Full Metal Alchemist has it backwards...
Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality
made entirely out of metal, instead of Elric, who simply has a cybernetic
arm and leg?
Fish Eye no Miko
You need to (re-watch) the early eps of the series. The title is
explained. It's an *intentional* joke.
Also, the other brother's name is Ed, Elric is their last name.
Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
Right now you are reading my .sig quote.
Chris Mattern
Elric and Alphonse Elric) "stage name" as a State Alchemist (like
Roy Mustang is the Flame Alchemist). Al can't have such a name because
Al never became a State Alchemist.
--
Christopher Mattern
"Which one you figure tracked us?"
"The ugly one, sir."
"...Could you be more specific?"
The Eternal Lost Lurker
"Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality" <ihat...@rogers.com> wrote
in message news:m6FYg.50877$p86....@fe05.news.easynews.com...
It's called irony, bitch, look it up.
--
This is a test of the Emergency Ass Dance System.
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The Eternal Lost Lurker
www.lurkerdrome.com
Ansgar -59cobalt- Wiechers
> "Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality" wrote:
>> Just a thought but shouldn't Al be the Full Metal Alchemist,
>> since he's made entirely out of metal, instead of Elric, who simply
>> has a cybernetic arm and leg?
>
> It's called irony, bitch, look it up.
That coming from someone who wouldn't recognise irony if it hit him with
a sledgehammer ...
cu
59cobalt
--
"My surname is Li and my personal name is Kao, and there is a slight
flaw in my character."
--Li Kao (Barry Hughart: Bridge of Birds)
sanjian
Way to bring up a joke that was made in the first episode and claim it as
yours.
Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality
"sanjian" <san...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
news:eh1au...@news4.newsguy.com...
A reference was made to this in the first episode? Was it in the
manga, too? If so, what page?
I never got into the anime (and, thus, don't have any episodes) but I'm
currently giving the manga a try...
sanjian
> "sanjian" <san...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
> news:eh1au...@news4.newsguy.com...
>> Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality wrote:
>>> Just a thought but shouldn't Al be the Full Metal Alchemist,
>>> since he's made entirely out of metal, instead of Elric, who simply
>>> has a cybernetic arm and leg?
>>
>> Way to bring up a joke that was made in the first episode and claim
>> it as yours.
>
> A reference was made to this in the first episode? Was it in the
> manga, too? If so, what page?
> I never got into the anime (and, thus, don't have any episodes)
> but I'm currently giving the manga a try...
rec.arts.ANIME.misc
We, as connisuers, give defference to the manga when they are the original
works. However, this is an ANIME discussion group and ANIME is assumed to
be the default for many series (though there are exception, such as Ranma
1/2), especially when they diverge like Utena, Escaflowne, and FMA.
Sea Wasp
> "sanjian" <san...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
> news:eh1au...@news4.newsguy.com...
>
>>Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality wrote:
>>
>>> Just a thought but shouldn't Al be the Full Metal Alchemist, since
>>>he's made entirely out of metal, instead of Elric, who simply has a
>>>cybernetic arm and leg?
>>
>>Way to bring up a joke that was made in the first episode and claim it as
>>yours.
>
>
> A reference was made to this in the first episode?
Yep. All the people in the town square gather around Al, thinking
he's the Full Metal Alchemist.
--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Live Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/seawasp/
elsie
times over the course of the series.
>
laurie
The Eternal Lost Lurker
"Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality" <ihat...@rogers.com> wrote
in message news:Sh%Yg.65152$0s1....@fe03.news.easynews.com...
as
> > yours.
>
> A reference was made to this in the first episode?
A reference is made to this in about TEN EPISODES IN THE SERIES. It's a
running gag.
Phil Yff
Fullmetal/steel is used as a metaphor. One of the themes of FMA is that
appearances can be deceiving. So, the Al who is literally made of metal is
frequently mistaken as the Fullmetal Alchemist in place of Edward who
embodies the figurative qualities of steel.
There is a running play on words throughout FMA. The author (Arakawa
Hiromu), herself, gave the series its English title, “Fullmetal Alchemist.”
In Japanese, the title is Hagane no Renkinjutsushi (鋼の錬金術師 – The Steel
Master of Alchemy). The Japanese have adopted the term ‘full metal’as a
loanword – hurumetaru – with the meaning of obstinate, thick-headed,
unyielding, stubborn, etc.
Throughout the series you see both positive and negative aspects of
Edward’s steel qualities. In Father Cornello’s comments at the beginning
of episode 2, he refers to both the good and the bad concluding that it is
not surprising that Edward was given such a grim designation (ikatsui
shougou).
I only have the Japanese region 2 DVD so I don’t know how the dialog was
translated in the dub and sub tracks. It would be interesting to listen to
the dub while reading the subtitles to see if there is any difference in
the translation. It should be noted that the term that Father Cornello
uses in the Japanese is hagane (steel) and not fullmetal.
Mata ato de,
Phil Yff
なるほど、そうか。。。
なぜこんながきが「鋼」なんぞといういかつい称号を掲げているのか不思議でならなかったが。。。
Naru hodo, sou ka...
Naze konna gaki ga ‘hagane’ nanzo to iu ikatsui shougou wo kakagete iru no
ka hushigi de naranakaa ga…
I see, that’s the reason...
Why such a brat was bestowed with the grim designation of ‘steel’ or the
like turns out not to be strange at all.
Father Cornello - Fullmetal Alchemist, episode 2
Phil Yff
Morality wrote:
> A reference was made to this in the first episode? Was it in the
> manga, too? If so, what page?
> I never got into the anime (and, thus, don't have any episodes) but I'm
> currently giving the manga a try...
There are slight differences between the anime and the manga. In the manga
(Story 1), the town people have heard of the Elric brothers and assume that
Al is the Fullmetal Alchemist. In the anime (Episode 1), the town people
do not know much about alchemy and have not heard of the Elric brothers. A
cloaked and hooded Lust sitting at the bar tells the town people about the
famous alchemists, the Elric brothers, and mentions that Edward Elric is
the Fullmetal Alchemist. She knows who is who; however, the town people
assume that Al is the Fullmetal Alchemist because of his size and
intimidating appearance.
Phil Yff
>> A reference was made to this in the first episode?
>
> Yep. All the people in the town square gather around Al, thinking
> he's the Full Metal Alchemist.
In both the anime and the manga Al immediately says it is not him. The
town people turn to Ed in surprise. One person says in disbelief, "That
little one..."
At this point, Ed goes ballistic and beats up on the town people,
exaggerating the perceived insult, asking how dare they call him a soybean
so small he can't be noticed.
elsie
"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:12awqaznd9ooy.2wkeubpffspc$.dlg@40tude.net...
> On Mon, 16 Oct 2006 05:52:18 GMT, Just Another Victim of the Ambient
> Morality wrote:
>
>> Just a thought but shouldn't Al be the Full Metal Alchemist, since
>> he's
>> made entirely out of metal, instead of Elric, who simply has a cybernetic
>> arm and leg?
>
> Fullmetal/steel is used as a metaphor. One of the themes of FMA is that
> appearances can be deceiving. So, the Al who is literally made of metal
> is
> frequently mistaken as the Fullmetal Alchemist in place of Edward who
> embodies the figurative qualities of steel.
>
> There is a running play on words throughout FMA. The author (Arakawa
> Hiromu), herself, gave the series its English title, "Fullmetal
> Alchemist."
> Master of Alchemy). The Japanese have adopted the term 'full metal'as a
> unyielding, stubborn, etc.
>
> Throughout the series you see both positive and negative aspects of
> Edward's steel qualities. In Father Cornello's comments at the beginning
> of episode 2, he refers to both the good and the bad concluding that it is
> not surprising that Edward was given such a grim designation (ikatsui
> shougou).
>
> I only have the Japanese region 2 DVD so I don't know how the dialog was
> translated in the dub and sub tracks. It would be interesting to listen
> to
> the dub while reading the subtitles to see if there is any difference in
> the translation. It should be noted that the term that Father Cornello
> uses in the Japanese is hagane (steel) and not fullmetal.
>
> Mata ato de,
>
> Phil Yff
>
> ?????????????????????????????????????????????
>
> Naru hodo, sou ka...
> Naze konna gaki ga 'hagane' nanzo to iu ikatsui shougou wo kakagete iru no
>
> I see, that's the reason...
> Why such a brat was bestowed with the grim designation of 'steel' or the
> like turns out not to be strange at all.
>
> Father Cornello - Fullmetal Alchemist, episode 2
>
will, Iron Man triathlons.
In the dub, Cornello says: You were crazy enough to find out for yourself.
You are the full metal... THE FULLMETAL ALCHEMIST!
In the sub, he says: "So this is why you have the title 'Fullmetal' -- THE
FULLMETAL ALCHEMIST!"
laurie
Phil Yff
Very interesting. Just to be sure that we're talking about the same thing,
I was referring to Father Cornello's speech right at the beginning of
episode 2 (but after the theme song) and chapter 1 of the manga. The sub
translation you provide sounds just like his words at the end of episode 1
and that are repeated at the beginning of episode 2 before opening theme.
This is a very carefully crafted sequence in both the manga and the anime.
I'll refer to the anime, but the same could be said for the manga by
substituting the word 'story' or 'chapter' for 'episode.'
Episode 1 concludes with a startling revelation. Father can't believe the
chimera's claws and fangs had no effect on Edward. Edward throws off his
mantle to reveal his auto-mail arm. He tells Rosa to look closely and
explains that his form is that of a sinner who dared intrude on God's
territory by performing alchemy on people. Father Cornello chimes in about
human alchemy being the ultimate taboo. Rosa recalls Ed's earlier words
about flying too close to the sun and getting burned up. Father Cornello
concludes the episode by saying: "So this is why you have the title
'Fullmetal' -- FULLMETAL ALCHEMIST!" (Using the translation you gave).
What a brilliant way to finish the first episode that starts with eleven
and ten year old brothers abortive attempt at human resurrection. Rosa's
final comments reinforce the episode's title, "They Who Challenge the Sun."
The viewer learns about the 'Fullmetal Alchemist' as the Elric brothers and
Father Cornello compete to provide Rosa with their different perspectives.
Instead of boring narrative, we get exciting drama and character
interaction as we expand on our background knowledge.
Episode 2 picks up where episode 1 leaves off. It repeats Father
Cornello's closing comments in episode 1. After the theme song, he
continues speaking to Edward with his new-found understanding. "I see, now
I understand. No wonder even a brat like you was given the stern-sounding
'fullmetal' title." ( A more idiomatic translation than the literal one I
gave in my previous post but still accurate).
Father Cornello then turn to Rosa and explains the alchemy taboos - gold
transmutation and human alchemy. He tells her the two brothers bit off
more than they could chew without understanding the consequences. Al cuts
in to say they did understand the consequences but decided to take the risk
anyway just to see their mother smile one more time. Father Cornello
gleefully points out that the brothers failed. A somber Ed explains to
Rosa that human resurrection extols a heavy price. Father Cornello
pompously interjects that unlike the amateurish brothers, he will succeed
because he has the philosopher's stone. The conversation concludes with
Father Cornello and Ed explaining their differing views of the
philosopher's stone.
In less than two minutes of dialog, Arakawa Hiromu has outlined several
main themes of the series - artifice vs. nature, God vs. human,
equivalency, mother as a nurturing symbol, human limitations, and so on.
We get so many conflicting ideas against a background of conflict as Ed
accuses Cornello of being a third rate charlatan while he counters by
calling Ed an amateur. Each side tries to gain Rosa's acceptance while
discrediting the other side. Each word is significant and the spoken
dialog has a cadence that reinforces the sense of urgency and the
importance of the high stakes.
elsie
Here it is:
Dub Cornello: Well, that does answer a riddle, why the military would give a
pup like you such a stern name. Full metal -- but it's literal. (And then
the explanation to Rose)
Sub Cornello: I see. So that's it. It's no longer any wonder why a kid like
you should bear the stern-sounding title of "Fullmetal". (And then the
explanation)
> This is a very carefully crafted sequence in both the manga and the anime.
> I'll refer to the anime, but the same could be said for the manga by
> substituting the word 'story' or 'chapter' for 'episode.'
>
> Episode 1 concludes with a startling revelation. Father can't believe the
> chimera's claws and fangs had no effect on Edward. Edward throws off his
> mantle to reveal his auto-mail arm. He tells Rosa to look closely and
> explains that his form is that of a sinner who dared intrude on God's
> territory by performing alchemy on people. Father Cornello chimes in
> about
> human alchemy being the ultimate taboo. Rosa recalls Ed's earlier words
> about flying too close to the sun and getting burned up. Father Cornello
> concludes the episode by saying: "So this is why you have the title
> 'Fullmetal' -- FULLMETAL ALCHEMIST!" (Using the translation you gave).
>
> What a brilliant way to finish the first episode that starts with eleven
> and ten year old brothers abortive attempt at human resurrection. Rosa's
> final comments reinforce the episode's title, "They Who Challenge the
> Sun."
> The viewer learns about the 'Fullmetal Alchemist' as the Elric brothers
> and
> Father Cornello compete to provide Rosa with their different perspectives.
> Instead of boring narrative, we get exciting drama and character
> interaction as we expand on our background knowledge.
>
We also get the confrontation between scientific and religious world views.
The idea that they're trying to persuade Rose is significant. Here she is
the stand-in for the viewer, the ordinary person who represents the masses
to be influenced by science or religion. The battleground is the mind of the
believer.
> Mata ato de,
>
> Phil Yff
>
laurie
Phil Yff
Both translations are accurate but neither of them conveys the 'oomph' of
the original. I am not being condescending because I consider both the
literal and idiomatic translations I provided to fall equally short. That
is why translation is so difficult. A successful translation retains the
literary quality of the original in a completely natural and uncontrived
manner while also corresponding as accurately as possible to the original
language.
Arakawa Hiromu condenses a lot of meaning into few words and presents it
with a crisp, poetic cadence. She does it consistently - not just here but
throughout the series. I think one reason I did not enjoy the movie as
much as the TV series is that Arakawa was not involved in the screenplay,
script, or the story boards. Consequently, it was much less intense.
Phil Yff
>> In less than two minutes of dialog, Arakawa Hiromu has outlined several
>> main themes of the series - artifice vs. nature, God vs. human,
>> equivalency, mother as a nurturing symbol, human limitations, and so on.
>> We get so many conflicting ideas against a background of conflict as Ed
>> accuses Cornello of being a third rate charlatan while he counters by
>> calling Ed an amateur. Each side tries to gain Rosa's acceptance while
>> discrediting the other side. Each word is significant and the spoken
>> dialog has a cadence that reinforces the sense of urgency and the
>> importance of the high stakes.
>>
> The idea that they're trying to persuade Rose is significant. Here she is
> the stand-in for the viewer, the ordinary person who represents the masses
> to be influenced by science or religion. The battleground is the mind of the
> believer.
Sorry about the name. I went to Anime News Network to make sure I got
Father Cornello's name right (it's Kounero in the Japanese). Rose's name
is Ro-ze in the Japanese and I just assumed it would be Rosa in the
translation.
I certainly agree with you. As Rose attempts to come to terms with some
hard choices and some hard to digest information, the viewer is taken along
from the ride. Because the thematic material is so embedded in the drama,
it is presented in a way that is not didactic or pedantic.
Juan F. Lara
Phil Yff <Phil...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Sorry about the name. I went to Anime News Network to make sure I got
>Father Cornello's name right (it's Kounero in the Japanese).
I wish he had some other name. I keep saying "Father Cornholio" by
mistake. :-)
- Juan F. Lara
Eric Schwartz
> Arakawa Hiromu condenses a lot of meaning into few words and presents it
> with a crisp, poetic cadence. She does it consistently - not just here but
> throughout the series. I think one reason I did not enjoy the movie as
> much as the TV series is that Arakawa was not involved in the screenplay,
> script, or the story boards. Consequently, it was much less intense.
I don't think she had a lot to do with the anime either. In the
translated manga notes, she says she gave the anime guys a vague
outline of where she saw the story going, and they took it and ran
with it on their own. She doesn't give any indication she had any
involvement in screenplay, script, or storyboards beyond the initial
outline of the series. Do you have any info otherwise?
-=Eric
sanjian
> I don't think she had a lot to do with the anime either. In the
> translated manga notes, she says she gave the anime guys a vague
> outline of where she saw the story going, and they took it and ran
> with it on their own. She doesn't give any indication she had any
> involvement in screenplay, script, or storyboards beyond the initial
> outline of the series. Do you have any info otherwise?
This, and a discussion elsewhere on the group, leads to a question... What
series had the anime actually be as good, or possibly even better than the
manga? There are only two I can think of:
Cardcaptor Sakura
Fullmetal Alchemist (having not sampled the manga, this is by reputation
only)
Of course, the question implies that the manga was a predecessor or
concurrent with the anime.
Phil Yff
Revolutionary Girl Utena and Princess Tutu IMHO both surpass the manga.
Phil Yff
Yes. Much of the anime script is word for word verbatim from the manga.
Sea Wasp
>
> This, and a discussion elsewhere on the group, leads to a question... What
> series had the anime actually be as good, or possibly even better than the
> manga? There are only two I can think of:
>
> Cardcaptor Sakura
> Fullmetal Alchemist (having not sampled the manga, this is by reputation
> only)
The canonical example is probably Vision of Escaflowne, which had not
one but TWO manga incarnations as I recall, one shoujo and one shonen,
and the anime combined the best elements of both to produce something
overall superior to either.
Dragonball Z had moments where I feel it improved on the manga.
Mostly it was equal. The only point where I feel it really lost out
was in the Freezer sequence, where they padded to hellangone.
Ping Kuo
<san...@widomaker.com> wrote:
> This, and a discussion elsewhere on the group, leads to a question... What
> series had the anime actually be as good, or possibly even better than the
> manga? There are only two I can think of:
> Cardcaptor Sakura
> Fullmetal Alchemist (having not sampled the manga, this is by reputation
> only)
easy choices, Kimagure Orange Road, Initial D, and Akazukin ChaCha,
and just my opinion, since I am sure others would disagree w/ me on
those, Fruits Basket, Patlabor, Emma, Mushishi, School Rumble, and
Azumanga Daioh.
Ansgar -59cobalt- Wiechers
> In article <ehad7...@news3.newsguy.com>, sanjian wrote:
>> This, and a discussion elsewhere on the group, leads to a question...
>> What series had the anime actually be as good, or possibly even
>> better than the manga? There are only two I can think of:
>
>> Cardcaptor Sakura Fullmetal Alchemist (having not sampled the manga,
>> this is by reputation only)
>
> easy choices, Kimagure Orange Road, Initial D, and Akazukin ChaCha,
>
> and just my opinion, since I am sure others would disagree w/ me on
> those, Fruits Basket, Patlabor, Emma, Mushishi, School Rumble, and
> Azumanga Daioh.
I'd agree on Azumanga Daioh (I think many scenes work out way better
without being restricted to the 4-koma format), but disagree on Fruits
Basket. The latter is a rather good adaptation of the manga, but they
had to leave several scenes out, and it ends after volume 8 of the
manga, where the plot has only just begun to develop.
Astrobiochemist
While I do love the CCS anime, many friends of mine actually think the
manga is superior. The reasons they've given me is that the manga has
no padding and is just one great moment after another.
I think the anime is better because of how it explores ideas only
touched upon in the manga. However, I do think that it can get a bit
tiresome at times and become repetitive. (Another reason I've been
told that the manga is superior to the anime is that the characters are
the focus of the manga but the cardcapturing is the focus of the anime.
I don't know if I believe that but it is an explanation for the
repetitiveness of the anime)
A scene in CCS that is done much better in the manga is the card
capture in the cave. While the anime has this as a normal capture, the
manga reinforces the idea that Sakura is being protected throughout her
ordeal, much as she is during the normal events of the school trip.
However, the anime does have the ending done as a two hour movie, as
opposed to a 4 page scene in the manga, which allows for a grander
ending.
junior-kun
Phil Yff wrote:
>
> Revolutionary Girl Utena and Princess Tutu IMHO both surpass the manga.
>
Yeah, but the Utena manga isn't really the source, it was created in
parallel.
Fuu-chan
> While I do love the CCS anime, many friends of mine actually think the
> manga is superior. The reasons they've given me is that the manga has
> no padding and is just one great moment after another.
I would have to agree.
The anime is clearly more chilildish, lighter. The manga has a deeper
study of characters, and is rather more serious.
Fuu-chan.
--
(...) and I am both terrified and reassured to know that there are still
wonders in the Universe. That we have not yet explained everything.
(G'Kar in Mind War - Babylon 5)
Net home: http://fuu-no-road.2ya.com/ >--< Net babbling:
http://fuunoroad.blogspot.com/
Astrobiochemist
> > manga is superior. The reasons they've given me is that the manga has
> > no padding and is just one great moment after another.
>
> I would have to agree.
> The anime is clearly more chilildish, lighter. The manga has a deeper
> study of characters, and is rather more serious.
The anime is gorgeous and really brings the manga characters to life.
I also think Li is fleshed out more in the anime, with the addition of
Meiling for him to play off of. Rika does get shortchanged, in terms
of her plotline but Sakura's other friends get to play more of a role
and Tohya also is expanded upon (I love th eepisode which is from the
point of view of a girl who has a crush on Tohya).
Eric Schwartz
But did Arakawa write it for the anime, or did they just take it from
her manga? A good deal of J. R. R. Tolkien's dialogue made it into
the LoTR movies, but I wouldn't say he had any direct involvement in
the screenplay.
-=Eric
Eric Schwartz
> Eric Schwartz wrote:
> This, and a discussion elsewhere on the group, leads to a question... What
> series had the anime actually be as good, or possibly even better than the
> manga? There are only two I can think of:
>
> Cardcaptor Sakura
> Fullmetal Alchemist (having not sampled the manga, this is by reputation
> only)
I really like the FMA manga, but the English translations are way
behind the anime (given that the latter is done, and the manga's still
in production in Japan). It's too early yet to call the manga better
or worse than the anime.
-=Eric
bobbie sellers
I love KOR but I never got to see the manga only read the
tranlated manga script and I still like it better than the anime.
From the few frames of KOR manga I have seen the artist was
not good at portraying his characters in an attractive way
in line drawings but it must have been good otherwise we wouldn't
have the KOR anime. And the anime is good on its own otherwise
I wouldn't have bothered to get the manga scripts downloaded.
Having read the manga scripts sometimes I dream the scenes
from it performed by the anime characters.
It might be time for a KOR remake since it has been out for
around 20 years. Good stories deserve to be remade and updated.
later
bliss -- C O C O A Powered... (at california dot com)
--
bobbie sellers - a retired nurse in San Francisco
Ningen banji Human beings do
Samazama no Every single kind
Baka a suru Of stupid thing
--- 117th edition of Haifu Yanagidaru published in 1832
sanjian
Not knowing he had involvement is not the same as not having direct
involvement. It's kind of like the Natalie Cole/Nat King Cole version of
"Unforgettable." Nat never knew it would exist, but he had a very direct
involvement in it.
sanjian
I'm basing that on reports from those who read the japanese version.
Ping Kuo
sellers <bli...@SPAMcalifornia.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 13:04:44 GMT,Ping Kuo, wrote
> > easy choices, Kimagure Orange Road, Initial D, and Akazukin ChaCha,
> I love KOR but I never got to see the manga only read the
> tranlated manga script and I still like it better than the anime.
since you haven't read it, all I can say is, you have to trust me, of
all the titles I mentioned, this one is not even close to being
comparable to its anime counter part.
> It might be time for a KOR remake since it has been out for
> around 20 years. Good stories deserve to be remade and updated.
can the remake improve on the animation, art design, voices,
songs/music, and story?
they done that for mony once already, and that is KOR movie #2,
thankfully it is such a bomb they don't think about making another one.
Ping Kuo
<usene...@planetcobalt.net> wrote:
> Ping Kuo <removeantispam*pk...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > and just my opinion, since I am sure others would disagree w/ me on
> > those, Fruits Basket, Patlabor, Emma, Mushishi, School Rumble, and
> > Azumanga Daioh.
> I'd agree on Azumanga Daioh (I think many scenes work out way better
> without being restricted to the 4-koma format), but disagree on Fruits
> Basket. The latter is a rather good adaptation of the manga, but they
> had to leave several scenes out, and it ends after volume 8 of the
> manga, where the plot has only just begun to develop.
that is why personal opinion varied, I found the story in manga after
#8 sucks, and I also dislike the changes in art style/character design
that made each characters' face look like a slice of bread. the story
in anime is less "grand" in scope, not trying to be too much, (since
manga had no ending at that time.) so it "screw up" less, if you get
what I mean. the pacing in manga after #12 is also hellish, consider
the dragging going on in the storyline, thankfully it is ending next
month.
of course, anime also come w/ motions and mood setting music, and FB's
anime in that regard is very well done.
bobbie sellers
> In article <10519627747545....@News.Individual.NET>, bobbie
> sellers <bli...@SPAMcalifornia.com> wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 13:04:44 GMT,Ping Kuo, wrote
>
> > > easy choices, Kimagure Orange Road, Initial D, and Akazukin ChaCha,
>
> > I love KOR but I never got to see the manga only read the
> > tranlated manga script and I still like it better than the anime.
>
> since you haven't read it, all I can say is, you have to trust me, of
> all the titles I mentioned, this one is not even close to being
> comparable to its anime counter part.
I note in a snipped part that the art I have seen from the Manga
is not very good. It has been reproduced in matters of a few frames
at a time in various publication including a very large hard cover
Manga! at $40 US.
>
> > It might be time for a KOR remake since it has been out for
> > around 20 years. Good stories deserve to be remade and updated.
>
> can the remake improve on the animation, art design, voices,
> songs/music, and story?
One does not of course know that until the attempt is made
but the story from the manga is different enough from the manga
(and I happen to think better) that they should try imo.
>
> they done that for mony once already, and that is KOR movie #2,
> thankfully it is such a bomb they don't think about making another one.
IMO Shin Kimagure Orange Road completes the anime series very
nicely. The author's subsequent novels I have found less than
satisfying. He seems to have run out of story.
bobbie sellers
> On Sat, 21 Oct 2006 06:17:50 GMT,Ping Kuo, wrote
>
> > In article <10519627747545....@News.Individual.NET>, bobbie
> > sellers <bli...@SPAMcalifornia.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 13:04:44 GMT,Ping Kuo, wrote
> >
> > > > easy choices, Kimagure Orange Road, Initial D, and Akazukin ChaCha,
> >
> > > I love KOR but I never got to see the manga only read the
> > > tranlated manga script and I still like it better than the anime.
> >
> > since you haven't read it, all I can say is, you have to trust me, of
> > all the titles I mentioned, this one is not even close to being
> > comparable to its anime counter part.
>
> I note in a snipped part that the art I have seen from the Manga is
> not very good. It has been reproduced in matters of a few frames at a
> time in various publication including a very large hard cover Manga! at
> $40 US.
>
> >
> > > It might be time for a KOR remake since it has been out for
> > > around 20 years. Good stories deserve to be remade and updated.
> >
> > can the remake improve on the animation, art design, voices,
> > songs/music, and story?
>
> One does not of course know that until the attempt is made but the
> story from the manga is different enough from the manga (and I happen to
> think better) that they should try imo.
The paragraph above should have read:
One does not of course know that until the attempt is made but the
story from the manga is different enough from the anime (and I happen to
sanjian
> On Sat, 21 Oct 2006 06:17:50 GMT,Ping Kuo, wrote
>>
>> they done that for mony once already, and that is KOR movie #2,
>> thankfully it is such a bomb they don't think about making another
>> one.
>
> IMO Shin Kimagure Orange Road completes the anime series very
> nicely. The author's subsequent novels I have found less than
> satisfying. He seems to have run out of story.
I Want to Return to that Day did that well enough. Shin KOR was rather
unnecessary.
sanjian
> In article <10519627747545....@News.Individual.NET>,
> bobbie sellers <bli...@SPAMcalifornia.com> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 13:04:44 GMT,Ping Kuo, wrote
>
>>> easy choices, Kimagure Orange Road, Initial D, and Akazukin ChaCha,
>
>> I love KOR but I never got to see the manga only read the
>> tranlated manga script and I still like it better than the anime.
>
> since you haven't read it, all I can say is, you have to trust me, of
> all the titles I mentioned, this one is not even close to being
> comparable to its anime counter part.
>
>> It might be time for a KOR remake since it has been out for
>> around 20 years. Good stories deserve to be remade and updated.
>
> can the remake improve on the animation, art design, voices,
> songs/music, and story?
Doubtful. They would probably make it hip-hop, then Ken would have to knife
a bitch.
bobbie sellers
I think the word "unnecessary" is absolutely the ideal word for
people who don't like anime or manga to use about every artistic
endeavor.
I find "I Want to Return to that Day" enormously affecting and
despite her age (and mine) identify strongly with Hikaru. The manga
(according to the script) treats her as a more sturdy and independent
character which is how I would rather view her. Still I use a box
of Kleenex® everytime I view it and watch it several times a year.
Ano Sora o Dakishimete rips me up every time I hear it and even
getting the lyric sheet out to get the title spelled right mists
me up. Most of the people i loved are dead now and will never
Hold Me Again.
But Shin KOR has its special appeal in that we get to see the
two chief characters leading adult lives and their relationship
progressing and the more adult Hikaru is well realised, and brave
enough to affirm her continuing feelings for Kyosuke and Madoka.
Thanks for your reply.
Phil Yff
The manga and anime were both produced by a collaboration team called
Be-PaPas founded by Ikuhara Kunihiko, one of the chief directors of Sailor
Moon. Ikuhara recruited Saitou Chiho, Shinya Hasegawa (an animator who
worked on EVA), Youji Enokido (a writer), and producer Yuuichiro Okuro (a
producer).
The manga preceded the anime but not by much. Ikuhara wanted the manga to
generate interest in the anime. He entrusted Saitou Chiho with the most of
the burden of drawing and writing the manga. I have the first printing of
the Tankoubon. Be-PaPas (the group of which Saitou Chiho was a member) and
Saitou, as an individual share the copyright. Saitou is credited as the
author and Be-PaPas as the creator.
With regards to the anime, Ikuhara assumed the primary creative
responsibilities. Although Saitou was still influential, the other members
of the group became more involved. Though not a member of Be-PaPas, J.A.
Seazer who provided the choruses was also a major creative influence.
I guess it's not accurate to say the anime was based on the manga. However,
neither is it correct to say they were produced in parallel since the manga
was being used as a forerunner of the anime. The most accurate way to
describe the relationship is to say that the manga and anime are both based
on the same concept created by Be-PaPas but the different group dynamics
resulted in the anime exploring new venues. This would explain why the
anime is very similar to the manga in certain areas and substantially
different in others.
Phil Yff
>
> The canonical example is probably Vision of Escaflowne, which had not
> one but TWO manga incarnations as I recall, one shoujo and one shonen,
> and the anime combined the best elements of both to produce something
> overall superior to either.
>
IMHO, it is also an example of an anime that fizzles out at the end.
Phil Yff
> In article <ehad7...@news3.newsguy.com>, sanjian
> <san...@widomaker.com> wrote:
>
>> This, and a discussion elsewhere on the group, leads to a question... What
>> series had the anime actually be as good, or possibly even better than the
>> manga? There are only two I can think of:
>
>> Cardcaptor Sakura
>> Fullmetal Alchemist (having not sampled the manga, this is by reputation
>> only)
>
> easy choices, Kimagure Orange Road, Initial D, and Akazukin ChaCha,
>
> and just my opinion, since I am sure others would disagree w/ me on
> those, Fruits Basket
Fruits Basket, the anime series, is very well crafted. However, it deals
with only a portion of the overall story. The larger story is much richer
and thematically complex than the anime. So, although I might agree with
you that the anime is better than the portion of the manga that was
animated, I think overall the manga is better.
Phil Yff
Arakawa not only provided the source material but participated in the
Studio BONES creative meetings. She participated in the way in which the
anime diverged from the manga and in the later episodes provided
considerable insight to ensure the later plot episodes remained faithful to
the overall FMA universe.
Sea Wasp
While to me it's probably the greatest anime I've ever watched. And I
love the ending. Neon Genesis Evangelion is the canonical "sucks at
the end" anime, to me.
Phil Yff
> Phil Yff wrote:
>> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 12:48:24 GMT, Sea Wasp wrote:
>>
>>> The canonical example is probably Vision of Escaflowne, which had not
>>>one but TWO manga incarnations as I recall, one shoujo and one shonen,
>>>and the anime combined the best elements of both to produce something
>>>overall superior to either.
>>>
>>
>> I agree that Vision of Escaflowne was superior to the manga. However,
>> IMHO, it is also an example of an anime that fizzles out at the end.
>
> While to me it's probably the greatest anime I've ever watched. And I
> love the ending. Neon Genesis Evangelion is the canonical "sucks at
> the end" anime, to me.
Couldn't agree more about EVA. However, don't you feel that they rushed
things at the end of Escaflowne. It was such a great story, the viewers,
IMHO, should have been allowed to savor the conclusion. Instead, I got the
sense that the season was coming to an end and they just wanted to pack
things up quickly and head off into the sunset.
Ethan Hammond
--
All Purpose Culture Randomness
http://www.angelfire.com/tx/apcr/index.html
Sea Wasp
I know they DID have to rush things (it was originally your standard
39-ep series, IIRC). However, I felt the "rush" at the end worked
because it was the climax of a war, with many different factions
trying to achieve their own goals, and the Fate Alteration Engine
driving things to a totally frenetic ending. It was unnaturally fast,
with everyone approaching "achieving their dreams" in a total chaos of
events.
Phil Yff
>
> I know they DID have to rush things (it was originally your standard
> 39-ep series, IIRC). However, I felt the "rush" at the end worked
> because it was the climax of a war, with many different factions
> trying to achieve their own goals, and the Fate Alteration Engine
> driving things to a totally frenetic ending. It was unnaturally fast,
> with everyone approaching "achieving their dreams" in a total chaos of
> events.
Ender also had heard it was originally planned to be 39 episodes. Just
because events were hectic did not mean the the anime had to be. The anime
did such a good job in creating a complex universe with a lot of non-linear
conflicts. A good suspenseful drama does not cheat its viewers who have
had to endure sitting on the edge of their seats with a bargain basement
ending.