Which Sun rim and ERD do have

xpzzzz

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Jun 1, 2012, 1:20:34 PM6/1/12

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Looks like a 27" to me; U-section single-wall clincher with boxes in the
corners, quite square, single eyelets, label says Sun Mistral Alloy Rims
made In USA, no number or size anyhere on it or the rim. Pinned joint;
decent-size bead hooks. Outside max is 27mm, bead hook inside is 21mm.

DirtRoadie

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Jun 1, 2012, 3:24:14 PM6/1/12

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The "Mistral" designation suggests it is an older version.
But if you can come up with an identification the following may help.

http://www.sun-ringle.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/SUNRingle_rim_chart.pdf

And maybe not.
DR

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datakoll

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Jun 2, 2012, 12:42:12 PM6/2/12

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we are running a survey.
What does ERD mean to you ?

How are you using it ?
to determine spoke length ?

why did you choose the methods you are using ?

DirtRoadie

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Jun 2, 2012, 11:08:36 PM6/2/12

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ERD is a concept that I detest because it relates more to an ethereal
"measurement" of an assembled wheel than to measurements of the
components which will be used to build a wheel.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.tech/msg/53f663f3824aa0e9

So to me it means "somebody wasn't thinking when they came up with
the concept."

DR

datakoll

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Jun 2, 2012, 11:23:34 PM6/2/12

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where did the poster go ? Its his survey.

POOOOOOOOSSTAHHHHHHHHHH

DR, a standard was needed. Do the manufactiurers state an ERD ? I forgot to look.
The prob is/was people believe (belief is necessary) ERD = spoke length...wharehouse people. A good idea went into a blind alley. We were tyring to get spoke clac people to state this on the spoke clac sheet. Foregtabboutit. NADA. ??????

DirtRoadie

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Jun 2, 2012, 11:41:56 PM6/2/12

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Yup. It's a standard. A misguided one. A rim does NOT have a
measurement which corresponds to ERD until it is known what nipples
are to be used AND how far into those nipples the spoke should
extend. Short of the nipple slot? Flush with the bottom of the nipple
slot? Flush with the top of the nipple? Those are some of the
possibilities

ERD eliminates being able to take these into account with ACTUAL
measurements except by adjusting on the next go-round with the same
components.

Too late now, but a much better figure for manufacturers to provide
would have been ACTUAL ID of a rim. The plethora of existing spoke
calculators would far no worse by also requiring an ACTUAL figure for
the precise desired depth the spoke is to extend into the rim.

DR

datakoll

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Jun 3, 2012, 12:36:57 AM6/3/12

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been a long day...I doahno if an Actual is possob;e as a standard. LBS software tries to arrive at an actual spoke length but nipples and spoke threadings confuse the software. Wen I tried it, the program was erratic using 6mm nipples giving ndifferent answers. I chosemone and it was almost correct. Then I went home, built a Barto wheel beam buying the quadrent 8 experimental real time spokes...as why not ? I was wasting scads time and money with spoke clacs.

Like you can blow a fuse on this nshit buying from Nbar or Universal....Harris whom should know better....

read on

https://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en&tab=gw#hl=en&output=search&sclient=psy-ab&q=Bicycle:+what+is+ERD&oq=Bicycle:+what+is+ERD&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_l=hp.12...2275.19682.1.21666.20.20.0.0.0.0.0.0..2.0...0.0.7sylkqKEec0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=16a76c5f7e072d5b&biw=1152&bih=635

DirtRoadie

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Jun 3, 2012, 12:49:52 AM6/3/12

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"fair no worse" not "far no worse"

Dan O

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Jun 3, 2012, 1:08:56 AM6/3/12

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On Jun 2, 9:36 pm, datakoll <datak...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> been a long day...I doahno if an Actual is possob;e as a standard. LBS software tries to arrive at an actual spoke length but nipples and spoke threadings confuse the software. Wen I tried it, the program was erratic using 6mm nipples giving ndifferent answers. I chosemone and it was almost correct. Then I went home, built a Barto wheel beam buying the quadrent 8 experimental real time spokes...as why not ? I was wasting scads time and money with spoke clacs.
>
> Like you can blow a fuse on this nshit buying from Nbar or Universal....Harris whom should know better....
>
> read on
>

> https://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en&tab=gw#hl=en&output=search&sclient...

I was very happy (happy like not many things in life can make you) to
walk into an LBS that would cut and roll my own spokes - spokes that I
brought in with me - for two bita apiece while I wait and browse the
showroom.

datakoll

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Jun 3, 2012, 1:23:23 PM6/3/12

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yeah, I ran into a 'weed doahn have it' on spoke length with optional rolling but the die costs for wear/replacement doubled or tripled spoke costs.

AMuzi

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Jun 3, 2012, 2:05:32 PM6/3/12

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I hear you, but we separate the classic "inner diameter at
the nipple heads" which we physically measure and use here
from "some larger number with a fudge factor included"
(Mavic and their minions). The concept is fine but nowadays
the waters of "define ERD" are muddy

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

AMuzi

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Jun 3, 2012, 2:36:16 PM6/3/12

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ahem.

"calculators would fare no worse..."

DirtRoadie

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Jun 3, 2012, 2:48:13 PM6/3/12

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Thanks. I was closer the first time. Third time's the charm.
DR