On Apr 12, 3:02 pm, Frank Krygowski <frkry...@gmail.com> wrote:

Oh my God, Frank. You've known a few guys who believed ad hype, going
back how many years?
And "bad design"? Oh my God, Part Deux (or would that be "Dieu"). Bad
in what way? Functioning well for the purpose intended is "bad
design"? Get real.

No no no, I never said anything about 25's being too wide. If you did
ask, in order to find out what people really think instead of
guessing, you might well find that a "25" might not be a popular size.
I'd suggest the reason might not be some kind of "credulity" but
experience, perhaps parallel to my own, and others in my cohort, that
a 23mm "nominal" tire, especially a top-quality sew-up, is plenty of
tire for even rough roads-- short of the cobbles of Paris-Roubaix--
and that there is a "feel" associated with tires popular in "racing"--
which of course is one of the reasons that such certain tires are
popular-- which feel is lacking in, from my experience, the larger
Clement "Paris-Roubaix" cotton and Del Mondo silk tires.

You keep on trying to establish that racers are stupid. That's part of
my question "what's the bitch?" Professional people with careers
completely lose all rationality when it comes to "bicycles"? Is that
what you're trying to say? Maybe you've seen that in your life; I
assure you the people in my cohort are not a bunch of fools.

 And

The only place I've ever seen people get really picky about tires is
on the velodrome and there are damn good reasons for that.
I think you might find any number of TT or TTT results, from amateur
to the professional ranks, where fractions of a seconds made the
difference in placings. When you can measure the drag difference
between a skinny front tire compared to a fatter one, and do a pretty
good mathematical model of a time difference that shows even a
second's advantage for the skinny front tire, all by itself, you need
to come out from hiding behind "it's all in the wash" and other
rhetoric.

You can believe as you wish on the first count; and sure, races have
been lost because of "lack of clearance", which goes back to the days
of break-a-delic spokes and tin-foil rims, even in bikes with huge
tire clearances.
If you're arguing that a couple of mm's would have made a difference?
Maybe so, on occasion, but that's some pretty fine splitting of hairs
regarding tire rub from an out-of-round wheel.

I did some of my best, most helpful training on rollers-- that's one
"builder"-- and stationary trainers, which are another distinct "area"
of training.
Rollers for learning control, balance, riding that proverbial
"straight line", which all BS aside, is one of the most important
skills a newbie racer-- or any rider, for that matter-- can learn.
Stationary trainer for max output sessions (among others) where it's
best not to have to balance, and where effort over time can be much
more closely controlled than in most "road" situations, save doing
"laps" and potentially lots and lots of very short little laps over
the same piece of pavement <g>. IOW, a trainer is great for doing
"intervals", which in one way or another can not be replaced by "road
miles" as usually thought of. You need both, not one or the other.

"Versatility" again, and ignoring the "whisker-thin" exaggeration at
least for the moment <g>. Instead: "Horses for courses". Including a
"rain bike" for many racers (and non-racers, for that matter), whether
they are "broke" or not. And, in the way many people "roll", a fixed-
gear bike for the fixed-gear stuff, and maybe a casual bike, or an
"errand" bike, a dedicated bike the kid trailer or "trail-a-bke" hooks
up to, a tandem to ride with the kids or the spouse, so on and so
forth.

Then you get into the world of using a tool designed for the job at
hand. That's a big difference from saying that someone's Eastwing  12
oz rip hammer makes a lousy axe and therefore it is a "bad design".
If you've ever used an Eastwing 12 oz rip I'm sure you can
understand-- it is lacking, severely, as an axe, no doubt about that,
but it's a pretty darn good tool when it's used for the purposes it
was meant to be used for. Same with the axe; those are usually not
very good nail-pounders and not much good at all for pulling nails--
short of massive destruction, of course.

Ride what you like, as you do, and be happy! Others are doing the same
and there's nothing "wrong" with what they're doing, either.
--D-y