Claudia Confirms She Quit
Jms at B5
To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was the one
who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my honesty
and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi Invasion,
containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank, without
equivocation, that she quit the show.
I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to apologize, but
I very much doubt it.
jms
(jms...@aol.com)
B5 Official Fan Club at:
http://www.thestation.com
Uncle Al
Jms at B5 wrote:
>
> To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was the one
> who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my honesty
> and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi Invasion,
> containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank, without
> equivocation, that she quit the show.
>
> I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to apologize, but
> I very much doubt it.
>
> jms
Judging from CC's recent made-for-TV movie effort, one suspects eating
crow is her new binge-purge dependency.
--
Uncle Al Schwartz
Uncl...@ix.netcom.com ("zero" before @)
http://pw2.netcom.com/~uncleal0/uncleal.htm
http://www.ultra.net.au/~wisby/uncleal.htm
http://www.guyy.demon.co.uk/uncleal/uncleal.htm
(Toxic URLs! Unsafe for children, Democrats, and most mammals)
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?" The Net!
Let's nuke it from orbit
On 9 May 1998 14:18:55 -0600, jms...@aol.com (Jms at B5) wrote:
>To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was the one
>who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my honesty
>and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi Invasion,
>containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank, without
>equivocation, that she quit the show.
>
>I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to apologize, but
>I very much doubt it.
>
>
> jms
>
I would back JMS on this - I saw her at a con where she said just
about the same thing. She claimed she decided not to go on the show
because she wasn't getting anything good to do, just docking ships and
notifying the captain. Too bad she didn't stick around - there
would've been plenty of good stuff for her in season 5 from what I can
tell.
Adam
Charles J. Walther
Jms at B5 wrote:
> To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was the one
> who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my honesty
> and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi Invasion,
> containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank, without
> equivocation, that she quit the show.
>
> I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to apologize, but
> I very much doubt it.
>
> jms
>
> (jms...@aol.com)
> B5 Official Fan Club at:
> http://www.thestation.com
I will not appologise to anyone regarding this. I read the original posts from
both you and CC. I know what you said, I know what she said, which is why I used
the, "truth is a three edge sword argument," in my original post. (Wonder where I
got that idea from?) My post was based on info available at the time from the
parties involved. If that infomration was reported in error by the parties
involved, that is beyond my control. We go with what we have and make our decisions
based on the infomration we have at the time. This is why the real truth is most
like given by historians and not by the parties there.
What I did shoot my mouth off about was the quality of the acting from the
replacement to CC. To be blunt, it is poor and shows no sign of getting better
IMHO. You didn't like what I said then, fine, your call and your show. Me, I have
watched acting both good and bad for nearly five decades. I think I know what good
acting is, and sorry the character of Lochley leaves me cold. The main quality of
acting I look for in any role is based on the ability of the actor to make me want
to suspend belief for duration of the show, and pretend to myself that this
character really is who and what they say they are. Peter and Andreas are masters
of this art, and should both have multiple Emmys.
Now if you think I am hard or a snob for not begging forgiveness, too bad. I meant
what I said then, and if presented with the same information then what I had now, I
most likely say the same thing.
CJW
Mac Breck
[The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set]
[Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set]
[Some characters may be displayed incorrectly]
So, Marcus dies to save her and she quits. We lose her and Marcus. My
question is Did she quit after the "Marcus sacrificing himself to save her"
part was filmed? If so, I consider that pretty low on her part.
Mac
FPP
In article <199805070647...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
jms...@aol.com (Jms at B5) wrote:
>To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was the one
>who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my honesty
>and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi Invasion,
>containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank, without
>equivocation, that she quit the show.
>
>I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to apologize, but
>I very much doubt it.
>
>
> jms
>
Actually, over on the other newsgroup, a few said that it made you "a
bigger dick than ever".
I'm *still* trying to figure out *that* one... but I'm pretty sure it
wasn't a compliment.
Bottom Feeders... Why do these people still amaze me?
FPP
Moyra J. Bligh
On 10 May 1998 14:32:54 -0600, "Mac Breck" <macb...@timesnet.net>
wrote:
> [The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set]
> [Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set]
> [Some characters may be displayed incorrectly]
>
>So, Marcus dies to save her and she quits. We lose her and Marcus. My
>question is Did she quit after the "Marcus sacrificing himself to save her"
>part was filmed? If so, I consider that pretty low on her part.
Everything that she did on B5 was in the can before she quit -
including "Thirdspace".
--
Moyra J. Bligh
mo...@interlog.com
newsgroups - alt.fan.mira-furlan
===============================================================
Proud member of: B.a.B.e. (Be active Be emancipated)
Women's Human Rights Group - http://www.interlog.com/~moyra/
Prilaz Gjure Dezelica 26/II, 10 000 Zagreb, Croatia
Tel/Fax: +385 1 484 6176, Tel: +385 1 484 6180
e-mail: BAB...@Zamir-zg.ztn.apc.org
===============================================================
Jms at B5
>My
>question is Did she quit after the "Marcus sacrificing himself to save her"
>part was filmed?
Yes. It was after all the season 4 episodes had been filmed.
Diane K De
>So, Marcus dies to save her and she quits. We lose her and Marcus. My
>question is Did she quit after the "Marcus sacrificing himself to save her"
>
The whole Claudia thing came down in July when the cast was at the Wolf
con--well after Season 4 was filmed.
Also, they filmed the Marcus stuff two ways.
DD
desert...@yahoo.com
> What I did shoot my mouth off about was the quality of the acting from the
> replacement to CC. To be blunt, it is poor and shows no sign of getting
better
> IMHO. You didn't like what I said then, fine, your call and your show. Me, I
have
> watched acting both good and bad for nearly five decades. I think I know
what good
> acting is, and sorry the character of Lochley leaves me cold. The main
quality of
> acting I look for in any role is based on the ability of the actor to make
me want
> to suspend belief for duration of the show, and pretend to myself that this
> character really is who and what they say they are. Peter and Andreas are
masters
> of this art, and should both have multiple Emmys.
> CJW
>
I have got to agree. Since she signed on as Lochley with B5, I have noticed
Tracy Scoggins in other tv shows. I've seen her as a Cardassian in DS9 and as
a reporter in Lois and Clark. She is the same character in every show she's
in. To put it bluntly, she can't act her way out of a paper bag. And she's
annoying to boot. She can't emote. If she were in some minor role, I
probably wouldn't notice her much, but as captain, I can't stand her.
Thus, do not consider this merely a "Lockley sux Ivanova rulez" post. Call it
a "I can't stand Tracy Scoggins" post. I wish to God someone else had been
cast, but oh well. The worst thing about it is that she'll be in some of the
movies. I wish she would go away.
Re: overall quality of S5: it hasn't been as good as the rest of the series,
but it's still better than most Trek, and most other tv out there. I am
inclined to think that most of the season's shortcomings have been due to the
compression of season 4 (which hurt season 4 as well as season 5-- I refer to
"Into the Fire" specifically, which would have worked much better as a
two-parter), which left season 4 super-intense and season 5 kind of slow in
comparison. JMS is promising to knock our socks off in the rest of the
series. My socks are ready and waiting. Let's have our Telepath War and
fight the Drahk and generally have some fighting going on. This peace stuff
is killing me.
:)
Babylon 5 is still good. It ain't season 3, but hey, what is?
Desert Rose
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
Plain and Simple Cronan
Jms at B5 wrote in message
<199805070647...@ladder03.news.aol.com>...
>To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was
>the one who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into
>question my honesty and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer
>issue of Sci Fi Invasion, containing an interview with Claudia wherein
>she confirms, point blank, without equivocation, that she quit the show.
>I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to
>apologize, but I very much doubt it.
I doubted your version of the story. Sounded vague, self-contradictory and
self-serving. I read the article.
I apologize.
Fair enough?
Doesn't excuse Season 5 though.
P&SC
...your doubt will be your undoing
WWS
Let's nuke it from orbit wrote:
I looked at your post 'cuz your name cracks me up.
I wrote this 'cuz it still cracks me up!
--
_______________________________________________________WWS______________________
I admit it.
Jen Funk
Hey, not to sound overtly crass, the whole time I compared this to
"Larry Linville Syndrome".
It is so common for a actor (who until the breakthrough role in question
lived in relative obscurity) to think so much of themsleves and jump off
a great successfull enemble show, and a role written for them, to
attempt to reap the rewards individually.
It usually fails to more than cause conersations how "Stupid " so-and
so was for leaving since thier big move usually results in little more
than television commercials or unnamed bit roles.
Shelly Long, David Caruso, Gary Burghoff (Radar), Rob Morrow, Markie
Post are just a few in this exclusive club that I can recall offhand,
(gee, I hope she at least gets a welcome basket from them... )
I predict George Clooney will be the next member, since he is leaving ER
this season.
jen
-------------------------------->
<--------------------------------
Jen Funk
Creative Director, Active, Inc.
http://www.activeinc.com
-------------------------------->
<--------------------------------
Let's nuke it from orbit
On 10 May 1998 14:32:54 -0600, "Mac Breck" <macb...@timesnet.net>
wrote:
> [The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set]
> [Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set]
> [Some characters may be displayed incorrectly]
>
>So, Marcus dies to save her and she quits. We lose her and Marcus. My
>question is Did she quit after the "Marcus sacrificing himself to save her"
>part was filmed? If so, I consider that pretty low on her part.
>
>Mac
>
I read an article with Jason Carter recently in which he was a tad
upset about his sacrifice for a character that left the show. He said
he thought they should've just had the alien machine not work for him,
and she dies and he lives. :P What I wonder is whether JMS will
ever use Marcus again? Since all that "if there is a season 5, you're
frozen" stuff was said by JMS, and there was/is a season 5, he could
just as well be frozen still.....
Adam
Hobbes
On 12 May 1998 desert...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> Babylon 5 is still good. It ain't season 3, but hey, what is?
>
> Desert Rose
>
That's part of the deal. Season 3 was the direct result of the slow
building process of Seasons 1-2. I mean, let's recap:
<spoiler alert>
<if that ain't enough....>
In Season 3 we finally had the breaking away from Earth--which was built
throughout Season 2 (actually since "Chrysalis"). We had the Rangers come
to the forefront (which were first introduced in "The Coming Of Shadows").
We had the answer to the "Babylon Squared" puzzle as well as the true
answer to Sinclair-Valen connection (in "War Without End"). Also, we
learned the truth about Vorlons ("The Fall of Night"), the real reasons
behind the Shadow War and the dissapearance of the Icarus ("In The Shadow
Of Z'ha'dum"). Add to all that: the death of Kosh, the dissapearance of
Garibaldi, Delenn becoming Entil'zha, the appearance of Anna Sheridan and
the mystery of what happened to John Sheridan at Z'ha'dum. ALL of this
packed into 22 episodes.
It's actually a miracle JMS didn't go insane.
Hobbes
Joe Othello
On 9 May 1998 14:18:55 -0600, jms...@aol.com (Jms at B5) wrote:
>To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was the one
>who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my honesty
>and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi Invasion,
>containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank, without
>equivocation, that she quit the show.
>
>I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to apologize, but
>I very much doubt it.
>
>
> jms
>
>(jms...@aol.com)
>B5 Official Fan Club at:
>http://www.thestation.com
Apologize for what? I haven't read the Interview so I don't know what
it says or in what context she was talking. I'm surprised you want to
be take your interpretation at face value, since people on this very
newsgroup that have read your interviews have taken you out of
context. For all we know, she could mean never being a part of Babylon
5 again.
A quick flash back some time ago to jog everyones memory, that you
posted notice of Claudia's departure instead of just letting it go.
You had to get in there and as a result start some pathetic little mud
slinging contest and who was in the right. If it was about money or
whatever, so what? She's an actress, there isn't a retirement plan,
not to mention the fact that in the case of women past a certain point
you are judge to be too old and the jobs start to dry up. Not the same
for a writer.
Mr. Straczynski are you so ignoble, that you have to bring this sort
of stuff up now after this issue has been dead for several month and
now demand an apology? Is it in your nature that you need to be proven
right at all costs and get that last word in regardless of how
transparent you become.?
Mr. Straczynski, you got your season five and a new series to work on
and you want to bring up Claudia's departure again? I mean a gentleman
would just let it go, since it can no longer prove anything. You
forget she signed a longer contract then away one else, she showed
true dedication in the four years she was on board. Why not respect
and remember that, instead of trying to prove yourself right.
For the first time, I hope another writer/producer comes along and
does a Science Fiction show that blows the Babylon series clean out of
the sky.
Joe Othello
"The best lack conviction, because they can't find a reason to save humanity. While the worst don't care for anything, but themselves."
-Othello
Laura M. Appelbaum
Let's nuke it from orbit wrote:
>
>
> >To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was the one
> >who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my honesty
> >and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi Invasion,
> >containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank, without
> >equivocation, that she quit the show.
> >
> >I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to apologize, but
> >I very much doubt it.
> >
> >
> > jms
> >
>
> about the same thing. She claimed she decided not to go on the show
> because she wasn't getting anything good to do, just docking ships and
> notifying the captain.
PUH-LEEESE!!! She's been bitching about this ever since the first
season, and it just never has been true. Over the course of the four
years she spent on B5, she had PLENTY of story-lines devoted to her
character. Nothing was ever enough for her, it seems, and her tendency
to lash out at people associated with B5 whenever it suits her goes back
all the way to the first season.
You know, some actors are "big" enough to share the stage with an
ensemble cast, and some just aren't. I've certainly learned alot about
the true "characters" of the various actors who've taken part in B5 just
from the ways in which they've handled being separated from the show. I
don't think I need to repeat again exactly who has demonstrated they are
"class acts" and who hasn't, but you CAN bet CC isn't in the first
category.
LMA
catm...@yahoo.com
> Shelly Long, David Caruso, Gary Burghoff (Radar), Rob Morrow, Markie
> Post are just a few in this exclusive club that I can recall offhand,
On the other hand, Clint Eastwood is doin' alright. To us it's a character;
to an actor, it's a job. Some of us stay in the same job for years, some of
us need to move on and try something new, whether we succeed or fall flat on
our faces.
Joan
(currently trying to straighten out nose bent from having fallen on it too
many times!)
Lyle Rooff
Joe Othello wrote in message <35589f7f...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>...
>A quick flash back some time ago to jog everyones memory, that you
>posted notice of Claudia's departure instead of just letting it go.
>You had to get in there and as a result start some pathetic little mud
>slinging contest and who was in the right.
He got in there because at the time, half the ng bandwidth was being taken
up by posts discussing rumors and innuendo about the terms of CC's
departure. Instead of quelling the heat, a number of folks began to call him
a liar, a provocation to which he certainly had a right to respond.
If it was about money or
>whatever, so what? She's an actress, there isn't a retirement plan,
>not to mention the fact that in the case of women past a certain point
>you are judge to be too old and the jobs start to dry up.
You're saying that she had to quit before she got too old? While I'll agree
that for actresses (and actors) whose only asset is an attractive face or
body, time takes its toll on employment possibilities, not so for those with
talent. "On Golden Pond" should have settled that issue for once and for
all. Hepburn and Fonda were both past the average age of entry into nursing
homes, and both received universal acclaim for their work there.
Not the same
>for a writer.
Tell that to the many writers who haven't been able to get subsequent works
published as they aged and reader preferences changed.
>
>Mr. Straczynski are you so ignoble, that you have to bring this sort
>of stuff up now after this issue has been dead for several month and
>now demand an apology?
My suspicion is that, even though the issue had died down on the ng for the
present, he's been getting private e-mail from CC devotees who won't take no
for an answer.
>
>For the first time, I hope another writer/producer comes along and
>does a Science Fiction show that blows the Babylon series clean out of
>the sky.
>
In other words, "I'm gonna take my electrons and go home!"
While we all (including JMS) want to see more and even better SF on
television, that seems a rather juvenile way of putting it.
Eliyahu Rooff
Fred Owens
catmommie wrote:
>> Shelly Long, David Caruso, Gary Burghoff (Radar), Rob Morrow, Markie
>> Post are just a few in this exclusive club that I can recall offhand,
>
>On the other hand, Clint Eastwood is doin' alright.
to hire him for the spaghetti westerns he is. Perhaps Caruso (who's new
show sucks as well) burghoff, and Morrow should go there, and wait. Shelly
Long and Markie Post should come ot Texas and wait with me ;-> Oops there I
go drooling again. Seriously. Shelly Long really upset some folks and made
some bad script choices, she is better than the things we have seen lately.
Markie Post should be on TV just because . . .
The Chief
If at first you do suceed, try not to look astonished.
Gordon B. Alley
In article <35589f7f...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>, joth...@ix.netcom.com
(Joe Othello) wrote:
>On 9 May 1998 14:18:55 -0600, jms...@aol.com (Jms at B5) wrote:
>
>>To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was
the one
>>who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my
honesty
>>and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi
Invasion,
>>containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank,
without
>>equivocation, that she quit the show.
>>
>>I would hope these same individuals would now have the spine to apologize, but
>>I very much doubt it.
>>
>>
>> jms
>>
>>(jms...@aol.com)
>>B5 Official Fan Club at:
>>http://www.thestation.com
>
>Apologize for what? I haven't read the Interview so I don't know what
>it says or in what context she was talking. I'm surprised you want to
>be take your interpretation at face value, since people on this very
>newsgroup that have read your interviews have taken you out of
>context. For all we know, she could mean never being a part of Babylon
>5 again.
Before you start making incendiary statements (below), maybe it would be
prudent to read the interview and find out what the context is. If you
are right, you could then come back to the newsgroup and triumphantly
debunk JMS' statement, rather than just assume he is misleading us and
running with that.
>A quick flash back some time ago to jog everyones memory, that you
>posted notice of Claudia's departure instead of just letting it go.
>You had to get in there and as a result start some pathetic little mud
>slinging contest and who was in the right. If it was about money or
>whatever, so what?
JMS has always kept us informed of the behind-the-scenes goings-on at B5.
The word would have gotten out pretty fast, anyway.
>She's an actress, there isn't a retirement plan,
>not to mention the fact that in the case of women past a certain point
>you are judge to be too old and the jobs start to dry up. Not the same
>for a writer.
That statement may be true, but I don't see what it has to do with this
situation. CC had a job, and then apparently decided she wanted to do
something else. From what I've heard and read, it happens all the time in
show business.
>Mr. Straczynski are you so ignoble, that you have to bring this sort
>of stuff up now after this issue has been dead for several month and
>now demand an apology? Is it in your nature that you need to be proven
>right at all costs and get that last word in regardless of how
>transparent you become.?
Well, I understand the new CC interview just came out recently. Since I
hadn't heard about it, I'm glad JMS informed the rest of us. I'm sure if
I had been attacked the way he has been on this issue, I wouldn't hesitate
to inform others when evidence supporting my position became available.
>Mr. Straczynski, you got your season five and a new series to work on
>and you want to bring up Claudia's departure again? I mean a gentleman
>would just let it go, since it can no longer prove anything.
JMS has been pretty quiet about the CC situation in recent months. It
looks to me like CC's interview brought up the subject again.
>You
>forget she signed a longer contract then away one else, she showed
>true dedication in the four years she was on board. Why not respect
>and remember that, instead of trying to prove yourself right.
One of a person's most valuable assets is his reputation for honesty and
fair play. JMS was dragged through the mud quite a bit over this issue
when it came down, so I don't begrudge him a chance to show that he was
being straight with us.
And did you notice that in the JMS message you quote, he didn't say
anything against Claudia Christian, merely stating that she had confirmed
his past statements? His statement was aimed at the people who seem to
always be ready to believe the worst about him, and who always give the
benefit of the doubt to his critics.
>For the first time, I hope another writer/producer comes along and
>does a Science Fiction show that blows the Babylon series clean out of
>the sky.
Gee, you seem to be taking this pretty hard.
I've been reading Joe's posts (and those of other fans) for over 6 years
(gee, has it been that long since he started talking up TWCNBN on
GEnie?). IMHO, the only times I've felt he has been less than forthcoming
with the fans was when he was protecting the story, or when he was
protecting his people by not releasing information that was none of our
business anyway. But he is human, and like most of us, when he feels he's
been betrayed by someone, he is liable to say something about it. :-)
--
--Gordon Alley <*>
<gal...@texas.net>
Arondell Hoch
Joe Othello wrote:
> Apologize for what? I haven't read the Interview so I don't know what
> it says or in what context she was talking. I'm surprised you want to
> be take your interpretation at face value, since people on this very
> newsgroup that have read your interviews have taken you out of
> context. For all we know, she could mean never being a part of Babylon
> 5 again.
>
I think he would like the apology for people essentially calling him a lair.
> A quick flash back some time ago to jog everyones memory, that you
> posted notice of Claudia's departure instead of just letting it go.
> You had to get in there and as a result start some pathetic little mud
> slinging contest and who was in the right. If it was about money or
> whatever, so what? She's an actress, there isn't a retirement plan,
> not to mention the fact that in the case of women past a certain point
> you are judge to be too old and the jobs start to dry up. Not the same
> for a writer.
I seem to recall her saying statements to the effect that she had been fired on a number of public appearances before even JMS knew
anything about it. Suddenly almost EVERYONE is asking questions and you expected him to just compleatly ignore it?
> Mr. Straczynski are you so ignoble, that you have to bring this sort
> of stuff up now after this issue has been dead for several month and
> now demand an apology? Is it in your nature that you need to be proven
> right at all costs and get that last word in regardless of how
> transparent you become.?
Would you rather a slander remain? Considering JMS has prided himself on his forthrightness with the fans of the show I would think he
would take an accusation of lying rather personally.
> Mr. Straczynski, you got your season five and a new series to work on
> and you want to bring up Claudia's departure again? I mean a gentleman
> would just let it go, since it can no longer prove anything.
It CAN prove that he is not a lair. I guess gentlemen allow people to get away with calling them liars. I guess that does NOT make me a
gentleman.
> For the first time, I hope another writer/producer comes along and
> does a Science Fiction show that blows the Babylon series clean out of
> the sky.
Actually for that matter so do I. I also suspect tha JMS would not mind either. In my opinion the more good TV science fiction the
better. No matter what the source.
Arondell Hoch
aron...@ix.netcom.com
FPP
>Apologize for what? I haven't read the Interview so I don't know what
>it says or in what context she was talking.
Nice of you to offer your opinion without even so much as reading what Joe
was responding to. It speaks volumes as to your credibility.
>A quick flash back some time ago to jog everyones memory, that you
>posted notice of Claudia's departure instead of just letting it go.
>You had to get in there and as a result start some pathetic little mud
>slinging contest and who was in the right.
So, if Joe posts his side of the story he's slinging mud... If he
doesn't, he's being evasive. It's kind of like the old "So, do you
*still* beat your wife?" question.
>Mr. Straczynski are you so ignoble, that you have to bring this sort
>of stuff up now after this issue has been dead for several month and
>now demand an apology?
And for the record, this entire thread was in response to Claudia's recent
interview. *That's* where the subject was brought up, and by whom.
Next time you might want to get at least *a few* of the facts straight
before going off half-cocked.
FPP
John W Kennedy
Joe Othello wrote:
> A quick flash back some time ago to jog everyones memory, that you
> posted notice of Claudia's departure instead of just letting it go.
> You had to get in there and as a result start some pathetic little mud
> slinging contest and who was in the right.
Wrong. Claudia made it public.
> Mr. Straczynski are you so ignoble, that you have to bring this sort
> of stuff up now after this issue has been dead for several month and
> now demand an apology?
He wants an apology from the people who called him a liar and were
proven wrong.
> You
> forget she signed a longer contract then away one else,
Huh?
> she showed
> true dedication in the four years she was on board.
True enough.
> Why not respect
> and remember that, instead of trying to prove yourself right.
Some people just don't like being accused in public of lying. They're
funny that way.
> For the first time, I hope another writer/producer comes along and
> does a Science Fiction show that blows the Babylon series clean out of
> the sky.
So does Joe.
mjohn...@yahoo.com
In article <199805070647...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
jms...@aol.com (Jms at B5) wrote:
>
> To those folks who have been ragging on me when I said that Claudia was the one
> who quit the show, that she was NOT fired, and calling into question my honesty
> and my forthrightness...I point you toward the Summer issue of Sci Fi Invasion,
> containing an interview with Claudia wherein she confirms, point blank, without
> equivocation, that she quit the show.
Yes, she does. However, in this same article, she says you didn't have a
storyline for the 5th season mapped out at that point. Is this true?
Matt Johnson
ChristyAG
>Yes, she does. However, in this same article, she says you didn't have a
>storyline for the 5th season mapped out at that point. Is this true?
>
>Matt Johnson
That seems like a rather odd comment to make.... I mean with the Arch and
all the comments JMS has made over and over again saying that yes season five
is part of the arch, that at this point we may not see it but that it is. I
mean dosen't that answer your questions???? From what I've read season five
has been at least basically planned all along the only thing that changed is
that when they wheren't sure if there would be a season five JMS moved four eps
into season four.... so yes that gave him some playing space to try a couple
of things whether or not those things where in the plan I have no idea, but I
believe that what going on with Michael was in the plann... the raiding party's
where in the plann, whats happening on Centari Prime was in the plan I'm sure
it all seems like it has to do with the arch... so well I'm not JMS but it
would be my guess from reading his comments that CC was wrong that JMS did know
what was gonna happen... maybe not every single little detail but it was
there.... ahhh well I talk to much...
mel
Mel's Place!!! at
http://members.aol.com/christyag
*******************************************
"my pulse... I used to have a pulse!!!! I'm turning BLUE!!!!!"
"you don't look bluish?"
Doc and Niko from "The Adventures of the Galaxy Rangers"
Joe Othello
On 12 May 1998 15:08:36 -0600, joth...@ix.netcom.com (Joe Othello)
wrote:
I'm replying to my own post since everyone who's replied to it has
said the same thing almost verbatim. So I'll just post it up here
where all can see. Since I don't wait to post similar replies...
I'd admit my edits were a bit rough, but I thought my point would get
through. I guess not. So I'll just be blantant...
He could of just said "For those still sending me mail about Claudia
depature read her interview in Sci-Fi Invasion, which should answer
your questions once and for all.". He was just waving a sign of "I was
right, I was right."
My general impression from the four seasons that she was on board was
that she did a bang up job, she was supportive of the show and she
enjoyed it very much (excluding the gripes that Ivanova wasn't being
developed as well as the Character could of been). I was trying to
say remember these things and just ignore the mud slinging since the
deal is done, nothing anyone can do to change it.
As for the money issue which I glazed over pretty quickly. However
some said that Older women are still getting jobs.. How many out of
the hundred or so of talented actress's who use to light up the
screen? We live in a society were youth and beauty are the standard
and age is a libelity against women. I'm wrong you say? How much do
most women spend trying to fight aging?
JMS welcomes competition? It would take the same miracle that got his
show produced not to mention being new and inovative, taking Science
Fiction in a diffrent direction. They're out there, they just have to
get a lucky break.
Oh and about the childish sounding comment... Better to be a child
then a sheep staying with the herd.
Joe
Scott Cantor
In article <6j8clt$fri$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, desert...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>I have got to agree. Since she signed on as Lochley with B5, I have noticed
>Tracy Scoggins in other tv shows. I've seen her as a Cardassian in DS9 and as
>a reporter in Lois and Clark. She is the same character in every show she's
>in. To put it bluntly, she can't act her way out of a paper bag. And she's
>annoying to boot. She can't emote. If she were in some minor role, I
>probably wouldn't notice her much, but as captain, I can't stand her.
>
>Thus, do not consider this merely a "Lockley sux Ivanova rulez" post. Call it
>a "I can't stand Tracy Scoggins" post. I wish to God someone else had been
>cast, but oh well. The worst thing about it is that she'll be in some of the
>movies. I wish she would go away.
For context, note that I haven't seen any of S5 yet, as I am watching the
first 4 for the first time on TNT and taping S5 for afterwards.
I first heard the rumor about Tracy Scoggins joining the cast last year as I
was first deciding to get into B5 when they reran. At the time, Highlander
was preparing to kick off its now infamous 6th season as a test run of
female immortals, once of which was rumored to be (and was in fact) Claudia.
After hearing that rumor, the one about Ms. Scoggins taking over as captain
on B5 started up. I thought it was quite ironic, since I was intrigued by
CC, and thought it absolutely hysterical, as a non-B5 fan at that point,
that the absolute worst actress I had ever seen was to be inflicted on my
friends, who did watch B5.
TS was, in addition to being a bad actress, part of some of the worst
Highlander episodes/movies ever done, including the blasphemous AAA sequence
of seasons 5-6, exceeded only by Highlander 2 in terms of damage to the
canon.
In other words, this woman seems to attract bad plotting, for some reason,
and when I did get into B5, I became very scared that S5 was going to suffer
for her presence. I'll have to reserve judgement on it, since I haven't
watched it yet, but this is not encouraging.
--------
Scott Cantor When you are courting a nice girl, an hour seems
cant...@osu.edu like a second. When you sit on a red-hot cinder,
Univ Tech Services a second seems like an hour. That's relativity.
The Ohio State Univ - Albert Einstein
WWS
ChristyAG wrote:
>
> >Yes, she does. However, in this same article, she says you didn't have a
> >storyline for the 5th season mapped out at that point. Is this true?
> >
> >Matt Johnson
>
> That seems like a rather odd comment to make.... I mean with the Arch and
> all the comments JMS has made over and over again saying that yes season five
> is part of the arch, that at this point we may not see it but that it is. I
> mean dosen't that answer your questions????
Well the Arch does answer your questions, but it's located in the_
Holo-Deck on the StarShip Enterprise.
--
_______________________________________________________WWS______________________
WWS
Scott Cantor wrote:
>
>
> I first heard the rumor about Tracy Scoggins joining the cast last year as I
> was first deciding to get into B5 when they reran. At the time, Highlander
> was preparing to kick off its now infamous 6th season as a test run of
> female immortals, once of which was rumored to be (and was in fact) Claudia.
>
> After hearing that rumor, the one about Ms. Scoggins taking over as captain
> on B5 started up. I thought it was quite ironic, since I was intrigued by
> CC, and thought it absolutely hysterical, as a non-B5 fan at that point,
> that the absolute worst actress I had ever seen was to be inflicted on my
> friends, who did watch B5.
>
> TS was, in addition to being a bad actress, part of some of the worst
> Highlander episodes/movies ever done, including the blasphemous AAA sequence
> of seasons 5-6, exceeded only by Highlander 2 in terms of damage to the
> canon.
>
> In other words, this woman seems to attract bad plotting, for some reason,
> and when I did get into B5, I became very scared that S5 was going to suffer
> for her presence. I'll have to reserve judgement on it, since I haven't
> watched it yet, but this is not encouraging.
>
--
_______________________________________________________WWS______________________
Why doesn't she wear that on the bridge?
ChristyAG
>>I have got to agree. Since she signed on as Lochley with B5, I have noticed
>>Tracy Scoggins in other tv shows. I've seen her as a Cardassian in DS9 and
>as
>>a reporter in Lois and Clark. She is the same character in every show she's
>>in. To put it bluntly, she can't act her way out of a paper bag.
WOW... I'm raher surprised to see this statement, I usually watch a little
of Lois and Clark cause it comes on right before B5. And I lost it laughing
histericly when I saw that Tracy Scoggins was on it and what her part was. My
first Opinion was "Wow that impresses me I don't think she could have played
two parts more differnt then Cat on L&C and Capt. Lochley on B5" I'm not
really sure that I understand why you say they are so similar, but I would LOVE
to hear your explanation. To me I saw Cat from L&C as a fluff headed call
girl ready to jump on what ever guy came along. The good captain is sooooooooo
far from that description it's not even funny, I mean Capt Lochley in my
opinion is stuff as nails and won't take anything from anyone, and would want
to kill someone like Cat on L&C.
Now I am not a big fan of Captain Lochley but I will reserve judgement
untill after season five is over. This is the way I look at it. When I first
saw Marcus I HATED his character I thought he was rightous and had too high of
an opinion of himself. I really didn't like him till I saw the ep "late
delivery from avalon" and heard him quoteing literature he won me over at that
point. And let me tell you when I saw "Endgame" the other night for the first
time and saw those ending scenes with him in medlab with Susan I must admit I
was crying. So from experiance I know that I can go from really hateing a
charactor on this show to being rather upset when I see them leave. JMS will
do that to us thats the way he writes I expect to have all my preordained
thought on whats going to happen in season five blow up in my face as we watch
the final episodes just cause JMS has done it time and time again before... I
mean who would have guess when we for the first time saw Londos Vision of his
own death who would have guessed that Londo and G'kar became friends and that
G'kar was not doing it out of hatred for a Centari??? So as I said I'm sure
JMS has a number of surprises up his sleeve, and I'm sure that some of those
surprises include Captain Lochley. So what is it that I'm trying to say???
Don't condem Lochley till we know all the facts... I for one feel sorry for her
charactor. I mean think about it sure she's a little stuffy, sure she doesn't
seem very personal, but to me it fits the charactor. Why??? Cause well I think
that If you where involved in a cival war and you fought for the loseing side
but afterwards you became a person of importance in what is the main structure
of the winning side... and you know that most under your comand probably don't
trust you??? well I think I would be the same way.
As I said I am not a big fan of Captain Lochley, I don't hate her she has
had her moments. I mean the scene where she is in security central talking
with Zach where she says she's going to Pound Michael... LOL well that scene is
hysterical :) ahhh well I've rambled on long enough...
WWS
ChristyAG wrote:
> WOW... I'm raher surprised to see this statement, I usually watch a little
> of Lois and Clark cause it comes on right before B5. And I lost it laughing
> histericly when I saw that Tracy Scoggins was on it and what her part was. My
> first Opinion was "Wow that impresses me I don't think she could have played
> two parts more differnt then Cat on L&C and Capt. Lochley on B5" I'm not
> really sure that I understand why you say they are so similar, but I would LOVE
> to hear your explanation. To me I saw Cat from L&C as a fluff headed call
> girl ready to jump on what ever guy came along. The good captain is sooooooooo
> far from that description it's not even funny, I mean Capt Lochley in my
> opinion is stuff as nails and won't take anything from anyone, and would want
> to kill someone like Cat on L&C.
But they aren't that different - Cat was *stuffed* as nails, too!
<*>
_o_/
(_\_,,
=/|/ (_
_________________(O)*__(O)______________________WWS_____________
"They killed Kosh!...You Bastards!..."
Lyta Alexander, "Walkabout"
Mac Breck
[The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set]
[Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set]
[Some characters may be displayed incorrectly]
I don't think I'd say that Tracy Scoggins can't act her way out of a paper
bag, however I don't think she's as good an actress as Claudia. I suppose
I'd characterize Ms. Scoggin's acting as "wooden" (I am making absolutely no
inference or comparison to Michael O'Hare's acting here. I liked his
acting.). I don't know if it's the material that's written for her, or her
acting ability, or lack of personality, but to me she's always dead serious,
almost always one-dimensional, and has absolutely NO sense of humor. I
don't know if it's the character or if it's her, but her portrayal of
Lochley is BORING. There's none of Ivanova's dry sense of humor (which I
really grew to love). It's as if Lochley always has her guard up, and will
not let anyone see anything else of her except the professional face she
puts on. Ivanova and Sheridan let their guard down and related to the other
characters on a level that was not "Captain" to the other character. It
seems that Lochley is "Captain" and nothing else.
There's a professional face that you have at work, and then there's a
personal face that you have with your friends. At work, you act like you're
at your job. When relating to your friends, you don't treat them like
they're part of your job. You treat them like they're your friends.
Lochley doesn't have this second dimension (at least in the episodes that
we've seen so far). The closest we've seen her get to this was Day of the
Dead, and that was with somebody who is not living.
If only CC hadn't fubared her (and Marcus') whole storyline.....
[expletive deleted] !!!
Mac
-----Original Message-----
From: ChristyAG <chri...@aol.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated
Date: Saturday, May 16, 1998 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: Claudia Confirms She Quit
>
>>>I have got to agree. Since she signed on as Lochley with B5, I have
noticed
>>>Tracy Scoggins in other tv shows. I've seen her as a Cardassian in DS9
and
>>as
>>>a reporter in Lois and Clark. She is the same character in every show
she's
>>>in. To put it bluntly, she can't act her way out of a paper bag.
>
> WOW... I'm raher surprised to see this statement, I usually watch a
little
>of Lois and Clark cause it comes on right before B5. And I lost it
laughing
>histericly when I saw that Tracy Scoggins was on it and what her part was.
My
>first Opinion was "Wow that impresses me I don't think she could have
played
>two parts more differnt then Cat on L&C and Capt. Lochley on B5" I'm not
>really sure that I understand why you say they are so similar, but I would
LOVE
>to hear your explanation. To me I saw Cat from L&C as a fluff headed call
>girl ready to jump on what ever guy came along. The good captain is
sooooooooo
>far from that description it's not even funny, I mean Capt Lochley in my
>opinion is stuff as nails and won't take anything from anyone, and would
want
>to kill someone like Cat on L&C.
Michael J. Hennebry
Is there a netiquette rule concerning speling flamez?
--
Mike henn...@plains.NoDak.edu
"I think, therefore it missed." -- The Doctor
Aubrey W. Adkins
Yes. The hotter the flame the better???
Aubrey
Kathryn Morton
ChristyAG wrote:
<CLIP>
> To me I saw Cat from L&C as a fluff headed call
> girl ready to jump on what ever guy came along. The good captain is sooooooooo
> far from that description it's not even funny, I mean Capt Lochley in my
> opinion is stuff as nails and won't take anything from anyone, and would want
> to kill someone like Cat on L&C.
Until I read this post, I didn't realise that Cat from L&C
WAS Lochley! And I was a devoted fan of L&C from day one.
I just didn't even recognise her. NOW, I'm impressed!
I don't know how anyone could say that the two characters
even exist in the same universe of being alike!
> When I first
> saw Marcus I HATED his character I thought he was rightous and had too high of
> an opinion of himself. <CLIP>
I'd like to confess that I HATED Bruce Boxleitner through
all of Season 2. Stupid grin.... Now, I feel as though I
can't live without him. Unfortunately, Lochley's only got
this one season to get in our good graces.
Good luck, Tracy.
--
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Kathryn L. Morton k.mo...@wayne.edu
Enrollment Systems
Wayne State University
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
All of us live in the gutter,
but some of us are looking at the stars.
-Oscar Wilde
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Aubrey W. Adkins
I hate to rain on your parade, but I have met more than one naval
officer in a long career who was even more one dimensional than the
Lockley character. Ivonava character was described as wooden and one
dimensional during the first season. I think Pat Tallman put it best in
a recent interview that you have to get used to the character in order
to have the confidence to tell the director that the character wouldn't
do this in this manner.
Aubrey
Jms at B5
But see, this is where I lose all respect for this kind of discussion. Just
about every time we introduce a new character, some folks say he or she is
wooden...then, later, this is a good character and THAT character is wooden.
But then there's that word, which is the core of it for me. These days,
over-acting is taken as acting...acting which has any kind of subtlety or
reality is termed "wooden" when it's simply not chewing up all the scenery in a
room.
On a strictly technical basis, my personal feeling is that Tracy is a better
performer than Claudia; that's a non-biased appraisal, said in the same way
that I can say that Andreas on a strictly technical basis is a better performer
than Stephen...though I'd rather not use such words as "better," which gets
into subjective appraisals, when some things -- extent of training, skills one
brings to the job -- can be more objectively explored.
Bottom line...Ivanova was a yeller; Lochley is a thinker. They are two
different characters. You can't look at Lochley and expect her to be the same
character or act like Ivanova. That would be an insult to both the character,
the actor and the audience.
WWS
Aubrey W. Adkins wrote:
> Yes. The hotter the flame the better???
> Aubrey
It's just like voting in Chicago. Flame early, and flame often.
_________________________________________________________WWS_________
ChristyAG
>I'd like to confess that I HATED Bruce Boxleitner through
>all of Season 2. Stupid grin.... Now, I feel as though I
>can't live without him. Unfortunately, Lochley's only got
>this one season to get in our good graces.
Well the grin from what I know wasn't Bruces addition it was part of the
story. Just like how Ivanova's never wearing her hair down (well almost never)
in season one was also part of the story. Sheridan when he first came on board
was trying his darndest to get to know his people and well to fit in, rember he
was replaceing Sinclair who was very well liked. there are alot of little
things like this in the show,that one of the reasons I like it so much. Such
as how long it took for anyone to call anyone else on the station by their
first name. How long it took for John and Delenn relationship to develope.
How Garibaldi had less and less hair as each season moved on.... well maybe
not. ;)
I just had to make a comment cause I'm a Huge fan of Bruce Boxleitner, and
I think he is a wonderful actor besides... I like his stupid Grin. ;)
mel
Hobbes
Well, part of the deal with Lochley is that she's the NEW person in B5.
She hasn't had the years that Ivanova had--so we don't know her that well.
We don't know what she likes, hates, what makes her tick or bitch. What
we know is only a small part of her life. Add to that her unusual
situation--being forced to work under someone that she was fighting
against--as well as her desire to not see B5 get in the middle of another
war (fat chance of THAT) and you have someone who isn't going to open up
to others--meaning, the viewers don't get to see who she really is.
Hobbes
Out somewhere planning my revenge on my professors (whahahahahaha)
Jurgen Patau
In article <199805182134...@ladder03.news.aol.com>, jms...@aol.com
says...
<snip-age>
>But then there's that word, which is the core of it for me. These days,
>over-acting is taken as acting...acting which has any kind of subtlety or
>reality is termed "wooden" when it's simply not chewing up all the scenery in
a
>room.
<endsnip-age>
One of the first things I noticed about B5 was its "sound". In some
way I can't precisely define, people speak differently than in other
shows I watch.
It range(d)(s) from Ivanova's poker-lipped rapid-fire sometimes monotonic
speech to Delenn's softly lilting tones to Sheridan's more expressive
tones to ... (I could name everyone) The result, for me, is that I don't
have the feeling there is a speech coach in the wings saying "say it this
way because that's canon on this show". Rather, I feel I'm hearing more
of the individual characteristics of the actors and actresses -- and thus
more of their personalities. I like some of these styles more than
others, but taken as a whole, they form, for me, one of the essential
differences between B5 and other shows.
This is something I notice every time I watch B5, and it's one of the
small things that contributes to my B5 "addiction". And I still
wonder if it's intentional, unintentional ... or just in my mind.
Mac Breck
[The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set]
[Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set]
[Some characters may be displayed incorrectly]
Thanks for the detailed reply. I *knew* I shouldn't have used that "W"
word. I hit the Send button too quickly.
Maybe I just like yellers with a sense of humor. Oh well...
Mac
-----Original Message-----
From: Jms at B5 <jms...@aol.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated
Date: Monday, May 18, 1998 7:37 PM
Subject: Re: Claudia Confirms She Quit
>But see, this is where I lose all respect for this kind of discussion.
Just
>about every time we introduce a new character, some folks say he or she is
>wooden...then, later, this is a good character and THAT character is
wooden.
>
>But then there's that word, which is the core of it for me. These days,
>over-acting is taken as acting...acting which has any kind of subtlety or
>reality is termed "wooden" when it's simply not chewing up all the scenery
in a
>room.
>
Bob Joesting
jms...@aol.com (Jms at B5) wrote:
>But see, this is where I lose all respect for this kind of discussion. Just
>about every time we introduce a new character, some folks say he or she is
>wooden...then, later, this is a good character and THAT character is wooden.
I think most of us who watch the show have the same
frustration with these bashers who seem to think that
any new character who isn't shooting or fighting must
be a wooden actor.
>But then there's that word, which is the core of it for me. These days,
>over-acting is taken as acting...acting which has any kind of subtlety or
>reality is termed "wooden" when it's simply not chewing up all the scenery in a
>room.
I have been around enough actors, amateur and
professional, who are wooden that I know wooden
when I see it. With very rare exceptions, for
perhaps a scene or with a bit part, I would be
hard pressed to call any acting on B5 "wooden."
Mostly what I see with a new character is the
first layer of a full complex person. I have
learned that I need to watch for several episodes
to see that there is a character reason behind
what may look like a over restrained portrayal.
[snip]
One of the problems with the show is that I find
the characters real enough that I care what happens
to them. This is a problem in that when one leaves,
for any reason, the replacement (or next new character)
has an impossible task. You can't replace a friend.
What does happen is that as I go through the loss of
one friend I slowly get to know a new friend. Those
who expect this to happen instantly must live very
shallow lives.
Bob Joesting <valen AT psicorps DOT com>
PsiCorps is your friend.
Trust the Corps.
Ann R
Well, I have to admit it: this is definitely de-lurking.
Joe: this is the first time you've heard from me. Unless of course you've
been wondering who that was yelling from time to time from several states
away. ( Like when I first saw "The Gathering" - I swear there is this one
hair on the back of my neck that still hasn't laid back down!
And when I finally found the show again and I got "Intersections" for my
trouble-- WOW, but not exactly "closure".
Now, I finally get to see what you did with the end of Season Four - what
a ride! Seriously, television never did that before, to me, that is.
BTW that was me yelling AGAIN when you started messing with Garibaldi
AGAIN-- I apologize for my language. And I LIKED the Season Five
'experiments'.)
On this topic:
Jms at B5 <jms...@aol.com> wrote in article
<199805182134...@ladder03.news.aol.com>...
> But see, this is where I lose all respect for this kind of discussion.
Just
> about every time we introduce a new character, some folks say he or she
is
> wooden...then, later, this is a good character and THAT character is
wooden.
Kind of like folks who say that a show not on the air yet is doomed or a
repeat of something else, just from reading the treatment?
> But then there's that word, which is the core of it for me. These days,
> over-acting is taken as acting...acting which has any kind of subtlety or
> reality is termed "wooden" when it's simply not chewing up all the
scenery in a
> room.
I frankly, haven't seen anything "wooden;" I happen to like "subtle" and
THAT I have seen a great deal of in B5. And "over-acting" is something I
personally hate. Not that I frown on the "chewing" of "scenery", but I get
bored with it easily, especially if I haven't come to identify with and
care for said "scenery" .
> On a strictly technical basis, my personal feeling is that Tracy is a
better
> performer than Claudia; that's a non-biased appraisal, said in the same
way
> that I can say that Andreas on a strictly technical basis is a better
performer
> than Stephen...though I'd rather not use such words as "better," which
gets
> into subjective appraisals, when some things -- extent of training,
skills one
> brings to the job -- can be more objectively explored.
While "extent of training, skills one brings to the job -- can be more
objectively explored", I have seen actors in the same program, learning the
same skills, full-tilt dedicated, but one just grabs the audience and the
other doesn't. There is an element of charisma and other unquantifiable
things at work. You know, you can 'hit your marks' and 'say your lines' and
..nothing.
That said, I don't know about the rest of the viewers, but I feel like I
just met Lochley. I don't know if I like her or not yet. I spent enough
time with Ivanova to miss her terribly. I have seen both actresses in other
roles now, so I know there is more to Claudia than she used portraying
Ivanova. I thought I didn't like Tracy's work; I am reconsidering. For me
the thing is the writing, acting, etc., are good enough that I care to
stick around to find out.
They are not the same role! That's important to say.
As for "reality", I don't expect to 'like' everyone there, same as I don't
expect to know the 'bad' guys by their dress, or theme music or even have
there be strictly 'bad' or 'good' people...
>
> Bottom line...Ivanova was a yeller; Lochley is a thinker. They are two
> different characters. You can't look at Lochley and expect her to be the
same
> character or act like Ivanova. That would be an insult to both the
character,
> the actor and the audience.
Amen, or saying that again might not be a bad idea.
> jms
>
> (jms...@aol.com)
> B5 Official Fan Club at:
> http://www.thestation.com
>
Thanks for the great entertainment.
Ann
B Poulton
>>about every time we introduce a new character, some folks say he or she is
>>wooden...then, later, this is a good character and THAT character is wooden.
>
>frustration with these bashers who seem to think that
>any new character who isn't shooting or fighting must
>be a wooden actor.
>
>>over-acting is taken as acting...acting which has any kind of subtlety or
>>reality is termed "wooden" when it's simply not chewing up all the scenery in a
>>room.
>
>professional, who are wooden that I know wooden
>when I see it. With very rare exceptions, for
>perhaps a scene or with a bit part, I would be
>hard pressed to call any acting on B5 "wooden."
>Mostly what I see with a new character is the
>first layer of a full complex person. I have
>learned that I need to watch for several episodes
>to see that there is a character reason behind
>what may look like a over restrained portrayal.
>
>[snip]
>
> One of the problems with the show is that I find
>the characters real enough that I care what happens
>to them. This is a problem in that when one leaves,
>for any reason, the replacement (or next new character)
>has an impossible task. You can't replace a friend.
>What does happen is that as I go through the loss of
>one friend I slowly get to know a new friend. Those
>who expect this to happen instantly must live very
>shallow lives.
>
>
>Bob Joesting <valen AT psicorps DOT com>
Pretty well my thoughts as well. I've finally had a chance to see the first
four episodes of S5. Like meeting a lot of people for the first time it's
too early to tell _what_ they're like. All I can see is the face they
present to the world. And whether or not TS is capable of presenting the
person hehind that 'face' remains to be seen as I quit watching L&C when
their romance started (see if you can find a copy of 'Man of Steel, Woman
of Kleenex' for the reason why). All I can say at this early point is that
I can't see any reason for me to _not_ like the character.
--
Bob Poulton *-------------------------------------------------------*
bpou...@vcn.bc.ca | |
| COFFEE.COM not found: A)dd more, R)eheat, F)reak out |
| |
*-------------------------------------------------------*
Laura M. Appelbaum
disappointed than I when Sinclair was written out at the end of the
first season. When Sheridan arrived, I could even tell at the time that
jms was purposefully setting him up to seem like a total jerk if judged
by the standards Sinclair set. I LIKED that. It made me angry with the
character, which in turn meant that from minute one, he came across as
REAL to me. I spent the first four or five weeks raging at the
television set "Sinclair would never do THAT" -- hell, I'm STILL doing
it! That doesn't mean that by the time Sheridan threw himself down the
pit on Z'ha'Dum I was cheering; heck no, I was CRYING. As you say, it
takes a long time to get to know someone especially if they are trying
to fill the role someone else you loved once held. It is the beauty and
power of jms' writing and the acting all around that I really feel like
Sinclair, Sheridan and the rest are people I know and care about, and
that doesn't happen over night.
Likewise now with Lochley. While I much prefered the way Christian
played the role of Ivanova in the first and second seasons -- something
after that point CHANGED that I know several of my friends have also
noticed, but none of us can put our finger on exactly WHAT -- it was
still hard to have the character leave. I didn't expect to fall in love
with Lochley right off the bat, and I haven't. But neither do I feel I
"know" her well enough to dislike her ... OR to say that the actress is
doing a bad job. It's kind of sad to see B5 fans of all people
demanding "instant gratification."
LMA
go...@compatible.com
In article <199805182134...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
> performer than Claudia; that's a non-biased appraisal, said in the same way
> that I can say that Andreas on a strictly technical basis is a better
performer
> than Stephen...though I'd rather not use such words as "better," which gets
> into subjective appraisals, when some things -- extent of training, skills
one
> brings to the job -- can be more objectively explored.
>
When comparing these actors (on a strictly technical or any other basis), I
feel it is important to note that this group is at the top of the heap. I
have always found that the quality of acting on Babylon 5 is far above the
average found on other shows. When comparing people at this level, there
isn't much to go on *besides* split hairs and opinions. I'd rather enjoy
the terrific ensemble acting than split hairs about who is better.
Steve Goldhaber
go...@compatible.com
L.Harbour
Laura M. Appelbaum wrote in message <356581...@mindspring.com>...
[...]
>OR to say that the actress is
>doing a bad job. It's kind of sad to see B5 fans of all people
>demanding "instant gratification."
As one whose only previous exposure to Tracy Scroggins was in "The New
Adventures of Lois and Clark", I've been very impressed with the *actress*
since day one. Captain Lockley, on the other hand, didn't appeal to me very
much at first until I figured out why.
As an American male (even one who considers himself enlightened), I was
subconsciously reacting negatively to her strong presence, leadership, and
no B.S. attitude. Hey, I can't help the early-1960s culture in which I was
raised. <shrug> Once I realized the reason for my discomfort, I was much
more easily able to accept and like her. She really is a dynamic character.
L.
Wombattt
I like your analysis. Personally, I think this is one of the
problems Garibaldi has with her (although, not because she
is a woman, but because of her hard-nosed attitude). But
then, Garibaldi has problems with anyone he does not know
well.
Granted, any authority figure he doesn't know or respect is
going to set off alarms in his mind.
As to Tracy, I enjoy her acting as well. I cannot say I warm
to her character of Lockley, but, that is because she is a
bit hard nosed in some of the strangest places. I don't
dislike Lochley, I just cannot warm to her yet. I think the
character is great though. I hated Cat in L&C:NAS. I thought
she was a charter member of the Shallow Slut of the Month
Club. I could NEVER think that about Lochley. JMS and Tracy
have crafted a character which exudes professionalism and
dignity. She exudes it right up to the point that I wanna
crack her over the head and say "Lighten up! Have some fun.
Be a pal."
Personally, I don't think she would do that. Yet. But, one
never knows what the future brings in character development.
--
WOMBAT! (aka- Field Admiral I. Mordant-Blake: jpdoyle)
** Visit the Stellar Operations Command Homepage *** "This
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