Chinese poem translation: 相見歡
Xah Lee
相見歡
李煜
無言獨上西樓，月如鉤。寂寞梧桐深院，鎖深秋。
剪不斷，理還亂，是離愁。別是一般滋味，在心頭。
Xah
x...@xahlee.org
∑ http://xahlee.org/PageTwo_dir/more.html ☄
Dale Houstman
Here's all I get from an on-line translator. The passionate expression
makes me want to weep into the reeds...
□□□g the Li 煜 □o word □□ above west □ pulls □ the month like □^.
Lonely Chinese parasol tree deep courtyard, □i late autumn. Does not
cut □ 啵 □ the principle □□□y, is □x worries. □e is the general taste,
in heart □^.
Xah Lee
相見歡 | Union Joy
李煜 | Li Yu
無言獨上西樓, | singly sans words, climb atop the belvedere,
月如鉤。| lune shapes the moon.
寂寞梧桐深院, | lonely trees in vacant yards,
鎖深秋。| locks the late autumn.
剪不斷，理還亂, | futile to slash, worsen by sort,
是離愁。is the grief of leave.
別是一般滋味，a relish of its own
在心頭。 at heart.
Hey, it's not too bad! if i may say so.
Xah
x...@xahlee.org
∑ http://xahlee.org/PageTwo_dir/more.html ☄
Martin Ambuhl
Your on-line translator would do a better job if you let it know that
these are traditional characters rather than simplified ones. Better,
but perhaps not well. Here, for example, is Babel Fish's attempt:
Meets happy
Li Yu
Does not have on the word alone west building,
the month like hook.
The lonely Chinese parasol tree deep courtyard, locks the late autumn.
Shears, the principle is also chaotic, is the sorrow of parting.
Maybe general taste, in heart.
Martin Ambuhl
Your on-line translator would do a better job if you let it know that
these are traditional characters rather than simplified ones. Better,
but perhaps not well. Here, for example, is Babel Fish's inadequate
attempt:
Meets happy
Li Yu
Does not have on the word alone west building,
the month like hook.
The lonely Chinese parasol tree deep courtyard, locks the late autumn.
Shears, the principle is also chaotic, is the sorrow of parting.
Maybe general taste, in heart.
[addition]
This poem was translated by Amy Lowell and Florence Ayscough as:
Silent and Alone
(to the tune "Happiness of Meeting")
Silent and alone, I ascended the West Cupola.
The moon was like a golden hook.
In the quiet, empty, inner courtyard, the coolness of early
Autumn enveloped the wutong tree.
Scissors cannot cut this thing;
Unraveled, it joins again and clings.
It is the sorrow of separation.
And none tastes to the heart like this.
Other translations are available in texts from
Alan Ayling and Duncan Mackubtisg
Sam Houston Brock
Daniel Bryant
Chang Kang-i Sun
John Scott
Stephen Soong
Marsha Wagner
Pauline Yu
The world does not need a hack job from the non-poet Xah Lee.
Stuart Leichter
Ambuhl at mam...@earthlink.net wrote on 4/3/05 12:56 PM:
> The world does not need a hack job from the non-poet Xah Lee.
You call this outpost the world? Who died and made you god, Mr. Litotes?
May
> Xah Lee wrote:
> > this one is beyond my caliber. Anyone care to translate it?
> >
> > æ Žç…œ
> >
> > ç„¡è¨€ç ¨ä¸Šè¥¿æ¨“ï¼Œæœˆå¦‚é‰¤ã€‚å¯‚å¯žæ¢§æ¡ æ·±é™¢ï¼ŒéŽ–æ·±ç§‹ã€‚
> > å‰ªä¸ æ–·ï¼Œç †é‚„äº‚ï¼Œæ˜¯é›¢æ„ ã€‚åˆ¥æ˜¯ä¸€èˆ¬æ»‹å‘³ï¼Œåœ¨å¿ƒé 。
> >
> > Xah
> > x...@xahlee.org
> > ∑ http://xahlee.org/PageTwo_dir/more.html ☄
>
> Here's all I get from an on-line translator. The passionate expression
> makes me want to weep into the reeds...
>
>
> Lonely Chinese parasol tree deep courtyard, â–¡i late autumn. Does not
> cut □ 啵 □ the principle □□□y, is □x worries. □e is the general taste,
> in heart â–¡^.
Well, I can just read a part of the poem, would u mind sending me this
poem via Email? maybe I can help. By the way, my English is not up to
par since I'm Chinese!!
Martin Ambuhl
the Amy Lowell translation:
相見 歡
At Meeting, Happiness
李煜
Li Yu
無言 獨 上 西 樓，
Silent [and] alone [I] ascend the West storied building,
月 如 鉤。
The moon like a hook.
寂寞 梧桐 深 院，
In Cold and still[1] the wutong tree[2][in the] dark courtyard,
鎖 深秋。
was locked [by] late autumn.
剪 不 斷，
Scissors cannot cut[3],
理 還 亂，
The texture[4] still in disorder.
是 離愁。
It is the sorrow of separation.
別是 一般 滋味，
There isn't any same taste
在 心頭。
is [to] the heart.
[1] '寂寞' is also 'lonely'
[2] '梧桐' is called a 'parasol' tree
[3] '不斷' also is read solid as 'unceasing'
[4] '理', as 'reason' or 'logic' is common and is certainly involved
here.
translation by Amy Lowell and Florence Ayscough:
Wayne Brown
> this one is beyond my caliber. Anyone care to translate it?
>
> ??
>
> ??????,??????????,????
> ???,???,??????????,????
Others have already commented on these lines that are the beginning of one
of the most famous poems in Chinese literature. They have been translated
into English over and over again by good poets, but several things can still
be said, and I'd like to say them before some dedicated participants of
alt.usage.english are so traumatized by being faced with Chinese poetry
again that they may never want to consider Chinese literature. That would be
a shame because Chinese master poets, even those writing more than a
thousand years ago, still have something to say us today.
Allow me to tell you something about this wonderful poem. It was written by
Li Yu, the last emperor of the Southern Tang who lived from 937 to 978. The
emperor was captured by his enemies, the Northern Song, and taken north to
Kaifeng, one of the major centers of ancient China, located in Henan
Province on the southern bank of the Yellow River. In Kaifeng, the emperor,
knowing he was going to die (he was forced to take poison), wrote one of the
most beautiful poems of world literature.
He starts out by saying that he, alone and silent, walked up to the West
Tower (of the fortress) where he could see the sickle of the moon. He
expresses the thought with just nine Chinese characters, but each one
immediately jolts the reader. "Alone and silent" poignantly expresses his
loneliness. "West Tower" is a image of impending death because the sun sets
in the West and the sun is now about to set on his life. The sickle of the
moon is an image of the moon fading, 'dying,' until there's nothing left but
a sliver.
From his high vantage point, the emperor looks down. Below him he sees a
lonely wutong tree in a courtyard where the clear autumn seems to be locked
up inside. In Chinese mythology, the wutong tree is the only tree on which
the phoenix, one of the four supernatural creatures, will light, and its
appearance on a wutong tree was a symbol of the peaceful rule of a virtuous
emperor. Again we have powerful symbols of confinement, a life coming to an
end and the impending death of an emperor.
Next come four famous lines that are known the length and breadth of China
more than a thousand years after they were written, although some Chinese
may not know their origin. The emperor writes of the pain of having to take
his leave and bid this world farewell. He says ties can be cut but not
severed. He says parting is like a (bitter) taste in the mouth.
Finally, I would like to say something about the Chinese characters and how
they can intensify the way a Chinese poem is perceived by the reader -- a
mechanism that's foreign to the English language with its system of writing
with an alphabet. At the end of his poem the emperor writes about the
melancholy of separation. The character meaning 'melancholy' or 'sorrow' is
made up of the character for autumn placed over the character for heart. How
that fits the text!
I hope my explanation may inspire interest in Chinese culture, one of the
world's greatest.
Regards, ----- WB.
Stuart Leichter
> world's greatest.
>
> Regards, ----- WB.
>
Thank you very much for your insightful explication.
Dale Houstman
Martin Ambuhl wrote:
> Dale Houstman wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Xah Lee wrote:
>>
>>> this one is beyond my caliber. Anyone care to translate it?
>>>
>>> 相見歡
>>> 李煜
>>>
>>> 無言獨上西樓，月如鉤。寂寞梧桐深院，鎖深秋。
>>> 剪不斷，理還亂，是離愁。別是一般滋味，在心頭。
>>>
>>> Xah
>>> x...@xahlee.org
>>> ∑ http://xahlee.org/PageTwo_dir/more.html ☄
>>
>>
>>
>> Here's all I get from an on-line translator. The passionate expression
>> makes me want to weep into the reeds...
>>
>> □□□g the Li 煜 □o word □□ above west □ pulls □ the month like □^.
>> Lonely Chinese parasol tree deep courtyard, □i late autumn. Does not
>> cut □ 啵 □ the principle □□□y, is □x worries. □e is the general
>> taste, in heart □^.
>
>
> Your on-line translator would do a better job if you let it know that
> these are traditional characters rather than simplified ones. Better,
> but perhaps not well. Here, for example, is Babel Fish's attempt:
> Meets happy
> Li Yu
>
I know all that: I just found the vague attempt at meaning amusing...
dmh
Father Ignatius
news:218cf57a.0504...@posting.google.com...
> Well, I can just read a part of the poem, would u mind sending me this
> poem via Email? maybe I can help. By the way, my English is not up to
> par since I'm Chinese!!
<ALeagueOfTheirOwn>I'm May. That's not just a name, it's an
attitude.</ALeagueOfTheirOwn>
Xah Lee
net research shows that there's no indication that this poem is
composed after his capture, nor confirmation that it's about his
capture or remembrance of his kingdom, nor that the Xi1Lo2 is a actual
place or castle, nor the numerous interpretation linking the poem to
facing death. Nor, can i sanction the number of incredible comments you
threw about Chinese mythology or Chinese language.
the comment about Chinese characters aiding poem appreciation, is
entirely preposterous. Chinese ideograms no more effect the poem than
the shape of alphabets effects English compositions. Perhaps you merely
wanted to note the interesting aspects of Chinese ideogram, of their
creation mechanism, etymology, genealogy.
for a account of the author, see
http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/李煜
the English version is more sketchy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li_Houzhu
for some explication of the poem, see
http://www.guxiang.com/shici/songci/liyu/xiangjianhuan.htm
i'd be interested to see published translations. The one given so far
is crass.
my translation is now here:
http://xahlee.org/Periodic_dosage_dir/sanga_pemci/xiang1_jian4_huan1.html
Xah
x...@xahlee.org
∑ http://xahlee.org/PageTwo_dir/more.html ☄
Wayne Brown
> your explanation seem unfounded if taken in any serious way. A little
> net research shows that there's no indication that this poem is
> composed after his capture, nor confirmation that it's about his
> capture or remembrance of his kingdom, nor that the Xi1Lo2 is a actual
> place or castle, nor the numerous interpretation linking the poem to
> facing death. Nor, can i sanction the number of incredible comments
> you threw about Chinese mythology or Chinese language.
>
> the comment about Chinese characters aiding poem appreciation, is
> entirely preposterous. Chinese ideograms no more effect the poem than
> the shape of alphabets effects English compositions. Perhaps you
> merely wanted to note the interesting aspects of Chinese ideogram, of
> their creation mechanism, etymology, genealogy.
[...]
I'm sorry I disappointed you.
Regards, ----- WB.
Father Ignatius
news:d2pmjb$2o7$05$1...@news.t-online.com...
> Others have already commented on these lines that are the beginning of
one
> of the most famous poems in Chinese literature. They have been
translated
> into English over and over again by good poets, but several things can
still
I know nothing of Chinese, and do not claim to be a poet, but I essayed
a translation. I was not aiming to be literal, but rather to say to
English speakers what the poem means, expressing as best I could the
background knowledge provided by Wayne without assuming the reader knows
it. Below is what I have, so far. I'm not satisfied with the title,
which I fear I have not understood. I suspect that the meaning may
alternatively be "Happiness of Union" (of the poet and the moon? Of the
poet and understanding? ...?) (Plus, I was suprised to see no comments
on '(to the tune "Happiness of Meeting)'), and I'm not convinced that I
have selected the correct variant of the translations given. Comments?
-----
Happiness of Reunion
Li Yu
Alone, I silently ascend the western turret.
The moon is a golden sickle.
The still autumn chill locks the phoenix tree
in the dark courtyard.
Scissors cannot ravel this re-knitting sorrow.
It is the melancholy of separation,
And nothing else tastes to the heart like it.
-----
Mike Lyle
The boy has promise! I tried to find a version by Arthur Waley, but
it seems I have none: maybe he didn't make one.
--
Mike.
Martin Ambuhl
> I know nothing of Chinese, and do not claim to be a poet, but I essayed
> a translation. I was not aiming to be literal, but rather to say to
> English speakers what the poem means, expressing as best I could the
> background knowledge provided by Wayne without assuming the reader knows
> it. Below is what I have, so far. I'm not satisfied with the title,
> which I fear I have not understood. I suspect that the meaning may
> alternatively be "Happiness of Union" (of the poet and the moon?
You have been misled. "Happiness of Union"/"Happiness of Meeting"/"Joy
of Encounter" etc. is not a "title" of the poem. It is the name of a
tune to which the poem can be sung. Li Yü used it as a base for more
than one of his poems. For example, he wrote the following to the same
tune (translation by Jiaosheg Weng):
Woodland flowers lose their vernal color
Too soon, all too soon!
How can they stand
Heartless evening blasts and chill rain at dawn?
Rouged tears, how they make one linger and drink one's fill;
Rosy blossoms, when will they reappear?
Regret, long-lasting, this life of ours--
A river of melancholy waters
That ever eastward flows.
Li Yü wrote his poems to be sung to already known tunes. Some that he
liked to reuse include
Happiness of Meeting/Joy of Encounter
Night Crw Calling/The Crow's Nocturnal Cry
Washing Silk in the Creek/Beating Silk Floss
The Beautiful Lady Yü/The Beauty of Yü
The Butterfly Loves the Flowers
Viewing the River Plum-Blossom
Wave-Washed Sand/Sand Washed by Waves
Gazing to the South/Memories of the South
Light Flowing Music
It is unusual when the poem is conceptually related to the name of the tune.
Father Ignatius
news:AEx9e.9970$sp3....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> Father Ignatius wrote:
> You have been misled. "Happiness of Union"/"Happiness of
Meeting"/"Joy
> of Encounter" etc. is not a "title" of the poem. It is the name of a
> tune to which the poem can be sung. Li Yü used it as a base for more
> than one of his poems. For example, he wrote the following to the
same
Ah-ha! Light dawns. Thank you.