Af/Pak & Other News (8/30/2012)

[dump...@hotmail.com]

SEAL's book shows bin Laden raid up close:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505245_162-57503259/seals-book-shows-bin-laden-raid-up-close/



5 Australian Soldiers Killed in Afghanistan:

http://www.voanews.com/content/five-australian-soldiers-killed-in-afghanistan/1498407.html



Pakistani officials confirm death of key militant:

http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworld/2019023253_apaspakistan.html



U.S. Marines remain focused on preventing suicides: general:

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=27459:us-marines-remain-focused-on-preventing-suicides-general&catid=3:Civil%20Security&Itemid=113



Training the Afghan Military:

http://nation.time.com/2012/08/29/training-the-afghan-military-2/




Pakistani Taliban 'chopped off the heads' of 7 Pakistani soldiers in
South Waziristan:

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2012/08/pakistani_taliban_ch_1.php



Apple Rejects App That Tracks U.S. Drone Strikes:

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/08/drone-app/



RAF Surveillance Aircraft Clock Up 20,000 Flying Hours:

http://www.defencetalk.com/raf-surveillance-aircraft-clock-up-20000-flying-hours-44373/



Documents show White House interest in bin Laden film:

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=27458:documents-show-white-house-interest-in-bin-laden-film&catid=52:Human%20Security&Itemid=114



US Army Apache Fleet Surpasses 3.5 Million Flight Hours:

http://www.spacedaily.com/reports/US_Army_Apache_Fleet_Surpasses_3_point_5_Million_Flight_Hours_999.html



NATO Official: Most Insider Attacks in Afghanistan ‘Personal’:

http://www.defensenews.com/article/20120829/DEFREG04/308290005/NATO-Official-Most-Insider-Attacks-Afghanistan-8216-Personal-8217-?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE#



Army Starts Final Tests On Latest Network Tech For Afghanistan:

http://defense.aol.com/2012/08/29/army-starts-final-tests-on-latest-network-tech-for-aghanistan/




Army equips MRAPs with next generation radios:

http://www.dodbuzz.com/2012/08/29/army-equips-mraps-with-next-gen-radios/



Army Doubles Down on ‘Garbled, Ineffective’ Next-Gen Radios:

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/08/army-radio-garble/




Nine die as Indian military choppers crash: police:

http://india.nydailynews.com/newsarticle/503f4369f7dfe07333000001/nine-die-as-indian-military-choppers-crash-police



Indian Army to buy 20 mini-UAVs for Jammu and Kashmir operations:

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics/nation/indian-army-to-buy-20-mini-uavs-for-jammu-and-kashmir-operations/articleshow/15951075.cms




Rafale MMRCA Deal: Last Minute Glitches?:

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/article-view/release/137979/depleted-indian-af-needs-fast-closure-of-mmrca-deal.html




Wiper Malware That Hit Iran Left Possible Clues of Its Origins:

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/08/wiper-possible-origins/



Iran expanded nuclear capacity by 30 percent since May, diplomats say:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/iran-expanded-nuclear-capacity-by-30-percent-since-may-diplomats-say-1.461798




US drone strike kills Saudi 'militant' in Yemen:

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2012/08/us_drone_strike_kill_12.php



Iraq takes delivery of final batch of US tanks:

http://www.defencetalk.com/iraq-takes-delivery-of-final-batch-of-us-tanks-44379/



Syrian activists say rebels shot down warplane:

http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Syrian-activists-say-rebels-shot-down-warplane-3826665.php



Tombstones a 'luxury' in war-torn Syria:

http://photoblog.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/30/13565505-tombstones-a-luxury-in-war-torn-syria?lite



Can Hezbollah Survive the Fall of Assad?:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/29/opinion/can-hezbollah-survive-the-fall-of-assad.html?_r=2&ref=opinion



Syria's War Spills Into Lebanon:

http://www.worldaffairsjournal.org/blog/michael-j-totten/syrias-war-spills-lebanon



Egypt's Morsi calls for intervention to end 'oppressive' Syria regime:

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/30/13563926-egypts-morsi-calls-for-intervention-to-end-oppressive-syria-regime?lite



Israel: Surrounded By Chaos And Collapse:

http://www.strategypage.com/qnd/israel/articles/20120830.aspx




Egypt army presses Sinai drive, says 11 militants dead:

http://www.spacewar.com/reports/Egypt_army_presses_Sinai_drive_says_11_militants_dead_999.html



British company to build SA Mamba:

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=27309:british-company-to-build-sa-mamba&catid=50:Land&Itemid=105



U.S. urges African air forces to form NATO-style ties:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/08/28/us-usa-africa-airforces-idUSBRE87R0QI20120828



AROUND AFRICA: Mombasa Violence, Ethiopian Leader Dies, Designated
Africa Brigade,:

http://4gwar.wordpress.com/2012/08/30/around-africa-mombasa-violence-ethiopian-leader-dies-designated-africa-brigade/




'Black Widow' assassinates moderate Muslim cleric in Russia's
Caucasus:

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2012/08/black_widow_assassin.php



Unexploded WWII bomb disrupts Amsterdam Schiphol airport:

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/29/13543423-unexploded-wwii-bomb-disrupts-amsterdam-schiphol-airport?lite



Venezuela to investigate reports of massacre of Indians by gold
miners:

http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/30/world/americas/venezuela-tribe-attack/index.html



Mexican police attacked CIA officers, ambush likely: sources:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/08/29/us-mexico-shooting-idUSBRE87S19K20120829



New Zealand: Upgraded Orion Transition Course Starts Flying:

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articles-view/release/3/137961/rnzaf-crews-train-on-upgraded-p_3k2-orions.html



China to build 11 UAV bases for coastal surveillance:

http://alert5.com/2012/08/30/china-to-build-11-uav-bases-for-coastal-surveillance/



Race against time to find US MIAs in Vietnam:

http://www.spacewar.com/reports/Race_against_time_to_find_US_MIAs_in_Vietnam_999.html



S. Korean Navy Operates 3rd Aegis Ship:

http://www.defensenews.com/article/20120830/DEFREG03/308300001/S-Korean-Navy-Operates-3rd-Aegis-Ship?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE



Inside China: Missile defense conspiracy?:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/aug/29/inside-china-missile-defense-conspiracy/



Army's Newest General Purpose Round Shows Accuracy In Rifle
Competition:

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articles-view/release/3/137964/new-5.56mm-round-shows-better-accuracy.html



Futuristic Ships Anchor US Navy Surface Plans:

http://defensetech.org/2012/08/30/futuristic-ships-anchor-us-navy-surface-plans/



USAF details F-16 life extension programme:

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/usaf-details-f-16-life-extension-programme-375914/



Navy Approves Full Rate Production for New Anti-Radiation Missile:

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/article-view/release/137980/us-navy-oks-full_rate-production-for-aargm-anti_radiation-missile.html



Harvard boffins build cyborg skin of flesh and nanowires:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/08/30/harvard_cyborg_skin/

[Vaughn]

On 8/30/2012 12:38 PM, dump...@hotmail.com wrote:
> Army equips MRAPs with next generation radios:
>
> http://www.dodbuzz.com/2012/08/29/army-equips-mraps-with-next-gen-radios/
>
>
>

> Army Doubles Down on �Garbled, Ineffective� Next-Gen Radios:
>
> http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/08/army-radio-garble/

"The Senate urged the Army to �leverage commercially available
technology� to fill in for the cut Manpacks, something the ground combat
branch has done repeatedly over the 15 years "

Yes, that's an idea that probably sounds good to someone who sits in a
Washington office and need never worry about being killed by "friendly
fire". Unfortunately, there is nothing worse than having a mish-mash of
mutually incompatible communications systems on the battlefield.

[Jim Wilkins]

"Vaughn" <vaugh...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:k1o5p1$hjt$1...@speranza.aioe.org...

> On 8/30/2012 12:38 PM, dump...@hotmail.com wrote:
>> Army equips MRAPs with next generation radios:
>>
>> http://www.dodbuzz.com/2012/08/29/army-equips-mraps-with-next-gen-radios/
>>
>>
>>

>> Army Doubles Down on �Garbled, Ineffective� Next-Gen Radios:
>>
>> http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/08/army-radio-garble/
>
> "The Senate urged the Army to �leverage commercially available
> technology� to fill in for the cut Manpacks, something the ground

> combat branch has done repeatedly over the 15 years "
>
> Yes, that's an idea that probably sounds good to someone who sits in
> a Washington office and need never worry about being killed by
> "friendly fire". Unfortunately, there is nothing worse than having
> a mish-mash of mutually incompatible communications systems on the
> battlefield.

Modern digital radios contain very little that isn't programmable with
software:
http://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/software/hardware-for-your-software-radio

The ones I built for the FAA and USAF used direct digital synthesizers
to generate the modulated IF frequency, and A/D converters to digitize
the received IF signal. Only the RF front end was specific to the
operating band and the modulation and protocol could be anything the
customer wanted without changing the hardware.

A hobbyist version:
http://midnightdesignsolutions.com/dds60/index.html
Such a device could modulate a transmitter sending anything from Morse
code to high-definition television.

They are a higher frequency version of the audio synthesizer that can
mimic any instrument you choose
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthesizer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Tactical_Radio_System
"Problems included a decentralized management structure, changing
requirements, and unexpected technical difficulties that increased
size and weight goals that made it harder to add the required
waveforms."
Remember that we have a government so dysfunctional that it couldn't
even pass a budget despite single-party domination.

I didn't work on JTRS.

jsw

[Vaughn]

On 8/30/2012 1:45 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>
> Modern digital radios contain very little that isn't programmable with
> software:
> http://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/software/hardware-for-your-software-radio
>
> The ones I built for the FAA and USAF used direct digital synthesizers
> to generate the modulated IF frequency, and A/D converters to digitize
> the received IF signal. Only the RF front end was specific to the
> operating band and the modulation and protocol could be anything the
> customer wanted without changing the hardware.

True in theory, but the devil is in the details. I spent 20 years in
public safety communications, and I can confidently tell you that the
market in high-end radio communications is no free-for-all buffet.
Manufacturers do all they can do to tie customers to their own product
line with proprietary protocols, multiplexers, vocoders etc.

Having lived with the transition from conventional to trunking, and then
later from trunking to digital, I know how devilishly difficult and
expensive a communications system can be.

[Andrew Swallow]

A military system may also want frequency hopping and encryption.

Andrew Swallow

[Jim Wilkins]

"Andrew Swallow" <am.sw...@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:tY2dnZyHjpGmVaLN...@bt.com...

Technically those are trivial. As Vaughn pointed out the hard problems
are economic and political.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_definition_optical_disc_format_war
http://mobiledevices.about.com/od/carrierfaq/i/Cdma-Vs-Gsm-Which-Is-More-Preferable.htm

By the 90's circuit board makers had enough familiarity and experience
with military circuit board standards to use them for industrial and
higher-end commercial products without much of a cost penalty. COTS or
Commercial-Off-The-Shelf electronics were nearly as reliable as
mil-spec ones at a much lower mass-produced price, and became very
attractive to avoid high development costs and long qualification
times. That took away some of my circuit board design work, replacing
it with more bench testing projects.

The auto industry contributed to this with engine controls that had to
withstand nearly the same operating range as a fighter plane, both
ends in quick succession in a snowplow truck in Alaska. I helped build
GM's test station for this. It cycled HEI modules from -55C to +125C
in five minutes.

jsw

[Bill]

On Thu, 30 Aug 2012 17:35:42 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
<murat...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>"Andrew Swallow" <am.sw...@btinternet.com> wrote in message
>news:tY2dnZyHjpGmVaLN...@bt.com...
>> On 30/08/2012 20:00, Vaughn wrote:
>>> On 8/30/2012 1:45 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>>>>
>>>
>>> Having lived with the transition from conventional to trunking, and
>>> then
>>> later from trunking to digital, I know how devilishly difficult and
>>> expensive a communications system can be.
>>>
>> A military system may also want frequency hopping and encryption.
>>
>> Andrew Swallow
>
>Technically those are trivial. As Vaughn pointed out the hard problems
>are economic and political.
>

Encryption is never trivial.

It is always horribly complicated.

Even if it's just a little black box the key management and operator
training remains a dreadful chore.

[Jim Wilkins]

"Bill" <black...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:l9ov38lb92j1ea6r0...@4ax.com...

Again it's a human problem, not a technical one. The hardware is quite
simple.

ATMs and bank cards are a good introduction to cryptographic
principles:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_teller_machine

t4o8%y6Bp

[Bill]

On Thu, 30 Aug 2012 18:18:13 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"

<murat...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>"Bill" <black...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:l9ov38lb92j1ea6r0...@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 30 Aug 2012 17:35:42 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
>> <murat...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>> Encryption is never trivial.
>>
>> It is always horribly complicated.
>>
>> Even if it's just a little black box the key management and operator
>> training remains a dreadful chore.
>
>Again it's a human problem, not a technical one. The hardware is quite
>simple.
>

That'll be why NSA employs all those people, some of whom are quite
bright...

[Uncle Steve]

You'd never know it since it seems they don't actually do anything
with the great masses of intel they gather. Perhaps that isn't true,
maybe they're just waiting for the right moment.


Regards,

Uncle Steve

--
"Assholes always advertise"
-- Pat Cadigan

[Daryl]

Then, Unc, they are going to quietly sneak up on your and eat all
your toastioes.



--
http://tvmoviesforfree.com
for free movies and Nostalgic TV. Tons of Military shows and
programs.

[Bill]

On Fri, 31 Aug 2012 08:56:47 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
wrote:

Ah, well it's like this Steve, as general rule politicians don't pay
people to sit around a drink coffee, especially if all it looks as if
they're doing is drinking coffee, they're far too easy a target for a
very popular government cut.

Nobody ever got any votes from being nice to civil servants who don't
appear to do any work...

[Uncle Steve]

Oh, I know. They're protecting their sources and methods, vital in
the intel business. Of course, since we don't know what their sources
and methods are, we really don't know what information they might
have. But it's interesting to note that whenever someone turns on the
light, by way of suing for access to information, people in the intel
community invariably scurry for cover like cockroaches.

It's almost as if they don't want the people who pay for their agency
to know anything about what they do.

[Bill]

On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 00:00:06 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Oh, I know. They're protecting their sources and methods, vital in
>the intel business. Of course, since we don't know what their sources
>and methods are, we really don't know what information they might
>have. But it's interesting to note that whenever someone turns on the
>light, by way of suing for access to information, people in the intel
>community invariably scurry for cover like cockroaches.
>
>It's almost as if they don't want the people who pay for their agency
>to know anything about what they do.

That's because they know how to keep a secret.

And when you read about them you realise that keeping secrets is more
important to them than just about anything else.

[Uncle Steve]

Then there are other people's secrets, which are not accorded quite
the same protection, now are they Bill. To wit, my IP was stolen and
passed around your shitty little industry quite freely. And because
someone decided they were going to really steal it, my copies were
destroyed and I was pushed out onto the street for ten years.

But info related to the looting of seniors' assets is sacred. Info
related to serial-killers operating for years and years unhindered is
sacred. Etcetera.

Which makes you and your ilk functionally equivalent to the most
fervent Nazis of the WWII era. Which is why we need a new round of
war-crimes trials.

[Bill]

On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 08:12:43 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>

wrote:

>On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 12:44:48PM +0100, Bill wrote:
>> On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 00:00:06 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Oh, I know. They're protecting their sources and methods, vital in
>> >the intel business. Of course, since we don't know what their sources
>> >and methods are, we really don't know what information they might
>> >have. But it's interesting to note that whenever someone turns on the
>> >light, by way of suing for access to information, people in the intel
>> >community invariably scurry for cover like cockroaches.
>> >
>> >It's almost as if they don't want the people who pay for their agency
>> >to know anything about what they do.
>>
>> That's because they know how to keep a secret.
>>
>> And when you read about them you realise that keeping secrets is more
>> important to them than just about anything else.
>
>Then there are other people's secrets, which are not accorded quite
>the same protection, now are they Bill. To wit, my IP was stolen

IP?

[Andrew Chaplin]

Bill <black...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:et3448lfgpoclfin7...@4ax.com:

Intellectual property.
--
Andrew Chaplin
SIT MIHI GLADIUS SICUT SANCTO MARTINO
(If you're going to e-mail me, you'll have to get "yourfinger." out.)

[Uncle Steve]

Sorry, Bill. I misspelled IPA. You worthless fuckers can't even buy
your own beer.

[Uncle Steve]

On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 01:51:37PM +0000, Andrew Chaplin wrote:
> Bill <black...@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:et3448lfgpoclfin7...@4ax.com:
>
> > On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 08:12:43 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >>Then there are other people's secrets, which are not accorded quite
> >>the same protection, now are they Bill. To wit, my IP was stolen
> >
> > IP?
>
> Intellectual property.

Not at all. See my direct reply to Bill.

[Bill]

On Sat, 1 Sep 2012 13:51:37 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Chaplin
<ab.ch...@yourfinger.rogers.com> wrote:

>Bill <black...@gmail.com> wrote in
>news:et3448lfgpoclfin7...@4ax.com:
>
>> On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 08:12:43 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>Then there are other people's secrets, which are not accorded quite
>>>the same protection, now are they Bill. To wit, my IP was stolen
>>
>> IP?
>
>Intellectual property.

He can sue...

[Uncle Steve]

In theory, Bill. The only problem is that assholes like you, the
military police, and the civilian police from CSIS on down to the
municipal level are all lying, corrupt, murdering swine and they enjoy
practical immunity from prosecution or litigation. That's because the
courts are full of bought-and-paid-for judges.

Don't worry, Bill. I have no evidence or personal experience to
support my "opinions". You just keep repeating the mental illness
attack; it's what you're good at.

[Andrew Chaplin]

Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com> wrote in news:4b2038a1007128e-
72...@gmail.com:

> In theory, Bill. The only problem is that assholes like you, the
> military police, and the civilian police from CSIS on down to the
> municipal level are all lying, corrupt, murdering swine and they enjoy
> practical immunity from prosecution or litigation. That's because the
> courts are full of bought-and-paid-for judges.

Not everyone thinks so: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/08/28/f-
rfa-macdonald-archie-barr.html.

[Uncle Steve]

On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 02:45:41PM +0000, Andrew Chaplin wrote:
> Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com> wrote in news:4b2038a1007128e-
> 72...@gmail.com:
>
> > In theory, Bill. The only problem is that assholes like you, the
> > military police, and the civilian police from CSIS on down to the
> > municipal level are all lying, corrupt, murdering swine and they enjoy
> > practical immunity from prosecution or litigation. That's because the
> > courts are full of bought-and-paid-for judges.
>
> Not everyone thinks so: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/08/28/f-
> rfa-macdonald-archie-barr.html.

It was reported by the CBC so it must be trve. The CBC is even worse
than NOW magazine.

[Andrew Chaplin]

On Sep 1, 11:00 am, Uncle Steve <stevet...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 02:45:41PM +0000, Andrew Chaplin wrote:

> > Uncle Steve <stevet...@gmail.com> wrote in news:4b2038a1007128e-

> > 72...@gmail.com:
>
> > > In theory, Bill. The only problem is that assholes like you, the
> > > military police, and the civilian police from CSIS on down to the
> > > municipal level are all lying, corrupt, murdering swine and they enjoy
> > > practical immunity from prosecution or litigation. That's because the
> > > courts are full of bought-and-paid-for judges.
>
> > Not everyone thinks so:http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/08/28/f-

> > frfa-macdonald-archie-barr.html.

>
> It was reported by the CBC so it must be trve.  The CBC is even worse
> than NOW magazine.

The piece is Neil Macdonald's opinion, and he is as good and as
sensible a reporter as you're likely to find in any media outlet.

You might have encountered his brother's work, too:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norm_Macdonald.

[Uncle Steve]

On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 09:27:15AM -0700, Andrew Chaplin wrote:
> On Sep 1, 11:00�am, Uncle Steve <stevet...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 02:45:41PM +0000, Andrew Chaplin wrote:
> > > Uncle Steve <stevet...@gmail.com> wrote in news:4b2038a1007128e-
> > > 72...@gmail.com:
> >
> > > > In theory, Bill. The only problem is that assholes like you, the
> > > > military police, and the civilian police from CSIS on down to the
> > > > municipal level are all lying, corrupt, murdering swine and they enjoy
> > > > practical immunity from prosecution or litigation. That's because the
> > > > courts are full of bought-and-paid-for judges.
> >
> > > Not everyone thinks so:http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/08/28/f-
> > > frfa-macdonald-archie-barr.html.
> >
> > It was reported by the CBC so it must be trve. �The CBC is even worse
> > than NOW magazine.
>
> The piece is Neil Macdonald's opinion, and he is as good and as
> sensible a reporter as you're likely to find in any media outlet.

That doesn't mean jack shit.

> You might have encountered his brother's work, too:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norm_Macdonald.

That's besides the point. If he's an insider, he will protect his
status by way of emiting reportage and opinion consistent with (let's
call it) the citizen-facing media establishment policy. If not, then
he, like so many media types, have expertise mainly in regurgitating
corporate and government reports.

There's an easy way to test this. Ask any of the media about the
prevelance of heroin use (or synthetics or derrivatives) among public
employees, and how it affects their thinking and work. The common
myth is that heroin addiction is almost exclusively a drug of the
streets ghettoes, and its users are prostitutes and the like. The
reality of the heroin trade is much less prosaic, and apparently
remains a priviliage of a relatively small group of elites.

The only way anyone can put toghther a somewhat coherent understanding
of how things are is through undertaking a burdensome analysis of
literature and current events without accepting any single source as
being credible or thorough in its treatment of any given subject.
Sturgeon's law applies in spades.

Returning to your MacDonald article, you should note that the opening
subheading is "ANALYSIS". The following paragraphs contain no
detectable traces of analysis. It is, in fact, almost entirely a
descriptive text, and possibly prescriptive to some of its intended
audience of journalists. Needless to say, there are no notes.

[Bill]

On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 13:02:57 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>

Actually pharmaceutical heroin, usually known as 'diamorphine', is in
widespread in hospitals.

[Uncle Steve]

No shit sherlock.

[Dean Markley]

Paranoid much!

[Bill]

On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 13:14:35 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>

It's good stuff, I was once given it in hospital and can understand
why people get addicted to it.

So what's your problem?

Can't get it on prescription?

I'd have thought you already looked out at the world through the
twilight glow of Nitrazepam...

[Uncle Steve]

They say once is all you need to become permanently dependent on the
shit, and your dealer.

> So what's your problem?
>
> Can't get it on prescription?

No, I can't get "it" on prescription. Maybe if my daddy was John
Harsh, then I'd have a secure supply of hot and cold running Heroin, but
sadly my parents were poor idiots without good political connections.

> I'd have thought you already looked out at the world through the
> twilight glow of Nitrazepam...

I'd prefer to smoke pot, however the organized crime element downtown
persists in selling utter garbage to the mere mortals in the area, and
unfortunately having hideous facial features (a tragic birth defect) I
don't tend to meet people socially who might know ethical pot dealers.

[Bill]

On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 15:33:54 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>

wrote:

>On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 06:59:43PM +0100, Bill wrote:
>> On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 13:14:35 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>

>> >> Actually pharmaceutical heroin, usually known as 'diamorphine', is in
>> >> widespread in hospitals.
>> >
>> >No shit sherlock.
>>
>> It's good stuff, I was once given it in hospital and can understand
>> why people get addicted to it.
>
>They say once is all you need to become permanently dependent on the
>shit, and your dealer.

Who's 'they' here?

I was on the stuff for a week and didn't suffer any physical
withdrawal symptoms.

>
>> So what's your problem?
>>
>> Can't get it on prescription?
>
>No, I can't get "it" on prescription. Maybe if my daddy was John
>Harsh, then I'd have a secure supply of hot and cold running Heroin, but
>sadly my parents were poor idiots without good political connections.

I'm sure if you told a doctor your problems he'd prescribe something
that would make your problems go away...

>> I'd have thought you already looked out at the world through the
>> twilight glow of Nitrazepam...
>
>I'd prefer to smoke pot, however the organized crime element downtown
>persists in selling utter garbage to the mere mortals in the area, and
>unfortunately having hideous facial features (a tragic birth defect) I
>don't tend to meet people socially who might know ethical pot dealers.

Love the idea of 'ethical dope dealers'.

Look Steve, almost all 'street level' sellers of controlled
substances are subsidising their own consumption.

There are no 'organised criminals' flogging the stuff to people
yourself.

[Keith W]

Uncle Steve wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 06:59:43PM +0100, Bill wrote:

>>
>> It's good stuff, I was once given it in hospital and can understand
>> why people get addicted to it.
>
> They say once is all you need to become permanently dependent on the
> shit, and your dealer.
>

'They' are talking out of their asses. Controlled usage in a
clinical situation causes little or no addiction. In fact doctors
prefer it to many other strong analgesics due to its low
risk of side effects. Its widely used for paim relief after
serious injury , heart attack and even in difficult births.

Keith

[Uncle Steve]

On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 08:54:38PM +0100, Bill wrote:
> On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 15:33:54 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 06:59:43PM +0100, Bill wrote:
> >> On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 13:14:35 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
>
> >> >> Actually pharmaceutical heroin, usually known as 'diamorphine', is in
> >> >> widespread in hospitals.
> >> >
> >> >No shit sherlock.
> >>
> >> It's good stuff, I was once given it in hospital and can understand
> >> why people get addicted to it.
> >
> >They say once is all you need to become permanently dependent on the
> >shit, and your dealer.
>
> Who's 'they' here?
>
> I was on the stuff for a week and didn't suffer any physical
> withdrawal symptoms.

How long is your week?

> >> So what's your problem?
> >>
> >> Can't get it on prescription?
> >
> >No, I can't get "it" on prescription. Maybe if my daddy was John
> >Harsh, then I'd have a secure supply of hot and cold running Heroin, but
> >sadly my parents were poor idiots without good political connections.
>
> I'm sure if you told a doctor your problems he'd prescribe something
> that would make your problems go away...

You clearly don't know who my doctor is. Sadly he is burdened with
ethics. It's probaly incurable, which is why I have decided to look
for another doctor. One with more flexible ethics.

> >> I'd have thought you already looked out at the world through the
> >> twilight glow of Nitrazepam...
> >
> >I'd prefer to smoke pot, however the organized crime element downtown
> >persists in selling utter garbage to the mere mortals in the area, and
> >unfortunately having hideous facial features (a tragic birth defect) I
> >don't tend to meet people socially who might know ethical pot dealers.
>
> Love the idea of 'ethical dope dealers'.

I would be one myself if it were not for those damn kids.

> Look Steve, almost all 'street level' sellers of controlled
> substances are subsidising their own consumption.
>
> There are no 'organised criminals' flogging the stuff to people
> yourself.

Says you.

[Uncle Steve]

So there are no cognitive effects that would lead quickly to
addiction?

[Bill]

On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 21:57:01 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>

wrote:

>On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 08:54:38PM +0100, Bill wrote:
>> On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 15:33:54 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 06:59:43PM +0100, Bill wrote:
>> >> On Sat, 01 Sep 2012 13:14:35 -0400, Uncle Steve <stev...@gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>>
>> >> >> Actually pharmaceutical heroin, usually known as 'diamorphine', is in
>> >> >> widespread in hospitals.
>> >> >
>> >> >No shit sherlock.
>> >>
>> >> It's good stuff, I was once given it in hospital and can understand
>> >> why people get addicted to it.
>> >
>> >They say once is all you need to become permanently dependent on the
>> >shit, and your dealer.
>>
>> Who's 'they' here?
>>
>> I was on the stuff for a week and didn't suffer any physical
>> withdrawal symptoms.
>
>How long is your week?

In this case, about 9 days.

>
>> >> So what's your problem?
>> >>
>> >> Can't get it on prescription?
>> >
>> >No, I can't get "it" on prescription. Maybe if my daddy was John
>> >Harsh, then I'd have a secure supply of hot and cold running Heroin, but
>> >sadly my parents were poor idiots without good political connections.
>>
>> I'm sure if you told a doctor your problems he'd prescribe something
>> that would make your problems go away...
>
>You clearly don't know who my doctor is. Sadly he is burdened with
>ethics. It's probaly incurable, which is why I have decided to look
>for another doctor. One with more flexible ethics.

Change your doctor, please...

>> Look Steve, almost all 'street level' sellers of controlled
>> substances are subsidising their own consumption.
>>
>> There are no 'organised criminals' flogging the stuff to people
>> yourself.
>
>Says you.

Says everyone.

Look, if you know of some 'Mr Big' why not tell everyone about him.

As a general rule the 'Mr Big' characters in the drug world are
smugglers rather than dealers.

Smugglers have always been well wealthy and connected violent
criminals.

[Dean Markley]

"POT" explains it all now.

[Keith W]

Uncle Steve wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 11:17:57PM +0100, Keith W wrote:
>> Uncle Steve wrote:
>>> On Sat, Sep 01, 2012 at 06:59:43PM +0100, Bill wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>> It's good stuff, I was once given it in hospital and can
>>>> understand why people get addicted to it.
>>>
>>> They say once is all you need to become permanently dependent on the
>>> shit, and your dealer.
>>>
>>
>> 'They' are talking out of their asses. Controlled usage in a
>> clinical situation causes little or no addiction. In fact doctors
>> prefer it to many other strong analgesics due to its low
>> risk of side effects. Its widely used for paim relief after
>> serious injury , heart attack and even in difficult births.
>
> So there are no cognitive effects that would lead quickly to
> addiction?
>

Properly administered no apart from the obvious relief
from pain. Typicaly its administered by either subcateneous
or intramuscular injection rather than into a vein which
gives the rush tha recreational users go for.

Keith

[Bill]

My experience, obviously anecdotal, is that after a week or so's use
I was moved onto less powerful painkillers and discharged from the
hospital.

No after effects.

However I can understand why people take the stuff, it is very nice.