do you like nashville?
kokoro
1. coal miner's daughter.
2. short cuts.
John Harkness
kokoro wrote:
Why would you compare it to Coal Miner's Daughter?
Nashville is an impressionist portrait of life in a city
that sprawls across three hours and 24 characters. Coal
Miner's Daughter is a conventional biopic about a well-known
singer that starts strong and finishes weak. (Spacek is
fantastic, however, as is Levon Helm, and his character's
departure is one of the things that weakens the film.)
Nashville is a series of stories that build together
narratively -- the characters go pinballing through the film
bouncing off one another all the way. Short Cuts' characters
are a little more disretely packaged.
BTW, did you know that Altman is the only director to have
won the big prize at the three main European film festivals
-- MASH won the Palme d'or at Cannes, Buffalo Bill And The
Indians won the Golden Bear at Berlin, and Short Cuts won
the Golden Lion at Venice.
John Harkness
chris littlefield
Cuts, had more interesting characters. Loved the Tomlin/Wait, couple.
chris
P.S. Altman, goes from great to lousy. An intersting film maker.
kokoro
John Harkness wrote in message <3721B4EA...@netcom.ca>...
>
>
>kokoro wrote:
>
>> how would you compare it to
>>
>> 1. coal miner's daughter.
>>
>> 2. short cuts.
>
> Why would you compare it to Coal Miner's Daughter?
>Nashville is an impressionist portrait of life in a city
>that sprawls across three hours and 24 characters. Coal
>Miner's Daughter is a conventional biopic about a well-known
>singer that starts strong and finishes weak. (Spacek is
>fantastic, however, as is Levon Helm, and his character's
>departure is one of the things that weakens the film.)
>
country music all wrong whereas coal miner's daughter got it right.
NowReVuing
us did the raving. Twenty-three years later we're probably muttering "Ouch!"
We're not laughing now or even accepting Robert Altman's view of the 70s quite
as much as we did. Altering our original views may be rather simple to explain:
we're tired of his style. Surprisingly, Altman doesn't wear for long; there's
something too contemporary about the character hodgepodge he's so fond of that
we tend to back away from it in repeats. In the 70s, when he was breaking
ground with "M*A*S*H," and in part with "Nashville," we were rather
"technically" involved with his collage of characters, intents and, most
agreeably, sounds. If it's not too arguable that we can still be held to
"M*A*S*H" for its form, it's because the movie is a demo about the use of all
the ingredients to produce the overall effects.
With "Nashville," something regrettably stale emerges: it's the shallowness we
didn't wish to observe the first time around that's exceedingly present today.
That damnable time machine has made Altman an American variant of Richard
Lester -- all knack and evasive of meaning. For Altman, it's more grievous a
sin because he's reaching for substance. That's not to say it isn't there: the
footage of "Nashville" goes on for hours and hours, and he had wanted to one
day air it as a miniseries. (It might be a good thing he didn't: how much more
of Ronee Blakley, Keith Carradine, Geraldine Chaplin and Shelley Duvall could
we take? Their welcome mats are pretty worn.) Watching this celebrated movie
years later doesn't restore any forgotten pleasures, except for Lily Tomlin.
What it did do is remind me just how really good Scorsese's "Taxi Driver" is.
For more on movies, visit http://members.aol.com/NowReVuing/Index.html
kokoro
NowReVuing wrote in message
<19990425060824...@ng-fd1.aol.com>...
>With "Nashville," something regrettably stale emerges: it's the shallowness
we
>didn't wish to observe the first time around that's exceedingly present
today.
>That damnable time machine has made Altman an American variant of Richard
>Lester -- all knack and evasive of meaning. For Altman, it's more grievous
a
>sin because he's reaching for substance. That's not to say it isn't there:
the
>footage of "Nashville" goes on for hours and hours, and he had wanted to
one
>day air it as a miniseries
i think if anything nashville has grown in stature over time. that movie IS
american. we see ross perot there.
we see the clash of cultures, young and old, square and hip, innocent and
corrupt. wee see how the most elaborately planned agendas can be ruined by
one pathetic sicko. and we see how despite all these failings american
reinvent themselves and carry on.
but the music was bad... a hodgepodge of reverence and parody...
John. A. W. Smith
I think you have an odd view of country music. In one case the music
and writer represent the very best country music has produced. In the
other we see a cross section from fine, to wannabe to plain awful.
You pick which are awful. I'm not just talking Gwen Welles.
The community spirit represented by "It Don't Worry Me" is as well
done as I've ever seen. I'd say Ronee Blakely is mighty fine as a
singer.
John
kokoro
John. A. W. Smith wrote in message <37249C...@grin.net>...
>I think you have an odd view of country music. In one case the music
>and writer represent the very best country music has produced. In the
>other we see a cross section from fine, to wannabe to plain awful.
>You pick which are awful. I'm not just talking Gwen Welles.
>
>The community spirit represented by "It Don't Worry Me" is as well
>done as I've ever seen. I'd say Ronee Blakely is mighty fine as a
>singer.
ronee blakely is a fine actress but her songs sucked.... look, i know
country music and no one who cares about country music thinks nashville is
good, musically.
altman told the actors to write their own songs... this shows contempt for
country music..
can you imagine altman making a movie about opera, blues, jazz, or baroque
music and telling his actors to just make up some stuff?
Jeffrey Davis
> There are painfully few exceptions like Lyle Lovett and The Mavericks.
Not Vince Gill? The 'einous sin of 'eresy, lad.
> And NASHVILLE is a great film, in me humble opinion. A great
> American film. A great political film. A great musical film.
> A prophetic, time-capsule of a film which has only grown
> richer with each passing year.
The betrayal plot w/ Carradine and Lily Tomlin is the only thing that
stands out in my memory. I think it's pretty gassy and empty, actually.
Give me McCabe and Mrs Miller, The Long Goodbye, and California Split.
--
Jeffrey Davis <da...@ca.uky.edu>
Thank you, Madam, the agony is somewhat abated.
Jeffrey Davis
> Jeffrey Davis wrote:
>
> >Nimrod wrote:
> >
> >> There are painfully few exceptions like Lyle Lovett and The Mavericks.
> >
> >Not Vince Gill? The 'einous sin of 'eresy, lad.
>
> of a career in country music 30 years ago, if he'd had to compete
> with real country singers.
He may be a modest songwriter, but he's a fine singer and the real deal
as a musician.
greg
>
<snipped a very good rant!>
>And I can't help but question the veracity and country pedigree of
>anyone who claims to "know" country music and, presumably,
>embrace it---yet opts for the phrase "her songs sucked" like some
>gen-X mallrat who thinks suburban fodder like Garth, Wynonna, and
>Trisha are the real deal---when their music is actually just as phony,
>weak, and non-country as anything in NASHVILLE (yet representing their
>mediocre crap in a movie about the current state of Nashville would be
>completely appropriate).
>
>I'll take a haunting, honest Ronee Blakely song over any of their
>processed pablum anyday.
>
>And NASHVILLE is a great film, in me humble opinion. A great
>American film. A great political film. A great musical film.
>A prophetic, time-capsule of a film which has only grown
>richer with each passing year.
Amen! I can't imagine anyone NOT liking that soundtrack!! "I'm Easy" is such a
fine song! And, yes, country is long dead... sigh... ain't nothing like Flatt
and Scruggs or the Louvin Brothers happening today; nor could it.
John. A. W. Smith
Never thought I'd agree 100% with you on anything, but it's at least
99% here :)
John
Nimrod wrote:
> You're full of happy horseshit. I was raised country, in the country,
> when---as they say---country wasn't cool. I bet I know country music
> as well as you do---if not more---having made my living playing it for
> a goodly portion of my younger years. And I'm even a bit of a country
> purist and hardcore crank who dearly loves Bill Monroe, bluegrass,
> primal rockabilly, Hank, Willie, Lefty, Loretta, Merle, Patsy, George
> Jones, Johnny Cash, Roger Miller, Carl Perkins, Faron Young, Mickey
> Newbury, Mac Vickery, Floyd Tillman, Billy Joe Shaver---the list goes
> on and on---while I can't tolerate this soft salon rock that passes
> for country music today (like godawful Garth): country music for folks
> who don't really like country music.
>
> And I love many of the tunes in NASHVILLE, including Ronee Blakely's
> beautiful, heartbreaking "Dues" and "My Idaho Home, "I'm Easy", and
> "It Don't Worry Me" (which was written by Carradine for THE EMPEROR
> OF THE NORTH POLE). In fact, contrary to your erroneous statement,
> all of these songs were already written by Blakely and Carradine prior
> to their ever being attached to the film. I even find Henry Gibson's
> "For The Sake Of The Children" and "200 Years" to be great fun
> despite their not being the epitome of fine country songcrafting.
>
> Pure country music was first and foremost "the people's music"---and
> that has always been its allure to the common, country folk and
> wannabe hillbilly stars, who were pulled toward Nashville and The Opry
> as their country music mecca. And me thinks this is what Altman was
> striving for by allowing so many of the actors to bring their own
> tunes to the party. Plus, Ronee Blakely was primarily a singer and
> songwriter (and a very good one) before she acted in NASHVILLE.
>
> As I've already said elsewhere---while NASHVILLE's music isn't
> strictly accurate country music (in contrast to COAL MINER'S
> DAUGHTER)---I still like NASHVILLE's score on its own terms.
> I find nothing at all contemptuous about Altman's attitude toward
> the music; he simply shows a broad cross-section from the very fine
> to the ridiculous to the mediocre---from dramatic representations of
> bluegrass to straight country to country-folk-rock to turgid morality
> hymns---in a town where even the chauffeur can hit a blues lick
> or two.
>
> By the way, I know other true country music lovers and musicians---who
> also love other kinds of music when its good---who love certain songs
> from NASHVILLE, especially Blakely's and Carradine's. We've talked in
> admiration about Blakely's stuff often and at length. Her songs and
> voice have more depth, are more "true", than 95% of the performers
> at the top of the "country" music industry today.
>
> I hate this bland pap they're now peddling to the suburban mallrats
> under the banner of "country" because I deeply care about country
> music and always have. The megabucks industry they refer to as
> "country" music these days is filled with pretty types with no timbre
> or character in their thin voices. Bland yuppies playing drugstore
> cowboy, talking folksy about how they love rawboned outlaws like
> "Hank" and "Merle" and "Willie"---while they actually grew up in the
> burbs on a steady diet of The Eagles and Bob Seger (and these new
> stars' pedestrian, forgettable soft-country-rock tunes prove it).
> There are painfully few exceptions like Lyle Lovett and The Mavericks.
>
> Real country music is dead and buried as a prime money-making industry
> on the radio and in the music marketplace, even in Nashville, and it
> survives only as a marginal, hardcore niche market. In the early
> Seventies, everybody thought Willie and Waylon were the cutting edge
> of a return to a grittier, tougher breed of country music at the cash
> register. Little did many realize that they were actually the last
> noble wheeze before real country music's death knell.
>
> And I can't help but question the veracity and country pedigree of
> anyone who claims to "know" country music and, presumably,
> embrace it---yet opts for the phrase "her songs sucked" like some
> gen-X mallrat who thinks suburban fodder like Garth, Wynonna, and
> Trisha are the real deal---when their music is actually just as phony,
> weak, and non-country as anything in NASHVILLE (yet representing their
> mediocre crap in a movie about the current state of Nashville would be
> completely appropriate).
>
> I'll take a haunting, honest Ronee Blakely song over any of their
> processed pablum anyday.
>
> And NASHVILLE is a great film, in me humble opinion. A great
> American film. A great political film. A great musical film.
> A prophetic, time-capsule of a film which has only grown
> richer with each passing year.
>
> Nimrod ;->
Jeffrey Davis
>
Perhaps irrelevantly, there's a mountain singer named Nimrod Workman.
Any relation to you?
chris littlefield
chris
Will
> Jeez,
>
> Never thought I'd agree 100% with you [Nimrod] on anything, but it's at least
> 99% here :)
100% hell, I'd have figured 14% an impossible target. But he sure nailed
this one!
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Bart Simpson
Twain, Tammy Wynette, George Jones, ... : they ALL SUCK!!
greg
NASHVILLE this sunday!!! Sure, the Brattle has shitty sound and a REAL bad
screen and it's full of prentious film snobs, but it's NASHVILLE! GO!
chris littlefield
MY SHORTS!!!!!