Gone to Dresden
Davey Crockett
The meeting point is Schlesischer Platz (Bahnhof Dresden Neustadt) in
Dresden, 12 (noon) on February 13. More info (in German) here:
http://www.jlosachsen.de/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=84&Itemid=1
Bring your helmets - it looks like it's gonna be a Donneybrook
--
Davey Crockett
Michael Press
Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
> See you there anyone who can make it
>
> The meeting point is Schlesischer Platz (Bahnhof Dresden Neustadt) in
> Dresden, 12 (noon) on February 13. More info (in German) here:
> http://www.jlosachsen.de/in...
>
> Bring your helmets - it looks like it's gonna be a Donneybrook
Suppose you tell us what it is about before we visit the site?
--
Michael Press
Ben Trovato
> In article <87hbplih2i....@darkstar.azurservers.com>,
Michael Press
<923e6cf1-a876-4821...@a5g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
Ben Trovato <benn.t...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 13, 2:09 pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> > In article <87hbplih2i....@darkstar.azurservers.com>,
> > Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
> >
> > > See you there anyone who can make it
> >
> > > The meeting point is Schlesischer Platz (Bahnhof Dresden Neustadt) in
> > > Dresden, 12 (noon) on February 13. More info (in German) here:
> > >http://www.jlosachsen.de/in...
> >
> > > Bring your helmets - it looks like it's gonna be a Donneybrook
> >
> > Suppose you tell us what it is about before we visit the site?
>
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_germany_dresden_anniversary
Thank you ever so much.
--
Michael Press
Ben Trovato
> Ben Trovato <benn.trov...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 13, 2:09 pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> > > In article <87hbplih2i....@darkstar.azurservers.com>,
> > > Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
>
> > > > See you there anyone who can make it
>
> > > > The meeting point is Schlesischer Platz (Bahnhof Dresden Neustadt) in
> > > > Dresden, 12 (noon) on February 13. More info (in German) here:
> > > >http://www.jlosachsen.de/in...
>
> > > > Bring your helmets - it looks like it's gonna be a Donneybrook
>
> > > Suppose you tell us what it is about before we visit the site?
>
> >http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_germany_dresden_anniversary
>
> Thank you ever so much.
>
> --
> Michael Press
I'm sure it wasn't much of a surprise...
Michael Press
<33880e3a-3f17-45e9...@l12g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
Ben Trovato <benn.t...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I'm sure it wasn't much of a surprise...
Surprise? I still do not know anything.
Do you think that visited the site?
--
Michael Press
Ryan Cousineau
Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> In article
> <923e6cf1-a876-4821...@a5g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
> Ben Trovato <benn.t...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 13, 2:09 pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> > > In article <87hbplih2i....@darkstar.azurservers.com>,
> > > Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > See you there anyone who can make it
> > >
> > > > The meeting point is Schlesischer Platz (Bahnhof Dresden Neustadt) in
> > > > Dresden, 12 (noon) on February 13. More info (in German) here:
> > > >http://www.jlosachsen.de/in...
> > >
> > > > Bring your helmets - it looks like it's gonna be a Donneybrook
> > >
> > > Suppose you tell us what it is about before we visit the site?
> >
> > http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_germany_dresden_anniversary
>
> Thank you ever so much.
So as I understand the protests, the neo-Nazis were memorializing the
bombing of Dresden.
Were the counter-protestors chanting "we deserved it!"?
More interestingly, that article says that estimates of the Dresden
firebombing deaths have lately been revised downward drastically: 25,000.
--
Ryan Cousineau rcou...@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."
Kyle Legate
> In article <rubrum-62A9E7....@news.albasani.net>,
> Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
>
>> In article
>> <923e6cf1-a876-4821...@a5g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
>> Ben Trovato <benn.t...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Feb 13, 2:09� pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
>>>> In article <87hbplih2i....@darkstar.azurservers.com>,
>>>> � Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> See you there anyone who can make it
>>>>> The meeting point is Schlesischer Platz (Bahnhof Dresden Neustadt) in
>>>>> Dresden, 12 (noon) on February 13. More info (in German) here:
>>>>> http://www.jlosachsen.de/in...
>>>>> Bring your helmets - it looks like it's gonna be a Donneybrook
>>>> Suppose you tell us what it is about before we visit the site?
>>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_germany_dresden_anniversary
>> Thank you ever so much.
>
> So as I understand the protests, the neo-Nazis were memorializing the
> bombing of Dresden.
>
> Were the counter-protestors chanting "we deserved it!"?
>
A. Dumas
> So as I understand the protests, the neo-Nazis were memorializing the
> bombing of Dresden.
>
> Were the counter-protestors chanting "we deserved it!"?
Dummer Junge,
No. The Neonazis are hijacking Dresden's deaths to excuse Nazi crimes.
"That was bad so we were good." Counter-protesters are trying to
separate the issues.
Davey Crockett
| In article <rubrum-62A9E7....@news.albasani.net>,
| Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
|
| > In article
| > <923e6cf1-a876-4821...@a5g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
| > Ben Trovato <benn.t...@hotmail.com> wrote:
| >
| > > On Feb 13, 2:09Â pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
| > > > In article <87hbplih2i....@darkstar.azurservers.com>,
| > > > Â Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
| > > >
| > > > > See you there anyone who can make it
| > > >
| > > > > The meeting point is Schlesischer Platz (Bahnhof Dresden Neustadt) in
| > > > > Dresden, 12 (noon) on February 13. More info (in German) here:
| > > > >http://www.jlosachsen.de/in...
| > > >
| > > > > Bring your helmets - it looks like it's gonna be a Donneybrook
| > > >
| > > > Suppose you tell us what it is about before we visit the site?
| > >
| > > http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_germany_dresden_anniversary
| >
| > Thank you ever so much.
|
| So as I understand the protests, the neo-Nazis were memorializing the
| bombing of Dresden.
|
| Were the counter-protestors chanting "we deserved it!"?
|
| More interestingly, that article says that estimates of the Dresden
| firebombing deaths have lately been revised downward drastically:
| 25,000.
The more information you dig up about the Allied firestorm bombing of
Dresden, the more obvious an atrocity it is. By February 1945, Germany
was only a few weeks away from total defeat. Dresden produced mainly
soap, china and cameras. It’s value as a military target was dismissed
by Allied strategists. One source reported “January 25 was the day when
the decision was taken that resulted in the blotting out of
Dresden. Until then, the capital of Saxony (Dresden) had been considered
so famous a cultural monument and so futile a military target that even
the Commander in Chief of Bombing Command, Air Marshal Sir Arthur
Harris, had given it hardly a thought…”
What Dresden did have was people. Hundreds of thousands of German
refugees fleeing the Red Army had stopped in Dresden. Soviet soldiers
were raping virtually all German women over the age of 10 (in another
Allied atrocity). Winston Churchill wanted to strike at the German
people one last time, mass murdering as many civilians as possible
before the war ended.
One British pilot reported “On 13th February 1945 I was a navigator on
one of the Lancaster bombers which devastated Dresden. I well remember
the briefing by our Group Captain. We were told that the Red Army was
thrusting towards Dresden and that the town would be crowded with
refugees and that the center of the town would be full of women and
children. Our aiming point would be the market place. I recall that we
were somewhat uneasy, but we did as we were told… The penny didn’t drop
until a few weeks later when my squadron received a visit from the Crown
Film Unit who were making the wartime propaganda films. There was a mock
briefing, with one notable difference. The same Group Captain now said,
‘as the market place would be filled with women and children on no
account would we bomb the center of the town. Instead, our aiming point
would be a vital railway junction to the east. I can categorically
confirm that the Dresden raid was a black mark on Britain’s war
record. The aircrews on my squadron were convinced that this wicked act
was not instigated by our much-respected guvnor ‘Butch’ Harris but by
Churchill. I have waited 29 years to say this, and it still worries me.”
The Allies discovered that if they dropped massive quantities of
incendiaries on a city that a firestorm results. Temperatures in the
middle of the firestorm can exceed 1,000 degrees and hurricane force
wind draws anything loose (including people) into the fire. When this
sort of attack was carried out on Hamburg, thousands of German civilians
in air raid shelters were suffocated or cooked alive. The British knew
what had happened during the firestorm at Hamburg. They deliberately
chose to carry out this sort of attack on a city full of refugees with
little if any military value only weeks before the war would end. What
kind of a monster would do this to hundreds of thousands of civilians in
the closing weeks of a war?
The German authorities and rescue workers counted and tagged 250,000
bodies at Dresden a few weeks after the bombing according to a report
received and noted by Joseph Goebbels in his 1945 diary (“Final
Entries”). This is the minimum number of dead. Who knows how many bodies
could not be recovered in the few weeks before the Red Army overran the
remains of the city? Many bodies were hopelessly buried under
rubble. The extreme temperatures of a firestorm may have incinerated
many victims near the center of the city. Allied historians have claimed
a death toll at Dresden many times less, but they never explain how they
arrived at their much-reduced estimates. Did they rely on observation
plane photos from 30,000 feet? Did they come up with a figure of 35,000
dead because 250,000 dead would make them obvious war criminals? The
German authorities were doing their best to retrieve the dead from the
rubble during the last chaotic weeks of the war. The Germans were known
to keep bureaucratic records of almost everything –even under the worst
conditions. Once the Soviets overran Dresden, the truth of the death
toll was unlikely to be revealed. The German records of this Allied
atrocity were almost certainly hidden or destroyed by the Soviets.
One source suggests that the number of dead may be as high as
500,000. That article reports “On the evening of February 13, 1945, an
orgy of genocide and barbarism began against a defenseless German city,
one of the greatest cultural centers of northern Europe. Within less
than 14 hours not only was it reduced to flaming ruins, but an estimated
one-third of its inhabitants, possibly as many as a half a million, had
perished in what was the worst single event massacre of all time..known
as the Florence of the North. Dresden was a hospital city for wounded
soldiers. Not one military unit, not one anti-aircraft battery was
deployed in the city. Together with the 600.000 refugees from Breslau,
Dresden was filled with nearly 1.2 million people. Churchill had asked
for “suggestions how to blaze 600.000 refugees”. He wasn’t interested
how to target military installations 60 miles outside of Dresden. More
than 700.000 phosphorus bombs were dropped on 1.2 million people. One
bomb for every 2 people. The temperature in the centre of the city
reached 1600 degrees centigrade. More than 260.000 bodies and residues
of bodies were counted. But those who perished in the centre of the city
can’t be traced. Approximately 500.000 children, women, the elderly,
wounded soldiers and the animals of the zoo were slaughtered in one
night.”
The American writer, Kurt Vonnegut, who was a POW near Dresden, remarked
“You guys burnt the place down, turned it into a single column of
flame. More people died there in the firestorm, in that one big flame,
than died in Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined.”
http://daveycrockett.free.fr/Dresden.rm
--
Davey Crockett
Davey Crockett
"We fought on the Wrong side...."
George S Patton - Letter to his wife
--
Davey Crockett
Fred Fredburger
> In article <rubrum-62A9E7....@news.albasani.net>,
> Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
>
>> In article
>> <923e6cf1-a876-4821...@a5g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
>> Ben Trovato <benn.t...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Feb 13, 2:09� pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
>>>> In article <87hbplih2i....@darkstar.azurservers.com>,
>>>> � Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> See you there anyone who can make it
>>>>> The meeting point is Schlesischer Platz (Bahnhof Dresden Neustadt) in
>>>>> Dresden, 12 (noon) on February 13. More info (in German) here:
>>>>> http://www.jlosachsen.de/in...
>>>>> Bring your helmets - it looks like it's gonna be a Donneybrook
>>>> Suppose you tell us what it is about before we visit the site?
>>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_germany_dresden_anniversary
>> Thank you ever so much.
>
> So as I understand the protests, the neo-Nazis were memorializing the
> bombing of Dresden.
>
> Were the counter-protestors chanting "we deserved it!"?
The counter-protesters were against holocaust denialism.
A. Dumas
Davey Crockett
| I repeat, I'll enjoy a good drink when you decide to die.
Well at least Davey's going to die on his feet and fighting
Not on his knees like some poor brainwashed bastard who'd believe the
moon was made of Blue Cheese if some New World Order Liar told him a
couple of times and who stands sheepishly by applauding whilst his Bilderberg
indoctrinated government fill his country full of sub human turd world
scum, or elects an ape who'd rather play with his cock than salute when
the National Anthem is playing:
http://azurservers.com:6080/rbr/salute.jpg
--
Davey Crockett
-
Miss Europe, 2015
http://azurservers.com:6080/rbr/misseurope.jpg
Amit Ghosh
> I repeat, I'll enjoy a good drink when you decide to die.
davey's having a good time in dresden while he can though :
bjwe...@gmail.com
> "A. Dumas" a écrit profondement:
>
> | I repeat, I'll enjoy a good drink when you decide to die.
It's intolerant people like you who won't look
beyond the stereotypes of neo-Nazis to see
what neo-Nazis are really like.
> Well at least Davey's going to die on his feet and fighting
Oh, bullshit.
Can the Martyr Talk and admit that you're most likely
to die in bed like the rest of us. Or at the most, check out
of a heart attack at a city limit sprint.
The only fighting you do anymore is trying to stir
up shit on usenet with your stupid signature material.
At least Kunich's pleas for attention are often marginally
bicycle related.
Ben
Ryan Cousineau
"A. Dumas" <alex...@dumas.fr> wrote:
"Hey-hey, ho-ho! The issues are more nuanced, you know!"
"What do we want? A balanced assessment of the event in a proper
historic context! When do we want it? Now!"
Howard Kveck
Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
> "A. Dumas" a �crit profondement:
>
> | I repeat, I'll enjoy a good drink when you decide to die.
>
> Well at least Davey's going to die on his feet and fighting
>
> Not on his knees like some poor brainwashed bastard who'd believe the
> moon was made of Blue Cheese if some New World Order Liar told him a
> couple of times and who stands sheepishly by applauding whilst his Bilderberg
> indoctrinated government fill his country full of sub human turd world
> scum, or elects an ape who'd rather play with his cock than salute when
> the National Anthem is playing:
> http://azurservers.com:6080/rbr/salute.jpg
Let's see now.
Out and out racist? Check.
Holocaust denial? Check.
9-11 Truther? Check.
Anti-semite? Check.
Religious Bigot? Check.
Nazi sympathizer? Check.
On top of all the above, you act like you think you're so much more informed and
nuanced than the rest. Then we have the cutesy spellingz and referring to yourself in
the third person. And the 'nym: "Davey Crockett." What a joke you are. I don't give a
damn about how much awesome bike racing you did back when, you're a pathetic, vile,
old man. You have every right to think the shit you do but don't cry when you get
called on it, dumbass.
--
tanx,
Howard
Caught playing safe
It's a bored game
remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?
Fred Fredburger
> In article <4b781609$0$22933$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>,
> "A. Dumas" <alex...@dumas.fr> wrote:
>
>> Ryan Cousineau wrote:
>>> So as I understand the protests, the neo-Nazis were memorializing the
>>> bombing of Dresden.
>>>
>>> Were the counter-protestors chanting "we deserved it!"?
>> Dummer Junge,
>>
>> No. The Neonazis are hijacking Dresden's deaths to excuse Nazi crimes.
>> "That was bad so we were good." Counter-protesters are trying to
>> separate the issues.
>
> "Hey-hey, ho-ho! The issues are more nuanced, you know!"
>
> "What do we want? A balanced assessment of the event in a proper
> historic context! When do we want it? Now!"
>
Well, yeah. Also, some things are difficult to get a laugh out of. I
understood that "we deserved it!" was intended to be funny (and I think
it is, I'm a big fan of dark humor) but the fact that it's attached to a
Holocaust denial thread distracts from that. I know, I've done similar
things.
At the dinner table a couple nights ago, my kids were complaining about
how they had to learn cursive writing in elementary school. No one uses
it in the real world, it's always an unreadable mess, etc. My wife
jumped in with "The only appropriate place for cursive is wedding
invitations." So I chimed in with "Yeah, that was the biggest complaint
of the Auschwitz survivors. Having to write in cursive all the time."
The joke flopped in much the same way that "we deserved it" flopped.
It's not fair!