Mechanical Beauty: Curta Calculator
Wm. Congreve (Sr.)
demer...@htc.honeywell.com (Bob DeMers) writes:
>
>After all that has been said about these wonders,
>
>I WANT ONE!!
>
Well, you guys can get ready to bid against each other. Three Curtas
are included as lots 430, 431, and 432, in a Sotheby/London auction
being held on March 7 and 8. They'll take bids by mail. Catalog
available from London, phone 0171 493 8080 "sixteen pounds overseas"
and surely is also available from their NYC office; phone 212 606 7000,
where I'd guess it would be about $25-30.
The first Curta lot is a "type one" with an estimate of 500 to 800
pounds; the second is a type two with an estimate of 350-450; and the
third is a type two estimated at 500-800. From the photographs, the
type one appears to be smaller. Each comes complete with plastic case
and instructions; no hint as to why lot 431 is predicted to bring less
money than #432.
Great catalog. 150pp, hundreds of illustrations, many in color. Title
is "Clocks, Watches, Wristwatches, Barometers, and Mechanical, Music,
and Scientific Instruments."
Alan Heldman
John R. Johnson
the UK and the US.
John
On 21 Feb 1996, Bob DeMers wrote:
> After all that has been said about these wonders,
>
> I WANT ONE!!
>
> Now, the problem is finding one. How did you proud owners find yours? I
> guess one way to find one is to determine who was buying them (University
> professors?, engineers?, businesses?) and check with their retirees. Any
> help will be appreciated and if you have a spare one for sale, please
> email me.
>
> Thanks
> --
> Bob DeMers
> Honeywell Technology Center
> demer...@htc.honeywell.com
>
>
Bob DeMers
Vance Bass
>After all that has been said about these wonders,
>
>I WANT ONE!!
>Now, the problem is finding one.
There is a wonderful shop in Ojai, California which deals in scientific
and engineering antiquities. They had a pretty good assortment of slide
rules (slipsticks and round), and various mechanical calculators. I
don't recall the name of the place, alas, but a call to the Chamber of
Commerce would certainly get you the name -- it's a small town.
By the way, they had a number of antique and newly constructed orreries,
for you orrery fans. Imagine one with planets made of polished
ornamental stones . . . .
--
Vance Bass Homepage at http://edge.edge.net/~vrbass/
Nashville Garden Railway Society
=====================================
The steam locomotive teaches us that the railway age was a totally
viable and a civilised alternative to the hideous consequences of
basing national economies on road transportation. -- Colin Garratt
Peter Brooks
'60s, you might get a lead on a Curta from them. In my youth, I'd read
about rallying, and one class was 'with computer', which (usually?) was
a Curta, since '60s vintage electronic calculators cost $eriou$ dollar$.
Actually, I'm not sure when the first portable electronic calcs came out;
my Craig (made by Bowmar) was a campus curiosity when I got one in '72.
Pete Brooks
darylb
wrote:
> demer...@htc.honeywell.com (Bob DeMers) wrote:
> >After all that has been said about these wonders,
> >
> >I WANT ONE!!
> >Now, the problem is finding one.
>
> There is a wonderful shop in Ojai, California which deals in scientific
> and engineering antiquities. They had a pretty good assortment of slide
> rules (slipsticks and round), and various mechanical calculators. I
> don't recall the name of the place, alas, but a call to the Chamber of
> Commerce would certainly get you the name -- it's a small town.
>
> By the way, they had a number of antique and newly constructed orreries,
> for you orrery fans. Imagine one with planets made of polished
> ornamental stones . . . .
Orrery??!! Orrery ??!!
Hardings is the name of the place in Ojai. If I ever get to California I
WILL visit this place. Unfortunately they don't put out a catalog, you
just have to pop in a see what they got. If I remember right the Orreries
are US$35,000 for the coffee table type I think there were some
simpler/cheaper models though. You must remember these are machined with
lots of custom gearing etc. Also if I remember right it was a classical 5
planet heliocentric orrery with inclined earth axis and orbiting moon
(orbiting on 5deg inclined plane). All of this motor/crank driven in a
large wooden case with glass top forming a coffee table - very nice. Best
of all no micro's or stepper motors. Just fine workmanship. 8^)
Cheers
Daryl
Ron Brown
heck is an orrery?
Ron Brown
Wm. Congreve (Sr.)
>
>Okay, Vance. Someone has to ask, and it might as well be me. What the
>heck is an orrery?
>
Our frequent contributer Daryl is the walking encyclopaedia of
orreries, and is building one of great complexity. He's off-line for a
few days but will doubtless post a good note on this when he catches
up. Basically it's a mechanical model of the sun, earth, and other
planets, rotating appropriately by gearwork.
Alan H.
Ron Ginger
>From: Ron Brown <docs...@servtech.com>
>Subject: Re: Mechanical Beauty: Curta Calculator
>Date: 23 Feb 1996 19:06:40 GMT
>Okay, Vance. Someone has to ask, and it might as well be me. What the
>heck is an orrery?
An Orrery is a device that simluates the motion of the sun and planets. Gear
driven mechanisms of sometimes incrediable complexity. Often made in the old
style with lots of flowing engraving.
For a photo of a very simple one I hope to build a replica of one of
these days, see my WEB page, noted below.
Oh, as long as I'm memntioning the WEB- I have added SOUND to my page, with
28 seconds of the noise of my 4 cylinder engine running. Why anyone would
load a 580Kb image to hear 28 seconds of this baffles me, but I bet I can now
cliam to be the FIRST to have a model engine with sound on the WEB
Ron Ginger
my signature is http://www.ultranet.com/~ginger
Alan Frisbie
> Well, you guys can get ready to bid against each other. Three Curtas
> are included as lots 430, 431, and 432, in a Sotheby/London auction
> being held on March 7 and 8. They'll take bids by mail. Catalog
> available from London, phone 0171 493 8080 "sixteen pounds overseas"
> and surely is also available from their NYC office; phone 212 606 7000,
> where I'd guess it would be about $25-30.
Thanks for turning me on to this. I just ordered it.
The Southeby's phone number for catalog orders is 800-444-3709,
and the price for this catalog is $22.00.
Don't worry, I'm not going to bid against any of you -- I
just wanted a copy of the catalog. I think that their price
estimates for the Curtas are a bit on the high side. I paid
$550.00 for my very nice Type II a few weeks ago.
In case you were wondering, the Type I has an 11-digit
result register, while the Type II has 15 digits and is
larger in diameter.
-- Alan E. Frisbie Fri...@Flying-Disk.Com
-- Flying Disk Systems, Inc.
-- 4759 Round Top Drive (213) 256-2575 (voice)
-- Los Angeles, CA 90065 (213) 258-3585 (FAX)
Peter O'Leary
Great story and welcome to RCM. I hope you find us to be a fairly
civilized lot even though most of us suffer from terminal fingernail
dirt :-). I hope it is not considered a terrible waste of bandwidth to
repost a few previous posts in the Curta Calculator thread.
Pete O'Leary
In article <4ggsrf$7...@excalibur.edge.net>, Vance Bass <vrb...@edge.net>
wrote:
> demer...@htc.honeywell.com (Bob DeMers) wrote:
> >After all that has been said about these wonders,
> >
> >I WANT ONE!!
> >Now, the problem is finding one.
>
> There is a wonderful shop in Ojai, California which deals in scientific
> and engineering antiquities. They had a pretty good assortment of slide
> rules (slipsticks and round), and various mechanical calculators. I
> don't recall the name of the place, alas, but a call to the Chamber of
> Commerce would certainly get you the name -- it's a small town.
>
> By the way, they had a number of antique and newly constructed orreries,
> for you orrery fans. Imagine one with planets made of polished
> ornamental stones . . . .
Orrery??!! Orrery ??!!
Hardings is the name of the place in Ojai. If I ever get to =03California I
WILL visit this place. Unfortunately they don't put out a catalog, you
just have to pop in a see what they got. If I remember right the Orreries
are US$35,000 for the coffee table type I think there were some
simpler/cheaper models though. You must remember these are machined with
lots of custom gearing etc. Also if I remember right it was a classical 5
planet heliocentric orrery with inclined earth axis and orbiting moon
(orbiting on 5deg inclined plane). All of this motor/crank driven in a
large wooden case with glass top forming a coffee table - very nice. Best
of all no micro's or stepper motors. Just fine workmanship. 8^)
Cheers
Daryl
In article <4gfeu7$b...@cloner4.netcom.com>,
Alan Frisbie
fri...@flying-disk.com (Alan Frisbie) writes:
>> Well, you guys can get ready to bid against each other. Three Curtas
>> are included as lots 430, 431, and 432, in a Sotheby/London auction
>> being held on March 7 and 8. They'll take bids by mail. Catalog
>> available from London, phone 0171 493 8080 "sixteen pounds overseas"
> Thanks for turning me on to this. I just ordered it.
>
> The Southeby's phone number for catalog orders is 800-444-3709,
> and the price for this catalog is $22.00.
The catalog arrived today. After checking out the Curtas,
I started thumbing through the rest of it. At lot 444 my
jaw dropped and all I could say was, "Oh my Ghod". There
is a genuine four-rotor German Enigma cipher machine! The
expected sales price is 8,000 to 10,000 pounds, which actually
sounds quite reasonable.
I know I cannot afford it, but the thought is tempting.
Steve Rayner
They were named after Lord Orrery, who had the first one built.
In a previous article, cong...@ix.netcom.com (Wm. Congreve Sr.)) says:
> Ron Brown <docs...@servtech.com> writes:
>>
>>Okay, Vance. Someone has to ask, and it might as well be me. What the
>>heck is an orrery?
>>
>
>
>Our frequent contributer Daryl is the walking encyclopaedia of
>orreries, and is building one of great complexity. He's off-line for a
>few days but will doubtless post a good note on this when he catches
>up. Basically it's a mechanical model of the sun, earth, and other
>planets, rotating appropriately by gearwork.
>
> Alan H.
>
--
************************************************************************
MY SECRET IS OIL OF HARLEY DAVIDSON ! Steve Rayner
************************************************************************
James Kirkpatrick
|>expected sales price is 8,000 to 10,000 pounds, which actually
|>sounds quite reasonable.
|>
|>I know I cannot afford it, but the thought is tempting.
|
I've often thought about making an Enigma replica. The rotors
and stepping mechanisms wouldn't be too bad, but I'm afraid that
the keyboard parts would be difficult and/or tedious as they were
probably stamped from sheet stock. And, I'd prefer a historically
accurate reproduction but haven't found blueprints, or plans in HSM
:-)
Jim
James Kirkpatrick
|>There was a posting in this thread from Michael Rainey explaining the
|>history of the Curta calculators, and the story of Curt Herzstark, but I
|>never got to see it. Can't find it in deja news, either. If anyone has it
|>please post it or mail it to me.
You could grab the archives I keep, via anonymous ftp to plains.uwyo.edu
in the metal directory. Get the file metal.96a (or metal96a.zip) and
use your favorite text editor to look for the word "curta".
But to save you the trouble --
>The Curta calculator has been recently mentioned on this newsgroup. As
>one who has long been fascinated by this little jewel, may I share a bit
>of its history?
>
>A Curta is a palm size four function mechanical calculator. It was
>manufactured from 1948 till 1970 by Contina A.G. of Mauren,
>Liechtenstein. Curta was produced in two sizes. The smaller (Type 1)
>gave an answer to 11 digits. The machine is operated by way of a top
>crank which drives a central multiple toothed gear (Leibniz wheel).
>Subtraction is by way of 9's complement addition, plus one.
>Multiplication and division are quickly performed by repeated addition
>and subtraction while making use of a moving decimal position selector.
>
>Curta was designed by an Austrian engineer named Curt Herzstark (strong
>hearted he was). Mr. Herzstark perfected Curta in his mind over a period
>of several years while an inmate at Buchenwald concentration camp. Upon
>his release in 1945 he contracted with Contina to begin the production
>process.
>
>I've spent some happy days hiking in and around the small village of
>Mauren in the foothills of the Alps. Though the factory is now gone,
>some people would smile and remember as I pulled out my Curta to figure
>the exchange rates.
>
>A fine Curta exhibit is to be seen at the Deutsches Museum in Munich,
>along with a photo of Mr. Herzstark. Recently, my brother reported
>seeing a Curta at the museum in Los Alemos, New Mexico.
>
>With the cover off I am humbled to follow the intricate workings of this
>tiny marvel. How could a man design such a perfectly beautiful device
>while living in the most perfect example of hell on earth yet designed by
>man?
>
>The Curta is an inspiration, mechanically and otherwise.
>
>Michael Rainey
>r...@sover.net
>Roxbury,Vermont U.S.A.
BobRiskin
permission I will forward a copy to the calculator museum web page. I
understand that there is an oral history transcript of an interview with
Mr. Herzstark at the Charles Babbage Institute, but it costs. I may send
for it.
This whole business has inspired me to get my model II out and show it
off. People go "wow" when they crank it. Operating it has the same sensory
pleasure as cutting a clean chip on a lathe (and what more sensual thing
could there be?).
Thanks Again
Bob R.
Bob DeMers
> There was a posting in this thread from Michael Rainey explaining the
> history of the Curta calculators, and the story of Curt Herzstark, but I
> never got to see it. Can't find it in deja news, either. If anyone has it
> please post it or mail it to me.
>
> I have a type II that I bought gov't surplus from JPL many years ago when
> it became obsolescent. It is really neat. I thought that I had seen an
> article in Scientific American, or maybe Smithsonian on it, but haven't
> been able to locate anything.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob R
There is a website on these:
http://www.teleport.com/~dgh/fourfunc.htm
they have a lot of info and several images.
Bob DeMers
BobRiskin
and quoted my memories of the Curta story, which prompted his request for
more detail and led to this search in the first place.
redw...@oanet.com
International Antiques Price Guide, page 525. The price guide for the Curta
is $300-375.
Roger Edwards
Edmonton, Alberta
Max ben-Aaron
I posted a message about a hydrogen gas generator last week and nobody
bit, so i would like to try again.
My friend David C. has a hydrogen gas generator which he would like to
use for oxy-hydrogen welding. He does not have a manual and the
chances of getting one are slim because the company that made it seems
to be defunct.
On the assumption that all hydrogen gas generators are generic
(electrolysis of ionised water and collection of the hydrogen by
pumping it into an accumulator), any hints on the care and feeding of
such beasts would be welcome. What is the electrolyte, amd what should
its concentration be? What are the hazards of operation of the system?
The unit, by the way, is a Protran H2 Gas Generator, Model 150APHG,
model # 3H009, originally manufactured by TRIENCO in Raleigh NC.
Dave Hicks
demer...@htc.honeywell.com (Bob DeMers) wrote:
>
>There is a website on these:
>
>http://www.teleport.com/~dgh/fourfunc.htm
>
>they have a lot of info and several images.
>
I've just uploaded an update with more mechanical calculators,
descriptions and diagrams. The main address is in my signature but the
mechanicals start at:
http://www.teleport.com/~dgh/prehp.htm
________________________________________________
Dave Hicks (d...@teleport.com)
The Museum of HP Calculators
http://www.teleport.com/~dgh/hpmuseum.html
________________________________________________
Kevin J. Hansen
>
> On the assumption that all hydrogen gas generators are generic
> (electrolysis of ionised water and collection of the hydrogen by
> pumping it into an accumulator), any hints on the care and feeding of
> such beasts would be welcome.
Max:
I once visited a remote island weather station where hydrogen filled
weather balloons were launched a couple of times daily. I asked about
the source of hydrogen, and the operator pointed at a steel cylinder
about 5 feet tall that looked much like an oxygen cylinder. It looked
as though it had been in a fire, however...
Turned out that he put some chemicals into this tank and closed the lid;
the reaction produced a LOT of heat and (he claimed) enough hydrogen to
pressurize the cylinder to about 3,000(!) psi. I have no reason to
question what he said. I don't recall what the chemicals were, though
when he told me the combination seemed to agree with what I remembered
of my high school chemistry.
Kevin
Clarence Noyer
to about 94%, you have a combustable mixture. This is the highest range
for any fuel. In an enclosed place, there is the obvious chance of an
explosion! Therefore, I would suggest great care when attempting to
cob-house an "invented here" device.
This news group may be getting crowded but please refrain from decimating
our numbers by immolating or shredding yourself through ignorance. I have
used ethane and other fuels and suggest extreme care.
Safety is respecting yourself and showing the same level of respect for
others.
"CC"
Orest I Koroluk
<kjha...@alaska.net> wrote:
>
> Max:
>
> I once visited a remote island weather station where hydrogen filled
> weather balloons were launched a couple of times daily. I asked about
> the source of hydrogen, and the operator pointed at a steel cylinder
> about 5 feet tall that looked much like an oxygen cylinder. It looked
> as though it had been in a fire, however...
>
> Turned out that he put some chemicals into this tank and closed the lid;
> the reaction produced a LOT of heat and (he claimed) enough hydrogen to
> pressurize the cylinder to about 3,000(!) psi. I have no reason to
> question what he said. I don't recall what the chemicals were, though
> when he told me the combination seemed to agree with what I remembered
> of my high school chemistry.
>
> Kevin
Many years ago when I was an inquisitive kid, we used to play at a lot of
things including making our own hydrogen filled balloons (with a time
delay fuse, what a bang). To do this we would take a glass pop bottle
(this was before twist off or screw cap lids) and mix some Lye (from the
grocery store, I think it's sodium hydroxide ) with some hot water and put
it into the bottle. We would then make some balls out of aluminum foil and
drop them into the bottle. The reaction produces hydrogen gas and turns
the aluminum into aluminum oxide (a white powdery form that settles out as
sludge). Balloons would be placed over the neck of the bottle and the gas
produced would inflate the balloon. Remove and tie when finished, attach a
fuse and launch. Im sure that a similar arrangement could be made to use
the gas in a torch of some sort. Use baffles to keeep the liquid where it
belongs as it is very caustic. The reaction does generate heat but I don't
know how much pressure would be developed.
Remember kids, play safe and don't try this at home.
Orest
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Orest I. Koroluk
Technical Officer~Agent technique
Royal Military College of Canada~College militaire royal du Canada
Department of Mechanical Engineering~Departement de genie mecanique
Kingston Ontario Canada K7K 5L0
__ __
Voice-(613) 541-6000 ext 6281 / /<^> / / NATIONAL DEFENSE
FAX-(613) 542-8612 / /<__>/ / DEFENCE NATIONALE
e-mail: koro...@rmc.ca /_/ / /_/
Robert Grauman
>From: "Kevin J. Hansen" <kjha...@alaska.net>
>Subject: Re: Help with hydrogen gas generator
>Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 09:36:58 -0900
>Max ben-Aaron wrote:
>>
>> On the assumption that all hydrogen gas generators are generic
>> (electrolysis of ionised water and collection of the hydrogen by
>> pumping it into an accumulator), any hints on the care and feeding of
>> such beasts would be welcome.
>Max:
>I once visited a remote island weather station where hydrogen filled
>weather balloons were launched a couple of times daily. I asked about
>the source of hydrogen, and the operator pointed at a steel cylinder
>about 5 feet tall that looked much like an oxygen cylinder. It looked
>as though it had been in a fire, however...
>Turned out that he put some chemicals into this tank and closed the lid;
>the reaction produced a LOT of heat and (he claimed) enough hydrogen to
>pressurize the cylinder to about 3,000(!) psi. I have no reason to
>question what he said. I don't recall what the chemicals were, though
>when he told me the combination seemed to agree with what I remembered
>of my high school chemistry.
>Kevin
I was an upper air observer for several years. We used to use hydrogen to
fill our ballons with. If I remember correctly, we used to fill them to lift
2.2 kilograms. For our primary source of hydrogen, we used a low pressure
hydrogen generator. We would dump a dry mixture of aluminum chips and caustic
soda through a port into a hopper in the bottom of the generator. Then we
would carefully drip water into the hopper. The hydrogen gas passed through a
heat exchanger on top of the hopper, and then into the balloon. The cooler
was about 4 feet x 4 feet x 4 feet, and was filled with antifreeze. The
reaction generated a lot of heat. The safety valve consisted of a piece of
balloon held on the end of a tube, and held on by a rubber band. Hydrogen gas
was not a lot of fun to work with. I always left the balloon exit door open,
the better to make a quick exit. In the arctic, I accidently brushed against
the balloon with my issue nylon parka, and heard the static jump to the
balloon. As I bailed out, I saw the flame, and I kept going. Not much
damage, but a large flame issued from the building. Not so much an explosion
as a very fast fire. I had to fill another balloon that morning.
The other device was as described in the previous post. It was used as a
backup to the low presure generator. It consisted of a high pressure bottle
about the size of a 220 cu ft oxygen bottle, with pins welded in the middle
and set in a frame. To use it, you set the cylinder vertical, and filled it
with a carefully measured amount of caustic soda, followed by some water.
Then the cylinder was tilted to a near horizontal position, and chips of
aluminum were carefully placed in the neck. The high pressure plug was then
placed in the top and tightened down. You would then rotate the cylinder one
revolution, and leave it vertically, and run like hell. On the way out the
door, you would glance back to see the pressure gauge on its way past 2500
psi. If you chemical measurements were correct, you would return in about ten
minutes, and there was just enough gas in the bottle to fill a balloon. The
bottle would be smoking hot, and after it cooled off, you would dump the
remnants out. If you were out on your measurements, the safety disk would
rupture, and you would wake up most of the town with the roar. The safety
disk consisted of a thin brass disk. Some operators would replace the disk
with two, in the mistaken impression that they had doubled the burst pressure.
We lost a few buildings that way.
In later years, we used electrolysis to generate hydrogen. They were a lot
easier to use, and the operation was pretty straight forward. I have
started construction of a small electrolyser for welding and brazing.
The secret is to generate the hydrogen as you need it, and not to store
it. However, even a little bit of hydrogen will make a big bang.
RJG