Ancient coins. Where to start?
varois83
I was wondering where one should start to collect ancient coins (Low
end ones). I don't want to become an expert on the subject, just know
the basics.
I just got a coin from India in a lot, it cost me only $2.00, it is a
bull/horse coin from the Shahi dynasty. The coin is of course heavily
circulated but I still like it.
How can some of these ancient coins be so cheap?
If you could recommend some sites/books that teach the basics of
ancient coins collecting, I would appreciate it. Also what to watch
out for as far as scams.
Thanks a lot
Patrick
Peter
There is a lot to learn and I know very little of it. I recommend a
connection with the Oriental Numismatic Society, in case you find that
convenient. They seem to be a particularly knowledgeable group and
learning from lectures and personal contact is sometimes the easiest.
http://www.onsnumis.org/
Seaby publishes guides for Greek and Roman coins that are highly
regarded by some.
The International Numismatic Convention in NYC in January has a wide
selection of ancient coins from all over the world and it is possible
to find folks that want to talk with visitors, there.
Why are coins so cheap? Well, some are not. Even so, there are far
more old coins than there are collectors.
Counterfeits and other scams are easily found, if not found out.
There are a lot of clever folks that want to make more money and
counterfeiting coins is not extremely difficult, especially when the
prevailing wages are tiny and some coins are extremely expensive.
Mike Marotta
> end ones). I don't want to become an expert on the subject, just know
> the basics.
Like any other area, it is up to you. Traditionally, we start with
ancient history. That provides the context, the story that truly
gives the coins value. The books of Michael Grant on Greek and Roman
history are authoritative and readable.
But it is perfectly valid to get a coin as you did and then do the
research on that. You see a coin in a junk box and you want to know
who struck it, when, and why. If you go to a larger show or
convention (state, regional or ANA) you can find dealers with $5 to
$25 items. (Avoid eBay; too many fakes. ANA dealers are bound by a
Code of Ethics.) You already know the dynasty, so you have a start.
The internet is rich but your local librarian can help you find other
resources. Books by Colin Kraay, Harold Mattingly, Martin Jessop
Price, are among the basic resources for all. They have great
pictures, nice narratives, and status in the eyes of both the
collector community and among academics.
If you are interested in the numismatics, the collecting of it, apart
from the history (strange as that may sound), then the books by WAYNE
SAYLES published by Krause are widely considered to be a good starting
place. His series ANCIENT COIN COLLECTING in six volumes goes from a
general overview through the Greeks, Romans, and Others.
If you want to view pictures of coins, the Wildwinds site
(www.wildwinds.com) and Coin Archives (www.coinarchives.com) are
databases built from auctions by reputable firms. The dealer ring
VCOINS wwww.vcoins.com is another running database, but you need to
know a bit in order to Search for Keywords.
FORVM Ancient Coins www.forumancientcoins.com is widely regarded as
helpful, friendly, open, reputable and authoritative. FORVM grants
awards to other websites and its laurels are highly valued.
Do you have any affinity for any time and place in the ancient world?
My introduction to ancients came from the episode "Backbone of the
Night" of Carl Sagan's COSMOS. I built a collection based on a day's
wages from the towns of the lifetimes of famous philosophers from
Thales of Miletus to Hypatia of Alexandria. But I also just published
an article on the times of medieval Champagne, the county in which is
the town of Troyes whose Great Fairs gave us "troy" ounces for
precious metals.
Mike M.
Michael E. Marotta
"Semper vale et salve"
Reid Goldsborough
eBay is a great way to get similar bargains on inexpensive coins as the
lot you bought. Many reputable dealers sell on eBay. But many
counterfeit scammers do too. The above Web site can help you differentiate.
--
Consumer: http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Connoisseur: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Counterfeit: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
part...@yahoo.com
Hi Patrick,
The responses so far in this thread have lost of good advice. I would
especially amplify the recommendations of Wayne Sayles' books
(especially Volume I, the general introductory guide) and of the
various coin dealers on the Vcoins.com website. Ebay can sometimes
be a good place to find coins, but it can also be a good place to get
scammed- you should probably avoid it for now. (I seldom buy coin on
eBay anymore.)
How can (some) ancient coins be so cheap? It all comes down to supply
and demand. Huge amounts of coins were struck, and since they were
made of metal many have survived to the present. Although collecting
of ancient coins has increased in popularity in the last couple of
decades, it is still a relatively "niche" area of numismatics, so
common coins can remain relatively cheap, while even rarities are
often less expensive than comparably scarce coins would be in US coins
or other popular series.
Avoiding scams- that is too big a topic to cover adequately. Your
best defense is to only buy from reputable dealers- Vcoins is a good
place to start. Avoid eBay, at least until you know a lot more about
ancient coins. Oh, and if you are on vacation at a tourist spot near
ancient ruins and some shady character offers to sell you "real
ancient coins"- they are almost certainly selling you badly-made
fakes. I have not encountered such peddlers myself, but I had to
disillusion a friend whose grandfather fell for such a scam. As you
examine more real ancient coins, you will get a better feel for them
and have an easier time of spotting fakes. There are also various
books and websites on the subject- Sayles' "Classical Deception" is a
useful start.
You might want to think about what attracts you to ancient coins, so
you can have a more focused collecting strategy. Are there particular
countries/regions or time periods that you find interesting? Is
there a particular artistic style you like? Are there subjects
(animals, weapons, etc.) that you want to collect? You don't have to
make a decision now, but as your collection grows it's good to
consider such questions. Hope this helps, please come back with any
further questions.
-Robert A. DeRose, Jr.
part...@yahoo.com
wrote:
> parthi...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > Avoid eBay, at least until you know a lot more about
> > ancient coins.
>
> dealers you know or who are recommended by reliable sources. ... When a dealer sells elsewhere along with
> eBay, eBay is typically the place where he sells his bargain coins, just
> the kind of coins this poster was asking about. [snip]
True, there is nothing about eBay that would suddenly make good
sellers turn untrustworthy. My point was that a complete novice is
not likely to know which sellers on eBay are knowledgeable and
reputable in the ancients world, and which are not. Anyone can set up
on eBay with a name like The Ancient Experts, and to a novice that
seems at least as impressive as Harlan J. Berk. Sites like Vcoins
help with that initial sorting process. Of course, once you've found
a good seller, their eBay auctions can represent a worthwhile source
of coins. Your point about eBay being a place where some big-time
sellers may put their bargain coins is a good one, though searching on
Vcoins itself turns up a number of pieces in the under $20, and even
under $10, range. I will therefore modify my advice to read "Avoid
unknown sellers on eBay."
Side note: Any other ancients fans received CNG's Triton XIII catalog
(or browsed it on the website)? I've been spending much of the past
few days quietly drooling over the Parthian collection up for sale,
and wondering how many kidneys I can sell so I can buy some of those
coins...
-Robert A. DeRose, Jr.
Reid Goldsborough
> Side note: Any other ancients fans received CNG's Triton XIII catalog
> (or browsed it on the website)? I've been spending much of the past
> few days quietly drooling over the Parthian collection up for sale,
> and wondering how many kidneys I can sell so I can buy some of those
> coins...
Stay away from that Athenian dek, though. <g>
varois83
I want to thank everybody for their answers. I have bookmarked all the
links and they have a ton of info, that should keep me busy for a
while.
Thanks again
Patrick
j-rod
Reid Goldsborough
> Has anyone mentioned The Celator yet?
>
> http://www.celator.com/
The Celator is a great magazine, but it's probably not the best place to
start for beginners. Most articles and columns in the Celator assume
basic knowledge. It makes sense to subscribe to the Celator after you've
read at least the first volume of Sayles or a similar intro book.