A rather sad endgame for poor estate planning.....

S. W. Harvey

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May 6, 2012, 10:50:51 PM5/6/12

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graham

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May 7, 2012, 1:00:22 AM5/7/12

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HAVE A WILL!

In addition to having a will that details dispersal, also make sure you can
find someone that will take on, what can be a daunting and time consuming
task. Many times this is beyond the ability or inclination of friends or family
members and some who might think of it as a burden. A large collection, more
often than not, can be more of a burden, than an asset if not handled properly.

The case below might have had no heirs and is in probate. Maybe money is
not an issue, disposal, this way was quick and easy. The radios do look
like they will be finding their way to collectors, or at least, staying out
of the landfill.

----------------------------------------------------

Winston

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May 7, 2012, 2:36:07 AM5/7/12

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S. W. Harvey wrote:
> The following photos were taken at the CHRS swap meet in Berkeley, CA
> yesterday:

Wow, Scott! Thanks for the info.
I saw one of the Atwater Kents at HSC and wondered
where the heck it came from.

--Winston

Eddie Brimer

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May 7, 2012, 5:03:09 PM5/7/12

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If anybody out there has, or knows who has this set...I want it. BAD.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/primitiveradiogod/7001262374/in/set-72157629980576269/

Winston

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May 7, 2012, 5:06:48 PM5/7/12

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Eddie Brimer wrote:
> If anybody out there has, or knows who has this set...I want it. BAD.
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/primitiveradiogod/7001262374/in/set-72157629980576269/

These'r the guys who bought it for $2.00 reportedly:
http://www.halted.com/

Good Luck!

--Winston

Eddie Brimer

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May 7, 2012, 6:35:57 PM5/7/12

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Shipping would be prohibitive for me. That the top of the line Silvertone for 1936. Model 4588. 13 tubes. Gold mirror dial. Motorized tuning. 12" speaker. It's a nice set. John Hagman needs this one to go with his 1935 model 1831, which was top of the line for 1935.

Winston

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May 7, 2012, 11:46:17 PM5/7/12

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When you phoned or emailed the fine folks at Halted Specialties
what did they tell you WRT price with shipping?

(Are you further away than say, Sunnyvale?) :) :)

Looks to me as if the restoration cost will make the
purchase price and shipping look like a pittance.

I Could Be Wrong, Though (TM)

--Winston

Eddie Brimer

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May 8, 2012, 8:29:43 AM5/8/12

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I'm is South Carolina. I didn't call. I know it would be prohibitive. Restoration cost?

Bill

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May 8, 2012, 10:13:00 AM5/8/12

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I don't know, I had a 3500 pound mill shipped about 2,000 miles for a
few hundred dollars, maybe shipping is not prohibitive.

Winston

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May 8, 2012, 10:59:32 AM5/8/12

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What's 'prohibitive'?

I shipped a ~300 lb rotary converter from San Jose to Michigan
recently. (2433 mi.) Shipping via bobtail cost the new owner $350.

If the cost per pound is linear, you could be looking at
say $60 for shipping to a residence. (2639 mi.)

Halted can get the requisite pallet from any liquor store
for nothing; strapping and a plastic sheet for nearly nothing.

Restoration cost?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/primitiveradiogod/7001262374/in/set-72157629980576269/

The time and materials needed to disassemble, repair
and tune up the radio, plus refinish the cabinet.

I agree that this is part of the fun of the hobby but
it does represent a substantial cost. :)

--Winston

HagstAr

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May 8, 2012, 8:34:03 PM5/8/12

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On 5/7/2012 6:35 PM, Eddie Brimer wrote:
> Shipping would be prohibitive for me. That the top of the line Silvertone for 1936. Model 4588. 13 tubes. Gold mirror dial. Motorized tuning. 12" speaker. It's a nice set. John Hagman needs this one to go with his 1935 model 1831, which was top of the line for 1935.

Been there-

http://www.antiqueradios.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=76367&view=next

I found it beautiful but kind of a mediocre performer, it resides
outside Philly now.

John H.

S. W. Harvey

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May 8, 2012, 11:54:57 PM5/8/12

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On 5/7/2012 2:03 PM, Eddie Brimer wrote:
> If anybody out there has, or knows who has this set...I want it. BAD.
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/primitiveradiogod/7001262374/in/set-72157629980576269/

I'm a sucker for big dials and motorized tuning gizmos, so I would've
bought that one, if the cost had been more reasonable. They had it
priced at $175.00 at the swap. That's a hell of a lot for a console,
most in that condition seem to go for $50-60 around here.

-Scott

Winston

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May 9, 2012, 12:43:24 AM5/9/12

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Whoa. Pretty!

--Winston

Winston

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May 9, 2012, 12:46:03 AM5/9/12

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At some point, they'll decide they need the floor space.

--Winston

HagstAr

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May 9, 2012, 11:39:31 PM5/9/12

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On 5/8/2012 11:54 PM, S. W. Harvey wrote:
>
> I'm a sucker for big dials and motorized tuning gizmos, so I would've
> bought that one, if the cost had been more reasonable. They had it
> priced at $175.00 at the swap. That's a hell of a lot for a console,
> most in that condition seem to go for $50-60 around here.
>
>

Actually the Flashomatic tuning just mutes between stations and lights
up when on a station. The mechanism is very simple.

John H,

Eddie Brimer

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May 10, 2012, 12:17:06 AM5/10/12

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Prohibitive is over 100.00 for this set. If I could buy it local for 100.00 or less, I would. Plus, I have been the console shipping route before many times. As often as not, it ends in heartache. I have never really considered the cost of materials in a restoration. Nor time. I haven't done a radio to sale or for someone in a few years. It would be for my own personal collection. The collection reached critical mass some years ago. It takes a very special console to come into my herd. it would mean one of my other consoles would need to go. This set comes close, but not quite there. If it were close to home, I would probably just slide my consoles closer together and work it in.

kimherron

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May 10, 2012, 9:47:28 PM5/10/12

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Sometimes, the plan is not to plan.

> The story behind the radios in these photos is rather interesting, and a
> lesson on the value of making plans for the beneficial divestment of
> your stuff after you die.

I learned of a HUGE stash of radios nearly 25 years ago not too far away
from me, but the fellow that owned them didn't even let anyone look at
what he had. Long story short, he finally died recently, and his heirs
had no idea how to move the stuff. But the old gent made it clear that
he DIDN'T want anybody looking at, or buying any of it, till his was
gone. So his grandson, and his wife, have been trying to deal with the
estate. It's humongous. Not just radios. We're talking antique cars,
phones, clocks, parts of all sorts, lumber, etc. Five pole barns full.
This fellow was a hoarder, but it wasn't all junk, just the opposite.
I estimated 400 to 500 radios at first glance and it will be much
closer to 1000 before it's all said and done. They have been scammed on
some stuff already. However I did manage to put them in touch with
honest, caring people that are making the radios, tubes, parts, service
info and test gear leave and put GOOD money on their pocket at the same
time. And before anyone asks; Yes my wife is well versed on what to do
with OUR stuff, if something happens to me. We're not hoarders, but we
got our share of "stuff" too. She and several others are well aware of
what's here and what to do with it without going to the cleaners or in
the toilet.

--
Kim Herron W8ZV

Michael Black

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May 10, 2012, 10:30:26 PM5/10/12

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I was reading "Murder in the Gun Room" by H. Beam Piper (it's out of
copyright and on Project Gutenberg) where someone apparently kills himself
accidentally, leaving a big collection small guns. So they bring in
someone to determine the value, but who is really there to solve the
murder.

It has no real relevance, other than that the rest of the family in the
story had no interest, and there was no instructions left about the
collection. The family wanted a fast sale, so they wanted to sell it as a
collection, rather than piece by piece.

H. Beam Piper is best known for writing science fiction. He killed
himself in the early sixties (no murder there), the reasons never quite
clear. But whatever happened, hist stuff went out of print, then was in
print in the early eighties, but somehow nobody was around to renew the
copyright, at a time when one had to renew a copyright if one wanted an
extension. So they are just out of copyright, sort of orphan books, about
fifty years after he killed himself.

Michael

Unca Pete

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May 13, 2012, 5:05:17 PM5/13/12

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All of this assumes the original owner had any family that could have
benefited from the sale of this equipment.

Personally, when I croak, I could care less where my equipment or
collection
ends up.
I've thought about about "selling out" early, but in reality, who
cares!
If I can enjoy my collection and ham gear for a few more years, what
happens after I pass is of little concern. My 401K, home and pensions
are worth
far more to my survivors.
Most collectors don't have a clue of what an albatross there
acquistations amount to their families when they pass. Old radios will
only decline in value as analog services decline over the following
years.

Pete

HagstAr

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May 14, 2012, 6:30:19 PM5/14/12

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On 5/13/2012 5:05 PM, Unca Pete wrote:
> Old radios will
> only decline in value as analog services decline over the following
> years.
>

Yes, no one has interest in horses since the automobile came along. If
you have any sleighs etc. I'll be glad to take those old worthless
things off your hands. Also radios like the Mae West, skyscraper
Stromberg, and Catalins despite their extreme beauty will have no value
at all in coming years so I'll be glad to pick those up too for a modest
fee.

Boatanchors will be worth nothing, and also all ugly radios from
1915-30. But that's not the whole story. It's all about eye appeal,
which has and will always be the more important thing.

John H.

graham

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May 15, 2012, 1:00:08 AM5/15/12

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"Unca Pete" <radioco...@gmail.com> wrote in message news:e29180f5-8f3a-403b...@w24g2000vby.googlegroups.com...

> All of this assumes the original owner had any family that could have
> benefited from the sale of this equipment.

... chances are, in reality, your family doesn't give a shit about your gear.

> Personally, when I croak, I could care less where my equipment or
> collection ends up.

... that is correct, you will be dead!

> I've thought about about "selling out" early, but in reality, who
> cares!

... that is correct, nobody does ...

> If I can enjoy my collection and ham gear for a few more years, what
> happens after I pass is of little concern. My 401K, home and pensions
> are worth far more to my survivors.

... well, it depends how much it costs to dispose of your hoard
I have seen cases where it the 401K & home value just about
paid for the removal of the hoard ....

> Most collectors don't have a clue of what an albatross there
> acquistations amount to their families when they pass.

... that is correct ... to your face they say, "we will take care of it
dear old dad" ... but once you are in the ground .. the dumpsters
are in the driveway ....

> Old radios will decline in value as analog services decline over the following years.

... yep, big time, just not worth floor space ... if not sought after, we toss them, just
not worth it ...

Unca Pete

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May 15, 2012, 5:28:55 PM5/15/12

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On May 14, 6:30 pm, HagstAr <yonnyK...@SPAMMERSatt.net> wrote:
> On 5/13/2012 5:05 PM, Unca Pete wrote:> Old radios will

> Boatanchors will be worth nothing, and also all ugly radios from
> 1915-30. But that's not the whole story. It's all about eye appeal,
> which has and will always be the more important thing.
>
> John H.

Most new hams don't have a clue how to interconnect boatanchors,
let alone repair or operate them :) Not much eye appeal for an
old B&W 5100, unless you grew up when they were popular...

Eye appeal hasn't done a thing for the decline in collectables.
Hummels... baseball cards... Lots of eye appeal there, but the
collector base--and the value of the collections--is collapsing.

Nothing is forever.

Pete

DumpsterDiver

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May 16, 2012, 10:42:35 AM5/16/12

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Well, it could be worse, a LOT worse, disposing of your collection (or
hoard) after you "break on through to the other side".

I know a fellow who collects (and SOMETIMES restores) ancient
bulldozers and other dirt-pushing equipment. He's got a number of
pole barns and several dozen acres outdoors filled up with dozens of
them, in various states of rustiness and diesel-leaking stink. Maybe
when he passes on, they'll use one of them to carve out a suitable
resting place for him on his farm. But pity the poor relative(s) who
get stuck with disposing of THAT hoard (not to mention the likely
mandated evvironmental cleanup)!

So what's the problem with a few dozen (or even a few hundred) old
radios? NO PROBLEMO! (at least relatively speaking).

Michael Black

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May 16, 2012, 12:21:45 PM5/16/12

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On Wed, 16 May 2012, DumpsterDiver wrote:

> Well, it could be worse, a LOT worse, disposing of your collection (or
> hoard) after you "break on through to the other side".
>
> I know a fellow who collects (and SOMETIMES restores) ancient
> bulldozers and other dirt-pushing equipment. He's got a number of
> pole barns and several dozen acres outdoors filled up with dozens of
> them, in various states of rustiness and diesel-leaking stink. Maybe
> when he passes on, they'll use one of them to carve out a suitable
> resting place for him on his farm. But pity the poor relative(s) who
> get stuck with disposing of THAT hoard (not to mention the likely
> mandated evvironmental cleanup)!
>
> So what's the problem with a few dozen (or even a few hundred) old
> radios? NO PROBLEMO! (at least relatively speaking).
>

I think Pete's point was that for the family that has no idea about a
collection, any path short of tossing it out requires some effort and
likely research. The easiest route is to sell the collection intact, but
then one has to have some idea of the value in order to get a respectable
price. And chances are good that there are relatively few who would buy a
complete collection, of anything. People collecting may find the search
part of the hobby, and at the very least it may turn out that buying a
collection is too expensive or entails too many duplcates. So the likely
buyers maybe dealers, who don't want to pay much, but who can then spend
the time to sell things individually, getting the maximum profit.

The family could sell the collection piece by piece, but then they need to
know even more about the pieces, and likely need to know a lot about the
hobby to find where they can sell the pieces. And it takes time,
advertising or going to places where such items are sold, a bit here a bit
there until it's all gone.

But Pete also seems to make the point that most people collect because it
interests them, not because there is value. Sure, there must be some
people who buy things because they think they'll be able to resell at a
profit, but those often don't have the same interest in the hobby, they
likely are dependent on others to tell them what might be valuable. But
someone may pay "good money" for that first shortwave receiver they had,
because they want that model and it's become scarce. They aren't buying
an investment, they are buying nostalgia. The hobby is the search, the
restoration, maybe the use (depending on the item).

I seem to have started collecting shortwave radios, now that I'm finding
htem at garage and rummage sales. I'm not paying much, it's not a
collection in the sense that I'm trying to find specific models, it's a
collection as in "more than one shortwave receiver". I'm going to garage
sales and rummage sales anyway, I'm just generally looking, sometimes I
find things I actually want to bring home. If I buy a radio for ten
dollars, I probably get more out of it than if I went to a movie for ten
dollars (now the price is higher), and the radio sticks around while the
movie is over in a couple of hours. I think I am hoping to find one of
those multi-band portables from the seventies, that I once lusted
after, or even something "valuable" like a Transoceanic or fancier
non-portable sw receiver (it's not like Ihaven't found some fairly good
portables, already), but that's not the end goal.

And that sort of thing, you could liquidate, but then, there goes the
hobby, and where does that leave you if you don't terminate soon after the
liquidation? I had a large collection of hobby electronic and ham
magazines, at one point I did a lot of pruning, saving specific articles
and scrapping the rest. I regret that, I got great enjoyment over reading
those old magazines, as magazines. yes, I can find specific articles, if
they were within the realm of things I decided to keep, but that's not the
same thing as going from the front cover to the hack, remembering what it
was like to see the magazine when it came out, in specific cases
remembering what it was like to see those first magazines when I was new
to the hobby, all those ads. And I've lost all those articles that I did
toss, which I might find interesting now but not then.

The problem with preparing for death is that you don't know when death is
coming, and if you prepare too soon, you end up with nothing to get you to
that point.

Michael

HagstAr

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May 16, 2012, 5:22:45 PM5/16/12

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On 5/16/2012 12:21 PM, Michael Black wrote:
>
> But Pete also seems to make the point that most people collect because
> it interests them, not because there is value.

The first collector I knew was as a teen, a father of a friend who
collected toy trains. He spent most of his spare time 1960-90 going to
meets, buying low and selling high. By the time he died a couple of
years ago, his net profit he estimated at about 1 1/2 million dollars.
SO- that's MY background re collecting. I don't expect to do as well on
my radios/TVs though :)

John H.

graham

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May 16, 2012, 9:33:02 PM5/16/12

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"DumpsterDiver" <morc...@att.net> wrote in message news:f16a96e0-0ba2-4cfd...@v24g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...

Well, it could be worse, a LOT worse, disposing of your collection (or
hoard) after you "break on through to the other side".

I know a fellow who collects (and SOMETIMES restores) ancient
bulldozers and other dirt-pushing equipment. He's got a number of
pole barns and several dozen acres outdoors filled up with dozens of
them, in various states of rustiness and diesel-leaking stink. Maybe
when he passes on, they'll use one of them to carve out a suitable
resting place for him on his farm. But pity the poor relative(s) who
get stuck with disposing of THAT hoard (not to mention the likely
mandated evvironmental cleanup)!

.... there are collectors & restorers of this equipment and the parts,
manuals, accessories and raw hulks are worth real money ...
The relative or executor would be smart to hire a company
that deals with the liquidation of these type of items.

So what's the problem with a few dozen (or even a few hundred) old
radios? NO PROBLEMO! (at least relatively speaking).

... If the family is interested (assuming there is one) or if the will provides or if the executor
is legally able there might be no problem, if they are not, big problem. Sorry to say this
but most people think old radios are just that and don't really care about them ... and based on
my experience, most of them are not worth dealing with as most collectors don't want to spend
much at all for them ... so it really boils down to a time consuming hassle, to a small group of
buyers for little money ...

graham

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May 16, 2012, 9:40:57 PM5/16/12

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"HagstAr" <yonn...@SPAMMERSatt.net> wrote in message news:L4KdnXAjepg_hynS...@posted.greenmountainaccess...

... after his death, how can he estimate his net profit?