electronic carabiner for sales - rescue equipment
K. R. Reeves
Bill Zaumen
> at ....
Is this a joke or is it a scam?
Will we get a new catagory in the accident reports:
"Carabiner gate fails to close---battery failure"? Or is someone
going to take a long fall because his 'biner had crashed and was
rebooting its OS?
Bill
--
As an anti-spam measure, my email address is only provided in a GIF
file. Please see <http://home.pacbell.net/zaumen/email.gif>.
Bill Zaumen
Emrich" <emr...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
> "Bill Zaumen" <nob...@nospam.pacbell.net> wrote:
> >
> > Is this a joke or is it a scam?
>
> Most importantly I think it was a poor description. The device is supposed to
> be a solution to the "rap down a single rope, then release it" problem.
I have no
> idea how it well works, or how likely it is to get stuck or damaged on
the way down.
> The ebay page said it was for "emergency use only." I didn't look at
the manufacturer's
> website.
You mean you send it a radio signal to tell it to release???
I hope all the codes are unique and there is enough error correction
so that noise won't mess it up.
It all sounds pretty hokey to me. You know: "Analysis: it is not
wise to use a cell phone when hanging off a 'biner that can release when
it receives a radio signal."
Not that I've bothered to read the web page :-).
Nigel Rablin
errors'
Bill Zaumen <nob...@nospam.pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:nobody-1203...@adsl-209-233-20-69.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net...
> In article <38CC15...@sympatico.ca>, sa...@emergencyrappel.com wrote:
>
> > at ....
>
> Is this a joke or is it a scam?
>
> Will we get a new catagory in the accident reports:
> "Carabiner gate fails to close---battery failure"? Or is someone
> going to take a long fall because his 'biner had crashed and was
> rebooting its OS?
>
David Emrich
Most importantly I think it was a poor description. The device is supposed to
be a solution to the "rap down a single rope, then release it" problem. I have no
idea how it well works, or how likely it is to get stuck or damaged on the way down.
The ebay page said it was for "emergency use only." I didn't look at the manufacturer's
website.
It sounded pretty funny though, and it launched the "electronic ropes for sale" thread.
If only someone would manufacture "smart shoes" ...
David
D.McMullin
DM
On Sun, 12 Mar 2000 22:04:43 GMT, "K. R. Reeves"
<kenr...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>at;
>
>emergencyrappel.com
>
>sa...@emergencyrappel.com
pete theobald
the darn things got a time delay on the release.
It's alright as it's got a weight sensor as well, but i guess that if you
have a slow abseil and rest on a ledge it could land on your head and give
you a bit of a shock
pretty flawed me thinks but then what do i know.
pete "wahts wrong with using double ropes" theobald
>You mean you send it a radio signal to tell it to release???
>I hope all the codes are unique and there is enough error correction
>so that noise won't mess it up.
>
>It all sounds pretty hokey to me. You know: "Analysis: it is not
>wise to use a cell phone when hanging off a 'biner that can release when
>it receives a radio signal."
>
>Not that I've bothered to read the web page :-).
>
Dan Goodman
>
> Or will it get mysterious 'Windows (oops I mean Biner) Protection
> errors'
The biners, manufactured in Redmond, would report a UAE
(User Application Error).
"This is a fully automated biner. Nothing can go wrong ...
go wrong ... go wrong ... go wrong ... "
Dan Goodman
MJL...@att.net
safety system that could potentially fuck up and kill them! Where do I
sign up for one?!?
Besides... rapping on 3 mm cord?!? Who are you kidding? Everyone knows
that kite string is cheaper and lighter.
Back to the drawing board, eh?
Happy Climbing!
Micah "I don't need an over-priced, battery powered piece of shit
controlling my rappels, even in an emergency!" Lauer
David Blume
Leave $12.00 worth of worth of booty per pitch, or trust a heavy,
battery-powered, time-release $175.00 carabiner each pitch?
Does it yell, "Rock" when it releases itself?
--David
--
To reply, please remove "NoSpam" from my domain.
http://home.earthlink.net/~daliblume/
Crack Boy
>
> The biners, manufactured in Redmond, would report a UAE
> (User Application Error).
>
> "This is a fully automated biner. Nothing can go wrong ...
> go wrong ... go wrong ... go wrong ... "
>
> Dan Goodman
Of course, the manual will say both:
"Uunexpected results occur when used as directed."
and
"This is by design."
Crack "If BD made biners like MSFT makes software..." Boy
a6demise
on 3/13/00 1:50 PM:
> Crack "If BD made biners like MSFT makes software..." Boy
They do, they just fix the problems before they put them into mass
production.
Buy a Mac, it pays!
--
Jon Poulson
a6de...@hotmail.groundfall.com
To reply to sender, remove .groundfall from e-mail address.
Chad Lake
David Blume <dbl...@NoSpam.pinnaclesys.com> wrote:
>Hmm. Emergency. What do I do?
>
>Leave $12.00 worth of worth of booty per pitch, or trust a heavy,
>battery-powered, time-release $175.00 carabiner each pitch?
>
Dude...it's not just one biner. It is actually two biners....Petzl
Spirits that have had their gates removed (seriously).
"This is a once in a life-time device", the site says. No shit
sherlock.
-c
GeoffCJ
Does anybody know Richard Gere's email? Rumor has it he's experienced with
this kinda stuff..
=>g
eoff
Karl Baba
Your assessment of the rescue gear market is only matched by your
usenet savey.
I have seen your web page. You need to show us how we could make use of
your device and incorporate it with the gear and techniques actual
climbers use. What kind of climbing have you done and where?
Peace
Karl
In article <38DEAF...@emergencyrappel.comnospam>, "K. R. Reeves"
<sa...@emergencyrappel.comnospam> wrote:
> Crack Boy wrote:
> >
> > Dan Goodman wrote:
> > >
> > > The biners, manufactured in Redmond, would report a UAE
> > > (User Application Error).
> > >
> > > "This is a fully automated biner. Nothing can go wrong ...
> Approximately 200 climbers die each year stranded at the top of alpine
> climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
> 50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
> am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
> metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
> that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
> tehnology to move up from wooden boats.> > go wrong ... go wrong ... go
> wrong ... "
>
>
> > >
> > > Dan Goodman
> >
> > Of course, the manual will say both:
> > "Uunexpected results occur when used as directed."
> > and
> > "This is by design."
> >
> > Crack "If BD made biners like MSFT makes software..." Boy
http://extra.newsguy.com/~climbing/
Rockclimbing Guide (remove NOSPAM from the return address)
K. R. Reeves
of climb half dead that is fine by me............There is no chip in
the device either so I imagine there would not be a boot problem.
K. R. Reeves
>
> In article <38CC15...@sympatico.ca>, sa...@emergencyrappel.com wrote:
>
> > at ....
>
>
> "Carabiner gate fails to close---battery failure"? Or is someone
> going to take a long fall because his 'biner had crashed and was
> rebooting its OS?
>
>
> --
> As an anti-spam measure, my email address is only provided in a GIF
> file. Please see <http://home.pacbell.net/zaumen/email.gif>.
K. R. Reeves
>
> Or will it get mysterious 'Windows (oops I mean Biner) Protection
> errors'
>
> news:nobody-1203...@adsl-209-233-20-69.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net...
> >
> > > at ....
> >
> > Is this a joke or is it a scam?
> >
> > Will we get a new catagory in the accident reports:
K. R. Reeves
>
> Dan Goodman wrote:
> >
> > The biners, manufactured in Redmond, would report a UAE
> > (User Application Error).
> >
> > "This is a fully automated biner. Nothing can go wrong ...
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
Dan Goodman wrote:
>
> Nigel Rablin wrote:
> >
> > Or will it get mysterious 'Windows (oops I mean Biner) Protection
> > errors'
>
> The biners, manufactured in Redmond, would report a UAE
> (User Application Error).
>
> "This is a fully automated biner. Nothing can go wrong ...
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
a6demise wrote:
>
> in article 38CD5499...@fake.com, Crack Boy at crac...@fake.com wrote
> on 3/13/00 1:50 PM:
>
> > Crack "If BD made biners like MSFT makes software..." Boy
>
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
Bill Zaumen wrote:
>
> In article <%BZy4.11522$WI1.2...@news1.frmt1.sfba.home.com>, "David
> Emrich" <emr...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>
> > "Bill Zaumen" <nob...@nospam.pacbell.net> wrote:
> > >
> > > Is this a joke or is it a scam?
> >
> > Most importantly I think it was a poor description. The device is supposed to
> > be a solution to the "rap down a single rope, then release it" problem.
> I have no
> > idea how it well works, or how likely it is to get stuck or damaged on
> the way down.
> > The ebay page said it was for "emergency use only." I didn't look at
> the manufacturer's
> > website.
>
> You mean you send it a radio signal to tell it to release???
> I hope all the codes are unique and there is enough error correction
> so that noise won't mess it up.
>
> It all sounds pretty hokey to me. You know: "Analysis: it is not
> wise to use a cell phone when hanging off a 'biner that can release when
> it receives a radio signal."
>
> Not that I've bothered to read the web page :-).
>
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
pete theobald wrote:
>
> even worse buddy.
>
> the darn things got a time delay on the release.
> It's alright as it's got a weight sensor as well, but i guess that if you
> have a slow abseil and rest on a ledge it could land on your head and give
> you a bit of a shock
>
> pretty flawed me thinks but then what do i know.
>
> pete "wahts wrong with using double ropes" theobald
>
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
David Blume wrote:
>
> Hmm. Emergency. What do I do?
>
> Leave $12.00 worth of worth of booty per pitch, or trust a heavy,
> battery-powered, time-release $175.00 carabiner each pitch?
>
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
Hans Lehmann wrote:
>
> I've got a far better solution!
>
> Carry a jar of peanut butter and an assortment of hamsters or other
> small rodents.
> When you're ready to rappell, just smear some peanut butter to the
> rope just below your anchor, and attach one hamster. According
> to my calculations, the rope should be chewed through just after
> you've safely reached your next rappell anchor.
>
> This method is Patent Pending. Dealer inquiries invited.
K. R. Reeves
climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
GeoffCJ wrote:
Rex Pieper
-Rex Pieper
remove ".XSPAM" from signature to reply
Dan Goodman
One copy of your plaintive missive would suffice, in less
your intent is to lash back at us for not seeing your
brilliance.
I guess since you've already judged us idiots (albeit still
alive ones) you haven't seen fit to convince us that this
will work.
So how about 1 reply to the NG, telling us how the release
signal is transmitted, and why several people in a popular
climbing spot wouldn't all be in a position to have their
electronic biner released by someone else's signal?
I don't consider you or your idea idiotic (yet) but if you
can't answer those two simple questions, instead of keying
off the banter, then your intelligence might remain suspect.
Dan Goodman
"K. R. Reeves" wrote:
>
> Crack Boy wrote:
> >
> > Dan Goodman wrote:
> > >
> > > The biners, manufactured in Redmond, would report a UAE
> > > (User Application Error).
> > >
> > > "This is a fully automated biner. Nothing can go wrong ...
> Approximately 200 climbers die each year stranded at the top of alpine
> climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
> 50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
> am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
> metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
> that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
> tehnology to move up from wooden boats.> > go wrong ... go wrong ... go
> wrong ... "
>
> > >
> > > Dan Goodman
> >
> > Of course, the manual will say both:
> > "Uunexpected results occur when used as directed."
> > and
> > "This is by design."
> >
Nate
> All because they are stuck in the
> 50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres.
that rappelling in way that has been proven and improved since the
beginning of climbing is living in the past. Always something new on
the internet.
> IF you use the device I
Maybe you should have been out climbing - market research...
> You stupid idiots.
You're way out of touch.
- Nate
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
maohai huang
:
: One copy of your plaintive missive would suffice, in less
: your intent is to lash back at us for not seeing your
: brilliance.
Hey, that is because you jinxed him when you wrote:
> "This is a fully automated biner. Nothing can go wrong ...
Mike Garrison
>
> I don't consider you or your idea idiotic (yet)
However, I do.
The guy wants us to spend $170 on a device designed to let
us recover a single line. But the device itself gets left
behind. $170 is more than an emergency spectra rap line
would cost -- why not just leave the line in the first
place?
Besides, no way would I ever rap off anything which was
*designed* to release my rope without me doing something to
make it happen.
-Mike
Dan Goodman
Well, if that's his level of computer literacy, I'd surely
think twice about an electronic device he designed!
Dan
Dan Goodman
Darnit, Mike! I just wanted to see him explain his way out
the whole shebang in front of us "idiots". Of course, your
points are right on target.
Guess I deserve it for busting on one of Galen's trolls a
while back, for which he was gracious enough not to
complain, and forgave me when I mentioned it.
But darnit anyway! I thought this guy was going to be fun to
play...and anyway, you never know when you might get
stranded 600 feet up without his device and 600 ft of 3mm
cord. How the hell does it release, anyway?
Dan
Dan
Bill Zaumen
<dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
>
> But darnit anyway! I thought this guy was going to be fun to
> play...and anyway, you never know when you might get
> stranded 600 feet up without his device and 600 ft of 3mm
> cord. How the hell does it release, anyway?
>
Actually, given the obnoxious email these guys sent me, they aren't going
to be fun :-).
I'm not sure how it releases, but if you need a rack of these things
at well over $100 a shot, it would be cheaper to climb on
double ropes, with probably less weight to boot.
I've no idea how these things release, but Jim Donini's remark about
grigris comes to mind, "I don't trust something I can't see inside of"
(or something like that).
When I first heard about these updated 'biners, I thought it was from
an updated version of the "Little Gem Catalog," a cute little blurb
put together years ago featuring rubber pitons (easy to remove) and
a belay seat that doubles as a parachute (recommended when using the rubber
pitons).
Bill Zaumen
> In article <38DEB0...@emergencyrappel.comnospam>,
> sa...@emergencyrappel.comnospam wrote:
> > Approximately 200 climbers die each year stranded at the top of alpine
> > climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
> > 50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
> > am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
> > metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
> > that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
> > tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
>
> I wonder how much product liability insurance would cost on something
> like this?
>
Zero if no one buys one :-).
Let's see if these guys can back up that "200 climbers die" number, though,
given that in 1998 there were only 21 fatalities listed for the U.S. and
Canada in "Accidents in North American Mountaineering", and that includes
all types of accidents.
I'd be really surprised if scare tactics would work on climbers, but
if they want to call people "stupid idiots," they damn well can justify
the numbers they use.
Of course, if I told co-workers in Silicon Valley that these guys took
3 years to develop an electronic gizmo to release a rope, they would
find it quite amusing: you'd be laughed out of the industry around here
if you took that long on what sounds like such a simple product! One
only hopes there is more to it.
But the reaction---calling potential customers "stupid idiots" pretty
much shows me that these guys don't have a clue.
rm...@my-deja.com
sa...@emergencyrappel.comnospam wrote:
> Approximately 200 climbers die each year stranded at the top of alpine
> climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
> 50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
> am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
> metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
> that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
> tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
>
>
I wonder how much product liability insurance would cost on something
like this?
RM
Bob Ternes
#How many climbers die?
#
#-Rex Pieper
Goddamn it, Rex, over 200, EVERY FUCKING YEAR. Please don't patronize such a
beneficient member of our human race, although he almost transcends us with
the invention of such a lifesaving device.
This man's work is important. Do you realize the lives, the HUMAN LIVES, fer
chrissakes, he's saving, EVERY YEAR? Why can't you get the work of such an
important humanitarian through your THICK SKULLS? Are you all idiots? Can't
you see, that device is a GODSEND!
Bob 'sycophant' Ternes
rte...@u.arizona.edu
Michael A. Riches
madb...@aol.com.XSPAM (Rex Pieper) wrote:
Damn...you mean he's actually posted that statistic???
I wonder how many pseudo-inventor/enjuneers/climber.wannabe's die every year
with keyboards stuck up their asses....?
--
The Rockrat
Dave Andersen
> Damn...you mean he's actually posted that statistic???
> I wonder how many pseudo-inventor/enjuneers/climber.wannabe's die every year
> with keyboards stuck up their asses....?
One too few, Rockrat, one too few.
-Dave
--
work: dga - at - lcs.mit.edu me: angio - at - pobox.com
MIT Laboratory for Computer Science http://www.angio.net/
Mike Garrison
>
> But darnit anyway! I thought this guy was going to be fun to
> play...and anyway, you never know when you might get
> stranded 600 feet up without his device and 600 ft of 3mm
> cord. How the hell does it release, anyway?
I was bored, and checked his website. It releases on ... get
this ... a timer! Yes, you have some preset amount of time
to complete your rap and then boom!
Actually, this could be the basis for some sort of game show
idea. "The Rap Of (Mis)Fortune"
The site says that there is a weight switch to prevent the
device from releasing too soon. I'd hate to be taking a
quick breather on some micro-ledge 300 feet from either the
top or the bottom when the timer runs out.
Sorry to interfere with your fun, but my guess is that any
amount of factual information will not deter this guy from
playing. After all, he says he spent three years of his life
working on this thing....
-Mike
Dan Goodman
>
> Dan Goodman wrote:
> >
> > But darnit anyway! I thought this guy was going to be fun to
> > play...and anyway, you never know when you might get
> > stranded 600 feet up without his device and 600 ft of 3mm
> > cord. How the hell does it release, anyway?
>
> I was bored, and checked his website. It releases on ... get
> this ... a timer! Yes, you have some preset amount of time
> to complete your rap and then boom!
"2700 feet of El Cap behind me,
and just 300 more to G
O
O
o
o
o
!
*
"
>
> Actually, this could be the basis for some sort of game show
> idea. "The Rap Of (Mis)Fortune"
Groucho Marx's "You Bet Your Life" comes to mind...
> Sorry to interfere with your fun, but my guess is that any
> amount of factual information will not deter this guy from
> playing. After all, he says he spent three years of his life
> working on this thing....
You're probably right. I sent him an email asking, among
other things, if this has been tested by UIAA and/or CE.
Last one down's a rotting egg.
Dan Goodman
pete theobald
his work. so a feel i better reply to it
I tried to post this yesterday but it didn't seem to work so this might turn
up twice. I don't care but it's in fashion now to post everything at least
20 times.
i think that mr reeves is a bit of a tit really.
Who can blame him after three years of work but market research should of
told you not to bother.
Since he seemed to bring up my post and slate us brits for being british
i've highlighted all the flaws that i instantly saw when i looked at his
website.
here goes
OK Mr Reeves.
When you rap down 600 metres on your 3mm dyneema and then wait for your
"electronic Biner" to release.
How fast is the electronic biner travellin when it hits you on the head. If
it does not hit you on the head but instead hits the ground travelling at an
assumed terminal velocity (Probably quite high for a samll heavy black
object consisting of some metal and a battery)
what is the chance of it surviving and being safe for the next abseil (sorry
rap)
BTW when we ab off stuff we use double ropes which means we get a 60 metre
pitch. This means that ten pitches and weve abseiled 600 meters.
At approx 10 min a pitch that makes it about 1h40 which ain't too bad. It
saves carrying extra line (I'm not sure how you ab on 3mm dyneema which your
website recommneds but i use the stuff as shoelaces) since you ab on your
lead ropes. Thin line also damages more easily.
A combination of the line being nearer to it's plastic limit and thus more
likely to break if damaged by for example A ROCK. Also since it has a very
light sheaf there is little to protect the inside.
It is difficult to back up your descent with an autoblock unless you use
fishing line. so in your 600 meter ab when you get knackered ogf holding
onto the shoelace (sorry rope) you have no way of stopping. It also needs a
complex setup to get enough friction to be able to control your descent.
I'll follow this up with some more personal observations.
1.) I don't like to trust anything that is going to do something on it's own
involving abseiling. I like the setup to be completely passive
and the only way of changing the system involves things that are attahced to
me i.e. pulling on the rope.
2.) At 600 meters up an alpine face it tends to be quite cold and batteries
don't work very well in the cold. Please reassure me that your biner does
work in the cold as i wouldn't like to prussik up a shoelace using my
shoelaces for 600 meters attached to something that is meant to be dropping
me because it won't drop me to make the thing that won't drop me drop me so
that i can get my "electronic biner" back as well as my 600 meters of
dyneema.
Now then Mr Reeves, I think if you intend to slate this response i think
that you need to explain away all the "possible" (don't want to get sued
here) problems. You don't need to convince me cos' i wouldn't buy the darn
thing anyway but i think you potential market needs a lkittle more
convincing.
pete
K. R. Reeves wrote in message <38DEB0...@emergencyrappel.comnospam>...
>Approximately 200 climbers die each year stranded at the top of alpine
>climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
>50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
>am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
>metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
>that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
>tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
>
>pete theobald wrote:
>>
>> even worse buddy.
>>
>> the darn things got a time delay on the release.
>> It's alright as it's got a weight sensor as well, but i guess that if you
>> have a slow abseil and rest on a ledge it could land on your head and
give
>> you a bit of a shock
>>
>> pretty flawed me thinks but then what do i know.
>>
>> pete "wahts wrong with using double ropes" theobald
>>
>> >You mean you send it a radio signal to tell it to release???
>> >I hope all the codes are unique and there is enough error correction
>> >so that noise won't mess it up.
>> >
>> >It all sounds pretty hokey to me. You know: "Analysis: it is not
>> >wise to use a cell phone when hanging off a 'biner that can release when
>> >it receives a radio signal."
>> >
>> >Not that I've bothered to read the web page :-).
>> >
Peter Boyle
> > In article <38DEB0...@emergencyrappel.comnospam>,
> > sa...@emergencyrappel.comnospam wrote:
> > > climbs, and that is not crag climbs. All because they are stuck in the
> > > 50's setting up a rap station every 25 metres. IF you use the device I
> > > am talking about, which took me 3 years to make, you could rap off a 600
> > > metre climb in 20 minutes. You stupid idiots. It does not surprise me
> > > that most of these emails are British, the ones that wait for American
> > > tehnology to move up from wooden boats.
What's your beef with wooden boats?
Have you tried engaging the turbo rap mode in your gizmo, I'm sure
you could cut that time down to 30 seconds. Please do.
Oh, my email doesn't have a passport, but it still reaches the US is
that illegal?.
Peter Boyle pbo...@physics.gla.ac.uk
pete theobald
come out and defend yourself.
i emailed you personally and asked you to defend your product. I have
offered to apologize for what i have said if you can prove to me that it is
wrong. I also said that i would continue to slate your product if you can't.
We ahven't heard from you so i guess youre keeping your mouth shut and
riding out the storm. You could of course write to me again with your
ranting drivel about our stupidity.
I don't think you'd be doing any favours though if you did post anything
again.
If you send a response to me personally that explains how you deal witht the
problems i highlighted then i will post a full apologie and even put in a
little plug for product
you can't get any fairer than that
pete
Bill Zaumen
<plthe...@iname.com> wrote:
> mr reeves where are you.
>
> come out and defend yourself.
>
This guy put out his 200 deaths number (while Accidents in North
American Mountaineering gave 21 for all of North America regardless
of cause for 1998) and has yet to back his number up.
Until he does, and given how he posted the same thing umpteen times,
I'll assume the guy is simply using the Nazi's big-lie technique.
What we may have is simply some guys who designed a product that no
one wants to buy, so they are blaming their potential customers instead
of simply trying again. Something like 97 percent of what seem like
very good ideas fail in the marketplace, so they really have no reason
to expect to do any better. But whining about "idiots" sounds like
someone who can't get up a climb and blames the guys who did the first
ascent instead of trying to get better at it.
Dan Goodman
>
> In article <38DFECB0...@pepboys.com>, Dan Goodman
> <dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
>
> >
>
> grigris comes to mind, "I don't trust something I can't see inside of"
> (or something like that).
Subsequent posts and the website noted the timer release,
and when that started getting questioned, a new product
feature, weight sensing, appeared.
Someone questioned the idea of RF signal releases, and KR
said not to worry, it did not operate off a signal.
NOW HEAR THIS:
Apparently KR has been relieved of his marketing duties,
because when I posted Qs to their website, Jon Riley, not KR
replied, and he indicated:
- that the EPriam model cannot have the rope drop disabled,
but surprise, a new model, not on their website a day ago,
called the EApollo will allow you to disable the rope drop.
How you would know you need to do so before it was too late,
was not explained.
- The EApollo disables via an RF signal, but don't worry
about line of sight, as the signal will go from the climber
to a newly-specified base station and thence to the EApollo.
How your rope wouldn't be disabled by somebody else's remote
also wasn't addressed.
- It is represented as being servicable after dropping 1000
ft, but you must not let it strike anything prior to
stopping on the deck.
- They will be submitting it to the Canadian standards board
for certification soon (bet they still have to build the
EApollo biner, base station, and remote control.)
I *KNEW* this would be fun(ny). I'd love to work in their
R&D department, you can always redesign your oversights on
the fly.
I still don't see this as a useful device for anyone.
Dan Goodman
Greg Daughtry
Dan Goodman wrote in message <38E1420C...@pepboys.com>...
-snip
>
>I *KNEW* this would be fun(ny). I'd love to work in their
>R&D department, you can always redesign your oversights on
>the fly.
I don't know about that. Getting tossed around like a rag doll due to
feature creep and poor marketing sucks. Of course if there was an actual
climber on the staff anywhere, he'd a been fired for insubordination long
ago...
>
>I still don't see this as a useful device for anyone.
Agreed.
'Greg
Portland, OR
Brent Ware
<dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
> Apparently KR has been relieved of his marketing duties,
> because when I posted Qs to their website, Jon Riley, not KR
> replied, and he indicated:
Funny, when I emailed and asked about the claim of 200 climbers per
year starving to death or dying of hypothermia on ledges, I just got a
simple "fuckoff".
-bw
perhaps it was my texan "I call bullshit on that"
Bill Zaumen
>
> I figured this out as soon as i heard they were using 3mm cord, As the
> military special forces are currently playing with rappel systems using
> 3mm Technora (I actually saw one of the kits at the trade show about 2
> years ago, everything fits in a fanny pack).
>
> Jim Cormier
> Cormier Mountaineering
>
Well, the U.S. military has very good reasons to subject their personnel
to risks while rappeling that climbers wouldn't take---we don't have
to get down blindingly fast to avoid being shot.
That is, unless you are climbing on private property owned by some
gun nut :-).
BIll
jim_c...@my-deja.com
> - They will be submitting it to the Canadian standards board
> for certification soon (bet they still have to build the
> EApollo biner, base station, and remote control.)
>
> I *KNEW* this would be fun(ny). I'd love to work in their
> R&D department, you can always redesign your oversights on
> the fly.
>
> I still don't see this as a useful device for anyone.
>
> Dan Goodman
>
C'mon Dan, there probably is already a well financed customer who is
probably going to do an initial purchase of say 100,000 units.
Our very own MILITARY.
Q: Guess who's paying the bill?
A: All of US
I figured this out as soon as i heard they were using 3mm cord, As the
military special forces are currently playing with rappel systems using
3mm Technora (I actually saw one of the kits at the trade show about 2
years ago, everything fits in a fanny pack).
Jim Cormier
Cormier Mountaineering
Bill Zaumen
> Bill Zaumen wrote:
> >
> > In article <38DFECB0...@pepboys.com>, Dan Goodman
> > <dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
> >
> > > How the hell does it release, anyway?
> > >
> >
> > I've no idea how these things release, but Jim Donini's remark about
> > grigris comes to mind, "I don't trust something I can't see inside of"
> > (or something like that).
>
> Subsequent posts and the website noted the timer release,
> and when that started getting questioned, a new product
> feature, weight sensing, appeared.
A timer? OK, you start rapping off this alpine death route where
the mythical(?) 200 people freeze to death every year, and this killer
avalanche starts comming down. The good news---you can crawl under
an overhang and avoid getting hit. The bad news---the clock is
ticking.
Then there was the time I rapped off the Glacier Point Apron after
finishing a climb. It looked like it was about to rain, and we definitely
wanted to get off ASAP. So, I pulled the rope and just as the end of
the rope reached the rappel point, it hung. I fooled around with it
a bit and it somehow freed. If I had to, with a full rope at the belay,
I could have reclimbed that pitch if necessary, but what would I have
done with only one rope? I'd have been up you know whose creek without
a paddle :-).
As to weight sensing, has anyone ever reached a large ledge while rappeling
and then continued? I have. What would the weight sensor do in that case? I'm
not going to guess, but I'm not going to be the first guy to find out
the hard way either.
> - It is represented as being servicable after dropping 1000
> ft, but you must not let it strike anything prior to
> stopping on the deck.
>
So we can drop it off Dolt Tower since it will probably miss Sickle
Ledge? Am I missing something here?
Bill
GeoffCJ
"Rapel, before it's to late! Dodge Rockfall, avoid getting hung in bushes, and
find your way to the next anchor, but remember, the clock is ticking, so hurry!
"
Coming soon to a video game player near you....
Geoff
Gmrcc
Rex Pieper
>Are we sure that this is no an elaborate April fools joke? ;)
Perhaps. But if so, it released a bit early....
Not something I'd want to have associated with a time-released
device, would you?
Oh, and btw, I saw on eBay that emergencyrappelidots.com is
SELLING the blueprints now. Guess they decided to cut their
losses and get what they can from their 3 years of work.
I see the asking price is a DOLLAR.
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=295058769
Nice pic too. Looks like a Rocky and Bullwinkle bomb next to a
tied-off tree. Tic Tic Tic Boom. No wonder they call it a
"once-in-a-lifetime" device.
Dan Goodman
>
> In article <38E1420C...@pepboys.com>, Dan Goodman
> <dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
>
> > because when I posted Qs to their website, Jon Riley, not KR
> > replied, and he indicated:
> > [ a list of changes ]
>
> Funny, when I emailed and asked about the claim of 200 climbers per
> year starving to death or dying of hypothermia on ledges, I just got a
> simple "fuckoff".
>
> -bw
> perhaps it was my texan "I call bullshit on that"
Ditto on "I call bullshit on that."
I got on email from Jon Riley telling me a was a liar,
without saying what was a lie. Then he said I should drop
around George Brown College in Ontario to read a doctoral
dissertation on the "execution" (oops! electronic) biner.
I wrote him back that now I know why I had never heard of GB
College, and challenged him to specify what specifically was
a lie. I am awaiting his reply.
I also challenged him to put the dissertation on his website
if he feels it supports their product design. (Like I'm
going to Ontaria to try to convince myself his product is
useful - not!).
Apparently they have decided to take a softer PR approach.
No more multiple posts of the same offensive reply by good
ole KR, now Mr. Riley personally tells us individually to
fuck off, or calls us liars, so that others won't be
affected by their vigorous, but unfactual, product defense.
You may or may not get a kick out of such waffling, but some
of us enjoy seeing bad ideas held up to the test of truth
and logic. And they seem to be masters of alienation of
their customer base, as well as inventive re-inventors of
what it is that their product is supposed to do and be.
"And our QA department is headed up by the lovely Morgan
Fairchild, *with whom* I am well acquainted!"
"Tommy Flana'gan" Goodman
Dan Goodman
>
> C'mon Dan, there probably is already a well financed customer who is
> probably going to do an initial purchase of say 100,000 units.
>
> Our very own MILITARY.
>
> Q: Guess who's paying the bill?
>
> A: All of US
GAAAACCCCK! I'm afraid you're probably right, although I can
see a big scandal arising out of it, if word of its
reception on r.c. ever gets in the hands of an investigative
reporter.
No wonder they need $10,000 toilet seats. This is enough to
knock the shit out of anyone bigtime.
BTW, I got an autoreply email with a plug for the fact that
the product is now up for bid on Ebay. Anybody care to track
the bid progress?
Dan
Dan Goodman
> Well, the U.S. military has very good reasons to subject their personnel
> to risks while rappeling that climbers wouldn't take---we don't have
> to get down blindingly fast to avoid being shot.
So after they get down fast, they're going to wait for the
timer to release their rope while under fire? *I don't THINK
so!* Not in this man's Marine Corps.
C'mon, Bill, even in the military context, it is a product
boondoggle, at least as presented thus far.
Dan
Dan Goodman
>
> the whole thing sounds to me like some kind of lame Rappelling Video Game.
Sorry! Game Over! You have 0 Lives Left!
Dan
Dan Goodman
> Nice pic too. Looks like a Rocky and Bullwinkle bomb next to a
> tied-off tree. Tic Tic Tic Boom. No wonder they call it a
> "once-in-a-lifetime" device.
Did I miss something, or does the picture show a single
anchor point at an angle to the direction of the rope from
the tree, and a rope loosely slung around the tree in a way
that the rope will only move slightly when the device
releases? Or if the knot in the rope will not retain the
rope when the device releases, neither will it retain it
while the device is connected to the anchor?
Or is this a new anchor building technique they haven't yet
released the schematics for?
For the ride of your life, buy an electronic biner!
Dan Goodman
Christopher A Kantarjiev
rappel? That just takes time.
Dan Goodman
>
> Are we sure that this is no an elaborate April fools joke? ;)
I don't think so. They're just a couple of pompous pricks
with a bad idea who don't know how to take reality.
Below are a couple of my queries/posts and the responses I
received from Jon Riley.
THE FIRST:
> Your no different from a sewing circle. Drop by
> George Brown College in Toronto and look up the thesis
> Emergency Rappel System, a device to remove rope from
> a carabiner by remote control.
>
> YOU ARE LIEING!
AND THE SECOND, in reply to my query on EBay.
> fuckoff Mr. sewing circle. You look like an idiot.
>
> --- Dan Goodman <dan_g...@PepBoys.Com> wrote:
> > Has this producted been built and tested?
> >
> > Is there any published research on the device?
> >
> > TIA,
> > Dan
> >
> >
>
> =====
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> Jon Riley
> Sales Manager, emergencyrappel.com
> 26 Belvale Ave. Toronto, Ontario
> M8X 2A7 Canada
> sa...@emergencyrappel.com
> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Bill Zaumen
<dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
Dan, what I was getting at is that to cut the chances of you being shot
by 10 percent, you might accept a 1 percent chance of the rappel device
you are using failing outright.
Mostly, I was trying to be funny (guess I needed more smilies :-).
Bill Zaumen
<chr...@webvangroup.com> wrote:
> Why would the military folks bother to recover the gear after the
> rappel? That just takes time.
They wouldn't unless they needed the gear later, or unless they wanted to
be sure that someone else couldn't use it.
Actually, it is kind of clever. You set up the rappels, release the
biners when done, and the biners fall to the ground and seriously munge
the electronics or whatnot. Then the bad guys (I mean, would we ever
say we are fighting good guys?) recover the gear, try to use it, and get
killed without our guys having to fire a shot :-).
Bill Zaumen
<dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
> Below are a couple of my queries/posts and the responses I
> received from Jon Riley.
No need to repeat what he said to Dan. What I got from Mr.
Riley (or at least someone claiming to be him) was,
: In reponding your mature newsgroups posting on the
: electronic carabiner. I will respond to at least one;
The post he then quoted was not even written by me! To just get
my email address, he had to open a gif file from a URL and copy
it by hand, so it isn't a question of a cutting and pasting error.
Riley (or whoever) then went on with "Approximately 200 climbers ..."
(the same thing the Reeves guy supposedly posted). Quite a coincidence.
I've sort of got to ask if Reeves and Riley just might be the same
person!
Bill Zaumen
<dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
> Bill Zaumen wrote:
>
> > I've sort of got to ask if Reeves and Riley just might be the same
> > person!
>
> Ditto no need to repeat.
>
> Since Riley challenged me to drop by Geo. Brown College to
> read a thesis on the concept .... I actually wrote
> the dean of the college asking for assistance in locating
> the thesis. Might be worth it just to see what it takes to
> get an advanced degree at Geo. Brown.
Some schools in some majors require undergrads to write a thesis
(something far shorter and simpler than what you would do for a
master's degree or PhD.) So, don't assume this was for any sort
of advanced degree!
> Didn't somebody say the schematics were on their website for
> a while? And does that make the device in the public domain?
> I never saw any patent notices, did anyone else?
You can file for a patent, but it can take years to get out of the
queue, and you can't claim it is 'patent pending' until the patent
office has said you can. It would be in the public domain if they
published it before they issued the patent.
Also, for the U.S., but not the rest of the world, there is a one-year
grace period where you can announce the product and talk about it,
although you may have to send a provisional application (a low-cost
place holder) to register your intentions. That gives companies a
chance to see if the product is worth anything before going to the
trouble of filing an application.
I have a feeling these guys just found out :-).
Bill Zaumen
<dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
> Bill Zaumen wrote:
> > Riley (or whoever) then went on with "Approximately 200 climbers ..."
> > (the same thing the Reeves guy supposedly posted).
>
> Maybe the 200 climbers were their Product Development and
> Test group.
Sounds like the Attack of the Killer Crash-Test Dummies :-).
>
> Ouch!
>
It was probably like Werner von Braun's early rocket launches in Germany
during WW-II. A whole bunch blew up on the launch pad. Finally, one went
up a few feet, settled back down, and then blew up. He quipped,
"we just make them go up. Where they come down is not our department"
to lighten the tension. Naturally, this has been quoted out of context
ever since!
For that matter, have the guy(s) trying to make this product actually
climbed anything?
Dan Goodman
> I've sort of got to ask if Reeves and Riley just might be the same
> person!
Ditto no need to repeat.
Since Riley challenged me to drop by Geo. Brown College to
read a thesis on the concept, since he later flamed me again
(twice) for asking for a name, title, date, and major for
this thesis, and since I can't climb for a while due to
being rear-ended (my car, all you dirty-minded people), and
in the interest of the pursuit of Truth, I actually wrote
the dean of the college asking for assistance in locating
the thesis. Might be worth it just to see what it takes to
get an advanced degree at Geo. Brown.
But I wonder if their moral and ethical standards measure up
to mine. ;-) I mean, is GBC aware of how they are being
represented by Messrs. Reeves and Riley? Nevertheless, I'd
love to see the thesis. (At least I think it's a thesis.
Could it, oh please say it isn't, a doctoral dissertation.)
And BTW (sorry Inez, I've been a technoweenie to long to
stop now!), did you see that exactly one person bid $1 for
the blueprints? I wonder who that could be, and what he will
do with them when he wins, or if they will even deliver. It
is only for the erPriam, the non-radio frequency model, not
the recently minted "belayer-to-base-station-to-device
auto-release cancelling" erApollo. But then, the closer to
no tech, the better off we probably are.
Didn't somebody say the schematics were on their website for
a while? And does that make the device in the public domain?
I never saw any patent notices, did anyone else? Maybe they
think they're the Linus Torvalds of climbing, giving away
the technology, but charging to package it up and distribute
it (yeah I know, Red Hat et al are in that analogy as well.)
Everyone on r.c., please stand pat, as I will gladly share
them with any interested regulars, even if I have to mail
them around the country to comply with copyright laws. I
think I'll reverse engineer the erPriam, into the
"MAyIRiPer" electronic belay device. If your erPriam goes
off prematurely, the MAyIRiPer will reach out and snatch
your rope and put you back on belay. (As Jerry Lee Lewis
once said after setting his piano on fire on stage as he
played Great Balls of Fire to close out his opening act:
"top that!") It will sell for only $50, with a lifetime
guarantee, provided it is used at least 100 feet off the
deck. Guess whose lifetime? (Oooh, that was bad.)
Stay tuned for the next exciting episode of "Toronto Riley
and the Sewing Circle of Idiots". Or should we call it: "As
the biner turns"? Or maybe that soap classic "One Life To
Live"? Or I could play the DeNiro part in a film about this,
called "Raging Bullshit".
Old Asian saying: if you wait patiently by the side of the
river, eventually you will see the body of your enemy float
by. These guys aren't clever enough to even be a stone in my
shoe, but as a sworn enemy of bullshit everywhere, these
guys present a massive (pun intended) blip on the radar, so
I'm willing to pay a bit (but not $170!) to see what cards
they're holding (if they have any left in their deck).
Dan
Dan Goodman
> Riley (or whoever) then went on with "Approximately 200 climbers ..."
> (the same thing the Reeves guy supposedly posted).
Maybe the 200 climbers were their Product Development and
Test group.
Ouch!
Dan
Dan Goodman
> I have a feeling these guys just found out :-).
They should do the opposite of what we suggest since we are
all idiots. Or maybe they'll send us a couple of free
evaluation copies to try to win us over to their point of
view.
Does this mean that they alone will reap the massive profits
that await them selling to experienced climbers and EBay
users?
When are they going IPO (Initial Public Offering, Inez)?
Perhaps Brutus would let us start a sewing circle chapter in
the Old Climbers' Home. Then we could sit around and say
"who would have thought they'd achieve a greater market cap
than Microsoft *and* Cisco".
Hahahaha.
Dan
Dan Goodman
> For that matter, have the guy(s) trying to make this product actually
> climbed anything?
Based on that spaghetti rig on their webpage and EBay, I
doubt it, or they wouldn't be here to talk about it.
Come on Reeves/Riley, show us some pictures of you guys
using the erPriam in a high exposure situation and shut us
up. We triple dog dare ya!
Dan "and sew it goes"
Mike James
Bill Zaumen wrote:
>
> In article <38E2DECE...@pepboys.com>, Dan Goodman> > read a thesis on the concept .... I actually wrote
> > the dean of the college asking for assistance in locating
> > the thesis. Might be worth it just to see what it takes to
> > get an advanced degree at Geo. Brown.
>
> (something far shorter and simpler than what you would do for a
> master's degree or PhD.) So, don't assume this was for any sort
> of advanced degree!
Well, I'm a native Torontonian, so maybe I can help.
First of all, George Brown College is a technical college. In general,
in Canada, "Universities" are schools that grant Bachelor and more
advanced degrees, "Colleges" are schools with non-degree or diploma
programs for skilled trades. This is not exclusively true, but as a
rule it holds.
If you get a pointer where at GBC I can find it, I'll go look it up
if people are interested. It will have to wait for a couple of weeks,
though, since on Saturday I'm off to Red Rocks for a week of climbing.
Wish me luck.
Mike
pete theobald
device but he hasn't replied to me "yet". I guess he must of forgot?
pete
>If you get a pointer where at GBC I can find it, I'll go look it up
try in the undergrad projects section.
Crack Boy
>
> Actually, it is kind of clever. You set up the rappels, release the
> biners when done, and the biners fall to the ground and seriously munge
> the electronics or whatnot. Then the bad guys (I mean, would we ever
> say we are fighting good guys?) recover the gear, try to use it, and get
> killed without our guys having to fire a shot :-).
>
I think I know what happened. Due to defense spending cuts, the
D.O.D.chose to focus on the "killing the bad guy" functionality.
The "keeping the good guy alive" functionality will be added next
year (after they get that commie pinko bastard Clinton out of office).
Of course, if DCONDIT hadn't spent all our defense money going to
the Bahamas, they might've got it in there before the release date.
Crack "Bandits at two o'clock" Boy
Dan Goodman
>
> i'm interested mike. I asked mr reeves to send me some tech details of his
> device but he hasn't replied to me "yet". I guess he must of forgot?
>
> pete
>
> >If you get a pointer where at GBC I can find it, I'll go look it up
>
> try in the undergrad projects section.
Well I can see why they don't have time to waste only only a
few hundred potential sales in r.c. <snortle, snarfle, grin>
They are extremely busy MAKING UP NEW PRODUCTS!
For a better understanding of this unique organization, its
product line and career opportunities, surf over to:
http://emergencyrappel.com/theemergencyrappel.html
where you will find such newly announced (since yesterday)
products as:
-- the erg, an emergency rappel device built around a
grigri;
-- the ergr, the same plus remote control;
-- the erPriam, which we all know and love, and which uses
an acrylic device as the gate for two BD biners (Chris H.,
you might want to have a look!);
-- the erFreemason, an erPriam with a harder case (so it can
stand more knocks?) (sorry, couldn't resist that one - no
offense intended to Freemasons);
-- the erShakespeare, which provides remote control plus the
erPriam features; and
-- the erApollo, which adds to the erPriam a harder case,
remote control *and* weight-sensing, which leads me to
believe that the weight-sensing feature is not now, or never
was, a feature of the $170 device. Dropping the
weight-sensing feature from the erPriam seems to make sense,
in that they can now offer more products. (Assuming of
course the existence of a market.)
But most telling is the following quote taken direct from
their webpage. No author is named but I'd guess it is KR
Reeves or Jon Riley.
> The first design of the Emergency Rappel came
> about while I was studying Electronic
> Communications in 1996 at George Brown College,
> Toronto. It was soon after the Everest Disaster of
> 1995, I started to think about a fast way climbers
> could get off a mountian if there was danger of not
> being able to get down. I wrote my thesis on this
> idea titled "Emergency Rappel System", A
> Release Mechanism to Electronically Remove
> Rope from a Carabiner by Remote Control. The
> design failed with an unsafe release mechanism
> and now sits in the GBC library unfinished. It was
> not until recently I thought of release mechanism
> using 2 carabiners and completed the Emergency
> Rappel, taking out the word system to have a
> smaller site address. I decided to set up this site
> to get fedback on the ER and try to get it on the
> market at a low cost. Please forward any
> suggestions about this new product to out email
> address.
Note that the seemingly strange transition from "thinking
about a release mechanism" to "taking out the word system to
have a smaller site address" is as it actually appears.
No wonder such a prolific solo inventor as himself thinks of
us as a bunch of idiots in a sewing circle.
I am deeply humbled by this show of innovation, Mr. Reeves
and Mr. Riley.
Please post back to the group when you have successfully
tested one or more of these models, with a complete report.
In the meantime, with nothing but an idea based on a failed
project, how many of us idiots do you think would still be
alive if we used equipment at that stage of development?
Mr. Reeves? Mr. Riley? Are you listening or are you way
beyond us mortals?
(BTW, what was the Everest Disaster of 1995? I thought 1996
was the Big One? Is that a typo, or is there another not as
well publicized Everest disaster occurring the year before?)
Dan Goodman
Head Knit-Wit & Director of Production for Irreproducible
Results,
Old Climbers Sewing Circle and Product Evaluation Team,
MidAtlantic Division
cc: Jon Riley
Well I really must be go
o
o
o
o
i
n
g
!
*
Robert Williams
this is the source of peer-review for these wizards.
Rob "Published in JIR"
Bill Zaumen
<dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
> pete theobald wrote:
> >
>
> But most telling is the following quote taken direct from
> their webpage. No author is named but I'd guess it is KR
> Reeves or Jon Riley.
>
> > The first design of the Emergency Rappel came
> > about while I was studying Electronic
> > Communications in 1996 at George Brown College,
> > Toronto. It was soon after the Everest Disaster of
> > 1995, I started to think about a fast way climbers
> > could get off a mountian if there was danger of not
> > being able to get down. ...
> Note that the seemingly strange transition from "thinking
> about a release mechanism" to "taking out the word system to
> have a smaller site address" is as it actually appears.
>
Note also the *lack* of thinking about how batteries and electronics
function at 40 below! Not to mention that, last I heard, they don't
rappel off of Everest, at least not by the route most people do.
Bill Zaumen
<rbw...@netscape.net> wrote:
> Hey Dan--are you familiar with The Journal of Irreproducible Results? Perhaps
> this is the source of peer-review for these wizards.
>
They nabbed me as a referee for the paper. We rejected it as too silly
for this august journal :-).
wing...@my-deja.com
drop them from planes with little propaganda leaflets from
EmergencyRappel.com.
"Da, tovarishch, eta elektronik biner ochen
khorosh-*click*-bozhe moi!-Aaaaaaah...*splat*"
"Julio, tiene usted los viente kilos de
cocaine-*click*-chingalo!-Aaaaaah...*splat*"
Or insert bad guy of your choice.
- Brett
In article
<nobody-2903...@adsl-209-233-20-69.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net>,
nob...@nospam.pacbell.net (Bill Zaumen) wrote:
>
> Actually, it is kind of clever. You set up the rappels, release the
> biners when done, and the biners fall to the ground and seriously
munge
> the electronics or whatnot. Then the bad guys (I mean, would we ever
> say we are fighting good guys?) recover the gear, try to use it, and
get
> killed without our guys having to fire a shot :-).
>
> Bill
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Dan Goodman
>
> Hey Dan--are you familiar with The Journal of Irreproducible Results? Perhaps
> this is the source of peer-review for these wizards.
Yeah. Director of Production for The Department of
Irreproducible Results is also my title in Dogbert's New
Ruling Class. Before JIR I recall it was called The
Worm-runner's Digest.
Dan
mfletc...@my-deja.com
device." I guess you won't get a second chance to use it because after
the first time since you will be, oh say, DEAD!
Mark
mfletc...@my-deja.com
device." I guess you won't get a second chance to use it because you
Brent Ware
<dan_g...@pepboys.com> wrote:
> Yeah. Director of Production for The Department of
> Irreproducible Results is also my title in Dogbert's New
> Ruling Class. Before JIR I recall it was called The
> Worm-runner's Digest.
And now it's the Annals of Improbable Reseach, www.improbable.com, due
to some falling out among the owners of the name JIR, and a severe lack
of humor amongst these humorists.
-bw
VCopelan
>The electronic carabiner is described on eBay as "A once-in-a-life-time
>device." I guess you won't get a second chance to use it because after
>the first time since you will be, oh say, DEAD!
Yes, but they only have happy owners. No unhappy users (those would be dead
ex-owners of their fine product). They really should have waited until April
1st to start advertising their product. At least then they would not have been
flamed quite as much.
Robert Williams
couple years ago. Scared the shit outta my running partner.
Rob
Dan Goodman wrote:
> Robert Williams wrote:
> >
> > Hey Dan--are you familiar with The Journal of Irreproducible Results? Perhaps
> > this is the source of peer-review for these wizards.
>
> Yeah. Director of Production for The Department of
> Irreproducible Results is also my title in Dogbert's New
> Ruling Class. Before JIR I recall it was called The
> Worm-runner's Digest.
>
> Dan
Bill Zaumen
<mike.g...@boeing.com> wrote:
> I was bored, and checked his website. It releases on ... get
> this ... a timer! Yes, you have some preset amount of time
> to complete your rap and then boom!
>
> Actually, this could be the basis for some sort of game show
> idea. "The Rap Of (Mis)Fortune"
>
> The site says that there is a weight switch to prevent the
> device from releasing too soon. I'd hate to be taking a
> quick breather on some micro-ledge 300 feet from either the
> top or the bottom when the timer runs out.
The guy who "developed" this obviously never had his rope
get caught in a tree :-).