I'm ashamed to admit I was conned.
Cicero Venatio
old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.
It was all such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
andre...@aol.com
You should have sold your mags on ebay.
You are right about the old stuff. It was all a con. Thank god I wised
up. Now, I buy the truly good stuff such as the pinarello carbon
asymmetric frame $3,000+. I now know that asymmetry in frame design
makes a big difference in performance. Only campy 11 for me since the
11th cog makes me ride faster.
Fred Flintstein
When I see someone claiming to be recording on vhs as recently as
2006 I have to wonder if they also have modern conveniences such
as flush toilets. My vhs tapes all hit the landfill years ago with
the vhs player.
No one on rbr rides carbon because of the risk of spontaneous
combustion.
Fred Flintstein
landotter
You should take the leap...to flat pedals. That's the trend in my
circle--Keens and big honkin freestyle pedals or even MKS Grip Kings.
Having one bike that can be ridden without changing a single article
of clothing is liberating.
That said, on a hot day, I got nothing against putting on a lycra
monkeysuit and going for a long haul on my SS roadie bike. It's got
spds--but I'll never ever buy another road shoe.
Duane Hebert
"landotter" <land...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:591035c1-706c-433e...@f30g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
deal is about road shoes.
I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) I have a pair of
Shimano MTB shoes
that I use with both bikes. My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
side and grips on the other.
I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. I've
used
Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.
They say that Look type pedals are easier to get into and out of but I don't
see that. They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
notice
that either. Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.
I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes. The
cleats
are recessed into the sole.
Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. I can unclip
and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.
I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until I
get
across the intersection.
The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are < $150 bucks.
I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.
What's the argument against this setup on a road bike?
Lou Holtman
There is no argument against it. I don't want single sided pedals so I
use double sided SPD's or Speedplay X serie. I prefer the Speedplays on
my roadbikes because I don't like the vertical play of the SPD's and it
is not likely I have to walk on the shoes I use with the Speedplays. Off
road the vertical play of the SPD's doesn't bother me. On my light
tourer I have the same SPD you have (one side SPD the other flat) only
because I want to use that bike also with normal shoes but it is a
hassle to get the good side up after a stop. Choice is good.
Lou
Brad Anders
> "landotter" <landot...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Mostly weight. There are some lighter pedal systems. Pros have used
SPD's in road races, there's nothing wrong with them. I don't know if
this is true of the SPD systems today, but when the first road
versions came out, I saw a number of guys have their cleats release
when sprinting.
Duane Hebert
"Lou Holtman" <lhollaatd...@planet.nl> wrote in message news:4d1cb...@news4us.nl...
> There is no argument against it. I don't want single sided pedals so I
> use double sided SPD's or Speedplay X serie. I prefer the Speedplays on
> my roadbikes because I don't like the vertical play of the SPD's and it
> is not likely I have to walk on the shoes I use with the Speedplays. Off
> road the vertical play of the SPD's doesn't bother me. On my light
> tourer I have the same SPD you have (one side SPD the other flat) only
> because I want to use that bike also with normal shoes but it is a
> hassle to get the good side up after a stop. Choice is good.
Yeah I forgot to mention about riding without cleats. I guess I'm
used to flipping the pedals.
landotter
> "landotter" <landot...@gmail.com> wrote in message
There is no rational argument against it. Sidis and a lot of other
shoes differentiate between the road and mtb model simply with the
addition of a few grams of tread. Tread that's really nice when you
walk into a store to get a Gatorade on a waxed Armstrong tile floor.
Shoes are exceptionally stiff these days, so hot spots aren't much of
a problem. I like Looks as well--easy to get into, and a very planted
feel--but not really practical for anything outside of race day,
unless you want to fool with (ugh) cleat covers.
Jay Beattie
> "landotter" <landot...@gmail.com> wrote in message
None. It's a matter of preference. I use SPDs on my commuter and
Look Keo on my racing bike. The Look pedals hold my foot more firmly.
With limber shoes, the Looks also provide better foot support and do
not concentrate forces over a small area. This is not much of a
problem for me since both my commuting and racing shoes have CF soles.
The Look pedals are also lighter, to the extent that is a selling
point.
Brad mentions road sprinters pulling out of SPDs, and frankly, that is
a real problem for me with my M520s. Even with new cleats and tension
at max, my right foot pulls out frequently. I have a really mobile
right ankle due to injuries and surgery, and that results in frequent
disengagement that I do not get on my Keos. -- Jay Beattie.
Jay Beattie
I wish I could discover the real joy of riding, but I think I would
have to move to San Diego to do it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWu6BTm74nM&NR=1
-- Jay Beattie.
raamman
> Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
> old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
> those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
> of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
> stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
> thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
> bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
> actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
> tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
> fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
> himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
> head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.
>
it was so obvious THEN even- I couldn't imagine all the fools here who
believed
( and they STILL believe the fucker )
> It was a such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
> racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
> ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
> pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
it sounds like you've discovered a joy of eating; 35 wide tires carry
such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
for "comfort"
landotter
> > It was a such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
> > racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
> > ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
> > pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
>
> it sounds like you've discovered a joy of eating; 35 wide tires carry
> such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
> for "comfort"
I'm well under 200 and my touring bike has 47s, while the SS is set up
for cross with 37s. The 47s at 20psi have been wonderful in this
winter slop, when you don't know if the slush is hiding debris. In
fact, I ran over a concrete parking bumper that was hidden the other
day. Threw my wheel half a mm out of true, but I didn't pinch flat.
It's winter, going fast just dries your skin out and makes your nose
run.
kolldata
but urine excellent physical condition right ?
complete with a carbo overload
Chalo
>
> I like Looks as well--easy to get into, and a very planted
> feel--but not really practical for anything outside of race day,
> unless you want to fool with (ugh) cleat covers.
Maybe someone could make some big ol' clodhoppers with a Look cleat
surrounded by a wide margin of rubber lugs. Sort of like a logger
boot with the middle of the forefoot carved away for the goofy Look
cleat.
That would be racy, yet practical. Wait... I guess "racy" really
means _impractical_, doesn't it? I mean, that's all that so-called
race equipment really has in common, right?
Chalo
news.suddenlink.net
"Duane Hebert" <duan...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
news:ifiblh$23a$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Dominator as such. They're good when the weather is cold and I can walk in
them. Shoes are hot in warm weather and Keen sandals are far more
comfortable. I never wore shoes again in warm weather after once trying
these.
True road shoes are good for racing I suppose?
Zenon
.
.
.
Okay all you retards need to quit your mamby pamby whining and get
over it. It is what it is. Accept it. Lance Armstrong is a doper
just like the rest of your VHS lovers except he is now a saint because
he cures cancer. He's no different than Bernard Madoff because, just
like Bernie, Lance Dopestrong has built his little one nut wonder
empire on lies. In a few weeks you'll all have erections watching him
leave the scene. So take Lance Armstrong and your fat tire, pedal,
and shoe thread and shove it up your ass. You're used to it. For you
it will be like throwing a hot dog down a hallway.
.
.
.
landotter
> landotter wrote:
>
> > I like Looks as well--easy to get into, and a very planted
> > feel--but not really practical for anything outside of race day,
> > unless you want to fool with (ugh) cleat covers.
>
> Maybe someone could make some big ol' clodhoppers with a Look cleat
> surrounded by a wide margin of rubber lugs. Sort of like a logger
> boot with the middle of the forefoot carved away for the goofy Look
> cleat.
Sounds good to me. Winter mukluks with a Look system. Mink trim to
help prevent "dirty air".
>
> That would be racy, yet practical. Wait... I guess "racy" really
> means _impractical_, doesn't it? I mean, that's all that so-called
> race equipment really has in common, right?
I dunno, take away ceramic bearings, low spoke count wheels, narrow
tires, and a ridiculous bar-seat relationship, you can build a pretty
durable bike out of race kit. Why one would want to throw out that
amount of dosh when $50 Deore shifters are more durable and shift
well, that part's lost on me.
Chalo
>
> Cicero Venatio wrote:
> >
> > It was a such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
> > racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
> > ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
> > pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
>
> it sounds like you've discovered a joy of eating; 35 wide tires carry
> such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
> for "comfort"
You are full of gas (and you're a prick, but I guess that's just a
racer thing). A supple 700x35 tire like the Pasela, Rivendell Jack
Brown, or Schwalbe Marathon Racer has _less_ rolling resistance than a
narrow race tire, because it flexes a lot less deeply to establish its
contact patch. It weighs a little more and has more aerodynamic drag
at speeds over 20mph or so, but neither of those things equal rolling
resistance.
I sell 700x23 Soma Everwear and 700x25mm Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires
at my shop. Those tires are sluggish, even though they are narrow.
If you want to compare an armored 35mm utility tire to a skinny tire,
compare with those. But a fast 35mm tire is simply a fast tire by any
measure.
Chalo
--D-y
> Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
> deal is about road shoes.
Just some trash talk. Trying to piss on someone else's parade.
> I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) I have a pair of
> Shimano MTB shoes
> that I use with both bikes. My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
> side and grips on the other.
> I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. I've
> used
> Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.
Might just be a "fashion" thing. Spuds don't have a reputation for
being the most secure pedals (I'm just reporting here), especially
with the less-secure SH 55 cleats, compared to the "single release"
SH51's. Roadies tend to be jealous of their own safety; unintended
releases can cause nasty crashes.
> They say that Look type pedals are easier to get into and out of but I don't
> see that. They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
> notice
> that either. Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.
"Works for you"?
> I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes. The
> cleats
> are recessed into the sole.
No doubt a "MTB" shoe might be more walkable but I've heard/seen of
soles cracking.
There used be a Shimano sandal that was favored by lots of riders. I
saw them used; not my cup of tea but they worked great for those who
favored them.
> Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. I can unclip
> and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.
Spuds have been an MTB standard for years, for good reason.
> I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until I
> get
> across the intersection.
It takes a little practice and learning and I certainly fumbled when I
changed brands a few years ago.
> The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are < $150 bucks.
Shimano SPD-SL road cleats last much longer than the old Looks I used
to use. and are far safer to walk in at convenience stops.
You use shoes that work for you and if they are cheap(er), so much the
better IMHO.
> I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.
Spuds seem to be a Spin standard in my limited experience.
If you didn't have trouble with pulling out of your Looks, especially
if they were the pre-KEO version, I'd guess you won't have trouble
pulling out of the spuds.
FWIW: I've been using Shimano Ultegra PD-6700 pedals (and 6600's) for
several years now and they work great, all the way around including
tension adjustment, secure hold without excessive tension, cleat wear
(excellent IME) and walk-ability. I use Sidi Genius shoes because they
work for me. If they cost less, that would be great...
--D-y
RobertH
[...]
> Brad mentions road sprinters pulling out of SPDs, and frankly, that is
> a real problem for me with my M520s. Even with new cleats and tension
> at max, my right foot pulls out frequently. I have a really mobile
> right ankle due to injuries and surgery, and that results in frequent
> disengagement that I do not get on my Keos. -- Jay Beattie.
That's a serious danger, I recommend Time pedals as they do not
release inadvertantly until the cleat is quite worn.
andre...@aol.com
> "landotter" <landot...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Road shoes are lighter :-p
landotter
It's more important that they be red.
Ryan Cousineau
Mostly a +1. There's arguably some very slight aero differences. Once
I decided to go to Crank Brothers for my cyclocross racing, I
converted all my bikes over to their pedals as I could. The advantages
for me are that I'm always walkable (hate Looks for the same reasons
others do here), and that any pair of shoes works on any bike (a big
deal, because Imelda Marcos on two wheels that I am, I have two sets
of summer shoes and two sets of winter boots, all with Crank Bros.
cleats).
The SPDs can indeed pull out, though I had no problems when I raced in
them. The CB's don't pull out when new, but they do pull out when worn
to the point of needing replacement.
Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.
Dumbass -
I feel the same about some of my memorabilia, especially anything that
has to do with Greg LemonD.
Great athlete. Tool of a human being.
thanks,
Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.
AMuzi
>> Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
>> old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
>> those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
>> of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
>> stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
>> thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
>> bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
>> actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
>> tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
>> fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
>> himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
>> head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.
>>
>> It was all such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
>> racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
>> ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
>> pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
Kurgan. presented by Gringioni. wrote:
> Dumbass -
> I feel the same about some of my memorabilia, especially anything that
> has to do with Greg LemonD.
> Great athlete. Tool of a human being.
I feel for you. We Anquetil fans needed blinders as well.
Doper, pervert, weirdo but damn could he ever ride!
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
Jay Beattie
Big fat tires ride like big fat tires. They are pigs climbing and can
ride like pogo sticks at real low pressure . . . but you get better
traction in crappy conditions and get good pinch flat resistance. I
switch between tires frequently on my cross-bike. I will throw on the
fatties this weekend because conditions have turned very soupy, and
riding in the dark and the rain is just asking to whack something. But
if it were summer, I would stick with my 25s or 28s because I hate
dragging the fatties uphill. -- Jay Beattie.
Jay Beattie
Blinders are a requirement for any fan, except maybe a fan of Keith
Richards, where doping is part of the appeal. -- Jay Beattie.
Mark J.
> landotter wrote:
>>
>> I like Looks as well--easy to get into, and a very planted
>> feel--but not really practical for anything outside of race day,
>> unless you want to fool with (ugh) cleat covers.
>
> Maybe someone could make some big ol' clodhoppers with a Look cleat
> surrounded by a wide margin of rubber lugs. Sort of like a logger
> boot with the middle of the forefoot carved away for the goofy Look
> cleat.
Like this? (prehistoric Look Y-cleats - no longer made)
http://home.comcast.net/~mandmlj/ShoeLugs/
Mark J.
James
Impractical for everything except racy bike riding. Is there any other
kind?
BTW, I use MTB shoes with SPD cleats when I go MTBing or shopping. I
can walk free and easy with the cleat well surrounded by rubber, yet
still ride bike with the same connected feeling as I get from my roadie
shoes and look keo carbon pedals!
JS.
Anton Berlin
>
> Like this? (prehistoric Look Y-cleats - no longer made)http://home.comcast.net/~mandmlj/ShoeLugs/
>
> Mark J.
That's the saddest page I've ever seen.
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°
>
> "landotter" <land...@gmail.com> wrote in message
--
T�m Sherm�n - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°
> I wish I could discover the real joy of riding, but I think I would
> have to move to San Diego to do it.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWu6BTm74nM&NR=1
> -- Jay Beattie.
You need a Tatra: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwXr774zZKs>.
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°
Wider tires have lower rolling resistance than narrower tires, all else
being equal.
--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°
> Okay all you retards need to quit your mamby pamby whining and get
> over it. It is what it is. Accept it. Lance Armstrong is a doper
> just like the rest of your VHS lovers except he is now a saint because
> he cures cancer. He's no different than Bernard Madoff because, just
> like Bernie, Lance Dopestrong has built his little one nut wonder
> empire on lies. In a few weeks you'll all have erections watching him
> leave the scene. So take Lance Armstrong and your fat tire, pedal,
> and shoe thread and shove it up your ass. You're used to it. For you
> it will be like throwing a hot dog down a hallway.
It's not cheating unless you get caught.
Lance was smart enough to get doctors and biochemists who could beat the
system.
Chalo
>
> Chalo wrote:
> >
> > A supple 700x35 tire like the Pasela, Rivendell Jack
> > Brown, or Schwalbe Marathon Racer has _less_ rolling resistance than a
> > narrow race tire, because it flexes a lot less deeply to establish its
> > contact patch. It weighs a little more and has more aerodynamic drag
> > at speeds over 20mph or so, but neither of those things equal rolling
> > resistance.
> >
> > I sell 700x23 Soma Everwear and 700x25mm Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires
> > at my shop. Those tires are sluggish, even though they are narrow.
> > If you want to compare an armored 35mm utility tire to a skinny tire,
> > compare with those. But a fast 35mm tire is simply a fast tire by any
> > measure.
>
> ride like pogo sticks at real low pressure . . . but you get better
> traction in crappy conditions and get good pinch flat resistance.
That's a pretty fair characterization of my big fat tires, which are
700x60 Big Apples and 26x3.0 Kenda Kraze slicks. I'd say "beach
balls" instead of "pogo sticks", but why quibble?
But not one of the three examples I gave, nor any other 700x35 tire,
is a big fat tire. There are some clunky 700x35s (like the Forte
Gothams on my wife's coastie) but then there are also clunky skinny
tires as I already pointed out.
Chalo
Dan O
The walnuts that litter my driveway every year have a rock hard inner
shell about 2 cm diameter, and a green outer coating that is tight at
first, but loosens after a day or so on the ground, and is slimy
inside. So, what you have here is a big rock with a thick slimy
coating.
Coming into the driveway one night on my 28 mm tires, I hit a single
walnut, which immediately put me on the ground (where my knee hit
another walnut). OTOH I can ride the 1.95" slicks on my wheelie bike
right through myriad walnuts no problem.
Dan O
> Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
> old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
> those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
> of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
> stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
> thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
> bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
> actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
> tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
> fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
> himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
> head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.
>
http://bikeportland.org/2010/12/29/frans-pauwels-founding-father-of-portland-bicycle-racing-35117
> It was all such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
> racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
> ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
> pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
I put the most miles on my LHT, too (ATM 32 mm front, ~35 mm rear
tires). It has SPD pedals, too - sweet M747's ($5 for the pair on
CL!) My shoes are Shimano MT40's ($55 on closeout) and sandals. I'd
like to have a nice pair of winter boots, but booties over the shoes
aren't too bad unless it rains a lot. The sandals are even good in
the rain if it isn't too cold, and they're great in the heat.
I put plastic MKS pedals on my wheelie bike - so I can ride it
barefoot.
Jay Beattie
Any opinion on Panaracer Urban Max tires?:
http://www.performancebike.com/bikes/Product_10052_10551_1035323_-1_1545502_1545500_400013#ReviewHeader
Price is right. It's a 32mm tire with some tread pattern, which comes
in handy this time of year. It looks like it would meet my commuting
needs. I had durability problems with the Paselas and have not tried
the other two you mention, the Rivendell and the Schwalbe, although it
looks like I could find at least the Schwalbe locally, but the
Marathon Plus in plus size is not cheap!
http://www.biketiresdirect.com/search/schwalbe-city-touring-tires --
Jay Beattie.
thirty-six
> "landotter" <landot...@gmail.com> wrote in message
They don't like that you've not paid your full dues into the
effeminate wannabe racer club. Next time tell them your a tourist to
confuse them. Road shoes are 'better' for climbing steep hills in big
gears and for sprinting in. If you always stick to appropriate small
and medium gears, keeping down pedal pressure, then road shoes show no
advantage. Just use the big gears when following some roadie fool(s)
who will do the work for you, because you're a lowly tourist. ;-)
thirty-six
Those screw sockets are used in furniture construction. A few pennies
each, they are not a Look specific component so keep the price real.
thirty-six
> On Dec 30, 6:07 am, Cicero Venatio <jazzyb...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
> > old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
> > those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
> > of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
> > stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
> > thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
> > bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
> > actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
> > tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
> > fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
> > himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
> > head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.
>
> > racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
> > ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
> > pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
>
> have to move to San Diego to do it.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWu6BTm74nM&NR=1
> -- Jay Beattie.
10" water means you want to use wellington boots, get them with the
ties on. Or use a Penny-farthing.
Peter Cole
> On Dec 30, 10:23 am, "Duane Hebert"<duaneb...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
>> deal is about road shoes.
>
> Just some trash talk. Trying to piss on someone else's parade.
>
>> I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) I have a pair of
>> Shimano MTB shoes
>> that I use with both bikes. My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
>> side and grips on the other.
>
>> I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. I've
>> used
>> Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.
>
> Might just be a "fashion" thing. Spuds don't have a reputation for
> being the most secure pedals (I'm just reporting here), especially
> with the less-secure SH 55 cleats, compared to the "single release"
> SH51's. Roadies tend to be jealous of their own safety; unintended
> releases can cause nasty crashes.
Arguably a worse problem in the woods because of much steeper climbs and
a lot of bouncing around. If spuds suck on the road, they should suck
worse in the woods.
I've always used SH-55's, never had a pull out. The only thing that
spuds really are bad at is mud and snow clogging.
>
>> They say that Look type pedals are easier to get into and out of but I don't
>> see that. They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
>> notice
>> that either. Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.
>
> "Works for you"?
>
>> I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes. The
>> cleats
>> are recessed into the sole.
>
> No doubt a "MTB" shoe might be more walkable but I've heard/seen of
> soles cracking.
> There used be a Shimano sandal that was favored by lots of riders. I
> saw them used; not my cup of tea but they worked great for those who
> favored them.
I've cracked a sole and so has my wife, sucks because the shoes are then
worthless.
Sandals are great, I bought my wife a pair, The Shimanos are heavy as
sin, I got her something else. I can't find them in size 16 for myself,
though.
>
>> Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. I can unclip
>> and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.
>
> Spuds have been an MTB standard for years, for good reason.
>
>> I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until I
>> get
>> across the intersection.
>
> It takes a little practice and learning and I certainly fumbled when I
> changed brands a few years ago.
>
>> The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are< $150 bucks.
>
> Shimano SPD-SL road cleats last much longer than the old Looks I used
> to use. and are far safer to walk in at convenience stops.
> You use shoes that work for you and if they are cheap(er), so much the
> better IMHO.
>
>> I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.
>
> Spuds seem to be a Spin standard in my limited experience.
>
> If you didn't have trouble with pulling out of your Looks, especially
> if they were the pre-KEO version, I'd guess you won't have trouble
> pulling out of the spuds.
>
> FWIW: I've been using Shimano Ultegra PD-6700 pedals (and 6600's) for
> several years now and they work great, all the way around including
> tension adjustment, secure hold without excessive tension, cleat wear
> (excellent IME) and walk-ability. I use Sidi Genius shoes because they
> work for me. If they cost less, that would be great...
> --D-y
Sidi's are crazy expensive, but they are very durable. I think they work
out to be pretty cost effective.
>
Peter Cole
I don't know what fatties you ride. I just switched my 35mm Paselas out
for my 35mm studded Nokians on my fixer. The Paselas are wicked light
and supple and cheap.
Big Jim
On Dec 30, 11:23 am, "Duane Hebert" <duaneb...@videotron.ca> wrote:
> "landotter" <landot...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:591035c1-706c-433e...@f30g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 30, 8:07 am, Cicero Venatio <jazzyb...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >That said, on a hot day, I got nothing against putting on a lycra
> >monkeysuit and going for a long haul on my SS roadie bike. It's got
> >spds--but I'll never ever buy another road shoe.
>
> Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
> deal is about road shoes.
>
> I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) I have a pair of
> Shimano MTB shoes
> that I use with both bikes. My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
> side and grips on the other.
>
> I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. I've
> used
> Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.
>
> They say that Look type pedals are easier to get into and out of but I don't
> see that. They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
> notice
> that either. Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.
>
> I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes. The
> cleats
> are recessed into the sole.
>
> Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. I can unclip
> and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.
>
> I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until I
> get
> across the intersection.
>
> The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are < $150 bucks.
>
> I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.
>
--D-y
> > Might just be a "fashion" thing. Spuds don't have a reputation for
> > being the most secure pedals (I'm just reporting here), especially
> > with the less-secure SH 55 cleats, compared to the "single release"
> > SH51's. Roadies tend to be jealous of their own safety; unintended
> > releases can cause nasty crashes.
>
> Arguably a worse problem in the woods because of much steeper climbs and
> a lot of bouncing around. If spuds suck on the road, they should suck
> worse in the woods.
That's what I've always thought. My "woods" riding was of limited
duration and happened many years ago, but I have BTDT.
Sidi Dominators, for one, are spud shoes. Not my end of the world, so
I don't pretend to "understand".
My spud usage has been limited to Spin class; not a fair yardstick as
those are (generally) cheap pedals that have seen a lot of use with
limited maintenance. Not very secure IME, really "casual", easy clip-
out.
> I've always used SH-55's, never had a pull out. The only thing that
> spuds really are bad at is mud and snow clogging.
I read stuff on the 'net, other people have had problems with the
55's. Including clogging, including the 51's, of course.
Years ago there was a Time model that an MTB-riding acquaintance told
me completely solved the clogging problem.
> I've cracked a sole and so has my wife, sucks because the shoes are then
> worthless.
Yup. Sidi's not immune. They're really not meant to hike in.
>
> Sandals are great, I bought my wife a pair, The Shimanos are heavy as
> sin, I got her something else. I can't find them in size 16 for myself,
> though.
There was a rider in Houston, a semi-regular on the Wednesday Nighter
ride from Planetary Cycles, who, I was told, did a transcontinental
ride in SPD sandals. Nuff said.
> Sidi's are crazy expensive, but they are very durable. I think they work
> out to be pretty cost effective.
Yes. Especially when people buy the wrong size and sell them on
Craigslist and elsewhere for cheap.
There apparently are other similar designs out there now, but when I
started wearing Geniuses some years ago, those were the only shoes I
knew of with a ratcheting strap which, combined with "fit", makes
these shoes work for me.
--D-y
landotter
>
> Price is right. It's a 32mm tire with some tread pattern, which comes
> in handy this time of year. It looks like it would meet my commuting
> needs. I had durability problems with the Paselas and have not tried
> the other two you mention, the Rivendell and the Schwalbe, although it
> looks like I could find at least the Schwalbe locally, but the
> Marathon Plus in plus size is not cheap!http://www.biketiresdirect.com/search/schwalbe-city-touring-tires --
> Jay Beattie.
you wanna save bux, try the Forte Gotham for $12. AFAIK, it's made
under contract by Panaracer. All these tires are fine--they're chunky
gumwalls with little effort made to reduce weight. Continental
Contacts are another similar flavor--that's priced twice what they
should really cost (same bogus markup as Schwalbe).
Brad Anders
> Look Keo on my racing bike. The Look pedals hold my foot more firmly.
> With limber shoes, the Looks also provide better foot support and do
> not concentrate forces over a small area. This is not much of a
> problem for me since both my commuting and racing shoes have CF soles.
> The Look pedals are also lighter, to the extent that is a selling
> point.
>
> Brad mentions road sprinters pulling out of SPDs, and frankly, that is
> a real problem for me with my M520s. Even with new cleats and tension
> at max, my right foot pulls out frequently. I have a really mobile
> right ankle due to injuries and surgery, and that results in frequent
> disengagement that I do not get on my Keos. -- Jay Beattie
I've been using Speedplays since they came out, I still ride on the
original pedals I bought in the early 90's (on about their 5th set of
X-wings). Other than the walking issue, which isn't a problem for me,
they're hard to beat. Very light weight, very low profile, full float
(all my knee issues w/LOOK went away and never came back), almost zero
effort to disengage and easy entry, and extremely positive engagement
- never pulled out of them in 15+ years of riding and racing.
Brad Anders
Brad Anders
> On Dec 30, 10:25 am, Jay Beattie <jbeat...@lindsayhart.com> wrote:
>
>
> > Brad mentions road sprinters pulling out of SPDs, and frankly, that is
> > a real problem for me with my M520s. Even with new cleats and tension
> > at max, my right foot pulls out frequently. I have a really mobile
> > right ankle due to injuries and surgery, and that results in frequent
>
> That's a serious danger, I recommend Time pedals as they do not
> release inadvertantly until the cleat is quite worn.
I could always tell who was riding Time pedals in crits, they were the
guys hitting their pedals in the turns. Maybe the new ones are better,
but years ago, it was an issue.
Duane Hebert
"Peter Cole" <peter...@verizon.net> wrote in message news:ifkm79$2tn$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> On 12/30/2010 3:06 PM, --D-y wrote:
>> On Dec 30, 10:23 am, "Duane Hebert"<duaneb...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
>>> deal is about road shoes.
>>
>> Just some trash talk. Trying to piss on someone else's parade.
>>
>>> I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) I have a pair of
>>> Shimano MTB shoes
>>> that I use with both bikes. My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
>>> side and grips on the other.
>>
>>> I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. I've
>>> used
>>> Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.
>>
>> Might just be a "fashion" thing. Spuds don't have a reputation for
>> being the most secure pedals (I'm just reporting here), especially
>> with the less-secure SH 55 cleats, compared to the "single release"
>> SH51's. Roadies tend to be jealous of their own safety; unintended
>> releases can cause nasty crashes.
>
> Arguably a worse problem in the woods because of much steeper climbs and
> a lot of bouncing around. If spuds suck on the road, they should suck
> worse in the woods.
I'm pretty much of a wimp in the woods. If I'm on my road bike, I use
the side of the pedal without the cleat through the trails. This way I
can slide around the turns with a foot down. I don't ride trails like
that much except for the couple of km on my commute. It's the best
way to skirt the highway.
> I've always used SH-55's, never had a pull out. The only thing that
> spuds really are bad at is mud and snow clogging.
Those are lateral release? I have SH-51s. I haven't come unclipped
yet, even on pretty decent climbs. Having said that, It will probably
happen next time out <g>
I have the BBB Dual pedals shown here http://www.cecilwalker.com.au/category229_1.htm
I use them on both bikes and they seem to work pretty well.
<snip>
> I've cracked a sole and so has my wife, sucks because the shoes are then
> worthless.
>
> Sandals are great, I bought my wife a pair, The Shimanos are heavy as
> sin, I got her something else. I can't find them in size 16 for myself,
> though.
One of my shoes looks like it's starting to crack. I'm having an
occasional chirp from the pedals that I haven't had since using Looks.
I suspect it's the shoe. But they're 5 years old and I get a lot of use
out of them.
Brad Anders
<kgringi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 30, 6:07 am, Cicero Venatio <jazzyb...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
> > old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
> > those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
> > of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
> > stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
> > thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
> > bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
> > actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
> > tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
> > fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
> > himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
> > head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.
>
> > racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
> > ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
> > pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
>
>
> I feel the same about some of my memorabilia, especially anything that
> has to do with Greg LemonD.
>
>
> thanks,
>
> Kurgan. presented by Gringioni
Hey, what about all those pricey Graham Watson books sitting in my
bookshelf? When I look at them now and page through, all I say is,
"doper.... doper.... dead... doper... doper..."
Anton Berlin
> Hey, what about all those pricey Graham Watson books sitting in my
> bookshelf? When I look at them now and page through, all I say is,
> "doper.... doper.... dead... doper... doper..."
LOL
N8N
> On Dec 30, 6:07 am, Cicero Venatio <jazzyb...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
> > old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
> > those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
> > of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
> > stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
> > thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
> > bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
> > actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
> > tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
> > fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
> > himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
> > head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.
>
>
> > It was all such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
> > racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
> > ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
> > pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
>
> I put the most miles on my LHT, too (ATM 32 mm front, ~35 mm rear
> tires). It has SPD pedals, too - sweet M747's ($5 for the pair on
> CL!) My shoes are Shimano MT40's ($55 on closeout) and sandals. I'd
> like to have a nice pair of winter boots, but booties over the shoes
> aren't too bad unless it rains a lot. The sandals are even good in
> the rain if it isn't too cold, and they're great in the heat.
>
> I put plastic MKS pedals on my wheelie bike - so I can ride it
> barefoot.
Possibly Bad Idea time...
I've found that when it is legitimately cold out that my Red Wing work
boots are the ticket for riding (on the platform side of the pedals,
natch.) Anyone ever take some work boots with deep lug soles and
carve the centers of the tread out for spuds?
nate
andre...@aol.com
> "andresm...@aol.com" <andresm...@aol.com> considered Thu, 30 Dec 2010
> 12:54:04 -0800 (PST) the perfect time to write:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Dec 30, 9:23 am, "Duane Hebert" <duaneb...@videotron.ca> wrote:
> >> "landotter" <landot...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >>news:591035c1-706c-433e...@f30g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> >> On Dec 30, 8:07 am, Cicero Venatio <jazzyb...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> >That said, on a hot day, I got nothing against putting on a lycra
> >> >monkeysuit and going for a long haul on my SS roadie bike. It's got
> >> >spds--but I'll never ever buy another road shoe.
>
> >> deal is about road shoes.
>
> >> Shimano MTB shoes
> >> that I use with both bikes. My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
> >> side and grips on the other.
>
> >> I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. I've
> >> used
> >> Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.
>
> >> see that. They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
> >> notice
> >> that either. Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.
>
> >> I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes. The
> >> cleats
> >> are recessed into the sole.
>
> >> Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. I can unclip
> >> and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.
>
> >> I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until I
> >> get
> >> across the intersection.
>
> >> The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are < $150 bucks.
>
> >> I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.
>
> >> What's the argument against this setup on a road bike?
>
>
> I use SPDs because I can get a model which takes proper robust
> reflectors, which are mandatory here for road use after dark.
> I don't know of any other clipless pedal with this capability.
Reflectors!?!?!?!
Road shoes with 3 hole cleats make a significant difference in
performance. You have three holes instead of two to penetrate with
your screw.
Sorry, Gene got me started with the nonsense.
Chalo
>
> Any opinion on Panaracer Urban Max tires?
>
> in handy this time of year.
I don't know that one.
My favorite in the 700x32 size is the Panaracer Ribmo. It's fast, it
rides and handles well, and it has very effective protection against
punctures. It's more expensive than the tires I normally use-- about
the same as a Conti Gatorskin or a Pasela Tourguard. But it's a much
worthier tire than those two in my opinion.
The Ribmo has minimal tread, though.
> but the Marathon Plus in plus size is not cheap!
The Schwalbe Marathon Plus is as flatproof as a tire can be while
still containing pressurized air. It's very heavy, pretty slow, and
expensive. But if you have had it up to here with flats and can't
take it any more, that's your tire. See also Michelin Pilot City and
CST Salvo.
Chalo
N8N
> Jay Beattie wrote:
>
> > Any opinion on Panaracer Urban Max tires?
>
> > Price is right. It's a 32mm tire with some tread pattern, which comes
> > in handy this time of year.
>
> I don't know that one.
I have some, but I didn't notice anything particularly wonderful about
them. Currently running Pasela TGs on both of my bikes. Never had a
flat on any of them that wasn't tube or tape related. ISTR discussion
of them here previously that said that UM's were similar to Paselas
(appear identical other than black sidewalls) but with a much lower
thread count casing.
nate
Dan O
A friend who doesn't Ride Bike (but is otherwise well-intentioned)
once went into the LBS to get some SPD cleats, intent on fabricating
some winter shoes for my poor cold feet. They tried to tell him that
bike shoes were special, and recommended neoprene booties, but he
already had hiking boots in my size, went ahead and carved out a space
in the tread (with a Dremel, I believe, after measuring one of my
shoes), and mounted the cleats.
The soles were obviously much too flimsy to try and push SPD's. I
never tried to pedal in them, moved the cleats to my old shoes, and
filled the holes and extra tread gap with Shoe Goo. Both soles split
across the mounting holes, and the cracks lap up water when I walk.
mike.a...@gmail.com
> On Dec 30, 12:17 pm, raamman <raam...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > It was a such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
> > > racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
> > > ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
> > > pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.
>
> > such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
> > for "comfort"
>
> for cross with 37s. The 47s at 20psi have been wonderful in this
> winter slop, when you don't know if the slush is hiding debris. In
> fact, I ran over a concrete parking bumper that was hidden the other
> day. Threw my wheel half a mm out of true, but I didn't pinch flat.
>
> It's winter, going fast just dries your skin out and makes your nose
> run.
100 mm tire 10 psi you won't even notice curbs.
http://salsacycles.com/bikes/mukluk/
Dan O
mike.a...@gmail.com
Yeah, you need a metal plate inside to reinforce and hold the bolt.
--D-y
Well, they were (probably mostly) all doping (at least) at one point
or another.
Bad rules, bad enforcement. If you know the guy next to you can dope
and get away with it... etc.
The heroes of old were (some of them, depending on era) quite open
about it.
Then, the irony of Tom Simpson's death, due to dehydration, being
blamed on "doping", and "the war on drugs" started.
Too bad, and they're not going to start making sense anytime soon
either--- oh, the children!
--D-y
Jay Beattie
Way back when my wife and I were both racing, I bought her a pair of
first generation Time pedals that she couldn't get to release. I
thought she was being a dork and just having a tough time
transitioning from cleats to a step-in system until I tried them
myself. Gawdamighty death pedals. That got fixed, and the later ones
also had very low lean angles -- so the pedal strike issue got
handled, too. -- Jay Beattie.
Anton Berlin
> > It's winter, going fast just dries your skin out and makes your nose
> > run.
>
> 100 mm tire 10 psi you won't even notice curbs.http://salsacycles.com/bikes/mukluk/
That's a romantic notion to go out and ride a bike in the snow but I
am pretty sure it's why god invented cross country skiiing.
Anton Berlin
LOL where the hell is that? Must be tough air dry clothing in that
area
Anton Berlin
Great story ! Is he the guy that made this bridge?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mclp9QmCGs
AMuzi
Whatever goes through your mind reading a newspaper then?
thief, scoundrel, idiot, alcoholic thief, liar, doper...
It's not as if competitive cyclists come from a different
pool than we other humans ( Karol Wotylja may be a special
case).
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
AMuzi
All that stuff would be in the way of snow shoveling here.
Dan O
Oh he put a plate in there. Like I said, though - I never pedaled a
bike in those shoes with the cleats. I took the cleats off, filled
the holes, and used them for walking around in at work. Just walking
around flexing the soles split them across the space between the
holes.
russell...@yahoo.com
> me completely solved the clogging problem.
Time ATAC pedals.
Archimedes Plutonium
Archemedis Plutonium
"Phil W Lee" <ph...@lee-family.me.uk> wrote in message
news:587rh650frjhjepie...@4ax.com...
> "andre...@aol.com" <andre...@aol.com> considered Thu, 30 Dec 2010
andre...@aol.com
wrote:
> Archemedis prefers the use of Sidi Denominator 5.
>
> Archemedis Plutonium
>
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°
> [...]
> It's not as if competitive cyclists come from a different pool than we
> other humans ( Karol Wotylja may be a special case).
Il Papa was a competitive cyclist?
--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.
Gary Young
> landotter wrote:
>>
>> I like Looks as well--easy to get into, and a very planted feel--but
>> not really practical for anything outside of race day, unless you want
>> to fool with (ugh) cleat covers.
>
> Maybe someone could make some big ol' clodhoppers with a Look cleat
> surrounded by a wide margin of rubber lugs. Sort of like a logger boot
> with the middle of the forefoot carved away for the goofy Look cleat.
It's been done:
http://www.phred.org/~josh/bike/boots.html
>
> That would be racy, yet practical. Wait... I guess "racy" really means
> _impractical_, doesn't it? I mean, that's all that so-called race
> equipment really has in common, right?
>
> Chalo
DirtRoadie
> I wish I could discover the real joy of riding, but I think I would
> have to move to San Diego to do it.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWu6BTm74nM&NR=1
There are MANY places where winter flooding is not an issue. However
in some of those places the winter precipitation is measured in feet
and the (packed or frozen) riding surface IS an issue.
DR
Jay Beattie
I was riding today in the West Hills, and I was fretting about the
areas of sheet ice from rain run-off and some local springs, but the
road was mostly clear -- it was in the 20s F, and there was snow on
the shoulder in some places, but nothing like the Midwest. I don't
know how people ride below 0, or even below 20 degrees and in real
snow and ice (with narrowed roads) for months on end. -- Jay Beattie.
Chalo
>
> There are MANY places where winter flooding is not an issue. However
> in some of those places the winter precipitation is measured in feet
> and the (packed or frozen) riding surface IS an issue.
Woe betide the miserable souls who inhabit such places.
Chalo
Duane Hebert
"Jay Beattie" <jbea...@lindsayhart.com> wrote in message
news:5161b3a9-bef2-4420...@d1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>I was riding today in the West Hills, and I was fretting about the
>areas of sheet ice from rain run-off and some local springs, but the
>road was mostly clear -- it was in the 20s F, and there was snow on
>the shoulder in some places, but nothing like the Midwest. I don't
>know how people ride below 0, or even below 20 degrees and in real
>snow and ice (with narrowed roads) for months on end. -- Jay Beattie.
Skiing.
AMuzi
> > [...]
>> It's not as if competitive cyclists come from a different pool than we
>> other humans ( Karol Wotylja may be a special case).
T�m Sherm�n� �_� > wrote:
> Il Papa was a competitive cyclist?
Yes, as a young man in Poland.
tomapa...@mac.com
I know one former Austinite who has lived in Alaska for several years,
and one returned Austinite who spent 6 months in Oulu, Finland.
When I lived in the GFN, I rode at temps down into the teens, about
17deg F was my limit, because I insisted on using cycling shoes and my
technology was limited. These guys would call those balmy afternoons
"the first signs of Spring" <g>. It's all a matter of gear:
<http://www.susitna100.com/index.php?
option=com_content&task=view&id=26&Itemid=40>
OTOH, there have been a few expats who have migrated to San Diego over
the years...
--D-y
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°
One can always wear more clothes for the cold. The converse is not true.
RobertH
> On Dec 30, 1:36 pm, RobertH <r15...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > On Dec 30, 10:25 am, Jay Beattie <jbeat...@lindsayhart.com> wrote:
>
> > [...]
>
> > > Brad mentions road sprinters pulling out of SPDs, and frankly, that is
> > > a real problem for me with my M520s. Even with new cleats and tension
> > > at max, my right foot pulls out frequently. I have a really mobile
> > > right ankle due to injuries and surgery, and that results in frequent
> > > disengagement that I do not get on my Keos. -- Jay Beattie.
>
> > That's a serious danger, I recommend Time pedals as they do not
> > release inadvertantly until the cleat is quite worn.
>
> I could always tell who was riding Time pedals in crits, they were the
> guys hitting their pedals in the turns. Maybe the new ones are better,
> but years ago, it was an issue.
Interesting ... I was referring to their off-road pedals vs. the SPDs
though. I know nothing about their road pedals.
Mark J.
>> A. Muzi wrote:
>> > [...]
>>> It's not as if competitive cyclists come from a different pool than we
>>> other humans ( Karol Wotylja may be a special case).
>
>> Il Papa was a competitive cyclist?
>
>
> Yes, as a young man in Poland.
Huh. I remember him being noted as a skier when he was first made pope.
While I have a news photo of him being presented with a Colnago by
Ernesto himself (in the first year or so of his papacy), I didn't know
he had any experience /riding/ the things.
Mark J.
Duane Hebert
"Mark J." <MarkU...@comcast.net> wrote in message news:ifo7pg$cs8$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> On 1/1/2011 9:14 AM, AMuzi wrote:
>>> A. Muzi wrote:
>>> > [...]
>>>> It's not as if competitive cyclists come from a different pool than we
>>>> other humans ( Karol Wotylja may be a special case).
>>
>>> Il Papa was a competitive cyclist?
>>
>>
>> Yes, as a young man in Poland.
>
> Huh. I remember him being noted as a skier when he was first made pope. While I have a news photo of him being
> presented with a Colnago by Ernesto himself (in the first year or so of his papacy), I didn't know he had any
> experience /riding/ the things.
I think that he was an "outdoor enthusiast" including cycling. (not
sure about the competitive bit though)
http://www.francescoproductions.com/papalimages/historic1.html
dusto...@mac.com
> On 1/1/2011 9:14 AM, AMuzi wrote:
>
> >> A. Muzi wrote:
> >> > [...]
> >>> It's not as if competitive cyclists come from a different pool than we
> >>> other humans ( Karol Wotylja may be a special case).
>
> >> Il Papa was a competitive cyclist?
>
> > Yes, as a young man in Poland.
>
> Huh. I remember him being noted as a skier when he was first made pope.
> While I have a news photo of him being presented with a Colnago by
> Ernesto himself (in the first year or so of his papacy), I didn't know
> he had any experience /riding/ the things.
<http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/sponsors/italia/colnago02/?id=bikes>
Detail, down the page a little, from Ernesto IRT the gold Colnago
Mexico he presented to Pope John Paul II, and what they built for him,
later, that he actually rode.
The poster of the presentation is priceless, many captions possible
and more power (so to speak) to J2P2; that Mexico was, um, heavenly.
--D-y
Jay Beattie
> "Jay Beattie" <jbeat...@lindsayhart.com> wrote in message
Skiing for me today. Blue bird day and corn starch, squeaky snow.
Lift lines were short, probably because everyone was home watching a
bowl game with a hang-over. -- Jay Beattie.
Duane Hebert
>Skiing for me today. Blue bird day and corn starch, squeaky snow.
>Lift lines were short, probably because everyone was home watching a
>bowl game with a hang-over. -- Jay Beattie.
Going in the morning but there's a chance of rain.
Last time it rained here in January it was followed by
"THE" ice storm that took out the province for weeks.
Hopefully it changes to snow...
David Scheidt
:"Jay Beattie" <jbea...@lindsayhart.com> wrote in message
:news:93320bbc-147d-4297...@r19g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
Was that about 1996?
--
sig 16
Chalo
>
> Skiing for me today. Blue bird day and corn starch, squeaky snow.
Consolation prize, I assure you.
Duane Hebert
Peter Cole
I always liked Sheldon's line about New England being great for cycling
10 months out of the year -- July and August being just too hot.
When I began doing weekly club rides many years ago, I was surprised to
find that everyone planned to stop once the cold weather arrived. I
announced that I was going to keep riding every Saturday morning, by
myself, if need be. That first winter, I did indeed ride a few times
alone, but most times had several companions. Now, the typical ride,
even in the dead of winter, draws 50 or so, even cold wind-swept rain
will bring out a dozen. The club's unbroken Saturday morning ride
"streak" now exceeds 700 rides. That list includes sub-zero (F),
pre-plow blizzards (had to bike to ride start, no cars out) and even a
hurricane. They were all fun.
I've never understood the reluctance to cycle in winter. I grew up doing
all kinds of outdoor winter activities, cycling seemed no different.
Like everything else, it just seemed a matter of getting the right
clothing/gear. Downhill skiing in some ways was much more challenging,
given that you were usually on top of some barren mountain, often going
faster than a bike, and/or spending long times shuffling in lift lines
or dangling on chair lifts (frequently stopped under snow guns).
Cycling, like X/C skiing or skating, makes it easier to tolerate the
cold, given the constant high activity level. A hour or two bike ride in
the lowlands seems like nothing compared to all day on the howling
summits with stop & go chilling and sweating.
Having done lots of both, I would rather ride in the woods in the winter
than X/C ski, conditions allowing, ditto for biking on frozen lakes over
skating. X/C skiing and mountain biking form almost perfect compliments,
since snow depth makes one or the other always possible. That said, snow
around here (Boston) has been unreliable enough to have only supported
brief X/C seasons in the last decade. Winter MTB seems to be the better
bet. Road riding is always do-able.
I actually ride more on winter weekends than I do in the summer. The
short winter days prod me to get as much daylight as possible, and there
aren't so many competing outdoor activities. In the summer, it's hard to
give up sailing or a picnic to sweat over hot pavement. I would much
rather ride for a couple of hours on Saturday or Sunday outside, even if
it's in sleet or freezing rain than slog on the trainer indoors or just
lay about nursing a bad case of cabin fever. There's not enough Prozac
in the world to get me to mall walk or spin in a gym.
I had a good ride yesterday, lots of snow melting in the almost 60F
warmth. The deep slush made things slippery in spots, I much prefer
things to be frozen solid so my studs have something to grip.
Lou Holtman
Indeed. Cycling keeps me sane during the dark season. The studs doing
very well on ice and hard pack frozen snow and not so well on deep
sticky wet snow we had the last couple of days. On the other hand it is
good for you steering and balancing capabilities ;-)
What is not to like about these circumstances:
http://picasaweb.google.com/LoetjeH/Winter_dec2010#
Lou
James
> Op 2-1-2011 17:36, Peter Cole schreef:
>
>
>
> > On 1/1/2011 10:51 AM, Duane Hebert wrote:
>
It's effing cold! I'm not equipped for riding in that stuff. Last
time I tried was the winter classic from Mt Hotham and around Omeo in
Victoria. It was -7 degC on top of Hotham and the cold air burned my
lungs. I don't know how the cross country skiers do it, or you folks.
Cheers,
James.
Jay Beattie
Sunny and cold today -- maybe high twenties when I started riding this
morning, but it perked up to the mid 30s and was just beautiful.
Flocks of cyclists, and the ride home through the cemetery was like a
drag race. I was riding with a friend (who is still racing), and we
got swollowed by the peleton in the middle of the climb and had a big
sprint up the steep part. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI7T2iuGjjc
(climb starts at 2:48 -- it's like a mile and half in real life). I
was suffering after a hard day of skiing, but still managed to hang --
which makes me feel pretty good for an old dude. This was a
consolation day. -- Jay Beattie.
dusto...@mac.com
"Life is a stage race".
Very good, thanks for that vid. Inspiring!
--D-y
Frank Krygowski
>
> I've never understood the reluctance to cycle in winter. I grew up doing
> all kinds of outdoor winter activities, cycling seemed no different.
> Like everything else, it just seemed a matter of getting the right
> clothing/gear.
Well, I find the choice of clothing is a lot more complicated than
for, say, winter hiking. Seems to me the amount of uphill heating and
the difference with downhill, wind chill cooling is much greater than
it is for hiking or XC skiing. Yes, I know to zip and unzip, etc.,
and I even worked up some records of what to wear in what
temperatures, but even that is tougher when I'm needing both hands
for bike control plus wearing clumsy gloves.
I admit that I wimp out a lot these days. I used to ride a lot more
in winter than I now do. Part of that was realizing that I frequently
got bronchitis after longish winter rides. A few years after that
began happening with some regularity, I began cutting back. Getting
old, I guess.
- Frank Krygowski
Dan O
> On Jan 2, 11:36 am, Peter Cole <peter_c...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I've never understood the reluctance to cycle in winter. I grew up doing
> > all kinds of outdoor winter activities, cycling seemed no different.
> > Like everything else, it just seemed a matter of getting the right
> > clothing/gear.
>
> Well, I find the choice of clothing is a lot more complicated than
> for, say, winter hiking.
It is extremely complicated. You absolutely have to start off
uncomfortably cold, else you wind up too hot as you warm up. "Just
right" is exceedingly elusive.
On top of everything else, the body's internal heating system seems to
vary in effect from one day to the next. Very, very complicated
indeed.
Add to that frequent but often hard to predict rain... still more
complication.
> Seems to me the amount of uphill heating and
> the difference with downhill, wind chill cooling is much greater than
> it is for hiking or XC skiing.
> Yes, I know to zip and unzip, etc.,
> and I even worked up some records of what to wear in what
> temperatures...
It is helpful to have a starting point in the ballpark - based on
experience.
> ... , but even that is tougher when I'm needing both hands
> for bike control plus wearing clumsy gloves.
Gloves are a bugaboo. They only work well in a narrow temperature
range, and hands too hot or too cold really affects overall comfort.
My Descente ear-cover headband is a godsend in the bitter cold, but
wearing it can also push the whole body over the threshold of
uncomfortably hot.
The worst part for me is my tendency to loathe stopping at all, and
just press on once I get going. I can sometimes pocket the headband
or change gloves out of my messenger bag while riding, but stopping to
change much of anything else fouls up the internal thermostat.
>
> I admit that I wimp out a lot these days. I used to ride a lot more
> in winter than I now do. Part of that was realizing that I frequently
> got bronchitis after longish winter rides. A few years after that
> began happening with some regularity, I began cutting back.
After two straight winters of riding more days than not, I have fallen
off the wagon hard this season. (Wouldn't have been nearly so bad if
I hadn't taken up smoking again while I was at it.) I *have* to get
back in the saddle (am planning to head out tomorrow morning in
mid-20's - we'll see).
The last time I bike-commuted (weeks ago), I had something of a semi-
hypothermia experience, collapsing on the kitchen floor when I got
home.
> Getting
> old, I guess.
>
It sucks, all right (I'm not the young buck you might imagine from my
attitude :-) Better than the alternative, as they say.
I say that the reason I ride is first and foremost fun - I get to be a
kid on a bike - and that all the typically assumed reasons (fitness,
environmental, financial, etc.) are side benefits. I think, though,
that this may be more true in the warmer season, and that I have done
it in winter largely just to prove how tough I am.
Jay Beattie
I don't think it's that hard to get cold weather clothing dialed in --
if you are willing to dump a lot of money on various layers. There is
some weather, though, where you are just not going to be comfortable,
like near freezing rain . . . after your gear soaks through, and you
are in the middle of a fourteen mile descent in driving rain with no
additional dry layers to put on. http://www.flickr.com/photos/kevinwagoner/368653942/
-- Jay Beattie.
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°
>
> I don't think it's that hard to get cold weather clothing dialed in --
> if you are willing to dump a lot of money on various layers. There is
> some weather, though, where you are just not going to be comfortable,
> like near freezing rain . . . after your gear soaks through, and you
> are in the middle of a fourteen mile descent in driving rain with no
> additional dry layers to put on. http://www.flickr.com/photos/kevinwagoner/368653942/
> -- Jay Beattie.
Who says you have to get wet and windchilled while riding?
<http://greenash.net.au/media/uploads/images/go_one_velomobile_jpg_720x1000_q85.jpg>