New web page of Disney benchmarks
Patty Winter
devoted to benchmarks (also known as survey marks) at Disneyland
and Walt Disney World. The page is here:
http://www.wintertime.com/OH/GC/Disney/disneymarks.html
Many thanks to Nick, Jay, and Jimmy for the information and photos
they've provided. I welcome contributions from anyone else who has
benchmark info. (Or if you prefer to host your photos on your own
page, I'd like to know so I can add a link to it.)
For those of you who are looking for something new and different
to do next time you visit a Disney park, you could always take
up benchmark hunting!
Patty
p.s. There's one county survey mark I know of at WDW. It's near
Pop Century and is called RAT WORLD. ;-)
Djali
> to do next time you visit a Disney park, you could always take
> up benchmark hunting!
Dang it~ now I won't be able to resist looking for them!
ºoº ~Randé~ ºoº
Moving to WDW in 7 days!!!
Mmdelpi144
Why are they located where they are? Why are there more in some parks?
Thanks
Patty Winter
Djali <dj...@yahoo.com> wrote:
[I wrote:]
>> For those of you who are looking for something new and different
>> to do next time you visit a Disney park, you could always take
>> up benchmark hunting!
>
>Dang it~ now I won't be able to resist looking for them!
:-)
Be sure to let me know about any you find!
Patty
Patty Winter
Mmdelpi144 <mmdel...@aol.com> wrote:
>Ok, I'll ask on behalf of the dummies. What are the survey benchmarks for?
Surveying. The ones installed by public agencies help them determine
the exact latitude, longitude, and/or elevation of a particular point.
I presume that Disney uses them for the same reason.
>Why are they located where they are? Why are there more in some parks?
I don't know the answers to those questions. It could even be that
there are just as many in one park as another, but we just haven't
found them yet.
Patty
pennyring
> I'm pleased to announce the inaugural version of a new web page
> devoted to benchmarks (also known as survey marks) at Disneyland
> and Walt Disney World. The page is here:
>
> http://www.wintertime.com/OH/GC/Disney/disneymarks.html
Cool site! I'll pass it on to my Dad. He's been a Professional Land
Surveyor since... 1964 I believe. Because of that, I've taken many of
those same photos for him during my different trips to the Parks. :)
~Amber
Chat live with Disney fans at the #DisneylandResort
http://www.dumptv.com/disneychat/
Admiral Boom
66 survey markers at WDW. These markers are placed in the ground in
order to mark a spot that has been exactly located using a tool called
a 'transit'. The location of the markers relate to points on the legal
survey map of WDW.
The first three (certified) markers had to be located according to the
legal description of the WDW property - by latitude and longitude -
and then cross measured to markers outside the property (that were
placed earlier by the county surveyors). Once those markers were
placed, other markers could be added by measuring off the first three.
Why place them at all ? Two reasons. First to make it easier to find
the property limits and park, resort, and infrastructure locations
(without having to physically measure). Second to exactly match the
physical property with the maps used by new construction and
maintenance teams.
For example, when a water line needs repair and the line is beneath
World Drive, the crew that has to dig up the street would like to
close only one lane and hit the pipe on the first try. They look at
the map for the exact coordinates, related to existing markers,
measure those distances to the pipe location, and then they can dig in
confidence.
Another example: Someday, another monorail extension will be built.
The designers will measure and mark the locations of the pillars on a
detailed map and then order the spans, using very exacting lengths,
designed to hold the monorail trains while being as light-weight as
possible. When the construction crew goes out to build these pillars,
they have to place them to within one-tenth of an inch of the
specification. The only way to do this is to be able to measure exact
distances from a known point: the survey marker. By placing many
markers, the construction team has the ability to pick the closest
ones to work with (of course, with something as critical as this, only
certain 'certified' markers will do).
Side note: WDW survey markers sometimes shift location due to the
movement of the ground (a big issue in Florida). The certified markers
are moved (if necessary) every several years. Non-certified markers
are generally not moved because they generally shift along with the
entire park they are placed in and the importance of those markers is
their relationship to that park's buildings and that park's
infrastructure. If you are out there looking, there is one exception:
a pair of markers that are approximately 2 inches apart (one
certified, one park-related, showing how much the park has shifted
over the years).
-Boom
PS. I am not at liberty to list their locations because they are
considered 'backstage' (sounds silly but technically I can't even
photograph them).
mmdel...@aol.com (Mmdelpi144) wrote in message news:<20040309121203...@mb-m18.aol.com>...
Randy Berbaum
: infrastructure. If you are out there looking, there is one exception:
: a pair of markers that are approximately 2 inches apart (one
: certified, one park-related, showing how much the park has shifted
: over the years).
: -Boom
Is it permissable to mention in passing a general location for this double
marker (assuming it is in a public area of the property)? For example a
mention that someone may want to walk around the area in front of the
Imagination Pavillion. This would not be defining a specific location, or
encouraging someone to go where they are not allowed to go. IMHO Of
course, if you feel that this would be in conflict with directives, I will
understand. :) It will just turn this into a massive treasure hunt. :)
BTW. You mentiones 66 markers. Do you happen to know how many are in
Public areas (vs. backstage areas)? This number would allow Patty to know
how many markers she is shooting for on her site. :)
I guess I'll be adding one more device to my park touring equipment. My
handheld GPS. :)
Randy
==========
Randy Berbaum
Champaign, IL
Patty Winter
In article <9818260a.04030...@posting.google.com>,
Admiral Boom <admir...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>I've never heard of them being referred to as 'benchmarks'
I think maybe benchmark are a subset of survey marks used
for vertical (elevation) control, but informally, the two
terms seem to be used interchangeably. The markers section
of Geocaching.com is called "Benchmark Hunting," and I
haven't seen any of the professional surveyors who hang
out in the benchmark forum raise a fuss about the name.
I suspect that people prefer saying "benchmark" when
precision is not necessary because it's a shorter word
than "survey mark."
> but we have 66 survey markers at WDW.
>The first three (certified) markers had to be located according to the
>legal description of the WDW property - by latitude and longitude -
>and then cross measured to markers outside the property (that were
>placed earlier by the county surveyors). Once those markers were
>placed, other markers could be added by measuring off the first three.
I guess RAT WORLD can't be one of those, because it wasn't monumented
until 1989.
>Another example: Someday, another monorail extension will be built.
Cool!
>If you are out there looking, there is one exception:
>a pair of markers that are approximately 2 inches apart (one
>certified, one park-related, showing how much the park has shifted
>over the years).
Oooh, please tell us where that one is, if it's in a publicly
accessible site!
>PS. I am not at liberty to list their locations because they are
>considered 'backstage' (sounds silly but technically I can't even
>photograph them).
Wow, that's interesting. Just to piggyback on Randy's posting,
do you mean that you aren't even allowed to tell us about the
ones that are in the public areas of the resort?
Can you at least reveal whether there are any at areas other
than MK, Epcot, and MGM? E.g. Animal Kingdom, the hotels,
Downtown Disney, the water parks, etc. etc.? That would help
us all either redouble our efforts or avoid wasting time where
there's nothing to find!
Thanks for the information!
Patty
p.s. And Randy, I expect a full listing of your new GPS
waypoints after your next WDW visit. ;-)
Randy Berbaum
: Patty
: p.s. And Randy, I expect a full listing of your new GPS
: waypoints after your next WDW visit. ;-)
Remind me before and after my trip (in Dec for the RADP Holiday meet).
Since I can forget things in a matter of min, the time between now and
December gives me LOTS of chances to forget to acquire or send on
documentation of any marks I spot. :)
Why is it that I can remember trivia or long gone facts and figures, but
important things (like my shopping list or where I left my car keys) slip
away from me in moments. :) And don't tell me this is due to my age. I've
had this happen since I was a child. (I could remember word for word
conversations that I overheard, but couldn't remember my mother calling me
to dinner if I was reading a good book.) :)
Sandi Femino
<rber...@bluestem.prairienet.org> wrote:
> I guess I'll be adding one more device to my park touring equipment. My
> handheld GPS. :)
I know I'll be looking down more often when touring WDW in the future :)
--
Sandi
Sandi Femino
<rber...@bluestem.prairienet.org> wrote:
> but couldn't remember my mother calling me
> to dinner if I was reading a good book.) :)
Couldn't remember or didn't hear?
I was in another dimension and just didn't hear her when I was reading :)
--
Sandi
Randy Berbaum
: In article <c2m9n1$6gj$1...@wildfire.prairienet.org>, Randy Berbaum
: <rber...@bluestem.prairienet.org> wrote:
I had an automatic answering machine in me that would reply "OK, I'm
COMING". But this response tended to happen without a concious decision on
my part, and so I would go on reading without realizing that I had been
called and responded. :)
JRClarkJR
TDC Sir Mickey RşoşN,
Keeper of everything magical on a Disney Evening
WDW
'73 off; '80 F.W.; '82 Poly; '96 DxL; '98 Sports; '99 PO; '00 Music/Dolphin;
'01 W.L.; 02 AKL; 03 GF/Hard Rock
DL '86, '94, '97, '99, '01, '02
Admiral Boom
I looked up the list of markers on my trusty PC and it gave me the
list of the '66' with lat/long numbers. In order to answer your
question I will have to get out a map and do some hunting. I will let
you know what I find as soon as I can get to it (the number, not a
list of locations). If I remember correctly, my favorite place to read
maps is just outside the International Gateway (on my lunch break).
Remember, I am not professional surveyor so it's ok to try this at
home!
-Boom
Randy Berbaum <rber...@bluestem.prairienet.org> wrote in message news:<c2m5fh$4n2$2...@wildfire.prairienet.org>...
Admiral Boom
>
> In article <9818260a.04030...@posting.google.com>,
> Admiral Boom <admir...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
> >I've never heard of them being referred to as 'benchmarks'
>
> I think maybe benchmark are a subset of survey marks used
> for vertical (elevation) control, but informally, the two
> terms seem to be used interchangeably. The markers section
> of Geocaching.com is called "Benchmark Hunting," and I
> haven't seen any of the professional surveyors who hang
> out in the benchmark forum raise a fuss about the name.
> I suspect that people prefer saying "benchmark" when
> precision is not necessary because it's a shorter word
> than "survey mark."
Thanks. Since I am not extremely survey-savvy, I didn't know.
> >PS. I am not at liberty to list their locations because they are
> >considered 'backstage' (sounds silly but technically I can't even
> >photograph them).
>
> Wow, that's interesting. Just to piggyback on Randy's posting,
> do you mean that you aren't even allowed to tell us about the
> ones that are in the public areas of the resort?
In general, if it's not listed on the Cast Portal, I am not allowed to
publish it. I can't say that it would make a big difference in this
case but I'm one of those by-the-book people and that helps at review
and raise time!
> Can you at least reveal whether there are any at areas other
> than MK, Epcot, and MGM? E.g. Animal Kingdom, the hotels,
> Downtown Disney, the water parks, etc. etc.? That would help
> us all either redouble our efforts or avoid wasting time where
> there's nothing to find!
Oh sure, there's at least two markers in each of the parks (water
parks too). I am told that this is just good practice in anticipation
of major refurbs and new construction. I am sure that there are at
least three at DTD. I am not sure about the resorts. I'll see if I can
sort some of this out and drop more hints as soon as I can get a map.
>
> Thanks for the information!
>
>
> Patty
>
> p.s. And Randy, I expect a full listing of your new GPS
> waypoints after your next WDW visit. ;-)
-Boom
Dillon Pyron
My wife missed a flight out of Newark because she was reading. Almost
had to stay the night. They had one seat available on the last flight
out (two hours later).
Still haven't let her forget that.
>
>Randy
>
>==========
>Randy Berbaum
>Champaign, IL
--
dillon
Life is always short, but only you can make it sweet
Dillon Pyron
wrote:
>In general, if it's not listed on the Cast Portal, I am not allowed to
>publish it. I can't say that it would make a big difference in this
>case but I'm one of those by-the-book people and that helps at review
>and raise time!
>
Also helps in the Keep Your Job time.
Patty Winter
to the page already. Several people have contributed new photos,
including Nick, who ran over to Epcot and MGM yesterday I think
specifically to help me with missing location pictures. It sure
looks like it was a beautiful weekend at WDW.
The page is here:
http://www.wintertime.com/OH/GC/Disney/disneymarks.html
Anyone who has any more photos, coordinates, or even just
recollections of "I remember seeing one near..." please
send them along!
Patty