The recession and old radio prices
pgon...@msn.com
for Xmas). I've found that the prices of old radios have definately
tanked. Here's an example. I bought a Sonora model E battery set for
$29. I figured I got a good deal. I had to re-build an audio to get
it working. I added six type 30 tubes so the radio played great. The
condition was excellent. The value of six type 30 tubes is more than
just a few bucks. Anyway, it sold on ebay for $31. Wopeeee! There
is one exception to getting little for old radios on ebay though. If
you're willing to send your stuff to Russia (yes, Russia!), Turkey,
Spain or Australia, you can do pretty good because the value of the
dollar is just about worthless (that's another subject; after eight
years of disasterous George Bush policies, our insatiable appetitie
for Chinese goods, and the fact that we make very few material goods
anymore (nobody wants to do real work), we are headed for the
financial trash-heap of the world). So OK, my collection is worthless
unless I'm willing to sell to foreigners. So be it. Sorry to be so
down.
Dave
Bill M
Ah, the can of worms has been opened!
Not referring to your stuff, Dave, but it seems that in recent years
people aren't just buying any old crap these days. There's a number of
reasons for that that have nothing at all to do with the World Economy
or George Bush.
High shipping costs and general distrust on ebay (again, not pointing at
you) have really cut into discretional buying. The 'good' stuff seems
to still sell well and its to US buyers because there is a dedicated
market for certain higher-end items that doesn't exist in Russia, etc.
They aren't so much into buying the catalins and the shiny red-painted
radios, for example.
I wasn't complaining then when I could buy European radios for 75 cents
on the dollar and shipping was often cheaper than I could get stuff from
Canada. The pendulum swings.
Kenneth Scharf
there will again be a market for old radios. Just like land, they ain't
making them anymore, so unless everybody simply loses interest in
collecting old radios (does then younger generation even care?) they
will be worth something again.
philo
What the heck are you doing?
*Why* are you selling your radios to get money for Christmas presents?
You need to give out your radios *as* Christmas presents.
If by some odd chance *everyone* you know does *not* love old
radios...then heck, they'll have to return them.
(Though I should know better than to get involved in anything to do with
politics...yes...Bush did screw things up)
TwoMuttHeads
decent money for radios. Mainly the hyper-glossed overdone, doesn't
really resemble the original radios. Some number of buyers are willing
to spend money on these hyped wrecks. No doubt this will influence
future sales because those of us who may want to sell the original but
"dull" specimens won't have a chance. I don't know where it will go
from here. I was able to sell several really nice consoles last month
from an antique store as consignments- all to one dealer from CA. My
18 tube Midwest console couldn't get a bite at $1800 or later $1500
BIN. I have a case at the above-mentioned antique store with a dozen
nice tabletop and transistor radios in it. Since Mid-October, I've
sold 1.
graham
<pgon...@msn.com> wrote in message news:2202d23d-f851-4899...@d20g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
... why would you think that old radios are a good or reasonable
investment?
Keith Park
I only sell fully restored sets with a warrantee though, and for that
kind of Radio Ebay is NOT the place to sell them, and for most cases Ebay
is NOT the place to Buy radios eather... I buy maybe 1 or 2 a year that way.
People with money will still spend it, and in this economy they feel better
about investing in
hard-goods, collectables, but you must offer something that will retain its
value or grow.
they high-end buyers are still out there, but you have to wave a flag and
whistle to attract them,
and offer them something of value in return for thier money,
Keith
<pgon...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:2202d23d-f851-4899...@d20g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
Pete Bertini
> for Xmas). I've found that the prices of old radios have definately
> tanked. Here's an example. I bought a Sonora model E battery set for
> $29. I figured I got a good deal. I had to re-build an audio to get
> it working. I added six type 30 tubes so the radio played great.
Sadly, the #30 tubes probably would have brought more on their own.
I suspect battery set prices are more depressed than the better AC
sets. A lot of radios are going for what I'd consider to be high
prices. Dave, have you considered selling your sets on the Radio
Attic, or just doing you own webpages? I'm going to be thinning
down a lot of the extra sets in the shop when I retire in a year or
two--and that's the route I may take.
Pete
Bill Turner
SOMETHING I DON'T UNDERSTAND.
CHECK MY WEBSITE: www.dialcover.com
Bill Turner, excuse caps, short answers, stroke.
WW
"TwoMuttHeads" <menw...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:201132f0-2bc3-4a4f...@p35g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
gone to antique stores. Warren
Carter
First, *in general*, I agree with all you have said above.
In specific, I would mildly disagree with your example. By that, I mean
that I thought the value of battery/TRF radios tanked years ago. They
were quite hot at one time but then seemed to have fallen out of favor.
Michael Black
> First, *in general*, I agree with all you have said above.
>
> In specific, I would mildly disagree with your example. By that, I mean that
> I thought the value of battery/TRF radios tanked years ago. They were quite
> hot at one time but then seemed to have fallen out of favor.
>
Isn't that an indicator that there aren't new people coming into the
hobby? First, virtually nobody collects, so those who do can get
anything they like for virtually nothing, maybe even getting things
that were about to be tossed out. Then more people become interested,
it becomes more of a hobby than a quirk. There's competition for
what's available, and that brings out people who didn't throw out their
radios, and since there's demand, the price is high(er). So long
as the hobby grows, the demand is there, since the new people have
to start somewhere. Then if growth flattens out, virtually everyone
who wants radios or at least certain radios, have been satisfied, so
demand drops, and so do the prices. The things that remain high
are things that have been scarce. Or things that nobody thought
of collecting before, which starts the cycle again. Look at all
those transistor radios...
Michael
Eddie Brimer
Why does everything have to be political? I guess the price of
everything should continue to soar upward forever. Everybody should
profit on everything. People should be forced to attend and pass basic
economic classes before being released into the real world. If you
think the prices of old radios are down right now, AND you think of
old radios as some sort of money making, stable investment, (lol) then
you should be BUYING them, not selling them. The misunderstanding of
cycles, winners and losers, profit and losses, supply and demand is
the core of the problem that exists today. But, people who don't
understand cycles, and sell when the market is tanking, actually help
speed the recovery because people that DO understand snap up the
bargains, and that turns the prices in an upwards direction .Thanks!
Phil Nelson
"Yeah -- the kind of money that goes away and doesn't come back."
If you total up the hours you spend finding and restoring a radio, then
think honestly what you could charge to sell it, the math usually doesn't
add up. Hour per hour, you could earn more money delivering newspapers or
working as a Wal-Mart greeter.
Remember to include shipping. Sometimes people crow about "that $25" radio"
but don't mention the $18.50 the eBay seller charged to ship it from Myrtle
Beach to Vancouver :-)
Happy holidays,
Phil
pgon...@msn.com
is selling old radios, or anything else for that matter, because you
need the money. Collecting old radios is the only hobby I'm aware of
where you can make enough money to feed your habit (of buying old
radios to keep). I know, I've done it for over 10 years. My friends
marvel. How can he do that? That is amazing. Etc, etc, etc. The
poor sucker who is into hoarding instead of collecting, misses out on
this factor. Of course, if he doesn't need money, then who cares?
Only Wall Streeters, I guess. I also agree with Phil's comment on the
hourly wage one earns from fixing old radio. It's below minimum wage,
for sure. But to earn money from a hobby, however small it is, is
truly amazing! Dave
Lou
I see just the opposite, some people are doing great.
http://completed.shop.ebay.com/nationaljukebox/m.html?LH_Complete=1&_fln=1&_ipg=&_trksid=p3911.c0.m283&_rdc=1
and http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150385109067
and
http://completed.shop.ebay.com/judy_102/m.html?LH_Complete=1&_fln=1&_ipg=&_trksid=p3911.c0.m283&_rdc=1
TwoMuttHeads
> Have you been doing any sales in Florence, CO recently? Most of the town has
> gone to antique stores. Warren
I go to Florence about once a month or so to visit family. It's too
much of a pain to try to keep any inventory there. I had some stuff
there along with my brother a couple of years ago...was a complete
waste of time for me.
TwoMuttHeads
couple of bucks, not counting time. I play with them for the "fun"
factor and personal pride in seeing the finished product. When it
stops being fun, I'm done. Yes, I've had a few lucky finds thru the
years. But I keep my retirement investments somewhere else.
Scott W. Harvey
Dave, welcome to reality. I'm glad you can join the rest of us here...
First of all, let's get real. I am a lifelong Democrat, a left-leaning
political creature. I am of the opinion that our previous president was
the most clueless, spineless, and worthless piece of sh*t to occupy the
office in modern times. There's never been anything even remotely good
that I can say about the man......
Until now.
For while I have no doubt that the economic meltdown is contributing to
depressed prices of vintage radios, and that many of the events which
precipitated this economic situation happened on Bush's watch, I can say
with lead-pipe-cinch certainty that the fall in radio prices has almost
nothing to do with Mr. Bush, his administration, his policies, or the
ultimate endgame of his presidency.
Nope......this fall in prices was inevitable no matter which clown
inhabited the White House or what he did while he was there. One need
only look at all the factors to understand the situation we have now:
1. EBAY-ah, eBay.....the biggest reality distortion field to hit the
market in modern times. From the standpoint of radio collecting, eBay's
main purpose in the beginning was to move vintage radios from places
where they were plentiful and almost worthless, like the Midwest and
Northeast, to places where they were harder to find and able to command
a better price, places such as the new South, Florida and the western
part of North America. This caused prices to soar to levels that, in
retrospect, were both insane and unsustainable. EBay made the process
cheap, easy, and novel, which brought more radios out of the woodwork
from the attics, basements and garages where they had been stored and
into the hands of collectors for top dollar. It was a giddy and wild
time to be a collector, you had to compete with a lot of other warm
bodies for the goodies, and people spent hours poring over eBay's
listings looking for good deals.
Alas, this could not last forever. There are both a finite number of
collectors and a finite number of radios they were willing to take on,
and somewhere between 2001 and 2004, a kind of equilibrium was achieved
where collectors in the more disadvantaged geographic regions had all
the radios they wanted from sellers in the radio-rich regions, and
demand began to fall. Also about this same time, eBay began to adopt
increasingly complicated and obnoxious pricing strategies and selling
policies which made it far less lucrative to use it as a venue to sell.
At the same time, fewer people were spending less time browsing the
listings than in the beginning, and novelty of eBay wore off. As a
result, the number of vintage radio listings available on any given day
has been on a downward spiral for years, from 12,000 to 14,000 a few
years ago to somewhere around 3000-4000 today.
2. THE DECAYING BOOMER POPULATION-Most of the people involved in this
hobby are boomers in their 50s, 60s, and 70s. (I am 47 and considered
something of a young pup in this realm). Many of these folks aren't
exactly health club regulars, and the percentage of people in this
demographic that are getting sicker and fewer in number is increasing as
time goes on.
As it stands now, about 40% of people aged 65-80 aren't able to walk
more than two blocks without assistance. Some of those people were once
involved in the radio hobby in a mobile, dynamic way, going to shows,
buying, selling and trading. Some of them stay in the hobby at a reduced
capacity, while others simply drop out entirely.
All this wouldn't be a problem if there were an equal number of
young'uns replacing them, but that doesn't seem to be happening. It
almost seems like radio collecting is undergoing the same challenges
attracting fresh blood that fraternal organizations faced 30 years or so
ago.
3. THE DIVERSITY OF COLLECTORS- Most guys who are involved in the radio
hobby seem to be involved in the collection of other things as
well-model trains, clocks, vintage cars, and many other things. I myself
have developed a passion for collecting and repairing early digital
cameras (they are almost worthless from a money standpoint but I don't
care). The time and money spent on these other pursuits reduces the
resources that can be devoted to radios and also tends to reduce the
demand for them.
Now, the prices for the super high-end stuff, such as catalins and
certain rare super-deluxe radios, seems to be holding steady or
increasing. The common stuff has fallen steadily to the point where it
is now down to what it was in the mid-1980s or perhaps a little more
adjusted for inflation. The radio business is certainly not a place to
make a lot of money in any case.
-Scott
Bill Noble
. I myself
> have developed a passion for collecting and repairing early digital
> cameras (they are almost worthless from a money standpoint but I don't
> care).
snip
>
> -Scott
So, scott, if you would drop me an email to w ill ia m_b _n obl E@ msn
and mention old digital cameras, I have something I'd like to offer you -
buzz
A friend once advised me on how to make a small fortune in antiques, and
that was to start out with a large fortune. The same could be said for
dealing in "antique" radios.
philsvintageradios
people were using it franticly, buying stuff at garage sales and
flipping it or unloading collectables they had stashed. The site was
quite simple to use.
I hardly visit it anymore, except for following links posted here. I
think it burned itself out and so many commercial enterprises started
selling junk and making thousands of postings selling posters,
worthless junk etc. I find it gives me a headache now. I can't follow
who I am bidding against or have any communication with them. It sort
of got so busy and commercialized it just doesn't attract me anymore.
I used to be able to search for things near me , and that always fails
when I try now so that really led me more in the direction of
craigslist and local sales.
I seem to run into less people who know anything about tube circutry,
so I think a lot of people are discouraged from owning them because
they don't know where to go for repairs. The psycology of all things
being throwaway has sort of set into a lot of people's minds as well.
I do think there will become a time where people tire of mass produced
plastic junk and I do think the nice radios with wood cabinetry will
eventually become scarce enough to be sought after.
Putting the time restoring them aside. If I emptied my basement of
tubes parts etc, I could probably rent it as a basement suite, so it
doesn't pay to hoard the stuff unless you have suitable space to store
it.
Peter Elem
computers and information technology. When I retired as audio-visual
specialist at a school district my replacement didn't even know how to
solder on an XLR connector to a mic cable.........This is the general
direction of our country as it becomes second to third rate power in the
world........Morons are now running the show....And so goes the antique
radio hobby.....
"Scott W. Harvey" <NOT_M...@email.com> wrote in message
news:hghuc...@news4.newsguy.com...
Tim Mullen
>Technology used to be people who did electronics. Now it has to do with
>computers and information technology. When I retired as audio-visual
>specialist at a school district my replacement didn't even know how to
>solder on an XLR connector to a mic cable.........This is the general
>direction of our country as it becomes second to third rate power in the
>world........Morons are now running the show....And so goes the antique
>radio hobby.....
Sigh. "Kids today..." and all that. It's coincidence you mention
XLR connectors, because just today I needed a 50' M-F cable for a rear
surround in one of our rooms. The solution? Send an intern out the
door to pick up a complete cable for $25.
As you said, the problems we face nowadays in the audio-visual field
are things like stream throughput, failover, cluster management, etc.
I far more need a kid who understands jumbo frames than I do someone
who can solder an XLR connector. And the young guys I work with, although
not born with a soldering iron in their hand, can make decent solder
joints when they practice a bit.
This doesn't make them "morons", it makes them useful.
"Second to thrid rate power"? I don't think so. The United States
is just as dominant in cutting-edge IT nowadays as it was in radio during
radio's golden age. Where's Cisco's design staff? Who's laying out the
next gen cell processors? WDM, anyone? And who's google, anyway?
Don't dis the kids today. There's some awfully sharp people running
around out there.
--
--------------------------- Tim Mullen ---------------------------
Am I in your basement? Looking for antique televisions, fans, etc.
finger this account or call anytime: (212)-463-0552
----------- Living in the future, playing in the past ------------
terry
> In <hm6j6v$85...@news.eternal-september.org> "Peter Elem" <pe...@optimum.net> writes:
>
> >Technology used to be people who did electronics. Now it has to do with
> >computers and information technology. When I retired as audio-visual
> >specialist at a school district my replacement didn't even know how to
> >solder on an XLR connector to a mic cable.........This is the general
> >direction of our country as it becomes second to third rate power in the
> >world........Morons are now running the show....And so goes the antique
> >radio hobby.....
>
> Sigh. "Kids today..." and all that. It's coincidence you mention
> XLR connectors, because just today I needed a 50' M-F cable for a rear
> surround in one of our rooms. The solution? Send an intern out the
> door to pick up a complete cable for $25.
>
> As you said, the problems we face nowadays in the audio-visual field
> are things like stream throughput, failover, cluster management, etc.
> I far more need a kid who understands jumbo frames than I do someone
> who can solder an XLR connector. And the young guys I work with, although
> not born with a soldering iron in their hand, can make decent solder
> joints when they practice a bit.
>
> This doesn't make them "morons", it makes them useful.
>
> is just as dominant in cutting-edge IT nowadays as it was in radio during
> radio's golden age. Where's Cisco's design staff? Who's laying out the
> next gen cell processors? WDM, anyone? And who's google, anyway?
>
> Don't dis the kids today. There's some awfully sharp people running
> around out there.
>
> --
> --------------------------- Tim Mullen ---------------------------
> Am I in your basement? Looking for antique televisions, fans, etc.
> finger this account or call anytime: (212)-463-0552
> ----------- Living in the future, playing in the past ------------
Exactly. Each generation adapts to the technology it's time (or at
least some do!).
For example as an 'electronics technician' of the 1950s (electronic
tubes and all!) I arrived in a new country at age 22 and found that I
had none of the skills that the older and younger men of my generation
in the new country considered normal.
Those traditional abilities included how to build and caulk wooden
boat, knit a cast net to catch bait, how to rig a fish trap capable of
catching hundreds of pounds of fish, how to jig a hand-line to catch
squid, or ground fish. I didn't even own a hammer at the time and had
to move among people who cut their own wood, built their own boats,
barns, carts, sheds, fishing stages and often their own homes.
Today I have acquired a few of those skills and updated them towards
newer technology, as necessary, to build and maintain a home in fairly
severe climate. And yes I can still solder when needed.
Don't downplay the younger generation. On a slightly different range
of skills my 30 year old son is a better technician than I am.