Kent Marine Tech CB part A & B
Larry Gilbert II
I really wanted just say thanks for all help this newsgroup gave me over
the last couple of months. Its great that people can share their
experiences with us newbies.
So far it's been seven days since I put my live rock in and some of the
coralline algae is lifting from the rock. Is this normal during cycling?
Will the coralline come back? Some green, not very much, starting to
cover some of the rock. Seen a Kent Rep. at That Fish Place in Pa.
celebrating 25th anniversary. He recommended that I use the Tech CB part
A & B.
I bought the aquadose 1400, Tech CB part A & B 64 oz. after reading the
instructions (when i got home, 5 year old son was getting impatient at
store) that part a and b can't be mixed together. So here comes the
dumb question.
I was wondering if I would put, one part a , then add two parts of
water from my ro/di , then one part of b into container of the
aquadose 1400. Can the product be used this way? or will i get a
chemical reaction ?
If not, at the same time, can i dose 2 cap fills (for 75 gallons) of
part a , poor into left side of tank and dose 2 cap fills (for 75
gallons) of part b , poor into right side of tank. One cap full equals
40 gallons.
Also dose in the early morning right?
My tank system and water quality listed below.
I'm just starting a 75 gallon. It's cycling 90 lbs of Fiji live rock
,bought at FFE I was very impressed with the quality of the live rock,
size, lots of purple and orange coralline algae on it.
63 lbs of carib-sea reef sand , 25 lbs of fiji live sand on top, bought
at FFE
I have Kent 60gpd Hi-S ro/di filter for my well water. Hooked up this
way, well water to softener to ro/di. Tropic Marin Salt.
Two normal output blue actinic bulbs. Waited 7 days, just started for 4
1/2 hours, 1 hour before and after and during below.
Two 175 watt, German 10000k metal halide. Waited 7 days, just started
for 2 1/2 hours. Was going to increase 1hr a week?
Two 150 watt Visa therm heaters, one each corner.
CPR Bak Pak 1 with pre-skimmer (black box) and bubble trap. E-mailed CPR
said it would work great. Their rating for 60 gallons is for fish only.
They said, with a reef, it work just fine.
Two 900 maxi- jets powerheads, one mounted low, on side, pushing water
along the back of rocks, cpr skimmer exits at top.
The other one mounted high, on side, pushing water along the front of
rocks
Used Kent Marine Reef Carbon for four days in a skilter 250 mounted on
right side of tank. Water was cloudy the first couple days now clear.
Still have skilter 250 running with their floss and carbon floss.
Using seachem test kit for reef.
Ammonia: .2
Nitrite: 2.5
Nitrate: 5
Temp: 79
PH: 8.2
Specific Gravity: 1.024 using seatest hyrdo
Alkalinity: Talk to rep stir while dripping? (will try again) have
trouble using
Phosphate: need buy a test kit? you have any suggestion ?
Calcium: seachem test just bought today
Thanks for taking the time to read this. Sorry so long
Thanks Again,
Larry Gilbert II
Baucum
> So far it's been seven days since I put my live rock in and some of the
> coralline algae is lifting from the rock. Is this normal during cycling?
> Will the coralline come back?
I had some coralline die off when I first added my live rock. It came back
within a couple of months. Different types of coralline grow better at
different light levels. So it may take a few months for the coralline that
grows best under your lighting to take off. If you ever make drastic lighting
changes you will probably see some coralline die off again.
> I was wondering if I would put, one part a , then add two parts of
> water from my ro/di , then one part of b into container of the
> aquadose 1400. Can the product be used this way? or will i get a
> chemical reaction ?
> If not, at the same time, can i dose 2 cap fills (for 75 gallons) of
> part a , poor into left side of tank and dose 2 cap fills (for 75
> gallons) of part b , poor into right side of tank. One cap full equals
> 40 gallons.
> Also dose in the early morning right?
I think that the big advantage of the two part calcium additives is that you
don't need to dose them. Just dump them in at any time that is convenient.
Maybe you can use your aquadose 1400 for kalk or just top off water. Kalk
needs to be dosed because of its high pH.
> 63 lbs of carib-sea reef sand , 25 lbs of fiji live sand on top, bought
I know that most people suggest spreading the live sand on top of your dead
sand to seed it but I think that this results in the destroying the anaerobic
bacteria. I think a better method that will establish denitrification faster
is to make piles of live sand first then add the dead sand. I think it is
harder to establish anaerobic bacteria than it is to establish aerobic. See
http://www.inlandaquatics.com/livesand.htm for more details. I tried to spark
a conversation about this a month ago but got no takers.
> Using seachem test kit for reef.
> Ammonia: .2
> Nitrite: 2.5
> Nitrate: 5
> Temp: 79
> PH: 8.2
> Specific Gravity: 1.024 using seatest hyrdo
> Alkalinity: Talk to rep stir while dripping? (will try again) have
> trouble using
> Phosphate: need buy a test kit? you have any suggestion ?
> Calcium: seachem test just bought today
Looks normal for 7 days. I like Salifert test kits. All the ones I have are
easy to read except for iodine. If your hydrometer is a swing arm type then
they are not real accurate but they are fairly precise which means that they
will give consistant readings but they may read a little higher or lower than
the actual specific gravity. They are fine to use but you should calibrate it
against an accurate one (floating glass or refractometer). Always rinse it in
fresh water after every use to prevent build up of crap on the arm. Do a
vinegar rinse once in a while.
Darren Baucum
> Thanks for taking the time to read this. Sorry so long
> Thanks Again,
> Larry Gilbert II
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Craig Bingman
Larry Gilbert II <lgil...@lancnews.infi.net> wrote:
>I was wondering if I would put, one part a , then add two parts of
>water from my ro/di , then one part of b into container of the
>aquadose 1400. Can the product be used this way? or will i get a
>chemical reaction ?
Since you have a dosing pump, I'm curious about why you aren't using
limewater. It is less expensive per equivalent of CaCO3 than the
two-part supplements are.
Back to your question, I'd be a little nervous about pumping the two-part
supplements sequentially through the dosing pump. You certainly could do
it, but you would need to make sure the pump was thoroughly rinsed with
RO water between part A and part B.
I'll also warn you that the Kent two-part supplement is considerably less
concentrated than the products that preceeded it on the market: ESV's
B-Ionic and TLF's C-Balance. Kent is about the most unimaginative
company in the aquarium world, and almost all of their products are
ripoffs of someone else.
>If not, at the same time, can i dose 2 cap fills (for 75 gallons) of
>part a , poor into left side of tank and dose 2 cap fills (for 75
>gallons) of part b , poor into right side of tank. One cap full equals
>40 gallons.
>Also dose in the early morning right?
You can add them both sequentially to the same side of the tank. You
just need to add the 2-part supplements as gradually as you can bear to
pour them, and maybe wait a few seconds between A and B. It is best to
add them in a high-turbulence zone of the tank, and if you have a sump,
that often makes a nice place to add them.
Craig
Larry Gilbert II
Craig Bingman wrote:
> In article <36F4B6DF...@lancnews.infi.net>,
> Larry Gilbert II <lgil...@lancnews.infi.net> wrote:
>
> >I was wondering if I would put, one part a , then add two parts of
> >water from my ro/di , then one part of b into container of the
> >aquadose 1400. Can the product be used this way? or will i get a
> >chemical reaction ?
>
> Since you have a dosing pump,
Just cheap gravity feed model, which I think I'm going to return. The seachem
rep. seen me carry the Kent marine part A &b in my hands and warned me about
their products. I thought it was a sales pitch. He (seachem) recommended that
I use reef strontium/km , reef plus. Which they were the products that he is
selling. What's your view on their products?
> I'm curious about why you aren't using limewater. It is less expensive per
> equivalent of CaCO3 than thetwo-part supplements are.
I thought I read in posting about limewater causing some problems but I can't
recall what it was. Also have problems with low Alkalinity? Could you please
tell me more about limewater? Where to buy and Pro's of using? (newbie)
I'm just starting out in reefkeeping. I often enjoy reading your replies to
this group and review your articles at aquarium frontiers on-line. Sometimes
the chemistry part gets over my head at times, but I'm trying.
> Back to your question, I'd be a little nervous about pumping the two-part
> supplements sequentially through the dosing pump. You certainly could do
> it, but you would need to make sure the pump was thoroughly rinsed with
> RO water between part A and part B.
>
o.k.
> I'll also warn you that the Kent two-part supplement is considerably less
> concentrated than the products that preceeded it on the market: ESV's
> B-Ionic and TLF's C-Balance.
Will look into these products dry or liquid form?
> Kent is about the most unimaginative
> company in the aquarium world, and almost all of their products are
> ripoffs of someone else.
See above
>
>
> >If not, at the same time, can i dose 2 cap fills (for 75 gallons) of
> >part a , poor into left side of tank and dose 2 cap fills (for 75
> >gallons) of part b , poor into right side of tank. One cap full equals
> >40 gallons.
> >Also dose in the early morning right?
>
> You can add them both sequentially to the same side of the tank. You
> just need to add the 2-part supplements as gradually as you can bear to
> pour them, and maybe wait a few seconds between A and B. It is best to
> add them in a high-turbulence zone of the tank, and if you have a sump,
> that often makes a nice place to add them.
I don't have a sump something that I plan on adding in the future.Thanks
Craig for the great information. I hope you can reply to above questions.
Thanks again
Larry
>
>
> Craig
Craig Bingman
Larry Gilbert II <lgil...@lancnews.infi.net> wrote:
>Craig Bingman wrote:
>> In article <36F4B6DF...@lancnews.infi.net>,
>> Larry Gilbert II <lgil...@lancnews.infi.net> wrote:
>>
>> >I was wondering if I would put, one part a , then add two parts of
>> >water from my ro/di , then one part of b into container of the
>> >aquadose 1400. Can the product be used this way? or will i get a
>> >chemical reaction ?
>>
>> Since you have a dosing pump,
>
>Just cheap gravity feed model, which I think I'm going to return. The seachem
>rep. seen me carry the Kent marine part A &b in my hands and warned me about
>their products. I thought it was a sales pitch. He (seachem) recommended that
>I use reef strontium/km , reef plus. Which they were the products that he is
>selling. What's your view on their products?
When I go to hell, I am going to have to use either Seachem or Kent
products in my trans-tropical reef aquarium.
>> I'm curious about why you aren't using limewater. It is less expensive per
>> equivalent of CaCO3 than the two-part supplements are.
>I thought I read in posting about limewater causing some problems but I can't
>recall what it was. Also have problems with low Alkalinity? Could you please
>tell me more about limewater? Where to buy and Pro's of using? (newbie)
I'll start with the last part first. Limewater is just a solution of
lime (calcium hydroxide or calcium oxide) in water. People usually make
a saturated solution of lime in water. The solution contains somewhat
over 800 mg/L Ca++ ion and somewhat over 40 meq/L of total alkalinity in
the form of hydroxide ions.
The pros of limewater are that it is probably the most inexpensive way of
adding calcium and alkalinity to a reef tank in balance proprotions. It
also will dramatically reduce the phosphate concentration in input water,
as long as you mix the limewater thoroughly and allow the "gunk" to
precipitate out and don't add any of that gunk to your tank. It also
tends to increase the pH of the system, which can be positive in many
cases. This increases the ability of skimmers to get phosphate out of
the tank. It also makes phosphate less soluble in the water in the tank.
Limewater will work best if it is slowly dosed, either throughout the
day, or dosed gradually at night. Some people make dripper arrangements
that work OK for them for a while, but in the long run, it is easiest to
dispense limewater with a dosing pump. That increases the cost, but it
takes a lot of the fight out of it.
Limewater can compliment CaCO3/CO2 reactors very nicely. These reactors
tend to increase the CO2 concentration in the tank, and depress the
system pH value. Limewater absorbs that excess CO2 and it is converted
into bicarbonate ions, which are useful in supporting calcification by
corals, coralline algae, giant clams, etc.
The "cons" of limewater are that you really do need to dispense it
gradually. Dumping large volumes of limewater into the tank will
increase the pH dramatically, and in extreme cases may destabilize the
system. Limewater is a "volume and CO2 limited" way of adding calcium and
alkalinity to a reef system. If you have a lot of calcifying organisms
in your tank, you may not be able to evaproate enough water to make
limewater work for you. Since the initial form of alkalinity is OH- ions
in limewater, there has to be sufficient CO2 in the tank to neutralize to
make bicarbonate ions. If your system pH is already high during the day,
then limewater might just make it go too high for it to be a useful
method for you.
There are other good ways of adding calcium and alkalinity to a reef
tank. I prefer limewater, CaCO3/CO2 reactors and the liquid 2-part
additives.
>> I'll also warn you that the Kent two-part supplement is considerably less
>> concentrated than the products that preceeded it on the market: ESV's
>> B-Ionic and TLF's C-Balance.
>
>Will look into these products dry or liquid form?
They are liquid products, and they are more expensive per unit of CaCO3
than limewater, CaCO3/CO2 reactors or the "kinda sorta balanced residual"
two-part solid products that SeaChem sells. Since SeaChem's synthetic
seawater resembles seawater in a rather loose sense of the word, I'm less
than sanguine about their repeated claim that their solid products give
an ionic residual that resembles seawater.
The other nice thing about the two-part liquid supplements is that you
just add equal parts of A and B and calcium and alkalinity stay in
balance. (To a good approximation. There are a number of effects that
can throw it off that are difficult to predict and incorporate into a
supplement.)
Best wishes,
Craig
Larry Gilbert II
Thanks for taking the time to reply.
I have a better understanding of limewater and it's benifits, and will be trying
soon.
Thanks Again,
Larry
Marty Boeckman
> The pros of limewater are that it is probably the most inexpensive way of
> adding calcium and alkalinity to a reef tank in balance proprotions. It
> also will dramatically reduce the phosphate concentration in input water,
> as long as you mix the limewater thoroughly and allow the "gunk" to
> precipitate out and don't add any of that gunk to your tank. It also
> tends to increase the pH of the system, which can be positive in many
> cases. This increases the ability of skimmers to get phosphate out of
> the tank. It also makes phosphate less soluble in the water in the tank.
I use a Spectrapure RO double DI unit to mix with kalk. Do you think there will
still be gunk to settle out? I traditionally have just stirred it up and added
everything. It seems to work fine. Since I don't have a dosing pump, I use
airline tubing and gravity to add the limewater. I estimate a total of 150
gallons of water in the system. I add about 1 gallon of limewater (1 level
teaspoon powder) over the course of 30 minutes. The pH does rise about 0.2
during that 30 minutes.
I am debating buying a dosing pump. The plan would be to mix 2 gallons of
limewater, and take about 12 hours to add the limewater (at night). Given that I
am using RO/DI water, do I really need to worry about letting the limewater
settle?
Marty
Craig Bingman
Marty Boeckman <Martin....@metaphasetech.com> wrote:
>I use a Spectrapure RO double DI unit to mix with kalk. Do you think there will
>still be gunk to settle out?
Not much.
The "precipitates phosphate in topoff water" is a real potential benefit,
but if there isn't much phosphate in the water, then there isn't any need
to worry about it.
Craig
Patrick Croft
about Kent ripping off other peoples' ideas. He is a shrewd businessman.
Another question: Why not dispense with all this hassle and get a calcium
reactor? If you have a well stocked growing reef ESV wil pay for the
reactor in a year.
Larry Gilbert II wrote in message <36F6C777...@lancnews.infi.net>...
>
>
>Craig Bingman wrote:
>
>> In article <36F4B6DF...@lancnews.infi.net>,
>> Larry Gilbert II <lgil...@lancnews.infi.net> wrote:
>>
>> >I was wondering if I would put, one part a , then add two parts of
>> >water from my ro/di , then one part of b into container of the
>> >aquadose 1400. Can the product be used this way? or will i get a
>> >chemical reaction ?
>>
>> Since you have a dosing pump,
>
>Just cheap gravity feed model, which I think I'm going to return. The
seachem
>rep. seen me carry the Kent marine part A &b in my hands and warned me
about
>their products. I thought it was a sales pitch. He (seachem) recommended
that
>I use reef strontium/km , reef plus. Which they were the products that he
is
>selling. What's your view on their products?
>
>
per
>
>I thought I read in posting about limewater causing some problems but I
can't
>recall what it was. Also have problems with low Alkalinity? Could you
please
>tell me more about limewater? Where to buy and Pro's of using? (newbie)
>this group and review your articles at aquarium frontiers on-line.
Sometimes
>the chemistry part gets over my head at times, but I'm trying.
>
>> Back to your question, I'd be a little nervous about pumping the two-part
>> supplements sequentially through the dosing pump. You certainly could do
>> it, but you would need to make sure the pump was thoroughly rinsed with
>> RO water between part A and part B.
>>
>
>o.k.
>
>> concentrated than the products that preceeded it on the market: ESV's
>> B-Ionic and TLF's C-Balance.
>
>Will look into these products dry or liquid form?
>
kaboommn
know this guy when he first started.
Patrick Croft <mas...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:7eud4f$uh5$1...@camel25.mindspring.com...