Tyler Got the Short End of the Stick
BLafferty
"The documents also show the vast discrepancy in bonus payments. An
invoice from August 2001 shows Armstrong earned $1.47 million for stage
wins, days wearing the leader's yellow jersey and the overall win at
that year's Tour.
Teammate Tyler Hamilton, whose contract stipulated that he would be the
second-highest paid rider after Armstrong, earned just $150,000 in
bonuses for the same race."
Quite a disparity. That kind of disparity doesn't build much loyalty
over the long run.
raamman
> http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/cycling/news/story?id=6019436&campaign=...
>
> "The documents also show the vast discrepancy in bonus payments. An
> invoice from August 2001 shows Armstrong earned $1.47 million for stage
> wins, days wearing the leader's yellow jersey and the overall win at
> that year's Tour.
>
> Teammate Tyler Hamilton, whose contract stipulated that he would be the
> second-highest paid rider after Armstrong, earned just $150,000 in
> bonuses for the same race."
>
> Quite a disparity. That kind of disparity doesn't build much loyalty
> over the long run.
money buys service, not loyalty,
Fred Flintstein
Yeah, I'll bet he's really out to get Wiesel for that.
Haha! You dumbasses all thought it was about Armstrong!
Fred Flintstein
PS Whatever you do, don't get too deep inside Laff's head.
It's really fucking scary in there.
RicodJour
> http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/cycling/news/story?id=6019436&campaign=...
>
> invoice from August 2001 shows Armstrong earned $1.47 million for stage
> wins, days wearing the leader's yellow jersey and the overall win at
> that year's Tour.
>
> Teammate Tyler Hamilton, whose contract stipulated that he would be the
> second-highest paid rider after Armstrong, earned just $150,000 in
> bonuses for the same race."
>
> Quite a disparity. That kind of disparity doesn't build much loyalty
> over the long run.
Let me sum up your position, Jowls.
Oh, LANCE, why are you ignoring me?! Sob. Fwap, fwap, fwap.
If Tyler could have gotten more money with another team, he would have
taken the job unless the difference was outweighed by other perks.
You know, little things, like having an excellent shot at being on the
winning team at the Tour. Provide a list of the teams that got into
the Tyler bidding war. Oh, none? Got it, dumbass.
R
BLafferty
the time Tyler had any idea the disparity was a great as it was. Now
that he knows, what effect will that knowledge have on whatever loyalty
to the Uniballer is left?
Fred Fredburger
> Your FuckWit brain
It is impossible to overstate the persuasive power of posts that start
like this.
derf...@gmail.com
<FredFredF...@Where.Are.The.Nachos> wrote:
> It is impossible to overstate the persuasive power of posts that start
> like this.
And people wonder why he didn't get elected to the "other USCF"
board ...
(well, actually, they probably don't wonder)
Mike Jacoubowsky
news:XNKdnaBebImUUqzQ...@giganews.com...
Regarding the "disparity" of pay between Lance and Tyler, you've first got
to level the playing field. Did Tyler win the overall GC? No. Slash $1
million. How many stages did Lance win? 4. How many did Tyler win? 0. How
many days in Yellow for Lance? 8. Tyler? 0. For all those things Lance had
bonuses paid.
What did Tyler do that he should have received a bonus for?
If we want to make a case about Tyler being paid fairly, don't we need to
know what sort of incentives there may have been in his contract, incentives
that he nevertheless FAILED to deliver on? Or do you believe he failed
because of the lack of bonuses? That Lance was never doped on drugs, he was
doped on $$$?
Brian, what about the disparity between the winner's share and loser in a
civil court proceeding involving lots of $$$? Is that unfair?
--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
Mike Jacoubowsky
Tyler didn't know that winners are rewarded more than losers? That
Quarterbacks make more than a defensive lineman? That the winning side in a
lawsuit gains financially? What is it exactly that you think Tyler didn't
know? That $1.47 million figure was entirely incentive pay, bonuses for
doing well.
If Tyler had been paid UCI minimum and was screwed out of opportunities to
make bonuses in his contract (which we have not heard evidence of, far as I
know), sure, you could try and make a case.
This is pathetically poor reporting. They even try to make it seem like a
revelation that USPS was being paid a lot of money. I asked the Trek liason
at the time how much the sponsorship was costing Trek (he wouldn't tell me)
and how much USPS. He said $8 million for USPS, and that's what I told
customers. And it turns out that's the correct number. I had no idea it was
a state secret. Far as I knew, it was common knowledge. But not in today's
revisionist, find-any-angle-to-make-Lance-look-bad media scrum.
RicodJour
wrote:
>
> Regarding the "disparity" of pay between Lance and Tyler, you've first got
> to level the playing field. Did Tyler win the overall GC? No. Slash $1
> million. How many stages did Lance win? 4. How many did Tyler win? 0. How
> many days in Yellow for Lance? 8. Tyler? 0. For all those things Lance had
> bonuses paid.
>
> What did Tyler do that he should have received a bonus for?
He waved the peloton to slow down after LANCE went cross country after
Beloki crashed and burned. That shows teamwork. BTW, isn't it
customary for the winner of the Tour to turn over a portion of his
winnings to his team? And didn't LANCE go around handing out
something like 50 or 100 grand checks to guys at the victory party one
year?
Jowls' cherry picks data that he knows is wrong and posts it so he can
fluff himself. But don't blame him - you try keeping up an erection
until LANCE gets indicted.
R
BLafferty
Come on. Of course Tyler knew of a disparity. Do you think Armstrong
told him he made $1.47 million? Unlikely.
>
> If Tyler had been paid UCI minimum and was screwed out of opportunities
> to make bonuses in his contract (which we have not heard evidence of,
> far as I know), sure, you could try and make a case.
>
> This is pathetically poor reporting. They even try to make it seem like
> a revelation that USPS was being paid a lot of money. I asked the Trek
> liason at the time how much the sponsorship was costing Trek (he
> wouldn't tell me) and how much USPS. He said $8 million for USPS, and
> that's what I told customers. And it turns out that's the correct
> number. I had no idea it was a state secret. Far as I knew, it was
> common knowledge. But not in today's revisionist,
> find-any-angle-to-make-Lance-look-bad media scrum.
I think the main point ESPN picked up on was the anti-drug/morals clause
insisted upon by Postal in the renewal contract. That will have
consequences for the Tailwind guys.
BLafferty
> "BLafferty" <b...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:XNKdnaBebImUUqzQ...@giganews.com...
>> http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/cycling/news/story?id=6019436&campaign=rss&source=OLYHeadlines
>>
>>
>> "The documents also show the vast discrepancy in bonus payments. An
>> invoice from August 2001 shows Armstrong earned $1.47 million for
>> stage wins, days wearing the leader's yellow jersey and the overall
>> win at that year's Tour.
>>
>> Teammate Tyler Hamilton, whose contract stipulated that he would be
>> the second-highest paid rider after Armstrong, earned just $150,000 in
>> bonuses for the same race."
>>
>> Quite a disparity. That kind of disparity doesn't build much loyalty
>> over the long run.
>
> Regarding the "disparity" of pay between Lance and Tyler, you've first
> got to level the playing field. Did Tyler win the overall GC? No. Slash
> $1 million. How many stages did Lance win? 4. How many did Tyler win? 0.
> How many days in Yellow for Lance? 8. Tyler? 0. For all those things
> Lance had bonuses paid.
>
> What did Tyler do that he should have received a bonus for?
>
> If we want to make a case about Tyler being paid fairly, don't we need
> to know what sort of incentives there may have been in his contract,
> incentives that he nevertheless FAILED to deliver on? Or do you believe
> he failed because of the lack of bonuses? That Lance was never doped on
> drugs, he was doped on $$$?
It isn't about being paid fairly. I think he probably was. The issue is
that now that that disparity is known, how will it play with Tyler and
others maintaining Omerta now.
Fred
>
> It isn't about being paid fairly. I think he probably was. The issue is
> that now that that disparity is known, how will it play with Tyler and
> others maintaining Omerta now.
>
You think they didn't know about the disparity back then?
dumbass... tsk, tsk
Fred
BLafferty
Try reading for comprehension. I wrote that he undoubtedly knew of the
disparity, but I doubt Armstrong or Tailwind told Tyler what Armstrong
actually received. You might want to contact Sylvan Learning Centers.
They're good at helping FuckTards like you.
RicodJour
>
> It isn't about being paid fairly. I think he probably was. The issue is
> that now that that disparity is known, how will it play with Tyler and
> others maintaining Omerta now.
Good point, Jowls. He knows he was paid fairly so he must have a bone
to pick. Sheesh.
Stop squeezing and let some blood back into the brain.
R
--D-y
wrote:
Very good two posts. Logical, reasoned.
Then the little man flew out of the clock and said "Fucktard!
Fucktard!".
All is in order. Bears are on TV.
--D-y
Fred Fredburger
> It isn't about being paid fairly. I think he probably was. The issue is
> that now that that disparity is known
Right. It was a big secret up until a couple days ago. No one knew.
Fred Flintstein
> Try reading for comprehension.
Dumbass,
Michael Press
BLafferty <b...@nowhere.com> wrote:
Is it not the case that much of the bonuses were race prizes
earned by LANCE all of which went into a pool and shared among
the other 8 riders; and that LANCE personally never took any
pool money?
And why are you standing up for a convicted doper?
--
Michael Press
RicodJour
> BLafferty <b...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>
> >http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/cycling/news/story?id=6019436&campaign=...
>
> > invoice from August 2001 shows Armstrong earned $1.47 million for stage
> > wins, days wearing the leader's yellow jersey and the overall win at
> > that year's Tour.
>
> > Teammate Tyler Hamilton, whose contract stipulated that he would be the
> > second-highest paid rider after Armstrong, earned just $150,000 in
> > bonuses for the same race."
>
> > Quite a disparity. That kind of disparity doesn't build much loyalty
> > over the long run.
>
> Is it not the case that much of the bonuses were race prizes
> earned by LANCE all of which went into a pool and shared among
> the other 8 riders; and that LANCE personally never took any
> pool money?
>
> And why are you standing up for a convicted doper?
It's his MO. If _anyone_ bashes LANCE, they're telling the truth, and
if _anyone_ has something good to say about LANCE, they're lying.
Likewise with any information, news, rumors, Ouija board results,
etc. But Jowls is a rationale guy and of course there's no bias
there.
R
blazing_saddles
If he can't read I'm sure someone told him on a bike ride.
Fred
That's not what you wrote, dumbass, and even if it was, it wouldn't
make any more sense than what you did write. When you said he now
knows of the disparity, the implication is that back then he did not.
You should try WRITING for comprehension.
Geez, what a ma-roon...
Fred
RicodJour
Don't be harsh on the guy. He performs a public service.
Every time he opens his mouth everybody in the room feels 20 IQ points
smarter.
R
Mike Jacoubowsky
So Tyler hasn't read the newspaper or the 'net these past few years? How
could he have missed the fireworks regarding the insuring company that
backed Lance's bonus and didn't want to pay? The amounts and specifics
were all laid out in the open. Again, there is nothing new here. Tyler
has had plenty of time to be upset over the fact that Lance got paid one
heck of a lot more than he did.
Mike Jacoubowsky
A team whose entire purpose was to deliver a TdF victory to Lance
Armstrong and it's a suprise that he got a $1 million bonus for winning?
>>
>> If Tyler had been paid UCI minimum and was screwed out of
>> opportunities
>> to make bonuses in his contract (which we have not heard evidence of,
>> far as I know), sure, you could try and make a case.
>>
>> This is pathetically poor reporting. They even try to make it seem
>> like
>> a revelation that USPS was being paid a lot of money. I asked the
>> Trek
>> liason at the time how much the sponsorship was costing Trek (he
>> wouldn't tell me) and how much USPS. He said $8 million for USPS, and
>> that's what I told customers. And it turns out that's the correct
>> number. I had no idea it was a state secret. Far as I knew, it was
>> common knowledge. But not in today's revisionist,
>> find-any-angle-to-make-Lance-look-bad media scrum.
>
> I think the main point ESPN picked up on was the anti-drug/morals
> clause insisted upon by Postal in the renewal contract. That will
> have consequences for the Tailwind guys.
Which like so much else is very old news.
Bring us something new and logical.
--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
RicodJour
You might as well tell Lazarus to get up and walk. It's gonna take a
miracle for that to happen.
R
Michael Press
"Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com> wrote:
> Bring us something new and logical.
Aww, come on. Both? One out of two is difficult enough.
--
Michael Press
Beloved Fred No. 1
> Don't be harsh on the guy. He performs a public service.
> Every time he opens his mouth everybody in the room feels 20 IQ points
> smarter.
And that's supposed to make anyone on rbr feel better ? Transfinite
arithmetic is not our strong point.
Michael Press
Fred
> In article <vscd08-m56....@donaldm.homeip.net>,
> "Beloved Fred No. 1" <n...@mailinator.com> wrote:
>
> > RicodJour wrote:
> > > Don't be harsh on the guy. He performs a public service.
> > > Every time he opens his mouth everybody in the room feels 20 IQ points
> > > smarter.
>
> > And that's supposed to make anyone on rbr feel better ? Transfinite
> > arithmetic is not our strong point.
>
> 1 + 1 = 1. All you need to know.
>
> --
> Michael Press
Yep, and nothing from nothing is nothing.
Fred
rickhopkins
Wow, a disparity in pay in sports where the super star of a team makes
more than the supporting cast - Lafathimself ought to win an award for
investigative journalism. O'Reily has been noted (check out Colbert's
report - very funny) to conclude there must be a God since the sun
goes up and the sun goes down, always the same. Maybe Lafatthimself
is providing another source of constancy and evidence of a God or,
maybe he is a stalker - kind of scary.
Rick
RicodJour
> On Jan 17, 2:04 pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> > "Beloved Fred No. 1" <n...@mailinator.com> wrote:
> > > RicodJour wrote:
>
> > > > Don't be harsh on the guy. He performs a public service.
> > > > Every time he opens his mouth everybody in the room feels 20 IQ points
> > > > smarter.
>
> > > And that's supposed to make anyone on rbr feel better ? Transfinite
> > > arithmetic is not our strong point.
>
> > 1 + 1 = 1. All you need to know.
>
Money from nothing and the chicks are free.
R
Beloved Fred No. 1
> 1 + 1 = 1. All you need to know.
Nonsense. 1 + 1 = 10. I learned that even before I learned to sing Daisy
and pass my Turing test.
Beloved Fred No. 1
> Money from nothing and the chicks are free.
Have you seen the chicks on rbr ?
Michael Press
"Beloved Fred No. 1" <no...@mailinator.com> wrote:
2 + 2 = 2.
--
Michael Press
Frederick the Great
<2f0b9574-c5ea-4d0b...@m20g2000prc.googlegroups.com>,
rickhopkins <rick_3...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Wow, a disparity in pay in sports where the super star of a team makes
> more than the supporting cast - Lafathimself ought to win an award for
> investigative journalism. O'Reily has been noted (check out Colbert's
> report - very funny) to conclude there must be a God since the sun
> goes up and the sun goes down, always the same. Maybe Lafatthimself
> is providing another source of constancy and evidence of a God or,
> maybe he is a stalker - kind of scary.
If Colbert is blasting somebody for saying the
"Sun comes up, the Sun goes down" that somebody
was probably talking to Chicken Little. You yourself
noted Laffety's impression of CL. So, I would
take O'Reilly's alleged position and agree with
you about Lafferty's rhetorical devices.
--
Old Fritz
Ryan Cousineau
> http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/cycling/news/story?id=6019436&campaign=...
>
> "The documents also show the vast discrepancy in bonus payments. An
> invoice from August 2001 shows Armstrong earned $1.47 million for stage
> wins, days wearing the leader's yellow jersey and the overall win at
> that year's Tour.
>
> Teammate Tyler Hamilton, whose contract stipulated that he would be the
> second-highest paid rider after Armstrong, earned just $150,000 in
> bonuses for the same race."
>
> Quite a disparity. That kind of disparity doesn't build much loyalty
> over the long run.
1) Pro cycling isn't a very serious sport, in terms of the money.
Noting that, first, this is the bonus money from the Tour, not the
total annual salary, that seems reasonable.
2) Lance is LANCE. TIOOYK. Tyler, especially in 2001, was Tyler. He
was the super domestique, and paid appropriately.
3) For comparison, here's a list of basketball salaries from one team:
http://content.usatoday.com/sportsdata/basketball/nba/Lakers/salaries/2009
I'd give the caveat that basketball really is more of a team game than
cycling, or at least that the pool of usable "lieutenants" in cycling
who could support a star rider is wide and deep. The pool of GC
contenders is narrower than the pool of top basketball players. Thus,
the star rider is worth proportionately more than the star basketball
player.
With that said, Kobe makes substantially more than any other player.
The starting 3 forwards make more than the rest of the team combined.
Lance got ten times as much bonus money as Tyler? Sounds about right.
And, after all, Tyler took a shot at leading his own team shortly
afterwards, on the assumption he could win big races on his own. His
salary almost certainly rose.
If anyone knows what the real take-home pay was for these pros, it
would be a more interesting comparison.
Also, I just want to point out this great photo of Rock Racing Tyler
Hamilton, taken by Richard Masoner:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Tyler_Hamilton_2008.jpg
-RjC.