So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black Mountain Cycles Road frame http://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo or just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a 2012 Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap with fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear your thoughts...
On Sunday, September 23, 2012 5:57:55 PM UTC-6, Chris Fly wrote:
> So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black Mountain > Cycles Road frame > http://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html > I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I > also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous > Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I > got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm > wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo or > just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a 2012 > Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap with > fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have > now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear > your thoughts...
I think the Black Mountain would be very similar to your Casseroll. Similar
OS tubing, similar traditional geometry. If toe overlap is your concern,
the Nordavinden would probably be better.
I have a Sogn with 650B Col de Vie tires, and it feels quite snappy on the
road.
On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 7:57 PM, Chris Fly <fourf...@gmail.com> wrote:
> So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black Mountain
> Cycles Road frame
> http://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html > I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I
> also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous
> Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I
> got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm
> wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo or
> just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a 2012
> Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap with
> fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have
> now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear
> your thoughts...
I have owned three 650b bikes (two Kogswell P/R's and an rSogn) and have tried most of the available road tires on them. None of them has felt as sprightly on the road to me as the Nordavinden rolling on 28 mm Rubino Pro's or 32 mm Randonneur Hypers.
The Bleriot was not a low-trail design, none of Grant P's bikes are. GP also tends to use heavier tubing gauges biased more towards touring than sport. I would not expect a Bleriot to have a really sporty ride.
I have a couple of hundred miles on the Nordavinden, and I'm really enjoying it. Yesterday's ride with the bike club was short, only 25 miles, but had 2500 feet of climbing hitting 15% in a couple of places, some patchy pavement, a descent that let me hit 42.5 MPH, and a 3% down grade where I was drafting a Madone at 30 MPH on rough chip seal. The NV felt good the whole time, stiff enough up the climbs, dead stable at speed, cushy comfortable over bumps. No wobbles, without any front load, sitting up straight at 21 MPH with no hands on the bars, It's not the lightest bike I own (that's an all-Campy equipped Calfee), but it's a lovely ride and that's what counts.
Just from the specs I's expect the Black Mountain to be a little stiffer, and to steer more like a traditional road bike. That's not a knock, just a choice. Couldn't say which you would like better.
Not to muddy the waters, but if you like lugs, this might be another option:
Note that there are two forks available with different rakes, and a fancier version with some chrome. Never seen or ridden one, but they sure look pretty in the pictures. You might fall between sizes.
On Sunday, September 23, 2012 4:57:55 PM UTC-7, Chris Fly wrote:
> So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black Mountain > Cycles Road frame > http://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html > I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I > also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous > Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I > got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm > wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo or > just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a 2012 > Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap with > fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have > now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear > your thoughts...
I own a Black Mountain and like it a great deal. Mike Varley is a good guy and I was happy to spend a little money at his shop. I think you'd still have TCO on a Black Mountain, though, esp with fenders.
On Sunday, September 23, 2012 4:57:55 PM UTC-7, Chris Fly wrote:
> So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black Mountain > Cycles Road frame > http://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html > I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I > also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous > Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I > got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm > wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo or > just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a 2012 > Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap with > fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have > now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear > your thoughts...
If you like the Casseroll, wouldn't it be easier to find a conversion fork
that eliminates the TCO? Rivendell has a conversion fork but I'm sure it's
not low-trail, so maybe you'd still have TCO. I think the Nordavinden fork
would be a sweet option for some frames if Sean would sell them separately,
though that might be a bad idea and eat into Norda frame sales.
On Mon, Sep 24, 2012 at 1:21 PM, Bubba <tapebu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I own a Black Mountain and like it a great deal. Mike Varley is a good
> guy and I was happy to spend a little money at his shop. I think you'd
> still have TCO on a Black Mountain, though, esp with fenders.
> On Sunday, September 23, 2012 4:57:55 PM UTC-7, Chris Fly wrote:
>> So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black Mountain
>> Cycles Road frame http://www.**blackmtncycles.com/p/black-** >> mountain-cycles-frames.html<http://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html>
>> I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I
>> also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous
>> Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I
>> got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm
>> wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo or
>> just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a 2012
>> Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap with
>> fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have
>> now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear
>> your thoughts...
But this is a chance to get a new bike.... :) plus I would hope the frameset would be designed to work as a unit... I'm not a big fan of mixing and matching if I can avoid it...
> If you like the Casseroll, wouldn't it be easier to find a conversion fork
> that eliminates the TCO? Rivendell has a conversion fork but I'm sure it's
> not low-trail, so maybe you'd still have TCO. I think the Nordavinden fork
> would be a sweet option for some frames if Sean would sell them separately,
> though that might be a bad idea and eat into Norda frame sales.
> Erich on the rSogn in MI
> On Mon, Sep 24, 2012 at 1:21 PM, Bubba <tapebu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I own a Black Mountain and like it a great deal. Mike Varley is a good
> > guy and I was happy to spend a little money at his shop. I think you'd
> > still have TCO on a Black Mountain, though, esp with fenders.
> > On Sunday, September 23, 2012 4:57:55 PM UTC-7, Chris Fly wrote:
> >> So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black Mountain
> >> Cycles Road framehttp://www.**blackmtncycles.com/p/black-** > >> mountain-cycles-frames.html<http://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html>
> >> I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I
> >> also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous
> >> Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I
> >> got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm
> >> wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo or
> >> just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a 2012
> >> Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap with
> >> fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have
> >> now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear
> >> your thoughts...
Having seen the BMC Road, the other differences in addition to the low
trail off the top of my head are as follows:
Lightweight steerer
Lighter fork blades
Pacenti crown
Cast stainless steel dropouts
A more perfect fork bend
Standard-diameter tubing
Lightweight tubing
Head tube reinforcement rings
Metal head tube badge
I am sure there are some more. Having owned Rivendells and Surlys
among others, I can say with confidence that the Nordavinden has a far
more refined feel to it. I rode mine up Mt. Diablo once again
yesterday, and am even more pleased with how the Nordavinden turned
out. So pleased that I am re-configuring mine to ride it off-road
again. That is also where the Nordavinden performs surprisingly well.
Sean
On Sep 23, 4:57 pm, Chris Fly <fourf...@gmail.com> wrote:
> So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black Mountain
> Cycles Road
> framehttp://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html > I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I
> also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous
> Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I
> got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm
> wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo or
> just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a 2012
> Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap with
> fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have
> now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear
> your thoughts...
Oh far be it from me to discourage a new bike purchase. If I was looking to
buy a lightweight sportif, the Nordavinden would be where I'd put my money.
Unfortunately most of my rides have been less than a mile lately, and the
rSogn is absolutely perfect as a city bike, puddles and potholes be damned.
On Mon, Sep 24, 2012 at 3:24 PM, Chris Fly <fourf...@gmail.com> wrote:
> But this is a chance to get a new bike.... :) plus I would hope the
> frameset would be designed to work as a unit... I'm not a big fan of mixing
> and matching if I can avoid it...
On Monday, September 24, 2012 12:48:45 PM UTC-7, Sean wrote:
> Hi Chris,
> Having seen the BMC Road, the other differences in addition to the low > trail off the top of my head are as follows:
> Lightweight steerer > Lighter fork blades > Pacenti crown > Cast stainless steel dropouts > A more perfect fork bend > Standard-diameter tubing > Lightweight tubing > Head tube reinforcement rings > Metal head tube badge
> I am sure there are some more. Having owned Rivendells and Surlys > among others, I can say with confidence that the Nordavinden has a far > more refined feel to it. I rode mine up Mt. Diablo once again > yesterday, and am even more pleased with how the Nordavinden turned > out. So pleased that I am re-configuring mine to ride it off-road > again. That is also where the Nordavinden performs surprisingly well.
> Sean
> On Sep 23, 4:57 pm, Chris Fly <fourf...@gmail.com> wrote: > > So I'm stuck between two bikes... the Nordavinden and the Black > Mountain > > Cycles Road > > framehttp://www.blackmtncycles.com/p/black-mountain-cycles-frames.html > > I think the major differences is the low-trail geos on the Norda... I > > also was wondering how the Norda would stack up against the previous > > Rivendell Bleriot... I know the Riv was a 650b, but one of the reasons I > > got rid of it was it always felt slow and bit sluggish... I guess I'm > > wondering if that would have been because of the 650b, the low trail geo > or > > just the design of the bike itself? For reference I currently ride a > 2012 > > Salsa Casseroll and really like it, I just don't like the toe overlap > with > > fenders and I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on a 56cm vs. my 54cm I have > > now... Anyway, I know this kind of rambled a bit, but I'd love to hear > > your thoughts...
