
>>>
>>> Me personally, I'd actually like to see the whole birth certificate issue
>>> investigated a bit further. There is simply too much smoke for fire to
>>> be considered impossible in this case.
>>> --
>>
>> The smoke is self-generated by the birther nutbags, like Richard the Loony
>> Libretardian. They're a self-propelled echo chamber, and your reaction is
>> exactly what they've been shooting for. To some degree, in other words,
>> they've been quite successful.
>>
>> --
>> Ed Huntress
>Soon the only smoke Gunner's going to be dealing with is from the 55 gallon
>drum he's warming his hands over.
>
Or the one they filled with concrete along with your corpse and used as
fill in a breakwater.
<G>
Hypothetically speaking of course.
Gunner Asch
wrote:
>but it will make another interesting chapter in the saga of the
>welfare/drama queen.
So you are admitting to being Gay also?
Fascinating. No big thing of course..but fascinating nonetheless.
cavelamb
Has anyone asked to see it lately?
Steve W.
>
> More lies. Don't you know how to use Snopes, Steve?
>
> http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/ap.asp
>
Yes, and I also don't trust them as my only source.
http://www.truthorfiction.com/
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-kenya.htm
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/l/lawyersues.htm
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-lies.htm
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-contributions-2.htm
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-truth-squad.htm
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-auschwitz.htm
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/r/roxana-mayer-md-not.htm
The fact is that it would be very easy to stop all of this crap. Just
release his original birth certificate NOT a copy generated AFTER people
asked for it.
I would bet that very few people here (yourself included Ed) don't have
the original document. I have the original and a state generated copy.
They are ENTIRELY different documents.
--
Steve W.
Hawke
> Gunner Asch wrote:
>>
>> Or are you simply giving your opinion? Again.
>>
>> Gunner
>>
>
>
> Guns! Take a step back and breathe!
>
> Bottom line - it doesn't matter anymore.
> The guy IS the President of the United States, and yes,
> he's not only a democrat, he's black.
>
> Deal with it, man.
What do you think they are doing? This is how they do it. This is just
more of the campaign to destroy the president. They did it with Clinton
and now this is round two. This ploy is the one perfected by the Nazis.
It's the big lie routine. They make up lies and keep telling them over
and over in the hope that if you hear the lie enough times you start to
believe them. It's very effective on average people. But this is only
one technique they have in their bag of tricks. You'll see every one of
them over the next four years. It's all about tearing down Obama. They
don't care what damage they do to the country because the see replacing
the Democratic president with any republican, even a Sarah Palin, as
being good for the country. So they will try every dirty, sneaky,
underhanded trick they can come up with. You just have to consider who
this is coming from and then pay no attention to any of it. Just
remember if it is being said by a right winger it's a lie.
Hawke
Hawke
Isn't it kind of funny that with all these right wingers who hate Obama
and would be glad to do just about anything to get rid of him that not a
one of them can find any proof Obama was born anywhere but Hawaii? With
all the motivation they have and all the resources the right wing has
behind it not one piece of evidence that Obama wasn't born in Hawaii.
That ought to tell you something. If they can't find anything it's
because it doesn't exist. But the accusations are still there. That's
the point though. They just want to make one false accusation after
another about the president. The couldn't win fair and square so now
they are trying it the good old tried and true right wing way...cheating.
Hawke
Neil Nelson
"Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote:
> Now I have two questions for you, Steve.
I'm not Steve but I'd like to answer those questions.
> First, what other president has had
> people from the opposing party demand to see his birth certificate?
Chester Arthur.
Chester A. Arthur was the 21st president of the United States, he took
office upon the death of James Garfield. Arthur was Garfield's vice
president.
Section 1 of Article 2 of the constitution states; No person except a
natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of
the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of
President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall
not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen
Years a Resident within the United States."
Natural born citizen? Chester Arthur was not a natural born citizen and
he knew it. To be a natural born citizen he would have had to be born
of parents who were citizens of the United States, but his father who
was born in Ireland did not become naturalized until Chester was 14
years old. Chester Arthur perpetuated his lie well enough and long
enough that it wasn't until much later that it was discovered that he
had usurped the office of the presidency. Historic accounts show that
Chester Arthur went to great lengths, even ordering all of his personal
papers to be burned (sounds familiar) and lying about the year he was
born in hopes that claiming to be one year younger would add
plausibility to whether his father had been in the U.S. long enough to
acquire citizenship.
Barack Obama's father was born in Kenya, to that there is no dispute,
there is also no dispute that at the time of Barack Jr. birth he was a
citizen of Kenya and a british subject. Barack Sr. never sought nor did
he receive United States citizenship. According to the constitution, it
takes both parents being citizens to convey natural born citizenship to
their offspring.
> The second question is, if you doubt that Obama was born in Hawaii, WHY do
> you doubt it?
Why would it matter which state he was born in? His father was not a
U.S. citizen so he could not by any stretch of the imagination convey
natural born citizenship to his son who now occupies the White House.
The whole issue of the Hawaiian birth certificate is a rouse, a red
herring, the so called "birthers" are a ploy by those who strive to
dismantle the constitution to divert and deflect the real issue.
Again, it wouldn't matter if he was born on the lawn of the White House
with J. Edgar Hoover as witness, his father was a Kenyan national, was
NOT a U.S. citizen and could NOT convey natural born status to his son.
The largest crime since the inception of this country is being
perpetrated right under your noses, right now,and you all think that's
just dandy.
Am I a racist? I might be, I voted for Obama.
cavelamb
Remember that logo on Micro Cornucopia Magazine and doctor Dobbs Journal?
Back in the mid 70s, when we were struggling to get computers into the hands of
the people, it seemed like the road to utopia. Everybody would have the power
to say his or her thing - and we would make the world a better place that way.
It didn't quite work out the way we imagined it would...
Gunner Asch
jbsl...@gmail.com
wrote:
If you have "the original" then how could the state generate a copy?
What did they copy?
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
Why should he show you his birth certificate? You are not an
authenticating agency. Has any previous president been asked to show
you his birth certificate?
My guess is that prior to being nominated by the national party there
would have been some formalities; proof of citizenship, etc.,
accomplished and whatever regulations and laws that applied would have
been conformed with.
To believe that somehow Obama slipped through a crack is pretty far
fetched given that not only was it to the Democrat's best interest to
ensure that he was squeaky clean but certainly the Republicans would
have had a good strong look at his antecedents. Given the Republican's
history with various intelligence organizations one must assume that
any shortcomings would have been disclosed early on and trumpeted to
the skies.
If the Democrats and the Republicans were too stupid to have a look at
his background wouldn't the Clintons been interested? How much good
old American green-back dollars would Hillary have been willing to
front up about the time she was running out of speed in the primaries
if you could actually prove that Obama was ineligible to be president?
And, of course any of the big news agencies would be glad to do a bit
of investigative reporting and blow the whistle on the President who
wasn't qualified to be elected. Better then torture, sex in the oval
office and Mai Lai all rolled into one.
But strangely, none of these heavy hitters have said a word about
Obama not being eligible. Not a peep out of any of them.
So what is the reason here? A conspiracy? Can't be the Knights of the
Bed Sheets -Nope, Obama is part colored. The International Jewish
Conspiracy? Doubtful. Obama seems soft on Moslems. The Democrats? Of
course they would deliberately pick an unqualified candidate?
Maybe the Clintons - Hills wanted to be Secretary of State and didn't
care about the presidency?
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
Are you really, really sure of your facts here? that to be considered
a native born citizen of the United States you must be born to a man
and woman who are both citizens? You are sure? Really sure? Absolutely
sure?
Unfortunately you are wrong. The 14th amendment to the constitution
says, in the first paragraph that:
" 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject
to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of
the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law
which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life,
liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any
person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
I can only assume that it is the fulfillment of some sort of complex,
that somehow "I" know something that all those other people don't
know; I am one of the informed. At least I can't think of any other
reason. It isn't as though Obama is going to hold a news conference
and wave his birth certificate around in front of the cameras together
with his expired passport.
There is something very alluring about this kind of thing - being a
party to esoteric information, secret societies, passwords, decoder
rings, etc. But it is noticeable that in all of these whisper
campaigns the information is never positive. Never, "whisper, whisper,
He gave 10 million to help orphan children". It is always derogatory.
Strange...
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
wrote:
>fa...@mauve.rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
>>Deucalion <som...@nowhere.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>That's three questions.
>>
>>And therein lies the problem. No matter how thoroughly Obama proves
>>his citizenship -- birth cert., newspaper clippings, vouched for by
>>the governor of Hawaii -- there's always more demands from the
>>birthers. Now they want to see *another* birth cert.
>
>We haven't see the first one yet. We did see a modern document
>attesting that there was something in the state files. But the rules
>at the time allowed for several kinds of births to be recorded in a
>way that make them all appear the same today. They ARE essentially
>the same for ordinary citizens. They are not the same for the purpose
>of determining the citizenship of the guy that was elected president.
>
>>Now they want to see his passport.
>
>That's real nice and simple spin. But read the post. ANY passport he
>may have used EITHER was illegal OR proves he is not a citizen. If
>the original birth certificate is to be withheld, then we must look
>for something else to prove citizenship. Or not. Again, we have
>nothing from Obama and a lot of flash and spin from his droids.
>
>>If he were to produce those, they'd want to
>>see something else.
>
>I'll settle for the original Hawaii birth certificate. If it's there
>and legitimate, I will end my search for some sort of answer.'
>
>Put up or stop apologizing.
From a USA Today issue quoting the Honolulu Advertiser:
By Dan Nakaso, The Honolulu Advertiser
In an attempt to quash persistent rumors that President Obama was not
born in Honolulu on Aug. 4, 1961, Hawaii's health director reiterated
Monday afternoon that she has personally seen Obama's birth
certificate in the Health Department's archives:
"I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of
Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the
Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was
born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing
further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in
October 2008 over eight months ago...."
Here is the Director of the Hawaii Department of Health testifying
that the man was born in Hawaii. The alternate is to assume that the
Hawaii State Government is somehow been suborned.
>>It would be a waste of time for Obama to appease the birthers any
>>more. The question has been asked and answered. It's time to
>>admit the earth is round and move on.
>
>He has yet to do ANYTHING to "appease" them. He has yet to prove he
>is a citizen in any of several ways that are open to him. Mr.
>Transparency only says "trust me".
>
>Nixon said "trust me"; Bush said "trust me" and you see where that
>got us.
Regards,
J.B.
Ed Huntress
"Steve W." <csr...@NOTyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:hf2d9k$jsa$1...@aioe.org...
> Ed Huntress wrote:
>
>>
>> More lies. Don't you know how to use Snopes, Steve?
>>
>> http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/ap.asp
>>
>
> Yes, and I also don't trust them as my only source.
Then why didn't you check them for the facts before posting that hoax?
That's where the "smoke" that Joe Agro was talking about comes from. Some
liars post something negative about Obama on the Internet; someone else
picks it up and starts spreading it around by e-mail (are you on Gunner's
re-mail lists? I am. They're full of crappy lies.). Then you post it here,
even though you know how to check it easily, and would have found out, if
you had checked, that it's a hoax.
So you perpetuate the crap. Get enough of this noise going, and it works
like Joseph Goebbels said it does: repeat a lie often enough, and people
start to believe it. Or, as in Joe's case, they start to believe that
"something must be there."
But nothing is really there, except a lot of people who mindlessly repeat
the lies, bouncing it back and forth in an echo chamber, until the truth
hardly has a chance.
>
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/
>
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-kenya.htm
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/l/lawyersues.htm
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-lies.htm
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-contributions-2.htm
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-truth-squad.htm
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-auschwitz.htm
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/r/roxana-mayer-md-not.htm
>
>
> The fact is that it would be very easy to stop all of this crap. Just
> release his original birth certificate NOT a copy generated AFTER people
> asked for it.
>
> I would bet that very few people here (yourself included Ed) don't have
> the original document. I have the original and a state generated copy.
> They are ENTIRELY different documents.
This isn't Hawaii, Steve. Laws are different in different states. NOBODY
requires the original document for anything. That includes joining the CIA.
A certification with a certifying seal is considered standard today.
The whole birther thing is nuts.
--
Ed Huntress
Ed Huntress
"Neil Nelson" <none...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:nonelson-CA4E0C...@nothing.attdns.com...
> In article <4b1499ed$0$22539$607e...@cv.net>,
> "Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>
>> Now I have two questions for you, Steve.
>
> I'm not Steve but I'd like to answer those questions.
>
>> First, what other president has had
>> people from the opposing party demand to see his birth certificate?
>
> Chester Arthur.
> Chester A. Arthur was the 21st president of the United States, he took
> office upon the death of James Garfield. Arthur was Garfield's vice
> president.
<snip>
This is a complete pack of lies and ignorance, Neil. To be a "natural born
citizen," one has to be born in the US. It has nothing to do with where your
*father* was born, fer chrissake.
Wikipedia does a pretty good job of explaining where the "birther" nonsense
comes from on Arthur. It was a bit similar to what Obama faces -- political
opponents who lied through their teeth to try to stop Arthur's presidency.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chester_A._Arthur#cite_note-1
> Section 1 of Article 2 of the constitution states; No person except a
> natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of
> the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of
> President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall
> not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen
> Years a Resident within the United States."
>
> Natural born citizen? Chester Arthur was not a natural born citizen and
> he knew it. To be a natural born citizen he would have had to be born
> of parents who were citizens of the United States...
Complete baloney.
> ... but his father who
> was born in Ireland did not become naturalized until Chester was 14
> years old. Chester Arthur perpetuated his lie well enough and long
> enough that it wasn't until much later that it was discovered that he
> had usurped the office of the presidency. Historic accounts show that
> Chester Arthur went to great lengths, even ordering all of his personal
> papers to be burned (sounds familiar) and lying about the year he was
> born in hopes that claiming to be one year younger would add
> plausibility to whether his father had been in the U.S. long enough to
> acquire citizenship.
>
> Barack Obama's father was born in Kenya, to that there is no dispute,
> there is also no dispute that at the time of Barack Jr. birth he was a
> citizen of Kenya and a british subject. Barack Sr. never sought nor did
> he receive United States citizenship. According to the constitution, it
> takes both parents being citizens to convey natural born citizenship to
> their offspring.
Complete nonsense. Show us this provision in the Constitution. (Hint: It
doesn't exist.)
>
>> The second question is, if you doubt that Obama was born in Hawaii, WHY
>> do
>> you doubt it?
>
> Why would it matter which state he was born in? His father was not a
> U.S. citizen so he could not by any stretch of the imagination convey
> natural born citizenship to his son who now occupies the White House.
This is an absolute crock of nonsense.
Now I have a question for you, Neil: Where did you get this pile of crap? I
don't believe you made it up on your own. This was written by someone who
was counting on his audience to be too dumb or lazy to check any of it out.
I don't believe you did that. So, who did you get it from?
I'm always curious about where these lies get their start.
--
Ed Huntress
Steve B
<jbsl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:tt2ah5hr4vu44gl86...@4ax.com...
When I was a kid, I saw my birth certificate. I took it with me when I left
home for ID purposes. I had it a long time. It was about half the size of
a piece of letter paper, very fragile thin paper, but it had a stamp, and
was legal. It got away from me over the years. Then, I needed a passport
to go to Kuwait, and could not find it. So, I sent for another. A big full
sized sheet of blue paper with fancy border, looking in no way or font like
the original.
Now, I ask this. What happened to my "original" birth certificate? Why
can't they produce a copy of the one I have burned on my memory banks? It's
a conspiracy, I tell ya, a Goddam conspiracy. I bet Bush and Rush had
something to do with it, but I can't prove it. Copies of birth certificates
can be produced from templates in minutes, reading just what is inputted.
Steve
aarcuda69062
jbsl...@gmail.com wrote:
Yes. You should be also.
> that to be considered
> a native born citizen of the United States you must be born to a man
> and woman who are both citizens? You are sure? Really sure? Absolutely
> sure?
>
> Unfortunately you are wrong. The 14th amendment to the constitution
> says, in the first paragraph that:
>
> " 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject
> to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of
> the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law
> which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
> United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life,
> liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any
> person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."
It says that all persons born or naturalized in the United States and
subject to the jurisdiction of are CITIZENS of the United States.
IOWs, being born here merely conveys _citizenship_.
Being born here doesn't not automatically make one a _natural born
citizen_.
The phrase to which you refer gives equal status (citizen) to someone
who was born here -or- has been naturalized.
I can't understand how so many can so easily confuse the issue, it's
simple enough to understand.
Then again, I can't understand how someone who was convicted of
possession of crack cocaine could be elected to mayor of the city of
Washington D.C.
Our standards keep dropping...
Regards to you.
Steve B
"Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote
> A certification with a certifying seal is considered standard today.
>
> Ed Huntress
And anyone with $12 worth of software can produce one.
Steve
Steve B
<jbsl...@gmail.com> wrote
>
> Here is the Director of the Hawaii Department of Health testifying
> that the man was born in Hawaii. The alternate is to assume that the
> Hawaii State Government is somehow been suborned.
Seems to me recently that a Louisiana congresscritter recently got some big
bucks by backing Barry on a deal. Could Hawaii's official been so tempted?
Naw.
Steve
aarcuda69062
jbsl...@gmail.com wrote:
Here is the Director of the Hawaii Department of Health giving a legal
opinion contrary to what is written in Section 1 of article 2 of the
constitution.
Suborned? Not necessarily, just woefully ignorant.
700 million dollars can buy a lot of ignorance.
aarcuda69062
"Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote:
> So you perpetuate the crap. Get enough of this noise going, and it works
> like Joseph Goebbels said it does: repeat a lie often enough, and people
> start to believe it.
A good example would be;
"I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of
Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the
Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was
born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen."
> Or, as in Joe's case, they start to believe that
> "something must be there."
>
> But nothing is really there, except a lot of people who mindlessly repeat
> the lies, bouncing it back and forth in an echo chamber, until the truth
> hardly has a chance.
Seems to be working.
>
> >
> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/
> >
> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-kenya.htm
> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/l/lawyersues.htm
> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-lies.htm
> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-contributions-2.htm
> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-truth-squad.htm
> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-auschwitz.htm
> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/r/roxana-mayer-md-not.htm
> >
> >
> > The fact is that it would be very easy to stop all of this crap. Just
> > release his original birth certificate NOT a copy generated AFTER people
> > asked for it.
> >
> > I would bet that very few people here (yourself included Ed) don't have
> > the original document. I have the original and a state generated copy.
> > They are ENTIRELY different documents.
>
> This isn't Hawaii, Steve. Laws are different in different states. NOBODY
> requires the original document for anything. That includes joining the CIA.
> A certification with a certifying seal is considered standard today.
>
> The whole birther thing is nuts.
It certainly is.
Ed Huntress
"aarcuda69062" <none...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:nonelson-B4E51A...@nothing.attdns.com...
> In article <4b1524c2$0$5011$607e...@cv.net>,
> "Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>> So you perpetuate the crap. Get enough of this noise going, and it works
>> like Joseph Goebbels said it does: repeat a lie often enough, and people
>> start to believe it.
>
> A good example would be;
> "I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of
> Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the
> Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was
> born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen."
He's right. That's what it takes to be a natural-born citizen.
>
>> Or, as in Joe's case, they start to believe that
>> "something must be there."
>>
>> But nothing is really there, except a lot of people who mindlessly repeat
>> the lies, bouncing it back and forth in an echo chamber, until the truth
>> hardly has a chance.
>
> Seems to be working.
Indeed it does.
>>
>> >
>> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/
>> >
>> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-kenya.htm
>> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/l/lawyersues.htm
>> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-lies.htm
>> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-contributions-2.htm
>> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-truth-squad.htm
>> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/o/obama-auschwitz.htm
>> > http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/r/roxana-mayer-md-not.htm
>> >
>> >
>> > The fact is that it would be very easy to stop all of this crap. Just
>> > release his original birth certificate NOT a copy generated AFTER
>> > people
>> > asked for it.
>> >
>> > I would bet that very few people here (yourself included Ed) don't have
>> > the original document. I have the original and a state generated copy.
>> > They are ENTIRELY different documents.
>>
>> This isn't Hawaii, Steve. Laws are different in different states. NOBODY
>> requires the original document for anything. That includes joining the
>> CIA.
>> A certification with a certifying seal is considered standard today.
>>
>> The whole birther thing is nuts.
>
> It certainly is.
--
Ed Huntress
rangerssuck
> In article <bt5ah5581trqg1cp47tajn0akf3c3pi...@4ax.com>,> > <nonel...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> > >In article <4b1499ed$0$22539$607ed...@cv.net>,
Exactly how would you define "natural born?"
Ed Huntress
"rangerssuck" <range...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:97185098-da13-4f9a...@p32g2000vbi.googlegroups.com...
A natural-born citizen is one who was born on US territory. There has been
some controversy about children born in foreign countries, of US-citizen
parents, but that controversy is partly settled today.
The Chester Arthur case described above is bogus history. That's not what
happened at all. And the business about one's father having to be a US
citizen is also bogus -- a misreading, unintentional or otherwise, of a 1790
law.
I have two law-review articles on the subject if you're interested. They're
too long to post here, and I can't give you a URL because they're in
subscription databases. You could find them at a law library, however:
"Presidential Eligibility: The Meaning of the Natural-Born Citizen Clause",
Christina S. Lohman, Gonzaga Law Review, 349 (2000 - 2001).
"Unnatural Born Citizens and Acting Presidents," James C. Ho, Constitutional
Commentary (Winter 2000).
--
Ed Huntress
Edward A. Falk
Are you claiming that's what happened? Because the Republican
governor of Hawaii says otherwise.
--
-Ed Falk, fa...@despams.r.us.com
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/
jbsl...@gmail.com
Sure; could have happened that way. Of course, in the case of Hawaii
you are talking about the Director of Health, the Governor, and all
the potential Deep-Throats. Probably talking, oh maybe 50 - 60 people.
All conspiring to keep the secret.
Do a google on Occam's Razor.
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
As I wrote in another reply - you are talking about the Director of
Health, the Governor, and all the little people who might rat you out.
I guessed probably 50 or 60 people might have access to the facts. do
you reckon they were all bribed?
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
Have a look at the Snopes page on the birth certificate. The
certificate has been examined and it does have an embossed seal. It is
a legal Hawaii State birth certificate.
As I already posted even USA Today accepts that it is a valid
document. CNN considers it a "none issue".
So, are you saying that not only the Hawaii state Director of Health,
the Governor of the state, USA Today and the rest of the major news
agencies have all been bribed?
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
Obviously not from having read the Constitution and it's amendments,
at least not the 14th.
Regards,
J.B.
jbsl...@gmail.com
Steve, when I needed a birth certificate to enlist in the Air Force I
went down to the Town Clerk's office and asked for one - there wasn't
one. There was a record of a birth, on a hospital form, signed by the
attending physician, stating that a boy child had been born to: My
parent's names, at such and such a time, on such and such a date.
From this record the town clerk typed up a "birth certificate" and
handed it to me - $1.00 please.
This occurred in New Hampshire, in 1952.
I suspect that this rather haphazard form of record keeping has
probably changed and records are now in a computer some place and they
press a button and your birth certificate comes squirting out the top
of a printer.
My point is that there probably isn't a "birth certificate" actually
filed away in some cabinet in a dingy office somewhere in the state
capital, There is a record of the birth in some government computer
and they print a certificate when you ask for it. Just like my town
clerk did, but maybe the cost has gone up to $5.00.
Regards,
J.B.
Ned Simmons
Stranger things have happened. Look at how long NASA has been able to
cover up the filming of the "moon landings" on a secret movie set. <g>
At least we aren't hearing about suspicious deaths linked to Obama's
birth certificate...yet.
--
Ned Simmons
rangerssuck
> "rangerssuck" <rangerss...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Ed, you're preaching to the choir. I was referring to this line from
"aarcuda69062":
Being born here doesn't not automatically make one a _natural born
citizen_.
Aside from the double negative, I was wondering what *WOULD*, in the
eyes of the poster, make one "natural born."
rangerssuck
[snip]
> At least we aren't hearing about suspicious deaths linked to Obama's
> birth certificate...yet.
>
> --
> Ned Simmons
Well, there ya go. Now you've let the cat out of the bag.
Just sayin'
jbsl...@gmail.com
It appears that you believe that there are two types of Citizens who
are born citizens? (1) those who are the descendents of a citizen
mother AND citizen father and those who just were lucky and born in
the US, and only the former are qualified to become President, and
you don't see why so many can so easily confuse the issue....
The Constitution states that :
No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United
States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be
eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be
eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of
thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the
United States.
Currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code, Section 1401, defines the
following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth:"
* Anyone born inside the United States *
* Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a
citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person's status as a citizen
of the tribe
* Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents
are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S.
* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a
citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other
parent is a U.S. national
* Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen
and lived in the U.S. for at least one year
* Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage
cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not
provided by age 21
* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an
alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who
lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and
diplomatic service included in this time)
* A final, historical condition: a person born before 5/24/1934 of
an alien father and a U.S. citizen mother who has lived in the U.S.
(* There is an exception in the law \u2014 the person must be "subject
to the jurisdiction" of the United States. This would exempt the child
of a diplomat, for example, from this provision.)
There appears to be no additional definition of a natural born
citizen, but if you have a different definition or definition of a
natural born citizen whereby he is, or is not, qualified to be
president it would be nice if you would point to a reference of some
sort for your definition.
Regards,
J.B.
Ed Huntress
Yeah, I realize what you were saying, but I mentioned the law review
articles in case you want to put a stop to this nonsense quickly. If you're
enjoying dragging it out, have at it. d8-)
This is another one of the pack of lies we're hearing from the birthers of
which I'd like to know the origins. I'm not going to track it all down, but
maybe someone knows. Maybe it's all coming from just a few sources.
The funny part is the absolute certitude of the idiots who propagate it. I
think we'll have a long wait to hear how the Constitution tells us that to
be a natural born citizen, your parents or at least your father have to be
US citizens.
--
Ed Huntress
jbsl...@gmail.com
You are some sort of a heretic? Reading a BOOK for goodness sakes?
(hard enough to get some people to read the instructions on the bottle
:-)
Regards,
J.B.
Neil Nelson
"Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote:
> "Neil Nelson" <none...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:nonelson-CA4E0C...@nothing.attdns.com...
> > In article <4b1499ed$0$22539$607e...@cv.net>,
> > "Ed Huntress" <hunt...@optonline.net> wrote:
> >
> >
> >> Now I have two questions for you, Steve.
> >
> > I'm not Steve but I'd like to answer those questions.
> >
> >> First, what other president has had
> >> people from the opposing party demand to see his birth certificate?
> >
> > Chester Arthur.
> > Chester A. Arthur was the 21st president of the United States, he took
> > office upon the death of James Garfield. Arthur was Garfield's vice
> > president.
>
> <snip>
>
> This is a complete pack of lies and ignorance, Neil. To be a "natural born
> citizen," one has to be born in the US. It has nothing to do with where your
> *father* was born, fer chrissake.
Please cite where i claimed that the fathers birthplace was germane to
natural born status.
You can't because I didn't.
Who's the liar Ed?
> Wikipedia does a pretty good job of explaining where the "birther" nonsense
> comes from on Arthur. It was a bit similar to what Obama faces -- political
> opponents who lied through their teeth to try to stop Arthur's presidency.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chester_A._Arthur#cite_note-1
That same article points out that Chester A. Arthur's father did not
become a naturalized citizen until 14 years after Chester A. Arthur was
born on U.S. soil, making Chester A. Arthur a usurper to the office of
president.
14th Amendment;
" 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject
to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of
the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law
which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life,
liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any
person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."
doesn't exist.)
Plainly states to anyone who can read that a person born in the United
States is a citizen. It also plainly makes no distinction between a
citizen born here and a naturalized citizen.
It doesn't make any distinction that those born here are natural born
versus those who choose to move here and do so can become naturalIZED
citizens, Yet section 1 article 2 of the constitution makes a
distinction by usage of the term natural born citizen as to who is
qualified to be president and since section 1 article 2 of the
constitution also mentions the means by which a mere citizen qualifies
to be president, we must not only recognize that there is a distinction
but also that the distinction exists.
Born here OR naturalized are citizens, just plain old run of the mill
citizens.
Born here of two citizen parents who may or may not have been born on
foreign soil = natural born citizen. Got it Ed? Good, because I'd hate
to see you accuse me again of saying something that I never actually
said.
Then comes the phrase "any person within it's jurisdiction." as is
common knowledge, Barack Obama senior was already married to someone in
Kenya when he married Stanley Ann Dunham, in effect, he considered
himself immune to our laws regarding polygamy (assumes that S.A.D. knew
of the other wife) and thus any children born to him in this country
would not assume citizenship the same as would apply to children born
here to a foreign diplomat subject to diplomatic immunity.
> >
> >> The second question is, if you doubt that Obama was born in Hawaii, WHY
> >> do
> >> you doubt it?
> >
> > Why would it matter which state he was born in? His father was not a
> > U.S. citizen so he could not by any stretch of the imagination convey
> > natural born citizenship to his son who now occupies the White House.
>
> This is an absolute crock of nonsense.
You're claiming that his father -was- a U.S. citizen when lil Barack was
born?
> Now I have a question for you, Neil: Where did you get this pile of crap?
Reading the constitution. Sorry that you think it's a pile of crap.
Federalist papers also, I suppose you think they are a pile of crap too?
> I don't believe you made it up on your own. This was written by someone who
> was counting on his audience to be too dumb or lazy to check any of it out.
"too dumb or lazy" certainly applies, just not how you think.
Barack Obama's whole campaign and presidency depends on people too dumb
or lazy to check any of it out.
> I don't believe you did that. So, who did you get it from?
Enterprise High School in Enterprise Alabama. The history teacher there
was an ex army drill sergeant, he expected more than the now popular
show up and fall asleep type of educational process. This was seven
years after Barack Obama was born so feel free to invent whatever
conspiracy theories you feel necessary.
> I'm always curious about where these lies get their start.
This particular one, the 2004 DNC AFAIK.
Steve B
<jbsl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:eiebh5ha6nuq4574n...@4ax.com...
Are any of the people you mentioned above bribery?
Steve B
"Edward A. Falk" <fa...@mauve.rahul.net> wrote in message
news:hf3u7c$g76$1...@blue.rahul.net...
You're not following this thread worth a flying fuck, are you?
Gunner Asch
Odd that you mention that. It would appear that so far this
year..Democrats have had bout triple that number of politicians put in
prison for corruption.
Funny how that works out huh?
Gunner
"Aren't cats Libertarian? They just want to be left alone.
I think our dog is a Democrat, as he is always looking for a handout"
Unknown Usnet Poster
Heh, heh, I'm pretty sure my dog is a liberal - he has no balls.
Keyton