Toyota's reputation needs some TLC
john
market share - on dependability, at a time when General Motors, Ford
Motor and Chrysler couldn't shake being identified with lemons.
The company that once could do no wrong has stumbled badly though a
series of embarrassments of disclosures, allegations and recalls.
Experts now are debating how deeply these will eat into the consumer
trust that is Toyota's most potent asset - and what it must do to
recover."
Full article at:
http://www.freep.com/article/20091221/BUSINESS01/91220036/1322/Toyotas-reputation-needs-some-TLC
C. E. White
----- Original Message -----
From: "john" <john...@hotmail.com>
Newsgroups:
alt.autos.toyota.camry,alt.autos.toyota,alt.autos.lexus,rec.autos.tech,alt.autos.toyota.trucks
Sent: Monday, December 21, 2009 9:18 PM
Subject: Toyota's reputation needs some TLC
> "Over a generation or so, Toyota built its reputation - and U.S.
> market share - on dependability, at a time when General Motors, Ford
> Motor and Chrysler couldn't shake being identified with lemons.
You mean Toyota built its reputation on the preception of reliability. I am
old enough to remember Toyota from the 60's, 70's, and 80's. They were
hardly paragon's of reliability.
Ed
Don Stauffer
I guess I'd disagree. Maybe we were just lucky. My son bought a
well-used Toyota Wagon to take to school in Massachusetts (we lived in
Missouri). That thing went back and forth I don't know how many times,
ran as well when he finished school as when he started.
I had a Datsun then that was a piece of junk. I looked his car over
carefully and wished that I had his car instead of mine. Castings
instead of pressed steel for covers, decent plastic instead of cardboard
for electrical system insulators, etc.
I would agree with you on the Datsun (Nissan), not the Toyota.
Wayne
"john" <john...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:9ef86ab9-f641-4911...@v15g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
Toyota can build and sell crap if they want....as long as there is a GM or
Ford to lower the bar of expectations.
Mike Hunter
better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel mileage
better than Toyota as well. GM and Ford vehicles can be driven home for
less, as well.
"Wayne" <mygarb...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:hgqqka$9to$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Paph Shmir
"Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote in message
news:4b30fa0d$0$31963$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
> The difference TODAY is that GM and Ford vehicles are rated as good or
> better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel mileage
> better than Toyota as well. GM and Ford vehicles can be driven home for
> less, as well.
>
Take a look at consumer reports. Ford and GM still don't cut the mustard.
They are getting closer but I would still rather have a Toyota than a Ford
or GM any day.
som...@some.domain
i had many 70's and 80's toyotas so i think this guy is fulla shit.
i had 1 77corolla that finally stopped when new england salt ate through it.
328,000mile. the i had an 86 2x4 truck with the amazing 22r motor. it was also
a new englander but kept passing smogs so i replaced the bed at 290,000 miles
and the cab at 387,000. i hated loosing the cab but it leaked cold air and the
cassette player died. the guy with the body i bought tossed in a cassette.
i kept that truck until 2002 when i gave it ti my idiot nephew. he replaced
the junk in the 5 speed and gave it ti his half brother. he still has it. it
runs loads of pig shit and cow feed around some hick midwest town.
it still runs fine and looks so funky it's classic.
i still have a 86 supra as the main ride. it needs paint and some fresh
upholstery but that's it. everything works, crusie and ac. i stuck a refurbed
tom tom on it and ain't no place we can't drive.
according to the toc, there are still 90 86!/2 supras licensed on the road.
not bad for a car only solf for 2 months. several have been converted to 89-90
standards so they aren't counted.
yoyota's have been good to me.
Wayne
"Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com>
The Top Posting Retard wrote in message
news:4b30fa0d$0$31963$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
> The difference TODAY is that GM and Ford vehicles are rated as good or
> better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel mileage
> better than Toyota as well. GM and Ford vehicles can be driven home for
> less, as well.
>
>
who gives a rat's ass about fuel economy if the car is dead on the side of
the road?
Mike Hunter
surveys.
"Paph Shmir" <p...@shmir.com> wrote in message
news:4b30...@news.x-privat.org...
Mike Hunter
manufacturers is making good vehicles today, the only real difference is
style and price.
<som...@some.domain> wrote in message
news:t97Ym.386569$8m4.3...@en-nntp-07.dc1.easynews.com...
Mike Hunter
"Wayne" <mygarb...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:hgrhdl$slb$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
in2dadark
> The difference TODAY is that GM and Ford vehicles are rated as good or
> better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel mileage
> better than Toyota as well. GM and Ford vehicles can be driven home for
> less, as well.
>
>
> news:hgqqka$9to$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
>
>
>
>
> > "john" <johngd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:9ef86ab9-f641-4911...@v15g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
> >> "Over a generation or so, Toyota built its reputation - and U.S.
> >> market share - on dependability, at a time when General Motors, Ford
> >> Motor and Chrysler couldn't shake being identified with lemons.
>
> >> The company that once could do no wrong has stumbled badly though a
> >> series of embarrassments of disclosures, allegations and recalls.
> >> Experts now are debating how deeply these will eat into the consumer
> >> trust that is Toyota's most potent asset - and what it must do to
> >> recover."
>
> >> Full article at:
> > -
> > Toyota can build and sell crap if they want....as long as there is a GM or
>
> - Show quoted text -
Oh gawd.. will it ever end? You're brainwashed. Get really, REALLY
drunk and clear your hard drive..
in2dadark
> In article <4b30de84$0$1331$815e3...@news.qwest.net>, Don Stauffer <stauf...@usfamily.net> wrote:
> >C. E. White wrote:
>
> >> Newsgroups:
>
> > alt.autos.toyota.camry,alt.autos.toyota,alt.autos.lexus,rec.autos.tech,alt.aut
>
> - Show quoted text -
I love it...:0)
in2dadark
> better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel mileage
> better than Toyota as well. GM and Ford vehicles can be driven home for
> less, as well.
>
>
> news:hgqqka$9to$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
>
>
>
>
> > "john" <johngd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:9ef86ab9-f641-4911...@v15g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
> >> "Over a generation or so, Toyota built its reputation - and U.S.
> >> market share - on dependability, at a time when General Motors, Ford
> >> Motor and Chrysler couldn't shake being identified with lemons.
>
> >> The company that once could do no wrong has stumbled badly though a
> >> series of embarrassments of disclosures, allegations and recalls.
> >> Experts now are debating how deeply these will eat into the consumer
> >> trust that is Toyota's most potent asset - and what it must do to
> >> recover."
>
> >> Full article at:
> > -
> > Toyota can build and sell crap if they want....as long as there is a GM or
>
> - Show quoted text -
And you GET less... Whenver I think of getting a new car, I go and
drive one and then get in my 01 and it feels solid compared to what I
was just in... I've driven EVERYTHING out there I think. I can't even
break my toyota if I tried. And sometimes I think I'm subconciously
'trying'...
All we talk about here is politics. When I go on the other boa...oops.
I'm not supposed to say the b word. Whenever I go on the
other..uh..forums, all they talk about are headaches and empty
wallets..
Nate Nagel
Mike, just STFU. You're an idiot. Any fool can see that there are real
differences in design and quality between different brands of
automobile. Any fool except you, that is.
*plonk*
nate
--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
Wayne
"Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com>
The Top Posting Retard...
>wrote in message news:4b314bc4$0$23469$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
> You mean like one of the Toyotas with their sludge problem?
>
But in the case of GM , much more important than all that,.....
With the violation of contract law that the Obama administration did to
screw bond holders, and to suck up to his union voting block....you sanction
all those sleasy dealings when you buy a GM vehicle . GM deserves to
actually experience bankruptcy.
And you still get a crappy car.
som...@some.domain
>On Dec 22, 11:58=A0am, "Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote:
>> The difference TODAY is that GM and Ford vehicles are rated as good or
>> better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel mileage
>or
>> less, as well.
>>
>> =A0"Wayne" <mygarbage...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>>
>> news:hgqqka$9to$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > "john" <johngd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>..
>> >> "Over a generation or so, Toyota built its reputation - and U.S.
>> >> market share - on dependability, at a time when General Motors, Ford
>> >> Motor and Chrysler couldn't shake being identified with lemons.
>>
>> >> The company that once could do no wrong has stumbled badly though a
>> >> series of embarrassments of disclosures, allegations and recalls.
>> >> Experts now are debating how deeply these will eat into the consumer
>> >> trust that is Toyota's most potent asset - and what it must do to
>> >> recover."
>>
>> >> Full article at:
>..
>> > -
>> > Toyota can build and sell crap if they want....as long as there is a GM=
> or
>> > Ford to lower the bar of expectations.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>And you GET less... Whenver I think of getting a new car, I go and
>drive one and then get in my 01 and it feels solid compared to what I
>was just in... I've driven EVERYTHING out there I think. I can't even
>break my toyota if I tried. And sometimes I think I'm subconciously
>'trying'...
>
>All we talk about here is politics. When I go on the other boa...oops.
>I'm not supposed to say the b word. Whenever I go on the
>other..uh..forums, all they talk about are headaches and empty
>wallets..
unto itself.
Ashton Crusher
wrote:
>Mike Hunter wrote the same tired old crap.
>
>Mike, just STFU. You're an idiot. Any fool can see that there are real
>differences in design and quality between different brands of
>automobile. Any fool except you, that is.
>
>*plonk*
>
>nate
There is VERY little difference. It's mostly perception and
preference based on the quality problems of the domestics one or two
decades ago. People have long memories. In the 70's you could figure
on something going wrong with your domestic several times a year. Now
it's pretty rare.
Ashton Crusher
wrote:
>
>"Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com>
>The Top Posting Retard...
>>wrote in message news:4b314bc4$0$23469$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
>> You mean like one of the Toyotas with their sludge problem?
>>
>Yep, still better than GM/Ford.
>
>But in the case of GM , much more important than all that,.....
>With the violation of contract law that the Obama administration did to
>screw bond holders, and to suck up to his union voting block....you sanction
>all those sleasy dealings when you buy a GM vehicle . GM deserves to
>actually experience bankruptcy.
>
>And you still get a crappy car.
>
U R talking out your ass.
Ashton Crusher
Same way I feel about my 92 Ford Explorer.
Nate Nagel
Balls. I've had enough minor issues with my company vehicles to
seriously doubt they will be worth repairing, if it's even possible, 20
years from now. There's a 22 year old Porsche in my driveway.
Mike Hunter
and look at all of the cars in the shop be repaired and you will see as many
Toyotas as Fords torn apart. The difference is the Toyota shop rate is at
least $10 more an hour and the owner paid 20% to 30% more to drive it home
when it was new. ;)
"Nate Nagel" <njn...@roosters.net> wrote in message
news:hgu3s...@news5.newsguy.com...
Ashton Crusher
wrote:
>Ashton Crusher wrote:
>> On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 21:17:49 -0500, Nate Nagel <njn...@roosters.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Mike Hunter wrote the same tired old crap.
>>>
>>> Mike, just STFU. You're an idiot. Any fool can see that there are real
>>> differences in design and quality between different brands of
>>> automobile. Any fool except you, that is.
>>>
>>> *plonk*
>>>
>>> nate
>>
>>
>> There is VERY little difference. It's mostly perception and
>> preference based on the quality problems of the domestics one or two
>> decades ago. People have long memories. In the 70's you could figure
>> on something going wrong with your domestic several times a year. Now
>> it's pretty rare.
>
>Balls. I've had enough minor issues with my company vehicles to
>seriously doubt they will be worth repairing, if it's even possible, 20
>years from now. There's a 22 year old Porsche in my driveway.
>
>nate
We have thousands of vehicles in our fleet, almost all domestic. Just
sticking with "cars" for the moment, generally when we get a new one
we drive it for 150,000 miles and about 10 years and in that time it's
rare to even have as much as one non-maintence repair a year. The
last car I had that has now been retired was a 95 caprice. In the 13
years and 125,000 miles we had it it had to have three minor warranty
repairs in the first couple years, after that I drove it for the next
decade and never had to do a thing to it but routine maintenance. Our
last two E350 Ford vans ran up to 250K with nothing needed outside the
changes we made like bigger alternators to run equipment. V-10
automatics that were flogged for 250K miles and they ran like new when
we auctioned them off and they looked like new (once they were
shampooed). I see the same thing over and over with our domestic
fleet vehicles. Yes, you may have had a couple problems but I can
tell you that the current domestics are nothing like what they were
producing in the 70's. I see a friend of mine plow big$$$$ into his
imports while I'm driving one of our fleet vehicles I bought at
auction - had 147,000 on it when I bought it, had 190,000 when I
traded it in for case for clunkers. Paid $2500, drove it for 7 years,
"sold" it for $4500. Put $1500 into it over the 7 years to make it
like I wanted.
Mike Hunter
"Sir F. A. Rien" <jaS...@gbr.online.com> wrote in message
news:mc57j51rhn2jgsvk9...@4ax.com...
> "Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> found these unused words:
>
>>I suggest one go to one of the Ford dealerships that are dueled with
>>Toyota
>>and look at all of the cars in the shop be repaired and you will see as
>>many
>>Toyotas as Fords torn apart. The difference is the Toyota shop rate is
>>at
>>least $10 more an hour and the owner paid 20% to 30% more to drive it home
>>when it was new. ;)
>
> That's a non-fact, qualifying as a Michael Mooreism.
>
> Equal numbers could be the result of a particular day schedule, more
> toyotas
> sold than fords, or that the shop has a reputation for properly servicing
> the toyota!
>
dick blisters
>>But in the case of GM , much more important than all that,.....
>>With the violation of contract law that the Obama administration did to
>>screw bond holders, and to suck up to his union voting block....you
>>sanction
>>all those sleasy dealings when you buy a GM vehicle . GM deserves to
>>actually experience bankruptcy.
>>
>>And you still get a crappy car.
>>
>
> U R talking out your ass.
I beg to differ...... He's talking out his fingertips.
FatterDumber& Happier Moe
I helped a friend of mine who was on foot get a car. We wound up
getting her a 94 Pontiac Grand Pix. Very rough and 120K miles. But all
the accessories worked and though I thought it rode harsh, that's the
way it was supposed to be for that model, so far it's been a pretty good
car. AC worked through the summer, I don't think she's had AC for
years, and so far it's started every time and runs well. It's enough to
get me thinking about maybe considering a domestic next time I look for
another car. On the other hand my mom's 5 year old buick had the famous
intake leaking problem at 60K miles and she was out 600 bucks to have it
fixed, her new buick the dealer had to work on the back brakes two or
three times because a rear wheel would lock up. I've about decided
Toyota won't be my next vehicle, I like the one I have but sludge, head
bolt problems and road noise I've read about pretty much eliminates a
Toyota for me. I usually buy something with around 50K miles on it and
put another 70-100K on it and then give it away, or sell it way under
what it's worth to a deserving person.
dick blisters
> bolt problems and road noise I've read about pretty much eliminates a
> Toyota for me. I usually buy something with around 50K miles on it and
> put another 70-100K on it and then give it away, or sell it way under what
> it's worth to a deserving person.
Could you infor me s to what you mean by a problem with sludge, head
bolt problems and road noise?
I have a 1989 Toyota pickup that I have been driving since 1988 and it has
289,653 miles on it.
I've never had a problem with any of the things you mention. Or is this only
concerning newer models. I would like to know especially about the "sludge
problem" as I am thinking of shopping around for a new vehicle.
Appreciate any info you are willing to provide. You can mail my personal
email address if you wish.
thanx
richard
nm...@wt.net
> GM Ford and Toyota is no better than the other. The fact is every
> manufacturers is making good vehicles today, the only real difference is
> style and price.
That's about all it wrote.. I hardly ever have a car crap out on me.
No matter what brand.. As far as the present Yota, I'll have had it
three years in Feb, and I've added 30k miles and zero problems.
Not a single one. Nada.. Zilch.. Bang on wood.. :/
And I'm still on the original set of tires at about 55k miles.. :/
I could probably get another 10k off them if I really wanted to
stretch it, but they will go soon as the wet traction sucks.
C. E. White
"Ashton Crusher" <de...@moore.net> wrote in message
news:cn35j5tjk6f681hu0...@4ax.com...
> There is VERY little difference. It's mostly perception and
> preference based on the quality problems of the domestics one or two
> decades ago. People have long memories. In the 70's you could figure
> on something going wrong with your domestic several times a year. Now
> it's pretty rare.
In the eighty I damn sure could count on something going wrong with my
Toyota three or four times a year. Finally fixed it my getting a Ford. Trips
to the shop for repairs immeadiately went to zero per year. So don't tell me
how great Toyotas were in the 70's and 80's. They built some real POS just
like every other manufacturer.
Ed
Ashton Crusher
You won't hear me tell you how great the Toyota's was. I have never
been impressed by them. Several years ago my Boss bought a Camry.
After hearing so much good stuff about Toyota's I was prepared to be
impressed when he drove to lunch. It was as dull a car as I think I
had ridden in in years and basically seemed no different in anyway
then any number of chevys and fords I'd been in. I know the couple of
imports I've had were not at all impressive as far as durability and
had nothing else special going for them either.
FatterDumber& Happier Moe
> FatterDumber& Happier Moe <"WheresMyCheck"@UncleSamLoves.Mee> found these
> unused words:
> buy a Toyota.
>
> BUTT !
>
> You have had actual major problems with GM and so -=will=- buy from them?
>
> Do you work for the company that makes 15 story elevators for 18 story
> buildings?
>
> ============
>
> My car history:
>
> How about Buick Skylark - out of round crankshaft - 3 months old. GMC said
> it was within 'tolerance' and thus not covered. [out of pocket]
>
> AMC {Chrysler} Wavy Lines in front windscreen, causing optical distortion.
> NOT covered though vehicle was 1 week old! Cal Law forced replacement.
>
> Chevrolet Malibu - intermittant problem where application experienced loss
> of rear brakes, then sudden application causing skidding. "Bad driving" NOT
> covered. [Faulty master cylinder - paid for out of pocket.]
>
> Ford Pinto - defective gas tank & mountings. Finally covered in the general
> lawsuit.
>
> Ford Fairlaine Wagon - defective wiring harness for rear. NOT covered as car
> had been driven more than 5,000 miles. [out of pocket]
>
> Three Toyotas - all minor problems and all but a sticky door lock [at 6
> years of age] fully covered with loaners [none of the US crappies offered!]
> when overnight.
>
> Oh yeah, the -=current=- Toyota is the LEAST noisy of all the above!
>
I've read of complaints of wind noise and road noise in the newer
Toyotas.
Actually a Honda a low mileage good used one will probably be my next
car, but I liked that old Pontiac from little bit I drove it, it was a
nice handling car and so far it's still running. A Malibu might be the
next car. I don't know, I've got lots of miles left on my Camry but I'm
always looking ahead at the past for a future used car.
ben91932
> > Ed
>
> I guess I'd disagree. Maybe we were just lucky. My son bought a
> well-used Toyota Wagon to take to school in Massachusetts (we lived in
> Missouri). That thing went back and forth I don't know how many times,
> ran as well when he finished school as when he started.
>
I have recommended Toyota's to dozens of people and not one complaint.
Also, I have been working on them since 1977, and found them to be
solid, reliable cars.
My latest is an 05 Highlander that I like alot.
YMMV, but I'll stick with what works.
HTH
Ben
Sharx35
"FatterDumber& Happier Moe" <"WheresMyCheck"@UncleSamLoves.Mee> wrote in
message news:4b37d296$0$5336$bbae...@news.suddenlink.net...
> Sir F. A. Rien wrote:
>> FatterDumber& Happier Moe <"WheresMyCheck"@UncleSamLoves.Mee> found these
>> unused words:
>>
>>> Ashton Crusher wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 18:16:18 -0800 (PST), in2dadark
>>>> <in2d...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 22, 11:58 am, "Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote:
>>>>>> The difference TODAY is that GM and Ford vehicles are rated as good
>>>>>> or
>>>>>> better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel
>>>>>> mileage
>>>>>> better than Toyota as well. GM and Ford vehicles can be driven home
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> less, as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Wayne" <mygarbage...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>
>>>>>> news:hgqqka$9to$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
Up here, Hondas are the preferred vehicle of ricer gangs.
Mike Hunter
generally underpowered and over priced as well.
"ben91932" <bente...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:4bd1050d-2f6f-4281...@b2g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...
dick blisters
> Up here, Hondas are the preferred vehicle of ricer gangs.
>
What part of "here" is "up here"?
Sharx35
"dick blisters" <dickbl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hha8jf$hpg$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
>
>> Up here, Hondas are the preferred vehicle of ricer gangs.
>>
> What part of "here" is "up here"?
>
Canada
dick blisters
"Sharx35" <sha...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ct3_m.57520$Db2.24589@edtnps83...
Sharx35
"dick blisters" <dickbl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hhb4pq$61a$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
As in WINTERpeg!
dick blisters
become real cowards in our old age (me 67, her 47). Can't stand freezing our
buns off anymore. Just talked to my brother in Wpg and he said it was
currently -24.
M. Balmer
As usual Ed, you are inhaling your own ass vapors.
"C. E. White" <cewhite...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:ZtWdnWPlPtHP363W...@earthlink.com...
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "john" <john...@hotmail.com>
> Newsgroups:
> alt.autos.toyota.camry,alt.autos.toyota,alt.autos.lexus,rec.autos.tech,alt.autos.toyota.trucks
> Sent: Monday, December 21, 2009 9:18 PM
> Subject: Toyota's reputation needs some TLC
>
>
>> "Over a generation or so, Toyota built its reputation - and U.S.
>> market share - on dependability, at a time when General Motors, Ford
>> Motor and Chrysler couldn't shake being identified with lemons.
>
> You mean Toyota built its reputation on the preception of reliability. I
> am old enough to remember Toyota from the 60's, 70's, and 80's. They were
> hardly paragon's of reliability.
>
>
> Ed
M. Balmer
"Sir Loin of Crotch" <jaS...@gbr.online.com> wrote in message
> "Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> found these unused words:
> That's a non-fact, qualifying as a Michael Mooreism.
Oh one funny turd blossom
M. Balmer
fucking break.
"Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote in message
news:4b314bc4$0$23469$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
> You mean like one of the Toyotas with their sludge problem?
>
>
> "Wayne" <mygarb...@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:hgrhdl$slb$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>> "Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com>
>> The Top Posting Retard wrote in message
>> news:4b30fa0d$0$31963$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
>>> The difference TODAY is that GM and Ford vehicles are rated as good or
>>> better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel mileage
>>> better than Toyota as well. GM and Ford vehicles can be driven home
>>> for less, as well.
>>>
>>>
>> Sounds like the old "Just as good as a Rolls, but cheaper" routine. AND
>> who gives a rat's ass about fuel economy if the car is dead on the side
>> of the road?
>>
>
>
M. Balmer
trash. take a look at the recall issues with non unionized plants in this
country and you'll see a real eye opener. Maybe you like working
for $5.50 an hour. bet you have your own personalized parking space at Wart
Mart too!
"Wayne" <mygarb...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:hgtet2$tln$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> "Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com>
> The Top Posting Retard...
>>wrote in message news:4b314bc4$0$23469$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
>> You mean like one of the Toyotas with their sludge problem?
>>
> Yep, still better than GM/Ford.
>
> But in the case of GM , much more important than all that,.....
> With the violation of contract law that the Obama administration did to
> screw bond holders, and to suck up to his union voting block....you
> sanction all those sleasy dealings when you buy a GM vehicle . GM
> deserves to actually experience bankruptcy.
>
> And you still get a crappy car.
>
>>
M. Balmer
a fucking parking light.
"Ashton Crusher" <de...@moore.net> wrote in message
news:l245j5to0o6gp91g6...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 18:16:18 -0800 (PST), in2dadark
> <in2d...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>On Dec 22, 11:58 am, "Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote:
>>> The difference TODAY is that GM and Ford vehicles are rated as good or
>>> better, in numerous consumer surveys, than Toyota and with fuel mileage
>>> better than Toyota as well. GM and Ford vehicles can be driven home for
>>> less, as well.
>>>
>>> "Wayne" <mygarbage...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>>>
>>> news:hgqqka$9to$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > "john" <johngd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> >news:9ef86ab9-f641-4911...@v15g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
>>> >> "Over a generation or so, Toyota built its reputation - and U.S.
>>> >> market share - on dependability, at a time when General Motors, Ford
>>> >> Motor and Chrysler couldn't shake being identified with lemons.
>>>
Mike Hunter
"M. Balmer" <booger...@wazoo.net> wrote in message
news:7xw_m.7$VT...@newsfe13.iad...
Mike Hunter
manufactures change the chemical makeup of paints, without giving them
enough time to field test the new brews, had THEIR paint peel off as well.
Vehicle manufactures do not make paint
"M. Balmer" <booger...@wazoo.net> wrote in message
news:vCw_m.10$VT...@newsfe13.iad...
Mike Hunter
"M. Balmer" <booger...@wazoo.net> wrote in message
news:0Gw_m.12$VT...@newsfe13.iad...
E. Meyer
this country". Put up your list. Then, put up the list of recall problems
that originated in unionized plants. It'll be an eye-opener alright, but
not the one you are implying.
On 12/29/09 5:53 PM, in article xEw_m.11$VT...@newsfe13.iad, "M. Balmer"
Whath...@shithouse.net
<booger...@wazoo.net> wrote:
>Yes let's have all domestics assembled by inbred southern non union white
>trash. take a look at the recall issues with non unionized plants in this
>country and you'll see a real eye opener. Maybe you like working
>for $5.50 an hour. bet you have your own personalized parking space at Wart
>Mart too!
Only "inbred motherfucker" in this group is "ole" Balmer.And only you
could bring your mothers shopping short cuts into this
conversation..lol
M. Balmer
peeling issues is a lot more prevalent in domestics than in foreigns and
continues until today. Just another example of the don't give a shit
attitude that has marginalized the U.S. industry. Take off your rose
colored glasses.
"Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote in message
news:4b3aa205$0$29506$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
M. Balmer
fat ass off the recliner and sign up!
"E. Meyer" <e.p....@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:C760CE00.15176%e.p....@verizon.net...
M. Balmer
<Whath...@shithouse.net> wrote in message
news:b02nj5tscpl58561d...@4ax.com...
M. Balmer
"Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote in message
news:4b3aa277$0$31150$ce5e...@news-radius.ptd.net...
E. Meyer
plants that is so eye opening? What a surprise!
Troll.
Plonk.
On 12/31/09 12:19 PM, in article 2X5%m.495$_H7...@newsfe24.iad, "M. Balmer"