African Cichlids how to raise and buffer pH

Nestor10

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Nov 5, 1997, 3:00:00 AM11/5/97

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For William:

Thrasher makes a good point - does your water need to change all that
significantly from its original parameters. How does your water measure up
straight from the tap?

If you "suffer" from soft or acidic water, there are ways to harden and/or
buffer it without spending all of your money making aquarium suppliers
richer. But before making any valid suggestions, it would help to know your
starting point and goal.

For Thrasher:

What quantities of soft water are you needing?

The best way I've found to provide a constant supply of change water on a
small scale (around five gallons every other day) is to brew it in a large
rubber trash can of at least 30 gallons or larger capacity. Fill it with
water that's below 200-250 ppm TH and below 80 ppm KH, even if you have to
dilute it with distilled or RO to get it there (only takes once). Put a
gallon dry measure of garden peat (you know the type, I'm sure) and run an
airline to the bottom to keep things stirred up. Let it brew untouched for
at least two weeks.

Once the water has softened and acidified, you can start drawing from it for
change water. The water you replace will be of a small enough volume
compared to the total that it can normally come straight from the tap, as
the peat and already acidified main volume will be able to handle it. The
water you draw can be used either straight or mixed with tap to increase the
buffering/hardness a little. This is also a way to bring the pH up a little
if the peat takes it too low.

This has always provided me with water that tests around 2 degrees DH,
starting with hard water. When it starts to weaken or the pH rises, simply
change out the peat. With really hard replacement water, use a larger volume
of peat.

Most efficient, economical and longest-term solution I've found yet.

-Y-

nest...@mindspring.chkr.com
"chkr." is for mail-bots

DDrewz

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Nov 6, 1997, 3:00:00 AM11/6/97

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>I guess I am fortunate, I live in the western US and our tap water is
>about ideal for Africans. I have the opposite problem of how to keep
>discus and cardinals happy.

I live near Seattle NW we have very soft water ph 7.8 Discus thrive

I too am trying to harden my Malawi tank. I have 200+lb of lime stone(large
pieces) and did use "Seachem Malawi / Victoria buffer" for set up. My "well"
water(no heavy metals) is ph 7.8
kh 4-5dkh
50ppm th

with limestone and buffer salt Im up to ph 7.9
kh 14dkh
80ppm th

I would like to use less or none of the buffering salt.
Would coral sand or crushed coral be my best bet?

DDr...@aol.com

Crom

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Nov 6, 1997, 3:00:00 AM11/6/97

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Two words -- baking soda. The carbonate in it will raise kH, which is
proportional to pH in the absence of things such as tannin and other
organic acids. A coral substrate (sand is best) also helps. If you
use baking soda, and do regular water changes, you'll never have a
problem keeping your pH up. And it's *cheap*!

On 5 Nov 1997 21:24:13 GMT, wl...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (William M Lee)
wrote:

> Hello everyone,
> I was thinking about starting an african cichlid tank but was
>wondering how I would raise the water pH. Are chemicals like pH up very
>reliable? Are there any other ways of raising pH? Should I buy a pH
>buffer? If I make water changes, will I need to change the pH of the
>water that will be put in? Any suggestions would be welcome!
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
> William Lee

Crom

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Nov 8, 1997, 3:00:00 AM11/8/97

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Pick up a chemistry textbook and figure it out. :) A good empirical
way to do it is to use something like a 5 gallon bucket, measure your
water parameters before, add baking soda until the water's how you
want it, and then figure out how much baking soda you needed to add
for each dh of kH...

On 7 Nov 1997 14:59:07 GMT, spdd...@aol.com (Spddmn305) wrote:

>How much baking soda should you use?

Dmitry Yakunin

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Nov 10, 1997, 3:00:00 AM11/10/97

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Thrasher <spectre911 @ hotmail.com> wrote in article
<34621ed7.405674116@news>...

> On 5 Nov 1997 21:24:13 GMT, wl...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (William M Lee)
> wrote:

> For Africans I think what you want is hard water, the high pH is
> really kind of incidental. If you harden the water the pH will almost
> invariably go up. This is the route I would recommend. Africans are
> pretty tolerant in regards to water though, unless your water is well
> under 7.0 I wouldn't expect it to be a problem for them.
>

I agree with Trasher that increase of pH is often supplemental to the
increase of total hardness. Indeed, adding limestone of other natural
minerals to the water will increase not only amount of Ca++ and Mg++
(general hardness), but will inevitably add carbonates and bicarbonates
(carbonate hardness), which provide increase of buffering capacity
resulting in neutralizing H+ and therefore increase of pH.

However, if required, total hardness may be increased through the increase
of general hardness only, leaving buffering capacity and, therefore, pH at
the same level. You can achieve it by adding calcium chloride and magnesium
sulfate. These are not carbonates and do not alter pH.
1 milliliter of 10% calcium chloride will increase hardness of 1 liter of
water by dH 2.9° (51.6 ppm)
1 milliliter of 25% magnesium sulfate will increase hardness of 1 liter of
water by dH 4° (71.2 ppm)
You can combine both methods to have required balance of Ca++, Mg++, Cl-,
SO4-- ions.
--
Best Regards,
Dmitry.
----------------------------------

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<html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF">Thrasher <spectre911 @ =
hotmail.com> wrote in article <34621ed7.405674116@news>... > On 5 Nov 1997 21:24:13 GMT, wl...@lynx.dac.neu.edu =
(William M Lee) > wrote: > For Africans I think what you =
want is hard water, the high pH is > really kind of incidental. If =
you harden the water the pH will almost > invariably go up. This =
is the route I would recommend. Africans are > pretty tolerant in =
regards to water though, unless your water is well > under 7.0 I =
wouldn't expect it to be a problem for them. > I agree with Trasher that increase =
of pH is often supplemental to the increase of total hardness. Indeed, =
adding limestone of other natural minerals to the water will increase =
not only amount of Ca++ and Mg++ (general hardness), but will inevitably =
add carbonates and bicarbonates (carbonate hardness), which provide =
increase of buffering capacity resulting in neutralizing H+ and =
therefore increase of pH. However, if required, total hardness =
may be increased through the increase of general hardness only, leaving =
buffering capacity and, therefore, pH at the same level. You can achieve =
it by adding calcium chloride and magnesium sulfate. These are not =
carbonates and do not alter pH.
<ul><li>1 milliliter of 10% calcium chloride will increase hardness =
of 1 liter of water by dH 2.9=B0 (51.6 ppm)<li>1 milliliter of 25% =
magnesium sulfate will increase hardness of 1 liter of water by dH 4=B0 =
(71.2 ppm)</ul>
You can combine both methods to have required balance of Ca++, Mg++, =
Cl-, SO4-- ions. -- Best =
Regards, Dmitry. ---------------------------------- 
</body></html>
------=_NextPart_000_01BCEC84.75E34C80--

Dmitry Yakunin

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Nov 10, 1997, 3:00:00 AM11/10/97

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Dear William, see my answer to Trasher. I hope it explains how to alter pH
and dH. However you may want to look better at what you really want to
achieve. Both pH and dH are integral characteristics of water. Talking of
African cichlids you may be interested not just to increase hardness or pH,
but provide certain amount of specific ions in a water. From what I know,
Tanganyika water is very specific, as its hardness is largely due to
magnesium oxides, as opposed to normal calcium oxides.

At the end of the day manufactures of specific aquarium salts are not that
stupid at all, so it may be appropriate to habit a practice of adding of
certain amount to the fresh water reservoir after each time you do water
change.

--
Best Regards,
Dmitry.
----------------------------------

William M Lee <wl...@lynx.dac.neu.edu> wrote in article
<63qo5t$p6a$1...@isn.dac.neu.edu>...

> Hello everyone,
> I was thinking about starting an african cichlid tank but was
> wondering how I would raise the water pH. Are chemicals like pH up very
> reliable? Are there any other ways of raising pH? Should I buy a pH
> buffer? If I make water changes, will I need to change the pH of the
> water that will be put in? Any suggestions would be welcome!
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
> William Lee
>

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<html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF">Dear William, see my answer to Trasher. =
I hope it explains how to alter pH and dH. However you may want to look =
better at what you really want to achieve. Both pH and dH are integral =
characteristics of water. Talking of African cichlids you may be =
interested not just to increase hardness or pH, but provide certain =
amount of specific ions in a water. From what I know, Tanganyika water =
is very specific, as its hardness is largely due to magnesium oxides, as =
opposed to normal calcium oxides. At the end of the day =
manufactures of specific aquarium salts are not that stupid at all, so =
it may be appropriate to habit a practice of adding of certain amount to =
the fresh water reservoir after each time you do water change. -- =
 Best =
Regards, Dmitry. ---------------------------------- <fon=
t size=3D1 color=3D"#000000" face=3D"MS Sans Serif">William M Lee =
<wl...@lynx.dac.neu.edu> wrote in article <63qo5t$p6a$1...@isn.dac.neu.edu>... >    Hello =
everyone, > 	I was thinking about starting an african cichlid =
tank but was > wondering how I would raise the water pH. Are =
chemicals like pH up very > reliable? Are there any other ways of =
raising pH? Should I buy a pH > buffer? If I make water changes, =
will I need to change the pH of the > water that will be put in? =
Any suggestions would be welcome! > > > > =
						Sincerely, > =
						  William Lee > 
</body></html>
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Dmitry Yakunin

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Nov 12, 1997, 3:00:00 AM11/12/97

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I was waiting for someone saying that. Soda will certainly increase KH, this in
turn will raise up pH. However one should keep in mind that this method is
effective at the pH level of 6.5 and lower. Adding baking soda will not
increase pH further than 8.5 no matter how much you add.
--
Best Regards,
Dmitry.
-----------------------------

Crom <cr...@cris.com> wrote in article
<34643d36...@news.concentric.net>...

> Two words -- baking soda. The carbonate in it will raise kH, which is
> proportional to pH in the absence of things such as tannin and other
> organic acids. A coral substrate (sand is best) also helps. If you
> use baking soda, and do regular water changes, you'll never have a
> problem keeping your pH up. And it's *cheap*!
>

> On 5 Nov 1997 21:24:13 GMT, wl...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (William M Lee)
> wrote:
>