Howdy from a newbie
popeyeball
to hearing more of the wisdom I have already read in the posts I have
seen here this morning. Have some experience camping and some
experience being in the cold but no experience winter camping. I just
bought a four season tent, have other supplies, and have bought a
couple of books on winter camping. But there is no greater knowledge
than getting it first hand from others who have experience. I'm
planning to roam Michigans Upper Peninsula in February (that way I'll
be buying 06 stickers for State & National parks).
Please say hi if you'd like.
Don't hesitate to dump all the information and advice my way that you
wish - it's all appreciated for consideration.
Steve in Michigan
Thiere is no try. You do, or you do not. Yoda
Peter Clinch
> But there is no greater knowledge
> than getting it first hand from others who have experience.
"Good judgment comes from experience
Experience comes from bad judgment"
Build up experience in relatively benign spots where you can bail out
fairly easily if need be, then when it gets to the serious stuff you'll
have your personal smarts in place to deal with problems.
Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.c...@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
Puppet_Sock
> popeyeball wrote:
>
> > But there is no greater knowledge
> > than getting it first hand from others who have experience.
>
> "Good judgment comes from experience
> Experience comes from bad judgment"
>
> Build up experience in relatively benign spots where you can bail out
> fairly easily if need be, then when it gets to the serious stuff you'll
> have your personal smarts in place to deal with problems.
That's good advice, and I just wanted to see it posted again.
Some examples of good places to learn.
- Set up your tent a few feet from your back door. Try to see if you
can keep going without going back inside to get stuff you forgot.
Keep a list of what you do go back inside to get.
- Car camp. That is, pile a load of equipment in your car, drive some
short distance, then unload it and camp beside your car. Even if
you get in deep deep trouble, you can last through a lot if you have
your car to retreat to.
Socks
Ed Huesers
> Thiere is no try. You do, or you do not. Yoda
http://www.grandshelters.com/images/snow-camping-cmf-s2.jpg
Stay dry with experience, use knowledge to find the experience.
Ed Huesers
http://www.grandshelters.com
mudboy
> Don't hesitate to dump all the information and advice my way that you
> wish - it's all appreciated for consideration.
> Steve in Michigan
>
Sporks are evil and don't feed the sasquatches.
Noh Phu Ling
>My name is Steve and I just signed up for your group. I look forward
>to hearing more of the wisdom I have already read in the posts I have
>seen here this morning. Have some experience camping and some
>experience being in the cold but no experience winter camping. I just
>bought a four season tent, have other supplies, and have bought a
>couple of books on winter camping. But there is no greater knowledge
>than getting it first hand ...
>
You're off to a good start with such a mindset. There is solid advice in
the posts prevous to mine.
>There is no try. You do, or you do not. Yoda
>
>
>
Your tagline is also apposite. Try to anticipate all likely scenarios,
but also be ready to meet the unexpected. Remain flexible/adaptable in
your plans and actions. Seemingly vague & vacuous generalities. Bringing
generalities to bear on specific situations will mark your growth. Be
not overly pratical; likewise be not too bound by maxims. Do not
second-guess yourself too often. More often than not your first
evaluation will be the correct one.
Do NOT carry everything you own. It's amazing how well one can do with
minimal gear. It's also amazing how some folk become hopelessly burdened
by just the mass of gear they try to carry. A good sleeping bag. A good
tent. A gound pad of insulating foam. A small tarp for windbreak. A good
trail axe. A packbasket with the simple items one should carry in all
seasons. A good heavy-guage pot w/ lid. A good sheath knife. A towel.
For fancies, a heavy mug for each person along. Same with soup spoons.
On the more concrete level: in winter camping/travel moisture is your
enemy and your goal. Be warm through layers; keep dry through not
overlayering. Be able to ventilate without chilling; be able to hydrate
without excessive bodily moisture. Do not carry heavy volumes of liquid
- find it in your surroundings. Have much liquid but moderate
carbohydrates in your diet and recipes. Cook for protein first, liquid
second and carbohydrates last. Heat beverages for internal body warmth.
Carry backups to all your layered clothing options. Carry double rations
of any medications/suppliments that are important to you, even the
1-a-day vitamins; your psyche needs them even when your body does not
and if there are unforseen delays you will be better prepared and
perhaps saved by any essential medications.
Yours in the North Maine Woods,
Pete Hilton (Reg. Me. Guide) aka The Ent
--
The universe is largely unexplored.
NPR News item
Daniel-San
"popeyeball" wrote ...
<<<snip>>>
> I look forward to hearing more of the wisdom I have already read in the
> posts I have
> seen here this morning.
<<snip>>
> Steve in Michigan
I must have a crappy ISP. The only 'wisdom' I've seen here today involves
definitions of libel, whether or not someone named Cheanne is Len's
SO/wife/daughter/neice/nephew, an ad from some WebTV moron that can't spell
'dollar', and a highly intellectual discussion regarding air pollution and
Mexicans.
Maybe the filters I use are set too strictly?
Dan
popeyeball
more input.
This is for Dan:
Dan, I'm sure your ISP is fine. Although I did not read any of the
topics you mentioned, I did spend several hours reading archives. That
is the wisdom of which I spoke
Steve in Michigan
Ed Huesers
> My name is Steve and I just signed up for your group.
Welcome.
> I look forward to hearing more of the wisdom I have already
> read in the posts I have seen here this morning.
Google is searchable with r.b. posts titled: Today's Humor
That'll lead you to the wisdom.
> Have some experience camping and some
> experience being in the cold but no experience winter camping.
Ya gonna have a fire?
I like cold camping without the bother of the fire. Sides, my
clothes ice up bad around a fire. It seems I like floundering in the
snow instead of just being around a fire. Well, my clothes warm up by
the fire and when I go out into the snow, the snow melts on my warm
clothes that then ice up. The next time away from the fire results in
even worse build up because of the wet drops on my clothing.
Yeah, I know, stop floundering in the snow.
> I just bought a four season tent
Sheesh, to late.
> have other supplies, and have bought a
> couple of books on winter camping.
Pay close attention when they talk about staying dry. Learn to
recognize the sweat coming on before any moisture gets into your
clothing, gloves included.
> But there is no greater knowledge
> than getting it first hand from others who have experience.
Hands... don't put them in the snow when they are warm right out of
your gloves. Shake, brush or knock snow off gear and articles before
touching them with bare hands. Avoid touching metals bare handed.
> I'm planning to roam Michigans Upper Peninsula in February (that
> way I'll be buying 06 stickers for State & National parks).
Maybe Len can help you with the UP. All I know is there's a lot of
shore ice and climbers climb some of it.
> Please say hi if you'd like.
How bout howdy?
> Don't hesitate to dump all the information and advice
> my way that you wish
Searchable and it drifts on through at times.
> Thiere is no try. You do, or you do not. Yoda
Searchable and better before that date.
Ed Huesers
Http://www.grandshelters.com
Sohn
"popeyeball" <popey...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1132046761.4...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
You should add this book to your library
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/083954040X/102-6394849-5462507?v=glance&n=283155&s=books&v=glance
Okpik: Cold Weather Camping is an excellent reference source. It's costs
$9.95 plus shipping if you buy it direct from Boy Scouts of America.
https://scoutnet.scouting.org/BSASupply/SearchPage.aspx?page=LIST&free_text|=okpik&answers_per_page=15
Ron
Puppet_Sock
[snip]
> Thiere is no try. You do, or you do not. Yoda
Sigh. If you are going to quote Yoda, then *quote* Yoda.
No! Try not!
Do! Or do not.
There is no try.
This was the first half of the quote on my thesis.
Socks
Daniel-San
"Puppet_Sock" wrote
>
> Sigh. If you are going to quote Yoda, then *quote* Yoda.
>
> No! Try not!
> Do! Or do not.
> There is no try.
>
> This was the first half of the quote on my thesis.
> Socks
>
Thesis? Color me interested....
Dan
Puppet_Sock
Nah. It's off topic like crazy here. I just like quotes to be quotes.
My thesis title: Hamiltonian Analysis on the Null Plane.That was
<mumble> years ago, and by now even I am bored with it.
Socks
Daniel-San
"Puppet_Sock" wrote...
>> Thesis? Color me interested....
>
> Nah. It's off topic like crazy here. I just like quotes to be quotes.
> My thesis title: Hamiltonian Analysis on the Null Plane.That was
> <mumble> years ago, and by now even I am bored with it.
> Socks
>
I can't even fathom WTF that's about. I guess I was hoping it was something
along the lines of _The Simpsons and Philosophy: the D'Oh of Homer_, but
with a Star Wars twist.
Sounds like the Yoda quote may be part of a long story...
Cheers,
Dan
Sohn
"Ed Huesers" <e...@grandshelters.com> wrote in message
news:ZXaff.89$%z5....@news.uswest.net...
Contact Alger Chamber of Commerce (906) 387-2138 about the waterfalls in
the area. Do a Google search for Miners Falls.
Ron
Ed Huesers
>> Maybe Len can help you with the UP. All I know is there's a lot of
>> shore ice and climbers climb some of it.
Sohn wrote:
> Contact Alger Chamber of Commerce (906) 387-2138 about the waterfalls in
> the area. Do a Google search for Miners Falls.
Ah, so I see: http://www.nps.gov/piro/WinterCampnIceClimb04.pdf
Ed Huesers
Http://www.grandshelters.com
Eugene Miya
>> My name is Steve and I just signed up for your group.
And what net.species do you declare?
In article <ZXaff.89$%z5....@news.uswest.net>,
Ed Huesers <e...@grandshelters.com> wrote:
> Welcome.
>
>> I look forward to hearing more of the wisdom I have already
>> read in the posts I have seen here this morning.
>
> Google is searchable with r.b. posts titled: Today's Humor
> That'll lead you to the wisdom.
ROFTL.
More bear jokes?
>> Have some experience camping and some
>> experience being in the cold but no experience winter camping.
>
> Ya gonna have a fire?
> I like cold camping without the bother of the fire. Sides, my
>clothes ice up bad around a fire. It seems I like floundering in the
>snow instead of just being around a fire. Well, my clothes warm up by
>the fire and when I go out into the snow, the snow melts on my warm
>clothes that then ice up. The next time away from the fire results in
>even worse build up because of the wet drops on my clothing.
> Yeah, I know, stop floundering in the snow.
Most of my other Colorado climbing and skiing buddies prefer the wood to
carrying a lot of fuel on a week long ski trip.
>> I just bought a four season tent
> Sheesh, to late.
Too quick to judge.
>> have other supplies, and have bought a
>> couple of books on winter camping.
>
> Pay close attention when they talk about staying dry. Learn to
>recognize the sweat coming on before any moisture gets into your
>clothing, gloves included.
Find and travel with an experienced person.
>> But there is no greater knowledge
>> than getting it first hand from others who have experience.
As a generalization...
>> Don't hesitate to dump all the information and advice
>> my way that you wish
Do you have the prerequisites?
>> Thiere is no try. You do, or you do not. Yoda
You trying for a job at Lucasarts?
--
Ed Huesers
> Ed Huesers wrote:
>> Google is searchable with r.b. posts titled: Today's Humor
>> That'll lead you to the wisdom.
Eugene Miya wrote:
> ROFTL.
> More bear jokes?
Well, there is that but I find gaining knowledge from any certain
group archives, my time is better spent finding a worthy poster and
reading all that they have to say.
> popeyeball wrote:
>>>Have some experience camping and some
>>>experience being in the cold but no experience winter camping.
>> Ya gonna have a fire?
>> I like cold camping without the bother of the fire. Sides, my
>>clothes ice up bad around a fire. It seems I like floundering in the
>>snow instead of just being around a fire. Well, my clothes warm up by
>>the fire and when I go out into the snow, the snow melts on my warm
>>clothes that then ice up. The next time away from the fire results in
>>even worse build up because of the wet drops on my clothing.
>> Yeah, I know, stop floundering in the snow.
> Most of my other Colorado climbing and skiing buddies prefer the wood to
> carrying a lot of fuel on a week long ski trip.
It looks like I've gone to the dark side. I think it's more work
gathering all that fire wood and maintaining the fire than it is to
carry the fuel and stove.
>>> I just bought a four season tent
>> Sheesh, to late.
> Too quick to judge.
The money is spent. I'll never buy anything more than a three season
tent when my old tent is retired.
>>>have other supplies, and have bought a
>>>couple of books on winter camping.
>> Pay close attention when they talk about staying dry. Learn to
>>recognize the sweat coming on before any moisture gets into your
>>clothing, gloves included.
> Find and travel with an experienced person.
True words of wisdom but I find it hard to find any wanting to join me.
Off to Trollhaugen Ski Area for the weekend.
Ed Huesers
http://www.grandshelters.com
Sohn
"popeyeball" <popey...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1132046761.4...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
The following information is from the February Midwest Edition issue of
Backpacker magazine:
Quoting Backpacker Magazine:
"Michigan Ice Fest February 2-5 Munising, Michigan
There's no higher concentration of ice in the Midwest than at Pictured Rocks
National Lakeshore. Discover it all-from the ice that drops form cliffs
into Lake Superior to the hidden pillars scattered throughout the park. Try
climbing gear, attend clinics (fees), and watch slide shows presented by
world-class climbers. www.downwindsports.com "
Here's a link that looks interesting too.
http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/land/wildlife/reclands/sandhill/calendar.htm#schedule
Ron
Gary S.
wrote:
>> popeyeball wrote:
>
>> Ed Huesers wrote:
>>> Google is searchable with r.b. posts titled: Today's Humor
>>> That'll lead you to the wisdom.
>
>Eugene Miya wrote:
>> ROFTL.
>> More bear jokes?
>
> Well, there is that but I find gaining knowledge from any certain
>group archives, my time is better spent finding a worthy poster and
>reading all that they have to say.
>
I agree, unless the person searching is a skilled searcher with good
critical thinking skills.
The problem with the Internet is not that information is not out there
on a given topic; the problem is all of the half-true, untrue,
tangential, or entirely irrelevant "information" also on the Net.
The different between drinking from an unlabeled hose, and having a
bartender mix the drink you asked for.
Library science and the role of librarians is changing, and becoming
more important.
>>> Ya gonna have a fire?
>>> I like cold camping without the bother of the fire. Sides, my
> It looks like I've gone to the dark side. I think it's more work
>gathering all that fire wood and maintaining the fire than it is to
>carry the fuel and stove.
>
In many areas, building a fire is either prohibited, or difficult (no
available fuel). A very useful skill to have, but for many trips, a
stove and fuel makes more sense.
Cooking over a fire can take more skill and equipment than many think.
>> Find and travel with an experienced person.
>
> True words of wisdom but I find it hard to find any wanting to join me.
> Off to Trollhaugen Ski Area for the weekend.
>
This is a role often filled by activity organizations.
Happy trails,
Gary (net.yogi.bear)
--
At the 51st percentile of ursine intelligence
Gary D. Schwartz, Needham, MA, USA
Please reply to: garyDOTschwartzATpoboxDOTcom
Eugene Miya
Gary S. <Idontwantspam@net> wrote:
>On Fri, 02 Dec 2005 09:24:57 -0700, Ed Huesers <e...@grandshelters.com>
>wrote:
>>> popeyeball wrote:
>>> Ed Huesers wrote:
>>>> Google is searchable with r.b. posts titled: Today's Humor
>>>> That'll lead you to the wisdom.
>>
>>Eugene Miya wrote:
>>> More bear jokes?
>>
>> Well, there is that but I find gaining knowledge from any certain
>>group archives, my time is better spent finding a worthy poster and
>>reading all that they have to say.
>>
>I agree, unless the person searching is a skilled searcher with good
>critical thinking skills.
Lacking in most people these days.
>The problem with the Internet is not that information is not out there
>on a given topic; the problem is all of the half-true, untrue,
>tangential, or entirely irrelevant "information" also on the Net.
No. First, those are both problems.
Second, the latter example isn't "information." This is why we make
distinctions of data vs. information.
Consider offers to maintain panel 7....
>The different between drinking from an unlabeled hose, and having a
>bartender mix the drink you asked for.
Poor example.
>Library science and the role of librarians is changing, and becoming
>more important.
Librarians are by and large being downsized and only given lip service.
>>>> Ya gonna have a fire?
>>>> I like cold camping without the bother of the fire. Sides, my
>
>> It looks like I've gone to the dark side. I think it's more work
>>gathering all that fire wood and maintaining the fire than it is to
>>carry the fuel and stove.
>>
>In many areas, building a fire is either prohibited, or difficult (no
>available fuel). A very useful skill to have, but for many trips, a
>stove and fuel makes more sense.
In a few areas. "Many" is far too strong a word.
>Cooking over a fire can take more skill and equipment than many think.
Sure. Does one philosophize about the skill or gain it?
>>> Find and travel with an experienced person.
>> True words of wisdom but I find it hard to find any wanting to join me.
>> Off to Trollhaugen Ski Area for the weekend.
Prepping the Hawaiian return to the snows.
>This is a role often filled by activity organizations.
Marginal these days. Society's urbanization has reduced the group
intelligence of these groups.
--