Heatwave
OB
Scattered with dry grackle
an afternoon's bramble
envies the sudden trousers
their brushed diplomatic serge -
hears heavy halitus,
"art'noon" (faint), the odd oath,
then lights upon a trickle
stickying the bramble.
Scattered the dry grackle
in sun-dappled bracken,
afternoon's faint cackle
haunts the wooded verge.
Scattering dry crackles
an afternoon's bramble
envies the pyromaniac
his brushed diplomatic serge.
OB
Tom Bishop
"OB" <nevil...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:6ebc501c.03070...@posting.google.com...
Geez man.
It has crackle, and the trickle is nice.
wooded verge is right on the edge of an image.
But it might need spackle, and of course
generous lubrication for any social functions.
Alas, I need help figuring out poetry.
Many of the images here don't make sense,
or I'm too dumb to see them.
For example, I have to wonder what, among other things,
a "brushed diplomatic serge" is, and how it fits with
grackles and crackles and brambles.
OK that I wonder... Ambiguity is great.
but I am not able to form any image
or solution to this, that appeals to me greatly,
and this poem is a barrage of such things.
Which leaves me with a few nice lines,
none the less, and you are still my hero.
What does it mean? :-)
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
"I'm not going to any intervention that doesn't
involve a gun or a guillotine." -- Dale Houstman
OB
Don't worry. Everything I post here appears first on a ML, where I am
given reassurance by the other posters that my words are utterly
incomprehensible to everyone except (sometimes) myself. (Which is why
I am not planning a career as a poet just yet.)
>
> For example, I have to wonder what, among other things,
> a "brushed diplomatic serge" is, and how it fits with
> grackles and crackles and brambles.
>
> OK that I wonder... Ambiguity is great.
> but I am not able to form any image
> or solution to this, that appeals to me greatly,
> and this poem is a barrage of such things.
>
> Which leaves me with a few nice lines,
> none the less, and you are still my hero.
>
> What does it mean? :-)
Here in Spain, every summer we get a series of fires that deplete the
already sparse wood cover in this semi-desert country ("Africa starts
at the Pyrenees", remember). The general consensus is that most of
these fires are started deliberately, either by "pirómanos" or by
people hired by construction and development companies who have a
vested interest in overturning "Green Belt" planning and building
restrictions.
Whether true or not, I liked the idea of describing a "pirómano"
(could have called him an arsonist, but I liked "pyromaniac" better,
for the rhythm, even if possibly wrong connotations, unsure about
that) arriving at a quiet woodland scene and starting a brush fire.
The poem started out (and was posted to the ML) as just four lines:
> Sprinkled with dry stoat
> An afternoon's brambles
> Envy the pyromaniac
> His brushed diplomatic serge.
This contains most of what I wanted to say, but has the small drawback
of being incomprehensible. So I decided to expand it a little for rap.
What I wanted to say here was: imagine the sort of place where you
would go for an afternoon's ramble in the country. Imagine it as being
very hot and dry. Wild too - a dead animal on the ground, left over by
a bigger predator and dried in the sun. Now imagine the feet and legs
of a man standing there. He is clearly not an "afternoon rambler",
since he is wearing trousers of an inappropriate material. Now (it
gets more difficult here) home in on the contrast between the unkempt
wildness of the "brambles" and the neatness of the trousers (remember,
the picture frame only includes the man's feet and legs). What does it
mean? What is going to happen? Clue: "brushed" (the brushing of a
match, to light it) and the easily-accesible homophone "surge" (the
surge of the flame through the tinder-dry vegetation), not to mention
of course "pyromaniac", and the title. But what is the poem really
about? The central word is the only finite verb in the poem, "envy".
Something like: wild disorder "envies" order, is ineluctably replaced
by it, but at the cost of destruction. Well, that's not entirely it,
because it leaves out the emotional content. Once the rest is
understood, "envy" will either convey that to the reader or it will
not. That's where the element of risk lies. (There's also
"diplomatic", which hints at a political reading, but I'd rather not
go there now, and that word would be the first to disappear in a
rewrite.)
To expand and disambiguate this a little, I decided first to include
"trousers", since although I was imagining a close-up of feet and
trouser-cuffs à la Hitchcock (which film was that? Strangers on a
Train?), I didn't actually say so. "Sudden", because they suddenly
appear on the scene, and would be odd and unexpected to the reader at
this stage. I also decided to get rid of "dry stoat", for various
reasons, e.g. because this seemed on reflection too elliptical and
baffling, and also because I've never seen a dead stoat, still less
one torn to pieces, and am not even sure there are any stoats round
these parts, or predators that could make a meal of one. I don't know
what led me to "grackle" (apart from an ornithologically-inclined
childhood), but once it came to me, I couldn't resist it, even though
it's a North American bird. Why? Because it's an unvoiced consonant
away from "crackle", which is what the poem is leading towards (the
fire at the end) and because both are onomatopoeic. It was remiss of
me to leave "dry" in, though, since these birds are not supposed to be
dead, but "scattering" as the pyromaniac approaches, or already
"scattered" through the brush. "Dry" should be there somewhere, but
not referring to the birds.
The second verse is as close as I could get (in the ten minutes I gave
myself) to describing the scene from the bramble's POV: you can't see
most of the arsonist, but you can hear the heavy breathing (he's not
an habitual country walker), the desultory exchange with another
walker who comes and goes, the curses ("odd" still, at this stage -
why curse? because he's been spotted, of course), then the trickle of
petrol over the ground and lowest branches of brushwood, which catches
the light ("lights upon" could read as "light's upon", as well as
foreshadowing the fact that this fuel is going to be "lit" with a
match).
"Scattered the dry grackle", depending on how you parse it, also
"sun-dappled bracken", might stir a literary association or two. At
least they're meant to, but if not, then mea culpa.
I'm not sure if the last four lines are de trop, they're there only
because I was still fretting over whether this would make sense to
anyone but myself, and figured it would help if the reader could at
least hear the "dry crackles" of the flames taking in the brushwood.
Dennis M. Hammes
>
...
>
> Here in Spain, every summer we get a series of fires that deplete the
> already sparse wood cover in this semi-desert country ("Africa starts
> at the Pyrenees", remember). The general consensus is that most of
> these fires are started deliberately, either by "pirómanos" or by
> people hired by construction and development companies who have a
> vested interest in overturning "Green Belt" planning and building
> restrictions.
Has anyone looked into the possibility (probability, around here)
that most were started by broken glass? Broken bottles have this
nasty property of being adequate solar lenses.
--
------(m+
~/:o)_|
To change the world
be that change.
http://scrawlmark.org
Tom Bishop
Say to yourself, here I am at the poetry club, and there are these
three cute poetry groupies asking you to read to them.
Do you pull out this poem?
Maybe.
As long as you have the important occassions covered
perhaps there is time for grackles and brambles.
But why couldn't the fires be started by (one example)
two rocks fucking, and their scraping starts the spark.
But what do I know.
I'm in a Holy War with 900 pound Dennis.
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
"The world is full of asses, but muleshit grows lilacs."
-- Dennis M. Hammes
OB
bec00c$3d9j7$1...@ID-138561.news.dfncis.de...
> Say to yourself, here I am at the poetry club, and there are these
> three cute poetry groupies asking you to read to them.
>
> Do you pull out this poem?
>
> Maybe.
I live in Spain, and poems written in English don't tend to go down
too well with the local poetry groupies. That's why I /write/ in
Spanish, and reserve the occasional tentative approximation to Eng for
mucking around on newsgroups.
However, I take your point. This one don't work.
Click->drag->"Elementos eliminados"->drop. There. Done.
See, you can be a good critic, when you want to.
> But what do I know.
> I'm in a Holy War with 900 pound Dennis.
No you're not. Right now, you're the crashing bore at the party who's
(so far) peed in the bath, thrown up on the carpet, exposed himself to
the hostess in the kitchen, knocked over several glasses, emoted in
people's faces, and is now picking a fight with the hatstand in the
hallway. All of which I could understand, only you say you don't
drink. Be that as it may, I really do think you should call a taxi.
OB
"Usenet is that which, when you stop reading it, stops bugging you."
OB
> OB wrote:
> >
> ...
> >
> > Here in Spain, every summer we get a series of fires that deplete the
> > already sparse wood cover in this semi-desert country ("Africa starts
> > at the Pyrenees", remember). The general consensus is that most of
> > these fires are started deliberately, either by "pirómanos" or by
> > people hired by construction and development companies who have a
> > vested interest in overturning "Green Belt" planning and building
> > restrictions.
> ...
>
> Has anyone looked into the possibility (probability, around here)
> that most were started by broken glass? Broken bottles have this
> nasty property of being adequate solar lenses.
Yes, but broken bottles don't /inspire/ me half as much as arsonists
do (plus I did a "Glass" poem not too long ago). Besides, here we
cherish our conspiracies. (Cuba, May 1898: "hey, who nicked our
coal?")
Tom Bishop
"OB" <nevil...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:6ebc501c.0307...@posting.google.com...
> Tom Bishop <tom-...@truly-NOT.nu> escribió en el mensaje de noticias
> bec00c$3d9j7$1...@ID-138561.news.dfncis.de...
>
> > Say to yourself, here I am at the poetry club, and there are these
> > three cute poetry groupies asking you to read to them.
> >
> > Do you pull out this poem?
> >
> > Maybe.
>
> I live in Spain, and poems written in English don't tend to go down
> too well with the local poetry groupies. That's why I /write/ in
> Spanish, and reserve the occasional tentative approximation to Eng for
> mucking around on newsgroups.
>
> However, I take your point. This one don't work.
> Click->drag->"Elementos eliminados"->drop. There. Done.
>
> See, you can be a good critic, when you want to.
All the time.
I'm always right about my opinion.
But it does change.
>
> > But what do I know.
> > I'm in a Holy War with 900 pound Dennis.
>
> No you're not. Right now, you're the crashing bore at the party who's
> (so far) peed in the bath, thrown up on the carpet, exposed himself to
> the hostess in the kitchen, knocked over several glasses, emoted in
> people's faces, and is now picking a fight with the hatstand in the
> hallway.
That's one way of looking at it.
> All of which I could understand, only you say you don't
> drink.
Nope.
> Be that as it may, I really do think you should call a taxi.
You need a taxi?
I see NO reason to go out there.
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away."
--Philip K. Dick
Texas Max King
"OB" <nevil...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:6ebc501c.0307...@posting.google.com...
. . . if he was inebriated , at least he'd have an excuse.
Maybe all the pain pills over the years have caused brain damage.
I feel somewhat sorry for the poor pathetic fool,
and yet . . . like chuckloser, he was given opportunities
and pissed them off.
Some people just can't quite understand the newsgroup concept.
He just seems like a desperate, lonely psychotic with
the ambition to become a multi-newsgroup loser.
These newsgroups are the only thing he has in life
that would come close to qualifying as 'social discourse'.
Actaully, these newsgroups are his life . . .
it's all he's got. No one would listen to him otherwise.
I'm sure he's scared away anyone with any drop of intelligence
that ever knew him, in the same way he tries to scare the regs away here.
I guess we should remind him this isn't High School . . .
and it sure as hell ain't Kansas.
-Max
pandora
"Texas Max King" <max...@pstx.com> wrote in message
news:bbqOa.58026$hV.33...@twister.austin.rr.com...
>
> "OB" <nevil...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6ebc501c.0307...@posting.google.com...
> > Tom Bishop <tom-...@truly-NOT.nu> escribió en el mensaje de noticias
> > bec00c$3d9j7$1...@ID-138561.news.dfncis.de...
> >
> > > Say to yourself, here I am at the poetry club, and there are these
> > > three cute poetry groupies asking you to read to them.
> > >
> > > Do you pull out this poem?
> > >
> > > Maybe.
> >
> > I live in Spain, and poems written in English don't tend to go down
> > too well with the local poetry groupies. That's why I /write/ in
> > Spanish, and reserve the occasional tentative approximation to Eng for
> > mucking around on newsgroups.
> >
> > However, I take your point. This one don't work.
> > Click->drag->"Elementos eliminados"->drop. There. Done.
> >
> > See, you can be a good critic, when you want to.
> >
> > > But what do I know.
> > > I'm in a Holy War with 900 pound Dennis.
> >
> > No you're not. Right now, you're the crashing bore at the party who's
> > (so far) peed in the bath, thrown up on the carpet, exposed himself to
> > the hostess in the kitchen, knocked over several glasses, emoted in
> > people's faces, and is now picking a fight with the hatstand in the
> > hallway. All of which I could understand, only you say you don't
> > drink. Be that as it may, I really do think you should call a taxi.
Amen to that.
> . . . if he was inebriated , at least he'd have an excuse.
Some excuse, perhaps.
> Maybe all the pain pills over the years have caused brain damage.
I would bet on that one.
> I feel somewhat sorry for the poor pathetic fool,
I don't. You reap what you sow.
> and yet . . . like chuckloser, he was given opportunities
> and pissed them off.
Indeed.
> Some people just can't quite understand the newsgroup concept.
> He just seems like a desperate, lonely psychotic with
> the ambition to become a multi-newsgroup loser.
> These newsgroups are the only thing he has in life
> that would come close to qualifying as 'social discourse'.
Discourse perhaps but never social.
> Actaully, these newsgroups are his life . . .
> it's all he's got. No one would listen to him otherwise.
Is someone listening to him now?
> I'm sure he's scared away anyone with any drop of intelligence
> that ever knew him, in the same way he tries to scare the regs away here.
I don't think that anyone who really understands is scared away. I think
some just can't be bothered fighting the good fight (and I can't really
blame them). Messengers sometimes get killed when others don't like the
message.
> I guess we should remind him this isn't High School . . .
> and it sure as hell ain't Kansas.
Funny thing about that.....I was just writing about Kansas today. Tornadoes
and such that almost got us.
pandora
Dennis M. Hammes
Ok. "Heh."
Texas Max King
> Is someone listening to him now?
I think Sheila is his new best friend, eventually he'll turn on her too,
and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
He subscribes to the masochism school of learning poetry.
His goals are more vindictive then academic.
This is evident by his mouth excretions
in response to Wlods poem.
He also has a 'restricitve' definition of poetry with
little openess for creative freedom.
This is evident by his obsession with
capitalization and punctuation . . .
we've heard that before.
I continue to filter him out including his new femme aliases.
Yet I can still point out his stupidity through responses that
are posted by regulars.
Life is grand indeed!
-Max
"pandora" <pan...@peak.org> wrote in message news:bedvsm$ban$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
sheila miguez herndon
>
>> Is someone listening to him now?
>
> I think Sheila is his new best friend, eventually he'll turn on her
I am sure Tom has no illusions that I am his best friend.
> too, and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
Well, he seems unsteady to me already. As long as he does no harm,
perhaps he'll recover.
Anyway, he says he wants to talk poetry. I am calling.
(I forget the term for when you make the call in poker for everyone to
show their cards? that's calling or not? that's what I mean. in other
words, if he actually does want to talk poetry, I will try to give him a
chance. if he doesn't, then his cards are on the table. so are mine.)
--
sheila
Tom Bishop
"sheila miguez herndon" <sheil...@feafaroth.org> wrote in message news:Xns93B272CCB...@129.188.7.11...
> "Texas Max King" <max...@pstx.com> wrote in
> news:crAOa.58396$hV.34...@twister.austin.rr.com:
> > "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
> >
> >> Is someone listening to him now?
> >
> > I think Sheila is his new best friend, eventually he'll turn on her
>
> I am sure Tom has no illusions that I am his best friend.
Err, no... :-)
Then again, I don't feel bitter anger exuding from her
towards me either.
>
> > too, and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
>
> Well, he seems unsteady to me already. As long as he does no harm,
> perhaps he'll recover.
>
> Anyway, he says he wants to talk poetry. I am calling.
>
> (I forget the term for when you make the call in poker for everyone to
> show their cards? that's calling or not? that's what I mean. in other
> words, if he actually does want to talk poetry, I will try to give him a
> chance. if he doesn't, then his cards are on the table. so are mine.)
Calling means you are meeting all outstanding bets,
and not raising the stakes.
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
Poetry is what gets lost in translation.
-- Robert Frost
>
> --
> sheila
pandora
> "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
>
> > Is someone listening to him now?
>
> I think Sheila is his new best friend,
Hopefully not. I think better of Sheila than that.
eventually he'll turn on her too,
> and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
One can only hope.
> He subscribes to the masochism school of learning poetry.
> His goals are more vindictive then academic.
Absolutely agreed.
> This is evident by his mouth excretions
> in response to Wlods poem.
> He also has a 'restricitve' definition of poetry with
> little openess for creative freedom.
> This is evident by his obsession with
> capitalization and punctuation . . .
> we've heard that before.
Yes, we have indeed. I've heard it ever since I began to eschew punctuation
and capitalization about 12 years ago. I decided that *I* wasn't going to
be constrained by them. I leave others to make their own choices and
indeed, I even enjoy some poetry *with* punctuation and capitalization. It
isn't an either/or for me. I like what I like no matter what form the poet
chooses. I believe there's room for all kinds.
> I continue to filter him out including his new femme aliases.
I've just recenlty switched to OE and was having a bit of trouble with
blocking him. I think I've got the hang of it now (thanks to sheila).
> Yet I can still point out his stupidity through responses that
> are posted by regulars.
> Life is grand indeed!
I agree. The best of all possible worlds.
pandora
sheila miguez herndon
news:befbnf$4epol$1...@ID-138561.news.dfncis.de:
> news:Xns93B272CCB...@129.188.7.11...
>
> Err, no... :-)
>
> Then again, I don't feel bitter anger exuding from her
> towards me either.
Not really. I am judgmental, but at the same time I don't tend to pass my
judgements on. lots of reasons why.
Dennis is fighting with me (well, I'm telling a story here, or maybe you
could call it outright lying, he may not be fighting/learning *me* per
se) -- hence his "soft answer turns away rats" words.
"it" is choosing to talk softly or to do nothing.
I am rock headed, maybe.
>> Anyway, he says he wants to talk poetry. I am calling.
>>
>> (I forget the term for when you make the call in poker for everyone
>> to show their cards? that's calling or not? that's what I mean. in
>> other words, if he actually does want to talk poetry, I will try to
>> give him a chance. if he doesn't, then his cards are on the table. so
>> are mine.)
>
> Calling means you are meeting all outstanding bets,
> and not raising the stakes.
Okay. I'm not sure if it's the best analogy, but it sort of fits. Too bad
(from your pov) that I am not that much of a poetry geek (lately I'm
reading Thomas Disch prose). but anyway.
(and like I said, it's my immature middle child showing.)
(um, I am getting a bit bored of my expositions so I think I'll take a
break now. I hate it when I get bored with myself.)
--
sheila
pandora
"sheila miguez herndon" <sheil...@feafaroth.org> wrote in message
news:Xns93B272CCB...@129.188.7.11...
> news:crAOa.58396$hV.34...@twister.austin.rr.com:
> > "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
> >
> >> Is someone listening to him now?
> >
> > I think Sheila is his new best friend, eventually he'll turn on her
>
> I am sure Tom has no illusions that I am his best friend.
You might be surprised by what hallucinations he has.
> > too, and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
>
> Well, he seems unsteady to me already. As long as he does no harm,
> perhaps he'll recover.
I rather doubt it.
> Anyway, he says he wants to talk poetry. I am calling.
>
> (I forget the term for when you make the call in poker for everyone to
> show their cards? that's calling or not? that's what I mean. in other
> words, if he actually does want to talk poetry, I will try to give him a
> chance. if he doesn't, then his cards are on the table. so are mine.)
It's been done by others but go for it. Everyone is entitled to make their
*own* blunders. :-)
pandora
> --
> sheila
j r sherman
>
>
>"sheila miguez herndon" <sheil...@feafaroth.org> wrote in message
>news:Xns93B272CCB...@129.188.7.11...
>> "Texas Max King" <max...@pstx.com> wrote in
>> news:crAOa.58396$hV.34...@twister.austin.rr.com:
>> > "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
>> >
>> >> Is someone listening to him now?
>> >
>> > I think Sheila is his new best friend, eventually he'll turn on her
>>
>> I am sure Tom has no illusions that I am his best friend.
>
>Err, no... :-)
>
>Then again, I don't feel bitter anger exuding from her
>towards me either.
indeed. bemused contempt always sounds like that.
love and kisses,
j r sherman
------------------------------------------------------------------
"A sad tale's best for winter: I have one
Of sprites and goblins."
------------------------------------------------------------------
Sick Mind
"j r sherman" <jr...@earthlink.net> wrote
> ... bemused contempt ...
And some say you don't write poetry.
Sick Mind a.k.a. Mind Manner
pandora
"Sick Mind" <boro...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:LNIOa.44916$0v4.3...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
> "j r sherman" <jr...@earthlink.net> wrote
>
> > ... bemused contempt ...
>
> And some say you don't write poetry.
>
pandora
Texas Max King
"pandora" <pan...@peak.org> wrote in message news:beff96$sqd$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
>
> "Texas Max King" <max...@pstx.com> wrote in message
> news:crAOa.58396$hV.34...@twister.austin.rr.com...
> > "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
> >
> > > Is someone listening to him now?
> >
> > I think Sheila is his new best friend,
>
> Hopefully not. I think better of Sheila than that.
Sheila is only doing what we all did . . .
giving him the opportunity to prove
that he is serious about writing poetry
and commenting on the poems of others.
So far with most of us here he has failed.
He's cozying up to Sheila because she hasn't been
reading his previous posts and she's the only one here that
will listen to him . . . for now anyways.
Sheila is a nice person and intelligent . . .
I think she'll draw the obvious conclusion.
> eventually he'll turn on her too,
> > and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
>
> One can only hope.
>
> > He subscribes to the masochism school of learning poetry.
> > His goals are more vindictive then academic.
>
> Absolutely agreed.
>
> > This is evident by his mouth excretions
> > in response to Wlods poem.
> > He also has a 'restricitve' definition of poetry with
> > little openess for creative freedom.
> > This is evident by his obsession with
> > capitalization and punctuation . . .
> > we've heard that before.
>
> Yes, we have indeed. I've heard it ever since I began to eschew punctuation
> and capitalization about 12 years ago. I decided that *I* wasn't going to
> be constrained by them. I leave others to make their own choices and
> indeed, I even enjoy some poetry *with* punctuation and capitalization. It
> isn't an either/or for me. I like what I like no matter what form the poet
> chooses. I believe there's room for all kinds.
. . . punctuation and capitalization in poetry are
stylistic preferences. Tommie thinks he wrote the
book on poetic perfection.
Yet I still haven't seen anything he wrote worth
commenting on.
I do know he loves my poetry because
he always likes to jump on it in loving adoration.
Dennis M. Hammes
>
> "Tom Bishop" <tom-0...@truly-NOT.nu> wrote in
> news:befbnf$4epol$1...@ID-138561.news.dfncis.de:
> > "sheila miguez herndon" <sheil...@feafaroth.org> wrote in message
> > news:Xns93B272CCB...@129.188.7.11...
> >> I am sure Tom has no illusions that I am his best friend.
> >
> > Err, no... :-)
> >
> > Then again, I don't feel bitter anger exuding from her
> > towards me either.
>
> Not really. I am judgmental, but at the same time I don't tend to pass my
> judgements on. lots of reasons why.
>
> Dennis is fighting with me (well, I'm telling a story here, or maybe you
> could call it outright lying, he may not be fighting/learning *me* per
> se) -- hence his "soft answer turns away rats" words.
>
> "it" is choosing to talk softly or to do nothing.
>
> I am rock headed, maybe.
>
> >> Anyway, he says he wants to talk poetry. I am calling.
> >>
> >> (I forget the term for when you make the call in poker for everyone
> >> to show their cards? that's calling or not? that's what I mean. in
> >> other words, if he actually does want to talk poetry, I will try to
> >> give him a chance. if he doesn't, then his cards are on the table. so
> >> are mine.)
> >
> > Calling means you are meeting all outstanding bets,
> > and not raising the stakes.
That's "seeing," and you "see" only the high bet (which may have
been seen before you also do so).
"Calling" means nobody else can raise the stake subsequently.
>
> Okay. I'm not sure if it's the best analogy, but it sort of fits. Too bad
> (from your pov) that I am not that much of a poetry geek (lately I'm
> reading Thomas Disch prose). but anyway.
>
> (and like I said, it's my immature middle child showing.)
(That's okay. Like he said, it's his middle finger showing.)
>
> (um, I am getting a bit bored of my expositions so I think I'll take a
> break now. I hate it when I get bored with myself.)
I'll see your bored and raise you a 2x4. Call.
At this point, subsequent players can no longer see the bored, but
must see the (bored plus the) 2x4 or fold. Nobody can raise over
the 2x4, and I lay when the play comes back to me, followed by
whoever cares to show in order.
A player with any brains will not show a losing hand; it lets the
rest know how he bets.
(But /so/ many kiddies bet on that big Ace in the middle of their
hands that the game becomes, yes, boring. 'Specially when I shut
'em out of the game with a pair a ducks ("/deux/"): my 1st
Amendment (/my/ middle finger) with a trigger finger for "backup";
it spells the 2nd Amendment, V, "victory." Kiddies standing safely
/behind/ me copy it as a "peace symbol," 'specially because whenever
I invoke it, /they/ have peace.)
>
> --
> sheila
Dennis M. Hammes
>
> "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
>
> > Is someone listening to him now?
>
> I think Sheila is his new best friend, eventually he'll turn on her too,
> and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
Because that is how Bi-Crawlered Pissin' Sock-Snakes (and by this, O
Best Beloved, he meant the crockophile) always walk.
pandora
>
> "pandora" <pan...@peak.org> wrote in message
news:beff96$sqd$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
> >
> > "Texas Max King" <max...@pstx.com> wrote in message
> > news:crAOa.58396$hV.34...@twister.austin.rr.com...
> > > "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
> > >
> > > > Is someone listening to him now?
> > >
> > > I think Sheila is his new best friend,
> >
> > Hopefully not. I think better of Sheila than that.
>
> Sheila is only doing what we all did . . .
> giving him the opportunity to prove
> that he is serious about writing poetry
Correct.
> So far with most of us here he has failed.
> He's cozying up to Sheila because she hasn't been
> reading his previous posts and she's the only one here that
> will listen to him . . . for now anyways.
> Sheila is a nice person and intelligent . . .
> I think she'll draw the obvious conclusion.
One can only hope so. Either way, it's all her choice.
He thinks he IS poetic perfection. Sadly.
> Yet I still haven't seen anything he wrote worth
> commenting on.
Nor have I.
> I do know he loves my poetry because
> he always likes to jump on it in loving adoration.
:-) I guess he loves mine as well then.
pandora
Tom Bishop
"pandora" <pan...@peak.org> wrote in message news:befnuf$h97$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
Icky poo.
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
Tom Bishop
"pandora" <pan...@peak.org> wrote in message news:befg0q$u2$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
Done by others?
Yes! Rose became my friend last year. Hired me to work for
her and her brother on his website.
She is now saying there is possibly more work.
We continue to be friends.
She thinks I am mostly mediocre and lazy as a poet,
but better than huge tons of /it/ (yours for one).
pandora, I assume you have friends (although recently
you blew of Colin, Angel and Nora). Why would you assume
that I have none?
Just because I don't get along with you, and/or you don't get
along with me doesn't mean that either of us doesn't have
friends. You appear moronic, when you are saying that I
have no friends to people who are obvious friends of mine.
In truly confuses me, how you think you come off as /smart/
by acting the way you do?
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
"Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever."
-- Napoleon Bonaparte
Tom Bishop
"pandora" <pan...@peak.org> wrote in message news:beff96$sqd$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
>
> "Texas Max King" <max...@pstx.com> wrote in message
> news:crAOa.58396$hV.34...@twister.austin.rr.com...
> > "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
> >
> > > Is someone listening to him now?
> >
> > I think Sheila is his new best friend,
>
> Hopefully not. I think better of Sheila than that.
>
> eventually he'll turn on her too,
> > and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
>
> One can only hope.
>
> > He subscribes to the masochism school of learning poetry.
> > His goals are more vindictive then academic.
>
> Absolutely agreed.
I am asking questions.
If you would discuss them, we might move on.
The two of you agreeing that I am some fantasy of yours
isn't going to move us on.
>
> > This is evident by his mouth excretions
> > in response to Wlods poem.
> > He also has a 'restricitve' definition of poetry with
> > little openess for creative freedom.
> > This is evident by his obsession with
> > capitalization and punctuation . . .
> > we've heard that before.
>
> Yes, we have indeed. I've heard it ever since I began to eschew punctuation
> and capitalization about 12 years ago. I decided that *I* wasn't going to
> be constrained by them. I leave others to make their own choices and
> indeed, I even enjoy some poetry *with* punctuation and capitalization.
How much does it affect you. You really prefer no caps, no punc. right?
Honest question. Sometimes just take me at face value.
(Like during most of this bullshit starting with "Down by the cliche")
> It
> isn't an either/or for me. I like what I like no matter what form the poet
> chooses. I believe there's room for all kinds.
You see no inherent reason for punctuation?
As in, it's use as another tool, to convey meaning
and make sense to the reader?
>
> > I continue to filter him out including his new femme aliases.
I wish you would answer my questions,
but as long as you insult me, and killfile me,
I will respond with the only thing I know.
Which is the original questions.
You answer some, but not clear.
>
> I've just recenlty switched to OE and was having a bit of trouble with
> blocking him. I think I've got the hang of it now (thanks to sheila).
You are afraid of nothing.
And the questions you run from will sit in the archive forever.
>
> > Yet I can still point out his stupidity through responses that
> > are posted by regulars.
> > Life is grand indeed!
>
> I agree. The best of all possible worlds.
I can live with it if you can.
But don't expect me to just let your vile bullshit stand
unchallenged.
The two of you are acting like children.
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
Poetry is what gets lost in translation.
-- Robert Frost
Tom Bishop
"Texas Max King" <max...@pstx.com> wrote in message news:L8KOa.50094$XV.31...@twister.austin.rr.com...
>
> "pandora" <pan...@peak.org> wrote in message news:beff96$sqd$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
> >
> > "Texas Max King" <max...@pstx.com> wrote in message
> > news:crAOa.58396$hV.34...@twister.austin.rr.com...
> > > "pandora" <pan...@peak.org
> > >
> > > > Is someone listening to him now?
> > >
> > > I think Sheila is his new best friend,
> >
> > Hopefully not. I think better of Sheila than that.
>
> Sheila is only doing what we all did . . .
> giving him the opportunity to prove
> that he is serious about writing poetry
> and commenting on the poems of others.
> So far with most of us here he has failed.
I think my comments on both of your /poems/ is quite
legitimate.
The fact that you can't take criticism, or even explain
what I have wrong, indicates you are a baby.
> He's cozying up to Sheila because she hasn't been
> reading his previous posts and she's the only one here that
> will listen to him . . . for now anyways.
> Sheila is a nice person and intelligent . . .
> I think she'll draw the obvious conclusion.
Gawd, what a moron.
You are going to love my relatives.
>
> > eventually he'll turn on her too,
> > > and she'll realize how unstable he really is.
> >
> > One can only hope.
> >
> > > He subscribes to the masochism school of learning poetry.
> > > His goals are more vindictive then academic.
> >
> > Absolutely agreed.
> >
> > > This is evident by his mouth excretions
> > > in response to Wlods poem.
> > > He also has a 'restricitve' definition of poetry with
> > > little openess for creative freedom.
> > > This is evident by his obsession with
> > > capitalization and punctuation . . .
> > > we've heard that before.
> >
> > Yes, we have indeed. I've heard it ever since I began to eschew punctuation
> > and capitalization about 12 years ago. I decided that *I* wasn't going to
> > be constrained by them. I leave others to make their own choices and
> > indeed, I even enjoy some poetry *with* punctuation and capitalization. It
> > isn't an either/or for me. I like what I like no matter what form the poet
> > chooses. I believe there's room for all kinds.
>
> . . . punctuation and capitalization in poetry are
> stylistic preferences. Tommie thinks he wrote the
> book on poetic perfection.
No moron, I am trying to figure it out, and you refuse to
help.
> Yet I still haven't seen anything he wrote worth
> commenting on.
So don't. Your opinion would be taken, but greatly
discounted. Given what you write, doubtful you
would say much of interest. But feel free.
> I do know he loves my poetry because
> he always likes to jump on it in loving adoration.
I see very little to comment in your centerspaced
garbage. Neither did peter at one point, but he needs
you to troll me I guess.
>
> > > I continue to filter him out including his new femme aliases.
Must not be working.
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
"The world is full of asses, but muleshit grows lilacs."
-- Dennis M. Hammes
> >
Tom Bishop
"pandora" <pan...@peak.org> wrote in message news:beg8dv$lva$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
>
> He thinks he IS poetic perfection. Sadly.
You never got this from me.
I've been nothing but asking questions all along.
The fact that you won't discuss it would seem to
indicate a problem on your side, not mine.
I never said I knew much, and disclaimed it in
the comments on your "Down by.." that you
can't get out of your mind.
--
Tom Bishop -- http://Poetry.Here.Nu
"We have Art to save ourselves from the truth."
-- Friedrich Nietzsche