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"The Thing On the Doorstep" (H.P. Lovecraft)

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Dr Hermes

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May 14, 2006, 9:39:30 PM5/14/06
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(May 14, 2006)

SPOILERS AHEAD
But honestly, the ending is obvious from early on...

Here's a Lovecraft story that I think does not quite get the attention
it deserves. When I encountered it during my first peak book-devouring
age of eleven or so, most of it went right over my tousled little head.
Okay, spirits switching bodies and a corpse stumbling around, I
thought... cool, but nothing I hadn't seen before in EC Comics like
<i>TALES FROM THE CRYPT</i>. I missed most of the darker and subtler
implications. Today, because it does not feature superstars of the
Mythos like Cthulhu and because the more potentially spectacular scenes
are only described briefly, "The Thing On the Doorstep" seems to be seen
as a lesser work.

Lovecraft wrote this story in 1933 but took his time submitting to
<i>WEIRD TALES</i> (he was not exactly your typical hard-working
pulpster, banging out one story after another and immediately sending a
rejected yarn off to a different editor), so it didn't see print until
the January 1937 issue. "The Thing On the Doorstep" is still another
example of the narrator trying desperately not to realize what is
stunningly obvious to the reader from early on. It works better this
time around, although maybe I'm just getting used to accepting the
formula.

We start with our narrator, an upper-class toff named Daniel Upton. He's
in police custody, explaining that there was a perfectly good reason why
he went to Arkham Sanitarium and popped six bullets into the head of his
lifelong chum Edward Derby. Dan explains that he was actually saving the
world from a dreadful menace and that rather than murdering Derby, "I
have avenged him."

We get Derby's life story and (to be frank) it sounds very much like
Lovecraft writing his own idealized autobiography. An only child with a
frail constitution, spoiled and coddled by a domineering mother, he was
kept under close watch and never allowed independence. As a result, he
developed a morbid taste for dark fantasy and showed great artistic
potential as a poet. It was not until the death of his mother that he
started to feel free enough to pursue his own inclinations. (Okay,
Howard Philip, we get your point.)

While whizzing through classes at Miskatonic University, Derby gets
deeper into arcane matters and reads the three best-sellers of the
hellbound, THE BOOK OF EIBON, THE UNUSSPRES -- UNAUSPRESCK --
UNAUSSPRECHLICHEN KULTEN and of course that beloved family classic THE
NECRONOMICON. After that, he's ripe for a malignant influence in his
life and sure enough, he meets a small dark coed named Asenath Waite.
She's cute enough except for slight protruberant eyes which are not a
sign of thyroid problems but a clue that she's from an old Innsmouth
family. (And if you've read "The Shadow Over Innsmouth, you might feel a
tiny little shudder at this information.)

Aside from the bad reputation her home town has, Asenath is a peculiar
little lass herself. She's very domineering and assertive, and quickly
takes over Derby's life (he was the submissive type anyway). There are a
lot of funny things about Asenath. She has a mocking grin and makes
shocking remarks about topics a proper young lady of that time was not
supposed to know about (pssst... s.e.x.) Most alarming, she has a hobby
of staring intensely with her bulgy eyes at young women, giving them the
strangest delusion of leaving their own bodies and looking at themselves
from Asenath's viewpoint.

Just to add one more bit against her suitability as a girlfriend,
Asenath is "Ephraim Waite's daughter -- the only child of his old age by
an unknown wife who always went veiled." Crazy old Ephraim was known as
a wizard of some skill and (strangely enough) he had died mysteriously
just before his child had entered college. Asenath had been his student
in the occult and she sometimes looked "fiendishly" like him. Okay, by
now veteran pulp readers have concluded that what we're dealing with
here is Ephraim's mind or spirit inhabiting the body of his daughter by
one of those unpleasantly fishy Innsmouth locals. But then we're working
with information not available to the narrator or (sadly) to poor Edward
Derby.

After Edward and Asenath are married, things get rapidly creepier. The
new husband starts showing dramatic personality changes that come and
go, he gets mired deeper and deeper into sordid mystical cults, and he's
not only on the highway to Hell, he's in the passing lane. Eventually he
starts turning up half-hysterical at Dan's house, explaining he only has
a brief moment before Asenath reclaims him. During one of these more
lucid intervals, when Asenath has "gone on a long trip" (hmm), he agrees
to be admitted to Arkham Sanitarium.

Then comes the dreadful night when Dan is awakened at midnight by a
phone call. All he can hear is this odd "Glub... glub" noise. Oh, well,
must be something wrong with the phone. Then, a knocking at the door in
the dead of night reveals a grotesque, crippled-up dwarfish figure in
clothing much too large. The visitor, who stinks worse than the dumpster
behind a fish market on a hot August day, hands Dan an almost illegible
note. All is made clear, much too late, and Dan sets out to visit
"Edward Derby" with revolver in his pocket, leaving behind the Thing on
the doorstep.

Whew. And even then there's an ominous hint that the nightmare might not
be completely over even then... Well, there is a lot of Edgar Allan Poe
in this story, from the beginning statements (which remind me of "The
Tell-Tale Heart") to the loathesome putrescent pile of decay by the
front door which is remiscent of poor old M. Valdemar. There is also a
surprising amount of Lovecraft's own invented mythology here, mostly the
Deep Ones and their longterm effects on half-deserted Innsmouth. One of
the most chilling moments is when Derby is ranting and raving about how
Asenath went (in his body) to a cursed ceremony in "the pit of the
shoggoths! Down the six thousand steps..." There the Hooded Thing (that
is, the inhuman secret wife of Ephraim) bleated her husband's coven name
"Kamog!" before the assembly. Derby babbles, "I saw a shoggoth -- it
changed shape... I can't stand it!" Just the bare mention of this sort
of thing seems much more unnerving to me than any detailed description
of actually being present at the ceremony would be.

While reading "The Horror At Red Hook" not long ago, I found it hard not
to see some of the storyline there as reflecting Lovecraft's issues
about his marriage to Sonia Greene. Here, his conflicted feelings seem
even closer to the surface. Edward Derby is so obviously a surrogate of
Lovecraft that he might as well have been named Philip H. Loveman or
something. And the way he is drawn into a relationship and marriage by a
strong-willed take-charge woman who has something alien and foreign in
her background (well, Sonia was Jewish and Lovecraft did have quite a
few prejudices) seems pretty blatant. Derby ends up losing his identity
to his wife, becomes literally taken over by her and drawn into stuff he
would rather not deal with, and it all ends tragically in both their
deaths.

Maybe Lovecraft wasn't taking this story all that seriously. From all
accounts, his marriage wasn't stormy or turbulent, just something that
fizzled out and he remained on good terms with Sonia for years. Perhaps
he wasn't even consciously exorcising his troubles by presenting his
wedded episode in this manner, or maybe he was saying things here that
he was too repressed and gentlemanly to ever have come out said and
openly. It's all conjecture, of course, but I've found that writers
themselves aren't always aware of what inner demons they're getting rid
of by putting them down on paper and writing "The End" to close things
off.

There is one aspect of the story that I doubt Lovecraft realized
himself. Derby and Asenath do get married and presumably have a wedding
night on which events take place in the expected way. That is, they shag
with fervor. Yet you remember that the bride is actually Ephraim's soul
in his own daughter's body (perverse enough in its own way) Oh well,
sorcerors are well-known for their willingness to experiment and conduct
ceremonies they may not enjoy themselves.

http://community.webtv.net/drhermes/DRHERMESREVIEWSHome/

sigi...@yahoo.com

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May 15, 2006, 5:07:18 AM5/15/06
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Dr Hermes wrote:

> Here's a Lovecraft story that I think does not quite get the attention
> it deserves.

I would agree!


> Lovecraft wrote this story in 1933 but took his time submitting to
> <i>WEIRD TALES</i> (he was not exactly your typical hard-working
> pulpster, banging out one story after another and immediately sending a
> rejected yarn off to a different editor)

De Camp says something like "if you were looking for a primer on how
/not/ to succeed as a professional writer, Lovecraft's career would be
an excellent place to start."


> We get Derby's life story and (to be frank) it sounds very much like
> Lovecraft writing his own idealized autobiography. An only child with a
> frail constitution, spoiled and coddled by a domineering mother, he was
> kept under close watch and never allowed independence. As a result, he
> developed a morbid taste for dark fantasy and showed great artistic
> potential as a poet. It was not until the death of his mother that he
> started to feel free enough to pursue his own inclinations. (Okay,
> Howard Philip, we get your point.)

While I completely agree with you, it's worth noting that the heroic
age of Weird Tales included not one, not two, but *three* fantasy
writers who grew up frail, overprotected, and with very strange
relationships with their mothers: Lovecraft, Robert E. Howard, and
Clark Ashton Smith.

There are differences, to be sure. Howard went from being a frail boy
to a great strapping hulk of a man, after a Teddy-Roosevelt-style
course of self-improvement. Clark Ashton Smith, like Lovecraft,
remained rail-thin all his life, but had an active (if not overactive)
sex life.

Still: while I don't doubt for a moment that Derby was indeed an
idealized self-image of the author, the stereotype -- the frail young
man of morbid tastes and poetic potential, who's a bit too close to Mom
-- seems to have been abroad and active in that American generation.


> The visitor, who stinks worse than the dumpster
> behind a fish market on a hot August day, hands Dan an almost illegible
> note.

IMS the pencil was jabbed right through the notepaper. The implication
being that the Thing's liquefying hands couldn't hold the paper any
longer.

It's those little details that do it, you know?


> Just the bare mention of this sort
> of thing seems much more unnerving to me than any detailed description
> of actually being present at the ceremony would be.

Firm agreement! Much of the strength of the Mythos stories is in what
they *don't* show.


[Sonia Greene]

> Maybe Lovecraft wasn't taking this story all that seriously. From all
> accounts, his marriage wasn't stormy or turbulent, just something that
> fizzled out and he remained on good terms with Sonia for years.

Well, maybe. This is still much debated. As you say, there was never
an open breach. The marriage was under a lot of economic stress,
Lovecraft hated New York City, and the two seem to have been better
friends than lovers. The breakup point came when HPL moved back to
Providence. His aunts, who had never cared for Sonia, made it clear
that she wasn't welcome. Sonia wouldn't go to Providence and HPL
wouldn't leave, so that was that.

But: he was oddly reluctant to divorce her. She had to push for some
time. And when he finally agreed, he then somehow "forgot" to file the
last court papers. As a result, the legal process was not completed,
and they were never officially divorced. Sonia moved to California and
remarried, unaware that she was formally still married to Lovecraft and
so committing bigamy. IMS it didn't come out until after his death,
ten years later.

So there's a case to be made that there was some real emotional tension
there.


> It's all conjecture, of course, but I've found that writers
> themselves aren't always aware of what inner demons they're getting rid
> of by putting them down on paper and writing "The End" to close things
> off.

This seems entirely plausible to me. Both that Lovecraft was
exorcising some demons from his married days, and that he wasn't aware
he was doing so.


> Oh well,
> sorcerors are well-known for their willingness to experiment and conduct
> ceremonies they may not enjoy themselves.

Dude. Ephraim was willing to shag a Deep One. After that, a bit of
nookie with a human of either gender would have to be homely and tame.


Doug M.

Jordan

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May 15, 2006, 10:49:34 AM5/15/06
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Dr. Hermes said:

> Aside from the bad reputation her home town has, Asenath is a peculiar little lass herself. She's very domineering and assertive, and quickly takes over Derby's life (he was the submissive type anyway). There are a lot of funny things about Asenath. She has a mocking grin and makes shocking remarks about topics a proper young lady of that time was not supposed to know about (pssst... s.e.x.) Most alarming, she has a hobby of staring intensely with her bulgy eyes at young women, giving them the strangest delusion of leaving their own bodies and looking at themselves from Asenath's viewpoint. <

Among the really creepy things _implied_ in this story is that Ephraim,
in Asenath's guise, has been keeping company with a whole elementary
and high school's full of geniuine innocent young girls. Who knows
what OTHER seeds of corruption he's sown, aside from those explicitly
mentioned in the story. And no, I don't think that Lovecraft wasn't
aware of these implications.

> Okay, by now veteran pulp readers have concluded that what we're dealing with here is Ephraim's mind or spirit inhabiting the body of his daughter by one of those unpleasantly fishy Innsmouth locals. But then we're working with information not available to the narrator or (sadly) to poor Edward Derby. <

Plus, I don't know how common this concept was, even in pulp fiction,
before this story made it popular.

> After Edward and Asenath are married, things get rapidly creepier. The new husband starts showing dramatic personality changes that come and go, he gets mired deeper and deeper into sordid mystical cults, and he's not only on the highway to Hell, he's in the passing lane.<

LOL!!! Good turn of phrase!

> While reading "The Horror At Red Hook" not long ago, I found it hard not to see some of the storyline there as reflecting Lovecraft's issues about his marriage to Sonia Greene. Here, his conflicted feelings seem even closer to the surface. Edward Derby is so obviously a surrogate of Lovecraft that he might as well have been named Philip H. Loveman or something. And the way he is drawn into a relationship and marriage by a strong-willed take-charge woman who has something alien and foreign in her background (well, Sonia was Jewish and Lovecraft did have quite a few prejudices) seems pretty blatant. Derby ends up losing his identity to his wife, becomes literally taken over by her and drawn into stuff he would rather not deal with, and it all ends tragically in both their deaths. <

Well, it _did_ occur to me, after I learned Lovecraft's biography, just
what Sonia thought of _this_ particular story. It's inconceivable that
she wouldn't have read it at some point, since she was herself a weird
fiction writer who had _met_ Lovecraft in the first place through their
shared literary interests.

> Maybe Lovecraft wasn't taking this story all that seriously. From all accounts, his marriage wasn't stormy or turbulent, just something that fizzled out and he remained on good terms with Sonia for years. Perhaps he wasn't even consciously exorcising his troubles by presenting his wedded episode in this manner, or maybe he was saying things here that
he was too repressed and gentlemanly to ever have come out said and
openly. It's all conjecture, of course, but I've found that writers
themselves aren't always aware of what inner demons they're getting rid
of by putting them down on paper and writing "The End" to close things
off. <

Well ... Lovecraft had problems in his marriage, but they weren't
sexual ones (according to Sonia). And Lovecraft and Greene remained
friends until the end, from what I heard. So at most I think that
Lovecraft was working out his darker emotions related to the marriage
in this story -- I don't think he really considered Sonia to be evil or
alien (except in the literal sense that she was of foreign extraction).

> There is one aspect of the story that I doubt Lovecraft realized himself. Derby and Asenath do get married and presumably have a wedding night on which events take place in the expected way. That is, they shag with fervor. Yet you remember that the bride is actually Ephraim's soul in his own daughter's body (perverse enough in its own way) Oh well, sorcerors are well-known for their willingness to experiment and conduct ceremonies they may not enjoy themselves. <

Oh, I think that Lovecraft _did_ realize how perverse the situation
was. Fully. I think that this was intended as part of the horror of
the situation. Remember, Ephraim had already pledged himself to
inhuman darkness from Beyond Space and Time; he had already murdered
his own daughter to obtain her body as a housing for his soul; who
_knows_ what he did in Asenath's body _before_ meeting Derby ... what's
a little transsexual sex compared to all that?

Sincerely Yours,
Jordan

Westprog

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May 15, 2006, 12:40:33 PM5/15/06
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<sigi...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1147684038....@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
...

> While I completely agree with you, it's worth noting that the heroic
> age of Weird Tales included not one, not two, but *three* fantasy
> writers who grew up frail, overprotected, and with very strange
> relationships with their mothers: Lovecraft, Robert E. Howard, and
> Clark Ashton Smith.

> There are differences, to be sure. Howard went from being a frail boy
> to a great strapping hulk of a man, after a Teddy-Roosevelt-style
> course of self-improvement. Clark Ashton Smith, like Lovecraft,
> remained rail-thin all his life, but had an active (if not overactive)
> sex life.

Howard's he-man appearance was only skin-deep. Killing yourself when your
mother dies is not a normal thing. I don't think Conan behaved like that.

J/

Westprog

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May 15, 2006, 12:41:41 PM5/15/06
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"Jordan" <JSBass...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1147704574....@j55g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
...

> Oh, I think that Lovecraft _did_ realize how perverse the situation
> was. Fully. I think that this was intended as part of the horror of
> the situation. Remember, Ephraim had already pledged himself to
> inhuman darkness from Beyond Space and Time; he had already murdered
> his own daughter to obtain her body as a housing for his soul; who
> _knows_ what he did in Asenath's body _before_ meeting Derby ... what's
> a little transsexual sex compared to all that?

It reminds me of a certain very famous SF writer. It's on the tip of my
tongue - no, it's gone.

J/


Dr Hermes

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May 15, 2006, 5:04:55 PM5/15/06
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Group: rec.arts.sf.written Date: Mon, May 15, 2006, 7:49am (EDT-3) From:
JSBass...@yahoo.com (Jordan)

Jordan wrote:
>Among the really creepy things _implied_ in this story is that Ephraim,
in Asenath's guise, has been keeping company with a whole elementary and
high school's full of geniuine innocent young girls. Who knows what
OTHER seeds of corruption he's sown, aside from those explicitly
mentioned in the story. And no, I don't think that Lovecraft wasn't
aware of these implications.

- Yikes. The implications there kinda slipped past me. I can see Asenath
being VERY popular at pajama parties and sleepovers. "You know, Anna,
she starts by telling you that she's just going to teach you how to kiss
a boy, so that you know how, but then all sorts of amazing things
happen... yes, I'd love to show you what she taught me." And there goes
a generation of Miskatonic coeds on the road to Sapphhic dissipation in
the ruins of Lesbos.

Also, I am certain that if there were Deep Ones, they would have their
own equivalent of today's Furries. There'd be Deep One porn. Look at
those gill slits -- they're wide open! You've never seen feet quite as
webbed as these? You say you like a little frog now and then?" Brrr,
never mind.

http://community.webtv.net/drhermes/DRHERMESREVIEWSHome/

Thomas Lindgren

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May 15, 2006, 5:49:17 PM5/15/06
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drhe...@webtv.net (Dr Hermes) writes:

> Also, I am certain that if there were Deep Ones, they would have their
> own equivalent of today's Furries. There'd be Deep One porn. Look at
> those gill slits -- they're wide open! You've never seen feet quite as
> webbed as these? You say you like a little frog now and then?" Brrr,
> never mind.

Well, batrachiophiles, if that's the word, might have some interfacing
problems. Let's see. The female sits down, whereafter one or more
males on, hug for dear life, and seminate at a discreet distance while
the female moves about at a stately pace.

Anything closer than a firm hug would, of course, be quite disgusting.
(Horrible, horrible mammals.) I wouldn't put it beyond Ephraim to have
debauched the Deep Ones, of course.

Best,
Thomas
--
Thomas Lindgren

Dr Hermes

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May 15, 2006, 6:05:36 PM5/15/06
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Group: rec.arts.sf.written Date: Mon, May 15, 2006, 9:49pm (EDT+4) From:
tho...@localhost.localdomain (Thomas Lindgren) wrote: [some clippage]

>one or more males... seminate at a discreet distance while the female


moves about at a stately pace.


So it's like a strip club?!

http://community.webtv.net/drhermes/DRHERMESREVIEWSHome/

Thomas Lindgren

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May 15, 2006, 6:21:20 PM5/15/06
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drhe...@webtv.net (Dr Hermes) writes:

>
>
> Group: rec.arts.sf.written Date: Mon, May 15, 2006, 9:49pm (EDT+4) From:
> tho...@localhost.localdomain (Thomas Lindgren) wrote: [some clippage]
>
> >one or more males... seminate at a discreet distance while the female
> moves about at a stately pace.
>
>
> So it's like a strip club?!

Well, perhaps one could put it like that; though for the purpose of
procreation, of course. Also, a lot of males can go for the very
special hug, the place of honour, so to speak, at once. Which one
probably won't see in the typical strip club.

William December Starr

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May 15, 2006, 9:28:39 PM5/15/06
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In article <1147704574....@j55g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"Jordan" <JSBass...@yahoo.com> said:

> Among the really creepy things _implied_ in this story is that
> Ephraim, in Asenath's guise, has been keeping company with a whole
> elementary and high school's full of geniuine innocent young
> girls. Who knows what OTHER seeds of corruption he's sown, aside
> from those explicitly mentioned in the story. And no, I don't
> think that Lovecraft wasn't aware of these implications.

That seems to assume that Innsmouth had (1) a normal public school
system and (2) any genuine innocent young girls. (And also that if
it did, Ephriam bothered to go through all the tedious fictions of
his masquerade, as opposed to staying in the house studying evil and
forging a high school transcript and diploma.)

--
William December Starr <wds...@panix.com>

William December Starr

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May 15, 2006, 9:32:34 PM5/15/06
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In article <23939-446...@storefull-3218.bay.webtv.net>,
drhe...@webtv.net (Dr Hermes) said:

> (May 14, 2006)
>
> SPOILERS AHEAD
> But honestly, the ending is obvious from early on...

One thing I can't tell from your summary is just what the titular
Thing _was_ and why it was providing, or at least messengering,
vital data to Mr. Upton. (My only guess is that it was <rot13>
gur trahvar Nfrangu, genccrq va jung jnf yrsg bs ure sngure'f
obql. </rot13>)

Joseph Michael Bay

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May 15, 2006, 9:46:25 PM5/15/06
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wds...@panix.com (William December Starr) writes:


>That seems to assume that Innsmouth had (1) a normal public school
>system and (2) any genuine innocent young girls. (And also that if
>it did, Ephriam bothered to go through all the tedious fictions of
>his masquerade, as opposed to staying in the house studying evil and
>forging a high school transcript and diploma.)

If you're studying evil and you stay out of high school you're
really failing to take advantage of a great resource.


--
"Congress shall make no law ... abridging the freedom of sXXXch, Joe
.. or the right of the people peaceably to XXXemble, and to Bay
peXXXion the government for a redress of grievances." Stanford
-- from the First Amendment to the US ConsXXXution University

Dr Hermes

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May 15, 2006, 9:47:07 PM5/15/06
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If I have done the Rot13 rightly so the following makes sense, the
dreadful visitor was Qreol'f zvaq genccrq va Nfrangu'f qrnq qrpnlvat
obql and it was bearing a note which explained the whole sordid affair.

http://community.webtv.net/drhermes/DRHERMESREVIEWSHome/

William December Starr

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May 15, 2006, 10:04:56 PM5/15/06
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In article <13075-446...@storefull-3213.bay.webtv.net>,
drhe...@webtv.net (Dr Hermes) said:

> If I have done the Rot13 rightly so the following makes sense, the
> dreadful visitor was Qreol'f zvaq genccrq va Nfrangu'f qrnq
> qrpnlvat obql and it was bearing a note which explained the whole
> sordid affair.

Yes you did, and thanks.

Dr Hermes

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May 15, 2006, 10:37:06 PM5/15/06
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Group: rec.arts.sf.written Date: Mon, May 15, 2006, 10:04pm From:
wds...@panix.com (William December Starr)

>Yes you did, and thanks.

- You're welcome. It's difficult to judge sometimes how much of a story
you can recount without ruining it for those who might want to read it,
and I try not to spoil things too much.

http://community.webtv.net/drhermes/DRHERMESREVIEWSHome/

Damien Sullivan

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May 16, 2006, 3:29:24 PM5/16/06
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jm...@Stanford.EDU (Joseph Michael Bay) wrote:
>wds...@panix.com (William December Starr) writes:
>
>
>>That seems to assume that Innsmouth had (1) a normal public school
>>system and (2) any genuine innocent young girls. (And also that if
>>it did, Ephriam bothered to go through all the tedious fictions of
>>his masquerade, as opposed to staying in the house studying evil and
>>forging a high school transcript and diploma.)
>
>If you're studying evil and you stay out of high school you're
>really failing to take advantage of a great resource.

And if you think slumber parties with teenage girls is going through
tedious fiction, you're not really taking advantage of being evil.

-xx- Damien X-)

Justin Fang

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May 16, 2006, 4:01:39 PM5/16/06
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In article <e4d96k$b05$2...@naig.caltech.edu>,

Damien Sullivan <pho...@ofb.net> wrote:
>jm...@Stanford.EDU (Joseph Michael Bay) wrote:
>>wds...@panix.com (William December Starr) writes:
>>>That seems to assume that Innsmouth had (1) a normal public school
>>>system and (2) any genuine innocent young girls. (And also that if
>>>it did, Ephriam bothered to go through all the tedious fictions of
>>>his masquerade, as opposed to staying in the house studying evil and
>>>forging a high school transcript and diploma.)

What would Asenath/Ephriam even need a transcript/diploma *for*?
Applying to R'lyeh University?

>>If you're studying evil and you stay out of high school you're
>>really failing to take advantage of a great resource.

>And if you think slumber parties with teenage girls is going through
>tedious fiction, you're not really taking advantage of being evil.

They had slumber parties in 193x?

--
Justin Fang (jus...@panix.com)

Lawrence Watt-Evans

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May 16, 2006, 4:29:26 PM5/16/06
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On 16 May 2006 16:01:39 -0400, jus...@panix.com (Justin Fang) wrote:

>They had slumber parties in 193x?

Yes.

We have my great-aunt's diary from her teen years in the 1890s. They
had slumber parties back then, too.


--
My webpage is at http://www.watt-evans.com

William December Starr

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May 30, 2006, 9:48:11 PM5/30/06
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In article <e4db33$jrs$1...@panix1.panix.com>,
jus...@panix.com (Justin Fang) said:

>>>> (And also that if it did, Ephriam bothered to go through all
>>>> the tedious fictions of his masquerade, as opposed to staying
>>>> in the house studying evil and forging a high school transcript

>>>> and diploma.) [wdstarr]

> What would Asenath/Ephriam even need a transcript/diploma *for*?
> Applying to R'lyeh University?

Dr Hermes' summation says:

While whizzing through classes at Miskatonic University, Derby
gets deeper into arcane matters and reads the three best-sellers
of the hellbound, THE BOOK OF EIBON, THE UNUSSPRES -- UNAUSPRESCK
-- UNAUSSPRECHLICHEN KULTEN and of course that beloved family
classic THE NECRONOMICON. After that, he's ripe for a malignant
influence in his life and sure enough, he meets a small dark coed
named Asenath Waite.

Which certainly seems to indicate that "she" had to go through the
admissions process at M.U.

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