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James Cameron's greenie lunacy takes him over the edge
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RichA
Apr 24, 2012, 8:10:41 AM4/24/12
to
See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
BBC:
24 April 2012 Last updated at 07:30 ET
Plans for asteroid mining emerge
Details have been emerging of the plan by billionaire entrepreneurs to
mine asteroids for their resources.
The multi-million-dollar plan would use robotic spacecraft to squeeze
chemical components of fuel and minerals such as platinum and gold out
of the rocks.
The founders include film director and explorer James Cameron as well
as Google's chief executive Larry Page and its executive chairman Eric
Schmidt.
They even aim to create a fuel depot in space by 2020.
However, several scientists have responded with scepticism, calling
the plan daring, difficult and highly expensive.
They struggle to see how it could be cost-effective, even with
platinum and gold worth nearly £35 per gram ($1,600 an ounce). An
upcoming Nasa mission to return just 60g (two ounces) of material from
an asteroid to Earth will cost about $1bn.
The inaugural step, to be achieved in the next 18 to 24 months, would
be launching the first in a series of private telescopes that would
search for asteroid targets rich in resources. The intention will be
to open deep-space exploration to private industry.
Within five to 10 years, however, the company expects to progress from
selling observation platforms in orbit around Earth to prospecting
services. It plans to tap some of the thousands of asteroids that pass
relatively close to Earth and extract their raw materials.
The company, known as Planetary Resources, is also backed by space
tourism pioneer Eric Anderson, X-Prize founder Peter Diamandis, former
US presidential candidate Ross Perot and veteran Nasa astronaut Tom
Jones.
The founders of the venture are to give further details in a press
conference on Tuesday.
Long game
"We have a long view. We're not expecting this company to be an
overnight financial home run. This is going to take time," Eric
Anderson told the Reuters news agency.
The billionaires are hoping that the real financial returns, which are
decades away, will come from mining asteroids for platinum group
metals and rare minerals.
"If you look back historically at what has caused humanity to make its
largest investments in exploration and in transportation, it has been
going after resources, whether it's the Europeans going after the
spice routes or the American settlers looking toward the west for
gold, oil, timber or land," Mr Diamandis explained.
Water from asteroids could be broken down in space to liquid oxygen
and liquid hydrogen for rocket fuel. Water is very expensive to get
off the ground so the plan is to take it from an asteroid to a spot in
space where it can be converted into fuel.
From there, it could be shipped to Earth orbit for refueling
commercial satellites or spacecraft.
"A depot within a decade seems incredible. I hope there will be
someone to use it," Dr Andrew Cheng, a planetary scientist at Johns
Hopkins University's Applied Physics Laboratory told the Associated
Press.
"And I have high hopes that commercial uses of space will become
profitable beyond Earth orbit. Maybe the time has come."
Prof Jay Melosh from Purdue University said that the costs were just
too high, calling space exploration "a sport that only wealthy
nations, and those wishing to demonstrate their technical prowess, can
afford to indulge."
Eric Anderson, who co-founded the space tourism firm Space Adventures,
said he was used to sceptics.
"Before we started launching people into space as private citizens,
people thought that was a pie-in-the-sky idea," He said.
"We're in this for decades. But it's not a charity. And we'll make
money from the beginning."
BBC:
24 April 2012 Last updated at 07:30 ET
Plans for asteroid mining emerge
Details have been emerging of the plan by billionaire entrepreneurs to
mine asteroids for their resources.
The multi-million-dollar plan would use robotic spacecraft to squeeze
chemical components of fuel and minerals such as platinum and gold out
of the rocks.
The founders include film director and explorer James Cameron as well
as Google's chief executive Larry Page and its executive chairman Eric
Schmidt.
They even aim to create a fuel depot in space by 2020.
However, several scientists have responded with scepticism, calling
the plan daring, difficult and highly expensive.
They struggle to see how it could be cost-effective, even with
platinum and gold worth nearly £35 per gram ($1,600 an ounce). An
upcoming Nasa mission to return just 60g (two ounces) of material from
an asteroid to Earth will cost about $1bn.
The inaugural step, to be achieved in the next 18 to 24 months, would
be launching the first in a series of private telescopes that would
search for asteroid targets rich in resources. The intention will be
to open deep-space exploration to private industry.
Within five to 10 years, however, the company expects to progress from
selling observation platforms in orbit around Earth to prospecting
services. It plans to tap some of the thousands of asteroids that pass
relatively close to Earth and extract their raw materials.
The company, known as Planetary Resources, is also backed by space
tourism pioneer Eric Anderson, X-Prize founder Peter Diamandis, former
US presidential candidate Ross Perot and veteran Nasa astronaut Tom
Jones.
The founders of the venture are to give further details in a press
conference on Tuesday.
Long game
"We have a long view. We're not expecting this company to be an
overnight financial home run. This is going to take time," Eric
Anderson told the Reuters news agency.
The billionaires are hoping that the real financial returns, which are
decades away, will come from mining asteroids for platinum group
metals and rare minerals.
"If you look back historically at what has caused humanity to make its
largest investments in exploration and in transportation, it has been
going after resources, whether it's the Europeans going after the
spice routes or the American settlers looking toward the west for
gold, oil, timber or land," Mr Diamandis explained.
Water from asteroids could be broken down in space to liquid oxygen
and liquid hydrogen for rocket fuel. Water is very expensive to get
off the ground so the plan is to take it from an asteroid to a spot in
space where it can be converted into fuel.
From there, it could be shipped to Earth orbit for refueling
commercial satellites or spacecraft.
"A depot within a decade seems incredible. I hope there will be
someone to use it," Dr Andrew Cheng, a planetary scientist at Johns
Hopkins University's Applied Physics Laboratory told the Associated
Press.
"And I have high hopes that commercial uses of space will become
profitable beyond Earth orbit. Maybe the time has come."
Prof Jay Melosh from Purdue University said that the costs were just
too high, calling space exploration "a sport that only wealthy
nations, and those wishing to demonstrate their technical prowess, can
afford to indulge."
Eric Anderson, who co-founded the space tourism firm Space Adventures,
said he was used to sceptics.
"Before we started launching people into space as private citizens,
people thought that was a pie-in-the-sky idea," He said.
"We're in this for decades. But it's not a charity. And we'll make
money from the beginning."
moviePig
Apr 24, 2012, 8:27:46 AM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 8:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
Yeah, Cameron'll never be a success until he learns to think inside
>
> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
the box...
--
- - - - - - - -
YOUR taste at work...
http://www.moviepig.com
RichA
Apr 24, 2012, 8:38:57 AM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 8:27 am, moviePig <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
> On Apr 24, 8:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> Yeah, Cameron'll never be a success until he learns to think inside
> the box...
Mining asteroids!!! Why not go to Europa (Jupiter moon) to find water
> On Apr 24, 8:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> Yeah, Cameron'll never be a success until he learns to think inside
> the box...
to help irrigate some desert?
Obveeus
Apr 24, 2012, 8:45:33 AM4/24/12
to
"moviePig" <pwal...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>On Apr 24, 8:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
>Yeah, Cameron'll never be a success until he learns to think inside
>the box...
remote location. If mining asteroids is going to be made profitable, the
key is to send out a large scale solar wind sail and attach it to the
asteroid. Then, the asteroid can be directed back to Earth for mining where
costs are much lower.
Obveeus
Apr 24, 2012, 8:47:01 AM4/24/12
to
"Obveeus" <Obv...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:jn679e$e59$1...@dont-email.me...
evident in the catastrophic results?
moviePig
Apr 24, 2012, 8:52:33 AM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 8:47 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
> "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote in message
Maybe this:
http://tinyurl.com/c6bw2ut
( http://news.discovery.com/space/meteor-the-size-of-a-minivan-exploded-over-california-120423.html
)
> "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote in message
http://tinyurl.com/c6bw2ut
( http://news.discovery.com/space/meteor-the-size-of-a-minivan-exploded-over-california-120423.html
)
Dave Head
Apr 24, 2012, 8:52:59 AM4/24/12
to
On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rande...@gmail.com>
wrote:
>See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
off our national debt like that...
wrote:
>See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
off our national debt like that...
Obveeus
Apr 24, 2012, 11:35:18 AM4/24/12
to
relevant to any decent mining operation, though. Why would you waste effort
bringing back something the size of a minivan when you really need to bring
back something at least a couple of miles in diameter to get any significant
mining profit.
Brad Guth
Apr 24, 2012, 11:47:38 AM4/24/12
to
through the roof, those spendy off-world alternatives become perfectly
viable, in addition to multiple other rare-earths that our terrestrial
resources are currently maxed out or depleted as is.
Massive TBMs processing through 0.1% the mass of of Earth (2e18 m3)
could take care of us for many centuries to come, but that too well be
spendy as hell and there will be any number of negative consequences
that may not offset the positive consequences. After these tunnels
are created and finished off for transportation and other uses, then
what's going to keep is going?
BTW, where's the energy and resources for creating and operating these
terrestrial TBMs, as well as for finishing off their tunnel interiors,
going to come from?
http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”
moviePig
Apr 24, 2012, 11:48:53 AM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 11:35 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
> "moviePig" <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >On Apr 24, 8:47 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote in message
>
> >>news:jn679e$e59$1...@dont-email.me...
>
> >> > "moviePig" <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >> >>On Apr 24, 8:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> >>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> >> >>Yeah, Cameron'll never be a success until he learns to think inside
> >> >>the box...
>
> >> > The whole idea is silly as it is far too expensive to mine stuff from
> >> > that
> >> > remote location. If mining asteroids is going to be made profitable,
> >> > the
> >> > key is to send out a large scale solar wind sail and attach it to the
> >> > asteroid. Then, the asteroid can be directed back to Earth for mining
> >> > where costs are much lower.
>
> >> Did that need a smiley or was the right wing tone of environmentalism
> >> self
> >> evident in the catastrophic results?
>
> >Maybe this:
>
> > http://tinyurl.com/c6bw2ut
>
> > (
> >http://news.discovery.com/space/meteor-the-size-of-a-minivan-exploded...
> "moviePig" <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >On Apr 24, 8:47 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote in message
>
> >>news:jn679e$e59$1...@dont-email.me...
>
> >> > "moviePig" <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >> >>On Apr 24, 8:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> >>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> >> >>Yeah, Cameron'll never be a success until he learns to think inside
> >> >>the box...
>
> >> > The whole idea is silly as it is far too expensive to mine stuff from
> >> > that
> >> > remote location. If mining asteroids is going to be made profitable,
> >> > the
> >> > key is to send out a large scale solar wind sail and attach it to the
> >> > asteroid. Then, the asteroid can be directed back to Earth for mining
> >> > where costs are much lower.
>
> >> Did that need a smiley or was the right wing tone of environmentalism
> >> self
> >> evident in the catastrophic results?
>
> >Maybe this:
>
> > http://tinyurl.com/c6bw2ut
>
> > (
> >)
>
> Texas had one of those a couple days ago, too. I don't see how they are
> relevant to any decent mining operation, though. Why would you waste effort
> bringing back something the size of a minivan when you really need to bring
> back something at least a couple of miles in diameter to get any significant
> mining profit.
I'm resisting the temptation to google "most valuable substance by
>
> Texas had one of those a couple days ago, too. I don't see how they are
> relevant to any decent mining operation, though. Why would you waste effort
> bringing back something the size of a minivan when you really need to bring
> back something at least a couple of miles in diameter to get any significant
> mining profit.
weight"...
Brad Guth
Apr 24, 2012, 11:49:12 AM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 5:52 am, Dave Head <rally...@att.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
> off our national debt like that...
Exactly, and then some. If that's not green, then perhaps nothing is.
>
> >See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
> off our national debt like that...
Tom
Apr 24, 2012, 12:12:50 PM4/24/12
to
So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
nation.
A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
Tom
Tom
Apr 24, 2012, 12:13:43 PM4/24/12
to
>
> - Show quoted text -
I'd wager Google would reveal the answer to be "brains."
Rich would be shit out of luck.
Tom
Obveeus
Apr 24, 2012, 12:30:30 PM4/24/12
to
In terms of metals, though, are their asteroids made of solid gold,
platinum, magnessium, etc...?
Paul Schlyter
Apr 24, 2012, 1:33:27 PM4/24/12
to
On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:12:50 -0700 (PDT), Tom <drs...@aol.com> wrote:
> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their
hard
> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
Yesssss, that is the fundamental idea. And the wealthy too will
> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their
hard
> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
benefit from wealth being more evenly distributed: then the wealthy
won't have to lock themselves up in gated communities. The crime rate
will get lower, and the costs for prisons will get much smaller. Life
will simply become safer for everyone, including the wealthy.
moviePig
Apr 24, 2012, 2:14:10 PM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 12:30 pm, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
> In terms of metals, though, are their asteroids made of solid gold,
> platinum, magnessium, etc...?
I'd have thought maybe rare earth minerals... or buckyballs...
> "moviePig" <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >On Apr 24, 11:35 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> Texas had one of those a couple days ago, too. I don't see how they are
> >> relevant to any decent mining operation, though. Why would you waste
> >> effort
> >> bringing back something the size of a minivan when you really need to
> >> bring
> >> back something at least a couple of miles in diameter to get any
> >> significant
> >> mining profit.
>
> >I'm resisting the temptation to google "most valuable substance by
> >weight"...
>
> The answer is: 'love'.
You misspelled 'wait'...
> >On Apr 24, 11:35 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> Texas had one of those a couple days ago, too. I don't see how they are
> >> relevant to any decent mining operation, though. Why would you waste
> >> effort
> >> bringing back something the size of a minivan when you really need to
> >> bring
> >> back something at least a couple of miles in diameter to get any
> >> significant
> >> mining profit.
>
> >I'm resisting the temptation to google "most valuable substance by
> >weight"...
>
> The answer is: 'love'.
> In terms of metals, though, are their asteroids made of solid gold,
> platinum, magnessium, etc...?
Bert
Apr 24, 2012, 2:33:01 PM4/24/12
to
In news:e04fb951-8d6e-4949...@f5g2000vbt.googlegroups.com
So long as he does it with his own money, why do you care?
--
be...@iphouse.com St. Paul, MN
So long as he does it with his own money, why do you care?
--
be...@iphouse.com St. Paul, MN
Chris.B
Apr 24, 2012, 3:20:56 PM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 8:33 pm, Bert <b...@iphouse.com> wrote:
>
> RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> So long as he does it with his own money, why do you care?
Sorry, Mr Canyon. I think I just dropped your rock on Beijing.
> RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> So long as he does it with his own money, why do you care?
Bert
Apr 24, 2012, 3:48:20 PM4/24/12
to
In
news:3762f5f8-c032-4438...@r13g2000vbg.googlegroups.com
Well, that's what liability insurance is for.
What would happen if a Chinese government space project dropped such a
rock (accidentally, of course) on New York?
Any difference? Is State Science immune from failure or error? Is it
shielded from such liability?
Or are you simply saying that since you can imagine some disastrous
outcome, this, and any similar project, must not be allowed?
news:3762f5f8-c032-4438...@r13g2000vbg.googlegroups.com
What would happen if a Chinese government space project dropped such a
rock (accidentally, of course) on New York?
Any difference? Is State Science immune from failure or error? Is it
shielded from such liability?
Or are you simply saying that since you can imagine some disastrous
outcome, this, and any similar project, must not be allowed?
Obveeus
Apr 24, 2012, 3:49:39 PM4/24/12
to
"moviePig" <pwal...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>On Apr 24, 12:30 pm, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
>> "moviePig" <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>> >On Apr 24, 11:35 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
>> >> Texas had one of those a couple days ago, too. I don't see how they
>> >> are
>> >> relevant to any decent mining operation, though. Why would you waste
>> >> effort
>> >> bringing back something the size of a minivan when you really need to
>> >> bring
>> >> back something at least a couple of miles in diameter to get any
>> >> significant
>> >> mining profit.
>>
>> >I'm resisting the temptation to google "most valuable substance by
>> >weight"...
>>
>> The answer is: 'love'.
>
>You misspelled 'wait'...
sight.
>> In terms of metals, though, are their asteroids made of solid gold,
>> platinum, magnessium, etc...?
>
>I'd have thought maybe rare earth minerals... or buckyballs...
what the mineral, it is likely that the asteroids are not 100% pure...except
for maybe that one planet made entirely of diamonds (if you believe the
whacky scientists).
Dave Head
Apr 24, 2012, 4:41:20 PM4/24/12
to
People don't steal because they have to (they don't have to, they can
get subsistence assistance) they steal because they want to, and have
no respect for property rights. IOW, they're criminals. The supply
of criminals will not be lessened 1 bit.
Brad Guth
Apr 24, 2012, 4:45:02 PM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 11:33 am, Bert <b...@iphouse.com> wrote:
> Innews:e04fb951-8d6e-4949...@f5g2000vbt.googlegroups.com
For obvious reasons, the Oligarchs and Rothschilds don't like the idea
of exploiting anything off-world.
> Innews:e04fb951-8d6e-4949...@f5g2000vbt.googlegroups.com
>
> RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> So long as he does it with his own money, why do you care?
>
> --
> b...@iphouse.com St. Paul, MN
> RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> So long as he does it with his own money, why do you care?
>
> --
For obvious reasons, the Oligarchs and Rothschilds don't like the idea
of exploiting anything off-world.
RichA
Apr 24, 2012, 5:33:56 PM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head <rally...@att.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
prices will stay that high?
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
> off our national debt like that...
You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
>
> >See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
> off our national debt like that...
prices will stay that high?
RichA
Apr 24, 2012, 5:34:42 PM4/24/12
to
RichA
Apr 24, 2012, 5:36:29 PM4/24/12
to
RichA
Apr 24, 2012, 5:35:52 PM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 1:33 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
stopping you from re-distributing the part of your income that exists
above that.
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:12:50 -0700 (PDT), Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
> > A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their
> hard
> > earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> Yesssss, that is the fundamental idea. And the wealthy too will
> benefit from wealth being more evenly distributed:
The World's people exist on about $9,000/ea. Nothing at all is
> > A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their
> hard
> > earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> Yesssss, that is the fundamental idea. And the wealthy too will
> benefit from wealth being more evenly distributed:
stopping you from re-distributing the part of your income that exists
above that.
RichA
Apr 24, 2012, 5:37:47 PM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 3:48 pm, Bert <b...@iphouse.com> wrote:
> Innews:3762f5f8-c032-4438...@r13g2000vbg.googlegroups.com
In-fact...
> Innews:3762f5f8-c032-4438...@r13g2000vbg.googlegroups.com
>
> "Chris.B" <chri...@nypost.dk> wrote:
> > On Apr 24, 8:33 pm, Bert <b...@iphouse.com> wrote:
>
> >> RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> >> So long as he does it with his own money, why do you care?
>
> > Sorry, Mr Canyon. I think I just dropped your rock on Beijing.
>
> Well, that's what liability insurance is for.
>
> What would happen if a Chinese government space project dropped such a
> rock (accidentally, of course) on New York?
>
Hopefully, the Americans would nuke them off the face of the Earth.
> "Chris.B" <chri...@nypost.dk> wrote:
> > On Apr 24, 8:33 pm, Bert <b...@iphouse.com> wrote:
>
> >> RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> >> So long as he does it with his own money, why do you care?
>
> > Sorry, Mr Canyon. I think I just dropped your rock on Beijing.
>
> Well, that's what liability insurance is for.
>
> What would happen if a Chinese government space project dropped such a
> rock (accidentally, of course) on New York?
>
In-fact...
RichA
Apr 24, 2012, 5:33:00 PM4/24/12
to
On Apr 24, 8:45 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
Reminds me of towing icebergs to Arabia to water the desert. How'd
they make out with that?
they make out with that?
Obveeus
Apr 24, 2012, 7:56:55 PM4/24/12
to
mid-French.
Tom
Apr 24, 2012, 8:13:55 PM4/24/12
to
it. Bragging will get me into trouble at confession.
Tom
Antonio E. Gonzalez
Apr 25, 2012, 12:45:07 AM4/25/12
to
On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rande...@gmail.com>
wrote:
No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
--
- ReFlex76
- <http://twitter.com/ReFlex76>
wrote:
--
- ReFlex76
- <http://twitter.com/ReFlex76>
Chris.B
Apr 25, 2012, 1:06:40 AM4/25/12
to
I bet the Chinese wouldn't mind a bit of wealth redistribution from
their unelected leaders. But then exactly the same goes for almost
every other country on earth. (Whether the gravy train riders are
fairly elected or otherwise) Some leaders just spend most of the
national wealth hiding the fact. Others cheerfully spend their untaxed
billions on toy space ships and submarines. If Apple redistributed a
tiny fraction of its vast wealth to the Chinese factory workers, the i-
Slave range would hardly increase in price. It is already obscenely
overloaded with profit in comparison with all of its market
competitors. Why didn't Jobsworth campaign for the abolition of i-
Slavery in China?
their unelected leaders. But then exactly the same goes for almost
every other country on earth. (Whether the gravy train riders are
fairly elected or otherwise) Some leaders just spend most of the
national wealth hiding the fact. Others cheerfully spend their untaxed
billions on toy space ships and submarines. If Apple redistributed a
tiny fraction of its vast wealth to the Chinese factory workers, the i-
Slave range would hardly increase in price. It is already obscenely
overloaded with profit in comparison with all of its market
competitors. Why didn't Jobsworth campaign for the abolition of i-
Slavery in China?
Dave Head
Apr 25, 2012, 1:16:38 AM4/25/12
to
On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rande...@gmail.com>
wrote:
Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
value above that of metals like iron and aluminum. And, there will be
a wide variety of metals that will come back, hopefully some
rare-earths that can be used in solar collectors.
We might not really pay off the national debt, but we'll have a wealth
of raw materials to make some really useful stuff. Hey, I wonder how
much lithium is in that asteroid? Lithium batteries could get
cheaper...
wrote:
and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
value above that of metals like iron and aluminum. And, there will be
a wide variety of metals that will come back, hopefully some
rare-earths that can be used in solar collectors.
We might not really pay off the national debt, but we'll have a wealth
of raw materials to make some really useful stuff. Hey, I wonder how
much lithium is in that asteroid? Lithium batteries could get
cheaper...
Martin Brown
Apr 25, 2012, 4:00:19 AM4/25/12
to
On 25/04/2012 06:16, Dave Head wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rande...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>>
>>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
>>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
>>> off our national debt like that...
>>
>> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
>> prices will stay that high?
>
> Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
> and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
Yeah. Gold is *so* useful that we dig it out of the ground refine it to
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rande...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>>
>>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
>>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
>>> off our national debt like that...
>>
>> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
>> prices will stay that high?
>
> Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
> and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
999, 9999, 99999, or 999999 purity cast ingots and then bury it again at
Fort Knox or other local repositories. A tiny amount *is* used for gold
plating connectors by comparison. Gold is too soft to do much with.
Platinum is a decent engineering metal but on the very expensive side.
Diamonds are worse still - de Beers have a global monopoly and have
taken to monogramming their "real" natural diamonds because the lab made
synthetic diamonds are now approaching true gem quality (and not just
for the nitrogen contaminated yellow ones either).
> value above that of metals like iron and aluminum. And, there will be
> a wide variety of metals that will come back, hopefully some
> rare-earths that can be used in solar collectors.
keeping our modern infrastructure running. There was a time when it was
the rarest and most expensive metal of the lot - Napoleon famously had a
dinner service made of it.
>
> We might not really pay off the national debt, but we'll have a wealth
> of raw materials to make some really useful stuff. Hey, I wonder how
> much lithium is in that asteroid? Lithium batteries could get
> cheaper...
If you could grab a nickel iron asteroid then you get mostly nickel and
> We might not really pay off the national debt, but we'll have a wealth
> of raw materials to make some really useful stuff. Hey, I wonder how
> much lithium is in that asteroid? Lithium batteries could get
> cheaper...
iron with the various siderophile impurities.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldschmidt_classification
Getting the thing back down to the ground without hitting a city or an
ocean is going to be tricky. Can you imagine the panic if their attempts
to deorbit the thing were out by say just a few minutes?
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 25, 2012, 5:56:43 AM4/25/12
to
On Apr 25, 4:00 am, Martin Brown <|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
wrote:
Solid gold cookware would have some very good properties.
http://geology.com/minerals/gold/uses-of-gold.shtml
<edit>
> If you could grab a nickel iron asteroid then you get mostly nickel and
> iron with the various siderophile impurities.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldschmidt_classification
>
> Getting the thing back down to the ground without hitting a city or an
> ocean is going to be tricky. Can you imagine the panic if their attempts
> to deorbit the thing were out by say just a few minutes?
Leave it in orbit or land it on the Moon.
wrote:
> On 25/04/2012 06:16, Dave Head wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > wrote:
>
> >> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
> >>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
>
> >>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> >>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
> >>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
> >>> off our national debt like that...
>
> >> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
> >> prices will stay that high?
>
> > Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
> > and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
>
> Yeah. Gold is *so* useful that we dig it out of the ground refine it to
> 999, 9999, 99999, or 999999 purity cast ingots and then bury it again at
> Fort Knox or other local repositories. A tiny amount *is* used for gold
> plating connectors by comparison. Gold is too soft to do much with.
It makes excellent dental crowns.
>
> >> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
> >>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
>
> >>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> >>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
> >>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
> >>> off our national debt like that...
>
> >> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
> >> prices will stay that high?
>
> > Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
> > and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
>
> Yeah. Gold is *so* useful that we dig it out of the ground refine it to
> 999, 9999, 99999, or 999999 purity cast ingots and then bury it again at
> Fort Knox or other local repositories. A tiny amount *is* used for gold
> plating connectors by comparison. Gold is too soft to do much with.
Solid gold cookware would have some very good properties.
http://geology.com/minerals/gold/uses-of-gold.shtml
<edit>
> If you could grab a nickel iron asteroid then you get mostly nickel and
> iron with the various siderophile impurities.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldschmidt_classification
>
> Getting the thing back down to the ground without hitting a city or an
> ocean is going to be tricky. Can you imagine the panic if their attempts
> to deorbit the thing were out by say just a few minutes?
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 25, 2012, 6:16:54 AM4/25/12
to
On Apr 24, 1:33 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:12:50 -0700 (PDT), Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
> > A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their
> hard
> > earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> Yesssss, that is the fundamental idea.
Communist.
> > A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their
> hard
> > earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> Yesssss, that is the fundamental idea.
> And the wealthy too will
> benefit from wealth being more evenly distributed: then the wealthy
> won't have to lock themselves up in gated communities.
use it to bribe would-be criminals into behaving themselves.
http://moneyland.time.com/2011/07/06/why-the-rich-shoplift-more-than-the-poor/
> The crime rate
> will get lower, and the costs for prisons will get much smaller. Life
> will simply become safer for everyone, including the wealthy.
we would still not want our kids and teens to be using drugs.
http://www.thelocal.se/28590/20100826/
While, one could use health care funds for treating drug abusers,
might it be better to use those funds for non-preventable problems?
So how does one decide who has to work and who gets to sit around
abusing drugs?
Martin Brown
Apr 25, 2012, 7:05:21 AM4/25/12
to
On 25/04/2012 10:56, wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Apr 25, 4:00 am, Martin Brown<|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
> wrote:
>> On 25/04/2012 06:16, Dave Head wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>
>>>> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
>>>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>
>>>>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>
>>>>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
>>>>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
>>>>> off our national debt like that...
>>
>>>> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
>>>> prices will stay that high?
>>
>>> Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
>>> and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
>>
>> Yeah. Gold is *so* useful that we dig it out of the ground refine it to
>> 999, 9999, 99999, or 999999 purity cast ingots and then bury it again at
>> Fort Knox or other local repositories. A tiny amount *is* used for gold
>> plating connectors by comparison. Gold is too soft to do much with.
>
> It makes excellent dental crowns.
Only when cut with about 10% each of silver, platinum and palladium to
> On Apr 25, 4:00 am, Martin Brown<|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
> wrote:
>> On 25/04/2012 06:16, Dave Head wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>
>>>> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
>>>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>
>>>>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>
>>>>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
>>>>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
>>>>> off our national debt like that...
>>
>>>> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
>>>> prices will stay that high?
>>
>>> Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
>>> and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
>>
>> Yeah. Gold is *so* useful that we dig it out of the ground refine it to
>> 999, 9999, 99999, or 999999 purity cast ingots and then bury it again at
>> Fort Knox or other local repositories. A tiny amount *is* used for gold
>> plating connectors by comparison. Gold is too soft to do much with.
>
> It makes excellent dental crowns.
give it some decent engineering properties.
>
> Solid gold cookware would have some very good properties.
>
> http://geology.com/minerals/gold/uses-of-gold.shtml
Pure 24 carat gold is far too soft for almost any application apart from
> Solid gold cookware would have some very good properties.
>
> http://geology.com/minerals/gold/uses-of-gold.shtml
hoarding in a bank or making gold leaf. To make coin they cut it with
copper to 22 carat so that it would stand up to being handled.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_sovereign
Even then they wore out after about 15 years in circulation and fall
below the required statutory weight were collected up and re-minted.
> <edit>
>
>> If you could grab a nickel iron asteroid then you get mostly nickel and
>> iron with the various siderophile impurities.
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldschmidt_classification
>>
>> Getting the thing back down to the ground without hitting a city or an
>> ocean is going to be tricky. Can you imagine the panic if their attempts
>> to deorbit the thing were out by say just a few minutes?
>
> Leave it in orbit or land it on the Moon.
commercial value whilst it remains inaccessible in orbit. Or stuck on
the moon - and why bother in that case? You could just go and mine one
of the lunar craters that already contains a nickel-iron meteorite!
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
Paul Schlyter
Apr 25, 2012, 9:49:57 AM4/25/12
to
RichA
Apr 25, 2012, 9:54:43 AM4/25/12
to
On Apr 25, 12:45 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >On Apr 24, 12:12 pm, Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
> >> entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
> >> nation.
>
> >> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> >> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> >> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
> >> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
> >> Tom
>
> >I thought I was kill-filed by you? You bragged about it.
>
> No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
Yes, James Cameron is a greenie, busybody nitwit.
>
> >On Apr 24, 12:12 pm, Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
> >> entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
> >> nation.
>
> >> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> >> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> >> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
> >> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
> >> Tom
>
> >I thought I was kill-filed by you? You bragged about it.
>
> No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
Paul Schlyter
Apr 25, 2012, 9:56:28 AM4/25/12
to
it's far from sufficient that I alone redistribute what I can
redistribute, as you suggest here.
Paul Schlyter
Apr 25, 2012, 9:59:05 AM4/25/12
to
On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 03:16:54 -0700 (PDT), wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Apr 24, 1:33 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:12:50 -0700 (PDT), Tom <drso...@aol.com>
wrote:
> > > A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with
their
> > hard
> > > earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
> >
> > Yesssss, that is the fundamental idea.
> Communist.
> > And the wealthy too will
> > benefit from wealth being more evenly distributed: then the
wealthy
> > won't have to lock themselves up in gated communities.
> IOW, you want the goobermint to take money from people who earn it
and
> use it to bribe would-be criminals into behaving themselves.
>
http://moneyland.time.com/2011/07/06/why-the-rich-shoplift-more-than-th
e-po=
> On Apr 24, 1:33 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:12:50 -0700 (PDT), Tom <drso...@aol.com>
wrote:
> > > A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with
their
> > hard
> > > earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
> >
> > Yesssss, that is the fundamental idea.
> Communist.
> > And the wealthy too will
> > benefit from wealth being more evenly distributed: then the
wealthy
> > won't have to lock themselves up in gated communities.
> IOW, you want the goobermint to take money from people who earn it
and
> use it to bribe would-be criminals into behaving themselves.
>
http://moneyland.time.com/2011/07/06/why-the-rich-shoplift-more-than-th
> or/
> > The crime rate
> > will get lower, and the costs for prisons will get much smaller.
Life
> > will simply become safer for everyone, including the wealthy.
> If drugs were legalized then by definition crime would drop.
However,
> we would still not want our kids and teens to be using drugs.
> http://www.thelocal.se/28590/20100826/
> While, one could use health care funds for treating drug abusers,
> might it be better to use those funds for non-preventable problems?
> So how does one decide who has to work and who gets to sit around
> abusing drugs?
Isn't drug use illegal, both in your country and in mine? So it's
> > The crime rate
> > will get lower, and the costs for prisons will get much smaller.
Life
> > will simply become safer for everyone, including the wealthy.
> If drugs were legalized then by definition crime would drop.
However,
> we would still not want our kids and teens to be using drugs.
> http://www.thelocal.se/28590/20100826/
> While, one could use health care funds for treating drug abusers,
> might it be better to use those funds for non-preventable problems?
> So how does one decide who has to work and who gets to sit around
> abusing drugs?
been decided already, right?
Dave Head
Apr 25, 2012, 10:57:18 AM4/25/12
to
On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 15:49:57 +0200, Paul Schlyter
Income taxes are theft. A consumption tax is not, since you can avoid
it by not buying what is taxed.
it by not buying what is taxed.
Antonio E. Gonzalez
Apr 26, 2012, 1:31:21 AM4/26/12
to
On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:38:57 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rande...@gmail.com>
wrote:
>On Apr 24, 8:27 am, moviePig <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>to help irrigate some desert?
Better yet, split that water into hydrogen and oxygen to make rocket
fuel!
wrote:
>On Apr 24, 8:27 am, moviePig <pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>> On Apr 24, 8:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>
>> Yeah, Cameron'll never be a success until he learns to think inside
>> the box...
>
>Mining asteroids!!! Why not go to Europa (Jupiter moon) to find water
>> the box...
>
>to help irrigate some desert?
Better yet, split that water into hydrogen and oxygen to make rocket
fuel!
Antonio E. Gonzalez
Apr 26, 2012, 1:34:45 AM4/26/12
to
On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rande...@gmail.com>
wrote:
Ummm, try again:
A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
wrote:
A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
Paul Schlyter
Apr 26, 2012, 3:54:43 AM4/26/12
to
On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 10:57:18 -0400, Dave Head <rall...@att.net>
How do you avoid buying e.g. food?
Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
Btw, do you also consider capital punishment to be murder?
Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
Btw, do you also consider capital punishment to be murder?
Dave Head
Apr 26, 2012, 4:07:42 AM4/26/12
to
On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 09:54:43 +0200, Paul Schlyter
A garden and maybe some domesticated animals.
>Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
Yep. But most people can't do that.
>Btw, do you also consider capital punishment to be murder?
Doesn't meet the legal definition.
>Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
>Btw, do you also consider capital punishment to be murder?
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 5:27:11 AM4/26/12
to
On Apr 25, 7:05 am, Martin Brown <|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
wrote:
still good for caps, crowns and fillings. So what is your point?
> > Solid gold cookware would have some very good properties.
>
> >http://geology.com/minerals/gold/uses-of-gold.shtml
>
> Pure 24 carat gold is far too soft for almost any application apart from
> hoarding in a bank or making gold leaf. To make coin they cut it with
> copper to 22 carat so that it would stand up to being handled.
Most metals need to be alloyed for practical applications. So what is
your point?
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_sovereign
>
> Even then they wore out after about 15 years in circulation and fall
> below the required statutory weight were collected up and re-minted.
>
> > <edit>
>
> >> If you could grab a nickel iron asteroid then you get mostly nickel and
> >> iron with the various siderophile impurities.
>
> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldschmidt_classification
>
> >> Getting the thing back down to the ground without hitting a city or an
> >> ocean is going to be tricky. Can you imagine the panic if their attempts
> >> to deorbit the thing were out by say just a few minutes?
>
> > Leave it in orbit or land it on the Moon.
>
> I suppose it would be fun as a novelty moonlet, but with absolutely no
> commercial value whilst it remains inaccessible in orbit.
So one might have the technology to bring back an asteroid, but not
the tech to mine it while it orbits the Earth or the Moon?
wrote:
> On 25/04/2012 10:56, wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 25, 4:00 am, Martin Brown<|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
> > wrote:
> >> On 25/04/2012 06:16, Dave Head wrote:
>
> >>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
>
> >>>> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
> >>>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
>
> >>>>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> >>>>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
> >>>>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
> >>>>> off our national debt like that...
>
> >>>> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
> >>>> prices will stay that high?
>
> >>> Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
> >>> and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
>
> >> Yeah. Gold is *so* useful that we dig it out of the ground refine it to
> >> 999, 9999, 99999, or 999999 purity cast ingots and then bury it again at
> >> Fort Knox or other local repositories. A tiny amount *is* used for gold
> >> plating connectors by comparison. Gold is too soft to do much with.
>
> > It makes excellent dental crowns.
>
> Only when cut with about 10% each of silver, platinum and palladium to
> give it some decent engineering properties.
Most metals need to be alloyed for practical applications. Gold is
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 25, 4:00 am, Martin Brown<|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
> > wrote:
> >> On 25/04/2012 06:16, Dave Head wrote:
>
> >>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
>
> >>>> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
> >>>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
>
> >>>>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> >>>>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
> >>>>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
> >>>>> off our national debt like that...
>
> >>>> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
> >>>> prices will stay that high?
>
> >>> Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
> >>> and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
>
> >> Yeah. Gold is *so* useful that we dig it out of the ground refine it to
> >> 999, 9999, 99999, or 999999 purity cast ingots and then bury it again at
> >> Fort Knox or other local repositories. A tiny amount *is* used for gold
> >> plating connectors by comparison. Gold is too soft to do much with.
>
> > It makes excellent dental crowns.
>
> Only when cut with about 10% each of silver, platinum and palladium to
> give it some decent engineering properties.
still good for caps, crowns and fillings. So what is your point?
> > Solid gold cookware would have some very good properties.
>
> >http://geology.com/minerals/gold/uses-of-gold.shtml
>
> Pure 24 carat gold is far too soft for almost any application apart from
> hoarding in a bank or making gold leaf. To make coin they cut it with
> copper to 22 carat so that it would stand up to being handled.
your point?
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_sovereign
>
> Even then they wore out after about 15 years in circulation and fall
> below the required statutory weight were collected up and re-minted.
>
> > <edit>
>
> >> If you could grab a nickel iron asteroid then you get mostly nickel and
> >> iron with the various siderophile impurities.
>
> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldschmidt_classification
>
> >> Getting the thing back down to the ground without hitting a city or an
> >> ocean is going to be tricky. Can you imagine the panic if their attempts
> >> to deorbit the thing were out by say just a few minutes?
>
> > Leave it in orbit or land it on the Moon.
>
> I suppose it would be fun as a novelty moonlet, but with absolutely no
> commercial value whilst it remains inaccessible in orbit.
the tech to mine it while it orbits the Earth or the Moon?
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 5:35:39 AM4/26/12
to
suggested it would be a start towards whatever dubious goal that you
people have in mind. IOW put your money where your mouth is. In
reality it's only the wealth of others that you wish to redistribute,
not your own.
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 5:50:27 AM4/26/12
to
On Apr 25, 9:59 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
Usually, if one has a prescription, no. Some drugs are "over the
counter." At least one drug that I know of requires that you buy in
only small quantities and sign a form. ("Would you like the 12-pack,
the 24-pack, or the 2400-pack?")
>So it's
> been decided already, right?
What has already been decided?
counter." At least one drug that I know of requires that you buy in
only small quantities and sign a form. ("Would you like the 12-pack,
the 24-pack, or the 2400-pack?")
>So it's
> been decided already, right?
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 6:09:50 AM4/26/12
to
On Apr 26, 3:54 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 10:57:18 -0400, Dave Head <rally...@att.net>
Under the Fair Tax, each person/family would get a "pre-bate" which is
enough to cover the Fair Tax on personal expenditures up to the
poverty line. Above that level everyone would be paying a consumption
tax on retail goods and services.
> Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
Income taxes can also be avoided by not having taxes on income.
> On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 10:57:18 -0400, Dave Head <rally...@att.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 15:49:57 +0200, Paul Schlyter
> > <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > >On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 16:41:20 -0400, Dave Head <rally...@att.net>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 15:49:57 +0200, Paul Schlyter
> > <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > >wrote:
> > >> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 19:33:27 +0200, Paul Schlyter
> > >> <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
>
> > >> >On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:12:50 -0700 (PDT), Tom <drso...@aol.com>
> > >> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 19:33:27 +0200, Paul Schlyter
> > >> <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
>
enough to cover the Fair Tax on personal expenditures up to the
poverty line. Above that level everyone would be paying a consumption
tax on retail goods and services.
> Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
Al
Apr 26, 2012, 7:51:39 AM4/26/12
to
"Dave Head" <rall...@att.net> wrote:
>
> Income taxes are theft. A consumption tax is not, since you can
> avoid it by not buying what is taxed.
"Paul Schlyter" <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> replied:
>
> Income taxes are theft. A consumption tax is not, since you can
> avoid it by not buying what is taxed.
> How do you avoid buying e.g. food?
> Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
If you're self-employed, that 5,000 is the profit, so you could have a turnover
of 50,000 and if you have 45,000 in expenses, you are not liable for income tax.
As long as you own your home, living on 5,000 per year is easy (I've lived
comfortably for 17 years doing that). And being classed as a 'low income'
household means I am entitled to free insulation and free boiler installation.
Last year I built a heated garage for my Prius, and they insulated that for
free as well. :-)
RichA
Apr 26, 2012, 1:11:53 PM4/26/12
to
On Apr 26, 1:34 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
>
> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
I only oppose it when it makes no sense and does not provide a net
gain outcome.
>
> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
Why is it stupid people always (especially rank leftists) resort to
invective and vulgarities?
> On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Apr 25, 12:45 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
>
> >> >On Apr 24, 12:12 pm, Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> >> So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
> >> >> entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
> >> >> nation.
>
> >> >> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> >> >> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> >> >> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
> >> >> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
> >> >> Tom
>
> >> >I thought I was kill-filed by you? You bragged about it.
>
> >> No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
>
> >Yes, James Cameron is a greenie, busybody nitwit.
>
> Ummm, try again:
>
> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
What do you think of people who own 50 guns in their collection?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Apr 25, 12:45 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
>
> >> >On Apr 24, 12:12 pm, Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> >> So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
> >> >> entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
> >> >> nation.
>
> >> >> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> >> >> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> >> >> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
> >> >> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
> >> >> Tom
>
> >> >I thought I was kill-filed by you? You bragged about it.
>
> >> No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
>
> >Yes, James Cameron is a greenie, busybody nitwit.
>
> Ummm, try again:
>
> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
gain outcome.
>
> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
invective and vulgarities?
Paul Schlyter
Apr 26, 2012, 1:26:39 PM4/26/12
to
On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 04:07:42 -0400, Dave Head <rall...@att.net>
wrote:
> >Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
> Yep. But most people can't do that.
Why not? Anyone can become a beggar, then you don't pay any tax.
> >Btw, do you also consider capital punishment to be murder?
> Doesn't meet the legal definition.
Neither does the "tax is theft" claim, since theft is illegal while
taxes are legal.
wrote:
> >> >Do you consider taxes to be theft?
> >> Income taxes are theft. A consumption tax is not, since you can
> >avoid it by not buying what is taxed.
> >How do you avoid buying e.g. food?
> A garden and maybe some domesticated animals.
That requires real estate, which often is taxed..... :-)
> >> Income taxes are theft. A consumption tax is not, since you can
> >avoid it by not buying what is taxed.
> >How do you avoid buying e.g. food?
> A garden and maybe some domesticated animals.
> >Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
> Yep. But most people can't do that.
> >Btw, do you also consider capital punishment to be murder?
> Doesn't meet the legal definition.
taxes are legal.
Paul Schlyter
Apr 26, 2012, 1:31:33 PM4/26/12
to
On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 03:09:50 -0700 (PDT), wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
> Income taxes can also be avoided by not having taxes on income.
Thue, but that would cause most nations to soon go bankrupt, which is
> > Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
> Income taxes can also be avoided by not having taxes on income.
a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel somewhere?
Build your won road! Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself. Want
protection against robbers? Hire your own guards. Et cetera .... In
the long run that would be more expensive that paying taxes to have
your country do that for you.
Paul Schlyter
Apr 26, 2012, 1:34:05 PM4/26/12
to
On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 11:51:39 -0000, "Al" <al-n...@agora.com> wrote:
> As long as you own your home, living on 5,000 per year is easy
(I've lived
> comfortably for 17 years doing that). And being classed as a 'low
income'
> household means I am entitled to free insulation and free boiler
installation.
> Last year I built a heated garage for my Prius, and they insulated
that for
> free as well. :-)
If too many people become parasites like that, real estate will
> As long as you own your home, living on 5,000 per year is easy
(I've lived
> comfortably for 17 years doing that). And being classed as a 'low
income'
> household means I am entitled to free insulation and free boiler
installation.
> Last year I built a heated garage for my Prius, and they insulated
that for
> free as well. :-)
inevitably get taxed. In many countries it already is.
Paul Schlyter
Apr 26, 2012, 1:37:08 PM4/26/12
to
On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 02:35:39 -0700 (PDT), wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> If everyone who believes in wealth redistribution were to do what RA
> suggested it would be a start towards whatever dubious goal that you
> people have in mind. IOW put your money where your mouth is. In
> reality it's only the wealth of others that you wish to
redistribute,
> not your own.
Blatantly false! I already live in a country and in a situation where
> If everyone who believes in wealth redistribution were to do what RA
> suggested it would be a start towards whatever dubious goal that you
> people have in mind. IOW put your money where your mouth is. In
> reality it's only the wealth of others that you wish to
redistribute,
> not your own.
parts if my income is redistributed to others. If you were right i
would immediately emigrate to e.g. Switzerland, however i have no
such plans.
Paul Schlyter
Apr 26, 2012, 1:39:12 PM4/26/12
to
On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 02:50:27 -0700 (PDT), wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > So how does one decide who has to work and who gets to sit
around
> > > abusing drugs?
> > Isn't drug use illegal, both in your country and in mine?
> Usually, if one has a prescription, no. Some drugs are "over the
> counter." At least one drug that I know of requires that you buy in
> only small quantities and sign a form. ("Would you like the
12-pack,
> the 24-pack, or the 2400-pack?")
> >So it's
> > been decided already, right?
> What has already been decided?
Who gets to sit around abusing drugs....
> > > So how does one decide who has to work and who gets to sit
around
> > > abusing drugs?
> > Isn't drug use illegal, both in your country and in mine?
> Usually, if one has a prescription, no. Some drugs are "over the
> counter." At least one drug that I know of requires that you buy in
> only small quantities and sign a form. ("Would you like the
12-pack,
> the 24-pack, or the 2400-pack?")
> >So it's
> > been decided already, right?
> What has already been decided?
Quadibloc
Apr 26, 2012, 1:39:24 PM4/26/12
to
On Apr 24, 6:45 am, "Obveeus" <Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
> The whole idea is silly as it is far too expensive to mine stuff from that
> remote location.
Unfortunately, I agree. Yes, somebody has to be first, but even the
first attempt should wait until the technology is where it is possible
to actually have a fighting chance of doing something more than
wasting money.
I hope I'm wrong, since it would be great if asteroid mining could be
made to work as soon as possible.
John Savard
> The whole idea is silly as it is far too expensive to mine stuff from that
> remote location.
Unfortunately, I agree. Yes, somebody has to be first, but even the
first attempt should wait until the technology is where it is possible
to actually have a fighting chance of doing something more than
wasting money.
I hope I'm wrong, since it would be great if asteroid mining could be
made to work as soon as possible.
John Savard
Bert
Apr 26, 2012, 1:40:46 PM4/26/12
to
In news:jnbcsv$v23$1...@dont-email.me "Al" <al-n...@agora.com> wrote:
> And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
> free insulation and free boiler installation.
>
By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
> And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
> free insulation and free boiler installation.
>
pay for your goodies.
--
be...@iphouse.com St. Paul, MN
Brad Guth
Apr 26, 2012, 6:21:46 PM4/26/12
to
for us?
Can you afford to buy a tonne of gold, platinum or most any other rare-
earths nowadays, or how about a decade from now?
http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”
Brad Guth
Apr 26, 2012, 9:12:04 PM4/26/12
to
He3 is actually good/better for just about everything, including party
balloons.
Earth has very little He3 as is, and we're running ourselves out of
He4 within the next three decades or at least by 2050 it'll become
practically nonexistent other than whatever thorium and uranium are
capable of producing that’s being suggested as limited to as little as
3e6 kg/year (roughly 1% of our needs if 100% of that helium could even
be captured, though I'd kind of doubt we could manage to capture .
0001%).
In other words, He4 is literally on its way out, and the rate of
natural replenishment isn’t going to be .0001% sufficient unless we
can manage to artificially create helium.
As for carbonado(aka black diamond), being really nifty for all sorts
of applications besides continuous tether fibers, and being easily
produced in the hard vacuum of space or even upon our physically dark
and paramagnetic moon, in unlimited volume that's easily transported
to/from just about anywhere, should be at least considered as one of
the cheapest raw elements that can be artificially obtained and
processed into just about anything.
Are you and other Oligarch Rothschilds planning on waiting until the
very last terrestrial tonne is about to run out? (at which time you
ZNRs have to fake and/or false-flag us into another war in order to
artificially inflate the global price via insider market speculation
and otherwise steal the scarce remainder of helium from others)
Of course, while obtaining off-world helium, there will be many other
elements of extremely valuable rare-earths will have to also get
processed and put into terrestrial circulation, unless you're planning
on speculating and hoarding those as well.
By going off-world, many rare and valuable elements and complex
solutions can be discovered, excavated and/or processed and
transferred back to Earth. Of course that’s not going to happen as
long as we keep the old guard of oligarchs in charge and never bother
to look back.
The loss of our OCO mission is just another prime example of how we’re
being kept uninformed and mislead into believing only whatever our
handlers want us to believe.
Those lakes under thick Antarctica ice remain fluid not because of our
planet having a sun, but only because of the ongoing 64 TW of residual
heat, geophysical modulation plus fission within Earth. A certain
amount of gravity tidal modulation that’s keeping our flexible planet
a little extra warm from the inside out, at an average surface bedrock
heat loss of perhaps 128 mw/m2. From the surface, we humans manage to
add roughly half again that amount of thermal energy to everything
from the surface on up (still considerably less than what nature
contributes), and of course we have our sun that’s less than ideally
stable, plus our nifty moon that’s contributing via its own 2e20 N of
tidal force modulating throughout the whole fluid body of our planet,
which may help to explain where some of the internal heat is coming
from besides a core and mantel of fission that’s responsible for
creating our helium that we’re about to run out of a sufficient annual
volume.
Of course our modern day K12s and most others are no longer smart
enough to care about any natural or artificial loss of helium, just
like Semites and Oligarchs could care less if all the natural ice on
Earth melted, and ocean levels increased by tens of meters or whatever
extreme weather of storms and/or droughts were ten fold worse off. I
mean to suggest, when these Oligarch Rothschilds own a fleet of
business jets and Mega Yachts plus multiple villas plus several
multimillion dollar condos around the world, they really don’t have to
worry if any one of those habitats is inconvenienced or disrupted by
extreme weather or getting flooded out because of rising ocean levels.
On Apr 24, 6:53 pm, 1treePetrifiedForestLane <Space...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
: well, so, What?
:
: : He4 migrates directly through ozone. It doesn't bind, it dilutes
or
: : displaces ozone as well as it acts as a molecular lubricant.
The "well, so, What?" is that our government and its faith-based mafia
of Oligarch Semites that get to operate as public-funded overlords and
robber barons regardless of whomever we elect or appoint, have been
telling us a pack of lies upon lies, as well as creating and
sustaining wars, costing us millions of lives plus trillions of our
hard earned loot, and ultimately keeping us from going off-world until
they've gotten every last drop of blood and dime out of us.
Obviously that doesn't bother those that never want their white-washed
Semitic version of history to ever get revised.
http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”
>
> 24 April 2012 Last updated at 07:30 ET
> Plans for asteroid mining emerge
>
> Details have been emerging of the plan by billionaire entrepreneurs to
> mine asteroids for their resources.
>
> The multi-million-dollar plan would use robotic spacecraft to squeeze
> chemical components of fuel and minerals such as platinum and gold out
> of the rocks.
>
> The founders include film director and explorer James Cameron as well
> as Google's chief executive Larry Page and its executive chairman Eric
> Schmidt.
>
> They even aim to create a fuel depot in space by 2020.
>
> However, several scientists have responded with scepticism, calling
> the plan daring, difficult and highly expensive.
>
> They struggle to see how it could be cost-effective, even with
> platinum and gold worth nearly £35 per gram ($1,600 an ounce). An
> upcoming Nasa mission to return just 60g (two ounces) of material from
> an asteroid to Earth will cost about $1bn.
>
> The inaugural step, to be achieved in the next 18 to 24 months, would
> be launching the first in a series of private telescopes that would
> search for asteroid targets rich in resources. The intention will be
> to open deep-space exploration to private industry.
>
> Within five to 10 years, however, the company expects to progress from
> selling observation platforms in orbit around Earth to prospecting
> services. It plans to tap some of the thousands of asteroids that pass
> relatively close to Earth and extract their raw materials.
>
> The company, known as Planetary Resources, is also backed by space
> tourism pioneer Eric Anderson, X-Prize founder Peter Diamandis, former
> US presidential candidate Ross Perot and veteran Nasa astronaut Tom
> Jones.
>
> The founders of the venture are to give further details in a press
> conference on Tuesday.
> Long game
>
> "We have a long view. We're not expecting this company to be an
> overnight financial home run. This is going to take time," Eric
> Anderson told the Reuters news agency.
>
> The billionaires are hoping that the real financial returns, which are
> decades away, will come from mining asteroids for platinum group
> metals and rare minerals.
>
> "If you look back historically at what has caused humanity to make its
> largest investments in exploration and in transportation, it has been
> going after resources, whether it's the Europeans going after the
> spice routes or the American settlers looking toward the west for
> gold, oil, timber or land," Mr Diamandis explained.
>
> Water from asteroids could be broken down in space to liquid oxygen
> and liquid hydrogen for rocket fuel. Water is very expensive to get
> off the ground so the plan is to take it from an asteroid to a spot in
> space where it can be converted into fuel.
>
> From there, it could be shipped to Earth orbit for refueling
> commercial satellites or spacecraft.
>
> "A depot within a decade seems incredible. I hope there will be
> someone to use it," Dr Andrew Cheng, a planetary scientist at Johns
> Hopkins University's Applied Physics Laboratory told the Associated
> Press.
>
> "And I have high hopes that commercial uses of space will become
> profitable beyond Earth orbit. Maybe the time has come."
>
> Prof Jay Melosh from Purdue University said that the costs were just
> too high, calling space exploration "a sport that only wealthy
> nations, and those wishing to demonstrate their technical prowess, can
> afford to indulge."
>
> Eric Anderson, who co-founded the space tourism firm Space Adventures,
> said he was used to sceptics.
>
> "Before we started launching people into space as private citizens,
> people thought that was a pie-in-the-sky idea," He said.
>
> "We're in this for decades. But it's not a charity. And we'll make
> money from the beginning."
balloons.
Earth has very little He3 as is, and we're running ourselves out of
He4 within the next three decades or at least by 2050 it'll become
practically nonexistent other than whatever thorium and uranium are
capable of producing that’s being suggested as limited to as little as
3e6 kg/year (roughly 1% of our needs if 100% of that helium could even
be captured, though I'd kind of doubt we could manage to capture .
0001%).
In other words, He4 is literally on its way out, and the rate of
natural replenishment isn’t going to be .0001% sufficient unless we
can manage to artificially create helium.
As for carbonado(aka black diamond), being really nifty for all sorts
of applications besides continuous tether fibers, and being easily
produced in the hard vacuum of space or even upon our physically dark
and paramagnetic moon, in unlimited volume that's easily transported
to/from just about anywhere, should be at least considered as one of
the cheapest raw elements that can be artificially obtained and
processed into just about anything.
Are you and other Oligarch Rothschilds planning on waiting until the
very last terrestrial tonne is about to run out? (at which time you
ZNRs have to fake and/or false-flag us into another war in order to
artificially inflate the global price via insider market speculation
and otherwise steal the scarce remainder of helium from others)
Of course, while obtaining off-world helium, there will be many other
elements of extremely valuable rare-earths will have to also get
processed and put into terrestrial circulation, unless you're planning
on speculating and hoarding those as well.
By going off-world, many rare and valuable elements and complex
solutions can be discovered, excavated and/or processed and
transferred back to Earth. Of course that’s not going to happen as
long as we keep the old guard of oligarchs in charge and never bother
to look back.
The loss of our OCO mission is just another prime example of how we’re
being kept uninformed and mislead into believing only whatever our
handlers want us to believe.
Those lakes under thick Antarctica ice remain fluid not because of our
planet having a sun, but only because of the ongoing 64 TW of residual
heat, geophysical modulation plus fission within Earth. A certain
amount of gravity tidal modulation that’s keeping our flexible planet
a little extra warm from the inside out, at an average surface bedrock
heat loss of perhaps 128 mw/m2. From the surface, we humans manage to
add roughly half again that amount of thermal energy to everything
from the surface on up (still considerably less than what nature
contributes), and of course we have our sun that’s less than ideally
stable, plus our nifty moon that’s contributing via its own 2e20 N of
tidal force modulating throughout the whole fluid body of our planet,
which may help to explain where some of the internal heat is coming
from besides a core and mantel of fission that’s responsible for
creating our helium that we’re about to run out of a sufficient annual
volume.
Of course our modern day K12s and most others are no longer smart
enough to care about any natural or artificial loss of helium, just
like Semites and Oligarchs could care less if all the natural ice on
Earth melted, and ocean levels increased by tens of meters or whatever
extreme weather of storms and/or droughts were ten fold worse off. I
mean to suggest, when these Oligarch Rothschilds own a fleet of
business jets and Mega Yachts plus multiple villas plus several
multimillion dollar condos around the world, they really don’t have to
worry if any one of those habitats is inconvenienced or disrupted by
extreme weather or getting flooded out because of rising ocean levels.
On Apr 24, 6:53 pm, 1treePetrifiedForestLane <Space...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
: well, so, What?
:
: : He4 migrates directly through ozone. It doesn't bind, it dilutes
or
: : displaces ozone as well as it acts as a molecular lubricant.
The "well, so, What?" is that our government and its faith-based mafia
of Oligarch Semites that get to operate as public-funded overlords and
robber barons regardless of whomever we elect or appoint, have been
telling us a pack of lies upon lies, as well as creating and
sustaining wars, costing us millions of lives plus trillions of our
hard earned loot, and ultimately keeping us from going off-world until
they've gotten every last drop of blood and dime out of us.
Obviously that doesn't bother those that never want their white-washed
Semitic version of history to ever get revised.
http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”
On Apr 24, 5:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> BBC:
> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
>
> 24 April 2012 Last updated at 07:30 ET
> Plans for asteroid mining emerge
>
> Details have been emerging of the plan by billionaire entrepreneurs to
> mine asteroids for their resources.
>
> The multi-million-dollar plan would use robotic spacecraft to squeeze
> chemical components of fuel and minerals such as platinum and gold out
> of the rocks.
>
> The founders include film director and explorer James Cameron as well
> as Google's chief executive Larry Page and its executive chairman Eric
> Schmidt.
>
> They even aim to create a fuel depot in space by 2020.
>
> However, several scientists have responded with scepticism, calling
> the plan daring, difficult and highly expensive.
>
> They struggle to see how it could be cost-effective, even with
> platinum and gold worth nearly £35 per gram ($1,600 an ounce). An
> upcoming Nasa mission to return just 60g (two ounces) of material from
> an asteroid to Earth will cost about $1bn.
>
> The inaugural step, to be achieved in the next 18 to 24 months, would
> be launching the first in a series of private telescopes that would
> search for asteroid targets rich in resources. The intention will be
> to open deep-space exploration to private industry.
>
> Within five to 10 years, however, the company expects to progress from
> selling observation platforms in orbit around Earth to prospecting
> services. It plans to tap some of the thousands of asteroids that pass
> relatively close to Earth and extract their raw materials.
>
> The company, known as Planetary Resources, is also backed by space
> tourism pioneer Eric Anderson, X-Prize founder Peter Diamandis, former
> US presidential candidate Ross Perot and veteran Nasa astronaut Tom
> Jones.
>
> The founders of the venture are to give further details in a press
> conference on Tuesday.
> Long game
>
> "We have a long view. We're not expecting this company to be an
> overnight financial home run. This is going to take time," Eric
> Anderson told the Reuters news agency.
>
> The billionaires are hoping that the real financial returns, which are
> decades away, will come from mining asteroids for platinum group
> metals and rare minerals.
>
> "If you look back historically at what has caused humanity to make its
> largest investments in exploration and in transportation, it has been
> going after resources, whether it's the Europeans going after the
> spice routes or the American settlers looking toward the west for
> gold, oil, timber or land," Mr Diamandis explained.
>
> Water from asteroids could be broken down in space to liquid oxygen
> and liquid hydrogen for rocket fuel. Water is very expensive to get
> off the ground so the plan is to take it from an asteroid to a spot in
> space where it can be converted into fuel.
>
> From there, it could be shipped to Earth orbit for refueling
> commercial satellites or spacecraft.
>
> "A depot within a decade seems incredible. I hope there will be
> someone to use it," Dr Andrew Cheng, a planetary scientist at Johns
> Hopkins University's Applied Physics Laboratory told the Associated
> Press.
>
> "And I have high hopes that commercial uses of space will become
> profitable beyond Earth orbit. Maybe the time has come."
>
> Prof Jay Melosh from Purdue University said that the costs were just
> too high, calling space exploration "a sport that only wealthy
> nations, and those wishing to demonstrate their technical prowess, can
> afford to indulge."
>
> Eric Anderson, who co-founded the space tourism firm Space Adventures,
> said he was used to sceptics.
>
> "Before we started launching people into space as private citizens,
> people thought that was a pie-in-the-sky idea," He said.
>
> "We're in this for decades. But it's not a charity. And we'll make
> money from the beginning."
Tom
Apr 26, 2012, 9:30:41 PM4/26/12
to
On Apr 26, 12:11 pm, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Apr 26, 1:34 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > >On Apr 25, 12:45 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
> > >> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> > >> wrote:
>
> > >> >On Apr 24, 12:12 pm, Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
> > >> >> So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
> > >> >> entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
> > >> >> nation.
>
> > >> >> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> > >> >> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> > >> >> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
> > >> >> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
> > >> >> Tom
>
> > >> >I thought I was kill-filed by you? You bragged about it.
>
> > >> No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
>
> > >Yes, James Cameron is a greenie, busybody nitwit.
>
> > Ummm, try again:
>
> > A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> > earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> What do you think of people who own 50 guns in their collection?
As long as the guns are legal to own and obtained in a legal manner, I
> On Apr 26, 1:34 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > >On Apr 25, 12:45 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
> > >> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
> > >> wrote:
>
> > >> >On Apr 24, 12:12 pm, Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
> > >> >> So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
> > >> >> entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
> > >> >> nation.
>
> > >> >> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> > >> >> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> > >> >> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
> > >> >> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
> > >> >> Tom
>
> > >> >I thought I was kill-filed by you? You bragged about it.
>
> > >> No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
>
> > >Yes, James Cameron is a greenie, busybody nitwit.
>
> > Ummm, try again:
>
> > A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
> > earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
> What do you think of people who own 50 guns in their collection?
couldn't care less. Why did you answer my question with a completely
unrelated question?
Now, answer my question.
>
>
>
> > B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
> I only oppose it when it makes no sense and does not provide a net
> gain outcome.
the outcome beforehand?
>
>
>
> > C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>
> Why is it stupid people always (especially rank leftists) resort to
> invective and vulgarities?
Tom
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 9:42:39 PM4/26/12
to
On Apr 26, 1:31 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
to use. Seems fair.
> Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself.
Not a bad idea and there are many private schools from which to
choose.
> Want
> protection against robbers? Hire your own guards.
Police tend to show up only after a crime has occurred. Protection
usually comes in the form of an alarm or a gun.
> Et cetera .... In
> the long run that would be more expensive that paying taxes to have
> your country do that for you.
No, it would not.
> On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 03:09:50 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
> > Income taxes can also be avoided by not having taxes on income.
>
> Thue, but that would cause most nations to soon go bankrupt, which is
> a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel somewhere?
> Build your won road!
Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> > > Income taxes can be avoided by not having any income.
> > Income taxes can also be avoided by not having taxes on income.
>
> Thue, but that would cause most nations to soon go bankrupt, which is
> a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel somewhere?
> Build your won road!
to use. Seems fair.
> Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself.
choose.
> Want
> protection against robbers? Hire your own guards.
usually comes in the form of an alarm or a gun.
> Et cetera .... In
> the long run that would be more expensive that paying taxes to have
> your country do that for you.
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 9:47:54 PM4/26/12
to
On Apr 26, 1:37 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
It was suggested that you donate ALL BUT about $9000 of your income to
those less fortunate, not donate $9000 and keep the rest.
those less fortunate, not donate $9000 and keep the rest.
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 9:55:43 PM4/26/12
to
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 10:10:14 PM4/26/12
to
On Apr 26, 1:40 pm, Bert <b...@iphouse.com> wrote:
house to pay for any upgrades. That would be fair to everyone.
> Innews:jnbcsv$v23$1...@dont-email.me"Al" <al-nos...@agora.com> wrote:
>
> > And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
> > free insulation and free boiler installation.
>
> By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
> pay for your goodies.
If he owns the home, then he should borrow against the value of the
>
> > And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
> > free insulation and free boiler installation.
>
> By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
> pay for your goodies.
house to pay for any upgrades. That would be fair to everyone.
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 26, 2012, 9:54:52 PM4/26/12
to
On Apr 26, 1:39 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
Ideally, nobody gets to do that, inasmuch as chronic drug users tend
to be unproductive and a burden on everyone else. Therefore we make
it a crime to deal, possess or even use some drugs in order to
discourage that sort of behavior.
to be unproductive and a burden on everyone else. Therefore we make
it a crime to deal, possess or even use some drugs in order to
discourage that sort of behavior.
Antonio E. Gonzalez
Apr 27, 2012, 1:21:01 AM4/27/12
to
On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 10:11:53 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rande...@gmail.com>
wrote:
>On Apr 26, 1:34 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >On Apr 25, 12:45 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
>> >> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>>
>> >> >On Apr 24, 12:12 pm, Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
>> >> >> So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
>> >> >> entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
>> >> >> nation.
>>
>> >> >> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
>> >> >> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>>
>> >> >> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>>
>> >> >> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>>
>> >> >> Tom
>>
>> >> >I thought I was kill-filed by you? You bragged about it.
>>
>> >> No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
>>
>> >Yes, James Cameron is a greenie, busybody nitwit.
>>
>> Ummm, try again:
>>
>> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
>> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
>What do you think of people who own 50 guns in their collection?
>
So, non-answer (again), and not even related to the original
question.
>>
>> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
>I only oppose it when it makes no sense and does not provide a net
>gain outcome.
>
Hmmm, one would think "net gain outcome" is only relevant to the
people investing, to each their own and all . . .
>>
>> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>>
>
>Why is it stupid people always (especially rank leftists) resort to
>invective and vulgarities?
Another norn-answer; non only that, but in a place where an answer
should be incredibly obvious.
So, that's one answer, two questions still left unaswered.
Well then, again quoting someone else::
>> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
>> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
wrote:
>On Apr 26, 1:34 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >On Apr 25, 12:45 am, Antonio E. Gonzalez <AntEGM...@aol.com> wrote:
>> >> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:34:42 -0700 (PDT), RichA <rander3...@gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>>
>> >> >On Apr 24, 12:12 pm, Tom <drso...@aol.com> wrote:
>> >> >> So you, who lives in a socilaist country, are opposed to an
>> >> >> entreprenurial, free enterprise endevor originating in a capitalist
>> >> >> nation.
>>
>> >> >> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
>> >> >> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>>
>> >> >> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>>
>> >> >> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>>
>> >> >> Tom
>>
>> >> >I thought I was kill-filed by you? You bragged about it.
>>
>> >> No questions anwered, no surprise . . .
>>
>> >Yes, James Cameron is a greenie, busybody nitwit.
>>
>> Ummm, try again:
>>
>> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
>> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
>What do you think of people who own 50 guns in their collection?
>
question.
>>
>> B) Why are you opposed to innovation?
>
>I only oppose it when it makes no sense and does not provide a net
>gain outcome.
>
people investing, to each their own and all . . .
>>
>> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>>
>
>Why is it stupid people always (especially rank leftists) resort to
>invective and vulgarities?
should be incredibly obvious.
So, that's one answer, two questions still left unaswered.
Well then, again quoting someone else::
>> A) Whay are you so concerned with what other people do with their hard
>> earned money? Could it be you want wealth redistribution?
>
>> C) Why are you so fucking stupid?
>>
>>
Paul Schlyter
Apr 27, 2012, 3:15:24 AM4/27/12
to
On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:42:39 -0700 (PDT), wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
somewhere?
> > Build your won road!
> Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> to use. Seems fair.
You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen money?
> > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
somewhere?
> > Build your won road!
> Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> to use. Seems fair.
> > Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself.
> Not a bad idea and there are many private schools from which to
> choose.
described in the bible instead of evolution..... Not a good idea!
Education should meet national, or even international, standards
rather than local whims.....
Paul Schlyter
Apr 27, 2012, 3:18:56 AM4/27/12
to
this by donation. Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
privileges, it's duties as well.
Paul Schlyter
Apr 27, 2012, 3:20:06 AM4/27/12
to
Martin Brown
Apr 27, 2012, 3:47:29 AM4/27/12
to
On 26/04/2012 18:40, Bert wrote:
> In news:jnbcsv$v23$1...@dont-email.me "Al"<al-n...@agora.com> wrote:
>
>> And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
>> free insulation and free boiler installation.
>
> By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
> pay for your goodies.
He lives in the UK. Almost no-one has a gun here and certainly not the
> In news:jnbcsv$v23$1...@dont-email.me "Al"<al-n...@agora.com> wrote:
>
>> And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
>> free insulation and free boiler installation.
>
> By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
> pay for your goodies.
tax authorities. Only specialist firearms police carry guns in the UK.
That is why the murder rate is an order of magnitude lower here.
The idea is that where insulation is concerned it makes sense to help
poor and vulnerable housebound individuals to insulate their homes. This
is obviously an alien concept to right wing Americans.
It also makes good sense to treat people with tuberculosis correctly
irrespective of whether or not they can *afford* the treatment. US is
particularly bad in this respect and we may end up back in the dark ages
where getting multiple drug resistant TB is a death sentence.
US view is that the poor are just another resource to be exploited and
ripped off by loan sharks and other unscrupulous parasites.
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 27, 2012, 5:49:46 AM4/27/12
to
On Apr 27, 3:20 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
And when we make drugs illegal, there will be significant numbers of
people committing drug-related crimes, whether or not there is massive
income redistribution.
people committing drug-related crimes, whether or not there is massive
income redistribution.
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 27, 2012, 5:44:04 AM4/27/12
to
On Apr 27, 3:15 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
used to build roads, those drivers who drive more miles get more use
out of the roads, buy more fuel and pay more tax. If they drive
heavier vehicles they also pay more fuel tax. They also will pay the
tax indirectly for deliveries of goods and services that they
purchase.
> > > Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself.
> > Not a bad idea and there are many private schools from which to
> > choose.
>
> ...so many of these kids are taught fairy-tales like creation as
> described in the bible instead of evolution.....
Home schooled children tend to do better academically, for whatever
reason. It could be genetics. Parents who can take on the task of
teaching might be smarter, healthier or more energetic and pass on
these traits to their kids. Evolution in action, up close and in your
face.
> Not a good idea!
> Education should meet national, or even international, standards
> rather than local whims.....
Standards based on the whims of rabid left wingers? Shall the
curriculum leave out the fact that lefties (whether commie or fascist)
started several horrible wars in the 20th Century?
> On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:42:39 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
> somewhere?
> > > Build your won road!
> > Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> > to use. Seems fair.
>
> You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen money?
A road needs to be paid for one way or the other. When fuel taxes are
> > > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
> somewhere?
> > > Build your won road!
> > Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> > to use. Seems fair.
>
> You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen money?
used to build roads, those drivers who drive more miles get more use
out of the roads, buy more fuel and pay more tax. If they drive
heavier vehicles they also pay more fuel tax. They also will pay the
tax indirectly for deliveries of goods and services that they
purchase.
> > > Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself.
> > Not a bad idea and there are many private schools from which to
> > choose.
>
> ...so many of these kids are taught fairy-tales like creation as
> described in the bible instead of evolution.....
reason. It could be genetics. Parents who can take on the task of
teaching might be smarter, healthier or more energetic and pass on
these traits to their kids. Evolution in action, up close and in your
face.
> Not a good idea!
> Education should meet national, or even international, standards
> rather than local whims.....
curriculum leave out the fact that lefties (whether commie or fascist)
started several horrible wars in the 20th Century?
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 27, 2012, 6:12:33 AM4/27/12
to
On Apr 27, 3:47 am, Martin Brown <|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
wrote:
demanding their cut, with guns if necessary.
> Only specialist firearms police carry guns in the UK.
> That is why the murder rate is an order of magnitude lower here.
The US is diverse, with many cultures and sub-cultures, whereas the UK
is perhaps an order of magnitude less so.
> The idea is that where insulation is concerned it makes sense to help
> poor and vulnerable housebound individuals to insulate their homes. This
> is obviously an alien concept to right wing Americans.
A concept that is alien to many or apparently most UKians is that
people should pay for what they use, poor or not.
> It also makes good sense to treat people with tuberculosis correctly
> irrespective of whether or not they can *afford* the treatment.
Tuberculosis being somewhat contagious.
> US is
> particularly bad in this respect and we may end up back in the dark ages
> where getting multiple drug resistant TB is a death sentence.
Bad example, since others have a self-interest in the presence of
infected people.
> US view is that the poor are just another resource to be exploited and
> ripped off by loan sharks and other unscrupulous parasites.
Yet the "poor" in the US have cars, air conditioning, microwaves,
cable, cell phones,....
wrote:
> On 26/04/2012 18:40, Bert wrote:
>
> > Innews:jnbcsv$v23$1...@dont-email.me"Al"<al-nos...@agora.com> wrote:
>
>
> >> And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
> >> free insulation and free boiler installation.
>
> > By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
> > pay for your goodies.
>
> He lives in the UK. Almost no-one has a gun here and certainly not the
> tax authorities.
If you don't pay your taxes, eventually the authorities will show up
> >> And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
> >> free insulation and free boiler installation.
>
> > By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
> > pay for your goodies.
>
> He lives in the UK. Almost no-one has a gun here and certainly not the
> tax authorities.
demanding their cut, with guns if necessary.
> Only specialist firearms police carry guns in the UK.
> That is why the murder rate is an order of magnitude lower here.
is perhaps an order of magnitude less so.
> The idea is that where insulation is concerned it makes sense to help
> poor and vulnerable housebound individuals to insulate their homes. This
> is obviously an alien concept to right wing Americans.
people should pay for what they use, poor or not.
> It also makes good sense to treat people with tuberculosis correctly
> irrespective of whether or not they can *afford* the treatment.
> US is
> particularly bad in this respect and we may end up back in the dark ages
> where getting multiple drug resistant TB is a death sentence.
infected people.
> US view is that the poor are just another resource to be exploited and
> ripped off by loan sharks and other unscrupulous parasites.
cable, cell phones,....
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 27, 2012, 5:47:18 AM4/27/12
to
On Apr 27, 3:18 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
conclude that you are a big part of the problem that you perceive to
exist.
> Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> privileges, it's duties as well.
Then you should donate most of your income and live on the "world
average" of $9000.
> On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:47:54 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > On Apr 26, 1:37 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 02:35:39 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com
> wrote:
> > > > If everyone who believes in wealth redistribution were to do
> what RA
> > > > suggested it would be a start towards whatever dubious goal
> that you
> > > > people have in mind. IOW put your money where your mouth is.
> In
> > > > reality it's only the wealth of others that you wish to
> > > redistribute,
> > > > not your own.
>
> > > Blatantly false! I already live in a country and in a situation
> where
> > > parts if my income is redistributed to others. If you were right i
> > > would immediately emigrate to e.g. Switzerland, however i have no
> > > such plans.
> > It was suggested that you donate ALL BUT about $9000 of your income
> to
> > those less fortunate, not donate $9000 and keep the rest.
>
> Taxes work better -- there are far too many people unwilling to do
> this by donation.
And since you refuse to donate the bulk of your income, one must
> > On Apr 26, 1:37 pm, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 02:35:39 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com
> wrote:
> > > > If everyone who believes in wealth redistribution were to do
> what RA
> > > > suggested it would be a start towards whatever dubious goal
> that you
> > > > people have in mind. IOW put your money where your mouth is.
> In
> > > > reality it's only the wealth of others that you wish to
> > > redistribute,
> > > > not your own.
>
> > > Blatantly false! I already live in a country and in a situation
> where
> > > parts if my income is redistributed to others. If you were right i
> > > would immediately emigrate to e.g. Switzerland, however i have no
> > > such plans.
> > It was suggested that you donate ALL BUT about $9000 of your income
> to
> > those less fortunate, not donate $9000 and keep the rest.
>
> Taxes work better -- there are far too many people unwilling to do
> this by donation.
conclude that you are a big part of the problem that you perceive to
exist.
> Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> privileges, it's duties as well.
average" of $9000.
pau...@stjarnhimlen.se
Apr 27, 2012, 10:07:19 AM4/27/12
to
In article <6f25f676-731d-41e7-8dea-
93bfc8...@z17g2000yqf.googlegroups.com>, wsne...@hotmail.com says...
Look who's talking ..... you don't want to do this yourself, do you?
> > Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> > privileges, it's duties as well.
>
> Then you should donate most of your income and live on the "world
> average" of $9000.
Just like you should. You should always be prepared to do yourself what
you demand of others -- or else you'll lose all credibility.
--
Paul Schlyter
Grev Turegatan 40, SE-11438 Stockholm
Email: pau...@stjarnhimlen.se
WWW: http://stjarnhimlen.se
93bfc8...@z17g2000yqf.googlegroups.com>, wsne...@hotmail.com says...
> > Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> > privileges, it's duties as well.
>
> Then you should donate most of your income and live on the "world
> average" of $9000.
you demand of others -- or else you'll lose all credibility.
--
Paul Schlyter
Grev Turegatan 40, SE-11438 Stockholm
Email: pau...@stjarnhimlen.se
WWW: http://stjarnhimlen.se
pau...@stjarnhimlen.se
Apr 27, 2012, 10:14:09 AM4/27/12
to
In article <a540ab0e-6c1f-48bb-96a7-46523dcae0e6
@c4g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>, wsne...@hotmail.com says...
it's ok to pay the costs with "stolen" money....
> > > > Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself.
> > > Not a bad idea and there are many private schools from which to
> > > choose.
> >
> > ...so many of these kids are taught fairy-tales like creation as
> > described in the bible instead of evolution.....
>
> Home schooled children tend to do better academically, for whatever
> reason. It could be genetics. Parents who can take on the task of
> teaching might be smarter, healthier or more energetic and pass on
> these traits to their kids.
This is just because only very motivated parents will shool their
children at home. If everyone were forced to do this, then the majority
of all kids would get hardly any education at all -- just like a few
centuries ago.
> Evolution in action, up close and in your face.
Civilisation is counteracting several of the effects of evolution.
That's why we don't throw our elderly off a high mountain, or leave
those who are severely ill to die with no help. Having evolution act
everywhere is dismounting civilisation.
> > Not a good idea!
> > Education should meet national, or even international, standards
> > rather than local whims.....
>
> Standards based on the whims of rabid left wingers? Shall the
> curriculum leave out the fact that lefties (whether commie or fascist)
> started several horrible wars in the 20th Century?
....or leave out the fact that the righties e.g. started international
trades of slaves before that ?????? We don't want that back, do we?
Perhaps you do, in the name of "evolution in action" ????
@c4g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>, wsne...@hotmail.com says...
>
> On Apr 27, 3:15 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:42:39 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
> > somewhere?
> > > > Build your won road!
> > > Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> > > to use. Seems fair.
> >
> > You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen money?
>
> A road needs to be paid for one way or the other. When fuel taxes are
> used to build roads, those drivers who drive more miles get more use
> out of the roads, buy more fuel and pay more tax. If they drive
> heavier vehicles they also pay more fuel tax. They also will pay the
> tax indirectly for deliveries of goods and services that they
> purchase.
It's interesting that you've found at least one case where you think
> On Apr 27, 3:15 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:42:39 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
> > somewhere?
> > > > Build your won road!
> > > Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> > > to use. Seems fair.
> >
> > You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen money?
>
> A road needs to be paid for one way or the other. When fuel taxes are
> used to build roads, those drivers who drive more miles get more use
> out of the roads, buy more fuel and pay more tax. If they drive
> heavier vehicles they also pay more fuel tax. They also will pay the
> tax indirectly for deliveries of goods and services that they
> purchase.
it's ok to pay the costs with "stolen" money....
> > > > Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself.
> > > Not a bad idea and there are many private schools from which to
> > > choose.
> >
> > ...so many of these kids are taught fairy-tales like creation as
> > described in the bible instead of evolution.....
>
> Home schooled children tend to do better academically, for whatever
> reason. It could be genetics. Parents who can take on the task of
> teaching might be smarter, healthier or more energetic and pass on
> these traits to their kids.
children at home. If everyone were forced to do this, then the majority
of all kids would get hardly any education at all -- just like a few
centuries ago.
> Evolution in action, up close and in your face.
That's why we don't throw our elderly off a high mountain, or leave
those who are severely ill to die with no help. Having evolution act
everywhere is dismounting civilisation.
> > Not a good idea!
> > Education should meet national, or even international, standards
> > rather than local whims.....
>
> Standards based on the whims of rabid left wingers? Shall the
> curriculum leave out the fact that lefties (whether commie or fascist)
> started several horrible wars in the 20th Century?
trades of slaves before that ?????? We don't want that back, do we?
Perhaps you do, in the name of "evolution in action" ????
pau...@stjarnhimlen.se
Apr 27, 2012, 10:16:50 AM4/27/12
to
In article <762530e2-17db-469e-a409-055abb985279
@h9g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>, wsne...@hotmail.com says...
Quite naturally, introducing a law means some people will break the law.
If there would be absolutely no law-breakers, there would be no reason
to introduce such a law. We could e.g. reduce the murder rate to zero
by making all killings legal, since murder is only illegal killing....
@h9g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>, wsne...@hotmail.com says...
If there would be absolutely no law-breakers, there would be no reason
to introduce such a law. We could e.g. reduce the murder rate to zero
by making all killings legal, since murder is only illegal killing....
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 28, 2012, 8:18:16 AM4/28/12
to
On Apr 27, 10:07 am, <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> In article <6f25f676-731d-41e7-8dea-
> 93bfc88cc...@z17g2000yqf.googlegroups.com>, wsnel...@hotmail.com says...
Here is what you wrote: "Yesssss, that is the fundamental idea. And
the wealthy too will benefit from wealth being more evenly
distributed:"
To which RA replied: "The World's people exist on about $9,000/ea.
Nothing at all is stopping you from re-distributing the part of your
income that exists above that."
Now, you wish to "redestribute" the wealth of the wealthy, yet you
have not stopped to consider that compared to Mr/Ms Average World
Citizen you are almost obscenely wealthy, even despite living in
Sweden.
> > > Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> > > privileges, it's duties as well.
>
> > Then you should donate most of your income and live on the "world
> > average" of $9000.
>
> Just like you should. You should always be prepared to do yourself what
> you demand of others -- or else you'll lose all credibility.
I am not in favor of wealth redistribution, but you are. I only
demand of you what you demand of others. My credibility is fine. Your
credibility is now gone.
> In article <6f25f676-731d-41e7-8dea-
> 93bfc88cc...@z17g2000yqf.googlegroups.com>, wsnel...@hotmail.com says...
the wealthy too will benefit from wealth being more evenly
distributed:"
To which RA replied: "The World's people exist on about $9,000/ea.
Nothing at all is stopping you from re-distributing the part of your
income that exists above that."
Now, you wish to "redestribute" the wealth of the wealthy, yet you
have not stopped to consider that compared to Mr/Ms Average World
Citizen you are almost obscenely wealthy, even despite living in
Sweden.
> > > Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> > > privileges, it's duties as well.
>
> > Then you should donate most of your income and live on the "world
> > average" of $9000.
>
> Just like you should. You should always be prepared to do yourself what
> you demand of others -- or else you'll lose all credibility.
demand of you what you demand of others. My credibility is fine. Your
credibility is now gone.
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 28, 2012, 8:39:29 AM4/28/12
to
On Apr 27, 10:14 am, <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> In article <a540ab0e-6c1f-48bb-96a7-46523dcae0e6
> @c4g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>, wsnel...@hotmail.com says...
> In article <a540ab0e-6c1f-48bb-96a7-46523dcae0e6
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 27, 3:15 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:42:39 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
> > > somewhere?
> > > > > Build your won road!
> > > > Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> > > > to use. Seems fair.
>
> > > You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen money?
>
> > A road needs to be paid for one way or the other. When fuel taxes are
> > used to build roads, those drivers who drive more miles get more use
> > out of the roads, buy more fuel and pay more tax. If they drive
> > heavier vehicles they also pay more fuel tax. They also will pay the
> > tax indirectly for deliveries of goods and services that they
> > purchase.
>
> It's interesting that you've found at least one case where you think
> it's ok to pay the costs with "stolen" money....
Fuel tax used to build public roads is not "stolen" money.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 27, 3:15 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:42:39 -0700 (PDT), wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
> > > somewhere?
> > > > > Build your won road!
> > > > Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in proportion
> > > > to use. Seems fair.
>
> > > You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen money?
>
> > A road needs to be paid for one way or the other. When fuel taxes are
> > used to build roads, those drivers who drive more miles get more use
> > out of the roads, buy more fuel and pay more tax. If they drive
> > heavier vehicles they also pay more fuel tax. They also will pay the
> > tax indirectly for deliveries of goods and services that they
> > purchase.
>
> It's interesting that you've found at least one case where you think
> it's ok to pay the costs with "stolen" money....
A tax (especially an income tax) that is used as a source of funds for
income redistribution IS stolen money.
Learn the difference.
> > > > > Want to educate your kids? Do it yourself.
> > > > Not a bad idea and there are many private schools from which to
> > > > choose.
>
> > > ...so many of these kids are taught fairy-tales like creation as
> > > described in the bible instead of evolution.....
>
> > Home schooled children tend to do better academically, for whatever
> > reason. It could be genetics. Parents who can take on the task of
> > teaching might be smarter, healthier or more energetic and pass on
> > these traits to their kids.
>
> This is just because only very motivated parents will shool their
> children at home.
motivated parents themselves.
> If everyone were forced to do this, then the majority
> of all kids would get hardly any education at all -- just like a few
> centuries ago.
private school. Barring that they might still be able to move to a
district with reasonably well-run public schools and hope for the
best. Even then they can take a more active role in educating their
kids outside of school.
> > Evolution in action, up close and in your face.
>
> Civilisation is counteracting several of the effects of evolution.
> That's why we don't throw our elderly off a high mountain, or leave
> those who are severely ill to die with no help. Having evolution act
> everywhere is dismounting civilisation.
can still be productive will tend to prevail over those who do not,
all else being equal. Such traits -very- likely have a genetic
component. Evolution continues.
> > > Not a good idea!
> > > Education should meet national, or even international, standards
> > > rather than local whims.....
>
> > Standards based on the whims of rabid left wingers? Shall the
> > curriculum leave out the fact that lefties (whether commie or fascist)
> > started several horrible wars in the 20th Century?
>
> ....or leave out the fact that the righties e.g. started international
> trades of slaves before that ?????? We don't want that back, do we?
> Perhaps you do, in the name of "evolution in action" ????
not fit MY definition of conservative, if that is what you mean by
"rightie."
Paul Schlyter
Apr 28, 2012, 9:21:58 AM4/28/12
to
be enforced, it's not enough to rely bsolely on voluntary
redistribution. Also, one needs a legal system, valid all over the
world, to be able to enforce this.
It's somewhat like if you're opposed to people killing other perople,
then you'd say "murder is, or should be, illegal!". You don't say
"well if you don't want to kill people, fine, then don't do it. But
let others who want to kill people do it without disturbing them!"
> > > > Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> > > > privileges, it's duties as well.
> >
> > > Then you should donate most of your income and live on the
"world
> > > average" of $9000.
> >
> > Just like you should. You should always be prepared to do
> t
> > you demand of others -- or else you'll lose all credibility.
> I am not in favor of wealth redistribution, but you are. I only
> demand of you what you demand of others. My credibility is fine.
Your
> credibility is now gone.
The very purpose of wealth distribution is to prevent unfair
> > you demand of others -- or else you'll lose all credibility.
> I am not in favor of wealth redistribution, but you are. I only
> demand of you what you demand of others. My credibility is fine.
Your
> credibility is now gone.
accumulation of wealth or at least make it smaller. The decision of
whether to do it or not is not an individual decision, it's a
decision the entire society must make.
But you've made your point clear: you prefer to lock yourself up in a
gated community, and pay large amounts for prisons, etc.
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 28, 2012, 9:15:15 AM4/28/12
to
On Apr 27, 10:16 am, <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> In article <762530e2-17db-469e-a409-055abb985279
> @h9g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>, wsnel...@hotmail.com says...
> In article <762530e2-17db-469e-a409-055abb985279
no law to break. However, there are bad behaviors that harm innocent
victims. We make laws against such behaviors. If there can be no
victim, there should be no law.
> We could e.g. reduce the murder rate to zero
> by making all killings legal, since murder is only illegal killing....
least among people who live in civilized countries such as the US.
Sweden is probably less enlightened:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/murky-truth-of-how-a-neutral-sweden-covered-up-its-collaboration-with-nazis-727261.html
Paul Schlyter
Apr 28, 2012, 9:24:45 AM4/28/12
to
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 05:39:29 -0700 (PDT), wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Apr 27, 10:14 am, <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > In article <a540ab0e-6c1f-48bb-96a7-46523dcae0e6
> > @c4g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>, wsnel...@hotmail.com says...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Apr 27, 3:15 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se>
wrote:
> > > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:42:39 -0700 (PDT),
wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
> > > > somewhere?
> > > > > > Build your won road!
> > > > > Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in
proportio=
> On Apr 27, 10:14 am, <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
> > In article <a540ab0e-6c1f-48bb-96a7-46523dcae0e6
> > @c4g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>, wsnel...@hotmail.com says...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Apr 27, 3:15 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se>
wrote:
> > > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:42:39 -0700 (PDT),
wsnel...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > a price too high for not paying taxes. You want to travel
> > > > somewhere?
> > > > > > Build your won road!
> > > > > Roads are largely paid for via fuel taxes, so one pays in
> n
> > > > > to use. Seems fair.
> >
> > > > You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen
money?
> >
> > > A road needs to be paid for one way or the other. When fuel
taxes ar=
> > > > > to use. Seems fair.
> >
> > > > You think it's fair to pay road construction with stolen
money?
> >
> > > A road needs to be paid for one way or the other. When fuel
Those who engaged in the slave trade were certainly no lefties, rabid
or not ......
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 28, 2012, 10:12:55 AM4/28/12
to
On Apr 28, 9:24 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
You have not really defined "rightie" or "rabid rightie" and nothing
that you write about this can make any sense until you do.
Slavery is not something that any true conservative would condone.
that you write about this can make any sense until you do.
Slavery is not something that any true conservative would condone.
wsne...@hotmail.com
Apr 28, 2012, 10:29:51 AM4/28/12
to
On Apr 28, 9:21 am, Paul Schlyter <pau...@stjarnhimlen.se> wrote:
Of course not, it will be necessary to steal from those who work
harder and take risks.
> Also, one needs a legal system, valid all over the
> world, to be able to enforce this.
So in other words you are a thief, a fascist, a communist, a
collectivist, etc., all rolled into one.
> It's somewhat like if you're opposed to people killing other perople,
> then you'd say "murder is, or should be, illegal!". You don't say
> "well if you don't want to kill people, fine, then don't do it. But
> let others who want to kill people do it without disturbing them!"
Your logic is deplorable.
A country could certainly close off its borders, ignore the rest of
the world, and be as communistic as it wants, assuming that its people
would tolerate it. On a smaller scale one could try out a hippie
commune. At least if that doesn't work out you can walk away.
> > > > > Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> > > > > privileges, it's duties as well.
>
> > > > Then you should donate most of your income and live on the
> "world
> > > > average" of $9000.
>
> > > Just like you should. You should always be prepared to do
> yourself wha=
> > t
> > > you demand of others -- or else you'll lose all credibility.
> > I am not in favor of wealth redistribution, but you are. I only
> > demand of you what you demand of others. My credibility is fine.
> Your
> > credibility is now gone.
>
> The very purpose of wealth distribution is to prevent unfair
> accumulation of wealth or at least make it smaller.
So if I decide to work more hours, I make more money and pay more tax
to support those who decide to do otherwise? No thanks.
> The decision of
> whether to do it or not is not an individual decision, it's a
> decision the entire society must make.
As I alluded to earlier, any given subset of people can work with each
other in various types of _voluntary_ collective arrangements. Just
be aware the if you need to obtain outside supplies to grow your dope
crop, the vendor will want to charge free-market rates.
> But you've made your point clear: you prefer to lock yourself up in a
> gated community, and pay large amounts for prisons, etc.
Did I ever say that? No.
harder and take risks.
> Also, one needs a legal system, valid all over the
> world, to be able to enforce this.
collectivist, etc., all rolled into one.
> It's somewhat like if you're opposed to people killing other perople,
> then you'd say "murder is, or should be, illegal!". You don't say
> "well if you don't want to kill people, fine, then don't do it. But
> let others who want to kill people do it without disturbing them!"
A country could certainly close off its borders, ignore the rest of
the world, and be as communistic as it wants, assuming that its people
would tolerate it. On a smaller scale one could try out a hippie
commune. At least if that doesn't work out you can walk away.
> > > > > Yes, being a member of a society isn't just
> > > > > privileges, it's duties as well.
>
> > > > Then you should donate most of your income and live on the
> "world
> > > > average" of $9000.
>
> > > Just like you should. You should always be prepared to do
> yourself wha=
> > t
> > > you demand of others -- or else you'll lose all credibility.
> > I am not in favor of wealth redistribution, but you are. I only
> > demand of you what you demand of others. My credibility is fine.
> Your
> > credibility is now gone.
>
> The very purpose of wealth distribution is to prevent unfair
> accumulation of wealth or at least make it smaller.
to support those who decide to do otherwise? No thanks.
> The decision of
> whether to do it or not is not an individual decision, it's a
> decision the entire society must make.
other in various types of _voluntary_ collective arrangements. Just
be aware the if you need to obtain outside supplies to grow your dope
crop, the vendor will want to charge free-market rates.
> But you've made your point clear: you prefer to lock yourself up in a
> gated community, and pay large amounts for prisons, etc.
Brad Guth
Apr 28, 2012, 1:54:29 PM4/28/12
to
Actually, off-world TBMs creating a partially hollowed out moon would
be really nifty, although there could already be a porous or geode
like hollow interior as is. TBMs could seek out such porous layers
and geode pockets, because within that moon that’s surrounded by such
a hard vacuum, and via sublimation or the vaporizing of elements (such
as the loss of sodium or the evaporation of mineral brines) is where
almost anything simple or complex is possible about the innards of our
moon.
Removing only 0.1% of the moon is worth 2.2e16 m3 which offers 1e7 m3
for each of 2.2 billion of us, or 1e6 m3 for each of 22 billion of
us. How is that a bad thing?
Hollowing out .001% of Earth is worth 1e16 m3 = 1e6 m3 for each of ten
billion of us.
A thousand really big and powerful TBMs working around the clock could
make this happen. That's based upon a conservative 1e7 m3 per TBM/yr,
so a thousand of those TBMs will only manage to dig through 1e10 m3/
year. As you might figure, this is a very big and energy consuming
dig, although a million years worth of plutonium reactor powered TBMs
would be a darn good utilization of our spent nuclear reactor fuel
(especially of spent MOX that has 7.5% plutonium). Of course I’m
being extremely optimistic about humanity lasting another million
years, especially when this current century keeps looking doubtful.
With such tunnels established, all sorts of vacuum tunnel public-
transporters running on frictionless magnetic drives could become the
only way to fly (so to speak). Currently 3 inches or 7.5 cm/minute is
the fastest hard-rock TBM, however with talent and resources applied
should be capable of doubling that, but of course finishing off the
interior for habitat use will take a bit longer. A Caterpillar TBM as
of 2005 did manage to reach 410 meters/month.
"The Herrenknecht S-373 Double Shield is optimally suited for this
kind of geological conditions. Since the start of excavation in July
2007, the machine has achieved world records in hard rock with a best
daily advance rate of 83.2 meters and a best weekly advance rate of
430.4 meters.”
As some of us can plainly see, the advancements in TBM performance
haven’t quite run out of steam or hit the wall, at least not so far.
Perhaps eventually exceeding a km/week isn’t even asking too much, and
that’s worth excavating 1e6 m3/month/TBM, or 1.2e7 m3/year/TBM.
http://www.phdtbm.com/page18/page12/page9/
http://www.herrenknecht.com/news/press-section/records-tumble-at-the-cabrera-tunnel.html
http://www.cattunnelboring.com/MS/MS1/page.php?p=29
Once the hollowing out of our moon gets underway, there should be all
sorts of ideas and notions of off-world exploitations going
mainstream.
Not that there’s any significant shortages or commercial market for
raw sodium that’ll need off-world sourcing, but it’s simply and
indication as to what certain asteroids should have to offer. If an
asteroid has indicators such as sodium and helium, is a really darn
good indication that other extremely valuable elements should exist.
Obviously our naked moon is quite highly charged (similar or somewhat
greater extent than charged particles within our Van Allen belts),
because it’s certainly not from its wussy gravity or any significant
geomagnetic field that’s holding into that surrounding cloud of
ionized sodium. I’m not at all certain why our moon should even have
its own internal cache of sodium, but none the less it has established
and manages to replenish a 900,000 km trail of it, plus hosting a 9r
surrounding cloud that together represent a considerable mass of
sodium.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium
“The free metal does not occur in nature, but instead must be
prepared from its compounds”
http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/622563/Van-Allen-radiation-belt
“The inner Van Allen belt consists largely of highly energetic
protons, with energy exceeding 30,000,000 electron volts. The peak
intensity of these protons is approximately 20,000 particles per
second crossing a spherical area of one square cm in all directions.”
Of course as a consequence our naked moon gives off a terrific amount
of gamma, as mostly created by other cosmic gamma interacting with its
metallicity and paramagnetic nature, plus there should be a little of
its own local cache of cobalt 60, as well as plutonium and most other
radioisotope fission worthy elements. Our moon is clearly a primary
and/or secondary/recoil source of gamma.
http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap060527.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Moon_gamma_rays_egret_instrument_cgro.jpg
Naturally the mainstream status quo of DARPA, JPL, ASU and NASA as
oligarch minions are all keeping this knowledge as mum as they can
about any of this metallicity, because it means that our naked moon is
charged at something greater than 20 MeV.
Here we have another stymied generation of K12+ students working with
those supposed Apollo moon rocks, except they’re checking out as
though their titanium plus other combinations of elements as having
come only from Earth.
“Titanium paternity test fingers Earth as moon's sole parent”
http://www.moontoday.net/news/viewpr.html?pid=36571
"We thought that the moon had two parents, but when we look at the
composition of the moon, it looks like it has only one parent," Zhang
said.
“Zhang's titanium analyses greatly reinforce previous work by other
researchers who came to the same conclusion after comparing
terrestrial and lunar oxygen isotopes, which are less refractory and
thus more likely to gasify during a giant impact than titanium.”
"We thought we knew what the moon was made of and how it formed, but
even 40 years after Apollo, there is still a lot of science to do with
those samples that are in curatorial facilities at NASA," Dauphas
said.
I’ve said the exact same thing since I discovered how totally
disinterested our NASA, DARPA and JPL were about our moon, its L1 and
especially obfuscating as to the planet Venus (aka Guth Venus).
http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”
On Apr 24, 5:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> BBC:
>
> 24 April 2012 Last updated at 07:30 ET
> Plans for asteroid mining emerge
>
> Details have been emerging of the plan by billionaire entrepreneurs to
> mine asteroids for their resources.
>
> The multi-million-dollar plan would use robotic spacecraft to squeeze
> chemical components of fuel and minerals such as platinum and gold out
> of the rocks.
>
> The founders include film director and explorer James Cameron as well
> as Google's chief executive Larry Page and its executive chairman Eric
> Schmidt.
>
> They even aim to create a fuel depot in space by 2020.
>
> However, several scientists have responded with scepticism, calling
> the plan daring, difficult and highly expensive.
>
> They struggle to see how it could be cost-effective, even with
> platinum and gold worth nearly £35 per gram ($1,600 an ounce). An
> upcoming Nasa mission to return just 60g (two ounces) of material from
> an asteroid to Earth will cost about $1bn.
>
> The inaugural step, to be achieved in the next 18 to 24 months, would
> be launching the first in a series of private telescopes that would
> search for asteroid targets rich in resources. The intention will be
> to open deep-space exploration to private industry.
>
> Within five to 10 years, however, the company expects to progress from
> selling observation platforms in orbit around Earth to prospecting
> services. It plans to tap some of the thousands of asteroids that pass
> relatively close to Earth and extract their raw materials.
>
> The company, known as Planetary Resources, is also backed by space
> tourism pioneer Eric Anderson, X-Prize founder Peter Diamandis, former
> US presidential candidate Ross Perot and veteran Nasa astronaut Tom
> Jones.
>
> The founders of the venture are to give further details in a press
> conference on Tuesday.
> Long game
>
> "We have a long view. We're not expecting this company to be an
> overnight financial home run. This is going to take time," Eric
> Anderson told the Reuters news agency.
>
> The billionaires are hoping that the real financial returns, which are
> decades away, will come from mining asteroids for platinum group
> metals and rare minerals.
>
> "If you look back historically at what has caused humanity to make its
> largest investments in exploration and in transportation, it has been
> going after resources, whether it's the Europeans going after the
> spice routes or the American settlers looking toward the west for
> gold, oil, timber or land," Mr Diamandis explained.
>
> Water from asteroids could be broken down in space to liquid oxygen
> and liquid hydrogen for rocket fuel. Water is very expensive to get
> off the ground so the plan is to take it from an asteroid to a spot in
> space where it can be converted into fuel.
>
> From there, it could be shipped to Earth orbit for refueling
> commercial satellites or spacecraft.
>
> "A depot within a decade seems incredible. I hope there will be
> someone to use it," Dr Andrew Cheng, a planetary scientist at Johns
> Hopkins University's Applied Physics Laboratory told the Associated
> Press.
>
> "And I have high hopes that commercial uses of space will become
> profitable beyond Earth orbit. Maybe the time has come."
>
> Prof Jay Melosh from Purdue University said that the costs were just
> too high, calling space exploration "a sport that only wealthy
> nations, and those wishing to demonstrate their technical prowess, can
> afford to indulge."
>
> Eric Anderson, who co-founded the space tourism firm Space Adventures,
> said he was used to sceptics.
>
> "Before we started launching people into space as private citizens,
> people thought that was a pie-in-the-sky idea," He said.
>
> "We're in this for decades. But it's not a charity. And we'll make
> money from the beginning."
be really nifty, although there could already be a porous or geode
like hollow interior as is. TBMs could seek out such porous layers
and geode pockets, because within that moon that’s surrounded by such
a hard vacuum, and via sublimation or the vaporizing of elements (such
as the loss of sodium or the evaporation of mineral brines) is where
almost anything simple or complex is possible about the innards of our
moon.
Removing only 0.1% of the moon is worth 2.2e16 m3 which offers 1e7 m3
for each of 2.2 billion of us, or 1e6 m3 for each of 22 billion of
us. How is that a bad thing?
Hollowing out .001% of Earth is worth 1e16 m3 = 1e6 m3 for each of ten
billion of us.
A thousand really big and powerful TBMs working around the clock could
make this happen. That's based upon a conservative 1e7 m3 per TBM/yr,
so a thousand of those TBMs will only manage to dig through 1e10 m3/
year. As you might figure, this is a very big and energy consuming
dig, although a million years worth of plutonium reactor powered TBMs
would be a darn good utilization of our spent nuclear reactor fuel
(especially of spent MOX that has 7.5% plutonium). Of course I’m
being extremely optimistic about humanity lasting another million
years, especially when this current century keeps looking doubtful.
With such tunnels established, all sorts of vacuum tunnel public-
transporters running on frictionless magnetic drives could become the
only way to fly (so to speak). Currently 3 inches or 7.5 cm/minute is
the fastest hard-rock TBM, however with talent and resources applied
should be capable of doubling that, but of course finishing off the
interior for habitat use will take a bit longer. A Caterpillar TBM as
of 2005 did manage to reach 410 meters/month.
"The Herrenknecht S-373 Double Shield is optimally suited for this
kind of geological conditions. Since the start of excavation in July
2007, the machine has achieved world records in hard rock with a best
daily advance rate of 83.2 meters and a best weekly advance rate of
430.4 meters.”
As some of us can plainly see, the advancements in TBM performance
haven’t quite run out of steam or hit the wall, at least not so far.
Perhaps eventually exceeding a km/week isn’t even asking too much, and
that’s worth excavating 1e6 m3/month/TBM, or 1.2e7 m3/year/TBM.
http://www.phdtbm.com/page18/page12/page9/
http://www.herrenknecht.com/news/press-section/records-tumble-at-the-cabrera-tunnel.html
http://www.cattunnelboring.com/MS/MS1/page.php?p=29
Once the hollowing out of our moon gets underway, there should be all
sorts of ideas and notions of off-world exploitations going
mainstream.
Not that there’s any significant shortages or commercial market for
raw sodium that’ll need off-world sourcing, but it’s simply and
indication as to what certain asteroids should have to offer. If an
asteroid has indicators such as sodium and helium, is a really darn
good indication that other extremely valuable elements should exist.
Obviously our naked moon is quite highly charged (similar or somewhat
greater extent than charged particles within our Van Allen belts),
because it’s certainly not from its wussy gravity or any significant
geomagnetic field that’s holding into that surrounding cloud of
ionized sodium. I’m not at all certain why our moon should even have
its own internal cache of sodium, but none the less it has established
and manages to replenish a 900,000 km trail of it, plus hosting a 9r
surrounding cloud that together represent a considerable mass of
sodium.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium
“The free metal does not occur in nature, but instead must be
prepared from its compounds”
http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/622563/Van-Allen-radiation-belt
“The inner Van Allen belt consists largely of highly energetic
protons, with energy exceeding 30,000,000 electron volts. The peak
intensity of these protons is approximately 20,000 particles per
second crossing a spherical area of one square cm in all directions.”
Of course as a consequence our naked moon gives off a terrific amount
of gamma, as mostly created by other cosmic gamma interacting with its
metallicity and paramagnetic nature, plus there should be a little of
its own local cache of cobalt 60, as well as plutonium and most other
radioisotope fission worthy elements. Our moon is clearly a primary
and/or secondary/recoil source of gamma.
http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap060527.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Moon_gamma_rays_egret_instrument_cgro.jpg
Naturally the mainstream status quo of DARPA, JPL, ASU and NASA as
oligarch minions are all keeping this knowledge as mum as they can
about any of this metallicity, because it means that our naked moon is
charged at something greater than 20 MeV.
Here we have another stymied generation of K12+ students working with
those supposed Apollo moon rocks, except they’re checking out as
though their titanium plus other combinations of elements as having
come only from Earth.
“Titanium paternity test fingers Earth as moon's sole parent”
http://www.moontoday.net/news/viewpr.html?pid=36571
"We thought that the moon had two parents, but when we look at the
composition of the moon, it looks like it has only one parent," Zhang
said.
“Zhang's titanium analyses greatly reinforce previous work by other
researchers who came to the same conclusion after comparing
terrestrial and lunar oxygen isotopes, which are less refractory and
thus more likely to gasify during a giant impact than titanium.”
"We thought we knew what the moon was made of and how it formed, but
even 40 years after Apollo, there is still a lot of science to do with
those samples that are in curatorial facilities at NASA," Dauphas
said.
I’ve said the exact same thing since I discovered how totally
disinterested our NASA, DARPA and JPL were about our moon, its L1 and
especially obfuscating as to the planet Venus (aka Guth Venus).
http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”
On Apr 24, 5:10 am, RichA <rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> BBC:
>
> 24 April 2012 Last updated at 07:30 ET
> Plans for asteroid mining emerge
>
> Details have been emerging of the plan by billionaire entrepreneurs to
> mine asteroids for their resources.
>
> The multi-million-dollar plan would use robotic spacecraft to squeeze
> chemical components of fuel and minerals such as platinum and gold out
> of the rocks.
>
> The founders include film director and explorer James Cameron as well
> as Google's chief executive Larry Page and its executive chairman Eric
> Schmidt.
>
> They even aim to create a fuel depot in space by 2020.
>
> However, several scientists have responded with scepticism, calling
> the plan daring, difficult and highly expensive.
>
> They struggle to see how it could be cost-effective, even with
> platinum and gold worth nearly £35 per gram ($1,600 an ounce). An
> upcoming Nasa mission to return just 60g (two ounces) of material from
> an asteroid to Earth will cost about $1bn.
>
> The inaugural step, to be achieved in the next 18 to 24 months, would
> be launching the first in a series of private telescopes that would
> search for asteroid targets rich in resources. The intention will be
> to open deep-space exploration to private industry.
>
> Within five to 10 years, however, the company expects to progress from
> selling observation platforms in orbit around Earth to prospecting
> services. It plans to tap some of the thousands of asteroids that pass
> relatively close to Earth and extract their raw materials.
>
> The company, known as Planetary Resources, is also backed by space
> tourism pioneer Eric Anderson, X-Prize founder Peter Diamandis, former
> US presidential candidate Ross Perot and veteran Nasa astronaut Tom
> Jones.
>
> The founders of the venture are to give further details in a press
> conference on Tuesday.
> Long game
>
> "We have a long view. We're not expecting this company to be an
> overnight financial home run. This is going to take time," Eric
> Anderson told the Reuters news agency.
>
> The billionaires are hoping that the real financial returns, which are
> decades away, will come from mining asteroids for platinum group
> metals and rare minerals.
>
> "If you look back historically at what has caused humanity to make its
> largest investments in exploration and in transportation, it has been
> going after resources, whether it's the Europeans going after the
> spice routes or the American settlers looking toward the west for
> gold, oil, timber or land," Mr Diamandis explained.
>
> Water from asteroids could be broken down in space to liquid oxygen
> and liquid hydrogen for rocket fuel. Water is very expensive to get
> off the ground so the plan is to take it from an asteroid to a spot in
> space where it can be converted into fuel.
>
> From there, it could be shipped to Earth orbit for refueling
> commercial satellites or spacecraft.
>
> "A depot within a decade seems incredible. I hope there will be
> someone to use it," Dr Andrew Cheng, a planetary scientist at Johns
> Hopkins University's Applied Physics Laboratory told the Associated
> Press.
>
> "And I have high hopes that commercial uses of space will become
> profitable beyond Earth orbit. Maybe the time has come."
>
> Prof Jay Melosh from Purdue University said that the costs were just
> too high, calling space exploration "a sport that only wealthy
> nations, and those wishing to demonstrate their technical prowess, can
> afford to indulge."
>
> Eric Anderson, who co-founded the space tourism firm Space Adventures,
> said he was used to sceptics.
>
> "Before we started launching people into space as private citizens,
> people thought that was a pie-in-the-sky idea," He said.
>
> "We're in this for decades. But it's not a charity. And we'll make
> money from the beginning."
Paul Schlyter
Apr 28, 2012, 2:44:52 PM4/28/12
to
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 07:12:55 -0700 (PDT), wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> You have not really defined "rightie" or "rabid rightie" and nothing
> that you write about this can make any sense until you do.
Likewise, you never defined "rabid leftie"....
> You have not really defined "rightie" or "rabid rightie" and nothing
> that you write about this can make any sense until you do.
> Slavery is not something that any true conservative would condone.
referred to their religion to justify their actions.
Paul Schlyter
Apr 28, 2012, 2:49:19 PM4/28/12
to
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 07:29:51 -0700 (PDT), wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > But you've made your point clear: you prefer to lock yourself up
in a
> > gated community, and pay large amounts for prisons, etc.
> Did I ever say that? No.
You didn't say so, but it follows from your opinions: no wealth
> > But you've made your point clear: you prefer to lock yourself up
in a
> > gated community, and pay large amounts for prisons, etc.
> Did I ever say that? No.
redistribution gives more uneven distribution of wealth, which
triggers more crime, which means more prisons must be built, and the
wealthy feels a need to protect themselves, which yields gated
communities.
Martin Brown
Apr 29, 2012, 4:45:30 AM4/29/12
to
On 27/04/2012 11:12, wsne...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Apr 27, 3:47 am, Martin Brown<|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
> wrote:
>> On 26/04/2012 18:40, Bert wrote:
>>
>>> Innews:jnbcsv$v23$1...@dont-email.me"Al"<al-nos...@agora.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
>>>> free insulation and free boiler installation.
>>
>>> By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
>>> pay for your goodies.
>>
>> He lives in the UK. Almost no-one has a gun here and certainly not the
>> tax authorities.
>
> If you don't pay your taxes, eventually the authorities will show up
> demanding their cut, with guns if necessary.
No. Not even then. But *guns* are always the first thing that springs
> On Apr 27, 3:47 am, Martin Brown<|||newspam...@nezumi.demon.co.uk>
> wrote:
>> On 26/04/2012 18:40, Bert wrote:
>>
>>> Innews:jnbcsv$v23$1...@dont-email.me"Al"<al-nos...@agora.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> And being classed as a 'low income' household means I am entitled to
>>>> free insulation and free boiler installation.
>>
>>> By "free" you mean that men with guns took money from other people to
>>> pay for your goodies.
>>
>> He lives in the UK. Almost no-one has a gun here and certainly not the
>> tax authorities.
>
> If you don't pay your taxes, eventually the authorities will show up
> demanding their cut, with guns if necessary.
into the mind of the paranoid US right whinger for any minor dispute.
>
>> Only specialist firearms police carry guns in the UK.
>> That is why the murder rate is an order of magnitude lower here.
>
> The US is diverse, with many cultures and sub-cultures, whereas the UK
> is perhaps an order of magnitude less so.
UK is also diverse but also an order of magnitude less violent. There is
>> Only specialist firearms police carry guns in the UK.
>> That is why the murder rate is an order of magnitude lower here.
>
> The US is diverse, with many cultures and sub-cultures, whereas the UK
> is perhaps an order of magnitude less so.
a very strong correlation between income inequality and violence in
society. This should not be much of a surprise. The hyper rich have
essentially opted out and now live in guarded mansions and the next tier
down in gated communities protected by more goons with guns.
Thatcher summed up America very well in her famous phrase after one
visit "No such thing as society" and set about wrecking the UK. The
present Tory Prime minister David Cameron is forever banging on about
"The Big Society" which is essentially a crude attempt to undo some of
the damage she inflicted (but mostly about firing librarians and
tricking well meaning do-gooders into doing their jobs for no pay).
>
>> The idea is that where insulation is concerned it makes sense to help
>> poor and vulnerable housebound individuals to insulate their homes. This
>> is obviously an alien concept to right wing Americans.
>
> A concept that is alien to many or apparently most UKians is that
> people should pay for what they use, poor or not.
Most people in the UK can see that it is reasonable to help those less
>> The idea is that where insulation is concerned it makes sense to help
>> poor and vulnerable housebound individuals to insulate their homes. This
>> is obviously an alien concept to right wing Americans.
>
> A concept that is alien to many or apparently most UKians is that
> people should pay for what they use, poor or not.
fortunate than themselves. An American right whinger however just sees
them as an opportunity ripe for exploitation by loan sharks.
We now have unregulated payday loan shark operations advertised on TV in
the UK - one was quoting an APR of 1250%. Another great American
invention to make sure the innumerate poor stay *very* poor forever.
>
>> It also makes good sense to treat people with tuberculosis correctly
>> irrespective of whether or not they can *afford* the treatment.
>
> Tuberculosis being somewhat contagious.
Indeed and US medical policy being incredibly myopic. Pay up or else!
>> It also makes good sense to treat people with tuberculosis correctly
>> irrespective of whether or not they can *afford* the treatment.
>
> Tuberculosis being somewhat contagious.
>
>> US is
>> particularly bad in this respect and we may end up back in the dark ages
>> where getting multiple drug resistant TB is a death sentence.
>
> Bad example, since others have a self-interest in the presence of
> infected people.
US citizens and Republicans in particular don't seem to understand
>> US is
>> particularly bad in this respect and we may end up back in the dark ages
>> where getting multiple drug resistant TB is a death sentence.
>
> Bad example, since others have a self-interest in the presence of
> infected people.
"enlightened self interest" probably because they are far too selfish to
give anyone else a second thought. MDR TB is growing rapidly in major US
cities and efforts to eradicate it are at best half hearted.
>
>> US view is that the poor are just another resource to be exploited and
>> ripped off by loan sharks and other unscrupulous parasites.
>
> Yet the "poor" in the US have cars, air conditioning, microwaves,
> cable, cell phones,....
Some of them don't. You don't have to look far to find the likes of
>> US view is that the poor are just another resource to be exploited and
>> ripped off by loan sharks and other unscrupulous parasites.
>
> Yet the "poor" in the US have cars, air conditioning, microwaves,
> cable, cell phones,....
people like Robert Burnham on the streets of any US city. He just
happened to be famous enough for his death eventually to be noticed.
Basic cell phones these days are so incredibly cheap that even in the
third world they are becoming commonplace. Much less infrastructure
needed to support them than for wired telephony.
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
Bert
Apr 29, 2012, 10:45:36 AM4/29/12
to
In news:Fc7nr.18148$8_6....@newsfe09.iad Martin Brown
government involvment in any dispute.
Are you saying that if you don't pay your taxes, nobody will eventually
show up at your door to haul you away to prison? Isn't there always the
threat of force when dealing with the government?
--
be...@iphouse.com St. Paul, MN
<|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> But *guns* are always the first thing that springs
> into the mind of the paranoid US right whinger for any minor dispute.
Actually, guns are the first thing that comes to my mind when I think of
> But *guns* are always the first thing that springs
> into the mind of the paranoid US right whinger for any minor dispute.
government involvment in any dispute.
Are you saying that if you don't pay your taxes, nobody will eventually
show up at your door to haul you away to prison? Isn't there always the
threat of force when dealing with the government?
--
be...@iphouse.com St. Paul, MN
Robert Miles
Apr 29, 2012, 3:17:52 PM4/29/12
to
On 4/24/2012 7:10 AM, RichA wrote:
> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> BBC:
>
> 24 April 2012 Last updated at 07:30 ET
[snip]
> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>
> BBC:
>
> 24 April 2012 Last updated at 07:30 ET
> Water from asteroids could be broken down in space to liquid oxygen
> and liquid hydrogen for rocket fuel. Water is very expensive to get
> off the ground so the plan is to take it from an asteroid to a spot in
> space where it can be converted into fuel.
A spot in space with what source of energy to power the breakdown?
> and liquid hydrogen for rocket fuel. Water is very expensive to get
> off the ground so the plan is to take it from an asteroid to a spot in
> space where it can be converted into fuel.
Robert Miles
Apr 29, 2012, 3:22:19 PM4/29/12
to
On 4/24/2012 7:38 AM, RichA wrote:
> On Apr 24, 8:27 am, moviePig<pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>> the box...
>
> Mining asteroids!!! Why not go to Europa (Jupiter moon) to find water
> to help irrigate some desert?
Why not, AFTER you find a source of energy for going to Europa and
bringing it back that is cheaper than extracting it from the ocean
instead?
> On Apr 24, 8:27 am, moviePig<pwall...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>> On Apr 24, 8:10 am, RichA<rander3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>
>> Yeah, Cameron'll never be a success until he learns to think inside
>>
>>
>>
>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>
>> the box...
>
> Mining asteroids!!! Why not go to Europa (Jupiter moon) to find water
> to help irrigate some desert?
Why not, AFTER you find a source of energy for going to Europa and
bringing it back that is cheaper than extracting it from the ocean
instead?
Robert Miles
Apr 29, 2012, 3:29:41 PM4/29/12
to
On 4/24/2012 11:30 AM, Obveeus wrote:
> "moviePig"<pwal...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>> On Apr 24, 11:35 am, "Obveeus"<Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
>>> Texas had one of those a couple days ago, too. I don't see how they are
>>> relevant to any decent mining operation, though. Why would you waste
>>> effort
>>> bringing back something the size of a minivan when you really need to
>>> bring
>>> back something at least a couple of miles in diameter to get any
>>> significant
>>> mining profit.
>>
>> I'm resisting the temptation to google "most valuable substance by
>> weight"...
>
> The answer is: 'love'.
>
> In terms of metals, though, are their asteroids made of solid gold,
> platinum, magnessium, etc...?
Solid magnesium should be good for producing an especially bright
fireball. Have you ever seen a magnesium strip burning?
> "moviePig"<pwal...@moviepig.com> wrote:
>> On Apr 24, 11:35 am, "Obveeus"<Obve...@aol.com> wrote:
>>> Texas had one of those a couple days ago, too. I don't see how they are
>>> relevant to any decent mining operation, though. Why would you waste
>>> effort
>>> bringing back something the size of a minivan when you really need to
>>> bring
>>> back something at least a couple of miles in diameter to get any
>>> significant
>>> mining profit.
>>
>> I'm resisting the temptation to google "most valuable substance by
>> weight"...
>
> The answer is: 'love'.
>
> In terms of metals, though, are their asteroids made of solid gold,
> platinum, magnessium, etc...?
Solid magnesium should be good for producing an especially bright
fireball. Have you ever seen a magnesium strip burning?
Robert Miles
Apr 29, 2012, 3:40:55 PM4/29/12
to
On 4/25/2012 12:16 AM, Dave Head wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rande...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
>>> off our national debt like that...
>>
>> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
>> prices will stay that high?
>
> Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
> and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
> value above that of metals like iron and aluminum. And, there will be
> a wide variety of metals that will come back, hopefully some
> rare-earths that can be used in solar collectors.
>
> We might not really pay off the national debt, but we'll have a wealth
> of raw materials to make some really useful stuff. Hey, I wonder how
> much lithium is in that asteroid? Lithium batteries could get
> cheaper...
Are you volunteering your home as the center of the site where such
an asteroid falls to Earth? With you trying to catch it to avoid
vaporizing it as it hits?
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:33:56 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rande...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Apr 24, 8:52 am, Dave Head<rally...@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 05:10:41 -0700 (PDT), RichA<rander3...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>>
>>> Green? What's green got to do with it? Harvest the metals from the
>>>
>>>> See what being a raving environmentalist does to your brain?
>>>
>>> asteroid Eros, and that's worth 20 trillion dollars. One could pay
>>> off our national debt like that...
>>
>> You think if someone hauls a multi-megaton lump of metal to Earth the
>> prices will stay that high?
>
> Naw, they'll fall, of course, but it doesn't change the fact that gold
> and platinum are extremely useful metals, and will have an intrinsic
> value above that of metals like iron and aluminum. And, there will be
> a wide variety of metals that will come back, hopefully some
> rare-earths that can be used in solar collectors.
>
> We might not really pay off the national debt, but we'll have a wealth
> of raw materials to make some really useful stuff. Hey, I wonder how
> much lithium is in that asteroid? Lithium batteries could get
> cheaper...
Are you volunteering your home as the center of the site where such
an asteroid falls to Earth? With you trying to catch it to avoid
vaporizing it as it hits?
Sjouke Burry
Apr 29, 2012, 4:02:19 PM4/29/12
to
Robert Miles <mil...@Usenet-News.net> wrote in news:4f9d93f2$0$11757
$882e...@usenet-news.net:
Sunlight? (You should ask difficult questions, this was too easy.)
$882e...@usenet-news.net:
Robert Miles
Apr 29, 2012, 4:28:11 PM4/29/12
to
On 4/26/2012 8:12 PM, Brad Guth wrote:
> He3 is actually good/better for just about everything, including party
> balloons.
>
> Earth has very little He3 as is, and we're running ourselves out of
> He4 within the next three decades or at least by 2050 it'll become
> practically nonexistent other than whatever thorium and uranium are
> capable of producing that’s being suggested as limited to as little as
> 3e6 kg/year (roughly 1% of our needs if 100% of that helium could even
> be captured, though I'd kind of doubt we could manage to capture .
> 0001%).
>
> In other words, He4 is literally on its way out, and the rate of
> natural replenishment isn’t going to be .0001% sufficient unless we
> can manage to artificially create helium.
[snip]
So you're assuming that fusion will never be developed enough to
become a new source of helium?
> He3 is actually good/better for just about everything, including party
> balloons.
>
> Earth has very little He3 as is, and we're running ourselves out of
> He4 within the next three decades or at least by 2050 it'll become
> practically nonexistent other than whatever thorium and uranium are
> capable of producing that’s being suggested as limited to as little as
> 3e6 kg/year (roughly 1% of our needs if 100% of that helium could even
> be captured, though I'd kind of doubt we could manage to capture .
> 0001%).
>
> In other words, He4 is literally on its way out, and the rate of
> natural replenishment isn’t going to be .0001% sufficient unless we
> can manage to artificially create helium.
[snip]
So you're assuming that fusion will never be developed enough to
become a new source of helium?
Brad Guth
Apr 29, 2012, 8:25:52 PM4/29/12
to
On Apr 29, 1:28 pm, Robert Miles <mile...@Usenet-News.net> wrote:
> On 4/26/2012 8:12 PM, Brad Guth wrote:> He3 is actually good/better for just about everything, including party
> > balloons.
>
> > Earth has very little He3 as is, and we're running ourselves out of
> > He4 within the next three decades or at least by 2050 it'll become
> > practically nonexistent other than whatever thorium and uranium are
> > capable of producing that’s being suggested as limited to as little as
> > 3e6 kg/year (roughly 1% of our needs if 100% of that helium could even
> > be captured, though I'd kind of doubt we could manage to capture
> > enough to provide .0001% of our needs).
> On 4/26/2012 8:12 PM, Brad Guth wrote:> He3 is actually good/better for just about everything, including party
> > balloons.
>
> > Earth has very little He3 as is, and we're running ourselves out of
> > He4 within the next three decades or at least by 2050 it'll become
> > practically nonexistent other than whatever thorium and uranium are
> > capable of producing that’s being suggested as limited to as little as
> > 3e6 kg/year (roughly 1% of our needs if 100% of that helium could even
> > be captured, though I'd kind of doubt we could manage to capture
>
> > In other words, He4 is literally on its way out, and the rate of
> > natural replenishment isn’t going to be .0001% sufficient unless we
> > can manage to artificially create helium.
>
> [snip]
>
> So you're assuming that fusion will never be developed enough to
> become a new source of helium?
Lets hope that our WMD wizards at our spendy NIF have sufficient time,
> > In other words, He4 is literally on its way out, and the rate of
> > natural replenishment isn’t going to be .0001% sufficient unless we
> > can manage to artificially create helium.
>
> [snip]
>
> So you're assuming that fusion will never be developed enough to
> become a new source of helium?
motivation and the necessary resources to give us fusion energy, other
than in the form of weapons. At least so far, it's not looking good.
Exactly how much fusion derived He4 are we going to get per TWhr of
generated electrical energy? (figuring 33% thermodynamic conversion
efficiency)
Martin Brown
Apr 30, 2012, 4:01:25 AM4/30/12
to
On 29/04/2012 15:45, Bert wrote:
> In news:Fc7nr.18148$8_6....@newsfe09.iad Martin Brown
> <|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> But *guns* are always the first thing that springs
>> into the mind of the paranoid US right whinger for any minor dispute.
>
> Actually, guns are the first thing that comes to my mind when I think of
> government involvment in any dispute.
Just goes to show how bitter and twisted you are.
> In news:Fc7nr.18148$8_6....@newsfe09.iad Martin Brown
> <|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> But *guns* are always the first thing that springs
>> into the mind of the paranoid US right whinger for any minor dispute.
>
> Actually, guns are the first thing that comes to my mind when I think of
> government involvment in any dispute.
The UK government is not involved with guns at all.
>
> Are you saying that if you don't pay your taxes, nobody will eventually
> show up at your door to haul you away to prison? Isn't there always the
> threat of force when dealing with the government?
They will eventually lock you up if you persistently refuse to pay your
> Are you saying that if you don't pay your taxes, nobody will eventually
> show up at your door to haul you away to prison? Isn't there always the
> threat of force when dealing with the government?
taxes but only after they have exhausted all other possible avenues. You
would really have to work hard at it.
Most of the people they prosecute were guilty as hell of tax evasion,
caught red handed and so don't get much sympathy.
The authorities don't always execute such cases efficiently or correctly
leading to bizarre rulings like today:
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/240796/Man-jailed-for-council-tax-evasion-may-win-50k-from-Euro-court-
It is in the Express so not entirely unbiased reporting.
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
Bert Hyman
Apr 30, 2012, 1:10:21 PM4/30/12
to
In news:iFrnr.16145$em4....@newsfe21.iad Martin Brown
Hey! That's funny!
--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN be...@iphouse.com
Hey! That's funny!
--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN be...@iphouse.com
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