The First Art Stamp Ever?
amesh
topical stamp to be issued. Some say that this collecting area began with
the French art series in the early 1960's, while others believe that it may
be the French stamp from 1849 depicting Ceres, and yet others that it was
the British Penny Black.
In the bi-monthly publication "Topical Time" published by American Topical
Association, #334/2005, Column "Topical Postline", appears a letter to the
editor
"--- sent an inquiry to American Philatelic Research Library, asking for the
design source of France #1. The response states, "An explanation of the
design appears in James Mackay's book "An Illustrated History of Stamp
Design". France introduced stamps in January 1849, but instead of using the
portrait of a living person, [they] chose the profile of Ceres, goddess of
agriculture, in a circular frame with a rectangular border (Scott #1). The
head of Ceres was taken from ancient Greek coins, a logical source of
inspiration since coins and stamps were analogous in many respects".
" --- I am not sure whether this qualifies as being the earliest use of art
on stamps; I think this depends upon how one defines fine arts. The portrait
on the 1840 British Penny Black (Scott #1) was based on "The Guildhall Medal
of 1838" showing Wyon's profile of Queen Victoria. Might this not be
considered to be fine arts?"
What do other (art stamp) collectors think?
--
Best regards
Ann Mette Heindorff (Mette)
http://arthistory.heindorffhus.dk
------
Outgoing messages.checked with Norton AV
Gerhard Reichert
every portrait on a stamp was made by an artist (painter, designer or what
ever), so every stamp needs a blueprint. Designing stamps is an act of art.
So the question should be specified, I think:
If You define "art on stamps" as reproduction of an existing painting or
sculpture to honore the artwork, then it is easy to look for the first stamp
issue honoring an artist or his work.
The Penny Black only honored Queen Victory as a living Majesty, not the
artwork of the designer of the portrait.
The same with the French Ceres. This picture was used as a symbol, not to
reproduce an antique artwork. So in my humble opinion it is not an example
for "art on stamps".
It愀 a problem of definition, I think.
Best regards
Gerhard
"amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:4371c30c$0$141$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk...
Rodney
Hiya Mette,
Here is the Guildhall medal
http://cjoint.com/data/ljnroDtwht.htm
The jury is still out here, with a strong "no" to the portraits.
I would consider the first art concerning the post, not be on a stamp
but evidenced by the Mulready envelopes.
As for stamps, still pondering.
Rodney
--
rodney at touch88.com.au
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"amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> wrote in message news:4371c30c$0$141$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk...
Rodney
but cannot be seen on the scan
Rodney
What about the Sardinian "Cavallini" impressed on
letter sheets of 1819 to 1836 ?
(riders with posthorn)
--
rodney at touch88.com.au
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"amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> wrote in message news:4371c30c$0$141$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk...
amesh
en meddelelse news:4371e7d4$0$7428$9b4e...@newsread4.arcor-online.net...
> Hi Mette,
>
> every portrait on a stamp was made by an artist (painter, designer or
> what ever), so every stamp needs a blueprint. Designing stamps is an act
> of art.
>
> So the question should be specified, I think:
>
> If You define "art on stamps" as reproduction of an existing painting or
> sculpture to honore the artwork, then it is easy to look for the first
> stamp issue honoring an artist or his work.
>
> The Penny Black only honored Queen Victory as a living Majesty, not the
> artwork of the designer of the portrait.
>
> The same with the French Ceres. This picture was used as a symbol, not to
> reproduce an antique artwork. So in my humble opinion it is not an example
> for "art on stamps".
>
> It愀 a problem of definition, I think.
Hi Gerhard,
Personally I think it is a question of definition. However, I could think of
a third definition: an artwork especially designed for the stamp format, and
which is not an already existing artwork reproduced on stamps. Such stamps
do exist, but they are not many. Out of the hat I can think of one
Hundertwasser-stamp, and 1-2 of the recent Danish art stamps.
I would like to hear other opinions :-)
Best regards
Mette
amesh
news:4371ec83$1...@news.eftel.com...
>
>
> What about the Sardinian "Cavallini" impressed on
> letter sheets of 1819 to 1836 ?
> (riders with posthorn)
In my opinion they are just as symbolic as Queen Victoria and Ceres :-)
Mette
amesh
>
> Hiya Mette,
>
> Here is the Guildhall medal
> http://cjoint.com/data/ljnroDtwht.htm
>
> The jury is still out here, with a strong "no" to the portraits.
Hej Rodney,
Nice medal. She was quite attractive as young ... ;-)
Mette
Victor Manta
Both of you think that it's a problem or question of definition. IMHO, it's
a matter of definition too. :-)
An old Romanian romance says:
...Because there isn't a man who hasn't written a poem
At least once, at least one, in his life.
If it's true, than the image of every man is related to art, in the same
manner as the image of Mark Twain on a stamp is related to literature.
On a more serious note, I have limited the object of my Art on Stamps Site
(link below) to: "... visual arts (painting, drawing, sculpting, pottery,
tapestry, enamel, etc.) as they appear on stamps."
I have included in the art on stamps database the stamps that meet the
following criteria:
a.. They should reproduce (pre-)existing works of art
b.. They should show real works of art (as for example opposed to banal
portraits, reproduced millions of times, like kings' or dictators' faces)
The only exception I have made is for the works of art designed by renown
artists, done with the purpose of being explicitly reproduced on stamps.
http://www.values.ch/db-en.htm
--
Victor Manta
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Art on Stamps: http://www.values.ch/
Spanish North Africa: http://www.values.ch/sna-site/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
amesh
news:3teh6oF...@individual.net...
> "amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> wrote in message
> news:437200c6$0$179$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk...
>> "Gerhard Reichert" <gerhard.reichert.re...@arcor.de>
>> skrev i en meddelelse
>> news:4371e7d4$0$7428$9b4e...@newsread4.arcor-online.net...
- snip -
> Both of you think that it's a problem or question of definition. IMHO,
> it's a matter of definition too. :-)
>
> An old Romanian romance says:
>
> ...Because there isn't a man who hasn't written a poem
> At least once, at least one, in his life.
>
> If it's true, than the image of every man is related to art, in the same
> manner as the image of Mark Twain on a stamp is related to literature.
Yes, with the addition that literature is a part of art history in the sense
that anyone whose works are read globally, are included. My personal poems
would *never* qualify, I can assure you! :-)
>
> On a more serious note, I have limited the object of my Art on Stamps Site
> (link below) to: "... visual arts (painting, drawing, sculpting, pottery,
> tapestry, enamel, etc.) as they appear on stamps."
> I have included in the art on stamps database the stamps that meet the
> following criteria:
A limitation that includes the rather vague "etc." ... ;-))
>
> a.. They should reproduce (pre-)existing works of art
In that case both the Guildhall-medal and the Ceres head qualify.
> b.. They should show real works of art (as for example opposed to banal
> portraits, reproduced millions of times, like kings' or dictators' faces)
> The only exception I have made is for the works of art designed by renown
> artists, done with the purpose of being explicitly reproduced on stamps.
Thank you for your opinion.
Mette
AK47
news:4371c30c$0$141$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk:
> Collectors of Art Stamps have often discussed which was the first art
> topical stamp to be issued. Some say that this collecting area began
> with the French art series in the early 1960's,
Spain's Goya nude of 1930 (Scott 397-399) comes to mind.Back in the middle
of the last century pre-teen boys loved that stamp.
The series of which the nudes were part honored Goya, the artist.The oter
stamps in the series pictured Goya himself.
amesh
news:Xns97096AF38FBF9ak...@216.196.97.136...
> "amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> wrote in
> news:4371c30c$0$141$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk:
>
>> Collectors of Art Stamps have often discussed which was the first art
>> topical stamp to be issued. Some say that this collecting area began
>> with the French art series in the early 1960's,
>
> Spain's Goya nude of 1930 (Scott 397-399) comes to mind.Back in the middle
> of the last century pre-teen boys loved that stamp.
I can understand that!
Here's the 1 peseta-stamp from the set
http://arthistory.heindorffhus.dk/goya-spain1930-maja1pta-medium.jpg
taken from my Goya-page
http://arthistory.heindorffhus.dk/frame-Goya.htm
Mette
amesh
"Didier Cuidet" <d.cuid...@alussinan.org> skrev i en meddelelse
news:b5f4n1tan9v69dog7...@4ax.com...
> Le Wed, 9 Nov 2005 20:24:05 +0800, dans rec.collecting.stamps.discuss,
> "Rodney" <rod...@touch88gum.com.au> a écrit :> And here the projects for the first French stamp :
> <URL:http://www.museedelaposte.fr/Chercheurs/Les_Tresors_du_Musee/Archives.htm#art601>
>
> There is no mention about a Greek coin.
>
> In that case, the goddess must be called Demeter and not Ceres.
> <URL:http://waltm.net/demeter.htm>
Interisting link, thank you.
Mette
>
> Caution, the last page has music.
>
> --
> DC
> Débuts dans les groupes -> <news:fr.bienvenue>
> Pour en savoir plus -> <url:http://www.usenet-fr.net>
> Rédiger agréablement ->
> <url:http://www.giromini.org/usenet-fr/repondre.html>
amesh
> Le Wed, 09 Nov 2005 09:30:47 -0600, dans rec.collecting.stamps.discuss,
> AK47 <ak47...@hotcoolmaildogs.com> a écrit :
>
>> "amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> wrote in
>> news:4371c30c$0$141$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk:
>>
>> > Collectors of Art Stamps have often discussed which was the first art
>> > topical stamp to be issued. Some say that this collecting area began
>> > with the French art series in the early 1960's,
>>
>> Spain's Goya nude of 1930 (Scott 397-399) comes to mind.Back in the
>> middle
>> of the last century pre-teen boys loved that stamp.
>
> sculptures :
>
> Le Lion de Belfort
> <URL:http://www.philatelix.fr/Catalogue/timbres.cfm?prov=annee_timbres&Annee=1900&dallay=152>
> <URL:http://www.phan-ngoc.com/fred/paris/html/lionbelfort.html>
>
> La Marseillaise
> <URL:http://www.philatelix.fr/Catalogue/timbres.cfm?prov=annee_timbres&Annee=1900&dallay=153>
> <URL:http://www.philatelix.fr/Catalogue/timbres.cfm?prov=annee_timbres&Annee=1900&dallay=154>
> <URL:http://www.parisrama.com/thematique_arc_de_triomphe/theme_adtcelysees/pages/025.htm>
Thank you. I will look into them soonest posssible.
Mette
Blair (TC)
placed on Italian letters to signify the degree of urgency.
(ie the degree of punishment to the messenger for
delaying the message.) 8*)
Blair
amesh
news:1131565906....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
amesh
news:4371c30c$0$141$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk...
C'mon guys and gals,
What was the earliest art stamp in *your* country?
Mette
Pierre Courtiade
> In that case, the goddess must be called Demeter and not Ceres.
> <URL:http://waltm.net/demeter.htm>
>
A nice quiet music, BTW ;-)
Thanks, Didier.
--
Pierre
Rodney
Well, for Australia, I'd guess..........
A painting by Virgil Reilly shown on the front cover
of Australia's favourite Womens magazine in 1939
inspired Frank Manly for the 1940 Oz issues.
The 3 servicemen shown in the painting, were killed during
the war. The nurse is the artist's wife.
All persons used in the stamp design survived the war.
http://cjoint.com/data/ljxDYz30CL.htm
apologies for poor example.
Gerhard Reichert
> C'mon guys and gals,
> What was the earliest art stamp in *your* country?
>
> Mette
For Germany it could be 1900, Michel # 64, 2 Reichsmark, its a detail of the
painting "North and South" by Anton von Werner (1843 - 1915).
Best regards
Gerhard
Blair (TC)
Based on your definition, pick one of the following.
=====================================
Postal Administration: Canada
Title: Queen Victoria
Denomination: 12d
Date of Issue: 14 June 1851
http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/ap/s/s000031k_a1.jpg
Based on a painting by Alfred Edward Chalon
Portrait engraved by Alfred Jones
Original Artwork: Alfred Edward Chalon,
"Queen Victoria", 1837
First definitive stamp showing portrait of a monarch
based on a painting.
=========================================
Postal Administration: Canada
Title: L'Abitation de Québecq
Denomination: 5¢
Date of Issue: 16 July 1908
http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/ap/s/s000154k.jpg
Designed by José Antonio Machado
Engraved by Elie Timothée Loizeaux
Based on a drawing by Samuel de Champlain
First commemorative of a historical event based on
a drawing of that period.
======================================
Postal Administration: Canada
Title: Confederation, 1867-1917
Denomination: 3¢
Date of Issue: 15 September 1917
http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/ap/s/s000199k.jpg
Based on a painting by Robert Harris
Engraved by Edwin H. Gunn
Original Artwork: Robert Harris,
"The Fathers of Confederation", 1883-1884
First commemorative of a historical event showing a
painting of the event.
======================================
Postal Administration: Canada
Title: Alaska Highway between Watson Lake and Nelson
Denomination: 8¢
Date of Issue: 8 February 1967
http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/ap/s/s000513k.jpg
Based on a painting by Alexander Young Jackson
Picture engraved by Allan Alexander Carswell
Lettering engraved by Gordon Mash
Designed by Rapid Grip and Batten Limited
Original Artwork: Alexander Young Jackson,
"Alaska Highway between Watson Lake and Nelson",
1943 , National Gallery of Canada, Ottawa, Ontario
First definitives to show Canadian paintings.
=======================================
Postal Administration: Canada
Title: Suzor-Côté, 1869-1937
Denomination: 50¢
Date of Issue: 14 March 1969
http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/ap/s/s000555k.jpg
Based on a painting by Marc-Aurèle de Foy Suzor-Côté
Original Artwork: Marc-Aurèle de Foy Suzor-Côté,
"Return from the Harvest Field", 1903
National Gallery of Canada, Ottawa, Ontario
First Canadian commemorative stamp issued to
commemorate a specific artist.
=========================================
Best Regards
Blair
Rodney
If the second hanging fails,
one gets a reprieve.
Pierre Courtiade
>> placed on Italian letters to signify the degree of urgency.
>> (ie the degree of punishment to the messenger for
>> delaying the message.) 8*)
>>
>> Blair
> Why a need for the third?
> If the second hanging fails,
> one gets a reprieve.
>
> Rodney
He he he !
Here you can see the superiority of the French system as opposed to the
British one : our guillotine never failed.
Thus, no need for any reprieve !
:-))))
To come back to the topic and to Mette's question : I think Didier
answered correctly for France (Lion of Belfort and Arc of Triumph
sculptures) : stamps issued in 1917.
But I prefer by far the French art series of the early 1960's mentioned
by Mette in her 1st post.
--
Pierre Courtiade
amesh
I like the Alaska Highway by Jackson, who was a member of The Group of
Seven. This stamp is in my collection, and I will add the technical details
to my website about Jackson.
L'Abitation de Québecq is a wonderful stamp!
Thanks, and
Best regards
Mette
"Blair (TC)" <stan...@sonetis.com> skrev i en meddelelse
news:1131587861.3...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
amesh
news:4372...@news.eftel.com...
>
> Well, for Australia, I'd guess..........
>
> A painting by Virgil Reilly shown on the front cover
> of Australia's favourite Womens magazine in 1939
> inspired Frank Manly for the 1940 Oz issues.
>
> The 3 servicemen shown in the painting, were killed during
> the war. The nurse is the artist's wife.
>
> All persons used in the stamp design survived the war.
>
> http://cjoint.com/data/ljxDYz30CL.htm
> apologies for poor example.
Nice commemorative with an interesting story.
Mette
amesh
Mette
"Gerhard Reichert" <dark...@arcor.de> skrev i en meddelelse
news:43729bcf$0$21944$9b4e...@newsread2.arcor-online.net...
Gerhard Reichert
if You found a picture of this painting, I would appreciate an Url for it.
The second art on stamps in Germany was Michel # 351 - 354, the welfare
issue of 1924,
with scenes of the living of St. Elisabeth, painted by Moritz von Schwind,
1804 - 1871. The same pictures were used for the very expensive block issue
1933, Michel # 508 -511.
The next one, I found, was Michel # 700, 1939, Picture of a Venice Lady by
Albrecht Dürer (1471 - 1528).
1944, Michel # 902 and 903 a piece of a goldsmith, the "Nautilusbecher" of
Dresden, made by Eberhard Quippe in the year 1689.
It´s interesting, really, I never before looked for this.
Have a fine day.
Gerhard
"amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:43731003$0$1838$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk...
amesh
en meddelelse news:437325a1$0$21952$9b4e...@newsread2.arcor-online.net...
> Hi again Mette,
>
> if You found a picture of this painting, I would appreciate an Url for it.
>
> The second art on stamps in Germany was Michel # 351 - 354, the welfare
> issue of 1924,
> with scenes of the living of St. Elisabeth, painted by Moritz von Schwind,
> 1804 - 1871. The same pictures were used for the very expensive block
> issue 1933, Michel # 508 -511.
>
> The next one, I found, was Michel # 700, 1939, Picture of a Venice Lady by
> Albrecht Dürer (1471 - 1528).
>
> 1944, Michel # 902 and 903 a piece of a goldsmith, the "Nautilusbecher" of
> Dresden, made by Eberhard Quippe in the year 1689.
>
> It´s interesting, really, I never before looked for this.
Hi again, Gerhard,
Sorry, I mixed up Germany with Deutsches Reich. It is from the
Bundesrepublik I have the images. At this moment I can only provide the
small thumbnails from my (ooold) Michel Germany 1997/98. I will look around
and see if it's possible to find proper images elsewhere.
BTW, I like that Nautilusbecher (#902-903) :-)
Mette
Dominique Stéphan
>
>>Hi Mette,
>>
>>every portrait on a stamp was made by an artist (painter, designer or
>>what ever), so every stamp needs a blueprint. Designing stamps is an act
>>of art.
>>
>>So the question should be specified, I think:
>>
>>If You define "art on stamps" as reproduction of an existing painting or
>>sculpture to honore the artwork, then it is easy to look for the first
>>stamp issue honoring an artist or his work.
>>
>>The Penny Black only honored Queen Victory as a living Majesty, not the
>>artwork of the designer of the portrait.
>>
>>The same with the French Ceres. This picture was used as a symbol, not to
>>reproduce an antique artwork. So in my humble opinion it is not an example
>>for "art on stamps".
>>
>
>
> Hi Gerhard,
> Personally I think it is a question of definition. However, I could think of
> a third definition: an artwork especially designed for the stamp format, and
> which is not an already existing artwork reproduced on stamps. Such stamps
> do exist, but they are not many. Out of the hat I can think of one
> Hundertwasser-stamp, and 1-2 of the recent Danish art stamps.
>
> I would like to hear other opinions :-)
Hello,
As pointed out by Gerhard, all stamps are somehow
art (well, a few exceptions exist, I don't think
Blue Boy qualifies as art). Well-known artists
(known for arts outside the stamp world) have
designed stamps, even definitive stamps (Jean
Cocteau made a Marianne for instance), and
most stamp artists also produce art.
So I see 2 ways to define Art on Stamp :
1) by the stamp subject : is it Art ?
The answer can generally be answered by yes or no.
For instance, all stamps designed by Decaris are not Art
on Stamp, but the one issued about Decaris is !
The Liberty by Delacroix is Art on Stamp when
reproduced in 1999, but is not when it's
the definitive set engraved by Gandon.
2) by the stamp illustration : is it Art ?
Well, you can make your opinion the large way (always
or so), or make some personal choices :
reproduction of existing art (so, if the painting is
done for the stamp, it's no more art ?), if the
art is from a "big" name, ... As it's a matter
of personal taste (or "expert" taste), you basically
have to decide what is art and what is not...
In this case, I don't see how to agree for the first "Art on Stamp"
stamp ! My personal taste would be the Black Penny,
as it's Art in many ways : reproduction of a
medal, great adaption to plane design, and
great engraving.
There is another way to see Art & Stamp, it's
to collect the actual art : original drawings
and also die proofs (when the dies are from the hand
of an engraver) are Art, not mere reproductions !
--
Regards
Dominique Stéphan
http://blog-philatelie.blogspot.com/ Mon blog philatélie
http://www.timbre-poste.com/ Timbres-poste d'usage courant
http://amisdemarianne.free.fr/ Cercle des Amis de Marianne
amesh
news:43734341$0$7337$636a...@news.free.fr...
> amesh a écrit:
>> "Gerhard Reichert" <gerhard.reichert.re...@arcor.de>
>> skrev i en meddelelse
>> news:4371e7d4$0$7428$9b4e...@newsread4.arcor-online.net...
It's quite interesting to see how differently collectors perceive "art". I
think that the answer to the original question, quoted from Topical Time,
boils down to that there is no given answer, and that any collector should
make his own definition. Personally I can accept the French stamps with the
Ceres-head as "art", since they reproduce an artwork of the mythological
figure. And I can also accept art designs specially made for the stamp
format by a recognized artist. But engravings are not "art on stamps" to me,
but rather philatelic art, which is quite different :-)
Mette
Blair (TC)
Just for my own curiousity....
Which of my picks would you define
as the first Canadian art stamp?
Blair
amesh
The Chalon painting of Queen Victoria.
Mette
Pierre Courtiade
>
> How about a swap ?
>
> I propose the FOUR pretty stamps of 1961 in exchange with the THREE
> ugly ones of 1917. Each of them MNH, of course.
;-)))
I never wrote the 1917 ones were ugly. I just prefer the 1961 (I should
have added "design").
BTW, the 1917 ones are still in my want list, even canceled.
--
All the best,
Pierre Courtiade
Dominique Stéphan
>>There is another way to see Art & Stamp, it's
>>to collect the actual art : original drawings
>>and also die proofs (when the dies are from the hand
>>of an engraver) are Art, not mere reproductions !
>
>
> It's quite interesting to see how differently collectors perceive "art". I
> think that the answer to the original question, quoted from Topical Time,
> boils down to that there is no given answer, and that any collector should
> make his own definition. Personally I can accept the French stamps with the
> Ceres-head as "art", since they reproduce an artwork of the mythological
> figure. And I can also accept art designs specially made for the stamp
> format by a recognized artist. But engravings are not "art on stamps" to me,
> but rather philatelic art, which is quite different :-)
Engraving (in general) is art. Stamp engraving is
"on order" art, but, well, a lot of art is "on order"
art, the Sixteen Vault (spelling ?) for instance !
Engraving art comes in the form of limited
print of original dies, so stamp proofs should
qualify.
The origin of the French Art Issues comes from
an artist (Cocteau I think) that asked the relevent
minister to make artistic stamps, but the minister
understood to make stamps about art, it is
quite different.
--
Cordialement
Rodney
when topics can fly off in tangents.
On reading William Finlay, "an illustrated history of stamp design"
he brings up the topic of Virgil Reilly's artwork, and suggests
he plagiarised the idea, from Fred Elliott's work on the 1900
Queensland "charity issue" of the Boer War.
http://cjoint.com/data/lkupteO85g.htm
(Just a FYI for any interested Australian student)
Rodney
........................and, the paintings by Wilhelm Pape (3 and 5 marks) ?
Rodney
paintings by J.V.Salgado.
It seems to me, that "Art Stamps" are one with the advent of "Pictorialism"
"Postal administrations woke up to realise that there were people
who were actually prepared to purchase stamps, not for the purpose
of posting letters, but to treasure in an album"
...William Finlay.
--
rodney at touch88.com.au
Send spam to the FTC at
sp...@uce.gov
Thanks, robots.
"amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> wrote in message news:4371c30c$0$141$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk...
| --
| Best regards
| Ann Mette Heindorff (Mette)
| http://arthistory.heindorffhus.dk
| ------
| Outgoing messages.checked with Norton AV
|
|
|
|
|
Gerhard Reichert
blame on me, or blame on Michel catalogue, because only the painting of
Anton von Werner is mentioned :-). History of art is not my business, really
:-).
Also Google gives me no answer, who the hell Wilhelm Pape is. :-)
But I am always ready to learn, if You have an internet website for me, I
swear I will have a look at it :-)
best regards
Gerhard
"Rodney" <rod...@touch88gum.com.au> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:4373a4e0$1...@news.eftel.com...
Rodney
the stamps in question belong to the same group as to
which you referred. (Von Werner)
I call them for convenience the "Reichspost set"
I queried you beause my simplified Gibbons does not indicate
if all were issued concurrently.
The Wilhelm Pape paintings are shown on the 3m and 5m values
and show "Unveiling of Kaiser Wilhem1 memorial" and
"25th anniv of German Empire address".
These stamps remain beyond my budget :)
Greetings from sunny Perth.
--
rodney at touch88.com.au
Send spam to the FTC at
sp...@uce.gov
Thanks, robots.
"Gerhard Reichert" <dark...@arcor.de> wrote in message news:4373c893$0$21955$9b4e...@newsread2.arcor-online.net...
Rodney
G'day Gerhard,
I agree, it is almost impossible to find anything
on Wilhelm Pape as a painter, on the net!
There is a brief reference to him here
http://www.muenster.de/~germania/info/info_en.html
The large format issues of 1, 2, 3, and 5 Mark, from
1920 also 1.25, 1.50, and 2.50 Mark were printed with
other designs; The Reichs Post Office in Berlin, An Allegory
'North and South' taken from the painting "Victoria" by A. von Werner,
the unvieling of the Kaiser Wilhelm Memorial in Berlin.
The 5 Mark value shows part of the painting
"Commemoration of the Foundation of the Reich in the
White Hall of the Berliner Schloß from a painting by W. Pape.
Rodney
As an aside, this is the first time I have encountered the
most curious expression
"Queen Victoria shown in her widow's weeds"
when referring to this stamp.
| http://cjoint.com/data/lkupteO85g.htm
We apparently stole that part of the English language
from the Germans.
Ryan Davenport
Canada Scott Nos. 46 & 47 are commonly referred to as the "Widow's
Weeds" stamps (both still missing from my Canada MNH collection,
unfortunately). 20c vermilion and 50c deep blue (second row on my
display, the links to the individual stamps are about 7000 characters
long, I think):
http://www.collectionscanada.ca/archivianet/020117/020117030102_e.html
And an article on the widow's weeds themselves - Victoria wore hers
from the death of Prince Albert (her first cousin!) in 1861 to her own
death in 1901.
http://www.mourningmatters.com/mourningmatters-article.html
And amazingly, this site lists her 997 direct descendants ....
http://www.btinternet.com/~allan_raymond/QV_Descendants_Statistics.htm
It can be difficult to compile such stats when a guy is both a
great-grandchild and a great-great-grandchild at the same time, through
various intertwinings of the family tree. Kind of like the old Lonzo &
Oscar tune, "I'm My Own Grandpa."
Ryan
Rodney
I like that 60's tune that focuses on the lady who only marries "Henrys"
the tune had the title "I'm Henry the 8th, I am"
further on the "weeds"
"Weeds" meaning "mourning clothes," on the other hand, comes from a very old
Germanic root meaning "clothing," and when this "weed" first appeared in English
around A.D. 888, it was used in the singular to mean simply "an article of clothing."
By about 1297, "weed" or "weeds" meant a style of clothing typical of an occupation
or station in life. One might speak of a priest's "weed" or a beggar's "weeds," for
instance. The phrase "widow's weeds," denoting the black veils and other
accoutrements of deep mourning, first appeared around 1595, and is the only use of
"weeds" in this sense still commonly heard in English.
Gerhard Reichert
thank You for the good information.
I asked the Berlin Museum of Art "Alte Nationalgalerie" for pictures of
these paintings and am still waiting for the answer.
Cordially
Gerhard
"Rodney" <rod...@touch88gum.com.au> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:4373f149$1...@news.eftel.com...
Victor Manta
by Blair:
http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/ap/s/s000031k_a1.jpg
BTW, the whole painting appeared in color, in 1988, on a miniature sheet
from New Zealand; see the bottom of my page (started 1997 - sorry for the
scans quality):
http://www.values.ch/history1.htm
--
Victor Manta
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Art on Stamps: http://www.values.ch/
Philatelic Webmasters Organization: http://www.pwmo.org/
Romania by Stamps: http://www.marci-postale.com/
Communism on Stamps: http://www.values.ch/communism/
Spanish North Africa: http://www.values.ch/sna-site/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Blair (TC)" <stan...@sonetis.com> wrote in message
news:1131587861.3...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
snip
Postal Administration: Canada
Title: Queen Victoria
Denomination: 12d
Date of Issue: 14 June 1851
http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/ap/s/s000031k_a1.jpg
Based on a painting by Alfred Edward Chalon
Portrait engraved by Alfred Jones
Original Artwork: Alfred Edward Chalon,
"Queen Victoria", 1837
First definitive stamp showing portrait of a monarch
based on a painting.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
amesh
news:3tlmj2F...@individual.net...
> Based on this thread, I conclude that the first Art Stamp is that
> mentioned by Blair:
>
> http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/ap/s/s000031k_a1.jpg
>
> BTW, the whole painting appeared in color, in 1988, on a miniature sheet
> from New Zealand; see the bottom of my page (started 1997 - sorry for the
> scans quality):
>
> http://www.values.ch/history1.htm
It is a very nice sheet. Is it possible that you could redo the scan to a
larger size and a better quality?
Mette
Blair (TC)
Helmut and Alison Gernsheim, in their book "The History of
Photography, 1685-1914" (New York, St. Louis and San
Francisco: McGraw-Hill Book Company, 1969), p. 118 relate:
"In the early days of daguerrotype portraiture, Queen Victoria
asked the fashionable miniature painter Alfred Chalon whether
he were not afraid that photography would ruin his profession,
'Ah, non, Madame', he replied in a mixture of French and English,
'photographie can't flatère'."
Originally published in "The Women at Home", London,
vol. VIII, 1897, p. 812.
Dominique Stéphan
That was before Photoshop ;-)
By the way, flatère is not a french word
as far as I know (flater is a verb).
And photography is definitly considered as Art.
Victor Manta
news:43763ba7$0$18068$626a...@news.free.fr...
> Blair (TC) a écrit:
>> There is an interesting story about Queen Victoria and Chalon.
>>
>> Helmut and Alison Gernsheim, in their book "The History of
>> Photography, 1685-1914" (New York, St. Louis and San
>> Francisco: McGraw-Hill Book Company, 1969), p. 118 relate:
>>
>> "In the early days of daguerrotype portraiture, Queen Victoria
>> asked the fashionable miniature painter Alfred Chalon whether
>> he were not afraid that photography would ruin his profession,
>> 'Ah, non, Madame', he replied in a mixture of French and English,
>> 'photographie can't flatère'."
>>
>> Originally published in "The Women at Home", London,
>> vol. VIII, 1897, p. 812.
>
> That was before Photoshop ;-)
>
> By the way, flatère is not a french word
> as far as I know (flater is a verb).
>
> And photography is definitly considered as Art.
Blair's source is:
http://aic.stanford.edu/jaic/articles/jaic24-02-004_appx.html
The Chalon brothers, both artists, were Swiss painter of French descent,
born in Geneva. Chalon's family were French Protestants who, like so many,
had fled persecution in France. They did not remain in Switzerland for a
long time but went to England.
http://www.nmm.ac.uk/mag/pages/mnuInDepth/Biography.cfm?biog=229
Because French was his native language, there is no reason to think that
Alfred Chalon himself made such a fault ("flatère" instead of "flater").
Possibly he was incorrectly cited or he used an older form of the word (what
I doubt).
As for photography, it isn't considered as being art by all thinkers.
--
Victor Manta
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
amesh
> "Dominique Stéphan" <news...@timbre-poste.com> wrote in message
> news:43763ba7$0$18068$626a...@news.free.fr...
- snip -
>
> As for photography, it isn't considered as being art by all thinkers.
Are *all* thinkers (philosophers) that categoric !?
I know who you are speaking about, and with whom I strongly disagree.
Could you name a few more, with references, please?
Mette
Victor Manta
> Are *all* thinkers (philosophers) that categoric !?
No, just some, me included :-)
> I know who you are speaking about, and with whom I strongly disagree.
We live in free countries, isn't it?
> Could you name a few more, with references, please?
I have answered at: "And photography is definitly considered as Art." My
intention was just to mention that there are disagreements. One example (and
you know already two :) should be sufficient. Sorry, momentarily I haven't
time for further research but maybe you can try on the Web.
Dominique Stéphan
>>as far as I know (flater is a verb).
>>
>>And photography is definitly considered as Art.
>
>
> Blair's source is:
> http://aic.stanford.edu/jaic/articles/jaic24-02-004_appx.html
>
> The Chalon brothers, both artists, were Swiss painter of French descent,
> born in Geneva. Chalon's family were French Protestants who, like so many,
> had fled persecution in France. They did not remain in Switzerland for a
> long time but went to England.
> http://www.nmm.ac.uk/mag/pages/mnuInDepth/Biography.cfm?biog=229
>
> Because French was his native language, there is no reason to think that
> Alfred Chalon himself made such a fault ("flatère" instead of "flater").
> Possibly he was incorrectly cited or he used an older form of the word (what
> I doubt).
"Flatère" look like "Flater" written in French like it's
pronounced in English, so it may be a wrong citation
(I didn't find flatère in dictionnaries, and it's
certainly "flater" that was intented).
> As for photography, it isn't considered as being art by all thinkers.
Well, if you define art as what is universally (and in all
period of history) thought as art, this will remove most
art since Impressionism (actually, most art as you'll
will always find someone that thinks art can only be
figurative and somone that thinks art can't be figurative).
amesh
> "amesh" <nob...@mail.dk> wrote in message
> news:43772a1c$0$1856$edfa...@dread11.news.tele.dk...
>> "Victor Manta" <manvic_...@yahoo.com> skrev i en meddelelse
>> news:3tohn1F...@individual.net...
>>>
>>> As for photography, it isn't considered as being art by all thinkers.
>
>> Are *all* thinkers (philosophers) that categoric !?
>
> No, just some, me included :-)
Are you a philosopher?
>
>> I know who you are speaking about, and with whom I strongly disagree.
>
> We live in free countries, isn't it?
Absolutely, that's one of the reasons I take the liberty to express
disagreement ;-)
>
>> Could you name a few more, with references, please?
>
> I have answered at: "And photography is definitly considered as Art." My
> intention was just to mention that there are disagreements. One example
> (and you know already two :) should be sufficient. Sorry, momentarily I
> haven't time for further research but maybe you can try on the Web.
No. Since it is you who brought up the statement about "all thinkers", it is
you who should justify further :-)
Mette