Pro-PCGS posts
Reid Goldsborough
This follows a fair amount of posts by real posters that shed negative
light on PCGS.
These posts discussed a judge tossing out PCGS's lawsuit against alleged
coin doctors, with the take-home message that it's PCGS's job to spot
coin doctoring in the first place, and a coin dealer who committed
suicide apparently being the recipient of negative posts on PCGS's
boards and PCGS then allegedly removing these posts from its site.
Anybody think there's any possibility that these three pro-PCGS
anonymous first-time posters aren't the work of PCGS's PR firm or
otherwise connected to PCGS? Anybody think that these posts don't make
PCGS look even worse?
PCGS is the top coin grading firm in the U.S., judging by popularity and
prices realized for coins it grades. It can do better than this nonsense.
Where's Ira, a real person, to defend PCGS when you need him?
--
Consumer: http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Connoisseur: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Counterfeit: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
Jason Burke
> Three anonymous first-time posters to RCC just post pro-PCGS messages.
> This follows a fair amount of posts by real posters that shed negative
> light on PCGS.
>
> These posts discussed a judge tossing out PCGS's lawsuit against alleged
> coin doctors, with the take-home message that it's PCGS's job to spot
> coin doctoring in the first place, and a coin dealer who committed
> suicide apparently being the recipient of negative posts on PCGS's
> boards and PCGS then allegedly removing these posts from its site.
>
> Anybody think there's any possibility that these three pro-PCGS
> anonymous first-time posters aren't the work of PCGS's PR firm or
> otherwise connected to PCGS? Anybody think that these posts don't make
> PCGS look even worse?
>
> PCGS is the top coin grading firm in the U.S., judging by popularity and
> prices realized for coins it grades. It can do better than this nonsense.
>
> Where's Ira, a real person, to defend PCGS when you need him?
>
For what it's worth, I dumped my CLCT stock - hard - yesterday.
Frank Provasek
brewing AGAINST PCGS on behalf of coin buyers who feel they were
harmed by failure of PCGS to buy back supposedly problem coins.
Troy
news:b522380a-629e-4c0d...@t35g2000yqj.googlegroups.com...
Just ambulance chasers. Don't forget that even a new fresh out of law school
attorney has to win his first case sometime, not to mention that even the
attorney that graduated lowest in his class and just barely passed the bar
exam is still called an attorney. I don't think PCGS has anything to worry
about. These people are scum.
RYK
customer service gaffe, and blunder that has ever occurred at PCGS has been
reported, often ad nauseum and on multiple occasions, on this forum. Over
the last nearly 8 years, I cannot remember a single collector complaining
that PCGS did not treat him/her fairly on the grade guarantee. If anything,
the few that have had issues have been ebullient in their praise for how
they were treated.
RYK
action lawsuit.
-----
Many of you have seen the ad in Coin World from two lawyers seeking clients
for a class action lawsuit regarding the PCGS grading guarantee.
Just so you know.
The firm, Jackson & Stephenson, is also representing Greg Krill and Tangible
Assets in a lawsuit regarding some coins we are holding that we think are
part of the doctoring lawsuit. Tangible Investments is a company owned or
somehow associated with Silvano DiGenova, I'm not usre of the exact
relationship. Jackson & Stephenson are also listed as an associate firm (or
something like that) in the major coin doctoring lawsuit. And Greg Krill and
Silvano DiGenova are defendants in the coin doctoring lawsuit.
Mark Stephenson did undergraduate work at UCLA and got his law degree from
South Western law school. Dorian Jackson did his undergraduate at UCLA and
got his law degree from Loyola. They both were admitted to the California
Bar in June, 2010.
homerunhall
TheBigOne
"RYK" <R...@pcgs.com> wrote in message news:ifoqo2$vme$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
Reid Goldsborough
What do you think? Are these three just-arrived anonymous posters who
are posting pro-PCGS spin, or maybe one poster with three email
addresses, a part of a PR firm retained by PCGS? Or are they PCGS employees?
If a PR firm, PCGS should fire the firm. PCGS isn't being represented
professionally. If they're part of PCGS and they're doing this on their
own, they should be reprimanded. If this is an official in-house PCGS
effort, shame. I don't see it as the work of three coin collectors who
just happen to like PCGS, which is the pretense.
In any case, it's not working, and it can't possibly work the way it's
being carried out.
Jason Burke
> On 1/1/2011 8:44 PM, Frank Provasek wrote:
>> According to this ad in coin publications, there seems to be a lawsuit
>> brewing AGAINST PCGS on behalf of coin buyers who feel they were
>> harmed by failure of PCGS to buy back supposedly problem coins.
>>
>> http://www.earlyus.com/coinforum/junk1101.jpg
>
> What do you think? Are these three just-arrived anonymous posters who
> are posting pro-PCGS spin, or maybe one poster with three email
> addresses, a part of a PR firm retained by PCGS? Or are they PCGS
> employees?
>
> If a PR firm, PCGS should fire the firm. PCGS isn't being represented
> professionally. If they're part of PCGS and they're doing this on their
> own, they should be reprimanded. If this is an official in-house PCGS
> effort, shame. I don't see it as the work of three coin collectors who
> just happen to like PCGS, which is the pretense.
>
> In any case, it's not working, and it can't possibly work the way it's
> being carried out.
>
It's my feeling that they just happen to be three non-PCGS posters. I
might be wrong, but I doubt PCGS would do something that
bite-yourself-in-the-assish.
Nick Knight
>What do you think? Are these three just-arrived anonymous posters who are
>posting pro-PCGS spin, or maybe one poster with three email addresses, a
>part of a PR firm retained by PCGS? Or are they PCGS employees?
All three new posters are posting from the same news server, with the same
NNTP posting host headers using identical versions of Outlook. And all with
the same unnatural super-positive attitude. Personally, I don't care much
about the topic, but this seems like a one-person mission to me.
>Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
>Message-ID: <ifoqo2$vme$1...@speranza.aioe.org>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: Zoc24BAheab7StuiH2wMVw.user.speranza.aioe.org
>X-Complaints-To: ab...@aioe.org
>X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994
>X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.8.2
>X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931
Nick
Michael Benveniste
> What do you think? Are these three just-arrived anonymous posters who are
> posting pro-PCGS spin, or maybe one poster with three email addresses, a
> part of a PR firm retained by PCGS? Or are they PCGS employees?
I think that Usenet is such an internet backwater that neither
PCGS nor a PCGS hired PR firm would bother with such an effort.
If this is sock-puppetry, and such tactics aren’t exactly unknown
here, then I would guess it’s the work of a single, unpaid, troll.
--
Mike Benveniste -- m...@murkyether.com (Clarification Required)
Its name is Public opinion. It is held in reverence. It settles
everything. Some think it is the voice of God. -- Mark Twain
Reid Goldsborough
> I think that Usenet is such an internet backwater that neither
> PCGS nor a PCGS hired PR firm would bother with such an effort.
If you do a Google search, by far the most common type of Internet
search for some years now, Usenet posts, including recent ones, will
show up. Google is one of the tools that PR firms doing "reputation
management" use. And just as individuals do "vanity searches" in Google
-- typing in their names -- I have no doubt that companies do this as well.
So what people are saying here in this newsgroup is without question
known to PCGS ... if they do what a fair amount of other companies do
and try to manage their reputations online or hire people to do this.
Bottom line is that though we can't know with certainty that they're
doing this, it's unreasonable to conclude that PCGS or anybody they hire
wouldn't possibly bother with what's being said about them here.
Beanie
"Reid Goldsborough" <reidgol...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4bl66u....@news.alt.net...
> Three anonymous first-time posters to RCC just post pro-PCGS messages. This
> follows a fair amount of posts by real posters that shed negative light on
> PCGS.
>
> These posts discussed a judge tossing out PCGS's lawsuit against alleged coin
> doctors, with the take-home message that it's PCGS's job to spot coin
> doctoring in the first place, and a coin dealer who committed suicide
> apparently being the recipient of negative posts on PCGS's boards and PCGS
> then allegedly removing these posts from its site.
>
> Anybody think there's any possibility that these three pro-PCGS anonymous
> first-time posters aren't the work of PCGS's PR firm or otherwise connected to
> PCGS? Anybody think that these posts don't make PCGS look even worse?
>
> PCGS is the top coin grading firm in the U.S., judging by popularity and
> prices realized for coins it grades. It can do better than this nonsense.
>
> Where's Ira, a real person, to defend PCGS when you need him?
I think it extremely unlikely that PCGS or its minions made those posts.
My view on the PCGS suit is that PCGS dropped the ball, didn't spot the doctored
coins and is responsible for honoring their buyback guaranty.
tony cooper
<reidgol...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On 1/2/2011 8:00 AM, Michael Benveniste wrote:
>> I think that Usenet is such an internet backwater that neither
>> PCGS nor a PCGS hired PR firm would bother with such an effort.
>
>If you do a Google search, by far the most common type of Internet
>search for some years now, Usenet posts, including recent ones, will
>show up. Google is one of the tools that PR firms doing "reputation
>management" use. And just as individuals do "vanity searches" in Google
>-- typing in their names -- I have no doubt that companies do this as well.
>
>So what people are saying here in this newsgroup is without question
>known to PCGS ... if they do what a fair amount of other companies do
>and try to manage their reputations online or hire people to do this.
>Bottom line is that though we can't know with certainty that they're
>doing this, it's unreasonable to conclude that PCGS or anybody they hire
>wouldn't possibly bother with what's being said about them here.
Both Adorama and B&H Photo - the major players in online camera
equipment sales - monitor the photographic newsgroups. Each has a
designated person to do this and post responses and comments where
appropriate. They sign their real names and company affiliation to
the posts. They don't post frequently, but they do post when serious
issues need clarification.
Examples recently have been on what "gray market" cameras they sell
and the issue of high shipping charges to Canadian buyers.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
Frank Provasek
disallowal of coins
graded by Larry Briggs' SEGS, by a first-time poster.
> And who put the idea in this guy's head that SEGS is 'highly respected
> in the coin business." I only know of junk coin dealers using the
> service and the vast majority of respected dealers in the hobby won't
> touch there stuff. There product, according to most in the hobby, is
> not market acceptible. They apparently don't guarantee their coins,
> which along with several other services, was the basis of removing
> them from ebay.
Posted from 65.196.179.50, which is listed to
65.196.179.50 UNITED STATES FLORIDA SARASOTA
NUMISMATIC GUARANTY CORP NGCCOIN.COM
NGC claimed they had fired the person responsible for the posting.
Reid Goldsborough
> I think it extremely unlikely that PCGS or its minions made those posts.
I've read nothing to suggest that there's any likelihood that what
appears to be one poster posting pro-PCGS spin anonymously from three
accounts is a coin collector without any fiduciary connection to PCGS.
Look at how he's kowtowing to David Hall personally. One post says
hooray for David Hall and calls him a genius. Another calls him "David
'Home Run' Hall." It strains credibility in the extreme to believe that
an independent person would kiss up this way.
The person or PR firm behind this isn't improving PCGS's image but doing
the reverse, making PCGS look bad.
Beanie
Absent any proof (other than your conjecture) that PCGS is responsible, I'll
continue to presume them to be innocent.
"Reid Goldsborough" <reidgol...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4bnfup....@news.alt.net...
Ed. Stoebenau
<reidgol...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Three anonymous first-time posters to RCC just post pro-PCGS messages.
>This follows a fair amount of posts by real posters that shed negative
>light on PCGS.
>
>These posts discussed a judge tossing out PCGS's lawsuit against alleged
>coin doctors, with the take-home message that it's PCGS's job to spot
>coin doctoring in the first place, and a coin dealer who committed
>suicide apparently being the recipient of negative posts on PCGS's
>boards and PCGS then allegedly removing these posts from its site.
>
>Anybody think there's any possibility that these three pro-PCGS
>anonymous first-time posters aren't the work of PCGS's PR firm or
>otherwise connected to PCGS? Anybody think that these posts don't make
>PCGS look even worse?
>
>PCGS is the top coin grading firm in the U.S., judging by popularity and
>prices realized for coins it grades. It can do better than this nonsense.
>
>Where's Ira, a real person, to defend PCGS when you need him?
Let's see if I remember how to do this posting thing.
One of the recent posters goes by "RYK", also the alias of a well
known poster on the PCGS forums. I have talked to him about
these posts, and he says about r.c.c "No, I have not visited for
at least 3 or 4 years."
The initial post was one he had made on the PCGS forums (though I
should see if there has been any editing), but thus obviously not
re-posted by him. We can thus be sure that posts made by "RYK"
on this thread are not from the real RYK.
--
Ed. Stoebenau
a #143
Reid Goldsborough
> You are asking folks to disprove a negative.
> Absent any proof (other than your conjecture) that PCGS is responsible, I'll
> continue to presume them to be innocent.
I agree with you completely that there's no proof -- in one way or
another. I also agree, when it comes to the legal system, in the U.S. at
least, that you're innocent until proven guilty. But these are criminal
standards, and this isn't a legal case.
I base what I've said not on a legal burden of proof but on logic and
the evidence at hand. This again suggests, emphasis on suggests, that
someone connected in some way to PCGS, the top grading service in the
U.S., and its parent company Collectors Universe is posting these
cloying accolades about the president of Collectors Universe. If the
person doing these postings were an independent collector, it's only
logical to presume that the praise would have been directed toward the
service, not the head honcho like it was.
I mentioned earlier a well-known dealer who used to post here. He was a
heavy user of PCGS, presumably using it to help generate income, as many
dealers do, buying what he regarded as undergraded coins and getting
them into PCGS holders to sell at profit. Nothing wrong with this, part
of the industry and hobby. As I recall he defended PCGS, and vigorously,
any time someone even suggested anything negative about PCGS. Even he,
however, never heaped plaudits like this on this one individual.
I'm not in any way saying these plaudits to David Hall aren't deserved,
or that they are deserved. I'm instead speaking of the circumstances
surrounding them appearing the way they have here.
So, I guess I'll have to agree to disagree with you about this.
Beanie
> So, I guess I'll have to agree to disagree with you about this.
You seldom seem to be in agreement with anyone.
Reid Goldsborough
> You seldom seem to be in agreement with anyone.
I agree with everyone, every single person, every single time, when I
think they're right. I disagree with myself, admit a mistake, change a
position, every single time I think I'm wrong.
j-rod
My sentiments were contained in my reply to the first one I read.
It seems obvious to me it's someone working for PCGS or heavily invested
in coins certified by PCGS.
JAM