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Cicero Venatio

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Aug 31, 2010, 9:13:16 PM8/31/10
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Didn't Fignon himself blame the performance enhancing drugs for his
cancer? I'll bet a lot of cyclists will lose some sleep tonight,
wondering if they'll be next.

Amit Ghosh

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Sep 1, 2010, 1:59:36 AM9/1/10
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dumbass,

maybe you should wonder about what a big dick you are.

Kurgan Gringioni

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Sep 1, 2010, 2:52:14 AM9/1/10
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"Cicero Venatio" <jazz...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c4ydnQQQm4U2NeDR...@earthlink.com...
: Didn't Fignon himself blame the performance enhancing drugs for his
: cancer?

Jackass -

He didn't do that at all.

He thinks maybe it was a factor, but he really didn't know.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Uncle Dave

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Sep 1, 2010, 4:55:05 AM9/1/10
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On Sep 1, 7:52 am, "Kurgan Gringioni" <soulinthemach...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> "Cicero Venatio" <jazzyb...@hotmail.com> wrote in message

>
> news:c4ydnQQQm4U2NeDR...@earthlink.com...
> : Didn't Fignon himself blame the performance enhancing drugs for his
> : cancer?
>
> Jackass -
>
> He didn't do that at all.
>
> He thinks maybe it was a factor, but he really didn't know.

It's a god point though. Before the latest set of drugs scandals -
i.e. those which blew up just before the millenium - I remember
remarking to my wife on how odd it was that so many top cyclists that
I read about in my youth and who rode in the 50s and 60s were dying
off. I wondered then whether drugs had something to do with it.
Buggered if I'd trade in years off the end of my life for fame in my
youth, but then I've never been a top sportsman...

UD

BLafferty

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Sep 1, 2010, 7:37:31 AM9/1/10
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It might have more to do with being French and eating certain food and
drinking. Interesting that Jacques A. dies of stomach cancer and
Fignon's started as intestinal cancer. Anyone know how French stomach
cancer rates compare to other European countries?

Anton Berlin

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Sep 1, 2010, 8:43:01 AM9/1/10
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cancer is a bugger. the plague of our times. except for cigarettes
and lung cancer - sun and skin - most of the other cancers are caused
by a number of factors.

BLafferty

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Sep 1, 2010, 8:51:43 AM9/1/10
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True. I checked the the Euro stomach cancer rates and France is quite
low on the list. Lithuania was number one--Sweden and Norway at the bottom.

Davey Crockett

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Sep 1, 2010, 10:11:58 AM9/1/10
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BLafferty a écrit profondement:

The French tend to eat a lot of undercooked or even raw meat.

They also eat a lot of horsemeat, sometimes so fresh and undercooked
that you can see where the jockey was whipping it in the 3:30 that
afternoon at the Hippodrome. ;)

Likewise I remember Larry having bouts of Tapeworm during his career.

But here is a site that might help if you browse around

http://info.cancerresearchuk.org/cancerstats/types/oesophagus/incidence/index.htm

And Larry was A Parsien - like a Northern resident

--
Davey Crockett

Mike Jacoubowsky

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Sep 1, 2010, 11:28:33 AM9/1/10
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"Cicero Venatio" <jazz...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c4ydnQQQm4U2NeDR...@earthlink.com...

> Didn't Fignon himself blame the performance enhancing drugs for his
> cancer? I'll bet a lot of cyclists will lose some sleep tonight,
> wondering if they'll be next.

Curious that LeMond made no mention of Fignon's drug use-
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/lemond-remembers-fignon. Talks about what a
great friend and champion he was. Fignon, near as I can tell, never
renounced doping, just admitted to it.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA

Mr. Slate

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Sep 1, 2010, 12:35:47 PM9/1/10
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Davey Crockett wrote:

> Likewise I remember Larry having bouts of Tapeworm during his career.

Laurent had a tapeworm I believe I read somewhere, years ago.


BLafferty

unread,
Sep 1, 2010, 1:02:43 PM9/1/10
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Yeah. He was sitting on a couch after some race when it started to
wriggle out of his butt.

Kurgan Gringioni

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Sep 1, 2010, 1:09:36 PM9/1/10
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"Uncle Dave" <david...@t-online.de> wrote in message
news:122a4d52-1aa1-4fd3...@q2g2000yqq.googlegroups.com...

On Sep 1, 7:52 am, "Kurgan Gringioni" <soulinthemach...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> "Cicero Venatio" <jazzyb...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:c4ydnQQQm4U2NeDR...@earthlink.com...
> : Didn't Fignon himself blame the performance enhancing drugs for his
> : cancer?
>
> Jackass -
>
> He didn't do that at all.
>
> He thinks maybe it was a factor, but he really didn't know.

:: It's a god point though. Before the latest set of drugs scandals -
:: i.e. those which blew up just before the millenium - I remember
:: remarking to my wife on how odd it was that so many top cyclists that
:: I read about in my youth and who rode in the 50s and 60s were dying
:: off.

Dumbass -

It's been discussed here many times how much of a red herring that is.

The average looks low because the guys who are gonna live till they're 95
aren't factored in yet.

Kurgan Gringioni

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Sep 1, 2010, 1:11:19 PM9/1/10
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"BLafferty" <Br...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:54-dnRfbJrytGuPR...@giganews.com...


Dumbass -

Ullrich should've done that strategy. Ingest a few tapeworms, get the weight
down while eating as much as he wants, then remove the tapeworms right
before the TdF.

Fred Flintstein

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Sep 1, 2010, 2:05:41 PM9/1/10
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Dumbass,

It was the 1988 Tour. And tapeworms don't do that.

Fred Flintstein

Magilla Gorilla

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Sep 1, 2010, 2:49:21 PM9/1/10
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Cicero Venatio wrote:

Most cyclists are too stupid to even think, so I doubt they are capable
of wondering about anything.

Magilla

Magilla Gorilla

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Sep 1, 2010, 2:53:35 PM9/1/10
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Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

I think Lemond felt it unnecessary to trample on a man's grave during what is
a time of grieiving and great pain for Fignon's wife and children.

Where's your soul, brother?

Magilla

Mike Jacoubowsky

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Sep 1, 2010, 3:18:51 PM9/1/10
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"Magilla Gorilla" <m.go...@sandiegozoo.org> wrote in message
news:4C7EA12E...@sandiegozoo.org...

Ah, forgive me, I bow to the conscience of rbr.

But seriously, Fignon raised the question himself in his book regarding his
illness and doping. It would hardly be a slam to his family to bring up the
idea that Fignon did raise the question, a question which ultimately might
make for a safer environment for future generations. That's a hopeful
message. But nothing.

Beloved Fred No. 1

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Sep 1, 2010, 4:09:51 PM9/1/10
to
BLafferty wrote:
> True. I checked the the Euro stomach cancer rates and France is quite
> low on the list. Lithuania was number one--Sweden and Norway at the bottom.

Ie don't eat at a Lithuanian McDonalds.

Beloved Fred No. 1

unread,
Sep 1, 2010, 4:10:55 PM9/1/10
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Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
> Ullrich should've done that strategy. Ingest a few tapeworms, get the weight
> down while eating as much as he wants, then remove the tapeworms right
> before the TdF.

WADA would ban tapeworms.

Magilla Gorilla

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Sep 1, 2010, 4:29:11 PM9/1/10
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Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

How do you know Lemon D won't bring it up in the near future? Perhaps Lemon D
didn't bring it up because he felt there was no definitive correlation to Filet
Mignon's death and his doping use over 2 decades ago?

Magilla


Uncle Dave

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Sep 1, 2010, 5:27:43 PM9/1/10
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On Sep 1, 6:09 pm, "Kurgan Gringioni" <soulinthemach...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> "Uncle Dave" <davidco...@t-online.de> wrote in message

Well, yeah, obviously. I wasn't looking at statistics, just names.
I've noticed a similar trend in rugby league. Purely anecdotal,
though it would be interesting to see how it pans out. Interesting,
and too late to do anything for future generations...

UD

BLafferty

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Sep 1, 2010, 5:45:25 PM9/1/10
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Symptoms of Taeniasis: Diarrhea, anorexia, nausea, vomiting, *anal
itching*, colic, ascites, headaches and weight loss are common symptoms
of having tapeworms. With severe infections hives, fever and convulsions
can also occur. Sometimes they embed in the tissues causing intestinal
nodules or cysts in the skin, lung or liver. An animal or human with a
tapeworm may also have a craving for salt. The tapeworms also compete
with the organism for Vitamin B 12, so slight anemia can occur. Seen
under a microscope, the red blood cells are immature looking and darker
in color than mature red blood cells.
http://www.naturalhealthtechniques.com/specificdiseases/tapeworms_files/tapeworms.htm

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dpd/parasites/hymenolepis/factsht_hymenolepis.htm

Beef tapeworms can cause anal itching . See p. 346, right column, second
full paragraph.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=20&ved=0CDwQFjAJOAo&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pharmj.com%2Fpdf%2Fcpd%2Fpj_20060916_parasiticworm.pdf&rct=j&q=tapeworm%20itching&ei=k8d-TJ6ILYP98Ab-kq3SAw&usg=AFQjCNEgLp1MPsdzTxqGxZxGSfNQ3GoC-w&cad=rja

Mike Jacoubowsky

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Sep 1, 2010, 7:01:14 PM9/1/10
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"Magilla Gorilla" <m.go...@sandiegozoo.org> wrote in message
news:4C7EB796...@sandiegozoo.org...

In the past, he couldn't help himself. Perhaps this is a significant event,
Greg entering a new stage in his life where he feels more secure about his
place in the cycling community. Maybe he feels that he's been vindicated by
public opinion (regarding Lance) so he's got that monkey off his back.

But I keep coming back to the fact that Greg knows he raced against a
confessed doper and it's no big deal. Could it be because he beat Fignon?
Would things have been very different had Fignon won in 1989?

Magilla Gorilla

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Sep 1, 2010, 8:35:24 PM9/1/10
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Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

No no no...Lemon D only made a correlation to active riders dying in their
sleep due to EPO use. I don't ever recall him making a correlation to doping
and cancer - not even in Lance's case.


> Perhaps this is a significant event,
> Greg entering a new stage in his life where he feels more secure about his
> place in the cycling community. Maybe he feels that he's been vindicated by
> public opinion (regarding Lance) so he's got that monkey off his back.

I think it has more to do with Fignon saying "everyone doped" and Lemon D not
wanting to touch that with a 10-foot pole (or an 11-foot Italian).


>
>
> But I keep coming back to the fact that Greg knows he raced against a
> confessed doper and it's no big deal. Could it be because he beat Fignon?
> Would things have been very different had Fignon won in 1989?
>
> --Mike Jacoubowsky
> Chain Reaction Bicycles
> www.ChainReaction.com
> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA

Lemon D is a hypocrite when it comes to Fignon - no question about it. Not
sure why but it probably has to do with Fignon only won 2 Tours and had no
chance of eclipsing him in U.S. sponsors (i.e. Trek, etc.). Now that he is
dead Lemon D has even less incentive to beat him down.

Magilla

H. Fred Kveck

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Sep 1, 2010, 10:32:38 PM9/1/10
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In article <6eqdnWo8NZ6hRuPR...@earthlink.com>,
"Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com> wrote:

> But I keep coming back to the fact that Greg knows he raced against a
> confessed doper and it's no big deal. Could it be because he beat Fignon?
> Would things have been very different had Fignon won in 1989?

I'd say it's because Fignon wasn't American. LemonD goes after the Americans whom
perform well (i.e. win the Tour) on the international stage. He goes after guys whom
disturb his concept (or conceit) of "Greg LemonD is ***the*** greatest American
bicycle racer *ever*."

Barry Taylor

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Sep 2, 2010, 8:50:24 AM9/2/10
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"Beloved Fred No. 1" <no...@mailinator.com> wrote in message
news:fjo2l7-...@donaldm.homeip.net...

hmmm!

I wonder if ingesting bloated leeches could be the way out for blood doping
?

bjt

--D-y

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Sep 2, 2010, 9:15:10 AM9/2/10
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On Sep 1, 9:32 pm, "H. Fred Kveck" <YOURhow...@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote:
> In article <6eqdnWo8NZ6hRuPRnZ2dnUVZ_t2dn...@earthlink.com>,

It's because Greg feels good about using aero bars to beat a superior
racer.

It's because Greg has (apparently) absolutely not one shred of
humility about his luck of the draw IRT The Holy VO2.

It's because Greg is a selfish, arrogant prick who cares only about
#1-- and being #1 in the Public Hall of Fame, USA division.

It might even be because Greg knows he doped and got away with it and,
unlike at least one prime adversary, will continue to get away with it
forever.

Pick your heroes and your parents carefully.
--D-y

mtb Dad

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Sep 2, 2010, 12:17:16 PM9/2/10
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On Sep 1, 4:01 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com> wrote:
> "Magilla Gorilla" <m.gori...@sandiegozoo.org> wrote in message

>
> news:4C7EB796...@sandiegozoo.org...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>
> >> "Magilla Gorilla" <m.gori...@sandiegozoo.org> wrote in message

> >>news:4C7EA12E...@sandiegozoo.org...
> >> > Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>
> >> >> "Cicero Venatio" <jazzyb...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Perhaps because the epo era hadn't started, so the doping had
relatively little effect on results compared to epo and transfusions?

Fred Flintstein

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Sep 2, 2010, 12:24:57 PM9/2/10
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On 9/2/2010 11:17 AM, mtb Dad wrote:
> Perhaps because the epo era hadn't started, so the doping had
> relatively little effect on results compared to epo and transfusions?

Francesco Moser would disagree with your timeline.

And just a reminder, transfusions for Moser were as legal as
EPO for Fignon (and Lemond).

Fred Flintstein

mtb Dad

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Sep 2, 2010, 12:51:15 PM9/2/10
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On Sep 2, 9:24 am, Fred Flintstein <bob.schwa...@sbcremoveglobal.net>
wrote:

True, even as far back as the 1984 us olympic team. But they weren't
legal by 1988. Even if they weren't detectable.

Fred Flintstein

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Sep 2, 2010, 2:04:27 PM9/2/10
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Eddy Planckaert would disagree with your timeline regarding EPO
becoming illegal. I'm pretty sure it wasn't banned until the mid 90s.

Fred Flintstein

Kurgan Gringioni

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Sep 2, 2010, 2:38:27 PM9/2/10
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"H. Fred Kveck" <YOURh...@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote in message
news:YOURhoward-44175...@news.giganews.com...
: In article <6eqdnWo8NZ6hRuPR...@earthlink.com>,


Absolutely-fuckin-right.

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