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how long does it take a book to get available for the masses ?
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Lynn McGuire
Feb 10, 2012, 4:50:29 PM2/10/12
to
How long does it take a book to get available for
the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
http://varley.net/
available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
months ! Is this typical ?
Lynn
the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
http://varley.net/
available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
months ! Is this typical ?
Lynn
Howard Brazee
Feb 10, 2012, 4:57:17 PM2/10/12
to
On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 15:50:29 -0600, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com>
wrote:
That does seem rather quick.
--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."
- James Madison
wrote:
--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."
- James Madison
David Dyer-Bennet
Feb 10, 2012, 5:05:06 PM2/10/12
to
what milestone he just reached; just the fact that his editor told him
the publication date.
Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
don't do it casually.)
The sales cycle for books goes in seasons, roughly. There's a catalog,
and salesmen go out and try to sell those books. So something at the
end of the season still has to be committed when the catalog goes out
before the season. The publisher needs to be absolutely sure they'll be
able to publish on time -- mostly, they require a final manuscript in
hand before they really commit to a publication date (though they'll
talk about one earlier, approximately). The more copies planned (and
this is mentioned as an attempted breakout book), the more important it
is not to screw it up.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, dd...@dd-b.net; http://dd-b.net/
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info
Lynn McGuire
Feb 10, 2012, 5:07:39 PM2/10/12
to
On 2/10/2012 3:57 PM, Howard Brazee wrote:
> On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 15:50:29 -0600, Lynn McGuire<l...@winsim.com>
> wrote:
>
>> How long does it take a book to get available for
>> the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
>> about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
>> http://varley.net/
>> available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
>> months ! Is this typical ?
>>
>> Lynn
>>
>
> That does seem rather quick.
Wow, I was thinking that was rather long.
> On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 15:50:29 -0600, Lynn McGuire<l...@winsim.com>
> wrote:
>
>> How long does it take a book to get available for
>> the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
>> about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
>> http://varley.net/
>> available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
>> months ! Is this typical ?
>>
>> Lynn
>>
>
> That does seem rather quick.
Lynn
Lynn McGuire
Feb 10, 2012, 5:11:31 PM2/10/12
to
On 2/10/2012 4:05 PM, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:
> Lynn McGuire<l...@winsim.com> writes:
>
>> How long does it take a book to get available for
>> the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
>> about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
>> http://varley.net/
>> available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
>> months ! Is this typical ?
>
> The question is, eight months *from what*? I don't find any mention of
> what milestone he just reached; just the fact that his editor told him
> the publication date.
>
> Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
> impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
> if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
> don't do it casually.)
>
> The sales cycle for books goes in seasons, roughly. There's a catalog,
> and salesmen go out and try to sell those books. So something at the
> end of the season still has to be committed when the catalog goes out
> before the season. The publisher needs to be absolutely sure they'll be
> able to publish on time -- mostly, they require a final manuscript in
> hand before they really commit to a publication date (though they'll
> talk about one earlier, approximately). The more copies planned (and
> this is mentioned as an attempted breakout book), the more important it
> is not to screw it up.
I got his email about the submitted manuscript on Feb 2:
> Lynn McGuire<l...@winsim.com> writes:
>
>> How long does it take a book to get available for
>> the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
>> about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
>> http://varley.net/
>> available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
>> months ! Is this typical ?
>
> The question is, eight months *from what*? I don't find any mention of
> what milestone he just reached; just the fact that his editor told him
> the publication date.
>
> Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
> impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
> if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
> don't do it casually.)
>
> The sales cycle for books goes in seasons, roughly. There's a catalog,
> and salesmen go out and try to sell those books. So something at the
> end of the season still has to be committed when the catalog goes out
> before the season. The publisher needs to be absolutely sure they'll be
> able to publish on time -- mostly, they require a final manuscript in
> hand before they really commit to a publication date (though they'll
> talk about one earlier, approximately). The more copies planned (and
> this is mentioned as an attempted breakout book), the more important it
> is not to screw it up.
"We now have a publication date for my new novel, SLOW
APOCALYPSE. It will see print on September 4, 2012."
"This novel is my attempt to reach a larger audience,
which I will never do with hard science fiction like
my Gaea Trilogy or the Thunder and Lightning series.
As such, the book begins with a more-or-less science
fiction premise in a more-or-less present-day
setting, and proceeds from there."
"SLOW APOCALYPSE follows the story of a family in Los
Angeles as they attempt to deal with an energy crisis
of unprecedented proportions. What if, virtually
overnight, all the crude oil in the world suddenly
became unusable? Hint: It would mean a lot more than
just having to walk to work in the morning ..."
Lynn
Drak Bibliophile
Feb 10, 2012, 5:27:36 PM2/10/12
to
"David Dyer-Bennet" <dd...@dd-b.net> wrote in message
news:ylfk8vka...@dd-b.net...
I've heard that publishers have books scheduled up to a year in advance.
So if a book is given to the publisher in February 2012, then March 2013 may
be the earliest it can be scheduled.
--
*
Paul Howard (Alias Drak Bibliophile)
*
Sometimes The Dragon Wins!
*
--------
*
news:ylfk8vka...@dd-b.net...
So if a book is given to the publisher in February 2012, then March 2013 may
be the earliest it can be scheduled.
--
*
Paul Howard (Alias Drak Bibliophile)
*
Sometimes The Dragon Wins!
*
--------
*
tphile2
Feb 10, 2012, 6:34:33 PM2/10/12
to
On Feb 10, 4:27 pm, "Drak Bibliophile" <drakbiblioph...@comcast.net>
wrote:
> "David Dyer-Bennet" <d...@dd-b.net> wrote in message
> > David Dyer-Bennet, d...@dd-b.net;http://dd-b.net/
Going thru it for changes, deletions etc as well as ensuring there are
no forseeable legal issues.and so on. and it getting passed back and
forth from editor/publisher and author. We see examples of this
process in RAH Grumbles From The Grave.
and then there is the authors own problems and issues with the writing
process aka Martin and Game of Thrones books
wrote:
> "David Dyer-Bennet" <d...@dd-b.net> wrote in message
> > Snapshots:http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
> > Photos:http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
> > Dragaera:http://dragaera.info
>
> I've heard that publishers have books scheduled up to a year in advance.
>
> So if a book is given to the publisher in February 2012, then March 2013 may
> be the earliest it can be scheduled.
>
> --
> *
> Paul Howard (Alias Drak Bibliophile)
> *
> Sometimes The Dragon Wins!
> *
> --------
> *
Even when the book is submitted, there is still the editing process.
> > Photos:http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
> > Dragaera:http://dragaera.info
>
> I've heard that publishers have books scheduled up to a year in advance.
>
> So if a book is given to the publisher in February 2012, then March 2013 may
> be the earliest it can be scheduled.
>
> --
> *
> Paul Howard (Alias Drak Bibliophile)
> *
> Sometimes The Dragon Wins!
> *
> --------
> *
Going thru it for changes, deletions etc as well as ensuring there are
no forseeable legal issues.and so on. and it getting passed back and
forth from editor/publisher and author. We see examples of this
process in RAH Grumbles From The Grave.
and then there is the authors own problems and issues with the writing
process aka Martin and Game of Thrones books
Lynn McGuire
Feb 10, 2012, 7:09:59 PM2/10/12
to
Robert Carnegie
Feb 10, 2012, 7:14:52 PM2/10/12
to
On Feb 10, 10:05 pm, David Dyer-Bennet <d...@dd-b.net> wrote:
> Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> writes:
> > How long does it take a book to get available for
> > the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
> > about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
> > http://varley.net/
> > available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
> > months ! Is this typical ?
>
> The question is, eight months *from what*? I don't find any mention of
> what milestone he just reached; just the fact that his editor told him
> the publication date.
>
> Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
> impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
> if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
> don't do it casually.)
>
> The sales cycle for books goes in seasons, roughly. There's a catalog,
> and salesmen go out and try to sell those books. So something at the
> end of the season still has to be committed when the catalog goes out
> before the season. The publisher needs to be absolutely sure they'll be
> able to publish on time -- mostly, they require a final manuscript in
> hand before they really commit to a publication date (though they'll
> talk about one earlier, approximately). The more copies planned (and
> this is mentioned as an attempted breakout book), the more important it
> is not to screw it up.
I guess so, but surely if he just e-mailed it to everybody who wants
> Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> writes:
> > How long does it take a book to get available for
> > the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
> > about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
> > http://varley.net/
> > available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
> > months ! Is this typical ?
>
> The question is, eight months *from what*? I don't find any mention of
> what milestone he just reached; just the fact that his editor told him
> the publication date.
>
> Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
> impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
> if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
> don't do it casually.)
>
> The sales cycle for books goes in seasons, roughly. There's a catalog,
> and salesmen go out and try to sell those books. So something at the
> end of the season still has to be committed when the catalog goes out
> before the season. The publisher needs to be absolutely sure they'll be
> able to publish on time -- mostly, they require a final manuscript in
> hand before they really commit to a publication date (though they'll
> talk about one earlier, approximately). The more copies planned (and
> this is mentioned as an attempted breakout book), the more important it
> is not to screw it up.
to read it -
Brenda Clough
Feb 10, 2012, 7:15:35 PM2/10/12
to
reasons to speed up the publication process -- it can be very quick.
That's how ripped-from-the-headline quickbooks about, oh, the death of
Princess Diana can come out a couple weeks after the funeral. There
-is- a schedule -- and for a profit they're willing to cut in line.
However, this is discombobulating and costly, and would not happen
casually.
In the case of the Varley novel, he will perhaps have been in close
communication with the editor, who could then be fairly confident that
barring calamity the ms would indeed be delivered by a certain date.
With a good plot summary and title in hand, a slot in the calendar can
be reserved, cover art and design can proceed early and a marketing plan
laid out. The moment the ms arrives, into production it goes -- the
various editorial jobs can turn around in a month or two.
So I think this just shows that everything is working out according to plan.
Brenda
--
My latest novel SPEAK TO OUR DESIRES is available exclusively from Book
View Cafe.
http://www.bookviewcafe.com/index.php/Brenda-Clough/Novels/Speak-to-Our-Desires-Chapter-01
Kurt Busiek
Feb 10, 2012, 7:22:48 PM2/10/12
to
On 2012-02-10 22:05:06 +0000, David Dyer-Bennet <dd...@dd-b.net> said:
> Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> writes:
>
>> How long does it take a book to get available for
>> the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
>> about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
>> http://varley.net/
>> available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
>> months ! Is this typical ?
>
> The question is, eight months *from what*? I don't find any mention of
> what milestone he just reached; just the fact that his editor told him
> the publication date.
Scrolling down the blog, there's an entry from last October mentioning
> Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> writes:
>
>> How long does it take a book to get available for
>> the masses ? I note that John Varley is crowing
>> about his new book, _Slow_Apocalypse_, being
>> http://varley.net/
>> available on Sept 4, 2012. That is roughly eight
>> months ! Is this typical ?
>
> The question is, eight months *from what*? I don't find any mention of
> what milestone he just reached; just the fact that his editor told him
> the publication date.
that he'd finished the ms and turned it in earlier in the year, but
hadn't mentioned it because there was going to be some editing and
rewrites, and they're talking about a new title. At that point, he says
the book'll be out in October 2012, but he'll let people know an exact
date when he has one.
So it seems that it's over a year from delivery to publication, and
that he was doing exactly what he said he would -- letting people know
the exact date when he had one.
kdb
--
Visit http://www.busiek.com -- for all your Busiek needs!
Lynn McGuire
Feb 10, 2012, 7:30:55 PM2/10/12
to
a long time.
Lynn
David Goldfarb
Feb 11, 2012, 2:10:52 AM2/11/12
to
In article <ylfk8vka...@dd-b.net>,
--
David Goldfarb | "I am an atheist, myself. A simple faith, but
goldf...@gmail.com | a great comfort to me in these last days."
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu | -- Lois McMaster Bujold, _Shards of Honor_
David Dyer-Bennet <dd...@dd-b.net> wrote:
>Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>impossibly fast.
Unless your name is George R. R. Martin. (Or possibly Robert Jordan.)
>Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>impossibly fast.
--
David Goldfarb | "I am an atheist, myself. A simple faith, but
goldf...@gmail.com | a great comfort to me in these last days."
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu | -- Lois McMaster Bujold, _Shards of Honor_
David Goldfarb
Feb 11, 2012, 2:12:10 AM2/11/12
to
In article <jh4cs7$vn$1...@dont-email.me>, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> wrote:
>So it is a year to get it published. Wow, a long time.
That's pretty typical, actually, unless (as I said elsethread) your
>So it is a year to get it published. Wow, a long time.
name is George R. R. Martin. Sometimes it can be even longer.
--
David Goldfarb |From the fortune cookie file:
goldf...@gmail.com |"You have an ability to sense and know
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu | higher truth."
Lawrence Watt-Evans
Feb 11, 2012, 3:06:28 AM2/11/12
to
On 2012-02-11 02:12:10 -0500, David Goldfarb said:
> In article <jh4cs7$vn$1...@dont-email.me>, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> wrote:
>> So it is a year to get it published. Wow, a long time.
>
> That's pretty typical, actually, unless (as I said elsethread) your
> name is George R. R. Martin. Sometimes it can be even longer.
Yeah. My experience at Del Rey, Tor, and elsewhere was that normally
> In article <jh4cs7$vn$1...@dont-email.me>, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> wrote:
>> So it is a year to get it published. Wow, a long time.
>
> That's pretty typical, actually, unless (as I said elsethread) your
> name is George R. R. Martin. Sometimes it can be even longer.
it took ten to fourteen months from delivery to publication. Del Rey
contracts specified that they had two years from acceptance to publish;
at least once, near the end of my time there, they actually overran
that and had me sign a contract addendum. (If it hadn't been the third
book in a trilogy I might have let the contract lapse and taken the
book elsewhere.)
Small presses, especially in these days of ebooks and PoD, can
sometimes be significantly faster, but it varies.
--
Now available on Amazon or B&N: One-Eyed Jack.
Greg Kraft could see ghosts. That didn't mean he could stop them...
tphile2
Feb 11, 2012, 9:10:37 AM2/11/12
to
On Feb 10, 6:22 pm, Kurt Busiek <k...@busiek.com> wrote:
> Visithttp://www.busiek.com-- for all your Busiek needs!
What is it for the comic book industry? Given an ongoing regular
title by the big two and hopefully a stable creative team. Like a
Batman, Captain America title. From turning in the script to hitting
the stands. I assume the plotting and direction of the book has been
worked out by the editors for the next year or so.
What is it for the comic book industry? Given an ongoing regular
title by the big two and hopefully a stable creative team. Like a
Batman, Captain America title. From turning in the script to hitting
the stands. I assume the plotting and direction of the book has been
worked out by the editors for the next year or so.
Kurt Busiek
Feb 11, 2012, 1:08:26 PM2/11/12
to
On 2012-02-11 14:10:37 +0000, tphile2 <tph...@cableone.net> said:
> On Feb 10, 6:22 pm, Kurt Busiek <k...@busiek.com> wrote:
>> So it seems that it's over a year from delivery to publication, and
>> that he was doing exactly what he said he would -- letting people know
>> the exact date when he had one.
>
> On Feb 10, 6:22 pm, Kurt Busiek <k...@busiek.com> wrote:
>> So it seems that it's over a year from delivery to publication, and
>> that he was doing exactly what he said he would -- letting people know
>> the exact date when he had one.
>
> What is it for the comic book industry? Given an ongoing regular
> title by the big two and hopefully a stable creative team. Like a
> Batman, Captain America title. From turning in the script to hitting
> the stands. I assume the plotting and direction of the book has been
> worked out by the editors for the next year or so.
If it's been worked out "by the editors," it's not a book I'm working
> title by the big two and hopefully a stable creative team. Like a
> Batman, Captain America title. From turning in the script to hitting
> the stands. I assume the plotting and direction of the book has been
> worked out by the editors for the next year or so.
on, at least.
But from turning in the script to hitting the stands might be a matter
of three months or so -- used to be a lot longer, but digital prepress
has made the production end go faster, and with magazines, deadlines
tend to get squeezed. It can be less, too, if a book's running late.
But "turning in the script" isn't the equivalent of turning in the
manuscript, since it's not the end of the creators' work. The art,
coloring, lettering -- all that is still to be done.
Once the last of that is turned in, it's generally off to the printer
within a day or two, and may hit the stands as little as two weeks
later.
There was one book I worked on that the publisher ran so close to the
edge that by the time the last page was lettered and colored on a
Friday, it would be on the stands the following Thursday. That was
only possible then by paying large penalty fees to the printer, and
isn't possible at all now.
kdb
--
Visit http://www.busiek.com -- for all your Busiek needs!
Greg Goss
Feb 11, 2012, 2:41:28 PM2/11/12
to
David Dyer-Bennet <dd...@dd-b.net> wrote:
>Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
>if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
>don't do it casually.)
One of the Jean Auel stories was rushed for a particular year's
>Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
>if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
>don't do it casually.)
Christmas market. I forget if it was Mammoth Hunters or one of the
later ones. Apparently Auel was dealing with personal issues
(alcoholism was the rumour) and missed several deadlines.
The book was rushed to publication. I don't know if "over-long" and
"wandering all over the place" was a result of rushed editing or
author too big to allow proper editing.
Bookstores were provided with certificates to sell which would be
exchanged for copies of the book, hopefully before Christmas.
--
"Recessions catch what the auditors miss." (Galbraith)
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
Feb 11, 2012, 3:30:08 PM2/11/12
to
On 2/11/12 2:41 PM, Greg Goss wrote:
> David Dyer-Bennet<dd...@dd-b.net> wrote:
>
>> Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>> impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
>> if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
>> don't do it casually.)
>
> One of the Jean Auel stories was rushed for a particular year's
> Christmas market. I forget if it was Mammoth Hunters or one of the
> later ones. Apparently Auel was dealing with personal issues
> (alcoholism was the rumour) and missed several deadlines.
>
> The book was rushed to publication. I don't know if "over-long" and
> "wandering all over the place" was a result of rushed editing or
> author too big to allow proper editing.
Could be both, plus Auel's style.
> David Dyer-Bennet<dd...@dd-b.net> wrote:
>
>> Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>> impossibly fast. (For fiction; they *can* turn a book around in a month
>> if it's tremendously topical and will sell in huge quantities, but they
>> don't do it casually.)
>
> One of the Jean Auel stories was rushed for a particular year's
> Christmas market. I forget if it was Mammoth Hunters or one of the
> later ones. Apparently Auel was dealing with personal issues
> (alcoholism was the rumour) and missed several deadlines.
>
> The book was rushed to publication. I don't know if "over-long" and
> "wandering all over the place" was a result of rushed editing or
> author too big to allow proper editing.
_Phoenix Rising_ is coming out in October 2012, final draft turned in
in December 2011; and that's fast.
--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com
Howard Brazee
Feb 11, 2012, 5:48:52 PM2/11/12
to
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 07:10:52 GMT, gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu (David
Goldfarb) wrote:
>In article <ylfk8vka...@dd-b.net>,
>David Dyer-Bennet <dd...@dd-b.net> wrote:
>>Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>>impossibly fast.
>
>Unless your name is George R. R. Martin. (Or possibly Robert Jordan.)
Rowling beat that handily.
Goldfarb) wrote:
>In article <ylfk8vka...@dd-b.net>,
>David Dyer-Bennet <dd...@dd-b.net> wrote:
>>Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>>impossibly fast.
>
>Unless your name is George R. R. Martin. (Or possibly Robert Jordan.)
David Dyer-Bennet
Feb 11, 2012, 6:00:20 PM2/11/12
to
course drastically change how the timeline was constructed.
It does somehow need to be done in a way that still lets writers (and
musicians and song-writers and movie directors and actors and etc.) make
a living. Ideally it would let *more* of them make a living (and I care
about the writers most of all, personally).
And, with luck, he's going to sell enough of these that personally
emailing each copy would be a big pain :-) .
David Dyer-Bennet
Feb 11, 2012, 6:01:02 PM2/11/12
to
enough back to find that.
David Goldfarb
Feb 12, 2012, 3:43:01 AM2/12/12
to
In article <f1sdj7d1uv2kar4b1...@4ax.com>,
correctly he turned in the manuscript for _A Dance With Dragons_
in February (might have been late January) and the book came out
in mid-July. That's a five-month turnaround, and for a really long
book to boot.
--
David Goldfarb |"To summarize the summary of the summary:
goldf...@gmail.com | People are a problem."
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu | -- Douglas Adams
Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> wrote:
>On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 07:10:52 GMT, gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu (David
>Goldfarb) wrote:
>
>>In article <ylfk8vka...@dd-b.net>,
>>David Dyer-Bennet <dd...@dd-b.net> wrote:
>>>Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>>>impossibly fast.
>>
>>Unless your name is George R. R. Martin. (Or possibly Robert Jordan.)
>
>Rowling beat that handily.
Yes, and for that matter so did Martin last year -- if I recall
>On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 07:10:52 GMT, gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu (David
>Goldfarb) wrote:
>
>>In article <ylfk8vka...@dd-b.net>,
>>David Dyer-Bennet <dd...@dd-b.net> wrote:
>>>Eight months from first turning in a completed manuscript is unheard-of,
>>>impossibly fast.
>>
>>Unless your name is George R. R. Martin. (Or possibly Robert Jordan.)
>
>Rowling beat that handily.
correctly he turned in the manuscript for _A Dance With Dragons_
in February (might have been late January) and the book came out
in mid-July. That's a five-month turnaround, and for a really long
book to boot.
--
David Goldfarb |"To summarize the summary of the summary:
goldf...@gmail.com | People are a problem."
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu | -- Douglas Adams
Gene Wirchenko
Feb 12, 2012, 11:07:45 PM2/12/12
to
seem out of line.
Currently, I am technical reviewer for a computing book. I
started TRing in August. There is one chapter to go plus any rechecks
necessary.
I suspect that the delay for fiction is more marketing-driven.
Could someone in the know please comment on this?
Sincerely,
Gene Wirchenko
William December Starr
Feb 18, 2012, 2:57:02 AM2/18/12
to
In article <jh44mr$g4d$1...@dont-email.me>,
Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> said:
> I got [John Varley's] email about the submitted manuscript on Feb 2:
first word of the title would be very wrong.
-- wds
Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> said:
> I got [John Varley's] email about the submitted manuscript on Feb 2:
> "We now have a publication date for my new novel, SLOW
> APOCALYPSE. It will see print on September 4, 2012."
>
> "This novel is my attempt to reach a larger audience,
> which I will never do with hard science fiction like
> my Gaea Trilogy or the Thunder and Lightning series.
> As such, the book begins with a more-or-less science
> fiction premise in a more-or-less present-day
> setting, and proceeds from there."
>
> "SLOW APOCALYPSE follows the story of a family in Los
> Angeles as they attempt to deal with an energy crisis
> of unprecedented proportions. What if, virtually
> overnight, all the crude oil in the world suddenly
> became unusable? Hint: It would mean a lot more than
> just having to walk to work in the morning ..."
I think that if it really did happen "virtually overnight" then the
> APOCALYPSE. It will see print on September 4, 2012."
>
> "This novel is my attempt to reach a larger audience,
> which I will never do with hard science fiction like
> my Gaea Trilogy or the Thunder and Lightning series.
> As such, the book begins with a more-or-less science
> fiction premise in a more-or-less present-day
> setting, and proceeds from there."
>
> "SLOW APOCALYPSE follows the story of a family in Los
> Angeles as they attempt to deal with an energy crisis
> of unprecedented proportions. What if, virtually
> overnight, all the crude oil in the world suddenly
> became unusable? Hint: It would mean a lot more than
> just having to walk to work in the morning ..."
first word of the title would be very wrong.
-- wds
Robert Carnegie
Feb 18, 2012, 1:39:07 PM2/18/12
to
On Feb 18, 7:57 am, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
> In article <jh44mr$g4...@dont-email.me>,
Well, the price of olive oil would go up a /lot/. And alcohol
wouldn't be for drinking any more.
So what happened, some idiot start a war in the Middle East? Say -
when did he start writing this, anyway?
> In article <jh44mr$g4...@dont-email.me>,
wouldn't be for drinking any more.
So what happened, some idiot start a war in the Middle East? Say -
when did he start writing this, anyway?
Walter Bushell
Feb 18, 2012, 9:17:27 PM2/18/12
to
In article
<6ea5faea-e5d3-4d94...@t30g2000vbx.googlegroups.com>,
Airline travel would stop, the food system would collapse. Probably a
return to subsistence farming. Most long haul rail lines are not
electrified, probably we can't keep coal coming to the electric
generating plants anyway. Society breaks into chaos, with islands of
fascism.
--
It is the nature of the human species to reject what is true but unpleasant
and to embrace what is obviously false but comforting. -- H. L. Mencken
<6ea5faea-e5d3-4d94...@t30g2000vbx.googlegroups.com>,
return to subsistence farming. Most long haul rail lines are not
electrified, probably we can't keep coal coming to the electric
generating plants anyway. Society breaks into chaos, with islands of
fascism.
--
It is the nature of the human species to reject what is true but unpleasant
and to embrace what is obviously false but comforting. -- H. L. Mencken
Michael Stemper
Feb 20, 2012, 12:48:49 PM2/20/12
to
In article <proto-22CB39....@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> writes:
>In article <6ea5faea-e5d3-4d94...@t30g2000vbx.googlegroups.com>, Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> wrote:
>> On Feb 18, 7:57 am, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
>> > In article <jh44mr$g4...@dont-email.me>, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> said:
>> > > "SLOW APOCALYPSE follows the story of a family in Los
>> > > Angeles as they attempt to deal with an energy crisis
>> > > of unprecedented proportions. What if, virtually
>> > > overnight, all the crude oil in the world suddenly
>> > > became unusable? Hint: It would mean a lot more than
>> > > just having to walk to work in the morning ..."
>> >
>> > I think that if it really did happen "virtually overnight" then the
>> > first word of the title would be very wrong.
>>
>> Well, the price of olive oil would go up a /lot/. And alcohol
>> wouldn't be for drinking any more.
>>
>> So what happened, some idiot start a war in the Middle East? Say -
>> when did he start writing this, anyway?
>
>Airline travel would stop, the food system would collapse.
Considering the significant role played by fertilizers derived from
>In article <6ea5faea-e5d3-4d94...@t30g2000vbx.googlegroups.com>, Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> wrote:
>> On Feb 18, 7:57 am, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
>> > In article <jh44mr$g4...@dont-email.me>, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> said:
>> > > "SLOW APOCALYPSE follows the story of a family in Los
>> > > Angeles as they attempt to deal with an energy crisis
>> > > of unprecedented proportions. What if, virtually
>> > > overnight, all the crude oil in the world suddenly
>> > > became unusable? Hint: It would mean a lot more than
>> > > just having to walk to work in the morning ..."
>> >
>> > I think that if it really did happen "virtually overnight" then the
>> > first word of the title would be very wrong.
>>
>> Well, the price of olive oil would go up a /lot/. And alcohol
>> wouldn't be for drinking any more.
>>
>> So what happened, some idiot start a war in the Middle East? Say -
>> when did he start writing this, anyway?
>
>Airline travel would stop, the food system would collapse.
petroleum products, that's a safe bet.
> Most long haul rail lines are not
>electrified, probably we can't keep coal coming to the electric
>generating plants anyway.
they could continue to carry the coal.
> Society breaks into chaos, with islands of
>fascism.
--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>
You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him talk like Mr. Ed
by rubbing peanut butter on his gums.
Lynn McGuire
Feb 20, 2012, 12:53:29 PM2/20/12
to
oil. Since coal is merely another form of oil, the bug
might consume oil also. Nuclear and hydro power would
be the only power sources but since nuclear+hydro power
is only 30% of the USA electrical, not good !
Lynn
Lynn McGuire
Feb 20, 2012, 1:00:15 PM2/20/12
to
might consume "coal" also.
Lynn
James Nicoll
Feb 20, 2012, 1:03:14 PM2/20/12
to
hydro, a fact I suspect many Kunstler-esque Peak Oil DOOOOOOOM
authors are unaware of.
--
http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll
http://www.cafepress.com/jdnicoll (For all your "The problem with
defending the English language [...]" T-shirt, cup and tote-bag needs)
Robert Carnegie
Feb 20, 2012, 3:13:48 PM2/20/12
to
On Feb 20, 5:48 pm, mstem...@walkabout.empros.com (Michael Stemper)
wrote:
> In article <proto-22CB39.21172618022...@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> writes:
> > [If suddenly there isn't any oil]
That's if we get to keep coal... but what about baby oil? If there
is no baby oil... then no more babies!
wrote:
> In article <proto-22CB39.21172618022...@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> writes:
> > [If suddenly there isn't any oil]
> > Most long haul rail lines are not
> >electrified, probably we can't keep coal coming to the electric
> >generating plants anyway.
>
> One causes the other really. If the long-haul rail lines were electrified,
> they could continue to carry the coal.
Here's an idea. Trains that /run/ on coal.
> >electrified, probably we can't keep coal coming to the electric
> >generating plants anyway.
>
> One causes the other really. If the long-haul rail lines were electrified,
> they could continue to carry the coal.
That's if we get to keep coal... but what about baby oil? If there
is no baby oil... then no more babies!
Kurt Busiek
Feb 20, 2012, 3:36:48 PM2/20/12
to
Suzanne Blom
Feb 20, 2012, 4:29:57 PM2/20/12
to
> Sigh. Since coal is merely another form of oil, the bug
> might consume "coal" also.
>
Whichever way it goes, I doubt it in a novel with humans in it. Plants
> might consume "coal" also.
>
are, to that extent, "merely another form of", other living things as well.
Bill Snyder
Feb 20, 2012, 5:33:22 PM2/20/12
to
On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 12:36:48 -0800, Kurt Busiek <ku...@busiek.com>
wrote:
Now, wait, isn't this where we normally say, "If corn oil is made
from corn, and soy bean oil is made from soy beans, and vegetable
oil is made from vegetables, then baby oil . . .?"
--
Bill Snyder [This space unintentionally left blank]
wrote:
from corn, and soy bean oil is made from soy beans, and vegetable
oil is made from vegetables, then baby oil . . .?"
--
Bill Snyder [This space unintentionally left blank]
Walter Bushell
Feb 20, 2012, 6:57:18 PM2/20/12
to
In article <mci5k7hauu7r9boaf...@4ax.com>,
Vegetable oil is not made from vegetables. Rapeseed, cotton seed,
safflower seed oil etcetera are are made from seeds.
safflower seed oil etcetera are are made from seeds.
Bill Snyder
Feb 20, 2012, 7:03:30 PM2/20/12
to
On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 18:57:18 -0500, Walter Bushell
<pr...@panix.com> wrote:
>In article <mci5k7hauu7r9boaf...@4ax.com>,
> Bill Snyder <bsn...@airmail.net> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 12:36:48 -0800, Kurt Busiek <ku...@busiek.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On 2012-02-20 20:13:48 +0000, Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> said:
>> >
>> >> On Feb 20, 5:480m, mstem...@walkabout.empros.com (Michael Stemper)
<pr...@panix.com> wrote:
>In article <mci5k7hauu7r9boaf...@4ax.com>,
> Bill Snyder <bsn...@airmail.net> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 12:36:48 -0800, Kurt Busiek <ku...@busiek.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On 2012-02-20 20:13:48 +0000, Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> said:
>> >
>> >> wrote:
>> >>> In article <proto-22CB39.21172618022...@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <
>> >> pr...@panix.com> writes:
>> >>>> [If suddenly there isn't any oil]
>> >>>>
>> >>> In article <proto-22CB39.21172618022...@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <
>> >> pr...@panix.com> writes:
>> >>>> [If suddenly there isn't any oil]
>> >>>>
>ost long haul rail lines are not
>> >>>> electrified, probably we can't keep coal coming to the electric
>> >>>> generating plants anyway.
>> >>>
>> >>> One causes the other really. If the long-haul rail lines were electrified
>> >> ,
>> >>> they could continue to carry the coal.
>> >>
>> >> Here's an idea. Trains that /run/ on coal.
>> >>
>> >> That's if we get to keep coal... but what about baby oil? If there
>> >> is no baby oil... then no more babies!
>> >
>> >Plenty of babies. Just...squeaky babies.
>>
>> Now, wait, isn't this where we normally say, "If corn oil is made
>> from corn, and soy bean oil is made from soy beans, and vegetable
>> oil is made from vegetables, then baby oil . . .?"
>
>Vegetable oil is not made from vegetables. Rapeseed, cotton seed,
>safflower seed oil etcetera are are made from seeds.
There's one in every crowd. Ok, then, make it, "and whale oil is
>> >>>> electrified, probably we can't keep coal coming to the electric
>> >>>> generating plants anyway.
>> >>>
>> >>> One causes the other really. If the long-haul rail lines were electrified
>> >> ,
>> >>> they could continue to carry the coal.
>> >>
>> >> Here's an idea. Trains that /run/ on coal.
>> >>
>> >> That's if we get to keep coal... but what about baby oil? If there
>> >> is no baby oil... then no more babies!
>> >
>> >Plenty of babies. Just...squeaky babies.
>>
>> Now, wait, isn't this where we normally say, "If corn oil is made
>> from corn, and soy bean oil is made from soy beans, and vegetable
>> oil is made from vegetables, then baby oil . . .?"
>
>Vegetable oil is not made from vegetables. Rapeseed, cotton seed,
>safflower seed oil etcetera are are made from seeds.
made from whales. . ."
Kurt Busiek
Feb 20, 2012, 7:52:39 PM2/20/12
to
Walter Bushell
Feb 20, 2012, 8:01:44 PM2/20/12
to
In article <jhupsn$m71$2...@dont-email.me>, Kurt Busiek <ku...@busiek.com>
wrote:
> On 2012-02-21 00:03:30 +0000, Bill Snyder <bsn...@airmail.net> said:
>
> > On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 18:57:18 -0500, Walter Bushell
> > <pr...@panix.com> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <mci5k7hauu7r9boaf...@4ax.com>,
> >> Bill Snyder <bsn...@airmail.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 12:36:48 -0800, Kurt Busiek <ku...@busiek.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 2012-02-20 20:13:48 +0000, Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com>
> >>>> said:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Here's an idea. Trains that /run/ on coal.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> That's if we get to keep coal... but what about baby oil? If there
> >>>>> is no baby oil... then no more babies!
> >>>>
> >>>> Plenty of babies. Just...squeaky babies.
> >>>
> >>> Now, wait, isn't this where we normally say, "If corn oil is made
> >>> from corn, and soy bean oil is made from soy beans, and vegetable
> >>> oil is made from vegetables, then baby oil . . .?"
> >>
> >> Vegetable oil is not made from vegetables. Rapeseed, cotton seed,
> >> safflower seed oil etcetera are are made from seeds.
> >
> > There's one in every crowd. Ok, then, make it, "and whale oil is
> > made from whales. . ."
>
> Wait, wait. If you rape seed, you get baby oil?
>
> kdb
I canola answer that question.
> On 2012-02-21 00:03:30 +0000, Bill Snyder <bsn...@airmail.net> said:
>
> > On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 18:57:18 -0500, Walter Bushell
> > <pr...@panix.com> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <mci5k7hauu7r9boaf...@4ax.com>,
> >> Bill Snyder <bsn...@airmail.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 12:36:48 -0800, Kurt Busiek <ku...@busiek.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 2012-02-20 20:13:48 +0000, Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com>
> >>>> said:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Here's an idea. Trains that /run/ on coal.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> That's if we get to keep coal... but what about baby oil? If there
> >>>>> is no baby oil... then no more babies!
> >>>>
> >>>> Plenty of babies. Just...squeaky babies.
> >>>
> >>> Now, wait, isn't this where we normally say, "If corn oil is made
> >>> from corn, and soy bean oil is made from soy beans, and vegetable
> >>> oil is made from vegetables, then baby oil . . .?"
> >>
> >> Vegetable oil is not made from vegetables. Rapeseed, cotton seed,
> >> safflower seed oil etcetera are are made from seeds.
> >
> > There's one in every crowd. Ok, then, make it, "and whale oil is
> > made from whales. . ."
>
> Wait, wait. If you rape seed, you get baby oil?
>
> kdb
Kip Williams
Feb 20, 2012, 8:25:51 PM2/20/12
to
Kip W
rasfw
David DeLaney
Feb 20, 2012, 11:21:35 PM2/20/12
to
The capitalistic sin of Onan!
Dave "when it rains, it pours" DeLaney
--
\/David DeLaney posting from d...@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Dave "when it rains, it pours" DeLaney
--
\/David DeLaney posting from d...@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
David Dyer-Bennet
Feb 21, 2012, 11:52:04 AM2/21/12
to
you aren't going to tell me they're fakes!).
Mark Zenier
Feb 20, 2012, 1:59:15 PM2/20/12
to
In article <jhu1t2$3bi$1...@reader1.panix.com>,
The bugs would need to get a whole lot of hydrogen to produce anything
organic out of it.
>Canada, on the other hand, gets 60% of its electricity from
>hydro, a fact I suspect many Kunstler-esque Peak Oil DOOOOOOOM
>authors are unaware of.
Anybody done a "Half of Alberta is a poisoned wasteland" story, yet?
"The Largest Industrial [mumble] in the world!" as one of your
right-wing polis put it...
Mark Zenier mze...@eskimo.com
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)
James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
>In article <jhu1b5$g4b$1...@dont-email.me>, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> wrote:
...
>In article <jhu1b5$g4b$1...@dont-email.me>, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> wrote:
>>Varley's failure mechanism is a super bug that consumes
>>oil. Since coal is merely another form of oil, the bug
>>might consume oil also. Nuclear and hydro power would
>>be the only power sources but since nuclear+hydro power
>>is only 30% of the USA electrical, not good !
Coal = carbon + crap. (Local coal here is something like 8% sulfur).
>>oil. Since coal is merely another form of oil, the bug
>>might consume oil also. Nuclear and hydro power would
>>be the only power sources but since nuclear+hydro power
>>is only 30% of the USA electrical, not good !
The bugs would need to get a whole lot of hydrogen to produce anything
organic out of it.
>Canada, on the other hand, gets 60% of its electricity from
>hydro, a fact I suspect many Kunstler-esque Peak Oil DOOOOOOOM
>authors are unaware of.
"The Largest Industrial [mumble] in the world!" as one of your
right-wing polis put it...
Mark Zenier mze...@eskimo.com
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)
The Doctor
Feb 21, 2012, 12:37:33 PM2/21/12
to
In article <ji0kf...@enews1.newsguy.com>,
Alison Redford or Danielle Smith can write that novel.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doc...@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doc...@nl2k.ab.ca
God, Queen and country! Never Satan President Republic! Beware AntiChrist rising!
https://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k
Birthdate : 29 Jan 1969 Croydon, Surrey, UK
--
Member - Liberal International This is doc...@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doc...@nl2k.ab.ca
God, Queen and country! Never Satan President Republic! Beware AntiChrist rising!
https://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k
Birthdate : 29 Jan 1969 Croydon, Surrey, UK
James Nicoll
Feb 21, 2012, 2:42:03 PM2/21/12
to
on the oil sands?
Who the heck in SF writes about Alberta at all? Sean Stewart maybe
but who else?
You could cut and paste some of the details from GATEWAY and not be
too far off.
Juho Julkunen
Feb 23, 2012, 1:16:03 AM2/23/12
to
In article <jhu121$cp6$1...@dont-email.me>, mste...@walkabout.empros.com
says...
finally bothered to look into it, I didn't find any.
The only point where fossil fuels enter fertilizer manufacturing,
AFAICT, is Haber?Bosch process which typically uses natural gas as a
source of hydrogen. Other hydrogen sources can be substituted, however.
I am willing to be educated further on the subject.
--
Juho Julkunen
says...
>
> In article <proto-22CB39....@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> writes:
> >Airline travel would stop, the food system would collapse.
>
> Considering the significant role played by fertilizers derived from
> petroleum products, that's a safe bet.
I keep hearing about these petroleum-derived fertilizers, but when I
> In article <proto-22CB39....@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> writes:
> >Airline travel would stop, the food system would collapse.
>
> Considering the significant role played by fertilizers derived from
> petroleum products, that's a safe bet.
finally bothered to look into it, I didn't find any.
The only point where fossil fuels enter fertilizer manufacturing,
AFAICT, is Haber?Bosch process which typically uses natural gas as a
source of hydrogen. Other hydrogen sources can be substituted, however.
I am willing to be educated further on the subject.
--
Juho Julkunen
Robert Carnegie
Feb 23, 2012, 5:59:14 AM2/23/12
to
On Feb 23, 6:16 am, Juho Julkunen <giaot...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> In article <jhu121$cp...@dont-email.me>, mstem...@walkabout.empros.com
> says...
production, and of course while conceptually you can get hydrogen in
other ways, in practice nobody does.
The other use of fossil fuel I'm aware of is to power agricultural
machinery, and, of course, to ship the produce.
I found a newspaper article online examining the fossil fuel input
into some foodstuffs in the U.S. I'm not vouching for the numbers,
but here are some of them:
"According to researchers at the University of Michigan's Center for
Sustainable Agriculture, an average of more than 7 calories of fossil
fuel is burned up for every calorie of energy we get from our food.
This means that in eating my 400-calorie breakfast, I will, in effect,
have consumed 2,800 calories of fossil fuel energy. (Some researchers
claim the ratio is as high as 10 to 1.)
"Read more:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/03/26/ING3PHRU681.DTL&ao=all#ixzz1nCYGVta5
> In article <jhu121$cp...@dont-email.me>, mstem...@walkabout.empros.com
> says...
>
>
>
> > In article <proto-22CB39.21172618022...@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> writes:
> > >Airline travel would stop, the food system would collapse.
>
> > Considering the significant role played by fertilizers derived from
> > petroleum products, that's a safe bet.
>
> I keep hearing about these petroleum-derived fertilizers, but when I
> finally bothered to look into it, I didn't find any.
>
> The only point where fossil fuels enter fertilizer manufacturing,
> AFAICT, is Haber?Bosch process which typically uses natural gas as a
> source of hydrogen. Other hydrogen sources can be substituted, however.
>
> I am willing to be educated further on the subject.
I think the Haber-Bosch process is a big one, in the volume of
>
>
> > In article <proto-22CB39.21172618022...@news.panix.com>, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> writes:
> > >Airline travel would stop, the food system would collapse.
>
> > Considering the significant role played by fertilizers derived from
> > petroleum products, that's a safe bet.
>
> I keep hearing about these petroleum-derived fertilizers, but when I
> finally bothered to look into it, I didn't find any.
>
> The only point where fossil fuels enter fertilizer manufacturing,
> AFAICT, is Haber?Bosch process which typically uses natural gas as a
> source of hydrogen. Other hydrogen sources can be substituted, however.
>
> I am willing to be educated further on the subject.
production, and of course while conceptually you can get hydrogen in
other ways, in practice nobody does.
The other use of fossil fuel I'm aware of is to power agricultural
machinery, and, of course, to ship the produce.
I found a newspaper article online examining the fossil fuel input
into some foodstuffs in the U.S. I'm not vouching for the numbers,
but here are some of them:
"According to researchers at the University of Michigan's Center for
Sustainable Agriculture, an average of more than 7 calories of fossil
fuel is burned up for every calorie of energy we get from our food.
This means that in eating my 400-calorie breakfast, I will, in effect,
have consumed 2,800 calories of fossil fuel energy. (Some researchers
claim the ratio is as high as 10 to 1.)
"Read more:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/03/26/ING3PHRU681.DTL&ao=all#ixzz1nCYGVta5
Howard Brazee
Feb 23, 2012, 9:31:49 AM2/23/12
to
The length of time it takes for a book to come out reminds me of an
article I read about why Apple builds its devices in China. They
claim labor prices aren't the reason - the reason is that it doesn't
take long to create a new factory for a new product there.
--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."
- James Madison
article I read about why Apple builds its devices in China. They
claim labor prices aren't the reason - the reason is that it doesn't
take long to create a new factory for a new product there.
--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."
- James Madison
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
Feb 23, 2012, 10:11:51 AM2/23/12
to
On 2/23/12 9:31 AM, Howard Brazee wrote:
> The length of time it takes for a book to come out reminds me of an
> article I read about why Apple builds its devices in China. They
> claim labor prices aren't the reason - the reason is that it doesn't
> take long to create a new factory for a new product there.
>
Hm. That actually makes sense. If you want to build a new factory for a
> The length of time it takes for a book to come out reminds me of an
> article I read about why Apple builds its devices in China. They
> claim labor prices aren't the reason - the reason is that it doesn't
> take long to create a new factory for a new product there.
>
brand new product HERE, you'll probably spend five years just
negotiating for the right to build it.
--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com
Greg Goss
Feb 23, 2012, 10:50:53 PM2/23/12
to
That's why they renamed the non-poisonous version "Canada Oil" or
Canola.
--
"Recessions catch what the auditors miss." (Galbraith)
Canola.
--
"Recessions catch what the auditors miss." (Galbraith)
William December Starr
Feb 24, 2012, 11:01:08 PM2/24/12
to
In article <proto-22CB39....@news.panix.com>,
Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> said:
[ re "if the oil went away" ]
> Airline travel would stop, the food system would
> collapse. Probably a return to subsistence farming. Most long
> haul rail lines are not electrified, probably we can't keep
> coal coming to the electric generating plants anyway. Society
> breaks into chaos, with islands of fascism.
And slowly stabilizes into fascism with islands of chaos?
-- wds
Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> said:
[ re "if the oil went away" ]
> Airline travel would stop, the food system would
> collapse. Probably a return to subsistence farming. Most long
> haul rail lines are not electrified, probably we can't keep
> coal coming to the electric generating plants anyway. Society
> breaks into chaos, with islands of fascism.
-- wds
Greg Goss
Feb 26, 2012, 10:17:27 PM2/26/12
to
mze...@eskimo.com (Mark Zenier) wrote:
>Anybody done a "Half of Alberta is a poisoned wasteland" story, yet?
I own shares in a company that's steam-cleaning that sand as fast as
>Anybody done a "Half of Alberta is a poisoned wasteland" story, yet?
it can.
Matt Hughes
Feb 27, 2012, 2:04:48 PM2/27/12
to
On Feb 10, 10:50 pm, Lynn McGuire <l...@winsim.com> wrote:
> How long does it take a book to get available for
> the masses ?
My experience, with large publishers and small, has generally been
fifteen to eighteen months from turn-in. But I've had books held up
by publishers because of changed marketing strategies and (in one
case), lack of cash flow for more than a year past the originally
intended publication date.
Matt Hughes
BSP: my space opera, The Other, is shortlisted for the PKD Award
First chapter: http://www.archonate.com/other
> How long does it take a book to get available for
> the masses ?
My experience, with large publishers and small, has generally been
fifteen to eighteen months from turn-in. But I've had books held up
by publishers because of changed marketing strategies and (in one
case), lack of cash flow for more than a year past the originally
intended publication date.
Matt Hughes
BSP: my space opera, The Other, is shortlisted for the PKD Award
First chapter: http://www.archonate.com/other
Mark Zenier
Feb 27, 2012, 12:43:38 PM2/27/12
to
In article <9r0auf...@mid.individual.net>,
millions of acres of pristine beach front. ;-)
Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote:
>mze...@eskimo.com (Mark Zenier) wrote:
>
>>Anybody done a "Half of Alberta is a poisoned wasteland" story, yet?
>
>I own shares in a company that's steam-cleaning that sand as fast as
>it can.
And the clever plan is to pipe all the toxic stuff to Texas, leaving
>mze...@eskimo.com (Mark Zenier) wrote:
>
>>Anybody done a "Half of Alberta is a poisoned wasteland" story, yet?
>
>I own shares in a company that's steam-cleaning that sand as fast as
>it can.
millions of acres of pristine beach front. ;-)
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