Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he has heard Ferrari-related information from a McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat of losing his own license.
Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, at least. I have no idea about the reliability of this news item.
> Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > of losing his own license.
> Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > of this news item.
In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
> Jari Arkko kirjoitti: > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > > of losing his own license.
> > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > > of this news item.
The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to help McLaren with its set-up.
McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
Jari Arkko wrote: > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > McLaren test driver.
That would be a Spanish test driver, of course... -- John Briggs
> In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, > j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
> > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: > > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > > > of losing his own license.
> > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > > > of this news item.
> The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between > Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which > it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to > help McLaren with its set-up.
> McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
> In article <46e03976$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, > Jari Arkko <j...@otapois.arkko.com> wrote:
> > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > > of losing his own license.
> > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > > of this news item.
> Well done, Alonso.
> Thank you.
> It confirms that McLaren are the thieving scum we've all argued they > were.
> It's despicable that some trash here actually tried to defend McLaren > despite being instructed otherwise by Ferrari fans.
Is that because Fiat are always so honest in their approach to the sport that they and their fans gain little support in the world of motorsport?
Fiat and their drivers have never done anything that could be classed as underhand - People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
> In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, > j...@otapois.arkko.com says... >> Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >>> Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >>> came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >>> has heard Ferrari-related information from a >>> McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >>> of losing his own license.
>>> Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >>> at least. I have no idea about the reliability >>> of this news item. >> Here:
> The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between > Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which > it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to > help McLaren with its set-up.
But what sort of setup information could there be that is suitable for both the Ferrari and the McLaren (which are different cars), and which is something that McLaren couldn't simply have hit upon themselves through a systematic testing procedure. If you are talking about setup, you aren't talking about something that involves the design of hardware - thereby limiting the number of possible alternatives that can be tried, but something that can be easily discovered through a comprehensive test program.
In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
> Jari Arkko kirjoitti: > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > > of losing his own license.
> > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > > of this news item.
> On 6 Sep, 19:16, Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> wrote: > > In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, > > j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
> > > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: > > > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > > > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > > > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > > > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > > > > of losing his own license.
> > > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > > > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > > > > of this news item.
> > The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between > > Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which > > it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to > > help McLaren with its set-up.
> > McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
> In article <1189102776.015123.307...@w3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, > gp.skin...@talk21.com says...
> > On 6 Sep, 19:16, Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> wrote: > > > In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, > > > j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
> > > > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: > > > > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > > > > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > > > > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > > > > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > > > > > of losing his own license.
> > > > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > > > > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > > > > > of this news item.
> > > The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between > > > Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which > > > it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to > > > help McLaren with its set-up.
> > > McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
> > I agree along with the team that sent it.
> Alonso sent it, obviously...
WTF, You're saying Alonso sent the Fiat data to mclaren, where did he get it from then?
It takes two to 'spy' one to send and one to receive, yet people are happy that only one of the two should be punished which must mean they have ulterior motives for the wanting to see mclaren punished.
> In article <46e04722$0$32550$4c368...@roadrunner.com>, > Joseph <jos...@eliminatespam.com> wrote:
>> Hell and High Water wrote: >> > In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, >> > j...@otapois.arkko.com says... >> >> Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >> >>> Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >> >>> came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >> >>> has heard Ferrari-related information from a >> >>> McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >> >>> of losing his own license.
>> >>> Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >> >>> at least. I have no idea about the reliability >> >>> of this news item. >> >> Here:
>> > The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between >> > Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which >> > it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to >> > help McLaren with its set-up.
>> But what sort of setup information could there be that is suitable for >> both the Ferrari and the McLaren (which are different cars), and which >> is something that McLaren couldn't simply have hit upon themselves >> through a systematic testing procedure.
> Perhaps nothing. Ever see "Falcon and the Snowman?" Pity McLaren stole.
Apart from the very boring fact - a real fact - that McLaren (nor, even, Coughlan) stole nothing....
One of my favourite films (mainly because of the music - but also because Sean Penn hadn't, then, dissappeared up his own fundament). The book's much more informative, though.
noone wrote: > In article <MPG.2149ffd88e196634989...@news.giganews.com>, > Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> wrote:
> > In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, > > j...@otapois.arkko.com says... > > > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: > > > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > > > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > > > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > > > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > > > > of losing his own license.
> > > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > > > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > > > > of this news item.
> > The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between > > Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from > > which it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was > > used to help McLaren with its set-up.
> > McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
On Thu, 06 Sep 2007 18:19:36 -0000, gs <gp.skin...@talk21.com> wrote: >On 6 Sep, 19:16, Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> wrote: >> In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, >> j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
>> > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >> > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >> > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >> > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a >> > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >> > > of losing his own license.
>> > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >> > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability >> > > of this news item.
>> The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between >> Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which >> it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to >> help McLaren with its set-up.
>> McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
>I agree along with the team that sent it.
Are you seriously suggesting that Ferrari SENT their information to McLaren, as a willful and conscious act?
Luigi Topolino wrote: > On Thu, 06 Sep 2007 18:19:36 -0000, gs <gp.skin...@talk21.com> wrote: >> On 6 Sep, 19:16, Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> >> wrote: >>> In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, >>> j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
>>>> Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >>>>> Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >>>>> came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >>>>> has heard Ferrari-related information from a >>>>> McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >>>>> of losing his own license.
>>>>> Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >>>>> at least. I have no idea about the reliability >>>>> of this news item.
>>> The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between >>> Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from >>> which it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was >>> used to help McLaren with its set-up.
>>> McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
>> I agree along with the team that sent it.
> Are you seriously suggesting that Ferrari SENT their information to > McLaren, as a willful and conscious act?
Luigi Topolino wrote: > On Thu, 06 Sep 2007 18:19:36 -0000, gs <gp.skin...@talk21.com> wrote: > >On 6 Sep, 19:16, Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> > wrote: >> In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, > >> j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
> >> > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: > >> > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > >> > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > >> > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > >> > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > >> > > of losing his own license.
> >> > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > >> > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > >> > > of this news item.
> >> The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between > >> Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from > which >> it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari > was used to >> help McLaren with its set-up.
> >> McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
> > I agree along with the team that sent it.
> Are you seriously suggesting that Ferrari SENT their information to > McLaren, as a willful and conscious act?
As much as McLaren received it clearly. Go figure fuckwit.
> In article <LcidndHbC8kPyH3bnZ2dnUVZ8smgn...@bt.com>, > "Probert" <nick.wf1commde...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>> Apart from the very boring fact - a real fact - that McLaren (nor, even, >> Coughlan) stole nothing....
> That may work in the Communist states, but we don't have a collective > forgetting over here.
Well, like it or not, the fact is that nothing was stolen. It seems to have got into Coughlan's hands via an extremely pissed-off Ferrari employee. However it got there, it wasn't stolen.
> BTB: The theme song was by an American who kindly flipped David some > lyrics.
Actually, it was the Metheny music I was getting at - I've been a long time fan. As for PM flipping anyone lyrics... AIUI Bowie heard Metheny and his band recording the instrumental version in a studio in Montreux and offered to try and write some lyrics.
> The instrumental is better.
Hmmm. I'm still undecided more than twenty years on.
Jari Arkko <j...@otapois.arkko.com> wrote in news:46e03976$0$3195$8f74b9c5 @news.maxinetti.fi:
> Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he > has heard Ferrari-related information from a > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat > of losing his own license.
> Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, > at least. I have no idea about the reliability > of this news item.
"John Briggs" <john.brig...@ntlworld.com> wrote in news:urXDi.37407 $ph7.8...@newsfe5-win.ntli.net:
> Jari Arkko wrote: >> Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >> came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >> has heard Ferrari-related information from a >> McLaren test driver.
> That would be a Spanish test driver, of course...
> On Thu, 06 Sep 2007 18:19:36 -0000, gs <gp.skin...@talk21.com> wrote: >>On 6 Sep, 19:16, Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> wrote: >>> In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, >>> j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
>>> > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >>> > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >>> > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >>> > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a >>> > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >>> > > of losing his own license.
>>> > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >>> > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability >>> > > of this news item.
>>> The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between >>> Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which >>> it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to >>> help McLaren with its set-up.
>>> McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
>>I agree along with the team that sent it.
> Are you seriously suggesting that Ferrari SENT their information to > McLaren, as a willful and conscious act?
>Luigi Topolino wrote: >> On Thu, 06 Sep 2007 18:19:36 -0000, gs <gp.skin...@talk21.com> wrote: >> >On 6 Sep, 19:16, Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> >> wrote: >> In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, >> >> j...@otapois.arkko.com says... >> >> > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >> >> > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >> >> > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >> >> > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a >> >> > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >> >> > > of losing his own license.
>> >> > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >> >> > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability >> >> > > of this news item.
>> >> The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between >> >> Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from >> which >> it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari >> was used to >> help McLaren with its set-up.
>> >> McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
>> > I agree along with the team that sent it.
>> Are you seriously suggesting that Ferrari SENT their information to >> McLaren, as a willful and conscious act?
>As much as McLaren received it clearly. Go figure fuckwit.
...Ignorance in the defense of larceny and malfeasance is no virtue, dirtbag.
>Luigi Topolino <tif...@mindspring.com> wrote in >news:uao0e31p4rubs4umgs9cs2tqqnr4q34coi@4ax.com: >> On Thu, 06 Sep 2007 18:19:36 -0000, gs <gp.skin...@talk21.com> wrote: >>>On 6 Sep, 19:16, Hell and High Water <tifoso...@OVEcomcast.net> wrote: >>>> In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, >>>> j...@otapois.arkko.com says...
>>>> > Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >>>> > > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >>>> > > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >>>> > > has heard Ferrari-related information from a >>>> > > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >>>> > > of losing his own license.
>>>> > > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >>>> > > at least. I have no idea about the reliability >>>> > > of this news item.
>>>> The damning evidence against McLaren is a series of e-mails between >>>> Fernando Alonso and McLaren 's test driver Pedro de la Rosa, from which >>>> it is clear that information that originated from Ferrari was used to >>>> help McLaren with its set-up.
>>>> McLaren should be banned from ever competing in F1 again.
>>>I agree along with the team that sent it.
>> Are you seriously suggesting that Ferrari SENT their information to >> McLaren, as a willful and conscious act?
>Let them grasp..
It's more the gasping of landed fish, which has always made me uncomfortable.
>In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, >j...@otapois.arkko.com says... >> Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >> > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >> > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >> > has heard Ferrari-related information from a >> > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >> > of losing his own license.
>> > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >> > at least. I have no idea about the reliability >> > of this news item.
Well, i only have one problem with this rumour. If Alonso did that, he may have cut his own throat. It doesn't matter whether it's the right thing to do or not, but all teams have a little dirty laundry somewhere and i would expect those teams, or anyone really, to be very wary in employing a known whistle blower. And i wouldn't have thought that Alonso would be so stupid as to not realise that. Or maybe he was really done wrong by McLaren and he just doesn't give a damn. It's not like he has to go back to sweeping streets.
Still, even if he is employed, he'd be kept so much in the dark as possible. Worse, his action may actually make all the teams lock away a lot of otherwise useful information from drivers, because one just never knows what can happen in a few months.. Sad affair all around.
>>In article <46e03f4f$0$3195$8f74b...@news.maxinetti.fi>, >>j...@otapois.arkko.com says... >>> Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >>> > Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >>> > came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >>> > has heard Ferrari-related information from a >>> > McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >>> > of losing his own license.
>>> > Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >>> > at least. I have no idea about the reliability >>> > of this news item.
> Well, i only have one problem with this rumour. If Alonso did that, he > may have cut his own throat. > It doesn't matter whether it's the right thing to do or not, but all > teams have a little dirty laundry somewhere and i would expect those > teams, or anyone really, to be very wary in employing a known whistle > blower. > And i wouldn't have thought that Alonso would be so stupid as to not > realise that. Or maybe he was really done wrong by McLaren and he just > doesn't give a damn. It's not like he has to go back to sweeping > streets.
> Still, even if he is employed, he'd be kept so much in the dark as > possible. Worse, his action may actually make all the teams lock away > a lot of otherwise useful information from drivers, because one just > never knows what can happen in a few months.. > Sad affair all around.
> --
> Regards, Frank
------------------------------
However, if the rumor is true, and Alonso did divulge the information, we don't know what the circumstances were in which he talked. He might have had no option. But this is just idle speculation at this point. I guess we may know in another week.\
<j...@otapois.arkko.com> wrote: >Jari Arkko kirjoitti: >> Finnish press is reporting that the leak to FIA >> came from Alonso, and that he's confessed he >> has heard Ferrari-related information from a >> McLaren test driver. He confessed under threat >> of losing his own license.
>> Not repeated in english-speaking press - so far, >> at least. I have no idea about the reliability >> of this news item.
>Well, i only have one problem with this rumour. If Alonso did that, he >may have cut his own throat.
Well, as soon as they said "a driver" it was clear to me that it couldn't be anyone else - this has "Briatore" written all over it. The man wants Alonso back and he's been saying that McLaren should be punished for weeks; AND he's Flavio. You do the math...
>It doesn't matter whether it's the right thing to do or not, but all >teams have a little dirty laundry somewhere and i would expect those >teams, or anyone really, to be very wary in employing a known whistle >blower.
I wouldn't know about that. F1 seems to have become extremely cynical.
>And i wouldn't have thought that Alonso would be so stupid as to not >realise that.
Likewise. And besides, it doesn't quite add up: I fail to understand how Fred and Pedro could know about having Ferrari-derived technology in their cars, let alone discuss it. Basically this is a case of "I'm sure it was him, but I'm also sure I'm wrong" for me...
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