Slightly OT: Rotton wood in concrete

[Tim Wescott]

Problem: Old wood post, bedded in concrete. I need to replace the post.

Is there any way to do this that's easier than breaking up the concrete
and replacing the whole mess? Putting a metal foot on the post and
putting that into concrete has a great deal of appeal, as I'd like to die
of old age before I'm called upon to do it again (at least with that
post).

--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consulting
www.wescottdesign.com

[Ignoramus17710]

On 2013-05-19, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.please> wrote:
> Problem: Old wood post, bedded in concrete. I need to replace the post.
>
> Is there any way to do this that's easier than breaking up the concrete
> and replacing the whole mess? Putting a metal foot on the post and
> putting that into concrete has a great deal of appeal, as I'd like to die
> of old age before I'm called upon to do it again (at least with that
> post).
>

Bolt a metal plate to concrete and weld on a metal post to the plate?

[dca...@krl.org]

On May 19, 4:47 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.please> wrote:
> Problem:  Old wood post, bedded in concrete.  I need to replace the post.
>
> Is there any way to do this that's easier than breaking up the concrete
> and replacing the whole mess?

> --
> Tim Wescott
> Control system and signal processing consultingwww.wescottdesign.com

Is the concrete just for the wood post or is it more like a floor
with a wooden post embedded in the floor. If it is like a post
embedded in concrete for a fence post or mailbox, I would use some
chain and a jack and just pull the concrete out with the post. And
use pressure treated wood or metal pipe for the replacement post.
Pressure treated wood rated for ground contact ought to be good for 25
to 30 years. Longer if you use somo torch down roofing around the
post.


Dan

[Tim Wescott]

It's pressure treated concrete post, with concrete around the post. It
lasted a bit over ten years, and the post is rotted away broken off, and
lying on the ground.

What part of the country do you live in that a pressure treated post in
concrete lives for 30 years?

(I'm planning on replacing it with a metal socket in concrete, that'll
accept a wood post).

[Stumpy]

>
> Problem: Old wood post, bedded in concrete. I need to replace the post.
>
> Is there any way to do this that's easier than breaking up the concrete
> and replacing the whole mess? Putting a metal foot on the post and
> putting that into concrete has a great deal of appeal, as I'd like to die
> of old age before I'm called upon to do it again (at least with that
> post).
>

These would be fast if not strong.

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Landscaping/Decking+Fencing+Metalwork/DriveIn+Repair+Spike+75+x+75mm/d130/sd3224/p80996

http://evstudio.info/repair-of-fence-post-using-simpson-e-z-mender/

[Ignoramus17710]

On 2013-05-20, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.please> wrote:
> On Sun, 19 May 2013 17:12:58 -0700, dca...@krl.org wrote:
>

>> On May 19, 4:47??pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.please> wrote:
>>> Problem: ??Old wood post, bedded in concrete. ??I need to replace the

>>> post.
>>>
>>> Is there any way to do this that's easier than breaking up the concrete
>>> and replacing the whole mess?
>>

>> Is the concrete just for the wood post or is it more like a floor with
>> a wooden post embedded in the floor. If it is like a post embedded in
>> concrete for a fence post or mailbox, I would use some chain and a jack
>> and just pull the concrete out with the post. And use pressure treated
>> wood or metal pipe for the replacement post. Pressure treated wood rated
>> for ground contact ought to be good for 25 to 30 years. Longer if you
>> use somo torch down roofing around the post.
>
> It's pressure treated concrete post, with concrete around the post. It
> lasted a bit over ten years, and the post is rotted away broken off, and
> lying on the ground.
>
> What part of the country do you live in that a pressure treated post in
> concrete lives for 30 years?
>
> (I'm planning on replacing it with a metal socket in concrete, that'll
> accept a wood post).
>

The way I installed my mailbox was to pour concrete, set a steel post
in it, and I mounted/welded everything to that steel post. No more
wood, thank you very much./

i

[Lloyd E. Sponenburgh]

Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.please> fired this volley in
news:qt2dnZ89loBE8gTM...@giganews.com:

> What part of the country do you live in that a pressure treated post in
> concrete lives for 30 years?

I'm in Florida, where wood posts in the ground stay wet continually. I'm
in an area called "flatwoods", where the mean water table is within a
couple of feet of the surface. So even poles inside my barn have wet
feet.

My barn is just now requiring some ten of the 48 posts to be replaced --
all of them at the eaves, where the drip gets to them. Fresh application
of water rinses out the protective chemicals. It's not _being_ wet, but
being _rinsed_ frequently that causes the problems.

There are another two that look like they'll need attention in four or
five years, and the remaining 36 are as sound as they day they were
planted.
-- in 1969 --
'course, back then we treated the soil in each hole with chlordane, which
is both an insecticide and an anti-fungal. And we painted the bottom 4'
of each pole with 'blackjack' before planting it.

LLoyd

[Gunner Asch]

On Sun, 19 May 2013 19:35:37 -0500, Tim Wescott
<t...@seemywebsite.please> wrote:

>On Sun, 19 May 2013 17:12:58 -0700, dca...@krl.org wrote:
>
>> On May 19, 4:47 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.please> wrote:
>>> Problem:  Old wood post, bedded in concrete.  I need to replace the
>>> post.
>>>
>>> Is there any way to do this that's easier than breaking up the concrete
>>> and replacing the whole mess?
>>> --
>>> Tim Wescott Control system and signal processing
>>> consultingwww.wescottdesign.com
>>
>> Is the concrete just for the wood post or is it more like a floor with
>> a wooden post embedded in the floor. If it is like a post embedded in
>> concrete for a fence post or mailbox, I would use some chain and a jack
>> and just pull the concrete out with the post. And use pressure treated
>> wood or metal pipe for the replacement post. Pressure treated wood rated
>> for ground contact ought to be good for 25 to 30 years. Longer if you
>> use somo torch down roofing around the post.
>
>It's pressure treated concrete post, with concrete around the post. It
>lasted a bit over ten years, and the post is rotted away broken off, and
>lying on the ground.
>
>What part of the country do you live in that a pressure treated post in
>concrete lives for 30 years?

Mine are that old. Still solid...here in the desert.

>
>(I'm planning on replacing it with a metal socket in concrete, that'll
>accept a wood post).

That will work. Just punch holes in the flange so water will run
out..or tar the snot out of it before installing in the socket.

Gunner

--
"You guess the truth hurts?

Really?

"Hurt" aint the word.

For Liberals, the truth is like salt to a slug.
Sunlight to a vampire.
RaidŽ to a cockroach.
Sheriff Brody to a shark
Bush to a Liberal

The truth doesn't just hurt. It's painful, like a red hot poker shoved
up their ass. Like sliding down a hundred foot razor blade using their
dick as a brake.

They HATE the truth."

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

I have had pretty good success pulling/washing the rotted post out of
the concrete and fitting a new post in it's place. 7 out of 8 4X4
cedar posts on my rear deck pulled out andI dropped new ones in place
with no trouble. The eighth one split the concrete so I had to pull it
and repour. I just dropped the post in and poured a half bag of
SackCrete into the hole around itand poured a couple cups of water on
it to get it started, and it drew enough moisture out of the
surrounding ground to hydrate it and harden the concrete within days.

[Tim Wescott]

I'm kinda questioning now whether the post in question was pressure
treated, and if so how well.

[Tim Wescott]

My problem is that the post is already broken off, and I don't see a way
to get a purchase on the stump down inside the concrete to pull it out.

[Larry Jaques]

On Sun, 19 May 2013 17:40:27 -0700, "Stumpy" <peri...@spamnet.corn>
wrote:

>>
>> Problem: Old wood post, bedded in concrete. I need to replace the post.
>>
>> Is there any way to do this that's easier than breaking up the concrete
>> and replacing the whole mess? Putting a metal foot on the post and
>> putting that into concrete has a great deal of appeal, as I'd like to die
>> of old age before I'm called upon to do it again (at least with that
>> post).
>>
>
>These would be fast if not strong.
>
>http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Landscaping/Decking+Fencing+Metalwork/DriveIn+Repair+Spike+75+x+75mm/d130/sd3224/p80996

Or drive one of those in and weld a plate to it to bolt to the
concrete for even better stability.

--
The Road to Success...is always under construction.
--anon

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

Get a big auger bit and bore a few holes down the post - to the
bottom, then collapse the post into the hole. You should be able to
get 4 or 5 holes over 1 1/4 inch in diameter, leaving little wood to
worry about.

[Gunner Asch]

On Sun, 19 May 2013 22:51:37 -0500, Tim Wescott

There are a couple ways to get it out. The easy way is to drill it out
with wood bits, then using a long chisel you can make from bar or rod
stock...bust out the bits of leftover

The other way..is to burn it out after drilling multiple holes in it.

Id strongly suggest #1

[dca...@krl.org]

On May 19, 8:35 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.please> wrote:
 And use pressure treated
> > wood or metal pipe for the replacement post. Pressure treated wood rated
> > for ground contact ought to be good for 25 to 30 years.  Longer if you
> > use somo torch down roofing around the post.
>

>

> What part of the country do you live in that a pressure treated post in
> concrete lives for 30 years?
>

> --
> Tim Wescott
> Control system and signal processing consultingwww.wescottdesign.com

According to this web site http://www.wilwaylumber.com/howto/howto082.htm
some manufacturers guarantee their PT wood for 30 years , but the life
may be more like 50 years. But you have to get PT wood that is rated
for ground contact.


Dan

[dca...@krl.org]

On May 19, 8:46 pm, Ignoramus17710 <ignoramus17...@NOSPAM.

17710.invalid> wrote:

>
> The way I installed my mailbox was to pour concrete, set a steel post
> in it, and I mounted/welded everything to that steel post. No more
> wood, thank you very much./
>
> i

I installed a mail box on a pressure treated post in 1975 and it was
still good in 2008. Probably still be good, I just have not been by
to see it.


Dan

[Larry Jaques]

On Mon, 20 May 2013 01:25:00 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>

Only people with too many tools would suggest multiple holes with a
$50 auger, so make sure you use an offsize bit you don't care about
tearing up. The concrete is kinda hard on the flutes, KWIM,V?

--
If you're trying to take a roomful of people by
surprise, it's a lot easier to hit your targets
if you don't yell going through the door.
-- Lois McMaster Bujold

[Jim Stewart]

Twenty years ago I made a "temporary" repair
to my redwood fence so I could sell the house.

Two adjacent 4"x4" posts had rotted at the soil
line and were flapping in the breeze. I drove
a 2" round fence posts 2 feet into the ground
and lag-bolted them to the existing redwood posts.
A couple of years ago I had occasion to visit
the house where the repair was done. It was
still solid.

About a month ago I had to repair two posts
on my present house. This time there were concrete
footings that had to be broken up before I could
pound the post in. The concrete was pretty easy
to get out.

[Kristian Ukkonen]

Could be the modern "environmentally friendly" treatment
that is just not very good.. The good old poisons lasted
a long time with heavy metals, chromated copper arsenate etc.
in them..

Just like modern paints.. They are just not even nearly
as good as the paints that were available 20 years ago.
The old paints had the heavy metals like lead, chromium etc.
in them, preventing anything eating the paint, and were
otherwise better too because of solvents used. Now there are
not heavy metals and they are water based, no good.

I'm getting old. I'm talking about the good old days. :)

[Kristian Ukkonen]

More like 5 usd for the cheap auger bit good enough
to make the holes..

[Bruce L. Bergman (munged human readable)]

On Sun, 19 May 2013 15:47:50 -0500, Tim Wescott
<t...@seemywebsite.please> wrote:

>Problem: Old wood post, bedded in concrete. I need to replace the post.
>
>Is there any way to do this that's easier than breaking up the concrete
>and replacing the whole mess? Putting a metal foot on the post and
>putting that into concrete has a great deal of appeal, as I'd like to die
>of old age before I'm called upon to do it again (at least with that
>post).

Myself, I'd go rent a Concrete Wet Saw and buy a diamond blade, and
slice a neat 1' square out of the concrete slab. Then jack out the
old footer, refill with concrete and a steel socket for a wood post.

Or better, a steel socket for a steel mailbox post - you don't have to
worry about rot, but cars and trucks do take them off at the dirt
every so often, and you don't want to do things over.

For extra credit, you put rebar on the backside of a 9" square of
Hot-Rolled Plate and cement that in level and a bit proud of the
surface. Then you get a big truck coil spring and tack that down to
the steel plate, and mount your mailbox post on another chunk of plate
on top of the spring. The mailbox will give a little.

And if the socket gets messed up (or they snap the spring) you can get
out the Blue-Point Wrench and fix it. Warm it up to red and massage
it back into shape with a cheater bar and a hand sledge. Or slice it
off level about 1/2" above grade, and weld on a nice new square piece.

--<< Bruce >>--

[Gunner Asch]

$50 auger? I pay so little for auger bits that a quarter..$0.25 is
too much.

Hell..for $50 Ill sell you this set.

https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/April192013#5868739221590568098

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Mon, 20 May 2013 06:33:47 -0700, Larry Jaques
<lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:

I've got several "adjustable" auger bits I've picked up at yard sales
foe between 1 and 5 dollars each. Some are kinda nasty - ideal for
risky jobs like that.

[Tim Wescott]

Oh, I don't see any risk of hitting concrete at all.

Just a certainty.

Horror Freight has an auger set for $16 on their web page, I'll look
around and see if there's anything better.

[Stanley Schaefer]

Exposed wood posts embedded in concrete WILL rot, if you don't give
water a way out. Water just collects in that concrete pocket and the
wood starts rotting. I see a lot of that around local housing
developments that are 5-10 years old, the fence posts are gone at the
ground level. Some yards have more fence props than pickets
left(didn't use galvanized nails, either). If you're going to redo it
the same way, I'd strongly suggest a layer of sand at the bottom,
followed by some crushed rock for drainage, then stick your post on
top of that and fill around it with rock and cap with concrete. Or,
put your metal sleeve in and fit the post so it's plumb, then
concrete. Sleeve should have an open bottom or you'll get both rust
AND rot. As to what's better, romoval of just the post or the whole
concrete mess, that depends on what it is. A fence post I'd
completely dig(or yank) out and redo it, same with a mailbox post. If
it's stuck in a finished concrete floor or driveway, you might be able
to drill out most of the rot, poke some holes in the bottom of the
pocket for drainage and carry on. Given the poor quality of pressure-
treated lumber these days, I'd tar the whole bottom of the post where
it's going to be covered and maybe a ways above the concrete, too. Or
just concrete the hole, put in some anchors and install a metal post
with a flange to bolt it down. Just depends on what you're trying to
support.

Stan

[Larry Jaques]

Not since the art of lumber-frame house building has blossomed again.

[Larry Jaques]

On Mon, 20 May 2013 13:25:13 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>

Pop that onto eBay for $30 + shipping with the words "American made"
and Timberframe/Timber Frame" and watch it blossom to $90 overnight,
mon. Seriously! There are cycles, but the high cycles are wonderful
for tool sales.

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 21 May 2013 14:29:47 -0700, Larry Jaques

No shit? Ill check into that. Ive got a bunch of bits and braces.

Gunner

--
"You guess the truth hurts?

Really?

"Hurt" aint the word.

For Liberals, the truth is like salt to a slug.
Sunlight to a vampire.

Raid® to a cockroach.

[Larry Jaques]

On Tue, 21 May 2013 17:05:49 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>

wrote:

>On Tue, 21 May 2013 14:29:47 -0700, Larry Jaques
><lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 20 May 2013 13:25:13 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>>wrote:

>>>Hell..for $50 Ill sell you this set.
>>>
>>>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/April192013#5868739221590568098
>>
>>Pop that onto eBay for $30 + shipping with the words "American made"
>>and Timberframe/Timber Frame" and watch it blossom to $90 overnight,
>>mon. Seriously! There are cycles, but the high cycles are wonderful
>>for tool sales.
>
>No shit? Ill check into that. Ive got a bunch of bits and braces.

Whenever a woodworking guru mentions something on their woodworking
show on teevee, all the newbs flock to the Web to buy that item used
on eBay. I believe they're the biggest cause of cycles in tool prices
on the Net nowadays.

I like the free listing of the sellers' first 50 items eBay is giving
nowadays (but hate their final fees, which include shipping!) and have
made several hundred dollars recently from listing old project stuff I
didn't get around to finishing. I've usually tripled my investment.

Craigslist & eBay are superb ways of getting buyers for your junque.
Just Do It!

Also, because my bank offers free checking accounts, I set one up
specifically for PayPal use. It secures my meager bank account from
the ravages of said entity, should they get funny on me.

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 21 May 2013 20:52:16 -0700, Larry Jaques

I got 5 messages on my phone..text messages...from wierd email
addresses since I put the ads on at 4am this morning. Including the
infamous "will you hold it until the check clears, then ship it?"

Only one guy has called...and Ive sold stuff to him before.

[Larry Jaques]

On Tue, 21 May 2013 22:17:48 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Tue, 21 May 2013 20:52:16 -0700, Larry Jaques
><lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
>
>>Craigslist & eBay are superb ways of getting buyers for your junque.
>>Just Do It!
>>
>>Also, because my bank offers free checking accounts, I set one up
>>specifically for PayPal use. It secures my meager bank account from
>>the ravages of said entity, should they get funny on me.
>
>I got 5 messages on my phone..text messages...from wierd email

That's your fault, trying to read email via a 2x3" screen. Crikey!

>addresses since I put the ads on at 4am this morning. Including the
>infamous "will you hold it until the check clears, then ship it?"

I love the famous "We're a large company, located in xxx country, who
would like to sell thousands of dollars worth of your products. Do
you accept US credit cards? What products do you carry?" Beware the
second chance offers supposedly from eBay, too, if you buy things
there. Bogus people are watching who bids and then going after them.
I don't know how it's done, but it's semi-believeable.

>Only one guy has called...and Ive sold stuff to him before.

So, did you sell your Old Arn (metal content) to him? Ebay is where
the money is. List it at a decent, profitable price, then go 50% more
for the Buy It Now. The Instant Gratification crew will swoop in and
nab it at the BIN price in seconds. Craigslist is really iffy. Get a
bill checking pen before selling anything to a Craigslister. Lotsa
scammers out there.
For Craigslist, I give my phone number, munged for the bots, and say
that I won't answer any emails without a phone number. The last time
I did, I got a months worth of smut spam (not all of it half bad) so I
won't answer any Craigslist email with my real email addy ever again.
If you don't have a phone (or call me, as I requested in the ad), you
don't get my address to come pick it up.
Sample phone munging: (123) four five six 7890.

--
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight
very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands.
It hopes we've learned something from yesterday.
-- John Wayne

[Michael A. Terrell]

Larry Jaques wrote:
>
> I love the famous "We're a large company, located in xxx country,
> who would like to sell thousands of dollars worth of your products.
> Do you accept US credit cards? What products do you carry?"

We want to buy from your company. What is the URL, and do you shop
to the Philippines?

> Beware the second chance offers supposedly from eBay, too, if you
> buy things there. Bogus people are watching who bids and then going
> after them. I don't know how it's done, but it's semi-believeable.

Ebay USED to display the bidder's ID. Now, it is a code that doesn't
match your account name, and legitimate second chance offers come
through the Ebay messaging system.