Painting on Fabric Question
MHA...@news.delphi.com
primer that is clear and won't obscure the color of the fabric but will
also protect the fiber from the oil paint. Any suggestions?
TexMexTamale
>
>I want to paint with oils on stretched *fabric*, not canvas. I need a
>primer that is clear and won't obscure the color of the fabric but will
>also protect the fiber from the oil paint. Any suggestions?
You can buy clear acrylic in large quantities (gallons). It is the same
thing as used for so-called gesso primer, minus the white pigment
filler. Of course, the fabric will no longer have its original appearance,
having a glazed coating on it. Wetting or soaking the fabric before
applying the acrylic will allow it to flow more freely and bind with and
protect the fibers better.
--
****** TexMexTamale ******
*** Fiery going In. ***
** Flames coming out. **
*********************************
Ross Green
>
> I want to paint with oils on stretched *fabric*, not canvas. I need a
> primer that is clear and won't obscure the color of the fabric but will
> also protect the fiber from the oil paint. Any suggestions?
>
What type of fabric are you using? Most fabrics aren't permanent
anyway, so maybe you shouldn't worry about the long term.
But one possibility is to switch to alkyd paints, which (supposedly)
don't rot paper or fabric, and are somewhat similar to oils in their
characteristics.
Best would be to use acrylics if possible, because they can actually
help *preserve* a weak support.
Another idea (from Gottsegen: The Painter's Handbook) is to use a
light coating of clear acrylic medium to isolate the support. - But
then you'd be painting oil over acrylic, which is taboo in the opinion
of many.
Ever consider using watercolor on silk???
-Ross
TexMexTamale
> But
>then you'd be painting oil over acrylic, which is taboo in the opinion
>of many.
RRRong RRRoss!!!! You paint with oil over acrylic all the time if
you are using the gesso commonly sold for priming canvas in this
age of high tech. What is NOT acceptable is painting acrylic (a
water based paint) over oil based paints. MANY artists combine
oil and acrylic--being certain it is OIL OVER
ACRYLIC and not the reverse.
Now I must admit, that if you are a purist, you will be using the
old-fashioned and traditional rabbit-skin glue and white lead
combination for priming canvas--but try and find REAL white lead
pigmented oil paints sold in the USA.
Ross Green
>
>>Ross Green wrote:
>>But then you'd be painting oil over acrylic, which is taboo in the
>>opinion of many.
>RRRong RRRoss!!!!
Hi Tex - You really don't know very much about artists' materials,
do you! I'm beginning to think you're just trying to pick a fight with
me, since you keep following up my postings with your "manure for
the mind," as you called it. (more like BS)
>You paint with oil over acrylic all the time if you are using the gesso
>commonly sold for priming canvas in this age of high tech.
Everyone in the world knows that, including me. The *reason* why
it's technically sound is that acrylic gesso contains calcium carbonate
(etc.), which gives it enough absorbency to form a good bond with the
oil paint. (Maybe.)
>MANY artists combine oil and acrylic--being certain it is OIL
>OVER ACRYLIC and not the reverse.
Well sure, but MANY artists don't care very much about archivally
sound procedures... Anyway, I didn't SAY it was unsound, I said:
>>Another idea (from Gottsegen: The Painter's Handbook) is to use a
>>light coating of clear acrylic medium to isolate the support. - But
>>then you'd be painting oil over acrylic, which is taboo in the opinion
>>of many.
Maybe the "opinion of many" isn't MY opinion, right???
>Now I must admit, that if you are a purist, you will be using the
>old-fashioned and traditional rabbit-skin glue and white lead
>combination for priming canvas--but try and find REAL white lead
>pigmented oil paints sold in the USA.
There is absolutely NO PROBLEM finding REAL white lead primer
in the USA, if you get it through mail order.
-Ross
TexMex
>Hi Tex - You really don't know very much about artists' materials,
>do you! I'm beginning to think you're just trying to pick a fight with
>me
No, not really. I've only been painting since 1967 in every medium
available, but then you were probably still only a thought or glimmer
of same for someone then. I've forgotten more than I know, I'll admit.
As for picking a fight with you--I'm a little old silver-haired lady with
fragile bones, and although I may look a lot like our ex-gov Ann Richards,
I lack her fiestiness or good-ole-boyness.
--
********************* 1845 - 1995 ****************************
*** From Deep in the Heart of Texas where we're celebrating ***
*** 150 Years of Mexicanization. MexTexTamale ***
**************************************************************************
Ross Green
>In article <3s92qr$a...@park.uvsc.edu>, lib...@uvsc.edu says...
>>Hi Tex - You really don't know very much about artists' materials,
>>do you! I'm beginning to think you're just trying to pick a fight with
>>me [...]
>No, not really. I've only been painting since 1967 in every medium
>available, but then you were probably still only a thought or glimmer
>of same for someone then.
I'm only twelve.
>As for picking a fight with you--I'm a little old silver-haired lady with
fragile bones [...]
Oh no, not the little-old-lady routine! I know trouble when I see it!!!
-Ross
PS- Loved your comments (posted elsewhere) on basic reading
comprehension. Now if people would just curtail their use of argument
fallacies...
Wray Kephart
X Hi Tex - You really don't know very much about artists' materials,
X do you! I'm beginning to think you're just trying to pick a fight with
X me, since you keep following up my postings with your "manure for
X the mind," as you called it. (more like BS)
X >You paint with oil over acrylic all the time if you are using the gesso
X >commonly sold for priming canvas in this age of high tech.
Gesso is a plaster product; and isnt good for anything but walls in
this day and age; terrible product to use for underpaint.
X Everyone in the world knows that, including me. The *reason* why
X it's technically sound is that acrylic gesso contains calcium carbonate
X (etc.), which gives it enough absorbency to form a good bond with the
X oil paint. (Maybe.)
You have to recoat the gesso with a slick; some acrylic compound to
seal it otherwise youl run drip or whatever without being able to
correct it other than repainting in gesso.
X >MANY artists combine oil and acrylic--being certain it is OIL
X >OVER ACRYLIC and not the reverse.
X Well sure, but MANY artists don't care very much about archivally
X sound procedures... Anyway, I didn't SAY it was unsound, I said:
X >>Another idea (from Gottsegen: The Painter's Handbook) is to use a
X >>light coating of clear acrylic medium to isolate the support. - But
X >>then you'd be painting oil over acrylic, which is taboo in the opinion
X >>of many.
The best method is to use a plastic build compound to a <fixed immoveable>
substrate; acrylic lacquer with a build to it-commonly called a primer
surfacer, then seal it with another lacquer compound similar to a
finish coat but protects the ground from bleeding and chem reaction to
other oil or dirt or broken plate compounds.
Personally I wouldnt use cloth canvas or linen for any oil painting and
wouldnt use gesso or rabbit skin glue as a ground.
X There is absolutely NO PROBLEM finding REAL white lead primer
X in the USA, if you get it through mail order.
This is true; if youve failed getting around using it.
No medium is fail-safe but Ive found one adequite.
Kephart
Wray Kephart
X In article <3ruddl$m...@park.uvsc.edu>, lib...@uvsc.edu says...
X > But
X >then you'd be painting oil over acrylic, which is taboo in the opinion
X >of many.
X RRRong RRRoss!!!! You paint with oil over acrylic all the time if
X you are using the gesso commonly sold for priming canvas in this
X age of high tech. What is NOT acceptable is painting acrylic (a
X water based paint) over oil based paints. MANY artists combine
X oil and acrylic--being certain it is OIL OVER
X ACRYLIC and not the reverse.
X Now I must admit, that if you are a purist, you will be using the
X old-fashioned and traditional rabbit-skin glue and white lead
X combination for priming canvas--but try and find REAL white lead
X pigmented oil paints sold in the USA.
Used rabbit skin glue once; every day the canvas either wrang like a drum
or looked like wet laundry on a sagging line. What is truely not
acceptable is layering lacquer over an uncured enamel product. Acrylic
is a misnomer-acrylic compounds exist in both oil enamels, epoxies and
lacquers. You almost have to go to school <I did> to learn what will
react or not react fav/unfav chemically.
Oil resins, enamels and lacquers cure via H2O, epoxies cure
chemically, <need hardners>..Oil: resins: and lacquers cure at
different ratios re: H2O; you want the acrylic cure before using
oil over it. Lacquer flashes of first, oil mediums without using
a dryer can take up to 3 months. Dont over coat anything without
an assurity of everything having cured.
For chemical or further info email me at Kep...@crash.cts.com
Kephart
Mani Deli
Ke> X There is absolutely NO PROBLEM finding REAL white lead
primer
Ke> X in the USA, if you get it through mail order.
You can use whatever you want but Lead White is very toxic and
artists are constantly poisoning themselves. There are books in
the library about the toxicity of artists materials. Everyone
should look into them.
As a former chemist I can only say artists would do well to make
themselves aware of toxic materials. For example all cadmiums,
emerald green and many solvents are highly toxic. There are
reliable substitutes and these can be found by a little research.
Mani DeLi
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