Lion dollars
Reid Goldsborough
one:
http://home.comcast.net/~reidgold/misc/Lion_dollar_o.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~reidgold/misc/Lion_dollar_r.jpg
The seller wasn't clear on its attribution. Is it a piece dated 1576
from Holland, Davenport 8838, Delmonte 831?
The seller described it as a coin minted in 1576, saying this was the
first year these were minted, according to Delmonte (correct?). But
then the seller said the obverse legend reads MO · NO · ARG · 16 76 ·
ORDIN · HOL.
The "16 76" may be a typo. Anybody know if the 1576 date, Holland,
Davenport 8838, and Delmonte 831 are correct? Thanks!
Harold Fears
: MO · NO · ARG · 15 76 ·ORDIN · HOL.
The digit 5 is weak in the picture, but I can make it out.
Anyway, the 1676 is just a typo.
Harold
"Reid Goldsborough" <reidgold...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:7b02d5e8-08a8-4881...@w1g2000prk.googlegroups.com...
Arizona Coin Collector
"Reid Goldsborough" <reidgold...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:7b02d5e8-08a8-4881...@w1g2000prk.googlegroups.com...
http://home.comcast.net/~reidgold/misc/Lion_dollar_o.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~reidgold/misc/Lion_dollar_r.jpg
---------------------------------------------
Hello
I hope this helps.
http://www.coins.nd.edu/ColCoin/ColCoinIntros/Lion-Dollar.intro.html
.
Nick Knight
01/18/2009
>The seller described it as a coin minted in 1576, saying this was the first
>year these were minted, according to Delmonte (correct?). But then the
>seller said the obverse legend reads MO · NO · ARG · 16 76 · ORDIN · HOL.
>The "16 76" may be a typo. Anybody know if the 1576 date, Holland,
>Davenport 8838, and Delmonte 831 are correct? Thanks!
It's hard to see the date in the picture, but all the other info, and the
image itself, looks just like the ~1576 Lion Daaler in Davenport. Here's a
bad picture of my Davenport European Crowns 1484-1600. Sorry, the pages is
a tiny bit wavy from a little water damage, but that's the book I ended up
with, and it works for me :)
http://www.mr2ice.com/coins/LionDaaler.jpg
I'll also point out that, while I didn't TRY to get any of D-8837's
description in the pic, I did. You can see from the text that Davenport
claims this is also a Lion Daaler, but it's dated 1575 and the bust is quite
different than yours. There is still a lion on the reverse. If you're
interested, I can get that in a picture, too. Tomorrow ... I've already
disconnected the camera and put it away.
The last date in the 8838 description line is 1598 (cut off in the pic).
What's the actual title for "Delmonte"?? I don't see it on my shelf ... do
I need to hunt for another book??!!! I've got all sorts of more-obscure
Taler/Crown references, but they don't get opened.
Nick
Jeff
Dutch. There is also a separate book on the gold coins. Davenport does
not list all the varities and types that Delmonte does. There is also a
supplement put out about 10 years ago on new varieties and types that
have been discovered.
Cheers,
jeff
http://www.klippes.com
Nick Knight
>The Silver Benelux by Albert Delmonte written in English, French and
>Dutch. There is also a separate book on the gold coins. Davenport does
>not list all the varities and types that Delmonte does. There is also a
>supplement put out about 10 years ago on new varieties and types that
>have been discovered.
Thanks, Jeff. The answer is then "yes", there is another book I need to
acquire. Well, a book and a supplement. I've never been able to jump the
purchase-and-keep hurdle with gold coins and I don't think I'm ever going
to. So, I'll just look for the silver-centric books.
Nick
Nick Knight
>>The Silver Benelux by Albert Delmonte written in English, French and
>>Dutch. There is also a separate book on the gold coins. Davenport does
>>not list all the varities and types that Delmonte does. There is also a
>>supplement put out about 10 years ago on new varieties and types that
>>have been discovered.
>Thanks, Jeff. The answer is then "yes", there is another book I need to
>acquire. Well, a book and a supplement. I've never been able to jump the
>purchase-and-keep hurdle with gold coins and I don't think I'm ever going
>to. So, I'll just look for the silver-centric books.
Wow. The claim is that these books are "hard to find". I did, however,
find enough copies to argue differently. But these copies aren't cheap!
Seems an average of about $200, for a book published in 1967. The scope is
not just talers, but silver coins of Holland (and perhaps surrounding
areas?).
Anyone have more info on the "supplement"? Specific title, author/publisher
and date would be handy.
Thanks in advance,
Nick
Reid Goldsborough
> It's hard to see the date in the picture, but all the other info, and the
> image itself, looks just like the ~1576 Lion Daaler in Davenport. Here's a
> bad picture of my Davenport European Crowns 1484-1600. Sorry, the pages is
> a tiny bit wavy from a little water damage, but that's the book I ended up
> with, and it works for me :)
>
> http://www.mr2ice.com/coins/LionDaaler.jpg
Thanks for the pic. You're far further along than me with these,
though I now have two and find these lion dollars really appealing,
big, very big, silver coins, often rough, and used to support a little
known, long gone, yet very interesting world empire, that of the
Dutch. One of mine is a 16th century coin, the other a 17th century
coin, and I suppose (if they're common enough) I'll add to this an
18th century lion dollar.
I'm doing a little set of Age of Exploration trade coins, these Dutch
coins plus Austrian Maria Theresa talers plus Spanish American pieces
of eight, all far more interesting to me than U.S. trade dollars,
which were minted for circulation for about an eyeblink.
So, is it correct that 1575 was the first year that Dutch lion dollars/
lion daalders/ leeuwendaalders were minted? Or was it 1576? Delmonte,
according to this eBay seller anyway, says 1576. Louis Jordan says
1575. Davenport seems to indicate 1575 as well, though you say it's a
different design. That's probably what's behind the differing views.
--
Consumer: http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Connoisseur: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Counterfeit: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
Nick Knight
01/24/2009
>So, is it correct that 1575 was the first year that Dutch lion dollars/
>lion daalders/ leeuwendaalders were minted? Or was it 1576? Delmonte,
>according to this eBay seller anyway, says 1576. Louis Jordan says 1575.
>Davenport seems to indicate 1575 as well, though you say it's a different
>design. That's probably what's behind the differing views.
I've taken another picture, expanding the area in the image:
http://www.mr2ice.com/coins/LionDaaler2.jpg
While the 1575 coin obverse is much different than yours, it is labeled by
Davenport as a Lion Daaler and looks like a same/similar reverse to yours.
IOW, I see about the same lion. I would, personally, argue against the
suggestion that the type in question was "the first". But you can look at
the images and make up your own mind.
Nick
Nick Knight
01/24/2009
at 11:58 AM, Reid Goldsborough <reidgold...@yahoo.com> said:
>So, is it correct that 1575 was the first year that Dutch lion dollars/
>lion daalders/ leeuwendaalders were minted? Or was it 1576? Delmonte,
>according to this eBay seller anyway, says 1576. Louis Jordan says 1575.
>Davenport seems to indicate 1575 as well, though you say it's a different
>design. That's probably what's behind the differing views.
Somehow (ok, ok, I googled :) I found a website that referenced these coins.
It wasn't apparent from the start page, but google honed in on this:
http://lakdiva.org/coins/dutch/dutch_ceilon.html
He has some ancient stuff mixed in if you go up a directory or 2, I believe
these are from the Indian area.
Just an FYI. I collect interesting coin websites, too, so I added this one
to my collection :)
Nick
Reid Goldsborough
> Just an FYI. I collect interesting coin websites, too, so I added this one
> to my collection :)
Yep, me too. I also collect articles and last night put in another
photocopy request to the ANA. I alternate between that and going to
the ANS. Collecting articles and other information can be as much fun
as collecting coins.