Af/Pak & Other News (3/9/2012)

[dump...@hotmail.com]

Pakistan Taliban demand release of bin Laden’s widows, threaten
attacks:

http://www.dawn.com/2012/03/09/pakistan-taliban-demand-release-of-bin-ladens-widows-threaten-attacks.html



US gives up control of jail where Quran was burned:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46685811/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/#.T1p-zPUvjIU



U.S. aid agency prepares switch to Afghan security:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/09/us-afghanistan-usa-aid-idUSBRE8281AM20120309



U.S. Drones Kill 12 Militants in Pakistan:

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2108702,00.html



Pakistan appoints new spy chief:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/story/2012-03-09/pakistan-spy-chief-taliban/53437194/1



CSA praises doomed C-27J’s role in Afghanistan:

http://www.dodbuzz.com/2012/03/09/csa-praises-doomed-c-27js-role-in-afghanistan/



More Boxers Prepare For Fight:

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs/defense/index.jsp?plckController=Blog&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&newspaperUserId=27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7&plckPostId=Blog%3a27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7Post%3a2b978b80-5714-4636-943f-0ba63bad6c4f&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest



Dawn Presents Wikileaks' Pakistan Papers:

http://www.dawn.com/pakistan-papers



CH-53D Has Left The Building:

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htairmo/articles/20120309.aspx



Clash With Iran Could See Use Of Huge Bomb:

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story.jsp?id=news/awx/2012/03/09/awx_03_09_2012_p0-434683.xml&headline=Clash%20With%20Iran%20Could%20See%20Use%20Of%20Huge%20Bomb&channel=defense



Pentagon Planning for Actions Against Iran, Syria:

http://www.defensenews.com/article/20120308/DEFREG02/303080008/Pentagon-Planning-Actions-Against-Iran-Syria?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE



Stratfor: Syria - what prevents US military involvement:

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=24263:stratfor-syria-what-prevents-us-military-involvement&catid=56:diplomacy-a-peace&Itemid=111



Reporting from Syria can be a nightmare, even lethal:

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle09.asp?xfile=data/middleeast/2012/March/middleeast_March201.xml&section=middleeast



Syria And Hezbollah Have Advanced Missiles:

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story.jsp?id=news/awst/2012/03/12/AW_03_12_2012_p27-433282.xml&headline=Syria%20And%20Hezbollah%20Have%20Advanced%20Missiles&channel=awst



Syria opposition chief rejects dialogue with Assad regime:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/story/2012-03-09/syria-opposition-diplomacy-defectors/53430532/1



Mass pro-democracy protest rocks Bahrain:

http://www.euronews.com/newswires/1429656-mass-pro-democracy-protest-rocks-bahrain/



US finalises $11.4 billion Saudi order for F-15s:

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/us-finalises-114-billion-saudi-order-for-f-15s-369304/



Millions in Israel 'lack gas masks, bomb shelters':

http://www.spacewar.com/reports/Millions_in_Israel_lack_gas_masks_bomb_shelters_999.html



Israel Concern Over Iran's Submarine Fleet in Possession of Fast
Torpedoes:

http://www.israeldefense.com/?CategoryID=426&ArticleID=954



Gaza militants fire rockets into Israel after IDF kills Palestinian
leader:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/gaza-militants-fire-rockets-into-israel-after-idf-kills-palestinian-leader-1.417594



Libya begins battle to seize $20 billion in Gadhafi assets - starting
with London mansion:

http://worldnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/09/10601385-libya-begins-battle-to-seize-20-billion-in-gadhafi-assets-starting-with-london-mansion



Libya: Thousands Protest Against Self-Rule:

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/libya-thousands-protest-rule-15885772#.T1qCBPUvjIU



Everything From Strike Eagles to Drones at U.S.’ African Hub:

http://defensetech.org/2012/03/09/everything-from-strike-eagles-to-drones-at-u-s-african-hub/



Italy condemns botched British raid in Nigeria:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/09/us-italy-britain-idUSBRE8280KG20120309



Probe links corporate spying to Chinese government:

http://bottomline.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/09/10623204-probe-links-corporate-spying-to-chinese-government



China cyber capability endangers US forces -report:

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=24255:china-cyber-capability-endangers-us-forces-report&catid=48:Information%20&%20Communication%20Technologies&Itemid=109



S. Korea Holds Firing Drill Near Tense Border:

http://www.defensenews.com/article/20120308/DEFREG03/303080009/S-Korea-Holds-Firing-Drill-Near-Tense-Border?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE



USAF, South Korean F-16s walk the walk:

http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/the-dewline/2012/03/usaf-south-korean-f-16s-walk-t.html



JLTV, GCV Survive But Face Competitions:

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story.jsp?id=news/dti/2012/03/01/DT_03_01_2012_p28-426912.xml&headline=JLTV,%20GCV%20Survive%20But%20Face%20Competitions&channel=defense



Pentagon Tries (Again) to Shoot Down Rockets:

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/03/anti-rocket-raytheon/



USS Simpson and HSL-60 Use Fire Scout UAV:

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articles-view/release/3/133392/us-frigate-first-to-deploy-with-own-uav.html



Putting the Joint in Rivet Joint:

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs/defense/index.jsp?plckController=Blog&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&newspaperUserId=27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7&plckPostId=Blog%3a27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7Post%3a3c874732-223e-4f20-9afd-9d79c2799325&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest



Cold War Tech: Soviet Torpedo Trawlers:

http://defensetech.org/2012/03/09/cold-war-tech-soviet-torpedo-trawlers/

[dump...@hotmail.com]

On Mar 9, 5:24 pm, dumpst...@hotmail.com wrote:

>
> Cold War Tech: Soviet Torpedo Trawlers:
>
> http://defensetech.org/2012/03/09/cold-war-tech-soviet-torpedo-trawlers/

So, how close did Soviet trawlers get to U.S Carriers during the Cold
War?

I wonder if the Chinese or Iranians have anything like this?

[Dennis]

wrote:

> On Mar 9, 5:24 pm, dumpst...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>>
>> Cold War Tech: Soviet Torpedo Trawlers:
>>
>> http://defensetech.org/2012/03/09/cold-war-tech-soviet-torpedo-trawlers/
>
>
> So, how close did Soviet trawlers get to U.S Carriers during the Cold
> War?

I read a book about a consultative body between the US and Soviet navies
that met annually during the Cold War to resolve grievances. Unfortunately
I can't think of the name of it. It would have that info.

Don't recall about carriers, but in some cases the trawlers collided with
US ships. US skippers handled these nuisances differently.

Soviet greivances were more about being buzzed and illuminated by US
airplanees.

> I wonder if the Chinese or Iranians have anything like this?

Or worse! Wouldn't be surprised. Of course, retaliation would be swift.
'Gee, sorry about that airliner...'

Dennis

[Andrew Swallow]

On 10/03/2012 01:24, dump...@hotmail.com wrote:
> Italy condemns botched British raid in Nigeria:
>
> http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/09/us-italy-britain-idUSBRE8280KG20120309

It was an Italian company and one of the hostages was Italian, where
were the Italian special forces?

Andrew Swallow

[dott.Piergiorgio]

Seems to me more like an ASW setup than an ASuW one; converting trawlers
in auxiliary escorts & sub chasers is a recognized wartime SOP, and the
soviet intel trawlers obviously will became much less useful in a WWIII
context...

Best regards from Italy,
dott. Piergiorgio.

[dott.Piergiorgio]

SF units, in general, don't talk much about cancelled or aborted
operations & planning in general, for obvious reasons...

Because isn't the first time UK botches an HR operation involving
Italian and british hostages (already happened in Afghanistan some time
ago...) I'm not exactly optimist on improvement in cooperation.

Also, I guess that "here had only been a limited opportunity to try to
free the hostages" and "The fact of the matter is things were moving
quite quickly on the ground and we had to respond to that and our top
priority was to maximize the chances of getting the hostages out."
aren't good nor valid reasons for precipitating an armed HR op in a
country whose locals are worldwide known for their high inclination
towards scamming and forgery....

[dump...@hotmail.com]

On Mar 9, 8:32 pm, "dott.Piergiorgio" <chiedet...@ask.me> wrote:

>
> Seems to me more like an ASW setup than an ASuW one; converting trawlers
> in auxiliary escorts & sub chasers is a recognized wartime SOP, and the
> soviet intel trawlers obviously will became much less useful in a WWIII
> context...
>
> Best regards from Italy,
> dott. Piergiorgio.

Then why not mount the tubes above the waterline, as is normally done
on
surface ships/boats?

The fact that the tubes are hidden below the waterline implies a
"surprise
attack" mission.

[dott.Piergiorgio]

Il 10/03/2012 08:20, dump...@hotmail.com ha scritto:

> Then why not mount the tubes above the waterline, as is normally done
> on
> surface ships/boats?
>
> The fact that the tubes are hidden below the waterline implies a
> "surprise
> attack" mission.

well, as you correctly point, with underwater tubes, only an
Pueblo-style capture can reveal the outfit; and honestly, in the initial
shots of a WWIII what US or NATO sub commander can't ignore the apparent
easy prey, an Intel ship apparently doing a sort of EW picket duty at
the fringe of Soviet sea sanctuaries ?

and I can humbly point that having AWL TTs defeats the formal
"fishermen" disguise.

I don't think that the sonar is used for clever "screwprinting" (lacking
a better term for this specific SIGINT) of US SSN on CVBG escort duties,
or attempting to intercept the undersea comms between said CVBG and the
SSN below, and the presence of both don't imply that russian maskirovkas
cover this type of sneak attack; after the "foxtrot quartet" incident
during the Cuban Missile Crisis one can definitively exclude that Sov
Gov't gives isolated ships in potential harm's way tools whose can
accidentally ignite WWIII....

Also, Soviets was definitively aware that US targeting includes
dockyards and the like, and considering the VMF "sanctuary" strategy,
that intel ship are equipped in advance for SC works actually makes
sense; and anyway, Soviet Admirals actually can read history books and
what happened to Japanese picket craft in mid-WWII onwards strongly
suggests giving picket and SC craft strong tools of self-defense and ASW
contrast.

I consider feasible the simple start-of-hostilities SOP of disembarking
the spooks detachment and embarking the torpedos and the torpedomen
detachment at a predesignated place, hopefully not already reduced to
radioactive pile of rubbles...

[SolomonW]

On Fri, 9 Mar 2012 17:24:48 -0800 (PST), dump...@hotmail.com wrote:

> Pentagon Tries (Again) to Shoot Down Rockets:
>
> http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/03/anti-rocket-raytheon/

Cost/benefit of such a missile has always been questionable

[Keith W]

They are if you think they are about to kill the hostages. Sitting around
doing nothing while you try and get approval from the government
in Rome is not a good option.


Keith

[Brian Colwell]

"Keith W" <keithnosp...@demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:s4I6r.21500$di4....@newsfe14.ams2...

>If the operation had been a success, I wonder what their reaction would
>have been !

bmc

[dump...@hotmail.com]

On Mar 9, 11:58 pm, "dott.Piergiorgio" <chiedet...@ask.me> wrote:
; after the "foxtrot quartet" incident
> during the Cuban Missile Crisis one can definitively exclude that Sov
> Gov't gives isolated ships in potential harm's way tools whose can
> accidentally ignite WWIII....
>

I don't know about that. Remember the "Whiskey on the rocks" incident
in Sweden?:

"The Swedish Defense Research Agency also secretly measured for
radioactive materials
from outside the hull, using gamma ray spectroscopy from a specially
configured Coast
Guard boat. They detected something that was almost certainly
uranium-238 inside the
submarine, localized to the port torpedo tube.[1] Uranium-238 was
routinely used as cladding
in nuclear weapons and the Swedes suspected that the submarine was in
fact nuclear armed.[1]
The yield of the probable weapon was estimated to be the same as the
bomb dropped over
Nagasaki in 1945. Although the presence of nuclear weapons on board
the S-363 was never
officially confirmed by the Soviet authorities,[3] the vessel's
political officer, Vasily Besedin, later
confirmed that there were nuclear warheads on some of the torpedoes,
and that the crew was
ordered to destroy the boat, including these warheads, if Swedish
forces tried to take control
of the vessel.[4]"

Source:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_submarine_S-363

See also:

http://www.strategypage.com/dls/articles/The-Mysterious-Swedish-Whiskey-On-The-Rocks-4-1-2011.asp

http://compunews.com/s139/sp2.htm

[Mike]

The Italians were still at their 3 hour lunch...


--
Mike

[dott.Piergiorgio]

Il 11/03/2012 01:38, Mike ha scritto:

> The Italians were still at their 3 hour lunch...

and the britons are doing their five meals a day and their five o' clock
tea...

let's not play with national stereotypes....

Dott. Piergiorgio.

[William Black]

Three o'clock tea, home at five...

We don't have a three hour lunch break...

--
William Black

Free men have open minds
If you want loyalty, buy a dog...

[Andrew Swallow]

Yes but British are having tea inside the enemy HQ.

Andrew Swallow

[Michele]

"Andrew Swallow" <am.sw...@btinternet.com> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:iLudnfpfYvfiWcDS...@bt.com...

If that is a metaphor for victory, yes, sometimes they are.
Not this time, though. It was an abysmal, utter failure.

[Andrew Swallow]

It was a half victory - we killed enemies. It is nice to get the
hostages back but more important that our enemies die. The lesson that
attacking Westerners gets you killed will keep the kidnapping rate down.

Andrew Swallow

[Alex Potter]

Andrew Swallow wrote:

> It was a half victory - we killed enemies. It is nice to get the
> hostages back but more important that our enemies die. The lesson that
> attacking Westerners gets you killed will keep the kidnapping rate down.
>

I've always thought that it would be better to consider hostages as already
dead, in the unlikely event that I'd ever be called upon to plan such a
rescue operation. Any still alive when the smoke cleared would be a bonus.

--
Alex

[Eugene Griessel]

The bleeding hearts would have the mother and father of a hissy fit
and toss all their toys to the ground at such a suggestion.

Eugene L Griessel

It is vain to say human beings ought to be satisfied with tranquillity:
they must have action; and they will make it if they cannot find it.
Jacob Bronowski

[George152]

And so long as the nutters are aware that attacking, kidnapping or
killing gets them the into the Darwin awards they will be careful to
avoid that fate...
bin liner must have shat himself when he saw the SEAL

[Michele]

"Andrew Swallow" <am.sw...@btinternet.com> ha scritto nel messaggio

news:D6adnUW85-058f3S...@bt.com...

The mission statement was to bring the hostages back alive. The mission
failed.

[Michele]

"Alex Potter" <spa...@ap-consulting.co.uk> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:jjqhoc$1sc$1...@dont-email.me...

Then it's a good thing you're not in charge.

[Michele]

"George152" <gbl...@hnpl.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:4OOdnTfb9vvFcv3S...@giganews.com...

> And so long as the nutters are aware that attacking, kidnapping or killing
> gets them the into the Darwin awards they will be careful to avoid that
> fate...

If that reasoning worked, there would be lower crime rates in the states
that have the death penalty.

[Steve Hix]

In article <4f634b0b$0$1381$4faf...@reader1.news.tin.it>,

There do seem to be lower violent crime rates in states with shall-issue
concealed carry laws than not. Whether it's a cause or side effect or just
coincidence isn't perfectly clear, but it's been the trend for several decades
now. The only thing that seems definite is that changing to shall-issue doesn't
make things worse.