Re: Toyota says no evidence 'runaway' Prius happened
dgk
<el...@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
>In article <4LednSrST467RAPW...@giganews.com>,
> dbu'' <nos...@nobama.com.invalid> wrote:
>
>> > When this "runaway" accelertor problem happens, can't the driver yank the
>> > gear shift to neutral, and/or turn the ignition off?
>>
>> The Prius is unlike any conventional car. I don't believe it's quite
>> that simple.
>...
>> Toyota innovations are getting ahead of operator
>> understanding of these vehicles.
>
>Dude, SHIFTING TO NEUTRAL IS NOT A "TOYOTA INNOVATION". What the fuck
>is so hard to understand about this simple and oh-so-basic function?
>
>For Sikes to have claimed that "I thought the car would flip if I
>shifted to neutral" is enough for me to demand that he be taken off the
>road for the rest of his life.
And that is the bottom line. I would worry that the engine might
destroy itself if I shifted a runaway car into neutral, but given that
the other option is to smash into someone else at 90+ mph, I take that
risk.
JoeSpareBedroom
news:elmop-3343C8....@news.eternal-september.org...
> In article <4LednSrST467RAPW...@giganews.com>,
> dbu'' <nos...@nobama.com.invalid> wrote:
>
>> > When this "runaway" accelertor problem happens, can't the driver yank
>> > the
>> > gear shift to neutral, and/or turn the ignition off?
>>
>> The Prius is unlike any conventional car. I don't believe it's quite
>> that simple.
>
> imagine that a Prius could behave like every other car in the
> world--even though you've never owned or driven one.
>
> The driver can indeed yank the shifter into neutral and/or turn the car
> off. Yanking into neutral is as easy as it is in a Buick--touch shift
> lever, move to neutral.
>
> And you know what happens? Yeah. No drama. Drive system disengages,
> gas engine stops running, car immediately starts slowing down.
>
>
>
>> There is no conventional key, there might even be a delay
>> in time for ignition off due to the electronics involved.
>
> If you're using the power button, they've programmed it with a 3 second
> delay. You'd know that if (a) you owned one, and (b) you bothered to
> read the owner's manual of your shiny new $25,000 toy. Of course,
> arrogant asses who claim they know everything about driving never bother
> even to open or keep track of their owner's manual, let alone read it,
> so they wouldn't know how their specific car operates. Even when they
> get in and see that there's no key like in their '67 Buick, they never
> bother to investigate how that power button works.
So, when they arrive at their destination, they leave their Prius running?
Justbob30
"JoeSpareBedroom" <news...@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
news:LFKnn.40001$_v6....@newsfe08.iad...
Since the car doe NOT run when stopped (most of the time) yes it has been
known to happen...again maybe if you had ever driven one.
>
Obveeus
"Justbob30" <NoT...@you.com> wrote in message
news:hno406$9el$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>> running?
>
> Since the car doe NOT run when stopped (most of the time) yes it has been
> known to happen...again maybe if you had ever driven one.
Won't the car shut off when you open the door?
JoeSpareBedroom
Then what's the purpose of having the OFF button? It seems odd that owners
would not become acquainted with it on day #1 of owning the car.
jim beam
drive a prius dude. prius drivers leave those things on all the time -
the vehicle makes no noise so it's real easy to forget.
--
nomina rutrum rutrum
Nasty
No. I have one. It WILL shift into neutral at any speed. It WILL turn
off by pressing the power button without shifting to park. It WILL
operate at or below the speed limit and can be operated without having a
wreck so I don't have to make up stories about it "running away on its
own".
When stopped, at a red light for instance, the gasoline engine will shut
down when the battery is above a pre-set level. When the battery level
drops the gasoline engine will start automatically, run at idle speed,
and recharge the battery. If the light is a long one and the battery
draw is high this cycle may repeat.
IMHO almost all runaway cars are caused by a defect in the central
processor of the driver. The driver steps on the gas instead of the
brake, panics, and presses the gas pedal even harder thinking they are
pressing the brake pedal. Then again, I live in Florida, seems like we
have a lot of runaway cars of all makes and models. Interestingly high
percentage of Cadillacs and Lincolns with VERY senior citizens. Remember
now, this is all just MHO.
Tegger
news:4b9f977a$0$4975$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>
> No. I have one. It WILL shift into neutral at any speed. It WILL turn
> off by pressing the power button without shifting to park. It WILL
> operate at or below the speed limit and can be operated without having
> a wreck so I don't have to make up stories about it "running away on
> its own".
I've never driven a Prius. Under what exact conditions does the thing
actually run under battery power alone?
--
Tegger
C. E. White
>> If you're using the power button, they've programmed it with a 3
>> second
>> delay. You'd know that if (a) you owned one, and (b) you bothered
>> to
>> read the owner's manual of your shiny new $25,000 toy. Of course,
>> arrogant asses who claim they know everything about driving never
>> bother
>> even to open or keep track of their owner's manual, let alone read
>> it,
>> so they wouldn't know how their specific car operates. Even when
>> they
>> get in and see that there's no key like in their '67 Buick, they
>> never
>> bother to investigate how that power button works.
>
>
> So, when they arrive at their destination, they leave their Prius
> running?
The power button actc differently when the vehicle is at reat. If the
car is stopped, pushing it once turns off the vehicle (you don't need
to hold it for three seconds). You only have to hold if for three
seconds if the car is moving.
Ed
Obveeus
"Nasty" <na...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:4b9f977a$0$4975$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
> Obveeus wrote:
>> "Justbob30" <NoT...@you.com> wrote in message
>> news:hno406$9el$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>
>>> "JoeSpareBedroom" <news...@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
>>>> So, when they arrive at their destination, they leave their Prius
>>>> running?
>>> Since the car doe NOT run when stopped (most of the time) yes it has
>>> been known to happen...again maybe if you had ever driven one.
>>
>> Won't the car shut off when you open the door?
>
> No. I have one. It WILL shift into neutral at any speed. It WILL turn off
> by pressing the power button without shifting to park. It WILL operate at
> or below the speed limit and can be operated without having a wreck so I
> don't have to make up stories about it "running away on its own".
So if a person drive into their driveway, presses the brake until they stop,
then gets out of the car without shutting the car off (or pressing park),
what stops it from 'running away'? If what you say is true and it is still
on (and no one is pressing the brake anymore) what keep the car from moving?
Are you simply hoping the driveway is flat enough that the car doesn't roll
away or does it take a significant amount of gas pedal to provide any
forward momentem?
I thought one of the safety features for the Prius was that getting out of
the car (opening the door or moving the wireless key away from the vehicle
at all) would shut it off. Is that only the 2010 model?
> IMHO almost all runaway cars are caused by a defect in the central
> processor of the driver.
Agreed. Most of this issue is with old people (or other problem drivers).
Similiarly, it is silly to expect Prius drivers to know how to avoid an
accident even if the car (say the brake system) fails since drivers in
pretty much any type of car get into accidents (more often than not) when
such a system fails.
Nasty
It has a system by which it monitors the battery charge level. It will
run on the battery only at idle and up to about 25 mph with 'normal'
acceleration. When the battery charge is reduced to a pre-set level the
gas engine starts up automatically to charge it, or if you do a jack
rabbit start from a stop it will start also. The thing apparently
doesn't have a traditional starter. The gas motor just starts running
when needed almost like an old fashioned jump start from a push and
popping the clutch.
It's kinda wild. Ours is an '07 and is exempt, so far anyway, from the
problems making the rounds. It still causes me to look when it shuts the
gas motor down while, for instance, at a red light. It just goes against
all my experience for the motor to suddenly stop. With a strictly gas
motor this is a pretty not good thing.
All systems will function normally while on battery only. The thing has
a display that shows the status of the system, battery level, gas engine
running and charging the battery, gas engine running and delivering
drive power, power recovery from the brakes to the battery. It can be
distracting because it's fun to watch.
Nasty
> "Nasty" <na...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:4b9f977a$0$4975$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
>> Obveeus wrote:
>>> "Justbob30" <NoT...@you.com> wrote in message
>>> news:hno406$9el$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>> "JoeSpareBedroom" <news...@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
>>>>> So, when they arrive at their destination, they leave their Prius
>>>>> running?
>>>> Since the car doe NOT run when stopped (most of the time) yes it has
>>>> been known to happen...again maybe if you had ever driven one.
>>> Won't the car shut off when you open the door?
>> No. I have one. It WILL shift into neutral at any speed. It WILL turn off
>> by pressing the power button without shifting to park. It WILL operate at
>> or below the speed limit and can be operated without having a wreck so I
>> don't have to make up stories about it "running away on its own".
>
> So if a person drive into their driveway, presses the brake until they stop,
> then gets out of the car without shutting the car off (or pressing park),
> what stops it from 'running away'? If what you say is true and it is still
> on (and no one is pressing the brake anymore) what keep the car from moving?
> Are you simply hoping the driveway is flat enough that the car doesn't roll
> away or does it take a significant amount of gas pedal to provide any
> forward momentem?
Nothing, just like getting out of any car. If you get out and the car is
running and in drive it will go forward.
>
> I thought one of the safety features for the Prius was that getting out of
> the car (opening the door or moving the wireless key away from the vehicle
> at all) would shut it off. Is that only the 2010 model?
Can't say. Ours will stay 'on' if you get out without the 'key' once
it's sensed the key and started. Haven't tried to drive away without the
key though. I'll run a little test and report back on that.
Ray O
"dgk" <d...@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:cmsup5do4n9dqf8fh...@4ax.com...
AFAIK, all fuel injected Toyotas have a rev limiter which cuts fuel when the
engine reaches just above redline on the tachometer.
--
Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)
Ray O
"Obveeus" <Obv...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:hnoc3u$8ar$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
in drive instead of neutral or park, and take your foot off of the brake,
the vehicle will start to creep, whether or not the ICE is running.
As far as getting out of the vehicle with the smart key in your pocket and
the engine or drivetrain on, the car starts to beep because the smart key is
not detected in the vehicle as a reminder to tell you to shut it off.
Nasty
> "Nasty" <na...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:4b9f977a$0$4975$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
>> Obveeus wrote:
>>> "Justbob30" <NoT...@you.com> wrote in message
>>> news:hno406$9el$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>> "JoeSpareBedroom" <news...@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
>>>>> So, when they arrive at their destination, they leave their Prius
>>>>> running?
>>>> Since the car doe NOT run when stopped (most of the time) yes it has
>>>> been known to happen...again maybe if you had ever driven one.
>>> Won't the car shut off when you open the door?
>> No. I have one. It WILL shift into neutral at any speed. It WILL turn off
>> by pressing the power button without shifting to park. It WILL operate at
>> or below the speed limit and can be operated without having a wreck so I
>> don't have to make up stories about it "running away on its own".
>
> So if a person drive into their driveway, presses the brake until they stop,
> then gets out of the car without shutting the car off (or pressing park),
> what stops it from 'running away'? If what you say is true and it is still
> on (and no one is pressing the brake anymore) what keep the car from moving?
> Are you simply hoping the driveway is flat enough that the car doesn't roll
> away or does it take a significant amount of gas pedal to provide any
> forward momentem?
Nothing, just like getting out of any car. If you get out and the car is
running and in drive it will go forward.
> I thought one of the safety features for the Prius was that getting
out of
> the car (opening the door or moving the wireless key away from the
vehicle
> at all) would shut it off. Is that only the 2010 model?
>
Can't say. Ours will stay 'on' if you get out with the 'key' in your
pocket once it's sensed the key and started. Haven't tried to drive away
without the key though. I'll run a little test and report back on that.
>
>
>
Nasty
The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is charged
but the car is still under battery power and if left on and in drive it
will walk away from you
>
>
> Then what's the purpose of having the OFF button? It seems odd that owners
> would not become acquainted with it on day #1 of owning the car.
To shut the system down. Just like turning the key to off.
Nasty
That's a bit of an exaggeration of course but it /is/ easy to do.
However, if the car is in drive, the instant you take your foot off the
brake it will start moving forward and you will be quickly embarrassed
and reminded of your lapse. If in park it will sit there and cycle from
battery to gas until it runs out of gas and the battery is depleted.
pws
My parent's Camry has another rev limited, it's called my parents.
I don't think that they have ever hit the redline in anything..........
JoeSpareBedroom
news:hnopt3$mhb$2...@speranza.aioe.org...
So, a "tuneup" means let someone under 60 drive it for an hour? :-)
pws
You nailed it........Also, make that rev limiter, but everyone probably
knew that already. :-)
dr_jeff
Only if you give it legs.
tc
"pws" <pwsh...@austin.rr.com> wrote in message
news:hnoqrp$pfo$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
>I would rather be on the road with your parents, than someone going 30+ mph
>over the speed limit and texting their girl or boy friend
the red line is there for a purpose, and if you do hit it I hope its with a
car you paid for not your parents. There is a lot to be said for growing up
and being responsible
AZ Nomad
Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
pws
I'm pretty old, just one ticket in the last 15 years, never a serious
accident, always insured, etc.
Not too irresponsible as it applies to cars.
I also have a car that has a fully adjustable redline. The engine was
built to handle 8,000 rpm shifts without damage, and those shifts are
not necessarily on a public road.
Never have texted while driving though. I don't really text at all with
my phone.
Tegger
$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
> Tegger wrote:
>>
>> I've never driven a Prius. Under what exact conditions does the thing
>> actually run under battery power alone?
>>
>>
>
> It has a system by which it monitors the battery charge level. It will
> run on the battery only at idle and up to about 25 mph with 'normal'
> acceleration. When the battery charge is reduced to a pre-set level the
> gas engine starts up automatically to charge it, or if you do a jack
> rabbit start from a stop it will start also.
Or when you rip along at 90mph while rapidly alternating between gas pedal
and brake pedal, which is what this Sikes fellow did.
--
Tegger
Cameo
> So, a "tuneup" means let someone under 60 drive it for an hour? :-)
I resemble that remark!
Cameo
news:Xns9D3DC4DE...@208.90.168.18...
>
> Or when you rip along at 90mph while rapidly alternating between gas
> pedal
> and brake pedal, which is what this Sikes fellow did.
I wonder if that can be proven with enough confidence to sue the guy
criminally. It would be no point to do that in civil court as he is a
deadbeat.
JoeSpareBedroom
news:hnp5sd$sui$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Well, what happened with that guy who claimed his kid floated away in a hot
air balloon last year? Last headline I saw said something like "Authorities
say charges pending." This Prius guy did something not very dissimilar.
dr_jeff
First, we don't know if he did anything wrong. Innocent until proven guilty.
Second, if he is guilty, there could charges of speeding, lying to
police and wreckless endangerment.
Tegger
september.org:
Really want to find out? Then don't lose interest in this issue. An update
will likely eventually be published in the papers, but you'll need to dig
down to the bottom of page A27 to find it. The TV morons will have lost
interest ages ago and won't bother to update it.
--
Tegger
AZ Nomad
perhaps some jail if he has done shit like this before as the wendy's
finger-fraud lady did.
Ed Maier
If you wanna have some fun at Chili's, get a jalapeno and hold it
between your thumb and index finger, walk up to the register, hold it up
and holler, "Hey! There's a pepper in my fingers!"
Ed Maier
Ed Maier
Duh
Ed Maier
jim beam
> "JoeSpareBedroom"<news...@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
>
>>> If you're using the power button, they've programmed it with a 3
>>> second
>>> delay. You'd know that if (a) you owned one, and (b) you bothered
>>> to
>>> read the owner's manual of your shiny new $25,000 toy. Of course,
>>> arrogant asses who claim they know everything about driving never
>>> bother
>>> even to open or keep track of their owner's manual, let alone read
>>> it,
>>> so they wouldn't know how their specific car operates. Even when
>>> they
>>> get in and see that there's no key like in their '67 Buick, they
>>> never
>>> bother to investigate how that power button works.
>>
>>
>> So, when they arrive at their destination, they leave their Prius
>> running?
>
> car is stopped, pushing it once turns off the vehicle (you don't need
> to hold it for three seconds). You only have to hold if for three
> seconds if the car is moving.
>
> Ed
>
>
hey, committee that is "ed", this one got away without spell check.
don't interns get supervised around your office?
--
nomina rutrum rutrum
Daniel who wants to know
"AZ Nomad" <azno...@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote in message
news:slrnhq03dm.9...@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net...
>
> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
The Prius has always had artificial creep (ICE running or not) for no other
reason than to emulate a regular automatic transmission with a torque
converter.
Leftie
>
>> No. I have one. It WILL shift into neutral at any speed. It WILL turn
>> off by pressing the power button without shifting to park. It WILL
>> operate at or below the speed limit and can be operated without having
>> a wreck so I don't have to make up stories about it "running away on
>> its own".
>
>
>
> actually run under battery power alone?
>
>
I don't have one, but it's my understanding that it will run in EV
mode at speeds under 26MPH at low throttle openings for up to one mile.
jim beam
and useful it is too...
--
nomina rutrum rutrum
ACAR
ACAR
snip
> Then again, I live in Florida, seems like we
> have a lot of runaway cars of all makes and models. Interestingly high
> percentage of Cadillacs and Lincolns with VERY senior citizens. Remember
> now, this is all just MHO.
Actually, there's plenty of documentation re. driver age vs crashes.
Lots of news articles are now quoting crash statistics as the
spotlight moves from the cars to the drivers. So I guess we should
thank the faker for shifting the debate.
Obveeus
"AZ Nomad" <azno...@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Mar 2010 20:00:41 -0400, dr_jeff <u...@msu.edu> wrote:
>>Cameo wrote:
>>> "Tegger" <inv...@invalid.inv> wrote in message
>>> news:Xns9D3DC4DE...@208.90.168.18...
>>>>
>>>> Or when you rip along at 90mph while rapidly alternating between gas
>>>> pedal
>>>> and brake pedal, which is what this Sikes fellow did.
>>>
>>> I wonder if that can be proven with enough confidence to sue the guy
>>> criminally. It would be no point to do that in civil court as he is a
>>> deadbeat.
>
>>First, we don't know if he did anything wrong. Innocent until proven
>>guilty.
>
>>Second, if he is guilty, there could charges of speeding, lying to
>>police and wreckless endangerment.
Charges for speeding and lying to police should be forthcoming. I'm not
sure what the laws in California are with respect to how much over the
posted speed limit a driver has to go before it becomes 'wreckless
endangerment'. Still, the police probably just want to see this incident
fade away from the front pages as quickly as possible given how they were
duped.
> perhaps some jail if he has done shit like this before as the wendy's
> finger-fraud lady did.
Apparently, he has twice filed insurance claims when short of funds. Those
insurance claims probably need another look given recent events.
dgk
wrote:
I did text once. I was at a conference with multiple simultaneous
tracks and thought that my boss should see the session I was in. So I
texted her rather than be distracting to the people around me. A few
minutes later she showed up.
My fourteen year old god-daughter, on the other hand, hit 15,000 in
one month. Now, that's incoming and outgoing but still, that's a lot
of messages. I really need to see a transcript but I won't live long
enough to read through 15,000 messages.
E. Meyer
"Obveeus" <Obv...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> "AZ Nomad" <azno...@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 16 Mar 2010 20:00:41 -0400, dr_jeff <u...@msu.edu> wrote:
>>> Cameo wrote:
>>>> "Tegger" <inv...@invalid.inv> wrote in message
>>>> news:Xns9D3DC4DE...@208.90.168.18...
>>>>>
>>>>> Or when you rip along at 90mph while rapidly alternating between gas
>>>>> pedal
>>>>> and brake pedal, which is what this Sikes fellow did.
>>>>
>>>> I wonder if that can be proven with enough confidence to sue the guy
>>>> criminally. It would be no point to do that in civil court as he is a
>>>> deadbeat.
>>
>>> First, we don't know if he did anything wrong. Innocent until proven
>>> guilty.
>>
>>> Second, if he is guilty, there could charges of speeding, lying to
>>> police and wreckless endangerment.
>
> Charges for speeding and lying to police should be forthcoming. I'm not
> sure what the laws in California are with respect to how much over the
> posted speed limit a driver has to go before it becomes 'wreckless
> endangerment'. Still, the police probably just want to see this incident
> fade away from the front pages as quickly as possible given how they were
> duped.
How were the police duped? He made a 911 call and they responded. What
happens after that is for the investigators to figure out, which they are
trying to do.
Obveeus
"E. Meyer" <e.p....@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Obveeus" <Obv...@aol.com> wrote:
>> Charges for speeding and lying to police should be forthcoming. I'm not
>> sure what the laws in California are with respect to how much over the
>> posted speed limit a driver has to go before it becomes 'wreckless
>> endangerment'. Still, the police probably just want to see this incident
>> fade away from the front pages as quickly as possible given how they were
>> duped.
>
> How were the police duped? He made a 911 call and they responded. What
> happens after that is for the investigators to figure out, which they are
> trying to do.
They fueled the publicity for this guy's scam. They also took the attitude
afterward (just as the New York case has taken) that Toyota is some sort of
evil entity that needs to be kept away from these 'crime scenes'...as if
Toyota is only working to cover things up. Toyota and the NHTSA, like it or
not, are still more qualified to investigate this type of car issue than are
local police. the police became part of the propaganda machine...most
definitely duped by Sikes.
Cameo
> Well, what happened with that guy who claimed his kid floated away in
> a hot air balloon last year? Last headline I saw said something like
> "Authorities say charges pending."
That guy got convicted for misleading authorities.
Nasty
> On Tue, 16 Mar 2010 15:27:46 -0400, Nasty <na...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote:
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>> "Justbob30" <NoT...@you.com> wrote in message
>>> news:hno406$9el$1...@news.eternal-september.org...>>>> news:LFKnn.40001$_v6....@newsfe08.iad...
>>>>> "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <el...@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:elmop-3343C8....@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>>> In article <4LednSrST467RAPW...@giganews.com>,
>>>>>> dbu'' <nos...@nobama.com.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> When this "runaway" accelertor problem happens, can't the driver yank
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> gear shift to neutral, and/or turn the ignition off?
>>>>>>> The Prius is unlike any conventional car. I don't believe it's quite
>>>>>>> that simple.
>>>>>> imagine that a Prius could behave like every other car in the
>>>>>> world--even though you've never owned or driven one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The driver can indeed yank the shifter into neutral and/or turn the car
>>>>>> off. Yanking into neutral is as easy as it is in a Buick--touch shift
>>>>>> lever, move to neutral.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And you know what happens? Yeah. No drama. Drive system disengages,
>>>>>> gas engine stops running, car immediately starts slowing down.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There is no conventional key, there might even be a delay
>>>>>>> in time for ignition off due to the electronics involved.
>>>>>> If you're using the power button, they've programmed it with a 3 second
>>>>>> delay. You'd know that if (a) you owned one, and (b) you bothered to
>>>>>> read the owner's manual of your shiny new $25,000 toy. Of course,
>>>>>> arrogant asses who claim they know everything about driving never bother
>>>>>> even to open or keep track of their owner's manual, let alone read it,
>>>>>> so they wouldn't know how their specific car operates. Even when they
>>>>>> get in and see that there's no key like in their '67 Buick, they never
>>>>>> bother to investigate how that power button works.
>>>>> So, when they arrive at their destination, they leave their Prius
>>>>> running?
>>>> known to happen...again maybe if you had ever driven one.
>
>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is charged
>> but the car is still under battery power and if left on and in drive it
>> will walk away from you
>
> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
Wow. There really is no limit to stupidity. Do you know ANYTHING about a
Prius?
Nasty
> Nasty <na...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in news:4b9fd8b3$0$4884
> $9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>
>> Tegger wrote:
>
>>> I've never driven a Prius. Under what exact conditions does the thing
>>> actually run under battery power alone?
>>>
>>>
>> run on the battery only at idle and up to about 25 mph with 'normal'
>> acceleration. When the battery charge is reduced to a pre-set level the
>> gas engine starts up automatically to charge it, or if you do a jack
>> rabbit start from a stop it will start also.
>
>
> Or when you rip along at 90mph while rapidly alternating between gas pedal
> and brake pedal, which is what this Sikes fellow did.
>
>
>
I think we need to add "get caught" between 'you' and 'rip[ing]'
Nasty
> "Tegger" <inv...@invalid.inv> wrote in message
> news:Xns9D3DC4DE...@208.90.168.18...
>>
>> pedal
>> and brake pedal, which is what this Sikes fellow did.
>
> criminally. It would be no point to do that in civil court as he is a
> deadbeat.
Do the onboard computers store that kind of data?
Nasty
> In article <hnoc3u$8ar$1...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> "Obveeus" <Obv...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>>> No. I have one. It WILL shift into neutral at any speed. It WILL turn off
>>> by pressing the power button without shifting to park. It WILL operate at
>>> or below the speed limit and can be operated without having a wreck so I
>>> don't have to make up stories about it "running away on its own".
>> then gets out of the car without shutting the car off (or pressing park),
>> what stops it from 'running away'?
>
> Nothing.
>
> If it's in D, it will creep away just like any other car in the world.
Hey, are you under the insane...wait, I think we settled that a while back.
Nasty
> In article <4b9fd8b3$0$4884$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com>,
> Nasty <na...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote:
>
>>> I've never driven a Prius. Under what exact conditions does the thing
>>> actually run under battery power alone?
>>>
>>>
>> It has a system by which it monitors the battery charge level. It will
>> run on the battery only at idle and up to about 25 mph with 'normal'
>> acceleration. When the battery charge is reduced to a pre-set level the
>> gas engine starts up automatically to charge it, or if you do a jack
>> doesn't have a traditional starter. The gas motor just starts running
>> when needed almost like an old fashioned jump start from a push and
>> popping the clutch.
>
> Everyone here needs to look up the Hybrid Synergy Drive and the center
> of the magic, the Power Split Device.
>
> Please refrain from speculating until you've read up on this.
Praise Jezuz and amen.
Tegger
news:4ba180e1$0$4943$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
> AZ Nomad wrote:
>>
>> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
>
> Wow. There really is no limit to stupidity. Do you know ANYTHING about
> a Prius?
>
Never having driven a Prius, I'm dependent on others' descriptions of its
behavior.
I gather the Prius is set up so that it mimics a conventional car's
automatic transmission "creep" when at a standstill and in Drive. The
"creep" would be provided by activating the electric propulsion motor when
the brakes are released, the amount of activation being in inverse
proportion to foot pressure on the brake pedal.
--
Tegger
C. E. White
"jim beam" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:vbmdnYjSW9Z80z3W...@speakeasy.net...
>> The power button actc differently when the vehicle is at reat. If the
>> car is stopped, pushing it once turns off the vehicle (you don't need
>> to hold it for three seconds). You only have to hold if for three
>> seconds if the car is moving.
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>
>
> hey, committee that is "ed", this one got away without spell check. don't
> interns get supervised around your office?
Yes I make typos all the time. One of the computers I use won't spell check
Outlook Express posts (it could be fixed, but I keep putting off the fix).
When I have the time, I usually use a different program to check the
spelling, but I was in hurry when I wrote the referenced append. I saw the
error after the post was out of my control, but I figured 99.5% of all
humans would properly translate the typo without comment.
BTW, did you lose the shift key off your TRS80 Keyboard?
My interns are all female Swedish models and they were out getting some sun
yesterday.
Ed
Nasty
Tegger, my comment was NOT directed at you. Pleased be assured of that.
dr_jeff
Sorry, I did a Mike Hunter.
dr_jeff
> "AZ Nomad" <azno...@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 16 Mar 2010 20:00:41 -0400, dr_jeff <u...@msu.edu> wrote:
>>> Cameo wrote:
>>>> "Tegger" <inv...@invalid.inv> wrote in message
>>>> news:Xns9D3DC4DE...@208.90.168.18...
>>>>> Or when you rip along at 90mph while rapidly alternating between gas
>>>>> pedal
>>>>> and brake pedal, which is what this Sikes fellow did.
>>>> I wonder if that can be proven with enough confidence to sue the guy
>>>> criminally. It would be no point to do that in civil court as he is a
>>>> deadbeat.
>>> First, we don't know if he did anything wrong. Innocent until proven
>>> guilty.
>>> Second, if he is guilty, there could charges of speeding, lying to
>>> police and wreckless endangerment.
>
> Charges for speeding and lying to police should be forthcoming. I'm not
> sure what the laws in California are with respect to how much over the
> posted speed limit a driver has to go before it becomes 'wreckless
> endangerment'. Still, the police probably just want to see this incident
> fade away from the front pages as quickly as possible given how they were
> duped.
The actions of the police kept the driver more in check than if they
didn't show up. They acted appropriately.
And, if it turns out that he was lying, a new pair of bracelets would be
appropriate, too. I think they definitely have him on reckless
endangerment (again, so I did a Mike Hunter with the spelling) because
he endangered the lives of some many people, particularly the life of a
CHP officer.
>> perhaps some jail if he has done shit like this before as the wendy's
>> finger-fraud lady did.
>
> Apparently, he has twice filed insurance claims when short of funds. Those
> insurance claims probably need another look given recent events.
True.
dr_jeff
> In article <slrnhq03dm.9...@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>,
> AZ Nomad <azno...@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>
>>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is charged
>>> but the car is still under battery power and if left on and in drive it
>>> will walk away from you
>
> other car works.
>
> Is this confusing to you? Toyota designed the Prius to ACT just like
> every other car everyone has ever driven. It does that quite admirably,
> frankly. They did a stupendous job.
Not my car. It doesn't have a "drive."
C. E. White
"Scott in Florida" <Mov...@Outa.here> wrote in message
news:2v83q5t6t2s13tqb7...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 23:09:09 -0400, "C. E. White"
> <cewhite...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>My interns are all female Swedish models and they were out getting
>>some sun
>>yesterday.
>>
>>Ed
>
jim bean is already jealous of my brilliant mind, great looks, and
fabulous wealth. Posting pictures of my interns might send him oer the
edge into a deep depression, so I'll spare jim and the group.
Ed
Nasty
What does it have <he asked half knowing he would sigh at the answer>?
Tegger
$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
He must mean that he has a manual transmission.
It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an "automatic" to
its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would expect the Prius to
behave like a traditional automatic-transmission ICE car, and that Toyota
would design the Prius to behave as such.
--
Tegger
Nasty
> Nasty <na...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in news:4ba25260$0$4884
> $9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>
>> dr_jeff wrote:
>>> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>>>> In article <slrnhq03dm.9...@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>,
>>>> AZ Nomad <azno...@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is
>>>>>> charged but the car is still under battery power and if left on and
>>>>>> in drive it will walk away from you
>>>>> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
>>>> If left on and in drive, it will move away from you--just like how
>>>> every other car works.
>>>>
>>>> Is this confusing to you? Toyota designed the Prius to ACT just like
>>>> every other car everyone has ever driven. It does that quite
>>>> admirably, frankly. They did a stupendous job.
>>> Not my car. It doesn't have a "drive."
>> What does it have <he asked half knowing he would sigh at the answer>?
>
>
>
> He must mean that he has a manual transmission.
<sigh>
>
> It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an "automatic" to
> its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would expect the Prius to
> behave like a traditional automatic-transmission ICE car, and that Toyota
> would design the Prius to behave as such.
>
>
Interesting point. Even though the gear selector is marked like a
traditional automatic, "P", "N", "D", etc., and there is no clutch
pedal, it really does kind of act somewhat like a manual since there is
no automatic shifting from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Sorta harkens back to the
VW "automatic/manual" tranny.
It's really an ingenious piece of engineering. Too bad it's in such a
crappy little box. But, my wife consistently gets in the low 50's.
C. E. White
"Nasty" <na...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:4ba25dd9$0$4868$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
> It's really an ingenious piece of engineering. Too bad it's in such
> a crappy little box.
Comapred to what? I don't own one, but I have been in them. It's no
BMW, but for the price it is an incredible deal. I find it as
comfortable as a Camry (not that Camry's are world class in comfort).
The only significant negatives I am aware of are the narrow width and
the horrible view out the rear. It is not really my cup of tea, but I
don't think I'd call it a "crappy little box."
Ed
Tegger
news:4ba25dd9$0$4868$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
> Tegger wrote:
>>
>> It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an
>> "automatic" to its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would
>> expect the Prius to behave like a traditional automatic-transmission
>> ICE car, and that Toyota would design the Prius to behave as such.
>>
>>
>
> Interesting point. Even though the gear selector is marked like a
> traditional automatic, "P", "N", "D", etc., and there is no clutch
> pedal, it really does kind of act somewhat like a manual since there
> is no automatic shifting from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Sorta harkens back to
> the VW "automatic/manual" tranny.
Do you need to shift into 2nd manually, or is it more like a CVT?
--
Tegger
Nasty
CVT.
Nasty
I do own one, as I've previously stated. Bought it new in '07. The more
you ride in one the more you see and feel. I think it has a bad ride,
uncomfortable seats, weird and rubbery steering, it wallows around turns
and there's a lot of wind noise at highway speed. It feels cheap and
boxy to me. It's a technological marvel but it is, IMHO, far inferior to
a Camry.
Tegger
$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
So... it is, then, for all intents and purposes, an automatic.
Since some 90% of new cars in North America are purchased with automatics,
Toyota had chosen well in having the Prius mimic a traditional automatic.
--
Tegger
Tegger
$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>
> I do own one, as I've previously stated. Bought it new in '07. The more
> you ride in one the more you see and feel. I think it has a bad ride,
> uncomfortable seats, weird and rubbery steering, it wallows around turns
> and there's a lot of wind noise at highway speed. It feels cheap and
> boxy to me. It's a technological marvel but it is, IMHO, far inferior to
> a Camry.
>
Toyota makes little to no money on the Prius; it's an "image" car, and is
expensive to build. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that they've
cut a /lot/ of corners in an attempt to keep the line from being a major
money pit.
--
Tegger
dr_jeff
A manual transmission.
dr_jeff
My dad's Ford Five Hundred has a CVT. The controls are marked like those
of an automatic, with P, R, N, D and either low or 1.
Jeff
dr_jeff
Actually, it is a type of CVT.
pws
That sounds a lot like my '94 Accord.
Actually, the main problem my Accord has is that the power goes to the
wrong wheels...............I never have been a big fan of FWD, but the
car was free and it is very reliable. I should finally hit 80,000 miles
today.
Nasty
Really? We have a 2000 Accord and love it. Superb handling but I agree
that it's not a great long haul car. Sneaking up on 150K. By some
standards in here that's nearly a new car!
rick++
because they are so prompt, forthcoming and honest.
pws
This '94 Accord LX is actually pretty nice for what it is. Very good gas
mileage.
It has pretty high wind noise, but this is also a very lightweight car
compared to many other 4 door sedans, and I like that.
The seats could be a lot better. This car is cheap to insure, however,
and it doesn't attract the attention of the various ticket-writers, so
there are definitely some advantages.
The reliability is what I like about it the most, and at the low miles
it has, it will hopefully remain reliable for some time to come.
Jim Yanik
news:4ba39a70$0$23502$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
more accurately,YOU bought the wrong car for YOU.
Having the front-mounted motor drive the front wheels makes better use of
interior space,gives better traction(and steerable!) under winter
driving,and is more efficient.It eliminates a driveshaft and associated U-
joints and weighs less than a comparable RWD setup.
> I never have been a big fan of FWD, but the
>> car was free and it is very reliable. I should finally hit 80,000 miles
>> today.
>
> Really? We have a 2000 Accord and love it. Superb handling but I agree
> that it's not a great long haul car. Sneaking up on 150K. By some
> standards in here that's nearly a new car!
>
In my 86 Prelude SI(THAT is "superb handling"),I drove for 12hrs
straight,only stopping for gas,and felt like I could go another 5-6 hrs at
the end of my trip.
Orlando,FL - Hopkinsville,KY. Piece of cake.
My 94 Integra GS-R would have been the same.
--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com
Tegger
$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>
> We have a 2000 Accord and love it. Superb handling but I agree
> that it's not a great long haul car. Sneaking up on 150K. By some
> standards in here that's nearly a new car!
My '91 'Teg is sneaking up on 340,000. It's at about 339,500.
I honestly never dared to think that it might go this far. And judging from
its current behavior, oil usage, and emissions numbers, I'm thinking it
might, possibly, actually hit 400,000.
--
Tegger
dr_jeff
If the motor gives out, you can always have it towed the last few miles.
Tegger
news:E4WdnbvaC9wChjnW...@giganews.com:
> Tegger wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> My '91 'Teg is sneaking up on 340,000. It's at about 339,500.
>>
>> I honestly never dared to think that it might go this far. And
>> judging from its current behavior, oil usage, and emissions numbers,
>> I'm thinking it might, possibly, actually hit 400,000.
>
>
> If the motor gives out, you can always have it towed the last few
> miles.
>
Thanks for the invaluable tip.
--
Tegger
dr_jeff
Glad I can help.
Jeff
Nasty
'Teg??
Daniel who wants to know
>
> My dad's Ford Five Hundred has a CVT. The controls are marked like those
> of an automatic, with P, R, N, D and either low or 1.
>
> Jeff
Just don't confuse the two systems like many seem to do. Your dad's Five
Hundred and my friend's Freestyle have a cone and belt CVT which varies the
effective size of the driving and driven pulleys to change ratios, it still
requires a torque converter, reverse gear of some sort, and a high pressure
hydraulic pump to apply tension to the stainless steel belt.
The PSD in a Toyota hybrid mimics a CVT by varying the speed difference
between the 2 motor/generators to change ratios. It has no torque converter
or reverse gear and just has a small fluid pump to keep the bearings lubed.
Cameo
> This '94 Accord LX is actually pretty nice for what it is. Very good
> gas mileage.
>
> It has pretty high wind noise, but this is also a very lightweight car
> compared to many other 4 door sedans, and I like that.
>
> The seats could be a lot better. This car is cheap to insure,
> however, and it doesn't attract the attention of the various
> ticket-writers, so there are definitely some advantages.
>
> The reliability is what I like about it the most, and at the low miles
> it has, it will hopefully remain reliable for some time to come.
Especially if it was assembled in Japan. Was it?
Cameo
news:Xns9D40D4A...@208.90.168.18...
> Thanks for the invaluable tip.
I am parsing that "invaluable" as not valuable. (You know, like
"incorrect" is not correct.)
dr_jeff
Just to be clear, the Toyota system is still a CVT, but of a completely
different type.
A Ford transmission with a belt? That sounds funny. A belt carrying the
load in a big car's transmission? It's a steel belt, though. And heavy
duty. I have seen the working model at NY Auto Show.
Jeff
Tegger
news:4ba44e46$0$5088$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>>
>>
>
> 'Teg??
>
Integra.
--
Tegger
pws
How do I find out where it was assembled? Also, this is a 1995 model, I
often think it is a 1994 model for some reason.
I finally hit 80,000 miles yesterday!
Tegger
september.org:
Having to explain a joke, ruins it. But I'll explain anyway.
"Invaluable" means "having value beyond measure", or "priceless". You can
define my comment as "ironic", or "tongue in cheek".
Tegger's School of Humor is now closed, never to re-open. Maybe.
--
Tegger
Tegger
> Cameo wrote:
>>
>> Especially if it was assembled in Japan. Was it?
>
> How do I find out where it was assembled? Also, this is a 1995 model, I
> often think it is a 1994 model for some reason.
Look at the VIN number in the windshield.
If the first character is a
1 = US assembly
J = Japan assembly.
If the 10th character is a
P = 1993
R = 1994
S = 1995
T = 1996.
>
> I finally hit 80,000 miles yesterday!
>
It's probably broken-in by now, but give it a bit longer to be sure.
--
Tegger
pws
> pws <pwsh...@austin.rr.com> wrote in news:ho2h3r$abk$1...@speranza.aioe.org:
>
>> Cameo wrote:
>
>>> Especially if it was assembled in Japan. Was it?
>> How do I find out where it was assembled? Also, this is a 1995 model, I
>> often think it is a 1994 model for some reason.
>
>
> Look at the VIN number in the windshield.
>
> If the first character is a
> 1 = US assembly
> J = Japan assembly.
>
> If the 10th character is a
> P = 1993
> R = 1994
> S = 1995
> T = 1996.
Thank you sir, this is indeed a 1995 model Accord LX that was assembled
in Japan.
> It's probably broken-in by now, but give it a bit longer to be sure.
Hehe, I have put about 3,000 of the miles on the car.
Most of the miles are from Grandma driving it back and forth 200 miles
each direction.
She did not run the A/C enough, and the entire system was replaced for
$1200.00 last year, so that works great now.
This is one of the few cars I have owned where everything works without
any issues.
Nasty
Ah so.