Unwonted Silence
David Friedman
have access to the net.
Just in case anyone wonders.
--
http://www.daviddfriedman.com/ http://daviddfriedman.blogspot.com/
Author of _Harald_, a fantasy without magic.
Published by Baen, in bookstores now
Joyce Reynolds-Ward
<dd...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> wrote:
>Tomorrow we go to Pennsic, so for about eight days thereafter I will not
>have access to the net.
>
>Just in case anyone wonders.
Given everything that's been going on of late (folks dying, bridges
collapsing), your note is appreciated.
jrw
Laurie Mann
wrote:
> Tomorrow we go to Pennsic, so for about eight days thereafter I will not
> have access to the net.
>
> Just in case anyone wonders.
I think you're going to spend some time trying to invent a non-
electric
air conditioner. It's going to be in the high 80s most of the next
week or
so in Western PA. Not much rain predicted.
Good luck.
David Friedman
Laurie Mann <ld...@dpsinfo.com> wrote:
It's called shade. What we get in exchange for not having much level
ground to camp on.
I spent yesterday setting up camp, then came back to Betty and the kids,
who are staying in Cleveland with her mother, yesterday evening. My
comment to our neighbors when I had finished was that it didn't matter
if the showers were hot or cold--the water would in any case come off me
steaming.
Until we break camp Saturday there isn't a lot more hard work to be
done. My "period furniture you can build in your dorm room" class is
held in the encampment next to ours, so I don't have to lug stuff up the
hill to the A&S area.
Dorothy J Heydt
The one time I went to Pennsic I sweltered for most of the week.
It was, I gather, a typical middle-of-the-continent summer, with
a humongous thunderstorm the night I arrived, and ghastly
humidity for several days thereafter as it all evaporated. I
went around in two layers of cotton gauze and sandals and a big
sun-hat, and I sweltered.
And then the weather changed, and fog rolled in and there were
very light showers from time to time. It was as if the Bay Area
weather had managed, although belatedly, to follow me east to
Pennsylvania. I still went around in my two layers of cotton
gauze and sandals and big hat, and I was perfectly comfortable.
And all the people from the East and Middle Kingdoms were bundled
up to their noses in their heavy wool cloaks, complaining about
how cold it was. These were people who were accustomed to having
it *snow* in the winter. I finally decided that they were not
merely adapted to the climate, but adapted to its regular
changes, and that while they could be comfortable in the cold in
the wintertime, by August they had all turned into lizards who
expected 90 Fahrenheit, and a sudden chill took them off guard.
In any case, David's been going to Pennsic forever, he
undoubtedly comes prepared for anything.
Dorothy J. Heydt
Albany, California
djh...@kithrup.com
David Harmon
<dd...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> wrote,
>Tomorrow we go to Pennsic, so for about eight days thereafter I will not
>have access to the net.
I suppose asking for a wireless hotspot would be
kinda missing the point of it.
David Friedman
David Harmon <sou...@netcom.com> wrote:
There is a place at Pennsic, or has been at past years, where you can
access the net; I forget what cute name they called it.
And I could access the net from my tent over the cell phone, as I'm
accessing it at the moment from my mother in law's house in Cleveland.
But that would be kinda missing the point of it.
Dorothy J Heydt
I think they actually do have wireless access at Pennsic now.
They've had a phone station for years, and Pennsic has its own
post office with its own postmark.
But David likes to go all-out for authenticity when he does the
SCA, so he would not USE a computer while at Pennsic, because
they hadn't been invented in the days of Cariadoc the
tenth-century Berber.
Examples: David is nearsighted. Once he gets his camp set up he
takes his glasses off. Cariadoc has never seen the stars as an
adult. Example: someone was commenting on rec.org.sca once that
there are limits to authenticity even for the prime authenticity
mavens, that even Cariadoc uses the porta-johns rather than
digging a latrine trench. And David posted that actually he
would prefer to dig a latrine trench if it were permitted, but he
knows it isn't.
Still, authenticity mavens in the SCA don't *generally* go as
far-out as a letter to an ACW group I once came across by
accident. The writer was remarking that many soldiers in the
real ACW became seriously ill from eating spoiled or badly
preserved food, and wanted to know about nineteenth-century
preserving recipes, and what were the symptoms of the various
enteritic diseases you could get from them? I sincerely hope he
was only planning to eat commercially cooked and preserved
food and *role-play* that he was suffering from enteritis or
botulism, but from the tone of the letter I wasn't sure.
Keith F. Lynch
> Laurie Mann <ld...@dpsinfo.com> wrote:
>> David Friedman <d...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> wrote:
>>> Tomorrow we go to Pennsic, so for about eight days thereafter I
>>> will not have access to the net.
What year is Pennsic supposed to be set in? Does it move up by one
year per year? When will it catch up to the Internet age? On that
year, will people log in to a simulated ARPAnet, using an ASR-33
teletype at 110 bps?
What are some other historic eras that are recreated? I know about
the Civil War reenactors, of course. Anything more recent?
Why is it always war? Why not reenact the industrial revolution, or
the early days of ham radio, fandom, or the net?
I just saw in the news that someone was arrested (!) for building
and peacefully operating a copy of the first submarine. It wasn't
explained what law he had broken.
>> I think you're going to spend some time trying to invent a non-
>> electric air conditioner.
Is invention allowed? Or just things that were actually known at
the time?
>> It's going to be in the high 80s most of the next week or so in
>> Western PA. Not much rain predicted.
Sounds pleasant enough to me.
> And all the people from the East and Middle Kingdoms were bundled
> up to their noses in their heavy wool cloaks, complaining about how
> cold it was. These were people who were accustomed to having it
> *snow* in the winter. I finally decided that they were not merely
> adapted to the climate, but adapted to its regular changes, and that
> while they could be comfortable in the cold in the wintertime, by
> August they had all turned into lizards who expected 90 Fahrenheit,
> and a sudden chill took them off guard.
I for one am not at all comfortable in the cold in the wintertime.
I can tolerate for short periods if I am physically active and very
heavily bundled up.
> In any case, David's been going to Pennsic forever, he undoubtedly
> comes prepared for anything.
If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the war.
--
Keith F. Lynch - http://keithlynch.net/
Please see http://keithlynch.net/email.html before emailing me.
Dorothy J Heydt
Keith F. Lynch <k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
>Dorothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
>> Laurie Mann <ld...@dpsinfo.com> wrote:
>>> David Friedman <d...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> wrote:
>>>> Tomorrow we go to Pennsic, so for about eight days thereafter I
>>>> will not have access to the net.
>
>What year is Pennsic supposed to be set in?
It isn't. It's year [current date minus May 1, 1966] of the
Current Middle Ages, and the period being emulated depends on the
individual. David's persona lives in the tenth century, mine in
the ninth; some people don't pick a century at all but choose on
a given day to dress for 14th century Burgundy, on another for
6th century Britain. The result is visually a colorful smorgasbord
of times and places.
>When will it catch up to the Internet age?
As mentioned upthread, there is a wireless connection available.
But Cariadoc will never use it, because it didn't exist in the
tenth century.
>What are some other historic eras that are recreated? I know about
>the Civil War reenactors, of course. Anything more recent?
Lots, probably. Note that the ACW re-enactors take a completely
different approach to date and time from the SCA's. They'll
decide on a given day to re-enact (modulo number of people
available, et cetera) a battle that took place on a certain date
in history, and if the battle was in 1863 you can't bring your
carefully constructed replica of a rifle that wasn't issued until
1864. They are *fanatical* about accuracy and authenticity,
which is perhaps not surprising considering that Matthew Brady
was hanging around taking *photographs* of that war.
>
>Why is it always war?
Well, the one year I went to Pennsic, the royalty of the East and
Middle Kingdoms, who are officially in charge (it says here),
decided not to have a war, they'd call it a tournament. The
fighting went on as usual. Fighting with sword and shield is the
primary athletic event in the SCA. I wrote a ballade about the
occasion, with which I will not bore you.
Why not reenact the industrial revolution, or
>the early days of ham radio, fandom, or the net?
I dunno, I suppose you could. The cutoff date for the SCA is
1600 CE.
>
>I just saw in the news that someone was arrested (!) for building
>and peacefully operating a copy of the first submarine. It wasn't
>explained what law he had broken.
>Is invention allowed? Or just things that were actually known at
>the time?
It's up to the individual; though if you're going to bring
post-period items to an event (the most common examples being ice
chests), it's considered polite to cover them with a tablecloth
or something so that their obvious plasticity doesn't show. On
the other hand, things that are *necessary*, like eyeglasses or
wheelchairs, are automatically exempt from the suggestion that
one make it look period or at least perioid.
>
>> And all the people from the East and Middle Kingdoms were bundled
>> up to their noses in their heavy wool cloaks, complaining about how
>> cold it was. These were people who were accustomed to having it
>> *snow* in the winter. I finally decided that they were not merely
>> adapted to the climate, but adapted to its regular changes, and that
>> while they could be comfortable in the cold in the wintertime, by
>> August they had all turned into lizards who expected 90 Fahrenheit,
>> and a sudden chill took them off guard.
>
>I for one am not at all comfortable in the cold in the wintertime.
>I can tolerate for short periods if I am physically active and very
>heavily bundled up.
Well, no, but you are (I'm told) extremely skinny. These guys
had much more meat (and fat) on their bones. Do you live
somewhere where it gets cold enough, e.g., to snow in the winter?
They did.
>> In any case, David's been going to Pennsic forever, he undoubtedly
>> comes prepared for anything.
>
>If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the war.
I suppose. Was that supposed to be clever, or something?
Keith F. Lynch
> Well, no, but you are (I'm told) extremely skinny.
You were told wrong. While I don't think I look at all fat, I am
technically overweight (BMI over 25).
There are photos of me and my apartment at http://KeithLynch.net/pics/
> Do you live somewhere where it gets cold enough, e.g., to snow in
> the winter?
Yes. It snows at least once nearly every winter here in Virginia.
There have been winters when there was snow or ice on the ground every
single day. (Yes, I know it's much colder and much snowier elsewhere.
Nobody needs to point this out to me.)
>> If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the war.
> I suppose. Was that supposed to be clever, or something?
Or something, I suppose.
mike weber
wrote:
>Is invention allowed? Or just things that were actually known at
>the time?
One of Brother David's "Honor Harrington" books mentions Honor's
favourite uncle who's active in the SCA, period weapons and all that
stuff, and, knowing her interest, makes her a gift of one of his
painstakingly-authentic reproductions - a model 1911 .45 Colt.
--
mike weber (fairp...@gmail.com)
============================
My Website: http://electronictiger.com
===================================
No use looking for the answers when the questions are in doubt - Fred leBlanc, "The Love of My Life"
Keith F. Lynch
> One of Brother David's "Honor Harrington" books mentions Honor's
> favourite uncle who's active in the SCA, period weapons and all that
> stuff, and, knowing her interest, makes her a gift of one of his
> painstakingly-authentic reproductions - a model 1911 .45 Colt.
Was this a mistake on the sender's part, or is the premise that
someday the SCA will regard the 20th century as "period"?
Paul Dormer
Lynch) wrote:
> What are some other historic eras that are recreated? I know
> aboutthe Civil War reenactors, of course. Anything more
> recent?
>
> Why is it always war? Why not reenact the industrial revolution,
> or the early days of ham radio, fandom, or the net?
There's a group in the UK called the Sealed Knot who do English Civil
War reenactment. (And I think they may have been going long before the
American Civil War reenactors.)
The humourist Miles Kington invented in one of his articles a group
called the Sealed Flask who go around recreating famous plagues and
epidemics.
Dorothy J Heydt
mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On 4 Aug 2007 11:19:40 -0400, "Keith F. Lynch" <k...@KeithLynch.net>
>wrote:
>
>>Is invention allowed? Or just things that were actually known at
>>the time?
>
>One of Brother David's "Honor Harrington" books mentions Honor's
>favourite uncle who's active in the SCA, period weapons and all that
>stuff, and, knowing her interest, makes her a gift of one of his
>painstakingly-authentic reproductions - a model 1911 .45 Colt.
Yes, Hal pointed that out to me. All I can say is, somebody
must've intervened and broken the 1600 cutoff date.
Dorothy J Heydt
Keith F. Lynch <k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
>> One of Brother David's "Honor Harrington" books mentions Honor's
>> favourite uncle who's active in the SCA, period weapons and all that
>> stuff, and, knowing her interest, makes her a gift of one of his
>> painstakingly-authentic reproductions - a model 1911 .45 Colt.
>
>Was this a mistake on the sender's part, or is the premise that
>someday the SCA will regard the 20th century as "period"?
No, Mike is describing his brother's text accurately. I think he
was trying to be funny. As I said elsethread, the SCA Board of
Directors is rather firm on the 1600 CE cutoff date, thought
there are people who will push the limits and come dressed for
the era of Charles II.
Dorothy J Heydt
Paul Dormer <p...@pauldormer.cix.co.uk> wrote:
>In article <f925ec$9p8$1...@panix2.panix.com>, k...@KeithLynch.net (Keith F.
>Lynch) wrote:
>
>> What are some other historic eras that are recreated? I know
>> aboutthe Civil War reenactors, of course. Anything more
>> recent?
>>
>> Why is it always war? Why not reenact the industrial revolution,
>> or the early days of ham radio, fandom, or the net?
>
>There's a group in the UK called the Sealed Knot who do English Civil
>War reenactment. (And I think they may have been going long before the
>American Civil War reenactors.)
Possibly. Certainly both lots date to well before the SCA's
founding date of 1966.
>
>The humourist Miles Kington invented in one of his articles a group
>called the Sealed Flask who go around recreating famous plagues and
>epidemics.
Like the ACW re-enactor I mentioned who wanted to be able to
recreate authentic enteritis from badly preserved food?
In fact, the UK has many little medieval re-enactment groups, and
I mean "little". The Norse Film and Pageant Society is fairly
good-sized, but there's a joke about a fellow who wrote sent mail
to some website that keeps track of such groups, to announce that
he and his friend had founded a new early-period re-enactment
group. A month later he wrote in to say that they had disbanded
and each was forming his own group. The SCA's Board and its
Governing Documents provide a force to keep the group more or
less in one piece, even with eighteen (I think) kingdoms at
present and members all over the globe. Some of the members
(David for instance) regret this and would rather have a
completely decentralized organization with small autonomous local
groups ... but I prefer things the way they are.
mike weber
wrote:
Well, the book is set about that far forward from our time...
mike weber
wrote:
>In article <e5h9b3tue7cfaqdr8...@4ax.com>,
Several hundred years in our future, 1600 might as well be the Garden
of Eden, but our time will be looked at as "classical times".
I can't say for sure, but i's almost bet that the SCA in Dave's
universe has a cutoff of the year zero AE.
Kip Williams
> mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> One of Brother David's "Honor Harrington" books mentions Honor's
>> favourite uncle who's active in the SCA, period weapons and all that
>> stuff, and, knowing her interest, makes her a gift of one of his
>> painstakingly-authentic reproductions - a model 1911 .45 Colt.
>
> Was this a mistake on the sender's part, or is the premise that
> someday the SCA will regard the 20th century as "period"?
I did a cartoon for a convention program book of a 30th century SCA
member, wearing an absurd hash of supposedly 20th century garments,
including a "Garfield" T-shirt depicting a dog.
Kip W
Dorothy J Heydt
Sounds like the costume Larry Niven wore to a Westercon
masquerade once upon a time. Miscellaneous garments of all sorts
kinds and eras, including a borrowed mailshirt. Title: Explosion
in a Time Machine.
Robert Sneddon
<djh...@kithrup.com> writes
>In fact, the UK has many little medieval re-enactment groups, and
>I mean "little". The Norse Film and Pageant Society is fairly
>good-sized,
There's a group who re-enact Roman-period 1st century British life,
with a small garrison of Roman troops.
Is this the earliest-period re-enactment group around?
--
To reply, my gmail address is nojay1 Robert Sneddon
mike weber
wrote:
>Sounds like the costume Larry Niven wore to a Westercon
>masquerade once upon a time. Miscellaneous garments of all sorts
>kinds and eras, including a borrowed mailshirt. Title: Explosion
>in a Time Machine.
He first wore that at (i think) the '67 Worldcon. Might have been
'66. He carried a joystick with a tangle of wires with neon bulb
blinkies in it hanging from it.. (Being long before LEDs and/or IC
chips, he had built some relaxation oscillators; i forget whether he
had a "B" supply battery or had some sort of DC-to-DC converter to get
the voltage...)
Joy Beeson
wrote:
> Why is it always war? Why not reenact the industrial revolution, or
> the early days of ham radio, fandom, or the net?
Today -- Saturday -- I walked downtown and took a tour of the Billy
Sunday home, escorted by Ma Sunday herself. I happened to mention it
during a fiftieth-reunion banquet this evening, and the woman across
from me said that she had once held that job.
The Sundays were quite wealthy by the way -- they not only had running
water, they had a bathtub *upstairs*.
Joy Beeson
--
joy beeson at comcast dot net
http://roughsewing.home.comcast.net/ -- sewing
http://n3f.home.comcast.net/ -- Writers' Exchange
The above message is a Usenet post.
I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.
Dorothy J Heydt
Robert Sneddon <fr...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>In message <JM9JJ...@kithrup.com>, Dorothy J Heydt
><djh...@kithrup.com> writes
>
>>In fact, the UK has many little medieval re-enactment groups, and
>>I mean "little". The Norse Film and Pageant Society is fairly
>>good-sized,
>
> There's a group who re-enact Roman-period 1st century British life,
>with a small garrison of Roman troops.
>
>http://www.romanarmy.net/
>
> Is this the earliest-period re-enactment group around?
I wouldn't count on it. There's probably some small group around
that does Babylonians or Sumerians, just for the hell of it.
Marilee J. Layman
wrote:
>Dorothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
>> Laurie Mann <ld...@dpsinfo.com> wrote:
>>> David Friedman <d...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> wrote:
>>>> Tomorrow we go to Pennsic, so for about eight days thereafter I
>>>> will not have access to the net.
>
>What year is Pennsic supposed to be set in? Does it move up by one
>year per year? When will it catch up to the Internet age? On that
>year, will people log in to a simulated ARPAnet, using an ASR-33
>teletype at 110 bps?
>
>What are some other historic eras that are recreated?
Besides Williamsburg?
Marilee J. Layman
http://mjlayman.livejournal.com
Paul Dormer
Heydt) wrote:
> >
> >The humourist Miles Kington invented in one of his articles a
> >group called the Sealed Flask who go around recreating famous
> > plagues and epidemics.
>
> Like the ACW re-enactor I mentioned who wanted to be able to
> recreate authentic enteritis from badly preserved food?
Kington also once suggested an "authentic performance" orchestra.
There has been a trend since the sixties (if not earlier) for musicians
to try and recreate earlier styles of playing, using instruments of the
period, or copies thereof. This group also wore clothing of the period,
lived of the wages of the period, and had all the diseases of the
period.
Joyce Reynolds-Ward
<mar...@mjlayman.com> wrote:
>On 4 Aug 2007 11:19:40 -0400, "Keith F. Lynch" <k...@KeithLynch.net>
>wrote:
>
>>Dorothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
>>> Laurie Mann <ld...@dpsinfo.com> wrote:
>>>> David Friedman <d...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> wrote:
>>>>> Tomorrow we go to Pennsic, so for about eight days thereafter I
>>>>> will not have access to the net.
>>
>>What year is Pennsic supposed to be set in? Does it move up by one
>>year per year? When will it catch up to the Internet age? On that
>>year, will people log in to a simulated ARPAnet, using an ASR-33
>>teletype at 110 bps?
>>
>>What are some other historic eras that are recreated?
>
>Besides Williamsburg?
Sturbridge Village? I think it's contemporary to Williamsberg,
though.
jrw
Dorothy J Heydt
There's an Anglo-Saxon village reconstruction in West Stowe,
Suffolk, UK,
and if I ever thought I'd travel again, I'd put it on the top of
my list (probably right after the Sutton Hoo parts of the British
Museum).
Kip Williams
> Sturbridge Village? I think it's contemporary to Williamsberg,
> though.
It covers the same historical era. It actually preceded Williamsburg in
idea and execution, and uses real buildings of the time instead of
modern recreations. (The things you learn when you move from Virginia
to Massachusetts!)
Kip W
Keith F. Lynch
>> someday the SCA will regard the 20th century as "period"?
> I did a cartoon for a convention program book of a 30th century SCA
> member, wearing an absurd hash of supposedly 20th century garments,
> including a "Garfield" T-shirt depicting a dog.
ObSF: Charlie Stross's _Glasshouse_, in which some people centuries
from now live in an enclave where they reenact 20th century life.
It's eligible for the Hugo.
I'm surprised Hugo voting is closed already. I thought Japan was
enamored of "just in time" everything, and that Hugo voting would be
closed only as the ceremony was beginning. The plaques on the awards
would then be inscribed by onstage industrial robots at the moment
each winner was announced.
I'm still hoping the award will consist of Godzilla biting the rocket.
Paul Dormer
Lynch) wrote:
> ObSF: Charlie Stross's _Glasshouse_, in which some people
> centuries from now live in an enclave where they reenact
> 20th century life. It's eligible for the Hugo.
>
Not only eligible, but nominated, which isn't quite the same thing.
Lots of works were eligible.
>
> I'm surprised Hugo voting is closed already. I thought Japan was
> enamored of "just in time" everything, and that Hugo voting would
> be closed only as the ceremony was beginning. The plaques
> on the awards would then be inscribed by onstage industrial robots
> at the moment each winner was announced.
>
I get the impression that Hugo voting is actually being run in the US
this year. Also, I discovered when I did vote, that the on-line ballot
wouldn't work with my firewall. Had an exchange of e-mails which
sorted that out, which was just in time.
mike weber
wrote:
There's "Lincoln's New Salem" - or was.
Marilee J. Layman
wrote:
>In article <$LZSQqHE...@nospam.demon.co.uk>,
To some extent, many Native American powwows are reenactments of long
ago.
SAMK
Our local orchestra does "historically informed" performances, where
they will include a period instrument and period styles for some of
the pieces. It turns out quite interesting.
SAMK
Paul Dormer
dima...@comcast.net (SAMK) wrote:
>
> Our local orchestra does "historically informed" performances,
> where they will include a period instrument and period styles
> for some of the pieces. It turns out quite interesting.
>
Well, living close to London, I have a lot of local orchestras, several
of which specialise in period performance. (It's amusing that you
often see the same players in the period bands also playing in the
contemporary music ensembles.) A few years ago, the Orchestra of the
Age of Enlightenment did all nine Beethoven symphonies over a season,
and a couple of years later, all five Beethoven piano concertos. The
Beethoven 5th was the best performance I'd ever heard of it.
But "interesting" is a double edged term. About 20 years ago, the BBC
Proms got a period orchestra for its annual performance of Beethoven's
9th. There is an elaborate sole for the 4th horn in the third movement.
Some people have suggested it was written for an early valve horn, but
the conductor, Sir Roger Norrington, is of the view that it can be
performed on the natural horn, as horn manuals of the day show.
However, when it came to the performance, the solo turned into a
horrible mess of fart sounds.
Kip Williams
> Well, living close to London, I have a lot of local orchestras, several
> of which specialise in period performance. (It's amusing that you
> often see the same players in the period bands also playing in the
> contemporary music ensembles.) A few years ago, the Orchestra of the
> Age of Enlightenment did all nine Beethoven symphonies over a season,
> and a couple of years later, all five Beethoven piano concertos. The
> Beethoven 5th was the best performance I'd ever heard of it.
I take it you mean the symphony, as the concerto has its own nickname.
I guess my favorite performance of that is Glenn Gould's.
Kip W
Paul Dormer
ki...@comcast.net (Kip Williams) wrote:
Yes, the symphony, sorry.
Don't know the Gould version. There was a documentary on TV many years
ago about the Emperor which stated that there's a misprint in the
printed version of the slow movement, and it should be played twice as
fast as it tended to be (at the time of the documentary - more recent
performances often take this into account). One of the things they
pointed out that as violin bows were shorter in Beethoven's time, it
would have been impossible to play it that slowly.
smg...@yahoo.com
> In article <f925ec$9p...@panix2.panix.com>,
> Keith F. Lynch <k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
> >the Civil War reenactors, of course. Anything more recent?
>
> different approach to date and time from the SCA's. They'll
> decide on a given day to re-enact (modulo number of people
> available, et cetera) a battle that took place on a certain date
> in history, and if the battle was in 1863 you can't bring your
> carefully constructed replica of a rifle that wasn't issued until
> 1864. They are *fanatical* about accuracy and authenticity,
> which is perhaps not surprising considering that Matthew Brady
> was hanging around taking *photographs* of that war.
Quibble: they are (to the best of my knowledge) fanatical about
recreating the warlike aspects of the era, including the men's
uniforms. However, the women's outfits are often dreadful (and no one
seems to care) and in some areas their idea of suitable music and
dancing has more in common with the 1970s than the 1860s. I get hired
to teach reenactors periodically, and it's quite an experience.
> >Why is it always war?
>
> Well, the one year I went to Pennsic, the royalty of the East and
> Middle Kingdoms, who are officially in charge (it says here),
> decided not to have a war, they'd call it a tournament. The
> fighting went on as usual. Fighting with sword and shield is the
> primary athletic event in the SCA. I wrote a ballade about the
> occasion, with which I will not bore you.
>
> > Why not reenact the industrial revolution, or
> >the early days of ham radio, fandom, or the net?
Who needs the wars? I just like to reenact the fun bits - food and
drink, costume, music, and dancing. This week, we're playing in
1860s, 1890s, and 1910s - see http://www.vintagedancers.org/newport.
I also do 1580s, 1810s, 1830s, 1880s, and 1920s. 1810s England
(Regency) is probably my favorite - we do balls, picnics, afternoons
of gaming, etc. (http://www.elegantarts.org/assembly), though I'm
almost as partial to the dances of 1580s Italy.
Susan
David G. Bell
<4sm9b3hls805c4133...@4ax.com>
fairp...@gmail.com "mike weber" wrote:
> On Sat, 4 Aug 2007 18:55:04 GMT, djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
> wrote:
>
> >In article <e5h9b3tue7cfaqdr8...@4ax.com>,
> >mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>On 4 Aug 2007 11:19:40 -0400, "Keith F. Lynch" <k...@KeithLynch.net>
> >>wrote:
> >>
> >>>Is invention allowed? Or just things that were actually known at
> >>>the time?
> >>
> >>One of Brother David's "Honor Harrington" books mentions Honor's
> >>favourite uncle who's active in the SCA, period weapons and all that
> >>stuff, and, knowing her interest, makes her a gift of one of his
> >>painstakingly-authentic reproductions - a model 1911 .45 Colt.
> >
> >Yes, Hal pointed that out to me. All I can say is, somebody
> >must've intervened and broken the 1600 cutoff date.
> >
> Several hundred years in our future, 1600 might as well be the Garden
> of Eden, but our time will be looked at as "classical times".
>
> I can't say for sure, but i's almost bet that the SCA in Dave's
> universe has a cutoff of the year zero AE.
August 1914 would be my candidate date, or maybe the end of that year.
--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.
On the horizon, a carrier task force of the Salvation Navy was
turning into the wind, preparing to launch Zeppelins.
David G. Bell
<memo.2007080...@pauldormer.compulink.co.uk>
p...@pauldormer.cix.co.uk "Paul Dormer" wrote:
> In article <f925ec$9p8$1...@panix2.panix.com>, k...@KeithLynch.net (Keith F.
> Lynch) wrote:
>
> > What are some other historic eras that are recreated? I know
> > aboutthe Civil War reenactors, of course. Anything more
> > recent?
> >
> > Why is it always war? Why not reenact the industrial revolution,
> > or the early days of ham radio, fandom, or the net?
>
> There's a group in the UK called the Sealed Knot who do English Civil
> War reenactment. (And I think they may have been going long before the
> American Civil War reenactors.)
>
> The humourist Miles Kington invented in one of his articles a group
> called the Sealed Flask who go around recreating famous plagues and
> epidemics.
There's a sizable collection of Napoleonic War groups, in both the UK
and Europe, and assorted Victorian-period groups (which could be taken
to include the "Wild West"). There are groups for the two World Wars.
Some people are military vehicle collectors who take the trouble to wear
the correct uniforms. Others get into more general reenactment, and a
popular generic term is "living history". The most recent period I've
heard of is the 1990/1991 Gulf War. Some of that's simply trying to
document what the soldiers wore.
About twenty years ago I knew a lad who was the spitting image of a
photo of a German paratrooper in Crete. He'd never been able to put a
name to the man.
I must admit there are times when the WW2 groups make me feel a little
uncomfortable. Not just the Germans... Some of them seem a little too
enthusiastic about running around with guns, maybe losing track of the
history.
There are people in Canada who operate Number 19 Wireless Stations as
radio amateurs, and have taken the trouble to get the correct uniforms
for when they set up at events.
But the SCA looks a little strange from over here. We seem to go for
more focused groups, even if some people might be members of groups that
cover different periods.
Dorothy J Heydt
<smg...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On Aug 4, 11:43 am, djhe...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) wrote:
>> In article <f925ec$9p...@panix2.panix.com>,
>> Keith F. Lynch <k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
>> >What are some other historic eras that are recreated? I know about
>> >the Civil War reenactors, of course. Anything more recent?
>>
>> Lots, probably. Note that the ACW re-enactors take a completely
>> different approach to date and time from the SCA's. They'll
>> decide on a given day to re-enact (modulo number of people
>> available, et cetera) a battle that took place on a certain date
>> in history, and if the battle was in 1863 you can't bring your
>> carefully constructed replica of a rifle that wasn't issued until
>> 1864. They are *fanatical* about accuracy and authenticity,
>> which is perhaps not surprising considering that Matthew Brady
>> was hanging around taking *photographs* of that war.
>
>Quibble: they are (to the best of my knowledge) fanatical about
>recreating the warlike aspects of the era, including the men's
>uniforms. However, the women's outfits are often dreadful (and no one
>seems to care)
I'm sorry to hear that. Ghu knows there are enough available
fashion drawings and/or photos to show what women's clothing in
that period actually looked like. Is it possible that a large
part of the female contingent at ACW events consists of the wives
and girlfriends of the military re-enactors, who feel that they
have to wear some kind of costume and are not interested in doing
any kind of research?
Mind you, we have people dressed with equal inaccuracy (for ANY
period) in the SCA. They are usually young females who couple
some kind of Ren Faire outfit, frequently a modified dirndl
engineered to display maximum boobage, e.g.
(though mind you that's not from a Ren Faire)
with a pointy hennin from the fifteenth century:
All in pale pink chiffon.
If one says what one really thinks about such outfits they cry;
so one has to approach them very very carefully and attempt to
get them interested in researching what kind of dress *really*
went with a hennin. Sometimes it works.
mike weber
("David G. Bell") wrote:
>On Saturday, in article
> <4sm9b3hls805c4133...@4ax.com>
> fairp...@gmail.com "mike weber" wrote:
>
>> I can't say for sure, but i'd almost bet that the SCA in Dave's
>> universe has a cutoff of the year zero AE.
>
>August 1914 would be my candidate date, or maybe the end of that year.
Nah - August 1945. When Things Changed.
They date their calendar "Post Diaspora".
Keith F. Lynch
> fairp...@gmail.com "mike weber" wrote:
>> I can't say for sure, but i's almost bet that the SCA in Dave's
>> universe has a cutoff of the year zero AE.
> August 1914 would be my candidate date, or maybe the end of
> that year.
Olaf Stapledon would probably agree. His protagonist, two billion (!)
years in our future, says World War I was the most significant event
in our species' history.
Keith F. Lynch
> Some of that's simply trying to document what the soldiers wore.
I could dress appropriately for the home front. Most of my clothes
are older than that.
I'm reminded of Mad Magazine's "2000 House" spoof of "1900 House."
Instead of people living as if it was still 1900, they would live as
if it were still 2000. No 9/11, no dot com crash, no president Bush.
What's not to like?
> About twenty years ago I knew a lad who was the spitting image of a
> photo of a German paratrooper in Crete. He'd never been able to put
> a name to the man.
Obviously he will become a time traveler, and it's himself in that
photo.
> There are people in Canada who operate Number 19 Wireless Stations
> as radio amateurs, and have taken the trouble to get the correct
> uniforms for when they set up at events.
I'm pretty deep into early radio history, but I've never heard of
"Number 19 Wireless Stations." And they get no Google hits.
The really early stations, which used sparks and arcs instead of the
not-yet-invented vacuum tubes, would be illegal to operate today, as
they'd interfere with pretty much everything. This is unfortunate, as
they're the most interesting -- back when radios had moving parts.
Keith F. Lynch
> However, the women's outfits are often dreadful (and no one seems
> to care) and in some areas their idea of suitable music and dancing
> has more in common with the 1970s than the 1860s.
A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle Ages --
with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never saw that
movie.
> 1810s England (Regency) is probably my favorite - we do balls,
> picnics, afternoons of gaming, etc.
Regency dances seem to be popular at cons, for some reason.
Karl Johanson
> A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle Ages --
> with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never saw that
> movie.
Why? Prefer movies about the middle ages with 18th & 19th century music?
: )
"The Boys are Back in Town" fit well with the knights showing up for a
tournament.
Karl Johanson
Karl Johanson
>> The most recent period I've heard of is the 1990/1991 Gulf War.
>> Some of that's simply trying to document what the soldiers wore.
>
> I could dress appropriately for the home front. Most of my clothes
> are older than that.
>
> I'm reminded of Mad Magazine's "2000 House" spoof of "1900 House."
> Instead of people living as if it was still 1900, they would live as
> if it were still 2000. No 9/11, no dot com crash, no president Bush.
> What's not to like?
Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon.
Karl Johanson
mike weber
wrote:
><smg...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> However, the women's outfits are often dreadful (and no one seems
>> to care) and in some areas their idea of suitable music and dancing
>> has more in common with the 1970s than the 1860s.
>
>A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle Ages --
>with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never saw that
>movie.
One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang, the
New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
guitars and amps.
Karl Johanson
> One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
> spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang, the
> New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
> guitars and amps.
One of my favourite movies is science fiction with a country & western
theme song.
Karl Johanson
Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing
><smg...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> However, the women's outfits are often dreadful (and no one seems
>> to care) and in some areas their idea of suitable music and dancing
>> has more in common with the 1970s than the 1860s.
>
>A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle Ages --
>with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never saw that
>movie.
"A Knight's Tale". Soundtrack with things like "We Will Rock You" on it.
That told me not to expect even a little bit of historical accuracy, and
so I was able to enjoy the movie.
>
>> 1810s England (Regency) is probably my favorite - we do balls,
>> picnics, afternoons of gaming, etc.
>
>Regency dances seem to be popular at cons, for some reason.
Historical reasons. (I should stop there.)
(A lot of Regency enthusiasts (specifically Georgette Heyer fans) were also
sf fans.)
-- Alan
mike weber
That other people, including me, like to write new verses to.
Dorothy J Heydt
Karl Johanson <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>"Keith F. Lynch" <k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote
>
>> A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle Ages --
>> with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never saw that
>> movie.
>
>Why? Prefer movies about the middle ages with 18th & 19th century music?
>: )
My daughter recently sent me an URL for a music video that she
and her husband and some other local SCAdians appeared in. She
warned me to turn the volume down before watching it -- "It's
heavy metal, you won't like it." So I don't know what it sounds
like, and I'm not sure at all what it's supposed to be about --
but the castle is a winery in Calistoga and *some* of the people
are members of the Kingdom of the West.
My daughter's the pretty, rather round-faced girl in the white
veil; her husband's the guy with his hair clipped so short he's
almost bald. (He just got out of the Air Force.)
Jette
> <smg...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> However, the women's outfits are often dreadful (and no one seems
>> to care) and in some areas their idea of suitable music and dancing
>> has more in common with the 1970s than the 1860s.
>
> A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle Ages --
> with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never saw that
> movie.
>
very good.
--
Jette Goldie
je...@blueyonder.co.uk
http://www.jette.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/
http://wolfette.livejournal.com/
("reply to" is spamblocked - use the email addy in sig)
Dorothy J Heydt
mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:07:26 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
><karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>>"mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>>
>>> One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
>>> spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang, the
>>> New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
>>> guitars and amps.
>>
>>One of my favourite movies is science fiction with a country & western
>>theme song.
>>
>That other people, including me, like to write new verses to.
Just out of idle curiosity: would somebody care to identify it?
Jette
TV show "Firefly", movie "Serenity".
I love the theme song but I wouldn't say it was necessarily "country &
western".
Dorothy J Heydt
Jette <boss...@scotlandmail.com> wrote:
>Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> In article <4lsib3d33adqdcemf...@4ax.com>,
>> mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:07:26 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>>>>
>>>>> One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
>>>>> spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang, the
>>>>> New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
>>>>> guitars and amps.
>>>> One of my favourite movies is science fiction with a country & western
>>>> theme song.
>>>>
>>> That other people, including me, like to write new verses to.
>>
>> Just out of idle curiosity: would somebody care to identify it?
>>
>
>TV show "Firefly", movie "Serenity".
>
>I love the theme song but I wouldn't say it was necessarily "country &
>western".
Oh. I should've guessed; I've been *told* it's wild west in
space.
Thanks.
mike weber
wrote:
>Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> In article <4lsib3d33adqdcemf...@4ax.com>,
>> mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:07:26 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>>>>
>>>>> One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
>>>>> spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang, the
>>>>> New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
>>>>> guitars and amps.
>>>> One of my favourite movies is science fiction with a country & western
>>>> theme song.
>>>>
>>> That other people, including me, like to write new verses to.
>>
>> Just out of idle curiosity: would somebody care to identify it?
>>
>
>TV show "Firefly", movie "Serenity".
>
>I love the theme song but I wouldn't say it was necessarily "country &
>western".
Hmmm. I wasn't thinking of that; given that the film i cited,
"Zachariah" is a cult film, i was assuming that Karl was referring to
cult film "Dark Star", with it's theme, "Benson Arizona"...
Article about the sonjg/film: http://www.benzedrine.cx/darkstar.html
MP3: http://www.benzedrine.cx/benson.mp3
Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing
I suspect Karl means _Dark Star_, with the quite nice song "Benson, Arizona"
as the theme song in question.
-- Alan
Kip Williams
> One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
> spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang, the
> New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
> guitars and amps.
"I'm gonna kill you!!"
"Kill? Haven't you learned -anything- yet?"
Kip W
Kip Williams
"You are false data."
Kip W
mike weber
wrote:
"I seen his eyes - *weird* eyes."
mike weber
wrote:
>Karl Johanson wrote:
"Let's have some music in here, Boiler."
Paul Dormer
Lynch) wrote:
>
> A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle
> Ages -- with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never
> saw that movie.
>
Well, anything with hard rock would put me off, especially as cinemas
seem to play soundtracks deafeningly loud (speaking as someone who
likes Wagner).
A few years ago I was at the Royal Opera House to see Sir Harrison
Birtwistle's opera Gawain, which is based on the 14th century poem and
set at King Arthur's court. During the interval, someone sitting next
to me - I think he was American - complained that the modern music
didn't go with the mediæval setting. I don't know if he would have
preferred Hollywood style romantic music, but I did point out that
Birtwistle has been heavily influenced by Guillaume de Machaut, whose
music is at least from the same century as the poem.
Tim McDaniel
mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:17:08 GMT, Jette <boss...@scotlandmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>> In article <4lsib3d33adqdcemf...@4ax.com>,
>>> mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:07:26 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>>>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>>> One of my favourite movies is science fiction with a country &
>>>>> western theme song.
>>>>>
>>>> That other people, including me, like to write new verses to.
>>>
>>> Just out of idle curiosity: would somebody care to identify it?
>>>
>>TV show "Firefly", movie "Serenity".
>>
>>I love the theme song but I wouldn't say it was necessarily "country
>>& western".
>
>cult film "Dark Star", with its theme, "Benson, Arizona"...
M3 T00, for all that I'm a Firefly/Serenity fan.
--
Tim McDaniel, tm...@panix.com
Nels E. Satterlund
Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> My daughter recently sent me an URL for a music video that she
> and her husband and some other local SCAdians appeared in. She
> warned me to turn the volume down before watching it -- "It's
> heavy metal, you won't like it." So I don't know what it sounds
> like, and I'm not sure at all what it's supposed to be about --
> but the castle is a winery in Calistoga and *some* of the people
> are members of the Kingdom of the West.
>
> http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.showvids&friendID=4246250&n=4246250&MyToken=8687e22c-f71c-4373-9959-47f09c750147
>
> My daughter's the pretty, rather round-faced girl in the white
> veil; her husband's the guy with his hair clipped so short he's
> almost bald. (He just got out of the Air Force.)
Dorothy,
I took a look and no one jumped out at me ... could you give a better
description of what your Daughter and husband are wearing
Any one else notice the sideburns on the princess?
Nels
--
Nels E Satterlund I don't speak for the company, specially here
Ne...@Starstream.net <-- Use this address for personal Email
My Lurkers motto: I read much better and faster, than I type.
Karl Johanson
news:JMG26...@kithrup.com...
Better than most music videos. I'm not a big metal fan, but their music
mixer seems to know what they were doing, compared to most of the metal
I've heard.
Karl Johanson
Karl Johanson
> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> In article <4lsib3d33adqdcemf...@4ax.com>,
>> mike weber <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:07:26 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>>>>
>>>>> One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
>>>>> spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang,
>>>>> the
>>>>> New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
>>>>> guitars and amps.
>>>> One of my favourite movies is science fiction with a country &
>>>> western theme song.
>>>>
>>> That other people, including me, like to write new verses to.
>>
>> Just out of idle curiosity: would somebody care to identify it?
>
> TV show "Firefly", movie "Serenity".
>
> I love the theme song but I wouldn't say it was necessarily "country &
> western".
That's a good one, but I meant, "Benson Arizona", the theme to the movie
"Dark Star". Music by John Carpenter & lyrics by Bill Taylor.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggpcNirFZ08
A million suns shine down
But I see only one
When I think I'm over you
I find I've just begun
The years move faster than the days
There's no warmth in the light
How I miss those desert skies
Your cool touch in the night
Benson, Arizona, blew warm wind through your hair
My body flies the galaxy, my heart longs to be there
Benson, Arizona, the same stars in the sky
But they seemed so much kinder when we watched them, you and I
Now the years pull us apart
I'm young and now you're old
But you're still in my heart
And the memory won't grow cold
I dream of times and spaces
I left far behind
Where we spent our last few days
Benson's on my mind
Benson, Arizona, blew warm wind through your hair
My body flies the galaxy, my heart longs to be there
Benson, Arizona, the same stars in the sky
But they seemed so much kinder when we watched
them, you and I
(I always assumed it was, "Benson, Arizona, blew warm wind through your
hair...", but listening again, it seems that "blew" is right.)
Karl Johanson
Karl Johanson
Quite so!
> Article about the sonjg/film: http://www.benzedrine.cx/darkstar.html
Cool article.
I compared Queen's "39" to "Benson Arizona" in an article in Neo-opsis:
Queen's song 39 by Brian May, is about a person traveling in a
reletavistic craft to another star system and returning a century later,
having only aged one year. The song alternates between an uplifting tone
about the volunteers and their great journey, and the lamentation of a
love left behind. Fans of quality acoustic guitar music will likely
appreciate this song, regardless of their reaction to the lyrics. 39 is
very similar in theme to Benson, Arizona by Bill Taylor and John
Carpenter, the country and western theme song for the 1974 movie Dark
Star. In Benson, Arizona, the protagonist hasn't returned to Earth from
his relativistic trip. He sings about his ex-girlfriend with the lines,
"Now the years pull us apart. I'm young and now you're old. But you're
still in my heart. The memory won't grow cold. I dream of times and
spaces, I left far behind. Where we spent our last few days, Benson's on
my mind."
The rest of the article talked about Prism, The Rockey Horror theme song
and the numerous songs about Major Tom.
Karl Johanson
Karl Johanson
> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:40:03 -0400, Kip Williams <ki...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
>>Karl Johanson wrote:
>>> "mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>>>
>>>> One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
>>>> spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang,
>>>> the
>>>> New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
>>>> guitars and amps.
>>>
>>> One of my favourite movies is science fiction with a country &
>>> western
>>> theme song.
>>
>>"You are false data."
>>
> "Let's have some music in here, Boiler."
"That's the lid to the heating unit."
Karl Johanson
Dorothy J Heydt
Nels E. Satterlund <Nels.Sa...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>
>> My daughter recently sent me an URL for a music video that she
>> and her husband and some other local SCAdians appeared in. She
>> warned me to turn the volume down before watching it -- "It's
>> heavy metal, you won't like it." So I don't know what it sounds
>> like, and I'm not sure at all what it's supposed to be about --
>> but the castle is a winery in Calistoga and *some* of the people
>> are members of the Kingdom of the West.
>>
>> http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.showvids&friendID=4246250&n=4246250&MyToken=8687e22c-f71c-4373-9959-47f09c750147
>>
>> My daughter's the pretty, rather round-faced girl in the white
>> veil; her husband's the guy with his hair clipped so short he's
>> almost bald. (He just got out of the Air Force.)
>
>Dorothy,
>I took a look and no one jumped out at me ... could you give a better
>description of what your Daughter and husband are wearing
Meg's wearing a deep maroon overdress over a white undergown that
you can see poking out at neck and arms. You see her in the
crowd when the knight (?) first enters the castle. Later on,
after the smith (?) has stabbed the wizard (?) in the back and
the knight (?) is beginning to recover, you see Walkyr and Meg
immediately to his left (the viewer's right). Walkyr's wearing
a black tunic with long sleeves; all you can see of Meg is her
head and shoulders.
Tim McDaniel
There's the two famous ones that hit the US charts. What others were
there?
--
Tim McDaniel, tm...@panix.com
Karl Johanson
> In article <oMnui.41485$_d2.8178@pd7urf3no>,
> Karl Johanson <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>and the numerous songs about Major Tom.
>
> There's the two famous ones that hit the US charts. What others were
> there?
"A cascade of music was inspired by David Bowie's 1969 song Space
Oddity, featuring astronaut Major Tom. (Astronaut Thomas Strafford, had
the rank of major during his 1965 flight on the Gemini 6A mission, but
there is no good evidence that Bowie intended the song to be about him).
While I mentioned fascination and awe as common feelings associated with
SF, Space Oddity carries with it a feeling of exhilaration and a sense
that missions of space exploration *matter*. Bowie's 1980 sequel song
Ashes to Ashes has a completely different tone and feel. The following
lines are suggestive that the post Apollo decline in manned space
exploration left Major Tom feeling like his entire post space flight
life is
anti-climatic. "Ashes to ashes, funk to funky. We know major Tom's a
junkie. Strung out in heaven's high, hitting an all time low." Some also
interpret this as suggestive that Major Tom wasn't an astronaut at all,
but rather a hallucinating drug addict. The music video for the English
version of Peter Schilling's song Major Tom (Coming Home), shows Major
Tom sitting at the top of a stack of cars in a junkyard, dreaming of
space flight, cheered on by his drinking buddies. This can be
interpreted to suggest that
Major Tom was simply a substance abusing hallucinator, or perhaps it's
that the person portrayed is dreaming of being Major Tom. Leaving the
interpretation to the listener/viewer, is part of the appeal of the
songs. The original German version of Major Tom (Coming Home), has Major
Tom dying in space.
Other songs in the Major Tom saga include Hallo Spaceboy by David Bowie
and Niel Tennat, and
Mrs. Major Tom by K.I.A. about Major Tom's wife."
Karl Johanson
mike weber
<karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>In Benson, Arizona, the protagonist hasn't returned to Earth from
>his relativistic trip. He sings about his ex-girlfriend with the lines,
>"Now the years pull us apart. I'm young and now you're old. But you're
>still in my heart. The memory won't grow cold. I dream of times and
>spaces, I left far behind. Where we spent our last few days, Benson's on
>my mind."
Further verses:
Well the seasons slip on by like seconds on ths ship.
So I'll take another pul at the flask that's on my hip.
Might have beens and the never weres
Can drive a man insane
So I guess I'll stay out in the void
Benson's not the same.
(author unknown; recorded by Clam Chowder)
When all has come full circle and time and space are one
When the youngest star has faded and all my tasks are done
Well I guess I'll turn my ship around
Toward the planet of my birth
And you and I can begin again
'Neath the cool green hills of Earth.
(by me. Be kind)
And then there's Hawkwind's "Spirit of the Age"
"...Your father refused to sign the forms to freeze you;
Let's se, you'd be about sixty now
And long dead by the time i return to Earth..."
mike weber
<karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>Peter Schilling's song Major Tom (Coming Home)
At one time Schilling had the brass-faced effrontery to claim that he
had never heard Bowie's song.
mike weber
I still sing "...the warm wind...", not "...blew warm wind..."
I *won't* start up the "flatbed/flathead" argument again...
mike weber
<karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>"mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:40:03 -0400, Kip Williams <ki...@comcast.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>Karl Johanson wrote:
>>>> "mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>>>>
>>>>> One of my favourite films is not only a Western with a hard rock
>>>>> spundtrack, but features Country Joe and the Fish, the James Gang,
>>>>> the
>>>>> New York Rock Ensemble (and Doug Kershaw), complete with electric
>>>>> guitars and amps.
>>>>
>>>> One of my favourite movies is science fiction with a country &
>>>> western
>>>> theme song.
>>>
>>>"You are false data."
>>>
>> "Let's have some music in here, Boiler."
>
>"That's the lid to the heating unit."
>
"Hey ...Bomb...?"
John Dallman
> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
> >In Benson, Arizona, the protagonist hasn't returned to Earth from
> "Let's see, you'd be about sixty now
> And long dead by the time i return to Earth..."
David Zindel dubbed this "crueltime"; one of SF's most apposite coinages.
--
John Dallman, j...@cix.co.uk, HTML mail is treated as probable spam.
Karl Johanson
> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 20:05:30 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>>Peter Schilling's song Major Tom (Coming Home)
>
> At one time Schilling had the brass-faced effrontery to claim that he
> had never heard Bowie's song.
I'd be quite interested in a reference for that, if you have it handy.
Thank you.
Karl Johanson
mike weber
<karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>"mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 20:05:30 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>
>>>Peter Schilling's song Major Tom (Coming Home)
>>
>> At one time Schilling had the brass-faced effrontery to claim that he
>> had never heard Bowie's song.
>
>I'd be quite interested in a reference for that, if you have it handy.
>Thank you.
>
Don't recall - i think it was MTV Music News, and, of course, it could
have been an error on their part.
Marilee J. Layman
wrote:
><smg...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> However, the women's outfits are often dreadful (and no one seems
>> to care) and in some areas their idea of suitable music and dancing
>> has more in common with the 1970s than the 1860s.
>
>A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle Ages --
>with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never saw that
>movie.
I saw that movie (although I don't remember the name) and there were
purposeful anachronisms throughout the movie.
--
Marilee J. Layman
http://mjlayman.livejournal.com
Karl Johanson
Nice.
Two decades pass on Earth.
The boredom gets to me.
It feels like that long here.
Although it's just year three
The sights we pass should excite me,
while the ship does quicken.
But I'm just sitting here sick and tired,
of Pinback and his chicken.
It seems another life
when my feet did touch turf.
It seems so strange to say,
that I mostly miss the surf.
If I could take this mission,
where ever it would reach.
I would turn this ship and go
back to Daytona beach.
It's fastened to our ship.
Events do not well bode.
For T S D two oh,
thinks it must explode.
I'm floating in my spacesuit
and I have to pee.
Teaching a bomb all about
phenomenology.
Karl Johanson
Marilee J. Layman
Winston - SSRL Central Computing) wrote:
>In article <f9b8so$fvq$1...@panix2.panix.com>, "Keith F. Lynch" <k...@KeithLynch.net> writes:
>><smg...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> However, the women's outfits are often dreadful (and no one seems
>>> to care) and in some areas their idea of suitable music and dancing
>>> has more in common with the 1970s than the 1860s.
>>
>>A few years ago I saw a trailer for a movie set in the Middle Ages --
>>with a soundtrack of hard rock. Needless to say, I never saw that
>>movie.
>
>"A Knight's Tale". Soundtrack with things like "We Will Rock You" on it.
>That told me not to expect even a little bit of historical accuracy, and
>so I was able to enjoy the movie.
>
I thought of that title, and figured I was wrong!
Daniel R. Reitman
<karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>"mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 20:05:30 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>Peter Schilling's song Major Tom (Coming Home)
>> At one time Schilling had the brass-faced effrontery to claim that he
>> had never heard Bowie's song.
>I'd be quite interested in a reference for that, if you have it handy.
>Thank you.
I saw that claimed in a text crawl on USA Network's "Radio 1990."
Dan, ad nauseam
mike weber
Good to have independent confirmation i didn't imagine it.
Kip Williams
> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 20:14:54 -0700, Daniel R. Reitman
> <drei...@spiritone.com> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 22:52:49 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> "mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>>>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 20:05:30 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>>>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>>> Peter Schilling's song Major Tom (Coming Home)
>>>> At one time Schilling had the brass-faced effrontery to claim that he
>>>> had never heard Bowie's song.
>>> I'd be quite interested in a reference for that, if you have it handy.
>>> Thank you.
>> I saw that claimed in a text crawl on USA Network's "Radio 1990."
>
> Good to have independent confirmation i didn't imagine it.
You only imagined that Daniel said that, though.
Kip W
Marcus L. Rowland
<db...@zhochaka.org.uk> writes
>
>I must admit there are times when the WW2 groups make me feel a little
>uncomfortable. Not just the Germans... Some of them seem a little too
>enthusiastic about running around with guns, maybe losing track of the
>history.
I was at a wargames con in January and one of these groups were there,
dressed up as some sort of SS desert warfare unit. I wasn't particularly
enthralled, particularly when I noticed they had a kid with them, aged
about 9 or 10, in SS desert drummer-boy uniform. I'm not convinced that
a kid knows enough about the history to make an informed choice in
joining this sort of activity.
--
Marcus L. Rowland http://www.forgottenfutures.com/
LJ:ffutures http://homepage.ntlworld.com/forgottenfutures/
Forgotten Futures - The Scientific Romance Role Playing Game
Diana: Warrior Princess & Elvis: The Legendary Tours
The Original Flatland Role Playing Game
Nels E. Satterlund
Thanks Spotter them.
Marcus L. Rowland
<forgotte...@ntlworld.com> writes
>In message <20070807.15...@zhochaka.org.uk>, David G. Bell
><db...@zhochaka.org.uk> writes
>>
>>I must admit there are times when the WW2 groups make me feel a little
>>uncomfortable. Not just the Germans... Some of them seem a little too
>>enthusiastic about running around with guns, maybe losing track of the
>>history.
>
>I was at a wargames con in January and one of these groups were there,
>dressed up as some sort of SS desert warfare unit. I wasn't
>particularly enthralled, particularly when I noticed they had a kid
>with them, aged about 9 or 10, in SS desert drummer-boy uniform. I'm
>not convinced that a kid knows enough about the history to make an
>informed choice in joining this sort of activity.
Sorry - thinking about it, I think he was supposed to be a bugler, not
drummer boy, not 100% sure if I remember a drum.
mike weber
wrote:
>mike weber wrote:
Whoa, man - what is reality and why does it keep following me 'round?
Kip Williams
> On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 11:36:54 -0400, Kip Williams <ki...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
>> mike weber wrote:
>>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 20:14:54 -0700, Daniel R. Reitman
>>> <drei...@spiritone.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 22:52:49 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>>>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> "mike weber" <fairp...@gmail.com> wrote
>>>>>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 20:05:30 GMT, "Karl Johanson"
>>>>>> <karljo...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>> Peter Schilling's song Major Tom (Coming Home)
>>>>>> At one time Schilling had the brass-faced effrontery to claim that he
>>>>>> had never heard Bowie's song.
>>>>> I'd be quite interested in a reference for that, if you have it handy.
>>>>> Thank you.
>>>> I saw that claimed in a text crawl on USA Network's "Radio 1990."
>>> Good to have independent confirmation i didn't imagine it.
>> You only imagined that Daniel said that, though.
>>
> Whoa, man - what is reality and why does it keep following me 'round?
It's like realty, only I'm in it.
Kip W
Marilee J. Layman
<forgotte...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>In message <20070807.15...@zhochaka.org.uk>, David G. Bell
><db...@zhochaka.org.uk> writes
>>
>>I must admit there are times when the WW2 groups make me feel a little
>>uncomfortable. Not just the Germans... Some of them seem a little too
>>enthusiastic about running around with guns, maybe losing track of the
>>history.
>
>I was at a wargames con in January and one of these groups were there,
>dressed up as some sort of SS desert warfare unit. I wasn't particularly
>enthralled, particularly when I noticed they had a kid with them, aged
>about 9 or 10, in SS desert drummer-boy uniform. I'm not convinced that
>a kid knows enough about the history to make an informed choice in
>joining this sort of activity.
There are lots of little boys playing the South in the Civil War
reenactments here. Most of them aren't taught it's about slaves,
though.
rksh...@rosettacondot.com
I grew up playing cowboys-and-Indians, cops-and-robbers and a lot of
other this-and-thats that I've forgotten. There wasn't any deep
philosophical meaning to it and no debate over which side we wanted to
be on (except that Indians were a lot cooler because they got to go
woo-woo-woo.) It was just a way of dividing into two sides for a game.
I doubt that it's more than that for most of the reenactors.
And, of course, fandom should be the last group to criticize others for
encouraging their children to dress oddly and associate with strange
people...
Robert
--
Robert K. Shull Email: rkshull at rosettacon dot com
smg...@yahoo.com
> > picnics, afternoons of gaming, etc.
>
> Regencydances seem to be popular at cons, for some reason.
The difference would be that my interest is in the historical dancing
of the Regency era (1810-1820).
If I don't get back to this thread, it will be because I'm on the road
at dance weeks and will be totally w/o net access for seven days
starting tomorrow afternoon.
And now I have to go (1) change into my civil war era outfit for
tonight's ball before (2) packing to head up to a another week of
teaching, among other things, Regency-era country dancing starting
tomorrow.
Susan
Dorothy J Heydt
Have fun.
I'm now reminded of the ending of _Highland Laddie Gone,_ where
the chief of police -- who had to hurry to a crime scene still
wearing his CSA uniform and riding his horse -- says to a young
woman attending the local Scottish Games -- whose participants
think of Scotland as a sort of quasi-historical Brigadoon -- "And
next week I'll be on duty anyway, the park will be full of the
Society for Creative Anachronism." The young woman -- whose
official title is Maid of the Cat and whose duty it is to
chaperone a genuine _Felis sylvestris grampia_ -- replies, "You
mean those people who hit each other with swords? Those people
are CRAZY!"
Marilee J. Layman
wrote:
Oh, no, the Civil War reenactors are very serious about it. They just
like to follow the current propaganda that the war was not about
slavery.
mike weber
Heydt) wrote:
>I'm now reminded of the ending of _Highland Laddie Gone,_ where
>the chief of police -- who had to hurry to a crime scene still
>wearing his CSA uniform and riding his horse -- says to a young
>woman attending the local Scottish Games -- whose participants
>think of Scotland as a sort of quasi-historical Brigadoon -- "And
>next week I'll be on duty anyway, the park will be full of the
>Society for Creative Anachronism." The young woman -- whose
>official title is Maid of the Cat and whose duty it is to
>chaperone a genuine _Felis sylvestris grampia_ -- replies, "You
>mean those people who hit each other with swords? Those people
>are CRAZY!"
My sbrother-in-law is named Scott. His parents are very proud of
their Scottish heritage and do the Highland Games thing and all that.
So, they were a bit taken aback to find that when some of our
second-cousins-teice-removed, or something like that, named
"Buckalew", did some genealogical research. It turned out that,
because of whatever tenuous relatonship Kathy has to the Buckalews on
our mother's side makles her actuallt more closely related to Sir
Walter Scott than her in-laws *named* Scott.
("Buckalew" is one spelling of "Bucchleuch" - Sir Walter's grandfather
was "Scott of Buccleuch"...)
mike weber
One more time.
Secession was about slavery (among other things, but mostly about
slavery).
The war was about seccession.
Aaron Denney
> On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 20:12:32 -0400, Marilee J. Layman
><mar...@mjlayman.com> wrote:
>
>>Oh, no, the Civil War reenactors are very serious about it. They just
>>like to follow the current propaganda that the war was not about
>>slavery.
>
> One more time.
>
> Secession was about slavery (among other things, but mostly about
> slavery).
>
> The war was about seccession.
If you want to get that reductionistic, the war was about Fort Sumter.
--
Aaron Denney
-><-
mike weber
Nope. the war was about States not being allowed to overrule the
Federal Government.
the fact that the shooting started when students at a second-rate
military school fired on Fort Sumter is pretty much irrelevant - once
the Confederate States had declared that they were no longer part of
the US, war was inevitable.
Was World War One about the Archduke?