Mercedes Diesels of the 1980s
DC
from the early 1980s, including the 300SD, 300D, 240D,
300TD, and 300CD are relatively inexpensive to purchase,
and they are still reliable cars after all these years..."
Continued: http://snipr.com/MercedesDiesels
Guenter Scholz
krp
"DC" <nob...@pseudo.borked.net> wrote in message
news:fed71ad408683596...@pseudo.borked.net...
> "...it's hard to beat an old Mercedes diesel. The diesels
> from the early 1980s, including the 300SD, 300D, 240D,
> 300TD, and 300CD are relatively inexpensive to purchase,
> and they are still reliable cars after all these years..."
Reliable, but slower than hell. 0 to 60 is measured with a CALENDAR!
Cordy
Rust is a problem for some countries. Not for mediterranean (or
southern USA) countries. If you live in north Germany or Holland, just
as an example, that's a problem. But is there a better model for that
weather, with a minimum of 25 years old car model? Probably some
Saab... but the engine is a real problem to sort up. So, in average,
it's still a good choice.
tra...@optonline.net
Not all that slow in acceleration and perfectly drivable if you get a
turbodiesel.
fred
news:e648e576-55ff-4dba...@j38g2000yqa.googlegroups.com:
>> ......... sure, but what about the rust
>
> Rust is a problem for some countries. Not for mediterranean (or
> southern USA) countries. If you live in north Germany or Holland, just
> as an example, that's a problem. But is there a better model for that
> weather, with a minimum of 25 years old car model?
Undercoating every couple of years or the Delorean. *If* you can find one.
The frame will be toast though if you don't undercoat.
krp
<tra...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:87256708-beb1-41df...@k36g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
Depends on what you are used to driving. Compared to A Yugo they are
just a little slow.
tra...@optonline.net
> <trad...@optonline.net> wrote in message
Here's a 1986 Yugo:
http://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/car/?car=19679
The Yugo does 0-60 in 16.8 secs. The MB 300SD comes in around 12.
That's substantially FASTER. And for an S class car that weighs
twice as much and will comfortably transport 4 or 5 people in roomy
luxury, while getting 26 MPG, I'd say it's pretty damn good.
Dori A Schmetterling
Germany at the time).
'Twas lucky I was living and working in flat country
(Schleswig-Holstein/HH). My colleagues based elsewhere who had the same
model and had to drive around Bavaria etc weren't so happy.
Juergen might chime in about his 240D, which took only 6 days to get there,
as it had a slightly bigger engine.
DAS
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<tra...@optonline.net> wrote in message
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krp
<tra...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:21b9979d-60a3-479b...@l39g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> > > "...it's hard to beat an old Mercedes diesel. The diesels
> > > from the early 1980s, including the 300SD, 300D, 240D,
> > > 300TD, and 300CD are relatively inexpensive to purchase,
> > > and they are still reliable cars after all these years..."
>
> > Reliable, but slower than hell. 0 to 60 is measured with a CALENDAR!
>
> < Not all that slow in acceleration and perfectly drivable if you get a
> turbodiesel.
>
> Depends on what you are used to driving. Compared to A Yugo they are
> just a little slow.
Here's a 1986 Yugo:
http://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/car/?car=19679
The Yugo does 0-60 in 16.8 secs. The MB 300SD comes in around 12.
That's substantially FASTER. And for an S class car that weighs
twice as much and will comfortably transport 4 or 5 people in roomy
luxury, while getting 26 MPG, I'd say it's pretty damn good.
===========
TURBO Diesel. I never said the Mercedes was anything but a GREAT car. FAST
is not one of the qualities one associates with the Mercedes Diesel of the
80's and 12 seconds to 60 is not the conventional diesel. It's more like 30
seconds.
krp
"Dori A Schmetterling" <nob...@spam.co.uk> wrote in message
news:f92dnf5K2-L_1bHU...@pipex.net...
> My 1980 200D took a week to get to 60 mph (or 100 km/h, since I was in
> Germany at the time).
>
> 'Twas lucky I was living and working in flat country
> (Schleswig-Holstein/HH). My colleagues based elsewhere who had the same
> model and had to drive around Bavaria etc weren't so happy.
>
> Juergen might chime in about his 240D, which took only 6 days to get
> there,
> as it had a slightly bigger engine.
CUTE.
tra...@optonline.net
> <trad...@optonline.net> wrote in message
So who said it's not fair to include the turbo diesel? They were
very poplular MB diesels of the 80s, which is the topic of the thead,
were they not? In fact, they were the majority of the diesel cars
sold by MB here in the USA in the 80's. And I would say 0 to 60, not
only beats Yugos, but is also not "so slow you need a calendar"
krp
<tra...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:186a764c-fae0-4bd0...@k19g2000yqg.googlegroups.com...
> > > > "...it's hard to beat an old Mercedes diesel. The diesels
> > > > from the early 1980s, including the 300SD, 300D, 240D,
> > > > 300TD, and 300CD are relatively inexpensive to purchase,
> > > > and they are still reliable cars after all these years..."
>
> > > Reliable, but slower than hell. 0 to 60 is measured with a CALENDAR!
>
> > < Not all that slow in acceleration and perfectly drivable if you get a
> > turbodiesel.
>
> > Depends on what you are used to driving. Compared to A Yugo they are
> > just a little slow.
>
> Here's a 1986 Yugo:
> http://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/car/?car=19679
>
> The Yugo does 0-60 in 16.8 secs. The MB 300SD comes in around 12.
> That's substantially FASTER. And for an S class car that weighs
> twice as much and will comfortably transport 4 or 5 people in roomy
> luxury, while getting 26 MPG, I'd say it's pretty damn good.
>
> ===========
> TURBO Diesel. I never said the Mercedes was anything but a GREAT car. FAST
> is not one of the qualities one associates with the Mercedes Diesel of the
> 80's and 12 seconds to 60 is not the conventional diesel.
So who said it's not fair to include the turbo diesel?
The topic was the CONVENTIONAL Diesel. Which made a corpse look fast.
tra...@optonline.net
> <trad...@optonline.net> wrote in message
>
> - Show quoted text -
Apparently you have either a reading comprehension problem or are
ignorant of MB models and history. From the very first post:
Topic: Mercedes Diesels of the 1980's
"...it's hard to beat an old Mercedes diesel. The diesels
from the early 1980s, including the 300SD, 300D, 240D,
300TD, and 300CD are relatively inexpensive to purchase,
and they are still reliable cars after all these years..."
Of the 5 models mentioned in that post, 4 were turbo diesels.
krp
<tra...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:8b6ff6bb-0897-4149...@v38g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
Maybe you MISS them point entirely that the comment was about the
CONVENTIONAL DIESEL being slow. I know a guy who put a turbo on a 1970 Allis
Chalmers tractor and it would do 0 to 60 in 13 seconds. The point is that
the NON-Turbo MB diesels were slower than a dead rabbit. Even snails would
pass them! Nobody said they weren't reliable. You could buy one at age 17,
and by the time you got to 60 at age 90, it was still running perfectly.
Great cars, last forever, good mileage. BUT they gave a new definition to
the word SLOW. Some years ago a friend of mine asked me to drive his MB to
the dealership following him. I was PASSED by a guy driving a Model T Ford
like I was PARKED! I had my toes on the firewall. The ONLY thing I have
ever driven AS SLOW was one of the electric carts in Lowe's when I got hurt
in a car accident. Nope - maybe I would have won a drag against the MD
diesel.
Ernie Willson
naturally aspirated diesel. 48 HP on a good day. I once got it up to
75MPH. I would guess the 0-60 time was in the 30 second area. It did
average 42 MPG for 80000 miles though. Cheap to operate on diesel which
cost about 15 cents/gal then.
EJ in NJ
Guenter Scholz
.... right,
now we had it tough. Had to get up 1/2 hr before we went to
bed to turn the engine on and get it up to speed before we could drive off.
Drive off, well, that meant we had to push it first and then jump in so
that the gears engaging would not cause the motor to stall......
cheers
In article <492f192e$0$5555$9a6e...@news.newshosting.com>,
Ernie Willson
actually faster that the 180D.
EJ in NJ
Blake wrote:
> On 2008-11-28, Ernie Willson <ewil...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> You don't know what slow is.
>
> Ever drive a Subaru 360?
>
Dori A Schmetterling
This is not Mercedes-specific. All old normally aspirated diesel cars were
slow, and there were other cars besides Merc, although they were leaders in
the field.
I don't suppose there were many non-Merc ordinary diesels in the US in the
80s and before.
DAS
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"Ernie Willson" <ewil...@comcast.net> wrote in message
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krp
> You don't know what slow is. I had a 1956 180D. It had a 4 cylinder
> naturally aspirated diesel. 48 HP on a good day. I once got it up to
> 75MPH. I would guess the 0-60 time was in the 30 second area. It did
> average 42 MPG for 80000 miles though. Cheap to operate on diesel which
> cost about 15 cents/gal then.
I have *NEVER* said or suggested that the MB was anything but an excellent
automobile. Or that it wasn't fuel efficient. The non-turbo diesels of the
80's were just slow as hell. Newer ones are much quicker. I don't know why
some dorks need to take commenting that they were slow as an attack on the
quality of the car. They weren't made to RACE. They were a nice, very
comfortable, economical and extremely reliable even IF incredibly SLOW cars.
Car quality isn't defined by 0 to 60 times. But I must say 30 seconds is
probably a bit optimistic. Downhill maybe.(If the incline was steep enough)
krp
>I have not had that pleasure, although I drove a Fiat 500, which was
>actually faster that the 180D.
I kid you not, when I was driving my friend's MB - I was passed by an
old Model T Ford. I did my best to not let him pass. He blew my doors off.
Roland Franzius
Its a problem for those who thought to have bought a car like some SE/SL
types.
The MB diesel 170/180/200/220 series were built for German taxi drivers
in the first place. Many were used to the reliable MB diesels from WWII
compared to gas engines that stopped working below 0 C. You may compare
them as a special type to the London cab for people with high hats. Its
true, I have never seen a taxi in those times that was not a MB diesel.
A second target group were farmers who were allowed to use taxfree
diesel for agricultural purposes. Its still easy to find a 240D with
green paint in Germany.
After the first oil crisis in 1974 this diesel became popular for its
fuel efficieny, especially in town and winter. Some people with a oil
heated house used to buy diesels hoping not to captured by the customs
controls with that red stuff in the tank.
So in after the oil crisis MB created the 240D 3.0 - non turbo - for
diesel friends with a need of normal autobahn speeds. I bought a used
one in '82. It showed no sign of fuel efficiency at speeds over 120 km/h
and already made some 165 km/h with an acceleration comparable to a VW
beetle of some 18 s for 0-100km/h.
At these times the MB US-market volume was negligible for DB.
--
Roland Franzius
Tiger
Dori A Schmetterling
Older Fiats (and Alfa Romeos, regrettably) were famous for becoming rust
buckets fairly soon.
Jokes about Alfasuds rusting on the assembly line were rife...
I think they rusted less in Italy, with its drier climate, but were pretty
bad in wetter Britain.
DAS
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"Tiger" <tige...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
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Tiger
monster holes everywhere. I don't mean 1" holes... I mean 6"... maybe 3" by
5" holes...
Dori A Schmetterling
:-(
DAS
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"Tiger" <tige...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
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fred
> How old is/was it?
>
> Older Fiats (and Alfa Romeos, regrettably) were famous for becoming rust
> buckets fairly soon.
>
> Jokes about Alfasuds rusting on the assembly line were rife...
>
> I think they rusted less in Italy, with its drier climate, but were
> pretty bad in wetter Britain.
>
They don't exactly get a lot of snow and salt in most of Europe you know.
Dori A Schmetterling
A lot more gritting rather than salting now, in the UK at least. I am sure
I read that Fiat's galvanising was poor and not as extensive as it ought to
have been.
DAS
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"fred" <fr...@bedrock.rock> wrote in message
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[...]
Richard Sexton
Dori A Schmetterling <nob...@spam.co.uk> wrote:
>Used to!
>
>A lot more gritting rather than salting now, in the UK at least. I am sure
>I read that Fiat's galvanising was poor and not as extensive as it ought to
>have been.
>
>DAS
Galvanising? Fiat? I had a 73 firat I bought in 76. a 124 Coupe (great
car wich I still had it). I got it for a couple of hundred dollars because
this 3 year old car had rusted out rockers and a fender. In 3 years they'd
becomne totally perforated. Oh and 2nd gear was worn out. It was owned
by a local racer.
At that time only Audi galvanizes panels or so I'm lead to believe.
--
Need Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net
tra...@optonline.net
> In article <E7mdndYb8eSJn9nUnZ2dnUVZ8hKdn...@pipex.net>,
Yeah, I don't know what they did or didn't do for corrosion
protection, but those Fiat's were rust buckets. I had a 76 124
Spyder. Had it Ziebarted, which may have helped and was smart enought
to get rid of it in maybe 4 years or less. At that point, it didn't
have any rust yet. But just about every year, I'd have to replace one
or more calipers, because they seized. Had a cylinder head gasket
go, with no overheating preceding it. It did happen while my friend
had borrowed the car and was driving in some mountain areas with
grades. I know he had a habit of letting the engine lug, instead of
downshifting, and always wondered if that could have contributed to
the head gasket failing. This was at maybe 60K miles and when they
removed the head, they said the valve seals were shot, so had to have
that done. They asked if I hadn't change the oil, like it was my
fault. But I had changed the oil at or before schedule every
time. Just another example of fine Fiat quality. Did I mention
the time the clutch cable broke in a parking garage in NYC?
Doug
Sexton) wrote:
>In article <E7mdndYb8eSJn9nU...@pipex.net>,
>Dori A Schmetterling <nob...@spam.co.uk> wrote:
>>Used to!
>>
>>A lot more gritting rather than salting now, in the UK at least. I am sure
>>I read that Fiat's galvanising was poor and not as extensive as it ought to
>>have been.
>>
>>DAS
>
>Galvanising? Fiat? I had a 73 firat I bought in 76. a 124 Coupe (great
>car wich I still had it). I got it for a couple of hundred dollars because
>this 3 year old car had rusted out rockers and a fender. In 3 years they'd
>becomne totally perforated. Oh and 2nd gear was worn out. It was owned
>by a local racer.
>
>At that time only Audi galvanizes panels or so I'm lead to believe.
Believe it or not, the first mass produced cars to use galvanizing in
the USA were those made by AMC/Rambler.
My 1962 Rambler had the entire body deep dipped in electro-galvanising
primer with the rocker panels made of standard galvanized steel.
Doug
Richard Sexton
Yup, that's a Fiat. My timing belt broke at 79K miles. Munched a couple
of valves and buggered the head. Had the head rebuilt, rebuilt the
motor, went away to Uni... my folks sold it for $100 to some Spanish
kid who racked up tickets on it in my name for two years.
I rebuilt everything on that car except the differential. Mine had
a cherrywood dash (the coupes had black platic there, the spyders
had real wood) and a capybara gearshift boot.
Still though, with a twincam engine, 4 wheel discs and a 5 speed
in the mid 70's it was a helluva car. I always lusted after
an Alfa till I drove one and found it nowhere near as
fast or managable.
tra...@optonline.net
Now that you mention Alfas, here's a good story. I bought my Fiat
spyder when I was in college. A good friend of mine, Charlie, had
one and I thought they were hot cars too. A year or so later,
Charlie and his fiancee both buy brand new Alfa spyders.
So, Fiats being what they are, one fine day my fuel pump went when I
was out on the highway. So, I called a tow truck and had it towed.
Charlie discovered that I had used a regular tow truck, not a flat-
bed. Being on the highway at the time, the thought of what kind of
tow truck to ask for never entered my mind. And they towed it fine,
no problems. So, I get a big lecture on how I was nuts to let them
tow it with a regular tow truck.
Then about a year later, Charlie and the fiancee are driving home from
Boston to PA and the girl friends Alfa breaks down. So, what does HE
do? Why he tries to push it with his Alfa and creams the front of
his car. Maybe her car too, don't really remember that part anymore.
Richard Sexton
tra...@optonline.net <tra...@optonline.net> wrote:
>Then about a year later, Charlie and the fiancee are driving home from
>Boston to PA and the girl friends Alfa breaks down. So, what does HE
>do? Why he tries to push it with his Alfa and creams the front of
>his car. Maybe her car too, don't really remember that part anymore.
I think he's lucky they both started and got that far. My boss
bought a new Alfetta in about 83 or so. Six months later it
was in the shop every week.
T Wiklanski
considerable improvement in acceleration was noted. Since these cars have
solid lifters, periodic valve adjustment is required.
"DC" <nob...@pseudo.borked.net> wrote in message
news:fed71ad408683596...@pseudo.borked.net...
> "...it's hard to beat an old Mercedes diesel. The diesels
> from the early 1980s, including the 300SD, 300D, 240D,
> 300TD, and 300CD are relatively inexpensive to purchase,
> and they are still reliable cars after all these years..."
>
>
Tiger
JD
> Yes, all old MB diesel must have the valve adjusted every year...
>
>
How old? I've never had the valves adjusted on my
'92 300D nor has my tech recommended such/
Ashton Crusher
wrote:
>Yes, all old MB diesel must have the valve adjusted every year...
>
how much does that cost??
Wan-ning Tan
Yours is OM60x series (in fact, OM602) which has aluminum cylinder head
with hydraulic lifter. The valve never needs adjustment but the lifter
sometimes does go bad. The gap can be checked when, for example,
replacing valve cover gasket.