ONE of a kind JEWELRY designs
HelloKittyCruzer
I am a young jewelry artist trying to get my artwork noticed by the
public and by galleries. I work in mainly metal and blown glass. All jewelry
is wearable but mostly meant for show. Below is a link to my personal website
filled with many of my vairous pieces. It is only a fraction what I have and
what I can do. At the current time, I am not working on any new piece for lack
of studio space and equippment after college. If i could sell some work or
get it recognized it will get me one step closer to getting into my own studio
to start creating more and get back into my artistic flow.
I hope you enjoy. and please email mail with your feedback good or
bad
THANK YOU
Here is the link to my website: http://www/81x.com/art2303/ultimatedesigns1
Abrasha
>I hope you enjoy. and please email mail with your feedback good or
> bad
>
> Here is the link to my website: http://www/81x.com/art2303/ultimatedesigns1
Ouch! My poor old eyes, ... and ears!
Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com
Typhoon News User
Robert Merritt
Abrasha <abr...@abrasha.com> wrote in message
news:576k3v0lqjidkj7e4...@4ax.com...
Abrasha
>
> hmmmm.....what did your first body of work look like?
>
> Robert Merritt
It wasn't very good.
And ... when I asked for critiques, I got what I deserved.
Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com
NE333RO
> I am a young jewelry artist trying to get my artwork noticed by the
>public and by galleries. I work in mainly metal and blown glass. All
>jewelry
>is wearable but mostly meant for show. Below is a link to my personal
>website
>filled with many of my vairous pieces. It is only a fraction what I have and
>what I can do. At the current time, I am not working on any new piece for
>lack
>of studio space and equippment after college. If i could sell some work or
>get it recognized it will get me one step closer to getting into my own
>studio
>to start creating more and get back into my artistic flow.
> I hope you enjoy. and please email mail with your feedback good
>or
>bad
I liked some of your designs though most are less than practicle. If you
want to sell jewelry my suggestion would be to make pieces that are wearable,
in metals the public finds valuable. It seems a shame to have most
conversations end with "It's aluminum? And you want HOW much?".
Barbara Otterson
>
> I liked some of your designs though most are less than practicle. If you
>want to sell jewelry my suggestion would be to make pieces that are wearable,
>in metals the public finds valuable. It seems a shame to have most
>conversations end with "It's aluminum? And you want HOW much?".
Haven't seen Peggy Eng's work have you? Aluminum,
machined. Dyed. Fascinating. Pins go for 200.00 and
up. She has no problem selling it. Neither do the galleries
that carry her work.
Barbara
Dream Master
www.dreamweaverstudio.com
A human being should be able to change a diaper,
plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship,
design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts,
build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take
orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations,
analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer,
cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.
Lazarus Long (Robert A. Heinlein)
NE333RO
>machined. Dyed. Fascinating. Pins go for 200.00 and
>up. She has no problem selling it. Neither do the galleries
>that carry her work.
>Barbara
Obviously you missed my point. I don't know Peggy Eng, nor do I intend to
spend much time looking for her work (though I would check it out if you have
an address). My guess is that she's been in business for a long time, has a
cliental built up, and can sell pieces that are made with "unusual" metals.
This is a kid straight out of school trying to sell jewelry and make money. If
you want to do that your best bet is to cater to the general public, not the
art crowd.
Just like most of the rest of us (unless she's brilliant and maybe even
then), she'll need to start out making run of the mill jewelry, pieces the
general public likes and at a price they will pay. Then she can branch out into
"art" pieces and pieces that are made with metals that aren't "precious."
By the way, if I spent as much time as this person spent on a pin, and only
got $200.00............................
Don Robinson
"Barbara Otterson" <drea...@dreamweaverstudio.com> wrote in message
news:m2uo3vcb1ns0vddg1...@4ax.com...
Abrasha
>
> I liked some of your designs though most are less than practicle. If you
> want to sell jewelry my suggestion would be to make pieces that are wearable,
> in metals the public finds valuable.
Wearable, yes. "metals the public finds valuable", a big fat no. Value, is by
agreement only. Gold, platinum, silver etc. are only valuable because we agree
that they are. The same for so called "precious" stones. They are only
precious by agreement.
>It seems a shame to have most
> conversations end with "It's aluminum? And you want HOW much?".
FYI, I regularly sell pieces mostly made out of stainless steel to private
clients, in the upper four figures. And I have sold pieces to museums for
prices well into five figures.
Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com
Abrasha
>
> > Haven't seen Peggy Eng's work have you? Aluminum,
> >machined. Dyed. Fascinating. Pins go for 200.00 and
> >up. She has no problem selling it. Neither do the galleries
> >that carry her work.
> >Barbara
>
> Obviously you missed my point.
She did.
> I don't know Peggy Eng, nor do I intend to
> spend much time looking for her work (though I would check it out if you have
> an address). My guess is that she's been in business for a long time,
You are right.
> has a
> cliental built up, and can sell pieces that are made with "unusual" metals.
Right again.
> This is a kid straight out of school trying to sell jewelry and make money. If
> you want to do that your best bet is to cater to the general public, not the
> art crowd.
Bullshit! With that kind of mindset no art would ever be produced.
> Just like most of the rest of us (unless she's brilliant and maybe even
> then), she'll need to start out making run of the mill jewelry, pieces the
> general public likes and at a price they will pay.
What a load of bull! If I would have subscribed to that attitude, I'd still be
making "run of the mill" garbage. Do you think Picasso painted "run of the
mill" paintings, because that is what the "general public likes". Our museums
are full of work of people who had the drive, desire and courage to make things
that were not "pieces the general public likes".
Your kind of thinking will only lead to frustration and bitterness at the end of
a mediocre life, that was full of compromises!
> Then she can branch out into
> "art" pieces and pieces that are made with metals that aren't "precious."
You seem to be truly clueless, about the nature of "art". But then again, what
can one expect from a person who "like most of the rest of us", allegedly makes
"run of the mill" jewelry.
I'd be curious to see some of your work. Put it online.
Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com
Dale Porter
"Abrasha" <abr...@abrasha.com> wrote > You seem to be truly clueless, about
the nature of "art". But then again, what
> can one expect from a person who "like most of the rest of us", allegedly
makes
> "run of the mill" jewelry.
>
May I make a suggestion? Try to make your point without turning an insult
against one form of art or jewellery, into an insult against other forms. In
insulting other forms, you only lower yourself to a level not worth going
to.
Dale
KG
Seems to me that there's a big disconnect here. Abrasha wants to make "Art"
but the newbie starting out wants to make jewelry. The vast majority of
people making jewelry today need to work in order to support themselves and
their families. If they make some great Artistic work along the way, fine,
but that's not going to pay the bills every month.
Particularly when starting out, you need to pay your dues, learn your craft,
and find your market(s). For every Picasso out there, there have been
hundreds or thousands of hard-working artists painting portraits and
landscapes on commission, doing good, sound work and making a living at it.
There have been just as many "Picasso wannabes" out there trying to "remain
true to their Muse" and starving.
Going the starving artist route isn't for everyone, and not everyone in this
biz sees it that way. For many, it's a "craft business" -- NOT Art. That's
why there's frequently a distinction made between the "arts" and the
"crafts."
So lighten up, Abrasha, and realize that not everyone has the same viewpoint
or goals as you do. Disparaging and insulting those with different goals
doesn't get you any respect from your community of peers. Try standing in
someone else's shoes occasionally, and you might just be surprised at how
positive life looks from over here -- no frustration and bitterness, no
compromises, just a long life of experimentation and the pleasure found in
producing something that brings joy to a lot of people.
KG
Peter W. Rowe
>>Seems to me that there's a big disconnect here. Abrasha wants to make "Art"
>>but the newbie starting out wants to make jewelry. The vast majority of
>>people making jewelry today need to work in order to support themselves and
>>their families. If they make some great Artistic work along the way, fine,
>>but that's not going to pay the bills every month.
I'm going to take Abrasha's side on this one.
First, the newbie in question was trained in art school, and is indeed, trying
very hard to make art, that happens in some of the pieces, to also be jewelery.
It seems to me that the work in question needs to learn more about being
jewelery than it does about being art, though it clearly needs to grow a lot in
both aspects before it will make it's maker wealthy.
The thing is, though the much larger buying public wants more conventional
commercially familier work, individual craftspeople working in that market can
be quickly swallowed up. There's a LOT of competition, and it's from very
skilled hands and big companies, with economies of scale, often economies of
foreign workforces too, or at least the advantage of already having the skills,
equipment, and market to do what they're doing. While a young newbie can
break into the conventional jewelery market, certainly, and make what the public
is most often buying and looking for, it's pretty difficult for such a person
to actually succeed on their own and build it into a living. Very few
graduating art students who try it that way, succeed at all, and those who
manage it, usually do so by ending up being empolyed by some kindly jeweler
who'll allow them to learn the commercial "ropes" at little more than minimum
wage, growing into a career that I'm sure most of you will agree is not exactly
a well paying one.
On the other hand, this newbie HAS been exposed to more art and design training
than many commercial jewelers. Sure, the training has got a lot of maturing to
do before the work is really good, but that's the way it goes. The market for
artistically adventurous work is a lot smaller, but I think it's also more
likely to take notice of a newcomer with differnet ideas, if that person has the
energy and commitment and stubbornness to stick it out in the beginning. Of
the many people I've studied with in various art school environments over the
years, more have gone on to careers in other fields than have tried to make
jewelry their living, a testament to how hard and competative this field can be.
Of those who've stayed, some went the commercial route, while others stayed true
to their art school roots and have become artist jewelers, not commercially
oriented jewelers. If you ask me to name the ones who're commercial, I can name
only a few. Most of the ones I know of, who stayed with it, and who I can name
or recall, are the artists. Some of them have become quite well known.
It's difficult for a young newcomer to break into either branch of the market.
But I think the chances of success are actually greater with the more
artistically astute and adventurous art world, and I think the potential for
real success is also a lot higher. I'd encourage this person to stay with their
art, not succumb to the lure of a steady paycheck at some commercial bench job,
whether at some other employer, or in their own business. It's maybe a harder
path to follow, but its a more rewarding one, I think.
Peter
WoN ereH
make "Art"
>but the newbie starting out wants to make jewelry.
Huh? Abrasha's art IS jewelry. And vice versa.
>So lighten up, Abrasha, and realize that not everyone has the same viewpoint
>or goals as you do. Disparaging and insulting those with different goals
>doesn't get you any respect from your community of peers.
I personally don't think Abrasha needs to lighten up one iota. In fact, his
bluntness is a kindness of truth where most would insert false platitudes.
IMHO
Debra
NE333RO
>If
>> you want to do that your best bet is to cater to the general public, not
>the
>> art crowd.
>Bullshit! With that kind of mindset no art would ever be produced.
Wow. It must be nice to grow up with a silver spoon in your mouth. Some of
us have to work for a living while we practice our art. It takes longer that
way, but it does pay the bills in the meantime.
>> Just like most of the rest of us (unless she's brilliant and maybe even
>> then), she'll need to start out making run of the mill jewelry, pieces the
>> general public likes and at a price they will pay.
>What a load of bull! If I would have subscribed to that attitude, I'd still
>be
>making "run of the mill" garbage.
The key word there would be "still".
Do you think Picasso painted "run of the
>mill" paintings, because that is what the "general public likes".
Ummmmmmm.....................actually yes. Picasso designed and painted
theater sets, designed costumes, and did graphic illustrations. Even prodigies
have to pay the bills.
Our
>museums
>are full of work of people who had the drive, desire and courage to make
>things
>that were not "pieces the general public likes".
Yep. They're also full of works done by people who died broke and
unappreciated. So what? That said, I see no reason why making jewelry that is
economically more feasible, to start, cannot allow you the time and resources
to work on your art also.
>Your kind of thinking will only lead to frustration and bitterness at the end
>of
>a mediocre life, that was full of compromises!
LOL. We certainly see things from a different perspective (yours sounds
awfully bitter and frustrated). Personally, I see it as the triumph of a person
who did what they needed to do to feed their family, while working on their
art. All of life is a compromise. That is, of course, unless it's all handed to
you.
>> Then she can branch out into
>> "art" pieces and pieces that are made with metals that aren't "precious."
>You seem to be truly clueless, about the nature of "art". But then again,
>what
>can one expect from a person who "like most of the rest of us", allegedly
>makes
>"run of the mill" jewelry.
But we really aren't talking about art, we are talking about making a
living until we can afford to make art. You may scoff at "run of the mill"
jewelry, but Walmart sold 2 billion dollars worth of it in 2000. Thats more
than any other chain selling jewelry. Is it sexy? No. Is it what sells? Yes.
>I'd be curious to see some of your work. Put it online.
Why? I don't especially like you, so I see no need to please you. I don't
much value your opinion, so I don't really care what you think about my work.
I'm not stuck on my own greatness, so I don't need a webpage to massage my ego
(nice webpage by the way). You planning on buying something? That's rhetorical
by the way, I'm particular who I sell to these days.
Abrasha
>
> Seems to me that there's a big disconnect here. Abrasha wants to make "Art"
That's not true. I have never said that I want to make art. I make jewelry.
The fact that some people call it art only means that these people have a very
limited view of what jewelry can or may look like. In any case, I do not call
my jewelry art, others have done that. In a recent issue of "Mmetalsmith
Magazine" ( Fall 2002, Volume22 number 5), there was a short article about me,
in which I address this issue. Read it, if you have a chance.
> but the newbie starting out wants to make jewelry. The vast majority of
> people making jewelry today need to work in order to support themselves and
> their families.
That includes me.
> If they make some great Artistic work along the way, fine,
> but that's not going to pay the bills every month.
That's right, and I abjected to the term "run of the mill" in an earlier post.
>
> Particularly when starting out, you need to pay your dues, learn your craft,
> and find your market(s). For every Picasso out there, there have been
> hundreds or thousands of hard-working artists painting portraits and
> landscapes on commission, doing good, sound work and making a living at it.
> There have been just as many "Picasso wannabes" out there trying to "remain
> true to their Muse" and starving.
>
> Going the starving artist route isn't for everyone, and not everyone in this
> biz sees it that way. For many, it's a "craft business" -- NOT Art.
That includes me. See the Metalsmith article I mentioned above.
> That's
> why there's frequently a distinction made between the "arts" and the
> "crafts."
>
> So lighten up, Abrasha, and realize that not everyone has the same viewpoint
> or goals as you do. Disparaging and insulting those with different goals
> doesn't get you any respect from your community of peers.
I wasn't aiming for approval.
> Try standing in
> someone else's shoes occasionally, and you might just be surprised at how
> positive life looks from over here -- no frustration and bitterness, no
> compromises, just a long life of experimentation and the pleasure found in
> producing something that brings joy to a lot of people.
>
I see your point. And you speak of it in a different tone, than the poster I
responded to, who spoke of "run of the mill" jewelry, which I found rather
offensive. I will probably receive some more flak for it.
Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com
Abrasha
>
> Wow. It must be nice to grow up with a silver spoon in your mouth.
What makes you think I grew up with a silver spoon in my mouth?
> Some of
> us have to work for a living while we practice our art. It takes longer that
> way, but it does pay the bills in the meantime.
Tell me about it.
>
> >> Just like most of the rest of us (unless she's brilliant and maybe even
> >> then), she'll need to start out making run of the mill jewelry, pieces the
> >> general public likes and at a price they will pay.
>
> >What a load of bull! If I would have subscribed to that attitude, I'd still
> >be
> >making "run of the mill" garbage.
>
> The key word there would be "still".
>
> Do you think Picasso painted "run of the
> >mill" paintings, because that is what the "general public likes".
>
> Ummmmmmm.....................actually yes. Picasso designed and painted
> theater sets, designed costumes, and did graphic illustrations.
And none of them were "run of the mill".
> Even prodigies
> have to pay the bills.
>
> Our
> >museums
> >are full of work of people who had the drive, desire and courage to make
> >things
> >that were not "pieces the general public likes".
>
> Yep. They're also full of works done by people who died broke and
> unappreciated. So what? That said, I see no reason why making jewelry that is
> economically more feasible, to start, cannot allow you the time and resources
> to work on your art also.
Nice thought, and that is usually not how it happens. Show me the work of a
handful of artists in any medium, where this has been the case.
>
> >Your kind of thinking will only lead to frustration and bitterness at the end
> >of
> >a mediocre life, that was full of compromises!
>
> LOL. We certainly see things from a different perspective (yours sounds
> awfully bitter and frustrated). Personally, I see it as the triumph of a person
> who did what they needed to do to feed their family, while working on their
> art. All of life is a compromise. That is, of course, unless it's all handed to
> you.
There you go again, making assumptions about silver spoons, etc.
>
> >> Then she can branch out into
> >> "art" pieces and pieces that are made with metals that aren't "precious."
>
> >You seem to be truly clueless, about the nature of "art". But then again,
> >what
> >can one expect from a person who "like most of the rest of us", allegedly
> >makes
> >"run of the mill" jewelry.
>
> But we really aren't talking about art, we are talking about making a
> living until we can afford to make art.
One does not postpone making "art" until one can afford to. I don't think that
this is how it works. If you wait for things to happen, they never will.
Besides, it's only art in the eye of the beholder, not in the eye of the person
making it.
A quote from Hillel that illustrates this point a bit "If I am not for myself,
who will be for me? And if only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?"
> " You may scoff at "run of the mill"
> jewelry, but Walmart sold 2 billion dollars worth of it in 2000. Thats more
> than any other chain selling jewelry. Is it sexy? No. Is it what sells? Yes.
What's your point? MacDonalds has served a few billion hamburgers. Do they
make good hamburgers? I think not. Your statement has absolutely nothing to do
with the topic, and it is totally pointless.
>
> >I'd be curious to see some of your work. Put it online.
>
> Why? I don't especially like you, so I see no need to please you. I don't
> much value your opinion, so I don't really care what you think about my work.
> I'm not stuck on my own greatness, so I don't need a webpage to massage my ego
> (nice webpage by the way).
I do not have a web page to massage may ego, but rather to sell my work, and to
show how I make it. I have found that people find it informative and
educating. I did $20,000 in business directly from my site in 2002. Not a
great deal of money, and about $20,000 more than I would have had without the
site. Now that massages my ego, and my bank account.
> You planning on buying something?
I don't buy "run of the mill" jewelry.
> That's rhetorical
> by the way, I'm particular who I sell to these days.
Rather foolish, you'll never sell 2 billion dollars worth that way. I sell to
anyone willing to pay my price.
Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com
Barbara Otterson
>>I'd be curious to see some of your work. Put it online.
>
> Why? I don't especially like you, so I see no need to please you. I don't
>much value your opinion, so I don't really care what you think about my work.
>I'm not stuck on my own greatness, so I don't need a webpage to massage my ego
>(nice webpage by the way). You planning on buying something? That's rhetorical
>by the way, I'm particular who I sell to these days.
Webpages don't necessarily massage ego, but can
produce that most helpful of commodities -- money!
Also, you can't get your name before the public too
many times. The more they see the name, the more
value they tend to attach to it (but I suspect you already
knew that).
It is nice to be able to put work with a name. I'm
terrible at faces, personally, but I always remember
work worth remembering. It helps "flesh out" ones
personality beyond what's typed on the keyboard.
So put some work on the web, I'd like to see it too.
NE333RO
>responded to, who spoke of "run of the mill" jewelry, which I found rather
>offensive.
Would you have prefered "mainstream"? That was the direction I was pointing
her.
Typhoon News User
delivered thoughts are sound and correct but I fail to see them as a
comparison to Abrasha's original remarks, which were of a crushing rather
than critical nature.Indeed, there was no hint of constructive criticism in
any of his remarks. I suspect he either, A. means well , a kind of school of
hard knocks approach or B. he knows it is cruel and does not care about the
consequences of his brief and unfriendly words. In either case, it is the
wrong response to the student requesting views on her work.
Robert Merritt
Peter W. Rowe <PWR...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:nkmv3vc7voamdcppj...@4ax.com...
> On , in rec.crafts.jewelry "KG" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >>Seems to me that there's a big disconnect here. Abrasha wants to make
"Art"
> >>but the newbie starting out wants to make jewelry. The vast majority of
> >>people making jewelry today need to work in order to support themselves
and
> >>their families. If they make some great Artistic work along the way,
fine,
> >>but that's not going to pay the bills every month.
>
> I'm going to take Abrasha's side on this one.
>
Peter
Peter W. Rowe
<ne...@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>Peter, I don't understand what part of Abrasha's side you are on.Your well
>>delivered thoughts are sound and correct but I fail to see them as a
>>comparison to Abrasha's original remarks,
I wasn't commenting on Abrasha's original remarks. I was commenting here, only
on the question of whether it would seem more viable for this person to pursue
the making of jewelery that is true to her art training, rather than attempting
to make more commercially oriented work, termed by one as "run of the mill". My
reasoning is simply htat there are an awful lot of firms and jewelers with a lot
of experience and marketing clout, competing for the commercial jewelery dollar.
For a single craftsperson, especially one just starting out, to compete in that
arena seems a formula for failure. On the other hand, work presented and
marketed as art, as well as jewelery (if even as jewelery at all) rather than
trying to compete with the rest of the commercial jewelery industry, has more
of a chance. It may be competing in a smaller pond, with fewer consumers and
fewer dollars to compete for, but at least it can be noticed and evaluated on
it's own terms.
As to the nature of Abrasha's orginal comments, well, we all know he can be, um,
"blunt...." But I'll take a blunt honest opinion any day, even if it's
painful, if I need a critique of my work, in place of of someone trying to be
nice and encouraging, even if they don't actually like the work. While I can't
say I was of quite the same harsh opinion as Abrasha on the work, I will say I
too, felt it needs further refinement and exploration before it will be a
success. And though this has little to do with the jewelery, I'll also
volunteer the personal opinion that I much prefer web sites that do NOT offer a
sound track. I find the music annoying most of the time. Not just this
example, but most web sites with music playing tend to bother me. It tends to
make me surf somewhere else rather quickly unless it just happens, by very rare
chance, to be the choice of music I happen to want to listen to just at that
moment, and I don't happen to also have something else on the stereo at the
moment. So then. do I agree with Abrasha? Well, I'd have used different,
gentler words. And I might have tried to explain why I felt the work isn't as
developed as it should be. but that's just my style. Abrasha is entirely
entitled to his own opinion and style of reply, when asked.
But as Abrasha says, if you ask for a critique, you expect to get an honest one.
I can recall critiques in graduate school that were a LOT harsher than Abrasha's
comments.
Nuff for now.
Peter