Ouch...

[JF]

My non-SF geocaching novel, The Geocache Killer, sits
unassumingly on Amazon, happily ignored by me and almost
everyone. Unfortunately someone has actually bought a copy and
written a humdinger stinker of a review which will preclude any
further chance of sales.

Has anyone got any advice?

JF

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

Reviews are out of your control, so worrying about them is pointless.
Bad enough reviews can get people to read your book, especially if the
review is either amusing or sufficiently foaming-at-the-mouth.

Most of my books have good reviews and bad reviews. Sometimes the bad
reviews are the first to show up. I don't think it makes much difference.


--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com

[JF]

On 28/12/2012 14:52, Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) wrote:

>>
>> Has anyone got any advice?
>
> Reviews are out of your control, so worrying about them is
> pointless. Bad enough reviews can get people to read your book,
> especially if the review is either amusing or sufficiently
> foaming-at-the-mouth.
>
> Most of my books have good reviews and bad reviews.
> Sometimes the bad reviews are the first to show up. I don't think
> it makes much difference.

Thanks. I think I'll try altering the blurb to counter some of
the more egregious errors.

JF

[James Nicoll]

In article <xvydnXsY9-xx4UDN...@brightview.co.uk>,

Never respond to a review and this goes double for negative ones.

--
http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll
http://www.cafepress.com/jdnicoll (For all your "The problem with
defending the English language [...]" T-shirt, cup and tote-bag needs)

[garabik-ne...@kassiopeia.juls.savba.sk]

James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:

> Never respond to a review and this goes double for negative ones.

however, this kind of worked for Jacqueline Howett...

--
-----------------------------------------------------------
| Radovan Garabík http://kassiopeia.juls.savba.sk/~garabik/ |
| __..--^^^--..__ garabik @ kassiopeia.juls.savba.sk |
-----------------------------------------------------------
Antivirus alert: file .signature infected by signature virus.
Hi! I'm a signature virus! Copy me into your signature file to help me spread!

[David Friedman]

In article <kbkmkt$868$1...@speranza.aioe.org>,

garabik-ne...@kassiopeia.juls.savba.sk wrote:

> James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
>
> > Never respond to a review and this goes double for negative ones.
>
> however, this kind of worked for Jacqueline Howett...

I respond to reviews of _Salamander_ (up as a Kindle) on Amazon. One of
the reasons to publish a book is to be able to discuss it with people.
Sometimes I agree with their criticisms, sometimes I don't, sometimes I
respond to other things.

--
http://www.daviddfriedman.com/
http://daviddfriedman.blogspot.com/
_Salamander_: http://tinyurl.com/6957y7e
_How to Milk an Almond,..._ http://tinyurl.com/63xg8gx

[Kay Shapero]

In article <xvydnXsY9-xx4UDN...@brightview.co.uk>,
jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk says...

I can't find the review, anyway the Wasp is right. No point in
stressing yourself to bits.

Now, four years ago you sent me a beta copy of something called The Big
Hack or The Multipuzzle, depending on whether you believe the file name
or the title on the start of the document. Dunno if it was an earlier
revision or a final one. The plot certainly sounds like this is the same
book - is this it?

--

Kay Shapero
Address munged, try my first name at kayshapero dot net.

[Kay Shapero]

In article <MPG.2b4807001...@news.eternal-september.org>,
k...@invalid.net says...

Aha - I was on Amazon.com and the review was on Amazon.uk. So at least
it's not being spread to the other countries that use Amazon, and since
it's a ebook... So I guess it could be worse.

[J.Pascal]

On Friday, December 28, 2012 2:46:14 PM UTC-7, David Friedman wrote:
> In article <kbkmkt$868$1...@speranza.aioe.org>,
>
> garabik-ne...@kassiopeia.juls.savba.sk wrote:
>
>
>
> > James Nicoll <jdni...@panix.com> wrote:
>
> >
>
> > > Never respond to a review and this goes double for negative ones.
>
> >
>
> > however, this kind of worked for Jacqueline Howett...
>
>
>
> I respond to reviews of _Salamander_ (up as a Kindle) on Amazon. One of
>
> the reasons to publish a book is to be able to discuss it with people.
>
> Sometimes I agree with their criticisms, sometimes I don't, sometimes I
>
> respond to other things.
>
>

I think that sometimes readers like to hear from the author.

So perhaps "respond" isn't what an author shouldn't do. Perhaps an author shouldn't "dispute" a criticism.

Same with crit group criticisms. I suppose it would be entirely possible to have a conversation about crit group criticisms, but I don't know that anything good comes out of the author trying to explain why the criticism is wrong.

-Julie

[JF]

On 29/12/2012 03:44, Kay Shapero wrote:


Dunno if it was an earlier
> revision or a final one. The plot certainly sounds like this is the same
> book - is this it?

Yes, retitled to be as obvious as possible.

The reviewer says, for example, that a GPS doesn't let you know
if something's 300 yards north and west from something else. Yes
it does, and how to do it is actually spelled out in one scene.
Various other points he makes show he's a comparative beginner
who thinks he's an expert. The damage is that no-one will buy
with that sitting up there, so I'll not get a good review with
this stopping sales.

He's a Ken Follett fan reading a cosy detective novel. I'm not
surpried he's unhappy.

JF

[Jacey Bedford]

In message <oMmdnXzvLcFNOEPN...@brightview.co.uk>, JF
<jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> writes

Well, I just gave it a 4* review.
:-)

Jacey
--
Jacey Bedford

[David Friedman]

In article <ba27897c-739d-41f5...@googlegroups.com>,

"J.Pascal" <ju...@pascal.org> wrote:

> I think that sometimes readers like to hear from the author.
>

And vice versa.

One of the nice things about the internet is that you can read a book,
locate, with luck, the author's email, and send him your comments. Some
authors will ignore such, others will appreciate and respond.

--
http://www.daviddfriedman.com/
http://daviddfriedman.blogspot.com/

Author of _Future Imperfect: Technology and Freedom in an Uncertain World_

[Raymond Daley]

"Koralatov" <use...@koralatov.com> wrote in message
news:kbnnfb$4tq$1...@dont-email.me...

> On 2012-12-29, David Friedman wrote:
>
>>> I think that sometimes readers like to hear from the author.
>>
>> And vice versa.
>>
>> One of the nice things about the internet is that you can read a book,
>> locate, with luck, the author's email, and send him your comments.
>> Some authors will ignore such, others will appreciate and respond.
>

> I don't think that's particularly new; only the method by which you do
> it, and the relative ease of doing so, is new. People have *always*
> written to authors as long as people have been writing books.
>
> A big part of whether an author responds depends on the tone in which
> the comments are delivered: it's pretty reasonable for someone to ignore
> an aggressive comment, regardless of how it's delivered.

When I first got online in the late 90's I emailed Joe Haldeman to thank him
for The Forever War which helped me through some very difficult periods in
my RAF career.
Joe was very nice in his reply and extremely understanding.

[Bill Swears]

On 12/29/2012 5:03 PM, Raymond Daley wrote:
>

>
> When I first got online in the late 90's I emailed Joe Haldeman to thank him
> for The Forever War which helped me through some very difficult periods in
> my RAF career.
> Joe was very nice in his reply and extremely understanding.

I probably mentioned this in some other year, but when the Internet was
new to me, I got hold of an e-mail address for Mike Resnick. I sent him
a very appreciative message thanking him for writing "Jitterbug," and
really letting him know how it had kept me up all night and how much I'd
thought about it after that. It's true, I loved the story. I just wish
I'd been e-mailing Mike McQuay about it.

Mike Resnick sent me a gentle note asking me not to write him at that
address anymore. That would have been in 91, I think, which was the
year I got Resnick's "Soothsayer."

This brings us back to "ouch."

Bill


--
www.billswears.com
Zook Country - http://twilighttimesbooks.com/ZookCountry_ch1.html
Also at Amazon, Barnes and Noble, and other fine ebook emporia.
Puppies - http://www.mtaonline.net/~wswears/
Opinions - http://wswears.livejournal.com/

[Bill Swears]

On 12/29/2012 10:07 AM, Koralatov wrote:
> On 2012-12-29, JF <jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> wrote:
>
> [snip]

>> The reviewer says, for example, that a GPS doesn't let you know if
>> something's 300 yards north and west from something else. Yes it does,
>> and how to do it is actually spelled out in one scene.

I tried to ask about this. Amazon UK won't let me ask the question
because I haven't bought the book, but I bought it from Amazon.com,
because Amazon.UK has previously refused to sell me books because of
some international law that they comply with.

Well, I tried. By the other token, I did buy the book, and I haven't
read Jacey's review, just the negative one. Such is life.

[J.Pascal]

> --
>
> www.billswears.com
>
> Zook Country - http://twilighttimesbooks.com/ZookCountry_ch1.html
>
> Also at Amazon, Barnes and Noble, and other fine ebook emporia.
>
> Puppies - http://www.mtaonline.net/~wswears/
>
> Opinions - http://wswears.livejournal.com/

Bill, when I try to search for Zook Country with my Nook I don't find anything. Are they selling it in paper?

-Julie

[J.Pascal]

If I search online with my computer I find the ebook at both Amazon and Barns and Noble as a Nook purchase... so something must be up with my Nook device or B&N are just messed up. Bah.

-Julie

[JF]

On 29/12/2012 17:45, Jacey Bedford wrote:

>>
> Well, I just gave it a 4* review.

Mwaah!

I think I'll alter my author details to reflect my experience: if
you've got it,flaunt it. I am, after all, the man who put out
/Gnome Sweet Gnome/, a geocache which is behind a little red door
with a brass handle let into the base of a 500 year old oak tree.

JF
I'm fond of the tree -- the chappy from Suffolk Wildlife found
that it's occupied by three species of owl. And a gnome,of course.

[JF]

On 29/12/2012 19:07, Koralatov wrote:


> negative review. The tone of the review is also pretty pompous, which
> will likely lead a lot of people to disregard it; it certainly made me
> ignore it.

Thanks, that was my impression, but I'm not sure that makes a lot
of difference. I'd expect it to be taken generally at face vale,
even the 'two years makes me an expert' assumption.

I took refuge in a short scene where my characters discuss the
review. Running from reality in fiction: no wonder I've not been
writing much recently, when things are fun.

JF
Are you really Russian? My granny was born Maria Korinieva in St
Petersberg.

[JF]

On 30/12/2012 06:01, Bill Swears wrote:

[northings, eastings]

Such is life.

The third decimal place of minutes is about 6 ft n/s and 6*cos
latitude east west, 0.616 here. Easy peasy. But you know that.
When I flew I used to have a man who did that sort of thing for me.

JF

[JF]

On 30/12/2012 02:03, Raymond Daley wrote:

>
> When I first got online in the late 90's I emailed Joe Haldeman to thank him
> for The Forever War which helped me through some very difficult periods in
> my RAF career.
> Joe was very nice in his reply and extremely understanding.

I used Glenfiddich.

JF

[David Friedman]

In article <kbnnfb$4tq$1...@dont-email.me>,
Koralatov <use...@koralatov.com> wrote:

> On 2012-12-29, David Friedman wrote:
>
> >> I think that sometimes readers like to hear from the author.
> >
> > And vice versa.
> >
> > One of the nice things about the internet is that you can read a book,
> > locate, with luck, the author's email, and send him your comments.
> > Some authors will ignore such, others will appreciate and respond.
>

> I don't think that's particularly new; only the method by which you do
> it, and the relative ease of doing so, is new. People have *always*
> written to authors as long as people have been writing books.

Yes. I wrote Tolkien a very long time ago, and got a response.

But email makes it easier.

> A big part of whether an author responds depends on the tone in which
> the comments are delivered: it's pretty reasonable for someone to ignore
> an aggressive comment, regardless of how it's delivered.
>

> What has changed is the ability for Joe Bloggs, the reader, to make
> comment in a widely readable public fashion, like the Amazon review that
> started this thread. That sort of mini-pulpit can be quite damaging
> because it doesn't really let an author respond in a sensible fashion.

On Amazon, the author can write a response, which anyone reading the
review can read. I often do.

[Kay Shapero]

In article <oMmdnXzvLcFNOEPN...@brightview.co.uk>,
jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk says...

>
> The reviewer says, for example, that a GPS doesn't let you know
> if something's 300 yards north and west from something else. Yes
> it does, and how to do it is actually spelled out in one scene.
> Various other points he makes show he's a comparative beginner
> who thinks he's an expert.

One of those folks who can't tell the difference between ten years of
experience and one year of experience repeated ten times, perhaps?

Alas, I know zilch about the field myself, so someone else will have to
write the review. My one usage of GPS is following automobile
navigation directions from one address to another.

[Kay Shapero]

In article <MPG.2b4a8246e...@news.eternal-september.org>,
k...@invalid.net says...

>
> In article <oMmdnXzvLcFNOEPN...@brightview.co.uk>,
> jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk says...
>
> >
> > The reviewer says, for example, that a GPS doesn't let you know
> > if something's 300 yards north and west from something else. Yes
> > it does, and how to do it is actually spelled out in one scene.
> > Various other points he makes show he's a comparative beginner
> > who thinks he's an expert.
>
> One of those folks who can't tell the difference between ten years of
> experience and one year of experience repeated ten times, perhaps?

Took another look at the review. Two years? He's been at this for two
whole years and he thinks he's an expert. Oi.

[JF]

On 31/12/2012 01:17, Kay Shapero wrote:

> Took another look at the review. Two years? He's been at this for two
> whole years and he thinks he's an expert. Oi.

He is to people with only a new GPS and a couple of finds. It's
a hobby that caters for everyone, from 4 year olds (Eddie loves
going out with his Grandma, weston wanderer) to old chaps in
wheelchairs who have to be driven to the locations. But the book
is just about two people (or at least that's what I wrote), and
you can read it straight through without worrying about the caches.

Miffed by the review I checked when we made our first cache:
Gnome Sweet Gnome was put out in 2007 just for kids. It's a
little red door with a brass handle, and the expected inhabitant...

Maybe I'm just a big kid, too.

JF
www.geocaching.com

[Kay Shapero]

In article <-OqdnWG8soYKxHzN...@brightview.co.uk>,
jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk says...

>

> Miffed by the review I checked when we made our first cache:
> Gnome Sweet Gnome was put out in 2007 just for kids. It's a
> little red door with a brass handle, and the expected inhabitant...

Got any pictures? That sounds really cute.

>
> Maybe I'm just a big kid, too.

Best way to have fun goodness knows. The opportuinty for play is what
got me into active science fiction fandom in the first place.

[JF]

On 31/12/2012 22:39, Kay Shapero wrote:

>> Miffed by the review I checked when we made our first cache:
>> Gnome Sweet Gnome was put out in 2007 just for kids. It's a
>> little red door with a brass handle, and the expected inhabitant...
>
> Got any pictures? That sounds really cute.

Finders are always putting up a picture and we have to ask them
to take it down -- the amazement on the faces of small children
when they see it for the first time, without a clue as to what
is there, is well worth the hassle.

We set the cache with just a box inside. After a couple of weeks
a parcel arrived through the post containing a gardening gnome,
complete with covering letter asking for employment. It took us
ages to puzzle out where it came from.

I mentioned the owls. Three species of owl and a gnome, all in
one tree. That's real nature conservation.

JF
Oh, yes. Happy New Year everyone.

[Kay Shapero]

In article <2rydnWMWUoWyE3_N...@brightview.co.uk>,
jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk says...

>
> On 31/12/2012 22:39, Kay Shapero wrote:
>
> >> Miffed by the review I checked when we made our first cache:
> >> Gnome Sweet Gnome was put out in 2007 just for kids. It's a
> >> little red door with a brass handle, and the expected inhabitant...
> >
> > Got any pictures? That sounds really cute.
>
> Finders are always putting up a picture and we have to ask them
> to take it down -- the amazement on the faces of small children
> when they see it for the first time, without a clue as to what
> is there, is well worth the hassle.

Good point - I shall simply continue to use my imagination. Sounds cool
in any case.

>
> We set the cache with just a box inside. After a couple of weeks
> a parcel arrived through the post containing a gardening gnome,
> complete with covering letter asking for employment. It took us
> ages to puzzle out where it came from.

Grin.

>
> I mentioned the owls. Three species of owl and a gnome, all in
> one tree. That's real nature conservation.

Yeppers - one big happy family!

> Oh, yes. Happy New Year everyone.

Same to you!

[Bill Swears]

On Saturday, December 29, 2012 10:49:16 PM UTC-9, J.Pascal wrote:

>
>
> Bill, when I try to search for Zook Country with my Nook I don't find anything. Are they selling it in paper?
>
>
>
> -Julie

julie, Barnes and Noble is selling Zook Country. I looked it up on the web at Barnes and Noble. The price is about $15.05 as of right now, which is a slight change in the discount (it's now 20%). I got on B&Ns website, searched for the book by name, and found both paper and nook versions. Nook is still $2.99. My replies here have just become problematic, because my internet provider just dropped their usenet service, so I'm on Google News until I can find a new pathway.

Bill

[Bill Swears]

Mr. Beam and I discuss philosophy at times. Generally he'll hid in something dark, like cola dark, in order to slip up on me. Today though, he was dressed in a yellow cream color, like commercial egg nog, but with a little more tang. twisted conversationalist.

[Kay Shapero]

In article <c153b487-577c-4166...@googlegroups.com>,
wsw...@gci.net says...

>

>
> My replies here have just become problematic, because my internet
> provider just dropped their usenet service, so I'm on Google News
> until I can find a new pathway.

When this sort of thing became endemic, we added a collection of links
to the rec.music.filk FAQ here:
http://www.kayshapero.net/filkunet.htm

Including a number of free feeds. Thus far I've had very good results
with the one I use, Eternal September (eternal-september.org.)

[Will in New Haven]

On Dec 28 2012, 6:05 am, JF <jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk>
wrote:
> My non-SF geocaching novel, The Geocache Killer, sits
> unassumingly on Amazon, happily ignored by me and almost
> everyone. Unfortunately someone has actually bought a copy and
> written a humdinger stinker of a review which will preclude any
> further chance of sales.

Well, this thread interested me enough that I went and bought the
book. It is on my to-read list. I didn't see any reviews while I was
there. I also picked up a copy of _Salamander_

I read it and
http://www.amazon.com/review/R1AID24VAHUJEE/ref=cm_sw_r_fa_cm_cr_notf_app_fbt?post_id=1180247684_504154306307454#_=_

Actually, my four-star review, while favorable, is dim in the company
of many five-star reviews.

--
Will in New Haven

[JF]

On 05/01/2013 23:14, Will in New Haven wrote:

> Well, this thread interested me enough that I went and bought the
> book. It is on my to-read list. I didn't see any reviews while I was
> there.

I hope you went through the process of reading the sample first.
Anyone expecting real-life gritty crime from me is... well, it's
like reading my SF and expecting scifi*.

> I also picked up a copy of _Salamander_

Please let the memory of that fade a bit before turning to me.
Sometimes I'd rather not compete -- well, not if I know I'm out
of my league or perhaps playing tiddlywinks in an arse-kicking
contest.

I went to a caching event in Norwich today. I've run out of the
cards but I left an A4 poster on the registration desk. Someone
stopped me at the end of the day and said he was going to buy
when he got home. That must have nearly doubled the sales total.

JF
*I got The Long Earth for Christmas: a pinch of Pratchett to a
peck of Baxter to borrow a phrase from DLS. I miss 'engagement',
someone to watch and worry about, someone to care for, usually
the great strength of a Pratchett book. Early yet, maybe it's not
the book but post Christmas ennui.

[Don Kuenz]

Jacey Bedford <look...@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> Well, I just gave it a 4* review.
> :-)

Bless you. You are a kind person.

A "fire and brimstone" criticism that holds back nothing and even adds
a halftruth or two tells me plenty. About the critic. Making it a
rather simple chore to discern the critic's worldview.

Does the critic exude a spiritual or a temporal worldview? Does the
critic seem empathetic or mean?

The answers to such questions tell me how to weigh the criticism. A
negative criticism from a righteous critic serves as a warning. A
negative criticism from a worldly critic indicates treasure.

--
Don Kuenz

[Gruff]

On Friday, December 28, 2012 11:05:09 AM UTC, JF wrote:
> My non-SF geocaching novel, The Geocache Killer, sits
>
> unassumingly on Amazon, happily ignored by me and almost
>
> everyone. Unfortunately someone has actually bought a copy and
>
> written a humdinger stinker of a review which will preclude any
>
> further chance of sales.
>
>
>

> Has anyone got any advice?
>
>
>
> JF

I just read it and it didn't put me off at all. The guy's a geocacher and clearly took the novel all a bit personally. His objections were highly subjective (and I thought your characters sounded fun - he obviously doesn't have a sense of humour). I wouldn't worry about it. So long as you get good reviews too, people will make their minds up.

I think it's far better to get 'marmite' reviews than lots of 2 or 3 stars. I set out deliberately with The Looking Glass Club to write a book that would have get polarised reviews.

Well done for getting out there I say!

Gruff
www.TheLookingGlassClub.com

[JF]

On 07/01/2013 16:36, Gruff wrote:


So long as you get good reviews too, people will make their
minds up.

What worried me was that one sitting there forever: no-one
would buy if that ws the only one.

Onwards and upwards -- I took the poster (run out of cards) to a
cache meet and someone actually asked about it. I told him to
read the freebie and reviews before buying, on the basis that I'd
hate him to find it wasn't a Ken Follett style brick

JF

[David Dyer-Bennet]

David Friedman <dd...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> writes:

> In article <ba27897c-739d-41f5...@googlegroups.com>,

> "J.Pascal" <ju...@pascal.org> wrote:
>
>> I think that sometimes readers like to hear from the author.
>>
>
> And vice versa.
>
> One of the nice things about the internet is that you can read a book,
> locate, with luck, the author's email, and send him your comments. Some
> authors will ignore such, others will appreciate and respond.

In some ways, it's harder now. If you had the published paper book, you
had the publisher's address, and you just wrote to the author care of
them.
--
Googleproofaddress(account:dd-b provider:dd-b domain:net)
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info

[David Dyer-Bennet]

David Friedman <dd...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> writes:

> In article <ba27897c-739d-41f5...@googlegroups.com>,
> "J.Pascal" <ju...@pascal.org> wrote:
>
>> I think that sometimes readers like to hear from the author.
>>
>
> And vice versa.
>
> One of the nice things about the internet is that you can read a book,
> locate, with luck, the author's email, and send him your comments. Some
> authors will ignore such, others will appreciate and respond.

And sometimes I've had authors show up in my email after I talked about
their books in my book log, even.

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

On 1/7/13 3:36 PM, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:
> David Friedman <dd...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com> writes:
>
>> In article <ba27897c-739d-41f5...@googlegroups.com>,
>> "J.Pascal" <ju...@pascal.org> wrote:
>>
>>> I think that sometimes readers like to hear from the author.
>>>
>>
>> And vice versa.
>>
>> One of the nice things about the internet is that you can read a book,
>> locate, with luck, the author's email, and send him your comments. Some
>> authors will ignore such, others will appreciate and respond.
>
> And sometimes I've had authors show up in my email after I talked about
> their books in my book log, even.
>

Especially those of us who have Google set to alert us to people
speaking our names, like D&D demons.

--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com

[Kay Shapero]

In article <kcfgic$8kk$2...@dont-email.me>, sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com
says...

>

> >
> > And sometimes I've had authors show up in my email after I talked about
> > their books in my book log, even.
> >
>
> Especially those of us who have Google set to alert us to people
> speaking our names, like D&D demons.

One of the advantages of having an unusual name or spelling - the "e" in
my surname means that if I Google myself, I'm the only Kay Shapero I
encounter in the resultant ton of listings. My brother, Carl Jones, has
a lot more anonymity. :)

Of course when you get two writers with ALMOST the same name outre
doesn't begin to describe it...

[JF]

On 10/01/2013 23:11, Koralatov wrote:

> <http://www.flickr.com/photos/koralatov/4994854891>

I began and abandoned a short around the beef prion scare. All
I remember is someone being described as 'pure beef between the
ears'.

JF

[Raymond Daley]

"Koralatov" <use...@koralatov.com> wrote in message
news:kcnhfa$2rk$4...@dont-email.me...

> On 2012-12-30, Raymond Daley wrote:
>
>> When I first got online in the late 90's I emailed Joe Haldeman to
>> thank him for The Forever War which helped me through some very
>> difficult periods in my RAF career.
>> Joe was very nice in his reply and extremely understanding.
>

> Great book, and I'm pleased to hear that Haldemann himself is a nice
> guy. He's not particularly `high profile', so it's hard to get a bead
> on him from a distance.
>
> Wasn't really a fan of _Forever Free_, though. Did you ever read it?

Yeah, I've read them all.

Peace is the one where they use telepresence to control robots in combat
isn't it?
Free is the terrible one where everyone suddenly vanishes and they're being
hidden by "a god" in underground caves.
I'm not sure which of those 2 I hate more.
Scarily I do re-read both though, maybe one day I'll actually understand
Peace.

[Bill Swears]

On 1/7/2013 7:13 PM, Kay Shapero wrote:
> In article <kcfgic$8kk$2...@dont-email.me>, sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com
> says...
>>
>
>>>
>>> And sometimes I've had authors show up in my email after I talked about
>>> their books in my book log, even.
>>>
>>
>> Especially those of us who have Google set to alert us to people
>> speaking our names, like D&D demons.
>
> One of the advantages of having an unusual name or spelling - the "e" in
> my surname means that if I Google myself, I'm the only Kay Shapero I
> encounter in the resultant ton of listings. My brother, Carl Jones, has
> a lot more anonymity. :)
>
> Of course when you get two writers with ALMOST the same name outre
> doesn't begin to describe it...
>

Speaking as a man with a verb for a last name, I've had little luck with
robot searches. Google seems to do okay, but after about 10-15 hits its
starts bring in every mention of somebody swearing, anywhere on the net.

Bill

--
Bill Swears
Http://www.billswears.com

[Raymond Daley]

"Bill Swears" <wsw...@gci.net> wrote in message
news:kdp18g$d1p$3...@dont-email.me...

> Bill Swears

I'm of a mind that only my mum is allowed to call my Raymond so I write as
Ray Daley. Sadly Google knows he was also a character in an 80's tv show
called Minder. I was Ray Daley over a decade before he was ever invented
though!

[Bill Swears]

I'm thinking of republishing Zook Country as Zool County under the name
Brian Charger, or Campnell, or something "C"ish.

[david.sh...@ymail.com]

On Jan 23, 11:30 am, Bill Swears <wswe...@gci.net> wrote:
>
> I'm thinking of republishing Zook Country as Zool County under the name
> Brian Charger, or Campnell, or something "C"ish.

There is no "Zook Country", there is only Zuul.

[JF]

On 23/01/2013 15:57, Bill Swears wrote:

> Speaking as a man with a verb for a last name, I've had little
> luck with robot searches.

Try researching your family history with a noun. Then add the
complication of variant spellings -- Flud, Flude, Fludd etc. And
Floyd, Lloyd, Loyd. Ap Powell. Walshman.

Flude is fun. Argent, an eagle displayed with two necks, sable.

JF

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <ubidnYOMVbvQyp3M...@brightview.co.uk>,

My maiden name was Jones. I'm not even going to try.

--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.

[Dan Goodman]

You only have to search in a couple of languages. For my ancestors, the
records might be in Russian, Polish, Hebrew, Spanish....

As for variable spellings: My paternal grandfather once mentioned that
his first job in the US was writing letters for a furniture factory. I
asked if he hadn't had difficulty with spelling.

No. Besides his Hebrew education, he'd had a year of education in
Polish. Polish and English are in the same alphabet; why would spelling
be a problem?

As most here probably know, English and Polish use different spelling
conventions.





--
Dan Goodman

[Bill Swears]

Are you the gatekeeper? The Keymaster?

[JF]

On 24/01/2013 00:07, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:

>
> My maiden name was Jones. I'm not even going to try.

Ah, Welsh. Hail, sweet cousin!

JF

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <PsydnRzoAsUgTp3M...@brightview.co.uk>,

I'm proud to be your cousin, Julian, even if it's what in some
parts of the States we call "kissin' cousins," that is, related
somehow or other but nobody has worked it out.

[Jacey Bedford]

In message <ubidnYOMVbvQyp3M...@brightview.co.uk>, JF
<jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> writes

My family history research wasn't too bad on the Lockyer side of things
as it's not a very common name in any of its spelling variants (Loker,
Lokier, Lockyear) but the Bennets and the Bedfords? Not so good. Even
worse when you get back few generations to Thomas Jones, a miner from
North Wales born in 1826. (No birth certificates existed before 1837 in
the UK).

In addition to having one of the most common names in Wales he was also
census-shy and managed to keep away from the census enumerators in 1841,
1851 and 1861. The family doesn't appear on any census until 1871 -
after Thomas had been killed in a mining explosion (The Oakes Colliery
disaster, 1866 in Barnsley - along with his two eldest sons age 19 and
17).


I've managed to get back to around 1600 on several family lines, though.
Fascinating stuff.

Jacey
--
Jacey Bedford

[JF]

On 24/01/2013 15:40, Jacey Bedford wrote:

>
> I've managed to get back to around 1600 on several family lines,
> though. Fascinating stuff.

You realise that 1600 is amazingly good? We've stalled at 1750
ish with a gap of 150 years between that and the really
interesting kin. It's tantalising -- in the early 1500s there's a
Fludd/Floyd/Walshman six miles (six miles!) from where my great
grandparents are buried, but no way to make a connection. One of
the folkies is keen on tracing back and she says it's always in
the 1700s that the connections peter out.

JF

[Jacey Bedford]

In message <5o-dnTsqp7Yq15_M...@brightview.co.uk>, JF
<jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> writes

Yes, I'm quite proud of the 1600 lines and couldn't have done it just a
few years ago but now there are a lot more parish records online so it's
easier. Of course if I were really dedicated I'd be off down to the
Forest of Dean and up to the various records offices to see the actual
registers.

The LDS batch numbers have been very useful, too.

Of course, I've also hit quite a few brick walls with some lines and
there are some where it's just impossible to guess which of two people
with the same name is the correct one.

And this is always presuming that BB's Grandpa was actually his
grandfather (because there are strong rumours about the lodger and no
one quite knows which of the 13 kids belong to Grandpa and which ones to
the mysterious 'Tarp'!)
:-)

Ah the joys of genealogy.

It's fun cracking the puzzles, though.

Jacey
--
Jacey Bedford

[JF]

On 25/01/2013 14:56, Jacey Bedford wrote:

> And this is always presuming that BB's Grandpa was actually his
> grandfather (because there are strong rumours about the lodger
> and no one quite knows which of the 13 kids belong to Grandpa and
> which ones to the mysterious 'Tarp'!)

They say that there's always something shameful when you start
digging. A bit of hows-yer-father is nothing, though. In our line
I think I've found an MP....


JF

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <ycadnfQQ7cE5c5_M...@brightview.co.uk>,

Somewhat north of where you are, a typical put-down is "Aaaah...
I knew his father."

[Jacey Bedford]

In message <ycadnfQQ7cE5c5_M...@brightview.co.uk>, JF
<jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> writes

OMG, that's terrible. Hang your head in shame, Mr Fludde.

Jacey
--
Jacey Bedford

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <Cx1Z8zqU...@parkhead.demon.co.uk>,

In Alisa Craig (Charlotte MacLeod)'s _A Dismal Thing to Do,_ RCMP
Detective Inspector Madoc Rhys has reason to suspect that the
perp he wants is from a particular neck of the woods (peculiar
local accent), so he talks to a friend of his from the same
region, asking, "Do you recall any of your boyhood buddies going
to the bad?" His friend answers, "Well, one's in jail and one's
in Parliament."

[JF]

On 25/01/2013 22:37, Jacey Bedford wrote:

Mr Fludde.


Fludde! I haven't searched on Fludde! Dammit....

JF
Hilary Mantel's novel, Flud, may well be about a kinsman. I've
not read it, but I've stalled with her first novel about Thomas
Cromwell. People talk about her wonderful writing style. I think
'why the hell is this in present tense?' It has an insistent
whining tone and the constructions are such that you have to pay
close attention to understand what's going on. IDCWHTTP.

[Jacey Bedford]

In message <h8OdnUgxcLrIFJ7M...@brightview.co.uk>, JF
<jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> writes

>On 25/01/2013 22:37, Jacey Bedford wrote:
>
> Mr Fludde.
>
>
>Fludde! I haven't searched on Fludde! Dammit....

:-)

>
>JF
>Hilary Mantel's novel, Flud, may well be about a kinsman. I've not read
>it, but I've stalled with her first novel about Thomas Cromwell. People
>talk about her wonderful writing style. I think 'why the hell is this
>in present tense?' It has an insistent whining tone and the
>constructions are such that you have to pay close attention to
>understand what's going on. IDCWHTTP.
>

Oh dear, I've bought that and it's on my kindle waiting for me to get
round to reading it.

Jacey
--
Jacey Bedford

[Will in New Haven]

Is Jones always Welsh? I knew that lots of Welshmen and women are
named Jones but I always figured there were Joneses who weren't. I
have a friend whose first cricket team was all Lewises and Joneses and
one kid from outside the area named Williams and that was in Wales.

--
Will in New Haven
"I believe you find life such a problem because you think there are
the good people and the bad people. You're wrong, of course. There
are, always and only, the bad people, but *some of them are on
opposite sides.*" -- Patrician Vetinari in Pratchett's /Guards!
Guards!/

[David Goldfarb]

In article <h8OdnUgxcLrIFJ7M...@brightview.co.uk>,

JF <jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> wrote:
>Hilary Mantel's novel, Flud, may well be about a kinsman. I've
>not read it, but I've stalled with her first novel about Thomas
>Cromwell. People talk about her wonderful writing style. I think
>'why the hell is this in present tense?' It has an insistent
>whining tone and the constructions are such that you have to pay
>close attention to understand what's going on. IDCWHTTP.

I didn't have any problem with the tense, myself -- maybe I've
read enough Charlie Stross that I've become immunized. Nor did
I find that I had to pay especially close attention to the prose
or lose the thread. It did take me a while to finish, simply
because it's long and didn't have a high amount of I-want-to-read-it-osity,
but I liked it well enough to acquire the sequel.

--
David Goldfarb |"...I'm a member of the Centre Extremist party.
goldf...@gmail.com | We have very moderate views, but if you don't
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu | agree with them, we'll kill you."

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <abbea46d-c459-450a...@f6g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>,

Will in New Haven <bill....@taylorandfrancis.com> wrote:
>On Jan 24, 1:24 am, JF <jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 24/01/2013 00:07, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > My maiden name was Jones.  I'm not even going to try.
>>
>> Ah, Welsh. Hail, sweet cousin!
>
>Is Jones always Welsh? I knew that lots of Welshmen and women are
>named Jones but I always figured there were Joneses who weren't. I
>have a friend whose first cricket team was all Lewises and Joneses and
>one kid from outside the area named Williams and that was in Wales.

Yes, that's an old joke: the English census taker who
canvassed a Welsh village and quit nine-tenths through,
declaring, "Every man in this village is named John
Jones!" But he was wrong, because down the end of the
last street was a man named Williams.

Jones, Williams, Hughes, et cetera are all fossilized
patronymics, imposed around the sixteenth century by
Englishmen who were tired of keeping trap of Hywell ap
Madoc ap Rhodri ap Gwyn, and insisted that the Welshmen
adopt surnames.

The surname Jones, however, doesn't necessarily lead to
an ancestor whose first name was John. Many Welshmen
were sufficiently incensed by the whole idea that they
chose Jones as a surname even if their father's name
hadn't been John, and there were times when to say a man
was "a Jones" meant he was a rebel.

Not to mention all the immigrants to the US during the
nineteenth century, whose surnames the immigration
officials could neither spell nor pronounce, so they
said "Never mind and that, we'll call you Smith or
Jones."

But I come by my maiden name honestly; I'm one-quarter
genuine Welsh. My father was half Welsh; his father was
the son of immigrants from, I seem to recall, Mold in
North Wales.

[JF]

On 28/01/2013 05:25, David Goldfarb wrote:

>> Hilary Mantel's novel, Flud,

> I didn't have any problem with the tense, myself -- maybe I've
> read enough Charlie Stross that I've become immunized. Nor did
> I find that I had to pay especially close attention to the prose
> or lose the thread. It did take me a while to finish, simply
> because it's long and didn't have a high amount of I-want-to-read-it-osity,
> but I liked it well enough to acquire the sequel.

I may have a thing about present tense. I've written in it, but I
like to save it if possible to change pace, switching to PT when
I need briefly to up the tempo. I have no idea if it works for
the reader but it works for me.

Presumably this is blocking my appreciation of how Miss Mantel
struts her stuff.

JF
>

[JF]

On 28/01/2013 06:57, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:

> But I come by my maiden name honestly; I'm one-quarter
> genuine Welsh. My father was half Welsh; his father was
> the son of immigrants from, I seem to recall, Mold in
> North Wales.

Well, if they went to the market in Wrexham, 15 miles south of
Mold, the Fludds and Jones may have nodded to each other in the
16th century.

JF

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <PaqdnZpTdZVer5vM...@brightview.co.uk>,

That would've been cool. Even if we weren't there to see it.

[Bill Swears]

I finished The Geocache Killer last night. I thought it was a lot of
fun. I'm not sure exactly where the police station was located, except
in East Anglia.

[JF]

On 28/01/2013 19:44, Bill Swears wrote:

>>
> I finished The Geocache Killer last night. I thought it was a
> lot of fun. I'm not sure exactly where the police station was
> located, except in East Anglia.

Good Lord! Thank you.

If you plot out the caches you'll find they are scattered all
over, but Bury St Edmunds makes an approximation for the centre.

JF
Incidentally, The Royston Cave is real. I have a theory (groans
from the back of the class) that it was a Rosicrucian temple,
with the Rev Alabaster of Therfield inducting James I.

[Bill Swears]

No. Thank you! I have professionally published books on my shelves that
remained on my shelves, and in two cases, were laid aside so that I
could finish your novel. I'm trying to read through all of my friends
and indie collection right now, but I thought Millie and Chas were an
interesting couple, so the book rose to the top. I like the business
about his treating her better than others leading to him treating others
better as well.

[JF]

On 30/01/2013 16:17, Bill Swears wrote:

I like the business about his treating her
> better than others leading to him treating others better as well.

He walks out from behind his walls once and finds it easier to
repeat the process. I have some sympathy with grumpy old buggers.
We.... err... they get a bad press and may just be frozen up inside.

Mind you, I wouldn't like to be Millie's next boyfriend. I speak
as a father.

JF

[JF]

On 30/01/2013 16:22, JF wrote:


Forgot to add: I'm glad you liked the interaction. To me* the
true mystery which should be addressed in fiction is the unknown
thing behind other peoples' eyes, so the novel is really about
two people getting to know each other. Catching murderers is a bonus.

JF
*Well, /I/ always find people puzzling.

[Will in New Haven]

On Jan 30, 11:26 am, JF <jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> wrote:
> On 30/01/2013 16:22, JF wrote:
>
> Forgot to add: I'm glad you liked the interaction. To me*


the
> true mystery which should be addressed in fiction is the unknown
> thing behind other peoples' eyes,

This is sig material and I would steal it if I had no conscience.

so the novel is really about
> two people getting to know each other. Catching murderers is a bonus.

I started it and then misplaced my damn Kindle. I am buying a new
Kindle as soon as I am absolutely certain that one is lost and I think
I can recover my books.

>
> JF
> *Well, /I/  always find people puzzling.

Will in New Haven
--
"The true mystery which should be addressed in fiction is the unknown

[JF]

On 31/01/2013 01:34, Will in New Haven wrote:

> "The true mystery which should be addressed in fiction is the unknown
> thing behind other peoples' eyes,"

You know, I look at that apostrophe and wonder -- I've tried it
both ways and neither makes me happy. I've got one novel called
The & Gentleman's Club and I worry about those as well. Don't
start me on 'whose'.

JF
>

[JF]

On 31/01/2013 01:34, Will in New Haven wrote:

I am buying a new
> Kindle as soon as I am absolutely certain that one is lost and I think
> I can recover my books.

Doesn't Amazon do it automatically? All (all! Hah! If they
relied on me they'd go bust) my ebooks have popped up in the
Kindle app on my phone.

Sorry for two posts, I'm half asleep.

JF

[David Friedman]

In article <uMSdndyvD9NR1ZTM...@brightview.co.uk>,

JF <jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> wrote:

> I like the business about his treating her
> > better than others leading to him treating others better as well.
>
> He walks out from behind his walls once and finds it easier to
> repeat the process.

In a way, that's what is hopefully happening in Heinlein's _Podkayne of
Mars_. In my view, the central figure isn't Podkayne but her brother,
and the central issue is whether he is going to end up as a more or less
decent human being or a psychopath, which he is pretty close to being.
His affection for his sister is one of his few links to ordinary
humanity, and the bit about the Venusian pet which he is taking care of
because she will want it when she recovers, along with his final comment
that he thinks it likes him, is the hint of light at the end of the
tunnel. And his uncle's overheard comment is the hint to the reader of
what the story is really about.

--
http://www.daviddfriedman.com/
http://daviddfriedman.blogspot.com/
_Salamander_: http://tinyurl.com/6957y7e
_How to Milk an Almond,..._ http://tinyurl.com/63xg8gx

[Kay Shapero]

In article <ddfr-B76A93.10045131012013@c-131-121-196-
216.gonavy.usna.edu>, dd...@daviddfriedman.nopsam.com says...

>
> In article <uMSdndyvD9NR1ZTM...@brightview.co.uk>,
> JF <jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > I like the business about his treating her
> > > better than others leading to him treating others better as well.
> >
> > He walks out from behind his walls once and finds it easier to
> > repeat the process.
>
> In a way, that's what is hopefully happening in Heinlein's _Podkayne of
> Mars_. In my view, the central figure isn't Podkayne but her brother,
> and the central issue is whether he is going to end up as a more or less
> decent human being or a psychopath, which he is pretty close to being.
> His affection for his sister is one of his few links to ordinary
> humanity, and the bit about the Venusian pet which he is taking care of
> because she will want it when she recovers, along with his final comment
> that he thinks it likes him, is the hint of light at the end of the
> tunnel. And his uncle's overheard comment is the hint to the reader of
> what the story is really about.

I'm inclined to agree, especially after having read the ending Heinlein
originally intended for the story.

--

Kay Shapero
Address munged, try my first name at kayshapero dot net.

[Bill Swears]

On 1/31/2013 9:04 AM, David Friedman wrote:
> In article <uMSdndyvD9NR1ZTM...@brightview.co.uk>,
> JF <jul...@oopsoopsfloodsclimbers.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> I like the business about his treating her
>>> better than others leading to him treating others better as well.
>>
>> He walks out from behind his walls once and finds it easier to
>> repeat the process.
>
> In a way, that's what is hopefully happening in Heinlein's _Podkayne of
> Mars_. In my view, the central figure isn't Podkayne but her brother,
> and the central issue is whether he is going to end up as a more or less
> decent human being or a psychopath, which he is pretty close to being.
> His affection for his sister is one of his few links to ordinary
> humanity, and the bit about the Venusian pet which he is taking care of
> because she will want it when she recovers, along with his final comment
> that he thinks it likes him, is the hint of light at the end of the
> tunnel. And his uncle's overheard comment is the hint to the reader of
> what the story is really about.
>

I thought he was supposed to be trending towards sociopathy. Psychopath
being a nutcase who kills and maims by compulsion, and a sociopath being
an amoral critter that will kill without conscience if you get in his way.

[Bill Swears]

That man has no conscience.

[David Friedman]

In article <kei7q8$ms$1...@dont-email.me>, Bill Swears <wsw...@gci.net>
wrote:

You may be correct--I wasn't making that fine a distinction.

But not "trending towards." He is a sociopath--the question is whether
he is gradually going to trend away from being one.

I suppose one could argue that not caring about the welfare of other
species doesn't count as sociopathy, and from his standpoint ordinary
humans are another species.

(For anyone who hasn't read the book, unlikely as that is on this
newsgroup, the boy is a super genius.)

[JF]

On 02/02/2013 05:24, Bill Swears wrote:

>> Don't start me on 'whose'.

> That man has no conscience.

Why isn't it who's? I know the derivation of the possessive as
e.g. 'the boy his cat >> the boy's cat' has been exploded bt it
makes an easy way to think about it. So, why no 'who his cat'?

JF

[Bill Swears]

Why isn't the possessive of it, it's? Is it to make room for the
contraction? How old are written contractions, anyway?

Bill