How do cartoonists draw?
Jeremy Nell
anyone has a personal relationship with Scott Adams, or Brant Parker,
or whomever. But of what you DO know, and have experienced; do most
famous cartoonists still draw on paper, using India inks etc? Or do
you think that they are migrating to - or have already migrated to
Wacom tablets and/or tablet PCs?
Mike Peters (Grimmy) seems to be digital, but I can't tell. And so on.
Thoughts?
Jeremy
HS WRand Om
Adams, at least, is drawing digitally (spurred on by problems drawing on
paper.) Borgman seems to still be drawing on paper.
hubcap
>> anyone has a personal relationship with Scott Adams, or Brant Parker,
>> or whomever. But of what you DO know, and have experienced; do most
>> famous cartoonists still draw on paper, using India inks etc? Or do
>> you think that they are migrating to - or have already migrated to
>> Wacom tablets and/or tablet PCs?
The first sentence above doesn't sound like me, but I can
say that I tried a wacom tablet for a while (not a cintiq) and hated
the disconnect.
I think my next PC will be a thinkpad tablet, and I'll give it a try
again, minus the disconnect. Nothing seems nearly as good as paper,
yet my relationship with paper is similar to Charlie Brown's
relationship with kites.
-Mike
Scott Nickel
Jeremy Nell wrote:
> How do some of the famous cartoonists draw?
I'm definitely not famous, but I draw TRIPLE TAKE (syndicated by King
Features) on Bristol board with Micron pens. I scan the art and add the
lettering digitally. I also color it in the computer. I couldn't get
the hang of a tablet -- but maybe that's because I was using a low-end
one.
As for other cartoonists, I have originals of BIG NATE, BIG TOP, TINA'S
GROOVE, TODD THE DINOSAUR, CLEAR BLUE WATER, and FRANKLIN FIBBS, and
they're all drawn on Bristol board (or some type of paper) and have
hand lettering. I know that THE MEANING OF LILA is drawn in the
computer and Darrin Bell does CANDORVILLE digitally. I've heard that
much of BLONDIE is produced digitally, too.
I'd be surprised if Mike Peters has gone this route. Anyone know for
sure?
Scott
HS WRand Om
>>> How do some of the famous cartoonists draw? I'm not assuming that
>>> anyone has a personal relationship with Scott Adams, or Brant Parker,
>>> or whomever. But of what you DO know, and have experienced; do most
>>> famous cartoonists still draw on paper, using India inks etc? Or do
>>> you think that they are migrating to - or have already migrated to
>>> Wacom tablets and/or tablet PCs?
>
> The first sentence above doesn't sound like me, but I can
> say that I tried a wacom tablet for a while (not a cintiq) and hated
> the disconnect.
How long did you try a tablet? It takes a few weeks to get really
comfortable with it. I've been using tablets for ... well, I got my
first tablet back in the late '80s but I've been using Wacom tablets
seriously for 10 years or more. And I'm still not totally comfortable
drawing everything on the computer but it has become almost as easy as
using paper. I think the accuracy of the tablets and capability of the
software make it good enough to do all work digitally. And I think a
Cintiq would just put me over the edge.
Andrew Ryan Chang
The artists of Copper and Applegeeks wrote up their processes,
which are half-half:
http://www.boltcity.com/workshop/copper_tutorial/
http://www.applegeeks.com/blog_archive/view.php?id=1344 (step 5, has links
to previous steps)
Also, it's been bugging me for a month now that I've misplaced my
"Daisy Kutter" book; I remember his process was explained for DK in there
too.
--
For certain purposes it's not too misleading to call our system democracy
or capitalism or -- better still -- industrialism, but its real names are
factory fascism and office oligarchy. Anybody who says these people are
"free" is lying or stupid. -- "THE ABOLITION OF WORK" by Bob Black
JGM
Andrew Ryan Chang wrote:
> The artists of Copper and Applegeeks wrote up their processes,
> which are half-half:
>
> http://www.boltcity.com/workshop/copper_tutorial/
>
> http://www.applegeeks.com/blog_archive/view.php?id=1344 (step 5, has links
> to previous steps)
That's very nice, thanks.
The Wildly Foxtrot treasury has a similar walk-through of Bill Amend's
process as an introduction section; You can actually view most of it
in the Amazon preview tool, in glorious low-res:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0836204166/ . . .
JGM
hubcap
>As for other cartoonists, I have originals of BIG NATE, BIG TOP, TINA'S
>GROOVE, TODD THE DINOSAUR, CLEAR BLUE WATER, and FRANKLIN FIBBS, and
>they're all drawn on Bristol board (or some type of paper) and have
>hand lettering.
Hmmm... Bristol Board, eh? As a non-famous cartoonist myself, I've
mostly worked with stuff like (there's a couple in my office now) the
"Morilla Beverly 606s sketch book" or "Strathmore Drawing paper (400 series)"
or "Grumbacher all-purpose".
The following, which at first appears to merely be an ad, has a
faq section at the end that's pretty cool. The stiffness of Bristol
Board might improve my relationship with paper given that
the other paper I use, no matter how tightly I tape it to
the drawing surface, moves too much when inking fine stuff like
lettering or small details.
http://www.dickblick.com/categories/artboards/
-Mike
hubcap
>How long did you try a tablet?
I asked the little man at the big box store how long I had to return it.
He said 30 days. I installed it that day and kept it on for
several weeks and fooled around with it numerous times. I guess
I'm just too set in my ways to look at the screen while drawing
somewhere else.
>And I think a Cintiq would just put me over the edge.
Or (I'm assuming it's going to be "the same thing" + a general purpose
computer) a good tablet.
-Mike
Brian Huntley
Jeremy Nell wrote:
> How do some of the famous cartoonists draw? I'm not assuming that
> anyone has a personal relationship with Scott Adams, or Brant Parker,
> or whomever. But of what you DO know, and have experienced; do most
> famous cartoonists still draw on paper, using India inks etc? Or do
> you think that they are migrating to - or have already migrated to
> Wacom tablets and/or tablet PCs?
I happen to have an original Frazz right here. It appears to be India
ink over pencil on art-paper (about 80 weight). Jef's lettering looks
like it was done with a very fine tech pen, while the strip's lettering
(done by Jef's wife, Patty), appears to be done in felt-tip.
The daily strip is drawn to a 10" x 3.25" size.
Ted Slampyak
I sketch out the layout for the strips on sketch paper, then do up the
panel borders and word balloons digitally in a desktop publishing
program. (Used to be Quark XPress, but I've recently switched to Adobe
InDesign.) I digitized my own hand lettering years ago -- the best 100
hours or so of investment I ever made -- and use that in the vector word
balloons.
Then I send the files with the panel borders, lettering and sound
effects to a local instant printer/copier place, and have the pages
output on 11x17 smooth card stock. I then draw directly on the board,
around the lettering balloons. I use micron pens for backgrounds and
small figures, and brush and ink for the main foregrounds. (The current
Annie storyline, where I recreate Harold Gray's original style, was
drawn entirely with Microns.)
Then I scan the artwork, back into the computer, and clean up the files
(for the Annie dailies) or add color (to Jazz Age and the Annie Sundays.)
--
Ted Slampyak
http://www.JazzAgeComics.com
http://www.comicspage.com/annie/annie.html
Guy Gilchrist
with old fashioned Hunt pen nibs, series 7 Winsor Newton Red Sable
Brushes, and do my lettering with B6 pens from Speedball.
Very little has changed with my prep since the 1970s.
I only use the computer to color the work, or to digitally mechanically
compose the Night Lights sundays, after the artwork is done.
Guy Gilchrist
Nancy/Night Lights and Pillow Fights/Your Angels Speak
Jeremy Nell
"real" stuff. It is definitely more economical to replicate
everything, digitally. I know that it loses a fair amount of feel
...but that's only picked up by people in the know - like other
artists. The mainstream market - who pays my salary - doesn't even
notice the difference.
I think.
Jeremy
Ted Kerin
"Jeremy Nell" <jer...@urbantrash.co.za> wrote in message
news:1143023150.5...@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> Mike Peters (Grimmy) seems to be digital, but I can't tell. And so on.
>
I have an original Grimmy strip from not-that-many years ago, and it's ink
on Bristol board. I assume he gets those heavy lines with a brush, not a
pen.
Beefies
> "real" stuff. It is definitely more economical to replicate
> everything, digitally. I know that it loses a fair amount of feel
> ...but that's only picked up by people in the know - like other
> artists. The mainstream market - who pays my salary - doesn't even
> notice the difference.
>
I think I either disagree with or don't understand your point. A computer
with a Wacom tablet and (unpirated) Photoshop would run you a few thousand
dollars. Granted that if you already have a computer and a "borrowed" copy
of Photoshop then your cost to get started is much lower.
But I can't imagine many professions less expensive to enter than
cartooning. I'm looking through my supplies now:
Pad of bristol board: $10.
One or two brushes: $5 to $20 depending on quality.
Pen holder and a couple of nibs: $10.
Bottle of ink and tube of white-out: $5.
Eraser, ruler, pencil, Exacto knife, various fol-de-rol: $10 to $20.
I could set you up with everything you need to produce a
professional-quality comic strip for $50. Maybe $100 if you go nuts and get
the good stuff. Of course, I also know of professional cartoonists who work
with little more than typing paper and a couple different sizes of Pentel
markers. In that case, the barrier to entry comes down to about $10.
Personally, while I understand and respect the aesthetic of artists who do
good work digitally (Darrin Bell, for example), nothing takes the place of
ink on paper for me. I just find it a lot more interesting and fun than
sitting at a computer, and if cartooning isn't interesting and fun then why
bother?
Brian
momscancer.com
Jeremy Nell
a LCD (some Acer Ferrari effort). I enjoy drawing digitally; and I
enjoy using (and creating brishing) brushes in Photoshop.
I'm not trying to sell drawing digitally. I'm just saying that it's
been a helluva lot more afforable in the long run, since I haven't
needed to buy material. And I KNOW that it's lost a fair amount of
feeling ...but it still looks pretty cool. I'm happy, and I enjoy it.
I hate cutting and mounting etc. I just want to draw, and get results.
Ha ha.
But Scott Adams' work is clearly digital. I wonder if Garfield is
too...
Beefies
> been a helluva lot more afforable in the long run, since I haven't
> needed to buy material. And I KNOW that it's lost a fair amount of
> feeling ...but it still looks pretty cool. I'm happy, and I enjoy it.
> I hate cutting and mounting etc. I just want to draw, and get results.
I'm glad you enjoy drawing digitally and don't intend to reignite a tired
old "digital vs. paper" argument. Whatever works for you is fine with me.
I just don't see any *economic* argument in support of digital, even in the
long run. For the cost of your PC, Intuos, and Photoshop (which will all be
obsolete in a few years), a cartoonist could buy a 50-year supply of paper,
pens and ink. Of course, like I said, if you've *already got* the digital
hardware and software then your ongoing costs approach zero, whereas the
traditional artist has to keep schlepping back to the store for their $2
nibs. I maintain that over a career, a digital artist will put out a lot
more bucks than a traditional one.
Brian
momscancer.com
Mark Jackson
> But Scott Adams' work is clearly digital
What is "clearly digital?" Before you answer, consider this from the
FAQ:
Q. What are some tips on equipment, software, and techniques for drawing
or editing comics on my computer?
A. For drawing, several posters recommend the Wacom Graphire tablet. It
comes bundled with software (Painter Classic and Photoshop LE) that
takes advantage of signals from the tablet about the pressure you
place on the pen, the angle you hold it, etc. This goes a long
way toward making it more like drawing with a real pen or pencil.
Brooke McEldowney has been using one since the mid-1990s and his
Pibgorn and 9 Chickweed Lane demonstrate that the results can be
impressive - at least if you have gobs of talent and work at it
for a decade.
--
Mark Jackson - http://www.alumni.caltech.edu/~mjackson
Archimedes constructing his circle pays with his life
for his defective biological adaptation to immediate
circumstances. - Ernst Mach
Mark Jackson
> > My problem is that, as a struggling artist, I can't afford all this
> > "real" stuff. It is definitely more economical to replicate
> > everything, digitally. I know that it loses a fair amount of feel
> > ...but that's only picked up by people in the know - like other
> > artists. The mainstream market - who pays my salary - doesn't even
> > notice the difference.
> >
>
> I think I either disagree with or don't understand your point. A computer
> with a Wacom tablet and (unpirated) Photoshop would run you a few thousand
> dollars. Granted that if you already have a computer and a "borrowed" copy
> of Photoshop then your cost to get started is much lower.
Reminder: GIMP (http://www.gimp.org/), which AIUI some actually prefer
to full-blown Photoshop, is free.
Richard Kaszeta
> > How do some of the famous cartoonists draw? I'm not assuming that
> > anyone has a personal relationship with Scott Adams, or Brant Parker,
> > or whomever. But of what you DO know, and have experienced; do most
> > famous cartoonists still draw on paper, using India inks etc? Or do
> > you think that they are migrating to - or have already migrated to
> > Wacom tablets and/or tablet PCs?
> > Mike Peters (Grimmy) seems to be digital, but I can't tell. And so
> > on.
>
> on paper.) Borgman seems to still be drawing on paper.
Let me ask my friends over at the Center for Cartoon Studies
(http://www.cartoonstudies.org/), but from what I've observed on
visits over there and talking with some of their faculty and students,
a rather large fraction of artists still do at least sketching on
paper. After that it varies. Some ink then scan. Some just scan and
do everything else digitally. And some, like Adams, are all digital.
There's still definitely a lot of work being done on paper, though.
Especially with the students, I just saw an exhibit in White River
Junction (where the CCS is) called "Pencils to Print: Comics Process
and artwork by the inaugural class of The Center for Cartoon Studies."
Pretty interesting, especially for someone like me that doesn't know
much about the technical details of cartooning.
Ted Kerin
"Mark Jackson" <mjac...@alumni.caltech.edu> wrote in message
news:e01in7$ecp$1...@news.wrc.xerox.com...
> "Jeremy Nell" <jer...@urbantrash.co.za> writes:
>
> > But Scott Adams' work is clearly digital
>
> What is "clearly digital?" Before you answer, consider this from the
> FAQ:
>
> Q. What are some tips on equipment, software, and techniques for drawing
> or editing comics on my computer?
> Brooke McEldowney has been using one since the mid-1990s and his
> Pibgorn and 9 Chickweed Lane demonstrate that the results can be
> impressive - at least if you have gobs of talent and work at it
> for a decade.
>
I don't remember whether Brooke was specific about the Graphire, although I
take your word for it. The distinction I wanted to bring out, is that Wacom
makes two kinds of tablets:
Wacom's long-established line of tablets, including the Graphire, Intuos,
etc, work by letting you input lines by "drawing" them invisibly on a blank
tablet, while seeing the results on your monitor. It works, but, as a tool
for creating original art, it requires extraordinary subtlety of hand-eye
coordination, since you are not looking at your pen or your hand while you
draw.
Someone here mentioned, but did not explain, the Cintique. This completely
different kind of Wacom tablet lets you draw directly on (in effect) a flat
monitor, so that you see the lines as they appear directly beneath your
pen-point -- much more like the experience of drawing on paper.
Unfortunately, these tablets are quite expensive, but they might be the best
choice for those who want to go digital, but can't get comportable drawing
while NOT looking at their hand. I believe a similar effect can be achieved
with a Windows Tablet PC, although it lack's the Cintinque's finer
resolution. I've never had the chance to try either a Cintique or a Tablet
PC, and I don't expect to unless the Cintique gets a lot cheaper. But I
thought the discussion might benefit from this distinction about the
different kinds of tablets.
Ted Kerin
"Ted Kerin" <tf.k...@gte.net> wrote in message
news:48j9g3F...@individual.net...
>
>
> Someone here mentioned, but did not explain, the Cintique. This completely
> different kind of Wacom tablet lets you draw directly on (in effect) a
flat
> monitor, so that you see the lines as they appear directly beneath your
> pen-point -- much more like the experience of drawing on paper.
>
Sorry, I've been mis-spelling Cintiq.
http://www.wacom.com/lcdtablets/index.cfm
Jeremy Nell
you happy.
Scott Nickel
> But Scott Adams' work is clearly digital. I wonder if Garfield is
> too...
GARFIELD is produced 100% by hand, the "old school" way (in more ways
than one): 3-ply Strathmore Bristol board; non-photo blue pencils;
Series 7 Windsor Newton sable brushes with India ink; hand-lettering
with a Radiograph. No photocopying or PhotoShopping. It is colored
digitally, however.
Scott
Jeremy Nell
while I do enjoy the traditional comics; I also quite enjoy the
new-school digital way of drawing. Kind of like Dexter's Lab in panel
form.