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700 cc rear wheel can't take the punishment
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Peter H
May 30, 2012, 8:35:12 PM5/30/12
to
I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
problem.
I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
It's a 700 cc rim with a disk brake rotor and my lbs just says bring
the wheel in and we'll true it. They have nothing stronger.
Is there a 700 cc, disk brake rear wheel out there that can take the
punishment? The streets I ride on are brutal and I ride with a slick
pumped to about 110 psi. Perhaps I'm asking too much.
TIA for all replies.
Peter H
problem.
I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
It's a 700 cc rim with a disk brake rotor and my lbs just says bring
the wheel in and we'll true it. They have nothing stronger.
Is there a 700 cc, disk brake rear wheel out there that can take the
punishment? The streets I ride on are brutal and I ride with a slick
pumped to about 110 psi. Perhaps I'm asking too much.
TIA for all replies.
Peter H
Nate Nagel
May 30, 2012, 8:54:31 PM5/30/12
to
it's a "700C" rim AKA ISO 622 (or maybe "29er" if this is a MTB type
thing.) That out of the way...
- what make/model bicycle is this?
- can you tell what brand/model your existing rim is?
- how many spokes? (probably 32 or 36 I would hope, on a commuter)
- how many speeds in the rear? (8/9/10?)
- What brand rear derailleur/shifter do you have, and what model? (e.g.
Shimano 105)
- what size tires are you running? (e.g. 25-622 or 700cx25)
with the above info I'm sure someone can come up with a recommendation
for a bomb-proof wheel for you.
If your roads are truly "brutal" I'm thinking you might want to consider
running at least a 28mm tire if you can fit it. 32s even at least by my
inexpert seat of the pants don't seem to be a huge detriment, and you
can then run lower pressures for a better ride.
nate
--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
thirty-six
May 30, 2012, 10:11:24 PM5/30/12
to
tyre. It's really not big enough on the back and best to fit the
biggest that will fit within the limitations of the frame. Usually
using a tyre that can cope at around 70psi will bring the desired
result.
Jay Beattie
May 30, 2012, 11:46:40 PM5/30/12
to
I had Open Pros as OEM rims on a disk brake CX bike, and they were
fine . . . until they cracked. You had to run pretty good tension to
keep them straight, and back then, I wasn't using spoke goop. I'm now
using a Velocity Aerohead touring disk rim that is probably too light
for me, but I am running thinner spokes and using goop (experimental
use of teflon containing pipe dope that seems to be working well --
poor man's Wheelsmith spoke prep). The wheel is holding up well so
far, and it takes a ton of abuse, and I run high pressure tires.
If I were to do it all over again, I would go hunting for a good,
cheap, mid-weight (450g - 550g) disk specific rim with a beefy spoke
bed. Maybe something like this:
http://www.alexrims.com/product_detail.asp?btn=4&cat=4&id=85
-- Jay Beattie.
DirtRoadie
May 31, 2012, 12:01:37 AM5/31/12
to
designation for an actual measurement of 622 mm. Perhaps a stupid
designation, but that's how it is.
DR
DirtRoadie
May 31, 2012, 12:08:08 AM5/31/12
to
brake 29er with no apparent durability issues, I would have to think
that a change of tire and/or tire pressure would go a long toward
resolving wheel issues.
DR
Tom $herman (-_-)
May 31, 2012, 12:44:36 AM5/31/12
to
--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731°N, 83.985007°W
Post Free or Die!
Király
May 31, 2012, 12:52:54 AM5/31/12
to
Peter H <hane...@rogers.com> wrote:
> I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
> problem.
>
> I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
> It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
> sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
Who's been doing the tightening and re-truing? You or the LBS? It sounds
> I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
> problem.
>
> I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
> It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
> sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
like the spokes aren't being tightened up enough and/or being properly
stress relieved after truing.
I've built all my own wheels for the last 15 years according to the
instructions in Jobst Brandt's book. I beat the hell out of my wheels
riding on some really rough pavement, and never once have I had to
re-true any of them; not even the one that had the rim sidewall wear
through after years of hard braking.
Get Brandt's book or find a LBS that knows how to do it properly.
--
K.
Lang may your lum reek.
m-gineering
May 31, 2012, 1:38:38 AM5/31/12
to
On 31-5-2012 2:35, Peter H wrote:
> I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
> problem.
>
> I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
> It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
> sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
>
> It's a 700 cc rim with a disk brake rotor and my lbs just says bring
> the wheel in and we'll true it. They have nothing stronger.
>
If they can't come up with at least a dozen suggestions for a better
> I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
> problem.
>
> I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
> It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
> sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
>
> It's a 700 cc rim with a disk brake rotor and my lbs just says bring
> the wheel in and we'll true it. They have nothing stronger.
>
wheel, a better shop who do know how to build wheels is probably your
first priority
--
/Marten
info(apestaartje)m-gineering(punt)nl
(PeteCresswell)
May 31, 2012, 10:08:07 AM5/31/12
to
Per Nate Nagel:
my garage. The rationale was that maybe I could keep up with
the roadies who are passing me at 18-20 mph while carrying on
relaxed conversations.
In fact, I found 28's at 90 psi tb good for 1 or 1.5 mph cruising
speed...
But I have gone back to my 38's because of the greatly-increased
comfort factor.
--
Pete Cresswell
>If your roads are truly "brutal" I'm thinking you might want to consider
>running at least a 28mm tire if you can fit it. 32s even at least by my
>inexpert seat of the pants don't seem to be a huge detriment, and you
>can then run lower pressures for a better ride.
I toyed around with 28's for awhile. Still have them hanging in
>running at least a 28mm tire if you can fit it. 32s even at least by my
>inexpert seat of the pants don't seem to be a huge detriment, and you
>can then run lower pressures for a better ride.
my garage. The rationale was that maybe I could keep up with
the roadies who are passing me at 18-20 mph while carrying on
relaxed conversations.
In fact, I found 28's at 90 psi tb good for 1 or 1.5 mph cruising
speed...
But I have gone back to my 38's because of the greatly-increased
comfort factor.
--
Pete Cresswell
thirty-six
May 31, 2012, 10:17:15 AM5/31/12
to
On May 31, 1:35 am, Peter H <hanebu...@rogers.com> wrote:
> I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
> problem.
>
> I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
> It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
If the nipples are without a threadlock then they can rattle loose
> problem.
>
> I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
> It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
causing loss of tension in the spokes and a variation from true
running. The simplest work is to fix the nipples by using a gum
rubbed between spoke and nipple. Even simpler is to check that the
nipples are self-adjusting. Take a marker and mark all the nipples
from one side of the wheel, taking the mark onto the spoke. This will
show if the nipples really turn when the wheel is taken over rough
roads, some wheels will make much noise yet the nipples don't budge.
> sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
case, it possibly points to the spokes being too tight anyway, which
leads to buckling.
>
> It's a 700 cc rim with a disk brake rotor and my lbs just says bring
> the wheel in and we'll true it. They have nothing stronger.
wheelbuild, not necessarily flimsy components. It would help if the
component parts were described along with your weight, any luggage and
how hard you actually ride in comparison to others and their
experiences..
>
> Is there a 700 cc, disk brake rear wheel out there that can take the
> punishment? The streets I ride on are brutal and I ride with a slick
> pumped to about 110 psi. Perhaps I'm asking too much.
David Scheidt
May 31, 2012, 11:48:35 AM5/31/12
to
Jay Beattie <jbea...@lindsayhart.com> wrote:
I've been happy with my Velocity Dyads so far. Don't have a huge
amount of milage on them yet, but they get a fair amount of abuse.
They're on my 29" commuter, so they go over and off curbs, through the
wonders of the Chicago Department of Making Mysterious Holes in
Streets's work, and so on. They take a perfectly reasonable amount of
tension (Velocity recommended 110-120 KgF), so you can avoid using
spoke goop. I've got a 32 spoke rear on the fancy reflective version,
which was a machine built wheel around afline gear hub that cost less
than I could find just a hub, and a 36 front that I built around a
dynamo humb.
--
sig 78
amount of milage on them yet, but they get a fair amount of abuse.
They're on my 29" commuter, so they go over and off curbs, through the
wonders of the Chicago Department of Making Mysterious Holes in
Streets's work, and so on. They take a perfectly reasonable amount of
tension (Velocity recommended 110-120 KgF), so you can avoid using
spoke goop. I've got a 32 spoke rear on the fancy reflective version,
which was a machine built wheel around afline gear hub that cost less
than I could find just a hub, and a 36 front that I built around a
dynamo humb.
--
sig 78
datakoll
May 31, 2012, 12:15:44 PM5/31/12
to
look in here
https://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en&tab=gw#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=mtb+forum&oq=mtb+forum&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_l=hp.12...0.0.8.4816.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0...0.0.KvNizFyw5Tc&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=1ddfc57b13f7bd6e&biw=1152&bih=635
first search reveals hard data under a mtn of ad debris...
my experience with spoke locktite which is excellent for riders with a not too difficult road surface for shorter rides but when the HOLE is plunged into and out
the rim bends, terminally. A 'normal' rim.
So a double wall rim with DT 2.0. Bombproof. Not so fast, My first new one found an antique storm grate with no cross bars at 20 miles. DOA. Cost ? unnnngh $120 ?
But the tire costs ? $30 ? no protection from the storm sewer grate but elevates the normal or extra rim as a suspension which the rim isnot.
think SUSPENSION. See Conti's ad copy for their wide commuter tire range - anti-Schwalbe
https://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en&tab=gw#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=mtb+forum&oq=mtb+forum&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_l=hp.12...0.0.8.4816.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0...0.0.KvNizFyw5Tc&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=1ddfc57b13f7bd6e&biw=1152&bih=635
first search reveals hard data under a mtn of ad debris...
my experience with spoke locktite which is excellent for riders with a not too difficult road surface for shorter rides but when the HOLE is plunged into and out
the rim bends, terminally. A 'normal' rim.
So a double wall rim with DT 2.0. Bombproof. Not so fast, My first new one found an antique storm grate with no cross bars at 20 miles. DOA. Cost ? unnnngh $120 ?
But the tire costs ? $30 ? no protection from the storm sewer grate but elevates the normal or extra rim as a suspension which the rim isnot.
think SUSPENSION. See Conti's ad copy for their wide commuter tire range - anti-Schwalbe
landotter
May 31, 2012, 12:53:20 PM5/31/12
to
the high end there. For rough roads, a 42-47mm tire at 40-50 psi will
save your wheels, ass, hands, and teeth. If that's too extreme--a 32
at 70--but 110? Nuts.
AMuzi
May 31, 2012, 4:09:30 PM5/31/12
to
What was the manufacturer's recommended tension and at what
tension is your wheel?
Rider weight?
48 spokes? 40 spokes?
How wide a tire are you using?
What rim is it? A Chukker? CliffHanger?
(oh, and your wheel size is 700C, smaller than 700A or 700B,
not one and a half pints)
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
Tom $herman (-_-)
Jun 1, 2012, 12:35:26 AM6/1/12
to
On 5/31/2012 11:53 AM, landotter wrote:
> [...]
suspension.
> [...]
> Yes. 110psi is ridiculous for anything but a race tire--and even on
> the high end there. For rough roads, a 42-47mm tire at 40-50 psi will
> save your wheels, ass, hands, and teeth. If that's too extreme--a 32
> at 70--but 110? Nuts.
I have run 53-406 Maxxis Hookworm tires at 110 psi, but that is with
> the high end there. For rough roads, a 42-47mm tire at 40-50 psi will
> save your wheels, ass, hands, and teeth. If that's too extreme--a 32
> at 70--but 110? Nuts.
suspension.
Tom $herman (-_-)
Jun 1, 2012, 12:36:37 AM6/1/12
to
On 5/30/2012 11:52 PM, Király wrote:
> Peter H<hane...@rogers.com> wrote:
>> > I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
>> > problem.
>> >
>> > I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
>> > It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
>> > sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
> Who's been doing the tightening and re-truing? You or the LBS? It sounds
> like the spokes aren't being tightened up enough and/or being properly
> stress relieved after truing.[...]
> Peter H<hane...@rogers.com> wrote:
>> > I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
>> > problem.
>> >
>> > I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
>> > It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
>> > sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
> Who's been doing the tightening and re-truing? You or the LBS? It sounds
> like the spokes aren't being tightened up enough and/or being properly
And/or having the spoke wind-up removed while tensioning.
Király
Jun 1, 2012, 1:39:24 PM6/1/12
to
"Tom $herman (-_-)" <""twshermanREMOVE\"@thi$southslope.net"> wrote:
> And/or having the spoke wind-up removed while tensioning.
Of course. For full accuracy, a small label on each spoke all pointing
> And/or having the spoke wind-up removed while tensioning.
in the same direction like little flags, will tell the truer if there is
any windup. But a quarter turn backwards after each half or full turn
forwards has always done it for me. Never had to retrue.
DirtRoadie
Jun 1, 2012, 4:09:17 PM6/1/12
to
indicator of wind-up. No guessing or estimating. But on a round spoke
all it takes is a black mark with a felt tip pen. That's one of the
most useful tricks I ever discovered for wheel building. Zero post
build "pinging."
DR
James
Jun 2, 2012, 3:28:33 AM6/2/12
to
--
JS.
thirty-six
Jun 2, 2012, 8:30:07 AM6/2/12
to
Tom $herman (-_-)
Jun 2, 2012, 6:56:20 PM6/2/12
to
As several have pointed out here in the past, buying a machine-built
wheel with standard components and doing final tensioning, truing, and
stress-relief by hand may be the best deal in many cases.
thirty-six
Jun 2, 2012, 8:14:03 PM6/2/12
to
On Jun 2, 11:56 pm, "Tom $herman (-_-)" <""twshermanREMOVE\"@THI
Might help, some.
For assistance in the final part:
http://youtu.be/K_d-Lj1O7_8
might help, some.
For assistance in the final part:
http://youtu.be/K_d-Lj1O7_8
might help, some.
Peter H
Jun 3, 2012, 10:24:23 AM6/3/12
to
http://www.trekbikes.com/ca/en/bikes/2011/archive/montare
I'm about 185 lbs and I have panniers on the back, which are never empty.
I know that I'm punishing the bike riding with 110 lbs in the tires, but just thought that in 2012 perhaps we could handle this. I've run this pressure in my road bike without any problems and the only difference I can see it that I'm adding weight.
I went to a different bike shop yesterday and they recommended a different rim, so will give it a try.
http://www.mavic.com/en/product/rims/mountain-bike/rims/XM-317
They had a rim that looked to be exactly what I'm looking for, but they only come in pairs and were $1,000.00, which is what I paid for the entire bike.
Thaks for all replies.
Peter H
David Scheidt
Jun 3, 2012, 3:09:21 PM6/3/12
to
Peter H <hane...@rogers.com> wrote:
:http://www.trekbikes.com/ca/en/bikes/2011/archive/montare
:I'm about 185 lbs and I have panniers on the back, which are never empty.
:I know that I'm punishing the bike riding with 110 lbs in the tires, but
just thought that in 2012 perhaps we could handle this. I've run this
pressure in my road bike without any problems and the only difference I
can see it that I'm adding weight.
Unless you're looking for an excuse to have your fillings replaced,
there's no benefit of running 110 psi in 38mm wide tires. There are
lots of negatives, apart from possible damage to the wheels. Ride
quality decreases, rolling resistence increases.
:I went to a different bike shop yesterday and they recommended a different rim, so will give it a try.
sig 91
:http://www.trekbikes.com/ca/en/bikes/2011/archive/montare
:I'm about 185 lbs and I have panniers on the back, which are never empty.
:I know that I'm punishing the bike riding with 110 lbs in the tires, but
just thought that in 2012 perhaps we could handle this. I've run this
pressure in my road bike without any problems and the only difference I
can see it that I'm adding weight.
there's no benefit of running 110 psi in 38mm wide tires. There are
lots of negatives, apart from possible damage to the wheels. Ride
quality decreases, rolling resistence increases.
:I went to a different bike shop yesterday and they recommended a different rim, so will give it a try.
:http://www.mavic.com/en/product/rims/mountain-bike/rims/XM-317
:They had a rim that looked to be exactly what I'm looking for, but they only come in pairs and were $1,000.00, which is what I paid for the entire bike.
:Thaks for all replies.
:Peter H
--
:They had a rim that looked to be exactly what I'm looking for, but they only come in pairs and were $1,000.00, which is what I paid for the entire bike.
:Thaks for all replies.
:Peter H
sig 91
Király
Jun 3, 2012, 10:50:23 PM6/3/12
to
Peter H <hane...@rogers.com> wrote:
> I know that I'm punishing the bike riding with 110 lbs in the tires,
> but just thought that in 2012 perhaps we could handle this.
Overinflating by that much could land you in a lot of trouble, like
> I know that I'm punishing the bike riding with 110 lbs in the tires,
> but just thought that in 2012 perhaps we could handle this.
wheel failure. Wider tires need lower pressure for maximum performance.
Note the 32 psi in car and truck tires, and the ~20 psi in fat Formula 1
auto racing tires.
thirty-six
Jun 4, 2012, 4:48:44 AM6/4/12
to
On Jun 3, 3:24 pm, Peter H <hanebu...@rogers.com> wrote:
> On Wednesday, May 30, 2012 8:35:12 PM UTC-4, Peter H wrote:
> > I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
> > problem.
>
> > I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
> > It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
> > sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
>
> > It's a 700 cc rim with a disk brake rotor and my lbs just says bring
> > the wheel in and we'll true it. They have nothing stronger.
>
> > Is there a 700 cc, disk brake rear wheel out there that can take the
> > punishment? The streets I ride on are brutal and I ride with a slick
> > pumped to about 110 psi. Perhaps I'm asking too much.
>
> > TIA for all replies.
>
> > Peter H
>
> The bike is a Trek Montare
>
> http://www.trekbikes.com/ca/en/bikes/2011/archive/montare
>
> I'm about 185 lbs and I have panniers on the back, which are never empty.
>
> I know that I'm punishing the bike riding with 110 lbs in the tires, but just thought that in 2012 perhaps we could handle this. I've run this pressure in my road bike without any problems and the only difference I can see it that I'm adding weight.
Too high a pressure for that wide tyre. That pressure is bearing on
> On Wednesday, May 30, 2012 8:35:12 PM UTC-4, Peter H wrote:
> > I hope someone from this excellent group can help me with this
> > problem.
>
> > I'm a commuter who's rear wheel can't seem to take the punishment.
> > It's constantly going out of round and spokes are losing tension. It
> > sounds like I'm making popcorn on my ride into work.
>
> > It's a 700 cc rim with a disk brake rotor and my lbs just says bring
> > the wheel in and we'll true it. They have nothing stronger.
>
> > Is there a 700 cc, disk brake rear wheel out there that can take the
> > punishment? The streets I ride on are brutal and I ride with a slick
> > pumped to about 110 psi. Perhaps I'm asking too much.
>
> > TIA for all replies.
>
> > Peter H
>
> The bike is a Trek Montare
>
> http://www.trekbikes.com/ca/en/bikes/2011/archive/montare
>
> I'm about 185 lbs and I have panniers on the back, which are never empty.
>
> I know that I'm punishing the bike riding with 110 lbs in the tires, but just thought that in 2012 perhaps we could handle this. I've run this pressure in my road bike without any problems and the only difference I can see it that I'm adding weight.
the rim, all around the rim and presents an unecessary extra load to
the wheel. A wider tyre needs to have proportionally less pressure to
present the same load to the rim.
>
> I went to a different bike shop yesterday and they recommended a different rim, so will give it a try.http://www.mavic.com/en/product/rims/mountain-bike/rims/XM-317
That'll lighten your wallet.
> I went to a different bike shop yesterday and they recommended a different rim, so will give it a try.http://www.mavic.com/en/product/rims/mountain-bike/rims/XM-317
> They had a rim that looked to be exactly what I'm looking for, but they only come in pairs and were $1,000.00, which is what I paid for the entire bike.
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