belay loop: your opinion
agedest
of differing judgement and practice. They did not trust the belay
loop for rappelling down, and had the carabiners through the belly
harness too. I watched the second fellow tie in. With all that
thick, stiff webbing already in the 'biner, plus the stiff retainer
cable for the device, the rope would barely fit, and the gate would
barely open enough anyway. But he jammed and tugged and twisted until
he was finally rigged to go.
To me, the assurance that "the belay loop is the strongest part of the
harness" is enough. The belay loop is already through both harness
parts, so why does putting the carabiner through them improve
anything? Doing that makes the carabiner ninety degrees rotated from
the position in the belay loop, meaning the belay device is rotated
also. I've read one comment that the carabiner will also be taking
"three-point stress" if put through the harnesses, which is like cross-
loading for being risky, meaning it is worse than using the belay loop
which is flexible.
What do you do, and why?
-
Al Black
> What do you do, and why?
Read and follow the manufactures instructions. Those instructions are
based on equipments design and testing.
I'd recommend you do the same with all your gear.
al
Eugene Miya
Al Black <al-b...@notthis.telus.net> wrote:
>On Thu, 08 May 2008 18:42:12 -0700, agedest wrote:
>> What do you do, and why?
>
>Read and follow the manufactures instructions. Those instructions are
>
>I'd recommend you do the same with all your gear.
Murray and I and others still do hip belays. No gear needed.
Well Murray may on occasion use a plate. I certainly know how to use
a plate or a Munter hitch.
What do you do if you lose a plate?
--
Al Black
> In article <k7SUj.1570$KB3.837@edtnps91>, Al Black
> Murray and I and others still do hip belays. No gear needed. Well
> Murray may on occasion use a plate. I certainly know how to use a plate
> or a Munter hitch.
No doubt a hip belay is useful esp. on that scrambly 4th-5th terrain.
That hip belay shows your Sierra Club heritage Eugene:-)
> What do you do if you lose a plate?
Mumble, lisp, and sound like grandpa. Oh you mean when climbing?
Mumble, list, Munter and/or biner brake.
al
Eugene Miya
Al Black <al-b...@notthis.telus.net> wrote:
>On Fri, 09 May 2008 13:36:20 -0800, Eugene Miya wrote:
>> Murray and I and others still do hip belays. No gear needed. Well
>> Murray may on occasion use a plate. I certainly know how to use a plate
>> or a Munter hitch.
>
>No doubt a hip belay is useful esp. on that scrambly 4th-5th terrain.
>That hip belay shows your Sierra Club heritage Eugene:-)
I think the Eastern Trade also used them before Sticht plates came to
the USA. That would be parts of the AMC, the HMC, and what every groups
existed.
>> What do you do if you lose a plate?
>
>Mumble, lisp, and sound like grandpa. Oh you mean when climbing?
>Mumble, list, Munter and/or biner brake.
I remember the first time I read some climbing maggazine and the guys of
the new generation doing some route in Pakistan dropping their plates,
and then having to figure something out.
--
David Kastrup
> In article <k7SUj.1570$KB3.837@edtnps91>,
> Al Black <al-b...@notthis.telus.net> wrote:
>>On Thu, 08 May 2008 18:42:12 -0700, agedest wrote:
>>> What do you do, and why?
>>
>>Read and follow the manufactures instructions. Those instructions are
>>based on equipment design and testing.
>>
>>I'd recommend you do the same with all your gear.
>
> Murray and I and others still do hip belays.
Who manufactured your hip?
--
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum
Hal Murray
>>>Read and follow the manufactures instructions. Those instructions are
>>>based on equipment design and testing.
>>>
>>>I'd recommend you do the same with all your gear.
>>
>> Murray and I and others still do hip belays.
>
>Who manufactured your hip?
My parents. Maybe my mother did all the production work and my father
just helped with the design.
--
These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's. I hate spam.
David Kastrup
>>>>Read and follow the manufactures instructions. Those instructions are
>>>>based on equipment design and testing.
>>>>
>>>>I'd recommend you do the same with all your gear.
>>>
>>> Murray and I and others still do hip belays.
>>
>>Who manufactured your hip?
>
> My parents. Maybe my mother did all the production work and my father
> just helped with the design.
So I hope you follow their instructions when putting your hips to work.
ch...@robotninja.net
> Read and follow the manufactures instructions. Those instructions are
> based on equipments design and testing.
Ditto.
If it's tested to withstand the dynamic forces created by a falling
lead climber (Wild Country, for example, three-sigma test all their
belay loops to 25kn), why anyone would worry about it withstanding the
mostly-static load of a abseil is totally beyond comprehension.
Al Black
On Fri, 09 May 2008 16:51:49 -0800, Eugene Miya wrote:
> In article <b44Vj.1712$KB3.1458@edtnps91>, Al Black
> <al-b...@notthis.telus.net> wrote:
>>On Fri, 09 May 2008 13:36:20 -0800, Eugene Miya wrote:
>>> Murray and I and others still do hip belays. No gear needed. Well
>>> Murray may on occasion use a plate. I certainly know how to use a
>>> plate or a Munter hitch.
>>
>>No doubt a hip belay is useful esp. on that scrambly 4th-5th terrain.
>>That hip belay shows your Sierra Club heritage Eugene:-)
>
> I think the Eastern Trade also used them before Sticht plates came to
> the USA. That would be parts of the AMC, the HMC, and what every groups
> existed.
<nod> yeah, I was thinking more along the lines of the old school Sierra
Club mountaineering orientation in contrast to more current modes. Its
something that makes me smile in appreciation.
al