They got Bonds on obstructing justice
Vagina Gorilla
Mike Jacoubowsky
news:9e61130e-00d2-4ab3...@l6g2000vbn.googlegroups.com...
> Lance will be convicted for obstructing the Olsen Twins
So how does this read? Novitsky's too incompetent to nail someone whose
ex-mistress graphically details the changes to his gonads caused by steroids
in a way that would scare the crap out of most high school wrestlers &
football players? I mean c'mon, if you can't get Bonds on something so
obvious...
Or are we going to see people thinking that now Novitsky's got time to do
things right, and that Lance doesn't have as much star-power as Barry Bonds
and thus will be easier to convict? I think he's got another thing coming if
that's his thinking, because NOBODY likes Barry Bonds. Lance, I'm sure, does
a whole lot better in polling.
Call me... not impressed. Call Lance... not too worried.
--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
Fred
wrote:
>NOBODY likes Barry Bonds. Lance, I'm sure, does
> a whole lot better in polling.
>
> Call me... not impressed. Call Lance... not too worried.
>
> --Mike Jacoubowsky
> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
Are you sure?
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/umedia/20110414/largeimage.e30fbb4688ab2c5e995ce728a88ed2d1.gif
Fred
Jim Feeley
Don't look to Jeff Novitzky here. Look to the murkiness of the questions
directed to Bonds during his Grand Jury questioning, the refusal of Greg
Anderson to testify, Dr. Arthur Ting's testimony that completely contradicted
that of another prosecution witness, and (according to some trial lawyers) the
performance of the US Attorneys. Novitzky's testimony was solid, but not at the
heart of this case... And once the trial starts, things are more in the hands of
the lawyers than the investigators; you know, like on Law & Order, Special
Doping Unit.
The Lance case, what little I know about it, is pretty different from all the
BALCO-related cases. Past performance is no guarantee of future returns.
But let's ask: Did Novitzky achieve his goal? The answer might be yes.
Jim
--
Jim
Jim Feeley
POV Media
William Fred
news:18faf181-5173-45f8...@a21g2000prj.googlegroups.com:
> On Apr 13, 9:22 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
> wrote:
>>NOBODY likes Barry Bonds. Lance, I'm sure, does
>> a whole lot better in polling.
>>
>> Call me... not impressed. Call Lance... not too worried.
>>
>
> Are you sure?
>
> http://d.yimg.com/a/p/umedia/20110414/largeimage.e30fbb4688ab2c5e995ce7
> 28a88ed2d1.gif
Right. And given that now all juries in the U.S. are composed entirely
of Frenchmen, Armstrong is probably wandering around his house going "I
wonder if that light fixture would support my weight."
--
Bill Fred
Choppy Warburton
wrote:
Lance is already one of the most detestable cunts on the planet
Fred
wrote:
No, with the exception of a few diehard haters, many of them regulars
on RBR, he's actually pretty well respected. You may detest him, but
most don't.
Fred
Mike Jacoubowsky
news:18faf181-5173-45f8...@a21g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
On Apr 13, 9:22 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
wrote:
>NOBODY likes Barry Bonds. Lance, I'm sure, does
> a whole lot better in polling.
>
> Call me... not impressed. Call Lance... not too worried.
>
> --Mike Jacoubowsky
> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
========
Are you sure?
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/umedia/20110414/largeimage.e30fbb4688ab2c5e995ce728a88ed2d1.gif
Fred
========
Funny, but seriously out of date. Lance made a lot of fans in France
when he did the French thing by becoming the "heroic loser" when he took
3rd. Pretty amazing to see. That won the French Press over, because they
love to write of epic battles lost. Very different style of sports
writing in France than here.
--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
William R. Mattil
>
> Lance is already one of the most detestable cunts on the planet
One of ABs sock puppets ?
Bill
--
William R. Mattil
Kurgan Gringioni
"Jim Feeley" <jfe...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:9CC43429-D9EC-445C-A267-653AEA286C41%jfe...@gmail.com...
:
: The Lance case, what little I know about it, is pretty different from all
: BALCO-related cases. Past performance is no guarantee of future returns.
:
: But let's ask: Did Novitzky achieve his goal? The answer might be yes.
Dumbass -
He did not.
Obstruction of justice means Bonds over-obfuscated to the grand jury. It's
not jack. The other BALCO people who got that particular conviction didn't
do jail time. Home confinement.
thanks,
Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.
Jim Feeley
Novitzky did if his goal was to (perhaps deservedly) trash the reputation of
Bonds and a bunch of other athletes and "lift the veil" off PED use in track
and basball. If the question was "did the US Attorneys achieve their goal?"
then I'd agree with you.
Home confinement isn't much. But more significantly, Trevor Graham is driving a
bus (last I knew). Tammy Thomas isn't in law school.
you're welcome,
Fred Flintstein
Dumbass,
He's negotiating his plea bargain to testify against Wiesel. I can't
believe everyone has forgotten about Wiesel.
Fred Flintstein
Mike Jacoubowsky
I don't think it likely Barry Bonds will have to drive a bus anytime soon.
Nothing Novitsky (or accomplices) has done will have had much, if any,
impact on Barry Bonds' financial situation. Nor is it likely that other
athletes are going to look at this case and say "Oh my goodness, I'd better
not dope because look what happened to Barry Bonds' career!"
Too little, much too late.
Trevor who? And Tammy? You're talking horses of an entirely different color
from Barry Bonds. Marion Jones would be a much better example. Neither
Treovr nor Tammy could afford anything close to the quality of legal counsel
that Barry (or Lance) can.
How many years have gone past without ANYTHING of substance (with the
exception of Marion Jones) coming out of all of this? How could it possibly
be considered worthy of such effort? If Novitsky wants to make a difference,
he needs to go after the people at the top, not athletes, not coaches even,
but the team owners. Make it clear that nobody is above the law, and maybe
you'll see a change in attitude
A. Dumas
> I can't believe everyone has forgotten about Wiesel.
Weisel, on the other hand..
Jim Feeley
I hear what your saying. But maybe we can look at it this way:
The financial loses are bummer, but not the crux for any of the defendents.
Trevor and Tammy both lost what they really cared about. Trevor can't coach.
Tammy can't become a lawyer. Their tattered athletic reputations were further
shredded. Bonds probably lost the chance to remove the asterisk from his record;
he's branded a cheater, not the greatest baseball hitter ever.
And I agree that other athletes won't choose to not dope because of the Bonds
verdict. But I don't know if that was one of Novitzky's goals.
I attended the Thomas and Graham trials, and part of the Bonds trial. They all
had very good legal representation. Tammy's lawyer, Ethan Balogh, did a great
job and the judge even said so from the bench (during sentencing, IIRC). There's
a rumor that Balogh was partly compensated by some of Bonds' legal team. Who
knows? I do know that a bunch of Bonds' team attended the trial, probably just
treating her as a canary in a coal mine so they'd have a hint of how the
government would present its case, how Novitzky and Catlin did on the stand, and
all that. Bill Keane is a former US Attorney and he represented Graham. Keane, a
private attorney, got paid through the Federal Public Defender system (ie- by
you and me).
Now was it worth all the effort? Probably not. But Novitzky wasn't spending the
money. And again, you could say that after all the press coverage, the MLB's
reluctant implementation of steroid testing, the congressional hearings, Bush's
mention of steroids in a state of the union address, the enlarged asterisk next
to Bonds' record (and perhaps a pending erasure of that record), Novitsky did
get what he wanted.
Is that the difference he "should" have wanted? I don't know. Did he get some
balls rolling? Yes.
Was it worth the cost and will it have any lasting impact? Hmm...
Fred Fredburger
> Home confinement isn't much. But more significantly, Trevor Graham is driving a
> bus (last I knew). Tammy Thomas isn't in law school.
Pretty much anyone who's ever been a professional cyclist has already
paid their debt to society.
Scott
what? How do you figure?
T. Miller
> Lance will be convicted for obstructing the Olsen Twins
Saying they got Bonds on obstructing justice is like saying they got
Dillinger on a parking violation. If this is the best they could do
Lance doesn't have to worry.
Mike Jacoubowsky
All good points. Tammy especially, although I seem to have much less
sympathy for a coach like Trevor, and in fact think that Trevor and
those above him, the entire coaching chain, the franchise owners,
they're the ones who should have a responsibility for what goes on and
feel the strongest punishment. It should be treated as an ill-gotten
gains thing in my book; the franchise benefits from the cheating, so the
franchise should pay.
If you think about it, so far, they haven't gone after those who make
the rules. Think about that. Why do we expect the rules to change when
those who make them may be seen to benefit from the cheating that goes
on? Only when it has the potential to hurt those who make the rules will
the rules likely change for the better.
Kurgan Gringioni
"T. Miller" <thisw...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:44824468-1c5d-4ae1...@q12g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
Dumbass -
The problem with Novitsky's whole scheme is the standard for criminal
convictions, beyond a reasonable doubt, is very, very high.
thanks,
Kurgan. presented by Grinigoni.
William Fred
news:jfidndbAS_Z08zrQ...@giganews.com:
>
> He's negotiating his plea bargain to testify against Wiesel. I can't
> believe everyone has forgotten about Wiesel.
>
Is Wiesel the one who has the grudge against Armstrong, or one of the
ones who someone who has a grudge against Armstrong has a grudge against?
These people all look alike to me.
--
Bill Fred
RicodJour
>
> I attended the Thomas and Graham trials, and part of the Bonds trial.
Broadcasting your masochistic tendencies - how RBR of you. :)~
I'd rather have my eye put out slowly with a red-hot knitting needle
than sit through one of those dog and pony shows.
R
William Fred
a67a-d92...@j12g2000prg.googlegroups.com:
He meant that in the sense that you wouldn't get the joke.
--
Bill Fred
Simply Fred
> Is Wiesel the one who has the grudge against Armstrong, or one of the
> ones who someone who has a grudge against Armstrong has a grudge against?
> These people all look alike to me.
Perhaps you can classify them according to teste size.
Fred
wrote:
> "Fred" <fred.gar...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:18faf181-5173-45f8...@a21g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 13, 9:22 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
> wrote:
>
> >NOBODY likes Barry Bonds. Lance, I'm sure, does
> > a whole lot better in polling.
>
> > Call me... not impressed. Call Lance... not too worried.
>
> > --Mike Jacoubowsky
> > Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
> > Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
>
> ========
> Are you sure?
>
>
> Fred
> ========
>
> Funny, but seriously out of date. Lance made a lot of fans in France
> when he did the French thing by becoming the "heroic loser" when he took
> 3rd. Pretty amazing to see. That won the French Press over, because they
> love to write of epic battles lost. Very different style of sports
> writing in France than here.
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReactionBicycles.com
Out of date? That's the strip from 04/14/11, the day I posted the
link. I said that's pretty timely. Not relevant, though. I happen
to agree with you re: whether LA should be all that worried.
Fred
Fred Fredburger
I cannot improve upon that answer.
Jim Feeley
> On Apr 14, 8:19 pm, Jim Feeley <jfee...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I attended the Thomas and Graham trials, and part of the Bonds trial.
>
> Broadcasting your masochistic tendencies - how RBR of you. :)~
Covering RAAM would be more fun.
Actually, it wasn't so bad. The judge let us use laptops in the
courtroom. And by the time Bonds rolled around, there was WiFi in court.
Besides, it's all part of the job.
> I'd rather have my eye put out slowly with a red-hot knitting needle
> than sit through one of those dog and pony shows.
Thats why I wasn't at all of Bonds. Graham and Thomas were more
interesting, at least to me.
Jim Feeley
I agree. Strange that Bonds, Thomas, et al are prosecuted for lying, but the
Wall Street execs who lied to Congress over issues of much greater import
aren't.
I'm following the reactions of sports czars to all these scandals:
http://twitter.com/#!/fakebudselig
http://twitter.com/#!/UCI_Overlord
BTW- the best long-term coverage of Bonds has been in The Onion.
Back in 2006:
http://www.onionsportsnetwork.com/articles/barry-bonds-took-steroids-reports-
everyone-who-has,1914/
After the first week of the Bonds trial:
http://www.onionsportsnetwork.com/articles/criminal-case-of-usa-v-steroidusing-
liar-barry-bon,19826/
I completely agree with your last paragraph. Sigh.
I think I'll go for a nice long ride tomorrow.