(OT) Dwarf throwing

[Noj]

The Paralympic javelin competion for little blokes has been amazing this
morning.
The world record has gone up from 40 metres to 47 metres, with the
record being broken 6 times - so far.

[Brian Lawrence]

How about yesterday's blind triple jump, that was pretty amazing, for all
sorts of reasons - a Chinese 'Full Monty"!

--

Brian W Lawrence
Wantage
Oxfordshire

[Noj]

Brian Lawrence wrote ...

>
> On 07/09/2012 11:24, Noj wrote:
> >
> > The Paralympic javelin competion for little blokes has been amazing this
> > morning.
> > The world record has gone up from 40 metres to 47 metres, with the
> > record being broken 6 times - so far.
>
> How about yesterday's blind triple jump, that was pretty amazing, for all
> sorts of reasons - a Chinese 'Full Monty"!

Missed that. I've been watching the women's blind longjump today.

The tv coverage has been so crap. More than half of the sports haven't
been shown, because the Olympic TV service couldn't be arsed to leave
cameras on site. The sports they have broadcast have used the minimum
of cameras - in some places only 1 or 2. My brother was at the
athletics last week and he could only see 4 or 5 cameras in the stadium.

[Brian Lawrence]

On 07/09/2012 12:59, Noj wrote:
> Brian Lawrence wrote ...
>
>>
>> On 07/09/2012 11:24, Noj wrote:
>>>
>>> The Paralympic javelin competion for little blokes has been amazing this
>>> morning.
>>> The world record has gone up from 40 metres to 47 metres, with the
>>> record being broken 6 times - so far.
>>
>> How about yesterday's blind triple jump, that was pretty amazing, for all
>> sorts of reasons - a Chinese 'Full Monty"!
>
>
> Missed that. I've been watching the women's blind longjump today.

I'd better explain. He started on the runway and was wearing his track
suit bottoms, when ready he reached down, gripped the legs and ripped
them off in one rapid movement. He seemed to do it most times that he
jumped. The crowd, understandably, loved it.

Digressing - I saw a blind relay race yesterday. In order to do the
handovers they need to shout at each other, so the crowd were asked to
remain silent during the race, which they did. Then, once the final
handover was completed they erupted into the usual 120db roar.

> The tv coverage has been so crap. More than half of the sports haven't
> been shown, because the Olympic TV service couldn't be arsed to leave
> cameras on site. The sports they have broadcast have used the minimum
> of cameras - in some places only 1 or 2. My brother was at the
> athletics last week and he could only see 4 or 5 cameras in the stadium.

Sadly, much of the rest of the world don't seem to want to watch, so
there is limited income to help fund it. It's an order of magnitude
'better' than previous Games though - better as in more.

[larkim]

Politically incorrect this might be, but when the sporting event's potential pool of competitors is taken from such a minority of the population (i.e. people with a disability) it doesn't make for particularly great TV (IMHO). I can understand why they are not giving it the coverage on an equal footing with the Olympics.

Matt

[Noj]

larkim wrote ...

>
> Politically incorrect this might be, but when the sporting event's potential pool of competitors is taken from such a minority of the population (i.e. people with a disability) it doesn't make for particularly great TV (IMHO). I can understand why they are not giving it the coverage on an equal footing with the Olympics.
>
> Matt

YFI

All sport is played by a minority of the population.

[Noj]

Brian Lawrence wrote ...

>
> On 07/09/2012 12:59, Noj wrote:
> > Brian Lawrence wrote ...
> >
> >>
> >> On 07/09/2012 11:24, Noj wrote:
> >>>
> >>> The Paralympic javelin competion for little blokes has been amazing this
> >>> morning.
> >>> The world record has gone up from 40 metres to 47 metres, with the
> >>> record being broken 6 times - so far.
> >>
> >> How about yesterday's blind triple jump, that was pretty amazing, for all
> >> sorts of reasons - a Chinese 'Full Monty"!
> >
> >
> > Missed that. I've been watching the women's blind longjump today.
>
> I'd better explain. He started on the runway and was wearing his track
> suit bottoms, when ready he reached down, gripped the legs and ripped
> them off in one rapid movement. He seemed to do it most times that he
> jumped. The crowd, understandably, loved it.

Ah - I heard about that.

>
> Digressing - I saw a blind relay race yesterday. In order to do the
> handovers they need to shout at each other, so the crowd were asked to
> remain silent during the race, which they did. Then, once the final
> handover was completed they erupted into the usual 120db roar.
>
> > The tv coverage has been so crap. More than half of the sports haven't
> > been shown, because the Olympic TV service couldn't be arsed to leave
> > cameras on site. The sports they have broadcast have used the minimum
> > of cameras - in some places only 1 or 2. My brother was at the
> > athletics last week and he could only see 4 or 5 cameras in the stadium.
>
> Sadly, much of the rest of the world don't seem to want to watch, so
> there is limited income to help fund it. It's an order of magnitude
> 'better' than previous Games though - better as in more.

The OBC picked up ￜ10m from Ch4 to show the Paralympics. With income
from those countries who do want to watch, I reckon they have received
more than enough to put a lot more effort into showing the event. All
of the equipment was in place, it's only a matter of paying staff.

[pltrgyst]

On 9/7/12 8:44 AM, Noj wrote:
>>
>> Politically incorrect this might be, but when the sporting event's

>>potential pool of competitors is taken from such a minority of the population...

>
> All sport is played by a minority of the population.

That's not what "potential pool of competitors" means.

-- Larry

[larkim]

Yes, but that minority is drawn from the vast majority of the population. Elite athletes with a disability are a minority of a minority, whereas elite "able bodied" athletes are a minority of the majority.

I don't diminish anyone's achievement in being the best you can be, given your birth or other life changing circumstances. I just have don't think it makes a great spectacle.

My own opinions, I know others have different ones.

Matt

[pltrgyst]

On 9/7/12 8:24 AM, Brian Lawrence wrote:
>
> Digressing - I saw a blind relay race yesterday. In order to do the
> handovers they need to shout at each other, so the crowd were asked to
> remain silent during the race, which they did. Then, once the final
> handover was completed they erupted into the usual 120db roar.

I didn't see that. How do they follow the track and stay in lanes?

I can see shouts tgo determine when the runner receiving the baton takes
off, but how do teammates locate each other?

-- Larry

[Brian Lawrence]

In the race that I saw each runner had a sighted guide. They are
attached by an elastic band.

[Bigbird]

Haha. yeah, sure.

[down_hill]

I ski raced against a blind guy at a Bode Miller charity race his guide
told him when to turn he was a couple of tenths faster than me. I guess
at times it is easier to race down a hill if you do not see what you are
racing on. so much for course inspections....

[Noj]

pltrgyst wrote ...

You've a better (or worse) chance of being in the Parlympics than you
have of driving in F1, F2 or F3.

[Noj]

Bigbird wrote ...

>
> > All of the equipment was in place, it's only a matter of
> > paying staff.
>
> Haha. yeah, sure.

You know the OBS is a permanent organisation with full time staff which
owns the equipment used to broadcast the games?

http://www.obs.es/olympicbroadcastinghistory.html

[Bigbird]

You're starting to make it sound rather similar to F1. There are many
sports that are in essence drawing form a reduced pool for all sorts of
reasons.

[Bigbird]

You're being a little build like.

If you would like to point out the part which says all the quipment
lies in a shed for three and a half years I'll concede your point.

[Noj]

Bigbird wrote ...

I'll point out the bit that says if you hire equipment for 8 weeks, it
probably doesn't cost a lot more than the hire for 4 weeks, as the
owners might prefer not to leave it lying in a shed.


http://www.gearhousebroadcast.com/uploads/rate-card-jan-2011.pdf

Hire Rates
Single day/s = Rate Card prices. Weekly Rate = 4x Daily Rate. Monthly
Rate = 16x Daily Rate. For longer term and larger rentals, please ask
our Hire Desk for a competitive Quotation.


Beers

[larkim]

On Friday, 7 September 2012 14:46:09 UTC+1, Bigbird wrote:

> larkim wrote:
> > Yes, but that minority is drawn from the vast majority of the
> > population. Elite athletes with a disability are a minority of a
> > minority, whereas elite "able bodied" athletes are a minority of the
> > majority.
> >
> > I don't diminish anyone's achievement in being the best you can be,
> > given your birth or other life changing circumstances. I just have
> > don't think it makes a great spectacle.
> >
> > My own opinions, I know others have different ones.
> >
>
> You're starting to make it sound rather similar to F1. There are many
> sports that are in essence drawing form a reduced pool for all sorts of
> reasons.

Don't get me started!

Yes, of course for any given sport there are various factors which will make one person's individual circumstances more likely to excel in a particular sport.

Born / raised near the sea - sailor
Born / raised into money in the country - equestrianism
Born / raised son of a former F1 driver - you get the picture.

But putting aside those natural advantages, in principle any able bodied person can try their hand at any sport if they can get access to the facilities.

And that incorporates the vast majority of the population.

But I am simply not eligible for the paralympics. Even if I wanted to take up professional wheelchair basketball to achieve a paralympic medal, I can't (I can take up wheelchair basketball in fact, just not compete in the paralympics). So it is by definition a very exclusive club of people that can take part.

Of course, probably most of the people who can take part would probably wish that they weren't part of that exclusive club, but the likelihood is that if the chance occurrence which left them with a birth defect or subsequent cause of their disability hadn't happened, the chances (purely based on probabilities, not my assessment of their capabilities) are that most of them would be no better than half decent club athletes, not international athletes.

And that's my problem with the paralympics - statistics!!

Matt

[larkim]

Unless they want to commit commercial and technological suicide by only using their cameras once every two years (let's assume the winter games use the same number and type of equipment for no other reason than it is a nice easy, if not necessarily logical, assumption) you can bet your house that they either a) own all their own equipment, but generate a commercial profit by hiring it out to other bodies once the games are over, and update / cycle through cameras etc to keep up with technology or b) they hire in the right equipment for each Games.

Even if it doesn't cost "a lot more", to hire for a longer period of time they'll still only put the amount of cameras in place as justified by the sale of the TV rights. The income to the OBS from broadcasting the paralympics will be a significant order of magnitude lower than that from broadcasting the Olympics.

Matt

[Noj]

larkim wrote ...

> But I am simply not eligible for the paralympics.
> Even if I wanted to take up professional wheelchair basketball to
> achieve a paralympic medal, I can't (I can take up wheelchair
> basketball in fact, just not compete in the paralympics). So it
> is by definition a very exclusive club of people that can take part.

There are several classifications for people of low IQ.

[Not Bernie Ecclestone]

...and subcontracted to a further 12 broadcasters to actually provide footage of
specific events in the Olympics

The Athletics for instance wasn't even covered by OBS or even the BBC but by the
Finns and the Swedes.

http://www.televisual.com/blog-detail/London-2012-the-broadcast-challenge_bid-317.html


--

[larkim]

Yes, I am aware of that. It is something one of my children will be eligible in a few years time, or perhaps take part in the Special Olympics.

He has a learning disability. I, on the other hand, just have a different perspective on the Paralympics than you do. That, however, does not make me learning disabled (or an imbecile as you so charmingly put it)

Matt

[Bigbird]

Well I guess you are making progress. You have gone from suggesting
they own all the equipment and not recognising the opportunity cost of
having it lying around to suggesting they might hire *all* the
equipment for ~6 weeks instead of ~2 weeks.

Next step is to recognise there is actually a cost involved.

[Bigbird]

larkim wrote:

> On Friday, 7 September 2012 14:46:09 UTC+1, Bigbird wrote:
> > larkim wrote:
> > > Yes, but that minority is drawn from the vast majority of the
> > > population. Elite athletes with a disability are a minority of a
> > > minority, whereas elite "able bodied" athletes are a minority of
> > > the majority.
> > >
> > > I don't diminish anyone's achievement in being the best you can
> > > be, given your birth or other life changing circumstances. I
> > > just have don't think it makes a great spectacle.
> > >
> > > My own opinions, I know others have different ones.
> > >
> >
> > You're starting to make it sound rather similar to F1. There are
> > many sports that are in essence drawing form a reduced pool for all
> > sorts of reasons.
>
> Don't get me started!
>
> Yes, of course for any given sport there are various factors which
> will make one person's individual circumstances more likely to excel
> in a particular sport.
>
> Born / raised near the sea - sailor
> Born / raised into money in the country - equestrianism

Not at all like "by definition a very exclusive club of people"

[Bigbird]

So Monthly rate = 4 x weekly rate.

What was your point?

[Noj]

Bigbird wrote ...


>
> What was your point?


That more of the Paralympic events should have been shown of the telly,
and it wouldn't have cost the earth to have done it. Instead OBS took
the piss (and the money).


Beers

[AC]

Noj wrote:
>
> The Paralympic javelin competion for little blokes has been amazing this
> morning.
> The world record has gone up from 40 metres to 47 metres, with the
> record being broken 6 times - so far.
>
>

Oh. Was hoping this was about Bernie can CVC. Oh well.

--
AC

[Noj]

larkim wrote ...

Odd how some people choose to have a humour bypass when it suits them.

BTW - I'm not alone in following the Paralympics - in fact viewing
figures match that of F1.

"...Channel 4 reveals record Paralympic coverage for Thriller Thursday
as 6.3 million tune in.."

http://www.insidethegames.biz/

[Brian Lawrence]

On 07/09/2012 12:59, Noj wrote:

> The tv coverage has been so crap. More than half of the sports haven't
> been shown, because the Olympic TV service couldn't be arsed to leave
> cameras on site. The sports they have broadcast have used the minimum
> of cameras - in some places only 1 or 2. My brother was at the
> athletics last week and he could only see 4 or 5 cameras in the stadium.

Saw a quote in yesterday's paper about this.

LOCOG comms. director, Jackie Brock-Doyle said, "This decision was made
by Locog early, that we couldn't do the live broadcast with the
television fees that were raised."

Specifically they couldn't afford to cover 'outdoor' competions like the
cycling from Brands Hatch and the marathons (today). The Eton-Dorney
rowing was limited too.

Note that it was Locog's decision not OBS.

[Noj]

Brian Lawrence wrote ...

They need money to pay Seb Coe.

One camera sited correct can cover practically all of the Brands Hatch
short circuit.

[Bigbird]

If you can't produce a quality program is it worth it?

An OBU consists of a lot more than one guy and his video camera
suspended from a crane.

[larkim]

Sorry if I was whooshed on the humour side of things. Yes, I am part of the 54million people in the UK that didn't watch Thriller Thursday though.

I know that genuinely many many people have found the paralympics uplifting, exciting, dramatic, fascinating etc. I'm just not one of them, and given my normally politically correct sensibilities I had to rationalise why for me. So I've posted my reasons. Perhaps I overthink it (I tend to do that, even in my own limited way ;-) )

btw, I think it was reasonably fair to respond to a counter-proposition of "YFI", and give some context why, for me, making such an statement is at least mildly irritating.

btw, my son takes part in normal competitive sport against "normal" other kids. He does rubbish, but he enjoys it. I'd much rather he competed against "normal" kids than just against other kids with Downs Syndrome because that normalises him - he plays against kids that are naturally fat, naturally tall, naturally small, naturally fast, naturally gifted at ball control. He is naturally of lower than average intellect. Seems fair to me.

Matt

[Bigbird]

You blame nature a lot.

[larkim]

I do. Its got a lot to answer for.