PBP: Group Riding for Randonneurs
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Paul Rozelle
Feb 22, 2011, 9:37:59 AM2/22/11
to randon
Especially for PBP aspirants, this brevet season is a good time to
practice safely and enjoyably riding in or near large groups of other
cyclists. Group riding – drafting, pacelining, and just plain riding
in the proximity of others – is, like other cycling skills, best
learned through practice and repetition.
Some randonneurs may think they don’t need these skills. They ride
their own ride, and they never ride in groups. At PBP, this is
impossible. The mass starts involve many hundreds of riders bunched
within minutes of each other. Even those taking the free start times
will, at some point, have to navigate around others. I am not an
expert on the subject. My aim is to raise awareness and start the
conversation. Contribute your ideas, suggestions, and tips and
hopefully the 2011 PBP contingent will be a safe, experienced, and
confident one. Here are some thoughts on group riding essentials for
randonneurs:
1. BE PREDICTABLE. Every group riding skill and rule is an offshoot
of this one.
2. Signal intentions. Let other riders and drivers know your
intentions. Point in the direction you’re turning and vocalize it
beforehand (Americans, please discard the bent left arm for a right
turn; it’s not widely used elsewhere). It’s less important that you
speak a language that can be understood by others than that you say
*something*. Your words might prevent a nearby sleepy or distracted
rider from causing a crash.
3. Announce hazards. When there are other riders near you, especially
close behind you, announce road hazards to them. Again, forget about
the language barrier. Say something – anything! – and point out the
hazard. If someone ahead of you announces a hazard and points, then
do the same thing automatically. Don’t wait to verify the information
for yourself. Trust them. Do what they do. If you don’t trust the
people you’re riding close behind, then do not ride close behind
them. Period.
4. Overtake other riders safely and politely. If you are overtaking
another rider let him or her know it. Announce your approach. “A
gauche” is roughly “on your left” in French and it’s a good default
call-out. The idea is to let the rider know you’re there. You might
ride a straight line as smooth as silk, but never assume the person
you’re overtaking can or will. Your move to the left to overtake
should be made gradually, well in advance of the overtaken rider, and
with full knowledge of what is behind you. (If you have a mirror, do
NOT rely solely on it. You must look, too.) Causing a faster rider
or group to alter pace so you can make your pass is a faux pass. Many
outside the United States are used to rigid lane discipline and they
cycle the same way. The typical American attitude of “I have as much
right to the road as anyone else,” if expressed in your cycling at
PBP, will likely get you yelled at at best and involved in a crash at
worst. We Americans are guests at PBP. We should try to conform our
riding to the expectations of others, rather than expect that others
will accommodate our individual preferences.
5. Similarly, keep to the right of the lane, unless overtaking
another rider.
6. That said, do not weave about the road. Bobbing in and out of a
lane of parked cars, for example, is a sure way to get crashed out.
Maintain a steady speed in a straight line.
7. Pass on the left, if at all possible. Give riders known to be
from countries that drive of the left (the U.K., Japan) additional
time to move right. They’re not used to it; some may move left when
you announce, “a gauche.”
8. Make no sudden or unannounced moves. Oftentimes the best course
of action (meaning, the least bad!) is to strike the stick/pothole/
roadkill/whatever-it-is that suddenly appears inches from your front
wheel rather than attempt unplanned, radical evasive maneuvers that
might end up putting you into a pitch-over fall, chopping another’s
wheel, or result in your striking the object anyway, but doing so off-
balance and with a turned front wheel. A flat is easier to fix than
missing teeth.
9. Do not overlap wheels. When riding near others, ride beside them
and even with them, or ride far enough behind them so that any sudden
moves on their part (or yours!) will not cause your wheels to touch.
The rear rider will likely go down in such a collision (as may others
behind that person). The responsibility for not overlapping wheels
belongs to the trailing rider. If you are in a disorganized cluster of
riders and overlapped with another rider or otherwise unsure if a
rider nearby knows you are in her blind spot, announce your presence.
Do not be offended if someone lightly touches or pats your hip or
butt. That’s a common signal for “I’m here,” letting you know that a
rider is overlapped with you.
10. Eat, drink, stretch, check what’s behind you, and adjust clothing
without changing your line or your pace. If you cannot do these
things smoothly, then it is your responsibility to do them well away
from other riders. If fidgeting with your stuff causes others to slow
or swerve, you are exhibiting poor road citizenship.
Some riders might want to go fast(er) or conserve energy and,
therefore, want to work together with others to set pace and break the
wind. Intentionally drafting others has its own set of skills and
generally and internationally observed rules, in addition to those
listed above. Like most rules, they can be bent and broken, but 99%
of the time – and, on PBP, unless you’re at the pointy end of the 80-
hour group -- you’ll want to observe them. Here are some additional
considerations for pacelining:
11. Be smooth. This is the “be predictable” rule on steroids. No
sudden or unexpected turns, stops, accelerations, or movements within
or off the front of the paceline. If you come into contact with
another rider, do not react suddenly. It happens. People can bump into
each other (usually shoulders or handlebars) and so long as no one
freaks out or reacts suddenly, no one will get hurt.
12. Relax. Riding steady in a straight line can only happen if you
are relaxed on the bike: loose grip on the bars; supple upper body;
smooth pedal stroke. Being relaxed also saves a lot of energy.
13. Change positions correctly. Moving around in a paceline smoothly
and predictably, without upsetting the pace of the group or of any
other rider, is key.
14. Pulling. When you come to the front of the line, do not change
the pace for any reason. If you want to show off, the best way to do
it is to take a long turn at the front, but keep the effort constant.
Similarly, when you end your turn at the front, do not slow down. Pull
off to the side while maintaining the pace as you signal to the rider
behind you that she’s now responsible for pulling. The signal varies,
but is typically a flick of your elbow or a waving/pointing motion
with your hand. Only then do you gradually decrease your speed as you
retreat to the end of the line. Think of it this way: don’t slow down
until you are out of the paceline. Make sure you resume the pace of
the group as you reach the end of the line or it will be difficult to
get back on! For this reason, it’s good form if you are last in the
line to announce to others, as they drift past you toward the rear,
that you are the last rider so that they can increase their pace and
smoothly take the position behind you.
15. There are two schools of thought on pulling off the front of a
paceline. Those with a racing background will pull off on the windward
side. This is because in a crosswind, the line should not be straight,
but angled leeward of the lead cyclist. The rider who completed her
pull gives an additional wind break to the others by remaining on the
windward side during her movement rearward. Others maintain that for
safety reasons you should always pull off to the right (away from
traffic). For PBP, the best course is to pull off on the same side as
the group has been rotating. It’s just like passing the stuffing at
Thanksgiving. Pass it in the same direction it was traveling when it
got to you, even if that direction is “wrong.”
16. When pulling in hilly or rolling terrain, keep a constant effort,
*not a constant speed*. You’ll want to smooth out speed changes as you
encounter different pitches, but once the transition is made, keep the
effort the same. On hills, gaps may form. The group may wait for
those who were contributing to the pacemaking and ride on without
those who were not. If a gap is opening in front of you and you
cannot or do not want to close it, say so -- “Gap!” – and get out of
the way, preferably to the right. This permits riders behind you to
close the gap as efficiently as possible.
17. Karl Marx loves pacelines. From each according to his abilities;
to each according to his needs. If you’re not strong enough or are too
tired to pull, then don’t. No one will be offended. Either
immediately rotate off to the side when you arrive at the front (known
as “pulling through”) or stay near the back of the group, open a gap,
and let the stronger cyclists pull in front of you instead of having
them go to the back of the line. If you can contribute to the
pacemaking, put a deposit in the karma bank and do so.
18. Don’t leave stragglers. If an established group becomes
momentarily separated – typically at an intersection -- as a matter of
courtesy, those in the lead group should soft pedal until the rest
have rejoined.
19. Look down the road, even if you can’t see it. Learn to “read”
developments as they occur several riders ahead of you, which will
help you be smooth. If you stare at the guy in front of you or his
wheel, your reactions will be sudden (and maybe not sudden enough!).
With practice you can tell how far you are off a wheel without looking
at it.
20. Descend correctly. This is the “keep a constant effort” rule on
steroids. The person pulling must overcome greater wind resistance
with increased speed and the following riders will accelerate faster
because drafting is more effective as speed increases. For both
reasons, the person pulling must continue to work at the front to keep
the group from bunching up. A lead rider who coasts downhill commits a
breach of etiquette, and an especially bad one in PBP’s rolling
terrain. It is frustrating to brake down a descent (the result of a
leader who coasts) only to work hard to climb the next pitch, which
could have been cleared with minimal effort had the leader kept
pedaling. Similarly, riders in the pack must space out to compensate
for the greater effects of drafting. Learn to “brake” without using
the brakes by sitting up to catch more wind or moving slightly to the
side, out of the draft.
21. If you’re not comfortable drafting someone, for whatever reason,
then get out of there. Ride alone. Find another group. Take
responsibility for the safety of your own ride. You’ve got poor
standing to complain about getting crashed out by a squirrely rider
when you knowingly sat on his wheel. What did you think would happen?
22. It is poor form to attach yourself to someone’s wheel
unannounced, proceed to draft, and then take off up the road.
Announce you’re there. Offer to do some work. If you cannot work,
ask to sit in. Most riders are fine with this, if they know you are
there. Thank the rider for the pull. Remember, you’re wearing a
jersey that ties you to your country and your club. Ride in such a
way that brings honor and respect to both.
23. Lights. If you are in a paceline at night and you are not
pulling, turn your headlight to the lowest possible setting.
Otherwise you put the lead riders in their own shadow which is
discourteous and potentially dangerous. Even consider turning off
your main light and running only the “be seen” back-up when in the
pack. If you have multiple taillights and can easily shut all but one
of them off, please do so. Make sure your lights are aimed
correctly. Remember that flashing lights of any kind are forbidden on
PBP. If you feel that you need to be lit up like a Christmas tree in
the middle of a paceline, then being in a paceline at night is not for
you.
Paul Rozelle
RUSA #2955
practice safely and enjoyably riding in or near large groups of other
cyclists. Group riding – drafting, pacelining, and just plain riding
in the proximity of others – is, like other cycling skills, best
learned through practice and repetition.
Some randonneurs may think they don’t need these skills. They ride
their own ride, and they never ride in groups. At PBP, this is
impossible. The mass starts involve many hundreds of riders bunched
within minutes of each other. Even those taking the free start times
will, at some point, have to navigate around others. I am not an
expert on the subject. My aim is to raise awareness and start the
conversation. Contribute your ideas, suggestions, and tips and
hopefully the 2011 PBP contingent will be a safe, experienced, and
confident one. Here are some thoughts on group riding essentials for
randonneurs:
1. BE PREDICTABLE. Every group riding skill and rule is an offshoot
of this one.
2. Signal intentions. Let other riders and drivers know your
intentions. Point in the direction you’re turning and vocalize it
beforehand (Americans, please discard the bent left arm for a right
turn; it’s not widely used elsewhere). It’s less important that you
speak a language that can be understood by others than that you say
*something*. Your words might prevent a nearby sleepy or distracted
rider from causing a crash.
3. Announce hazards. When there are other riders near you, especially
close behind you, announce road hazards to them. Again, forget about
the language barrier. Say something – anything! – and point out the
hazard. If someone ahead of you announces a hazard and points, then
do the same thing automatically. Don’t wait to verify the information
for yourself. Trust them. Do what they do. If you don’t trust the
people you’re riding close behind, then do not ride close behind
them. Period.
4. Overtake other riders safely and politely. If you are overtaking
another rider let him or her know it. Announce your approach. “A
gauche” is roughly “on your left” in French and it’s a good default
call-out. The idea is to let the rider know you’re there. You might
ride a straight line as smooth as silk, but never assume the person
you’re overtaking can or will. Your move to the left to overtake
should be made gradually, well in advance of the overtaken rider, and
with full knowledge of what is behind you. (If you have a mirror, do
NOT rely solely on it. You must look, too.) Causing a faster rider
or group to alter pace so you can make your pass is a faux pass. Many
outside the United States are used to rigid lane discipline and they
cycle the same way. The typical American attitude of “I have as much
right to the road as anyone else,” if expressed in your cycling at
PBP, will likely get you yelled at at best and involved in a crash at
worst. We Americans are guests at PBP. We should try to conform our
riding to the expectations of others, rather than expect that others
will accommodate our individual preferences.
5. Similarly, keep to the right of the lane, unless overtaking
another rider.
6. That said, do not weave about the road. Bobbing in and out of a
lane of parked cars, for example, is a sure way to get crashed out.
Maintain a steady speed in a straight line.
7. Pass on the left, if at all possible. Give riders known to be
from countries that drive of the left (the U.K., Japan) additional
time to move right. They’re not used to it; some may move left when
you announce, “a gauche.”
8. Make no sudden or unannounced moves. Oftentimes the best course
of action (meaning, the least bad!) is to strike the stick/pothole/
roadkill/whatever-it-is that suddenly appears inches from your front
wheel rather than attempt unplanned, radical evasive maneuvers that
might end up putting you into a pitch-over fall, chopping another’s
wheel, or result in your striking the object anyway, but doing so off-
balance and with a turned front wheel. A flat is easier to fix than
missing teeth.
9. Do not overlap wheels. When riding near others, ride beside them
and even with them, or ride far enough behind them so that any sudden
moves on their part (or yours!) will not cause your wheels to touch.
The rear rider will likely go down in such a collision (as may others
behind that person). The responsibility for not overlapping wheels
belongs to the trailing rider. If you are in a disorganized cluster of
riders and overlapped with another rider or otherwise unsure if a
rider nearby knows you are in her blind spot, announce your presence.
Do not be offended if someone lightly touches or pats your hip or
butt. That’s a common signal for “I’m here,” letting you know that a
rider is overlapped with you.
10. Eat, drink, stretch, check what’s behind you, and adjust clothing
without changing your line or your pace. If you cannot do these
things smoothly, then it is your responsibility to do them well away
from other riders. If fidgeting with your stuff causes others to slow
or swerve, you are exhibiting poor road citizenship.
Some riders might want to go fast(er) or conserve energy and,
therefore, want to work together with others to set pace and break the
wind. Intentionally drafting others has its own set of skills and
generally and internationally observed rules, in addition to those
listed above. Like most rules, they can be bent and broken, but 99%
of the time – and, on PBP, unless you’re at the pointy end of the 80-
hour group -- you’ll want to observe them. Here are some additional
considerations for pacelining:
11. Be smooth. This is the “be predictable” rule on steroids. No
sudden or unexpected turns, stops, accelerations, or movements within
or off the front of the paceline. If you come into contact with
another rider, do not react suddenly. It happens. People can bump into
each other (usually shoulders or handlebars) and so long as no one
freaks out or reacts suddenly, no one will get hurt.
12. Relax. Riding steady in a straight line can only happen if you
are relaxed on the bike: loose grip on the bars; supple upper body;
smooth pedal stroke. Being relaxed also saves a lot of energy.
13. Change positions correctly. Moving around in a paceline smoothly
and predictably, without upsetting the pace of the group or of any
other rider, is key.
14. Pulling. When you come to the front of the line, do not change
the pace for any reason. If you want to show off, the best way to do
it is to take a long turn at the front, but keep the effort constant.
Similarly, when you end your turn at the front, do not slow down. Pull
off to the side while maintaining the pace as you signal to the rider
behind you that she’s now responsible for pulling. The signal varies,
but is typically a flick of your elbow or a waving/pointing motion
with your hand. Only then do you gradually decrease your speed as you
retreat to the end of the line. Think of it this way: don’t slow down
until you are out of the paceline. Make sure you resume the pace of
the group as you reach the end of the line or it will be difficult to
get back on! For this reason, it’s good form if you are last in the
line to announce to others, as they drift past you toward the rear,
that you are the last rider so that they can increase their pace and
smoothly take the position behind you.
15. There are two schools of thought on pulling off the front of a
paceline. Those with a racing background will pull off on the windward
side. This is because in a crosswind, the line should not be straight,
but angled leeward of the lead cyclist. The rider who completed her
pull gives an additional wind break to the others by remaining on the
windward side during her movement rearward. Others maintain that for
safety reasons you should always pull off to the right (away from
traffic). For PBP, the best course is to pull off on the same side as
the group has been rotating. It’s just like passing the stuffing at
Thanksgiving. Pass it in the same direction it was traveling when it
got to you, even if that direction is “wrong.”
16. When pulling in hilly or rolling terrain, keep a constant effort,
*not a constant speed*. You’ll want to smooth out speed changes as you
encounter different pitches, but once the transition is made, keep the
effort the same. On hills, gaps may form. The group may wait for
those who were contributing to the pacemaking and ride on without
those who were not. If a gap is opening in front of you and you
cannot or do not want to close it, say so -- “Gap!” – and get out of
the way, preferably to the right. This permits riders behind you to
close the gap as efficiently as possible.
17. Karl Marx loves pacelines. From each according to his abilities;
to each according to his needs. If you’re not strong enough or are too
tired to pull, then don’t. No one will be offended. Either
immediately rotate off to the side when you arrive at the front (known
as “pulling through”) or stay near the back of the group, open a gap,
and let the stronger cyclists pull in front of you instead of having
them go to the back of the line. If you can contribute to the
pacemaking, put a deposit in the karma bank and do so.
18. Don’t leave stragglers. If an established group becomes
momentarily separated – typically at an intersection -- as a matter of
courtesy, those in the lead group should soft pedal until the rest
have rejoined.
19. Look down the road, even if you can’t see it. Learn to “read”
developments as they occur several riders ahead of you, which will
help you be smooth. If you stare at the guy in front of you or his
wheel, your reactions will be sudden (and maybe not sudden enough!).
With practice you can tell how far you are off a wheel without looking
at it.
20. Descend correctly. This is the “keep a constant effort” rule on
steroids. The person pulling must overcome greater wind resistance
with increased speed and the following riders will accelerate faster
because drafting is more effective as speed increases. For both
reasons, the person pulling must continue to work at the front to keep
the group from bunching up. A lead rider who coasts downhill commits a
breach of etiquette, and an especially bad one in PBP’s rolling
terrain. It is frustrating to brake down a descent (the result of a
leader who coasts) only to work hard to climb the next pitch, which
could have been cleared with minimal effort had the leader kept
pedaling. Similarly, riders in the pack must space out to compensate
for the greater effects of drafting. Learn to “brake” without using
the brakes by sitting up to catch more wind or moving slightly to the
side, out of the draft.
21. If you’re not comfortable drafting someone, for whatever reason,
then get out of there. Ride alone. Find another group. Take
responsibility for the safety of your own ride. You’ve got poor
standing to complain about getting crashed out by a squirrely rider
when you knowingly sat on his wheel. What did you think would happen?
22. It is poor form to attach yourself to someone’s wheel
unannounced, proceed to draft, and then take off up the road.
Announce you’re there. Offer to do some work. If you cannot work,
ask to sit in. Most riders are fine with this, if they know you are
there. Thank the rider for the pull. Remember, you’re wearing a
jersey that ties you to your country and your club. Ride in such a
way that brings honor and respect to both.
23. Lights. If you are in a paceline at night and you are not
pulling, turn your headlight to the lowest possible setting.
Otherwise you put the lead riders in their own shadow which is
discourteous and potentially dangerous. Even consider turning off
your main light and running only the “be seen” back-up when in the
pack. If you have multiple taillights and can easily shut all but one
of them off, please do so. Make sure your lights are aimed
correctly. Remember that flashing lights of any kind are forbidden on
PBP. If you feel that you need to be lit up like a Christmas tree in
the middle of a paceline, then being in a paceline at night is not for
you.
Paul Rozelle
RUSA #2955
WMdeR
Feb 22, 2011, 12:18:02 PM2/22/11
to randon
Dear Paul,
Thank you for this reminder. The ability to ride smoothly and safely
in a paceline helps both the rider and those with whom they cooperate,
and, as you've pointed out in your discussion, groups are unavoidable
in a large mass-start event like PBP.
Most of us have ridden with (or even been, sadly) the grit in the
group salad that makes a paceline run like a clown's unicycle.
Another take on group riding etiquette:
http://spectrum-cycles.com/67.htm
The Bicycle Quarterly in its "randonneuring basics" series has also
covered paceline rotation.
I'm planning to ride the local group rides to sharpen up these skills
this spring and early summer.
Thanks again.
Best Regards,
Will
William M. deRosset
Fort Collins, CO
Thank you for this reminder. The ability to ride smoothly and safely
in a paceline helps both the rider and those with whom they cooperate,
and, as you've pointed out in your discussion, groups are unavoidable
in a large mass-start event like PBP.
Most of us have ridden with (or even been, sadly) the grit in the
group salad that makes a paceline run like a clown's unicycle.
Another take on group riding etiquette:
http://spectrum-cycles.com/67.htm
The Bicycle Quarterly in its "randonneuring basics" series has also
covered paceline rotation.
I'm planning to ride the local group rides to sharpen up these skills
this spring and early summer.
Thanks again.
Best Regards,
Will
William M. deRosset
Fort Collins, CO
Mark W
Feb 22, 2011, 3:00:02 PM2/22/11
to randon
I would also add a point about not stopping on the road. If someone needs to stop the whole group should move off the roadway. That deserted road can quickly fill with a fast peloton or a few sleepy inattentive riders.
Mark W
Sent from my iPhone
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Old5ten
Feb 22, 2011, 6:09:13 PM2/22/11
to Paul Rozelle, randon
this is really an excellent summary and definitely a worthwhile subject. however, a few things don't really make sense.
in my experience the groups on brevets are too small to get a good sense of what riding in a pack (vs. paceline) is like. a local group ride that attracts a good number of bodies (40, 50, 60+) of similar abilities (and perhaps with several regroups) might be a better option.
know left and right in french. saying 'something' can be quite confusing to those around you who don't know what you're saying.
yes, it's worthwhile trying to identify riders who seem stable and those who're squirrely, sticking with the former and avoiding the later.
wow! let's not go there. this generalization is really a bunch of BS! 'typical' american attitude? please. it's offensive (and i'm not even american).
the french are WAY more accommodating toward cyclists than you make them out to be, regardless of nationality and position on the road. nowhere else have i seen the patience with cyclists as i have in france in general and PBP in particular!
... and less costly! 8^)
yes, and don't be afraid to lean into someone if they're leaning into you. it's the best way for both to stay up.
it's good to do these things at the rear if possible.
NOOOO!!! there should be no distinction between the front, the middle, or the rear for any group.
once again, lean into the other rider if he bumps you.
hmmmm.... personally i really dislike riders who are consistently (over the course of hours) strong enough to suck wheel, but not strong enough to pull. if you can sit on my wheel for a extended periods of time then you can pull, even if it's only briefly. i've frequently found myself in the company of stronger riders and try to make a point of pulling every once in a while, even if i'm toast. it might only be a minute to their 5 or 10 and it might be at a slower pace, but it does give them a break and it is a sign of respect and appreciation for their efforts.
nuts!
we definitely disagree here. i very much appreciate those with stronger lights behind me. more light is more visibility. the only time that (additional light) could be a factor is for someone with a mirror (forget that thing at night).
elmar
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 6:37 AM, Paul Rozelle <proz...@gmail.com> wrote:
Especially for PBP aspirants, this brevet season is a good time to
practice safely and enjoyably riding in or near large groups of other
cyclists. Group riding – drafting, pacelining, and just plain riding
in the proximity of others – is, like other cycling skills, best
learned through practice and repetition.
in my experience the groups on brevets are too small to get a good sense of what riding in a pack (vs. paceline) is like. a local group ride that attracts a good number of bodies (40, 50, 60+) of similar abilities (and perhaps with several regroups) might be a better option.
It’s less important that you
speak a language that can be understood by others than that you say
*something*. Your words might prevent a nearby sleepy or distracted
rider from causing a crash.
know left and right in french. saying 'something' can be quite confusing to those around you who don't know what you're saying.
If you don’t trust the
people you’re riding close behind, then do not ride close behind
them. Period.
yes, it's worthwhile trying to identify riders who seem stable and those who're squirrely, sticking with the former and avoiding the later.
The typical American attitude of “I have as much
right to the road as anyone else,” if expressed in your cycling at
PBP, will likely get you yelled at at best and involved in a crash at
worst.
wow! let's not go there. this generalization is really a bunch of BS! 'typical' american attitude? please. it's offensive (and i'm not even american).
We Americans are guests at PBP. We should try to conform our
riding to the expectations of others, rather than expect that others
will accommodate our individual preferences.
the french are WAY more accommodating toward cyclists than you make them out to be, regardless of nationality and position on the road. nowhere else have i seen the patience with cyclists as i have in france in general and PBP in particular!
A flat is easier to fix than
missing teeth.
... and less costly! 8^)
9. Do not overlap wheels. When riding near others, ride beside them
and even with them, or ride far enough behind them so that any sudden
moves on their part (or yours!) will not cause your wheels to touch.
The rear rider will likely go down in such a collision (as may others
behind that person). The responsibility for not overlapping wheels
belongs to the trailing rider. If you are in a disorganized cluster of
riders and overlapped with another rider or otherwise unsure if a
rider nearby knows you are in her blind spot, announce your presence.
Do not be offended if someone lightly touches or pats your hip or
butt. That’s a common signal for “I’m here,” letting you know that a
rider is overlapped with you.
yes, and don't be afraid to lean into someone if they're leaning into you. it's the best way for both to stay up.
10. Eat, drink, stretch, check what’s behind you, and adjust clothing
without changing your line or your pace. If you cannot do these
things smoothly, then it is your responsibility to do them well away
from other riders. If fidgeting with your stuff causes others to slow
or swerve, you are exhibiting poor road citizenship.
it's good to do these things at the rear if possible.
Like most rules, they can be bent and broken, but 99%
of the time – and, on PBP, unless you’re at the pointy end of the 80-
hour group -- you’ll want to observe them.
NOOOO!!! there should be no distinction between the front, the middle, or the rear for any group.
People can bump into
each other (usually shoulders or handlebars) and so long as no one
freaks out or reacts suddenly, no one will get hurt.
once again, lean into the other rider if he bumps you.
17. Karl Marx loves pacelines. From each according to his abilities;
to each according to his needs. If you’re not strong enough or are too
tired to pull, then don’t. No one will be offended.
hmmmm.... personally i really dislike riders who are consistently (over the course of hours) strong enough to suck wheel, but not strong enough to pull. if you can sit on my wheel for a extended periods of time then you can pull, even if it's only briefly. i've frequently found myself in the company of stronger riders and try to make a point of pulling every once in a while, even if i'm toast. it might only be a minute to their 5 or 10 and it might be at a slower pace, but it does give them a break and it is a sign of respect and appreciation for their efforts.
23. Lights. If you are in a paceline at night and you are not
pulling, turn your headlight to the lowest possible setting.
Otherwise you put the lead riders in their own shadow which is
discourteous and potentially dangerous. Even consider turning off
your main light and running only the “be seen” back-up when in the
pack.
nuts!
If you have multiple taillights and can easily shut all but one
of them off, please do so. Make sure your lights are aimed
correctly. Remember that flashing lights of any kind are forbidden on
PBP. If you feel that you need to be lit up like a Christmas tree in
the middle of a paceline, then being in a paceline at night is not for
you.
we definitely disagree here. i very much appreciate those with stronger lights behind me. more light is more visibility. the only time that (additional light) could be a factor is for someone with a mirror (forget that thing at night).
elmar
Paul Rozelle
Feb 23, 2011, 10:39:06 AM2/23/11
to randon
Here's another, observed on last night's spirited race-training ride:
24. Headphones/earpieces. Even if they're not illegal (they are most
places in the US; I do not know about France), they're not a good
idea, especially in groups, and especially on a ride like PBP where
you should expect a significant number of riders to be tired or
distracted under the best of circumstances. A rider cannot hear
what's going on around him as well if he has music or a podcast of
This American Life going. That said, think twice about confronting
another rider who is plugged in. I think circumstances matter. For
example, the kid who had his jamz going last night was a very steady
wheel a total stud, too. He couldn't hear me (or traffic, or anything
else), but then I didn't ever have anything to say to him, so I -- and
everyone else in our 6-person group -- let the music go (if he were a
teammate, or I his coach or his dad, I would not have let it go).
Headphones/earpieces are bad form in a group, but so is calling out
every foul and violation.
24. Headphones/earpieces. Even if they're not illegal (they are most
places in the US; I do not know about France), they're not a good
idea, especially in groups, and especially on a ride like PBP where
you should expect a significant number of riders to be tired or
distracted under the best of circumstances. A rider cannot hear
what's going on around him as well if he has music or a podcast of
This American Life going. That said, think twice about confronting
another rider who is plugged in. I think circumstances matter. For
example, the kid who had his jamz going last night was a very steady
wheel a total stud, too. He couldn't hear me (or traffic, or anything
else), but then I didn't ever have anything to say to him, so I -- and
everyone else in our 6-person group -- let the music go (if he were a
teammate, or I his coach or his dad, I would not have let it go).
Headphones/earpieces are bad form in a group, but so is calling out
every foul and violation.
LittleWheelsandBig
Feb 23, 2011, 12:17:07 PM2/23/11
to randon
Elmar, have you ridden at night with somebody drafting you using
considerably brighter lights? The front rider ends up riding in their
own shadow and into potholes. Drafting riders should use lower
intensity lighting, they can't see a long way past the rider in front
of them anyway. If you are at the front and feel the need, crank up
the power but that has some effect on others too. Experienced Brits
with adequate lights are considering 'joining the arms race' because
of the expected use of ludicrous lumen lights by a large percentage of
the field this year. Many fast riders complain about poorly-aimed
powerful lighting (particularly MTB helmet lights) used by slower
riders going the other direction near Loudiac. It is going to be worse
this year, I expect.
Dave
On Feb 22, 11:09 pm, Old5ten <old5t...@gmail.com> wrote:
> this is really an excellent summary and definitely a worthwhile subject.
> however, a few things don't really make sense.
>
considerably brighter lights? The front rider ends up riding in their
own shadow and into potholes. Drafting riders should use lower
intensity lighting, they can't see a long way past the rider in front
of them anyway. If you are at the front and feel the need, crank up
the power but that has some effect on others too. Experienced Brits
with adequate lights are considering 'joining the arms race' because
of the expected use of ludicrous lumen lights by a large percentage of
the field this year. Many fast riders complain about poorly-aimed
powerful lighting (particularly MTB helmet lights) used by slower
riders going the other direction near Loudiac. It is going to be worse
this year, I expect.
Dave
On Feb 22, 11:09 pm, Old5ten <old5t...@gmail.com> wrote:
> this is really an excellent summary and definitely a worthwhile subject.
> however, a few things don't really make sense.
>
Old5ten
Feb 24, 2011, 1:06:24 AM2/24/11
to LittleWheelsandBig, randon
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 9:17 AM, LittleWheelsandBig <davidj...@gmail.com> wrote:
Elmar, have you ridden at night with somebody drafting you using
considerably brighter lights?
i'm currently riding at 250 lumens, which seems on the mid to upper end of mainstream lights (the ones you don't pay $300+ for). yes, you can get in the 800+ lumen range, but few people i've encountered use those on the road.
The front rider ends up riding in their
own shadow and into potholes.
that is just a bunch of BS. think about it in a logical manner: your own front light is putting out X lumens in front of you. the rider(s) behind you put out Y lumens. lets assume that Y is greater than X. so what?! your 'shadow' is still illuminated by X, which is what you had to begin with.
Drafting riders should use lower
intensity lighting, they can't see a long way past the rider in front
of them anyway.
if a drafting rider has a higher powered light and that light shines past the person in front of them, then the person in front of them has more light! to me, having more light is better. of course there is the consideration of battery life (that is changing rapidly in terms of more efficient bulbs and batteries) and mirrors.
If you are at the front and feel the need, crank up
the power but that has some effect on others too. Experienced Brits
with adequate lights
what's adequate? your definition?!
are considering 'joining the arms race' because
of the expected use of ludicrous lumen lights by a large percentage of
the field this year.
arms race and ludicrous lumens? hmmm... are we bringing mel brooks into this?
currently the limit to using ludicrous lumens on brevets is battery life.
Many fast riders complain about poorly-aimed
powerful lighting (particularly MTB helmet lights) used by slower
riders going the other direction near Loudiac.
ohhh, poor fast riders! come on, let's be a little more inclusive and think of everybody on the ride (i.e. the other 5000 bodies). when those (fast) guys passed me (going back home) there were about 30 or so of them in a pack (not a pace line). they're definitely putting out a lot more light than i was. btw, bike lighting in 2007 wasn't what i would call powerful (especially by today's standards) and the average stock low beam car lights we have to deal with run well over a 1000 lumens. you can easily upgrade to 1800+ lumens.
It is going to be worse
this year, I expect.
no, not worse. better!
elmar
LittleWheelsandBig
Feb 24, 2011, 3:29:33 AM2/24/11
to randon
Bollocks Elmar. Your eyes adjust to the ambient (brighter) light and
with your shadow moving around (as the relative positions of both
riders move), it can be very difficult to pick up changes in road
condition.
No worries though. For you (and others), brighter is always better and
the arms race will continue. I just won't let those of your ilk draft
me at night. Enjoy your PBP, I certainly will.
Dave
On Feb 24, 6:06 am, Old5ten <old5t...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 9:17 AM, LittleWheelsandBig
> <davidjmin...@gmail.com>wrote:
with your shadow moving around (as the relative positions of both
riders move), it can be very difficult to pick up changes in road
condition.
No worries though. For you (and others), brighter is always better and
the arms race will continue. I just won't let those of your ilk draft
me at night. Enjoy your PBP, I certainly will.
Dave
On Feb 24, 6:06 am, Old5ten <old5t...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 9:17 AM, LittleWheelsandBig
Matthew Haigh
Feb 24, 2011, 3:51:18 AM2/24/11
to randon
On 24/02/2011 06:06, Old5ten wrote:
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 9:17 AM, LittleWheelsandBig
> <davidj...@gmail.com <mailto:davidj...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Elmar, have you ridden at night with somebody drafting you using
> considerably brighter lights?
>
>
> i'm currently riding at 250 lumens, which seems on the mid to upper end
> of mainstream lights (the ones you don't pay $300+ for). yes, you can
> get in the 800+ lumen range, but few people i've encountered use those
> on the road.
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 9:17 AM, LittleWheelsandBig
> <davidj...@gmail.com <mailto:davidj...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Elmar, have you ridden at night with somebody drafting you using
> considerably brighter lights?
>
>
> i'm currently riding at 250 lumens, which seems on the mid to upper end
> of mainstream lights (the ones you don't pay $300+ for). yes, you can
> get in the 800+ lumen range, but few people i've encountered use those
> on the road.
So you're generally running pretty bright lighting :-)
> The front rider ends up riding in their
> own shadow and into potholes.
>
>
> that is just a bunch of BS. think about it in a logical manner: your
> own front light is putting out X lumens in front of you. the rider(s)
> behind you put out Y lumens. lets assume that Y is greater than X. so
> what?! your 'shadow' is still illuminated by X, which is what you had
> to begin with.
I understand what you are saying, but whilst it seems fine on paper it
really doesn't work on the road. I've been in exactly the same situation
that LWaB describes - my last relatively serious accident was at night,
being followed by somebody whose lights were much brighter than mine. At
the time I was running a DLumotec dynamo light (perfectly adequate), he
was running a new set of Ay-ups.
Yes, having bright lights behind may give more overall light on the road
- but it isn't constant (their distance to you will be changing
slightly, the angle of the lights will change as they move their bars),
and it upsets your night vision. So what was an adequately lit patch in
front of you becomes very dim by comparison with the very bright but
irregularly lit areas around you, and you really cannot make out the
details where you need to be looking.
> Many fast riders complain about poorly-aimed
> powerful lighting (particularly MTB helmet lights) used by slower
> riders going the other direction near Loudiac.
>
>
> ohhh, poor fast riders! come on, let's be a little more inclusive and
> think of everybody on the ride (i.e. the other 5000 bodies).
The point isn't that they are fast or slow, just that these are the
riders who will face each other head on. Ignore the relative speeds -
the point is that poorly focused lights dazzle both oncoming cars and
oncoming riders. They are simply inconsiderate, and on a ride when you
will be around many other people everybody needs to be as considerate as
possible.
> btw, bike lighting in 2007 wasn't what i would
> call powerful (especially by today's standards) and the average stock
> low beam car lights we have to deal with run well over a 1000 lumens.
> you can easily upgrade to 1800+ lumens.
Car lighting has well defined beam patterns - they put the light on the
road, and in the right places. Most MTB lights give an almost even light
pattern, which is good off road - you see everything, including
overhanging branches. When used on road they are like a car using its
main beam - they shine right in the face of oncoming riders. Helmet
mounted lights are worse for this, especially if the oncoming rider
actually looks at you to acknowledge you.
Matt
Alan Walker
Feb 24, 2011, 5:06:49 AM2/24/11
to randon
"that is just a bunch of BS. think about it in a logical manner: your own front light is putting out X lumens in front of you. the
rider(s) behind you put out Y lumens. lets assume that Y is greater than X. so what?! your 'shadow' is still illuminated by X,
which is what you had to begin with. "
" if a drafting rider has a higher powered light and that light shines past the person in front of them, then the person in front of
them has more light! to me, having more light is better. "
This is what happens when junior high school science combines with extensive inexperience.
Randy Graves
Feb 24, 2011, 8:40:48 AM2/24/11
to ran...@googlegroups.com
I would repeat David's question to Elmar, which received no
answer... "have you ridden at night with somebody drafting you using
considerably brighter lights?"
"think about it in a logical manner" is NO answer - only having had that experience will suffice.� Your own shadow falls *exactly* where you need visibility the most, which is destroyed by the glare from the brighter illumination in exactly the wrong, adjacent regions.� Calling "BS" is no substitute.
Randy
considerably brighter lights?"
"think about it in a logical manner" is NO answer - only having had that experience will suffice.� Your own shadow falls *exactly* where you need visibility the most, which is destroyed by the glare from the brighter illumination in exactly the wrong, adjacent regions.� Calling "BS" is no substitute.
Randy
On 2/23/2011 10:06 PM, Old5ten wrote:
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 9:17 AM, LittleWheelsandBig <davidj...@gmail.com> wrote:
Elmar, have you ridden at night with somebody drafting you using
considerably brighter lights?
i'm currently riding at 250 lumens, which seems on the mid to upper end of mainstream lights (the ones you don't pay $300+ for).� yes, you can get in the 800+ lumen range, but few people i've encountered use those on the road. �
�
The front rider ends up riding in their
own shadow and into potholes.
that is just a bunch of BS.� think about it in a logical manner: your own front light is putting out X lumens in front of you.� the rider(s) behind you put out Y lumens.� lets assume that Y is greater than X.� so what?!� your 'shadow' is still illuminated by X, which is what you had to begin with.
�
Drafting riders should use lower
intensity lighting, they can't see a long way past the rider in front
of them anyway.
if a drafting rider has a higher powered light and that light shines past the person in front of them, then the person in front of them has more light!� to me, having more light is better.� of course there is the consideration of battery life (that is changing rapidly in terms of more efficient bulbs and batteries) and mirrors.
. . .�
elmar
�
hr...@mindspring.com
Feb 24, 2011, 9:23:00 AM2/24/11
to Alan Walker, ran...@googlegroups.com
I must say, I am truly amazed at any cyclist that is so self centered that they actually work at keeping others off of their wheel during group rides. Life is far too short for that.
In 1996 at age 40 and weighing 487 pounds I had a heart attack. They wanted to do quadruple by-pass the next morning. Having also smoked for 25 years I knew I could not survive it. I opted not to have the surgery. To make a long story short - I stopped smoking that day completely and with the help of my bicycle - I lost 250 pounds over the next 18 months. I ran a couple marathons. I was released by my cardiologist 3 years after the attack. But I kept riding my bike.
On one group ride, the Cross Florida ride I ended up pulling a large group for miles. I even had one rider come up to me near the end, after about 175 miles that day and ask me "do you take American Express" I always enjoyed pulling because I knew the benefits I was getting personally.
Again long story short. I ended up having a bout with lung cancer 10 years later. Again I beat it - thank God. But I stopped riding for a couple years with the distraction of the treatments.
Recently I decided to get back on my bike. I worked myself up to thinking I was ready again for a century ride. I found one and registered. The day of the ride I did struggle after about 50 Miles. While at a sag stop, I was literally trying to decide whether to finish or not. A rider came up to me and said "hey not sure if you remember me but you have pulled me 200 miles across the state of florida into that relentless head wind a couple of times a few years ago." It was Mr. American Express! I told him how I was feeling that day and he said "if you want to ride on my wheel to the finish I will consider it an honor!" I did and I finished that ride.
It might not be today or this particular ride but someday you might need a bit of help. I consider cyclist a big family and just cannot understand the mentality of "get out of my space" between each other. Even from our selfish little brothers and sisters.
As my father would say. "Just play nice you all!"
I've never done PBP but wish all of you the sweetest of rides this time around. Good luck!
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
Vik Banerjee
Feb 24, 2011, 9:39:14 AM2/24/11
to Old5ten, LittleWheelsandBig, randon
Symmetric high powered bike lights are far more blinding to oncoming traffic than vehicle lights. I compared my 2010 F150 truck's lights to a set of Dinotte 200 lumen bike lights:
The difference between a focused optic in a bike light with a vertical cut off is amazing...both in terms of how little it blinds you compared to a symmetric beam bike light and how well it lights up the road.
safe riding,
On 2011-02-23, at 10:06 PM, Old5ten wrote:
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 9:17 AM, LittleWheelsandBig <davidj...@gmail.com> wrote:Elmar, have you ridden at night with somebody drafting you using
considerably brighter lights?
Jacques Bilinski
Feb 24, 2011, 10:49:59 AM2/24/11
to randon
>
> 16. When pulling in hilly or rolling terrain, keep a constant effort,
> *not a constant speed*. You’ll want to smooth out speed changes as you
> encounter different pitches, but once the transition is made, keep the
> effort the same.
maintain a constant effort. You're better off coasting downhill (in an
aero tuck), resting, and saving your energy for the climbs when less
of your energy is 'wasted' churning up the air.
hughgs
Feb 24, 2011, 12:04:19 PM2/24/11
to Jacques Bilinski, randon
If you're in the front of a pace-line then your job is NOT to be
efficient. Your job is to allow those behind you to ride as smoothly as
possible.
The original post doesn't discuss how to be efficient it discusses how to
act when you're in a paceline. Two entirely different scenarios.
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "randon" group.
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>
>
George S. Hugh
(302) 530-9335
hug...@duke.edu
Old5ten
Feb 24, 2011, 11:55:43 AM2/24/11
to randon
On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 12:29 AM, LittleWheelsandBig <davidj...@gmail.com> wrote:
Bollocks Elmar. Your eyes adjust to the ambient (brighter) light and
with your shadow moving around (as the relative positions of both
riders move), it can be very difficult to pick up changes in road
condition.
lets take this to an extreme. you've got a car behind you and it's illuminating the road around you. you're riding in your own shadow. every time i've been in a situation like that (last time would be a couple of evenings ago) i've enjoyed the additional light.
you may want to check out this to get a feel for what i'm talking about: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WicnoNHvAcA
one could argue beam patterns, lens optics, angles, diffusers, etc. ad nauseum, but i'm referring to what you are saying above (i.e. adjustment to brighter light causing difficulty to pick up changes in the road) and it has definitely NOT been my experience.
No worries though. For you (and others), brighter is always better and
the arms race will continue.
no, i'm pretty happy with what i have right now (cygolite mightycross running at 250 lumens on high). i might switch to something running on AAs at some point for the convenience of using widely available batteries.
elmar
'junior high school science meets extensive inexperience' (from alan walker) - i like that! still trying to figure out which one is applicable to me. ahhh, let's just get it done with and say both. those guys on raam have got no clue...
Matthew Haigh
Feb 24, 2011, 12:40:25 PM2/24/11
to ran...@googlegroups.com
On 24/02/2011 16:55, Old5ten wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 12:29 AM, LittleWheelsandBig
> <davidj...@gmail.com <mailto:davidj...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Bollocks Elmar. Your eyes adjust to the ambient (brighter) light and
> with your shadow moving around (as the relative positions of both
> riders move), it can be very difficult to pick up changes in road
> condition.
>
>
> lets take this to an extreme. you've got a car behind you and it's
> illuminating the road around you. you're riding in your own shadow.
> every time i've been in a situation like that (last time would be a
> couple of evenings ago) i've enjoyed the additional light.
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 12:29 AM, LittleWheelsandBig
> <davidj...@gmail.com <mailto:davidj...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Bollocks Elmar. Your eyes adjust to the ambient (brighter) light and
> with your shadow moving around (as the relative positions of both
> riders move), it can be very difficult to pick up changes in road
> condition.
>
>
> lets take this to an extreme. you've got a car behind you and it's
> illuminating the road around you. you're riding in your own shadow.
> every time i've been in a situation like that (last time would be a
> couple of evenings ago) i've enjoyed the additional light.
Apples and oranges! When riding in front of a car, the car has two
widely spaced lights with an overlapping beam pattern. Either of the
lights will give a reasonable illumination of much of the road. Whilst
the cyclist may be blocking the light from the lamp on the passenger
side of the vehicle, they won't be blocking the light from the lamp on
the driver's side (or vice-versa) - therefore as you say the rider will
typically benefit from that arrangement (though there could be some
night vision loss which becomes a problem when the car drives past). The
same is typically true for a cyclist with a bright light riding out to
one side of you.
If there is a single light source directly behind the rider (as you'd
have when riding a paceline), then the rider will block the light
directly in front, and ride their own shadow. Try drawing it on a piece
of paper, and see where the light beams get blocked - or even just a pen
a couple of inches in front of one eye; if you only look through that
eye you cannot see what is in front of the pen. If your eye was a light,
then there would be a shadow in front of the pen. Open the other eye and
you can see around the pen; if it was a light then the area ahead of the
pen would be lit up.
> one could argue beam patterns, lens optics, angles, diffusers, etc. ad
> nauseum, but i'm referring to what you are saying above (i.e. adjustment
> to brighter light causing difficulty to pick up changes in the road) and
> it has definitely NOT been my experience.
Enough other people (on this list and other forums) have complained
about this that you must at least realise that it is a very real issue
for some riders, even if you are blessed with eyes that can cope with
it. I do wonder if you have ridden in very dark conditions with a
cyclist behind you who has vastly brighter lights than yours.
Matt
Don Bennett
Feb 24, 2011, 12:52:19 PM2/24/11
to Matthew Haigh, ran...@googlegroups.com
While I have not experienced this, I was finishing a 300k recently with some friends who asked me and my Edelux to move to the front; When I dropped back, I made a point of adjusting the aim so that it didn't go way out in front of them.
Don
Don
On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 9:40 AM, Matthew Haigh <ran...@haigh.org> wrote:
Enough other people (on this list and other forums) have complained
about this that you must at least realise that it is a very real issue
for some riders, even if you are blessed with eyes that can cope with
it. I do wonder if you have ridden in very dark conditions with a
cyclist behind you who has vastly brighter lights than yours.
Matt
Jacques Bilinski
Feb 24, 2011, 1:19:47 PM2/24/11
to randon
On the topic of group cycling in rolling terrain, another thing I've
noticed is when the group is made of of riders of different weights it
makes no sense for a small light weight rider to be 'pulling' on any
kind of down hill. No matter how hard the light weight leader works
that big guy behind him or her will be applying his brakes. Better off
to let the heavy riders lead on the down hills and let the light ones
make their contribution to the group on the flats.
noticed is when the group is made of of riders of different weights it
makes no sense for a small light weight rider to be 'pulling' on any
kind of down hill. No matter how hard the light weight leader works
that big guy behind him or her will be applying his brakes. Better off
to let the heavy riders lead on the down hills and let the light ones
make their contribution to the group on the flats.
Paul Rozelle
Feb 24, 2011, 1:17:44 PM2/24/11
to randon
Regarding bright lights, mid-paceline:
I can only comment from my experience, which is minimal compare to
others' on this list. I've been doing ultra-distance races since '04
and brevets since '05. I ride a weekly race training ride that starts
and finishes at night, in the dark. I've been commuting by bicycle --
mostly in the dark -- for over 20 years.
My experience, all in many different regions of the US and at PBP in
2007, has been that it's poor form to run lights other than the "be
seen" variety in a paceline, unless you're at the front. The bright
light is more harmful to the group than helpful. Anything that's
harmful to the group doesn't belong in a paceline, even if you really,
really like it and even if you think everyone else is really, really
wrong. I've never experienced a situation in which other riders
thought someone running bright lights in the group was helpful. I've
experienced countless situations where riders asked others to turn
down their lights unless they were at the front.
I have a Niterider Moab, which can throw a massive amount of light on
the road (and the side of the road and everything else). Even someone
with a much weaker light, directly behind me, puts me in a shadow that
makes it difficult to make out the texture of the road surface. If
you're in an echelon or a rapidly rotating paceline at night --
situations that are probably irrelevant to elmar and most other
readers on this list -- then worrying about light brightness isn't a
big issue. But when folks are lined up one behind the other, or where
the rotation is long in duration (like you'll find in most groups on
brevets and especially at PBP), then my experience has been that it's
a huge issue.
You can, of course, do what you want -- it's a free country and all
that -- but you should be prepared for other riders to react
negatively to your bright lights, and some of them may not be so
friendly about it. I doubt anyone will want to debate optical physics
with you after they've asked you, hopefully politely, either to dim
your lights or exit the paceline.
The same goes with taillights, which I've found to be a worse problem
in pacelines than excessively bright headlights. No one wants a face-
full of bright light. And there is no purpose to running all that
light in a group. Groups hare highly visible to drivers -- SAG
sometime for a ride that runs at night and see for yourself. If
someone would like to share an anecdote about how a driver ran over a
paceline of randonneurs at night, and how that accident would have
been prevented if only everyone was running three taillights instead
of one, then please share.
Paul (run only enough light for the application and no more) Rozelle
I can only comment from my experience, which is minimal compare to
others' on this list. I've been doing ultra-distance races since '04
and brevets since '05. I ride a weekly race training ride that starts
and finishes at night, in the dark. I've been commuting by bicycle --
mostly in the dark -- for over 20 years.
My experience, all in many different regions of the US and at PBP in
2007, has been that it's poor form to run lights other than the "be
seen" variety in a paceline, unless you're at the front. The bright
light is more harmful to the group than helpful. Anything that's
harmful to the group doesn't belong in a paceline, even if you really,
really like it and even if you think everyone else is really, really
wrong. I've never experienced a situation in which other riders
thought someone running bright lights in the group was helpful. I've
experienced countless situations where riders asked others to turn
down their lights unless they were at the front.
I have a Niterider Moab, which can throw a massive amount of light on
the road (and the side of the road and everything else). Even someone
with a much weaker light, directly behind me, puts me in a shadow that
makes it difficult to make out the texture of the road surface. If
you're in an echelon or a rapidly rotating paceline at night --
situations that are probably irrelevant to elmar and most other
readers on this list -- then worrying about light brightness isn't a
big issue. But when folks are lined up one behind the other, or where
the rotation is long in duration (like you'll find in most groups on
brevets and especially at PBP), then my experience has been that it's
a huge issue.
You can, of course, do what you want -- it's a free country and all
that -- but you should be prepared for other riders to react
negatively to your bright lights, and some of them may not be so
friendly about it. I doubt anyone will want to debate optical physics
with you after they've asked you, hopefully politely, either to dim
your lights or exit the paceline.
The same goes with taillights, which I've found to be a worse problem
in pacelines than excessively bright headlights. No one wants a face-
full of bright light. And there is no purpose to running all that
light in a group. Groups hare highly visible to drivers -- SAG
sometime for a ride that runs at night and see for yourself. If
someone would like to share an anecdote about how a driver ran over a
paceline of randonneurs at night, and how that accident would have
been prevented if only everyone was running three taillights instead
of one, then please share.
Paul (run only enough light for the application and no more) Rozelle
Old5ten
Feb 24, 2011, 2:13:11 PM2/24/11
to Matthew Haigh, ran...@googlegroups.com
On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 9:40 AM, Matthew Haigh <ran...@haigh.org> wrote:
On 24/02/2011 16:55, Old5ten wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 12:29 AM, LittleWheelsandBig
> <davidj...@gmail.com <mailto:davidj...@gmail.com>> wrote:Apples and oranges!
>
> Bollocks Elmar. Your eyes adjust to the ambient (brighter) light and
> with your shadow moving around (as the relative positions of both
> riders move), it can be very difficult to pick up changes in road
> condition.
>
>
> lets take this to an extreme. you've got a car behind you and it's
> illuminating the road around you. you're riding in your own shadow.
> every time i've been in a situation like that (last time would be a
> couple of evenings ago) i've enjoyed the additional light.
yes. i figured that would be the easy default response. as i mentioned, one could argue light patterns ad nauseum.
If there is a single light source directly behind the rider (as you'd
have when riding a paceline), then the rider will block the light
directly in front, and ride their own shadow.
you're neglecting the rider's own light!
a bit of topic, but i haven't experienced any randonneuring events where riders ride single file in a tight pace line at night. in my experience, riding brevets or doubles, any sort of pace line has been somewhat staggered and frequently it's more of a pack situation, rather than a pace line. the only time i've experienced anything truly resembling a pace line at night (yes, the very dark) is on team rides. even then the gap is more than what it would be during daylight.
I do wonder if you have ridden in very dark conditions with a
cyclist behind you who has vastly brighter lights than yours.
hmmmm... i put out 250 lumens on high (which is normally what i use on descents). not sure what lumens it is on medium (which is what i normally use on flats), but there's not a huge difference in terms of perception. low is reserved for climbing and is pretty dim.
in 2007 (well before the light i currently use) there were certainly lights that were brighter than mine and i did not have any problems on pbp or other brevets.
elmar
Red Bacchetta
Feb 24, 2011, 2:40:56 PM2/24/11
to randon
Ok here are my musings. Drafting at night as a whole is a crapshoot
and you are taking risks. When I have been underlit I have found
powerful lights behind me annoying. I know of people that have
accidents with road hazards and animals and broken things because of
light too tightly focused or just plain inadequate. Just the other
night I narrowly missed a rabbit. Why did I miss it? I had a lot of
light on the situation to where I could see things other than in a
narrow 4 foot swath in front of me. I was able to brake because I saw
it enter the roadway on my left. A tightly focused light would not
have let me see it until I was on top of it. If you are going car
speeds you need car level light. I don't believe it is fair for me to
be expected to drop my light level to something that is only safe if
there are no cars passing me or the moon is full. What is acceptable
in the middle of nowhere with no traffic quickly becomes inadequate in
other situations, such as passing cars, or following riders. If
your light washes out when car headlights pass you it is not a light I
am comfortable using at this point in my life. I don't think everyone
should be dropped to the lowest common denominator because of one
person. If you don't like them drafting you, then pull off and join
a group with dim lights.
Due to family commitments I won't be riding PBP for many years, but I
hope you all have a great ride, and encourage you to lighten up (no
pun intended) and enjoy the company of cyclists from the whole
spectrum and not just your narrow definition of what is the "Proper"
Randonneur. Offer friendly advice to those who may not know better,
back off and startup a conversation with the guy you have been
convincing yourself is the devil incarnate because he has been
drafting you too long, maybe you will learn something about them you
didn't know, maybe they will feel more inclined to pull, who can
tell, whatever happens you will now be in a better position to
judge. The object, unless I am quite mistaken is to have fun. If you
hinge your ability to have fun on the actions of other riders you will
likely miss your object. If however you are determined to find the
fun regardless of the actions of those around you, you may find it.
and you are taking risks. When I have been underlit I have found
powerful lights behind me annoying. I know of people that have
accidents with road hazards and animals and broken things because of
light too tightly focused or just plain inadequate. Just the other
night I narrowly missed a rabbit. Why did I miss it? I had a lot of
light on the situation to where I could see things other than in a
narrow 4 foot swath in front of me. I was able to brake because I saw
it enter the roadway on my left. A tightly focused light would not
have let me see it until I was on top of it. If you are going car
speeds you need car level light. I don't believe it is fair for me to
be expected to drop my light level to something that is only safe if
there are no cars passing me or the moon is full. What is acceptable
in the middle of nowhere with no traffic quickly becomes inadequate in
other situations, such as passing cars, or following riders. If
your light washes out when car headlights pass you it is not a light I
am comfortable using at this point in my life. I don't think everyone
should be dropped to the lowest common denominator because of one
person. If you don't like them drafting you, then pull off and join
a group with dim lights.
Due to family commitments I won't be riding PBP for many years, but I
hope you all have a great ride, and encourage you to lighten up (no
pun intended) and enjoy the company of cyclists from the whole
spectrum and not just your narrow definition of what is the "Proper"
Randonneur. Offer friendly advice to those who may not know better,
back off and startup a conversation with the guy you have been
convincing yourself is the devil incarnate because he has been
drafting you too long, maybe you will learn something about them you
didn't know, maybe they will feel more inclined to pull, who can
tell, whatever happens you will now be in a better position to
judge. The object, unless I am quite mistaken is to have fun. If you
hinge your ability to have fun on the actions of other riders you will
likely miss your object. If however you are determined to find the
fun regardless of the actions of those around you, you may find it.
Red Bacchetta
Feb 24, 2011, 2:56:25 PM2/24/11
to randon
One addendum to my post before. I have ridden a lot of solo miles
alone at night. No matter how bright their light is, I would prefer
the company of another to chat with or just enjoy their company.
Although I do enjoy moments alone I am afraid I have plenty of those
and much to spare.
Paul Rozelle
Mar 25, 2014, 10:15:23 PM3/25/14
to ran...@googlegroups.com
Following up on John's recent post, some here may find this blast-from-the-past thread useful.
With PBP again on the horizon, sharpening safe group riding skills is a good idea for all of us.
Paul Rozelle
NormC
Mar 26, 2014, 6:42:39 AM3/26/14
to ran...@googlegroups.com
Less of the clumsy and, in my experience, for whatever that's worth, unfounded nationalistic generalizations, please.
-Norm
On Tuesday, February 22, 2011 6:37:59 AM UTC-8, Paul Rozelle wrote:
7. Pass on the left, if at all possible. Give riders known to be
from countries that drive of the left (the U.K., Japan) additional
time to move right. They’re not used to it; some may move left when
you announce, “a gauche.”
Paul Rozelle
RUSA #2955
Rob
Mar 26, 2014, 7:32:14 AM3/26/14
to NormC, ran...@googlegroups.com
You know western France has arrows all over the
roads telling the English to get back on the right side.
And in London there are warnings for tourist to
look to the right before crossing the street.
It is just a fact of life.
Rob Dayton
----- Original Message -----From: NormCSent: Wednesday, March 26, 2014 6:42 AMSubject: [Randon] Re: PBP: Group Riding for Randonneurs
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j schaller
Mar 26, 2014, 9:59:38 AM3/26/14
to ran...@googlegroups.com, NormC
And here's some philosophical observations of group riding dynamics along with some more "rules" to mull over:
"Cycling isn’t a Hobbesian state of nature, it’s the best example of Kropotkin’s theory: we prosper because we cooperate."
"Learning to ride was an apprenticeship. The goal was to become a member of the peloton, not merely a guy who is sort of fast on a bike."
WMdeR
Mar 26, 2014, 12:55:05 PM3/26/14
to ran...@googlegroups.com
Hi, All,
Back from the dead, three years later. The Spectrum cycles link I posted in 2011 is broken--here's what was there, more or less.
[Executive Summary from TK: Heads up--Ride Smart--Don't be a jerk]
Best Regards,
Will
William M. deRosset
Fort Collins, CO
GROUP RIDING by Tom Kellogg of Spectrum Cycles - www.spectrum-cycles.com
All of us can be better riders. As we learn and improve as riders, we become safer and can
enjoy our riding more and more. As long as I have been riding and racing (32 years) I still
need to be reminded by my betters when I do something stupid and/or dangerous on a
bike. Earlier this season at the Liberty High School Criterium, a rider I respect a great deal
told me that I was riding erratically. My first reaction was to make excuses and become
defensive, but after the race was over I started to think about what he had said to me.
And of course, he was right. I had gotten so used to my ability to make extremely quick
manoeuvres and to shoot through tight holes in the pack, that I did it just because I could,
not because I needed to. Although I am a very good bike handler, and I enjoy out
cornering and outmanoeuvring other folks, I had become enamoured with that ability and
had forgotten that those around me were annoyed and sometimes endangered when I
pulled those stunts. That was the end of that. While I still use those skills, I use them only
when I NEED to, not for the fun of it. Thank you Chuck.
Most of the dangerous riding done in groups is a result of ignorance or a simple lack of
skill, not a result of a rider being a jerk (except in my case). For the purposes of this
article, I want to discuss aspects of group riding that many folks have simply not had the
opportunity to experience or learn. It is not my intention to be a coach (someone who can
improve your skills) and in any case, if you are one of those jerks, I can't help you anyway.
In the Lehigh Valley of Eastern Pennsylvania, we have been blessed with a consistently
high calibre of riders for the last thirty plus years because of our proximity of the
Velodrome. Back in the day ('75-'76) the mentors were Jack Simes, Dave Chauner and Phil
Petrick. Now the list is much longer, ranging from the old men (Marty Nothstein, Paul
Pearson and Jack Simes) to the young Pros like Kyle Wamsley (Navigators) and Alejandro
Borrajo (Rite-Aid). It may seem odd, but a training ride with these folks is often easier than
rides without them. How is it possible with so many world and national champions in the
area, that the big boys make rides easier?
The obvious reason is that these folks usually DON'T ride very hard. They do most of their
miles at a steady, but fairly slow pace. Most of the time they spend on the bike, they
spend just trying to get more time on the bike, not working on their power or speed.
Riding with these guys when they are working on power or speed is really no fun at all.
The more subtle reason that riding with the pros is easier is that they keep things
steadier, tighter and they simply don't abide riders riding erratically. A few years back, I
was on a winter training ride. Kyle Wamsley (Navigators) and Josh Taylor (Rite-Aid) were
on the front riding at a steady pace. As we started a climb, a young rider made an
"attack." Kyle signalled to Josh to keep the same steady pace, rode up to the young rider
and had him back into the group in short order. It was made clear to that rider that there
were times to go hard and times for steady riding. Tearing a ride apart does not
accomplish anything beyond tearing the ride apart. Those who know Kyle know that he
has a way of helping riders without being harsh. He let the young rider know that while his
attack was something he was clearly capable of, at that time of year and early in the ride,
he would be better off just spending "time in the saddle." Lesson learned.
So, what are some of those lessons that can make each of us better, safer and more
capable group riders?
1. The most important thing to keep in mind on a group ride is that you are on a
GROUP ride.
Anything you do as an individual that will make it more difficult or unpleasant for the
group to stay together is counterproductive. If you arrive at the start of a group ride with
the intention of getting in some hill intervals or sprint training, wave goodbye to the
others and meet them at the coffee shop later.
2. A few of the riders in the group are getting dropped on the hills even though
the pace is not hard.
It is to everyone's benefit to wait at the top of the hills. Those who are struggling will get
much more out of the ride since they will keep trying harder instead of noodling home in a
funk. The stronger riders will not only get a rest day, but they will get more time in the
saddle (and a better tan) and they will have gained more respect from others as well.
3. Towards the end of many group rides, things can get frisky.
As long as everyone on the ride knows their way back home and none of the struggling
riders are beginning to bonk, this is the time when the stronger riders can get a bit of
speed work in. On the other hand, if a rider is truly struggling, it is up to the strongest
riders to stay with him, offer him some gel and something to drink. Experienced riders will
recognize bonk before the bonking rider has a clue what is going on. It is the responsibility
of the best riders to make sure that the weakest make it home.
4. Half wheeling
This is one of the most annoying, rude and disruptive things that can happen on a ride.
Half-wheeling occurs when one of the two riders at the front of a double echelon seems to
always be a "half wheel" ahead of his partner. Most chronic half wheelers are not aware of
what they are doing. Half wheeling comes from an unconscious urge to be in front
(testosterone?). The result is that the slower partner is constantly trying to catch up,
which results in further half wheeling surges and increasing speeds. The slower partner is
eventually riding at an uncomfortable or above LT rate where he will blow. Great for the
group! Riding steady in a double echelon does take practice and experience. The easiest
way to think of doing it properly is that the pace is set by the SLOWER of the two riders at
the front. It is up to the stronger rider to slow down, not the slower rider to speed up.
There are times for the strong riders to show their stuff against other riders. It is called
racing.
5. Standing surge
This can be quite dangerous, especially in larger groups. Few inexperienced riders are
aware of standing surge. It occurs any time someone stands up unless they are aware of it
and correct for it. As a rider stands up to climb, accelerate or just to stretch their legs,
their bike will actually move back relative to their body mass. In a tight pack, this results
in the rider's bike suddenly moving back towards the rider behind them by 6 to 12 inches.
The taller the rider, the larger will be the surge. The most dangerous and likely time for
this to happen is at the beginning of a short, steep kicker. Not only is the front rider
throwing his bike back into the rider behind, but the rider behind is most likely running up
on the front rider because of the start of the hill. Wheels overlap and move laterally with
the climbing motion and the recipe for a crash seems to come out of nowhere. When you
think of it, it is quite predictable but most riders aren't aware of what happened even after
they get back up, put their chain back on and dig the gravel out of their elbow. All riders
are responsible for these accidents. The front rider should have increased pedal pressure
as he began to stand up, thus preventing his bike from moving back and the rear rider
should have been looking for the standing surge and reduced pace on the hill as they guy
in front of him stood up. HEADS UP, Y'ALL!
6. Echelon - or rotating pace line.
A rotating pace line is not only a thing of beauty, it is a remarkably efficient way of getting
a group of cyclists down the road faster and with less effort than they could as individuals.
We all know that drafting is anywhere from a few percent to almost 70 percent easier than
taking a pull depending on the circumstances. The amount of drafting advantage is
determined by:
- Wind direction and speed. A strong tail wind makes for less drafting advantage while a
strong head wind gives a larger advantage to a drafter.
- The degree of incline. Downhills offer much more drafting advantage to the point where
a drafting rider may need to brake while the lead rider is pedaling hard. Climbs, especially
steep ones can almost eliminate the advantage of drafting.
- Speed. Similar to wind speed and incline, the faster the pace line's speed, the bigger the
drafting advantage.
7. So, how do we take advantage of these characteristics of wind resistance and
drafting?
Riding a pace line efficiently, safely and comfortably takes a lot of practice. It is not
natural. Ideally, you will learn the tricks from riding with more experienced riders in a
relaxed (read moderate pace) setting. Getting good at it takes a few years. Don't expect
to "get it" on your third try. What should you be looking to master?
8. Feel the pocket
In any drafting situation, there is a space somewhere very close to the rider in front of you
where the air is the least difficult to get through. In conditions with a dead head or tail
wind, that space is directly behind the rider you are drafting. In cross winds that space can
be just slightly to the right or left of that rider or in extreme cross winds it can be up on his
hip. In any case, you will need to learn how to feel for that space … and feel is the word.
The easiest ways to feel for the pocket is with your legs and with your shoulders. Your legs
tell you how much pressure you are putting on the pedals in order to keep up. If you feel
less pressure in your legs and feet as you shift right or left, you are feeling the pocket. You
can also use your shoulders to actually feel the wind pressure on them. If there is more
pressure on your right shoulder than your left, then you need to move to the left a bit.
Using your shoulders is a very accurate way to find the pocket quickly, especially as the
pocket shifts rapidly with changes in the wind or pace line direction. The problem is that
feeling with your shoulders takes a lot more practice. The wind pressure differential is
usually quite subtle. The faster the pace, the easier it is to feel.
9. Pace line patterns
A pace line is composed of a group of riders who travel down the road together in a
regular and consistent rotating fashion. The one or two riders at the front of the pace line
are doing the lion's share of the work for the moment that they are up there while the
other riders are recovering in their draft. The reason that a good pace line works so well is
that at no time does any single rider work hard enough to allow himself to blow before he
has had a chance to recover. A good pace line will be a group of riders who are doing a
consistent set of intervals, making harder efforts at the moment that they are on the front,
followed by a recovery period before they reach the front again. Under most
circumstances, pace lines work best when all riders are doing the same amount of work,
keeping the speed steady and the pulls even. Clockwise or counter clockwise … it depends
on the wind direction.
Traditionally, the default rotation is counter-clockwise, up on the right, back on the left.
However, when the wind is from the right, rotation is clockwise. This gives the riders who
are approaching the front a better draft. Because they will be better recovered, when they
reach the front, the pace line can go at a higher pace. Wind from the left, rotate counterclockwise.
If the wind is from the left and you want your pace line to stay together and
work well, make sure that the front of the Echelon is NOT on the right side of the road. I
know, I know, we do need to ride to the right as best as we can. However, where there is
little or no traffic and there is a good shoulder, the front of the echelon can slip out to the
left when it is safe. This shift will make it MUCH easier for the riders going back on relief to
catch their breath before moving back up the line. As most of you know, when the wind is
from the right, the tail end of a pace line will drift out to the center of the road. When the
wind is from the left, it is just that the other end of the pace line is out towards the middle
of the road. A left shift works beautifully with a double pace line as well. If your group is
not rotating, just riding two abreast, and the wind is from the left, the front two riders
should move out to the left as far as it is safe to give the other riders a chance to get a
draft without riding in the gutter.
10. "Sweepers"
One of the keys to a smooth pace line is that only those who can keep a steady pace
should go through the rotation. OK, this is a bit technical, so try to follow me on this. In a
group, the guys doing the work at the front in a rotating echelon are said to be "rotating
through." If you are strong enough to lend a hand, slip into the rotation at the back as one
side of the echelon begins to move forward. If you are not capable of pulling through
smoothly, or by pulling through you will be blowing yourself up, stay BEHIND the rotation
in its draft but out of the way. Pretending you can pull through will do you no good when
you blow and cause the echelon to fall apart. In any large group, there is someone who
ends up just behind the point where the echelon reverses and starts forward again. They
are called the sweeper. If you find that you are just behind the echelon but you can't pull
through, you still have an important job to do as a sweeper:
- First, you should only sit on the wheel of the rider coming back. Once that rider moves
over to start back up the line, move over again to get onto the wheel of the next rider
coming back. If you stay in line with the riders coming back down the echelon, they will
know what to do when they reach you since they will see the one bike gap that they
need to slip into. If you stay behind the line which is moving back up towards the front,
the riders coming back will not have room to cross over and the smooth rotation will be
broken;
- Second, if you see (or feel) a rider behind you who wants to get into the rotation, stay
in line with the riders coming back so that the "new" rider can slip by and into the
rotation.
- Third, if sweeping is too tough (and it can be) move out of the way so that someone
stronger can come forward and do the job. When the pace is hard, if you find yourself
having significant difficulty pulling through enough to get past the previous rider in
order to pull over, it is time to get behind the sweeper. Instead of simply letting up on
the pedals, creating a gap in front of you for someone else to fill, pull out of the line
and FORWARD one bike length. This will allow whoever is behind you to use your draft
to fill your gap. Then slip back into the shelter of the part of the group which is
suffering like you are. If you can't pull through and contribute, stay behind the rotation.
11. "Steady" and "Tempo"
Back in the day ('76-'79) when we had evening training sessions at the Velodrome, we
learned quickly what those two words meant. If you were at the front of a pace line and
you heard Jack Simes' uttering one of those words, it meant that you were not keeping the
same pace that the pace line had been moving at. "Steady" meant that you were picking
the pace up too quickly (keep it steady) and "Tempo" meant that you were slowing down
(pick up the tempo). Either one causes problems for the pace line. A steady pace helps
keep things together. It works the same way on the road. Surging or inconsistent pace will
shatter a pace line. The trick is NOT to keep the same speed, but to keep the same
EFFORT. Knowing what that effort is as the pace line rolls up and down hills and is
subjected to changes in wind direction and intensity is an acquired art, but there are a few
tricks to learning how to do it. The effort to keep a steady pace increases as you reach the
front, but as long as the grade and wind doesn't change, you just need to keep the same
cadence once you are at the front. Just before you get back to the front, note your
cadence and try to keep it up during your short time at the front. As you pull off, shift
down one gear but keep the same cadence. This will start you back in the line but keep
your legs from loading up. If the wind direction or grade changes, try to feel for the
pressure on the soles of your feet and in your quads as you try to gage the effort. You can
use muscle feel as you would in finding the "pocket" as you try to keep it steady.
12. Long pulls
Don't be a hero unless there is a good reason. Even if you are the strongest rider in the
bunch, it is to everyone's benefit for you to rotate through at a steady pace. You will get
more practice and the others will get a much better workout. The other reason for you to
keep rotating through is that the rider who pulls just before you do will not get your draft
as he rotates back if you stay at the front too long. He will be left out in the wind until he
reaches the back of the rotation. When that happens to me, I get pretty ticked. Don't be a
hero, there are folks who will just resent the pain that it can cause.
13. Rotation rate
The faster the pace, the quicker the rotation. At race speed, your time at the front is
usually just as long as it takes to move beyond the previous rider and move over into the
rearward moving line. During steady easy group rides, your time at the front may
somewhat longer as the rotation will be more casual. When the pace is relaxed, a turn at
the front may even take a number of minutes for the front two riders.
14. Point out obstacles!!
Potholes, rocks, gravel, debris, turtles, whatever. The rider(s) at the front are responsible
for alerting those behind them of anything dangerous ahead. If the object is immobile
(pothole, etc) then a simple finger point towards the ground on the side that the object
will pass will do. If the hole or turtle could cause real damage, something more vocal in
addition to the finger point may be called for. "Hole, Gravel, Horse Shit! etc"
15. Overtaking other riders, runners, strollers, runners with strollers …
The riders behind you may not be aware that the group is overtaking someone. The best
ways to let those behind you know is to either call out "Runner!" (etc.) or slap yourself on
your right butt to get the attention of those behind you and then point out the runner. A
bit of history; the butt slap was and still is used sometimes in Madison racing to alert
those behind you that you are about to ride into an exchange and will shortly be slowing
down from 50kph to about 10kph in about 10 meters. Wake up!
16. Leave room for emergencies
When you are in a pace line, your options for avoiding obstacles or other riders can be
severely limited. For example, if you are on the right side of the echelon next to an eight
inch curb and a pot hole appears right in front of you, you are pretty much screwed. You
may have time to jump the curb if you have the skills, and there are no ladies with walkers
on the sidewalk, but it is unlikely that you will have the time. To a degree, you need to
trust the lead riders (see above), that they will not only alert you of the pot hole, but that
they will swing wide enough to allow you room to miss it. You should be ready with your
own contingency plans though. In the situation noted above, you might leave enough
room between your bike and the curb to allow you to avoid all but the widest pot holes.
This may force the pace line away from the side of the road by another foot or so, but it
will give everyone more room to avoid whatever is near the curb. You always need to do
your best to keep an eye far enough down the road as well. You shouldn't be looking at
the rider right in front of you anyway. Likewise, you need to be aware that while you may
not be in danger of hitting that dead skunk ahead, the rider next to you may be headed
right for it and you need to give him room to avoid it.
17. Don't look at the wheel in front of you - EVER!
You don't need to. As you look ahead, down the road, you will see the rider and wheel in
front of you perfectly well without looking right at them.
Looking at the wheel in front will only make you squirrelly. As you stare at that wheel right
there in front of you, you simply can't keep the same gap between your front wheel and
their rear wheel. It takes such a tiny change in pedal pressure by either him or you to
change the gap that it can't be done outside of track racing. If instead, you look up at
least three or four wheels up the line, your pace will be much more even as you flow, not
with reactions to the guy right in front of you, but with the pace line as a whole.
Also, you will have more difficulty holding the wheel. When the speed ramps up and your
legs start to load up, the last thing you want to do is stare at that wheel which seems to
be getting harder and harder to hold. Again, if you look up the road, holding the wheel
gets easier. Your pace will even out somewhat (see next paragraph) and yes, this one is a
psychological trick as well, but it works.
So, the advantages to this peripheral vision technique are:
- You will actually see where you are going.
- You won't have a tendency to over react to small changes in the momentum of the
riders in font of you.
- You will automatically counteract the accordion effect. As those around you stare at
the wheels in front of them, the accordion effect will begin to set in. As the front rider
slows slightly, there is a delayed reaction by each rider in the line which, because no
one is looking up, grows with each rider back. By the time that slight slowing reaches
the fifth rider, folks are using brakes and touching wheels. Not good. If you are the only
one looking up, you will be the one who anticipates the surges and slowing and you will
be able to save a lot of energy by not having to use your brakes. You will also receive
the silent blessings from those behind you who will have an easier time of it.
Experienced riders will absorb the accordion, coasting before the guy in front of him
slows down and accelerating only as quickly as they need to, to steadily close a gap.
18. Coaching during the ride:
Some group rides are specifically coaching rides, but most aren't. On coaching rides, it is
best to have only one or two coaches. In many cases, coaches need to move up and down
a pace line helping riders during the ride and too many coaches can make things
dangerous or distracting for young or inexperienced riders.
On group rides, you don't set out to coach, but if you are one of the experienced riders in
the group and you see someone doing something that you may be able to help them with,
give them a positive suggestion when it is safe to do so. If someone is making a real
mistake, something dangerous, or even if they could use a bit of gearing advice, don't
hammer on them for being an idiot. The positive approach ALWAYS works better. Explain
how their action could cause an accident or why riding into a head wind at 45 rpm isn't
going to help them improve. This is how the pros in our area do it. They coach gently and
by example.
Ask your elders and those more experienced. If you are having trouble riding in a group,
don't be afraid to ask for help. There is always someone who knows more than you do. By
asking, riders will be much more likely to offer help, to wait at the tops of hills and to give
you a hand when you get a flat. Who knows, they may even buy you a Latte at the end of
the ride. If they don't, offer them one - it works every time.
enjoy our riding more and more. As long as I have been riding and racing (32 years) I still
need to be reminded by my betters when I do something stupid and/or dangerous on a
bike. Earlier this season at the Liberty High School Criterium, a rider I respect a great deal
told me that I was riding erratically. My first reaction was to make excuses and become
defensive, but after the race was over I started to think about what he had said to me.
And of course, he was right. I had gotten so used to my ability to make extremely quick
manoeuvres and to shoot through tight holes in the pack, that I did it just because I could,
not because I needed to. Although I am a very good bike handler, and I enjoy out
cornering and outmanoeuvring other folks, I had become enamoured with that ability and
had forgotten that those around me were annoyed and sometimes endangered when I
pulled those stunts. That was the end of that. While I still use those skills, I use them only
when I NEED to, not for the fun of it. Thank you Chuck.
Most of the dangerous riding done in groups is a result of ignorance or a simple lack of
skill, not a result of a rider being a jerk (except in my case). For the purposes of this
article, I want to discuss aspects of group riding that many folks have simply not had the
opportunity to experience or learn. It is not my intention to be a coach (someone who can
improve your skills) and in any case, if you are one of those jerks, I can't help you anyway.
In the Lehigh Valley of Eastern Pennsylvania, we have been blessed with a consistently
high calibre of riders for the last thirty plus years because of our proximity of the
Velodrome. Back in the day ('75-'76) the mentors were Jack Simes, Dave Chauner and Phil
Petrick. Now the list is much longer, ranging from the old men (Marty Nothstein, Paul
Pearson and Jack Simes) to the young Pros like Kyle Wamsley (Navigators) and Alejandro
Borrajo (Rite-Aid). It may seem odd, but a training ride with these folks is often easier than
rides without them. How is it possible with so many world and national champions in the
area, that the big boys make rides easier?
The obvious reason is that these folks usually DON'T ride very hard. They do most of their
miles at a steady, but fairly slow pace. Most of the time they spend on the bike, they
spend just trying to get more time on the bike, not working on their power or speed.
Riding with these guys when they are working on power or speed is really no fun at all.
The more subtle reason that riding with the pros is easier is that they keep things
steadier, tighter and they simply don't abide riders riding erratically. A few years back, I
was on a winter training ride. Kyle Wamsley (Navigators) and Josh Taylor (Rite-Aid) were
on the front riding at a steady pace. As we started a climb, a young rider made an
"attack." Kyle signalled to Josh to keep the same steady pace, rode up to the young rider
and had him back into the group in short order. It was made clear to that rider that there
were times to go hard and times for steady riding. Tearing a ride apart does not
accomplish anything beyond tearing the ride apart. Those who know Kyle know that he
has a way of helping riders without being harsh. He let the young rider know that while his
attack was something he was clearly capable of, at that time of year and early in the ride,
he would be better off just spending "time in the saddle." Lesson learned.
So, what are some of those lessons that can make each of us better, safer and more
capable group riders?
1. The most important thing to keep in mind on a group ride is that you are on a
GROUP ride.
Anything you do as an individual that will make it more difficult or unpleasant for the
group to stay together is counterproductive. If you arrive at the start of a group ride with
the intention of getting in some hill intervals or sprint training, wave goodbye to the
others and meet them at the coffee shop later.
2. A few of the riders in the group are getting dropped on the hills even though
the pace is not hard.
It is to everyone's benefit to wait at the top of the hills. Those who are struggling will get
much more out of the ride since they will keep trying harder instead of noodling home in a
funk. The stronger riders will not only get a rest day, but they will get more time in the
saddle (and a better tan) and they will have gained more respect from others as well.
3. Towards the end of many group rides, things can get frisky.
As long as everyone on the ride knows their way back home and none of the struggling
riders are beginning to bonk, this is the time when the stronger riders can get a bit of
speed work in. On the other hand, if a rider is truly struggling, it is up to the strongest
riders to stay with him, offer him some gel and something to drink. Experienced riders will
recognize bonk before the bonking rider has a clue what is going on. It is the responsibility
of the best riders to make sure that the weakest make it home.
4. Half wheeling
This is one of the most annoying, rude and disruptive things that can happen on a ride.
Half-wheeling occurs when one of the two riders at the front of a double echelon seems to
always be a "half wheel" ahead of his partner. Most chronic half wheelers are not aware of
what they are doing. Half wheeling comes from an unconscious urge to be in front
(testosterone?). The result is that the slower partner is constantly trying to catch up,
which results in further half wheeling surges and increasing speeds. The slower partner is
eventually riding at an uncomfortable or above LT rate where he will blow. Great for the
group! Riding steady in a double echelon does take practice and experience. The easiest
way to think of doing it properly is that the pace is set by the SLOWER of the two riders at
the front. It is up to the stronger rider to slow down, not the slower rider to speed up.
There are times for the strong riders to show their stuff against other riders. It is called
racing.
5. Standing surge
This can be quite dangerous, especially in larger groups. Few inexperienced riders are
aware of standing surge. It occurs any time someone stands up unless they are aware of it
and correct for it. As a rider stands up to climb, accelerate or just to stretch their legs,
their bike will actually move back relative to their body mass. In a tight pack, this results
in the rider's bike suddenly moving back towards the rider behind them by 6 to 12 inches.
The taller the rider, the larger will be the surge. The most dangerous and likely time for
this to happen is at the beginning of a short, steep kicker. Not only is the front rider
throwing his bike back into the rider behind, but the rider behind is most likely running up
on the front rider because of the start of the hill. Wheels overlap and move laterally with
the climbing motion and the recipe for a crash seems to come out of nowhere. When you
think of it, it is quite predictable but most riders aren't aware of what happened even after
they get back up, put their chain back on and dig the gravel out of their elbow. All riders
are responsible for these accidents. The front rider should have increased pedal pressure
as he began to stand up, thus preventing his bike from moving back and the rear rider
should have been looking for the standing surge and reduced pace on the hill as they guy
in front of him stood up. HEADS UP, Y'ALL!
6. Echelon - or rotating pace line.
A rotating pace line is not only a thing of beauty, it is a remarkably efficient way of getting
a group of cyclists down the road faster and with less effort than they could as individuals.
We all know that drafting is anywhere from a few percent to almost 70 percent easier than
taking a pull depending on the circumstances. The amount of drafting advantage is
determined by:
- Wind direction and speed. A strong tail wind makes for less drafting advantage while a
strong head wind gives a larger advantage to a drafter.
- The degree of incline. Downhills offer much more drafting advantage to the point where
a drafting rider may need to brake while the lead rider is pedaling hard. Climbs, especially
steep ones can almost eliminate the advantage of drafting.
- Speed. Similar to wind speed and incline, the faster the pace line's speed, the bigger the
drafting advantage.
7. So, how do we take advantage of these characteristics of wind resistance and
drafting?
Riding a pace line efficiently, safely and comfortably takes a lot of practice. It is not
natural. Ideally, you will learn the tricks from riding with more experienced riders in a
relaxed (read moderate pace) setting. Getting good at it takes a few years. Don't expect
to "get it" on your third try. What should you be looking to master?
8. Feel the pocket
In any drafting situation, there is a space somewhere very close to the rider in front of you
where the air is the least difficult to get through. In conditions with a dead head or tail
wind, that space is directly behind the rider you are drafting. In cross winds that space can
be just slightly to the right or left of that rider or in extreme cross winds it can be up on his
hip. In any case, you will need to learn how to feel for that space … and feel is the word.
The easiest ways to feel for the pocket is with your legs and with your shoulders. Your legs
tell you how much pressure you are putting on the pedals in order to keep up. If you feel
less pressure in your legs and feet as you shift right or left, you are feeling the pocket. You
can also use your shoulders to actually feel the wind pressure on them. If there is more
pressure on your right shoulder than your left, then you need to move to the left a bit.
Using your shoulders is a very accurate way to find the pocket quickly, especially as the
pocket shifts rapidly with changes in the wind or pace line direction. The problem is that
feeling with your shoulders takes a lot more practice. The wind pressure differential is
usually quite subtle. The faster the pace, the easier it is to feel.
9. Pace line patterns
A pace line is composed of a group of riders who travel down the road together in a
regular and consistent rotating fashion. The one or two riders at the front of the pace line
are doing the lion's share of the work for the moment that they are up there while the
other riders are recovering in their draft. The reason that a good pace line works so well is
that at no time does any single rider work hard enough to allow himself to blow before he
has had a chance to recover. A good pace line will be a group of riders who are doing a
consistent set of intervals, making harder efforts at the moment that they are on the front,
followed by a recovery period before they reach the front again. Under most
circumstances, pace lines work best when all riders are doing the same amount of work,
keeping the speed steady and the pulls even. Clockwise or counter clockwise … it depends
on the wind direction.
Traditionally, the default rotation is counter-clockwise, up on the right, back on the left.
However, when the wind is from the right, rotation is clockwise. This gives the riders who
are approaching the front a better draft. Because they will be better recovered, when they
reach the front, the pace line can go at a higher pace. Wind from the left, rotate counterclockwise.
If the wind is from the left and you want your pace line to stay together and
work well, make sure that the front of the Echelon is NOT on the right side of the road. I
know, I know, we do need to ride to the right as best as we can. However, where there is
little or no traffic and there is a good shoulder, the front of the echelon can slip out to the
left when it is safe. This shift will make it MUCH easier for the riders going back on relief to
catch their breath before moving back up the line. As most of you know, when the wind is
from the right, the tail end of a pace line will drift out to the center of the road. When the
wind is from the left, it is just that the other end of the pace line is out towards the middle
of the road. A left shift works beautifully with a double pace line as well. If your group is
not rotating, just riding two abreast, and the wind is from the left, the front two riders
should move out to the left as far as it is safe to give the other riders a chance to get a
draft without riding in the gutter.
10. "Sweepers"
One of the keys to a smooth pace line is that only those who can keep a steady pace
should go through the rotation. OK, this is a bit technical, so try to follow me on this. In a
group, the guys doing the work at the front in a rotating echelon are said to be "rotating
through." If you are strong enough to lend a hand, slip into the rotation at the back as one
side of the echelon begins to move forward. If you are not capable of pulling through
smoothly, or by pulling through you will be blowing yourself up, stay BEHIND the rotation
in its draft but out of the way. Pretending you can pull through will do you no good when
you blow and cause the echelon to fall apart. In any large group, there is someone who
ends up just behind the point where the echelon reverses and starts forward again. They
are called the sweeper. If you find that you are just behind the echelon but you can't pull
through, you still have an important job to do as a sweeper:
- First, you should only sit on the wheel of the rider coming back. Once that rider moves
over to start back up the line, move over again to get onto the wheel of the next rider
coming back. If you stay in line with the riders coming back down the echelon, they will
know what to do when they reach you since they will see the one bike gap that they
need to slip into. If you stay behind the line which is moving back up towards the front,
the riders coming back will not have room to cross over and the smooth rotation will be
broken;
- Second, if you see (or feel) a rider behind you who wants to get into the rotation, stay
in line with the riders coming back so that the "new" rider can slip by and into the
rotation.
- Third, if sweeping is too tough (and it can be) move out of the way so that someone
stronger can come forward and do the job. When the pace is hard, if you find yourself
having significant difficulty pulling through enough to get past the previous rider in
order to pull over, it is time to get behind the sweeper. Instead of simply letting up on
the pedals, creating a gap in front of you for someone else to fill, pull out of the line
and FORWARD one bike length. This will allow whoever is behind you to use your draft
to fill your gap. Then slip back into the shelter of the part of the group which is
suffering like you are. If you can't pull through and contribute, stay behind the rotation.
11. "Steady" and "Tempo"
Back in the day ('76-'79) when we had evening training sessions at the Velodrome, we
learned quickly what those two words meant. If you were at the front of a pace line and
you heard Jack Simes' uttering one of those words, it meant that you were not keeping the
same pace that the pace line had been moving at. "Steady" meant that you were picking
the pace up too quickly (keep it steady) and "Tempo" meant that you were slowing down
(pick up the tempo). Either one causes problems for the pace line. A steady pace helps
keep things together. It works the same way on the road. Surging or inconsistent pace will
shatter a pace line. The trick is NOT to keep the same speed, but to keep the same
EFFORT. Knowing what that effort is as the pace line rolls up and down hills and is
subjected to changes in wind direction and intensity is an acquired art, but there are a few
tricks to learning how to do it. The effort to keep a steady pace increases as you reach the
front, but as long as the grade and wind doesn't change, you just need to keep the same
cadence once you are at the front. Just before you get back to the front, note your
cadence and try to keep it up during your short time at the front. As you pull off, shift
down one gear but keep the same cadence. This will start you back in the line but keep
your legs from loading up. If the wind direction or grade changes, try to feel for the
pressure on the soles of your feet and in your quads as you try to gage the effort. You can
use muscle feel as you would in finding the "pocket" as you try to keep it steady.
12. Long pulls
Don't be a hero unless there is a good reason. Even if you are the strongest rider in the
bunch, it is to everyone's benefit for you to rotate through at a steady pace. You will get
more practice and the others will get a much better workout. The other reason for you to
keep rotating through is that the rider who pulls just before you do will not get your draft
as he rotates back if you stay at the front too long. He will be left out in the wind until he
reaches the back of the rotation. When that happens to me, I get pretty ticked. Don't be a
hero, there are folks who will just resent the pain that it can cause.
13. Rotation rate
The faster the pace, the quicker the rotation. At race speed, your time at the front is
usually just as long as it takes to move beyond the previous rider and move over into the
rearward moving line. During steady easy group rides, your time at the front may
somewhat longer as the rotation will be more casual. When the pace is relaxed, a turn at
the front may even take a number of minutes for the front two riders.
14. Point out obstacles!!
Potholes, rocks, gravel, debris, turtles, whatever. The rider(s) at the front are responsible
for alerting those behind them of anything dangerous ahead. If the object is immobile
(pothole, etc) then a simple finger point towards the ground on the side that the object
will pass will do. If the hole or turtle could cause real damage, something more vocal in
addition to the finger point may be called for. "Hole, Gravel, Horse Shit! etc"
15. Overtaking other riders, runners, strollers, runners with strollers …
The riders behind you may not be aware that the group is overtaking someone. The best
ways to let those behind you know is to either call out "Runner!" (etc.) or slap yourself on
your right butt to get the attention of those behind you and then point out the runner. A
bit of history; the butt slap was and still is used sometimes in Madison racing to alert
those behind you that you are about to ride into an exchange and will shortly be slowing
down from 50kph to about 10kph in about 10 meters. Wake up!
16. Leave room for emergencies
When you are in a pace line, your options for avoiding obstacles or other riders can be
severely limited. For example, if you are on the right side of the echelon next to an eight
inch curb and a pot hole appears right in front of you, you are pretty much screwed. You
may have time to jump the curb if you have the skills, and there are no ladies with walkers
on the sidewalk, but it is unlikely that you will have the time. To a degree, you need to
trust the lead riders (see above), that they will not only alert you of the pot hole, but that
they will swing wide enough to allow you room to miss it. You should be ready with your
own contingency plans though. In the situation noted above, you might leave enough
room between your bike and the curb to allow you to avoid all but the widest pot holes.
This may force the pace line away from the side of the road by another foot or so, but it
will give everyone more room to avoid whatever is near the curb. You always need to do
your best to keep an eye far enough down the road as well. You shouldn't be looking at
the rider right in front of you anyway. Likewise, you need to be aware that while you may
not be in danger of hitting that dead skunk ahead, the rider next to you may be headed
right for it and you need to give him room to avoid it.
17. Don't look at the wheel in front of you - EVER!
You don't need to. As you look ahead, down the road, you will see the rider and wheel in
front of you perfectly well without looking right at them.
Looking at the wheel in front will only make you squirrelly. As you stare at that wheel right
there in front of you, you simply can't keep the same gap between your front wheel and
their rear wheel. It takes such a tiny change in pedal pressure by either him or you to
change the gap that it can't be done outside of track racing. If instead, you look up at
least three or four wheels up the line, your pace will be much more even as you flow, not
with reactions to the guy right in front of you, but with the pace line as a whole.
Also, you will have more difficulty holding the wheel. When the speed ramps up and your
legs start to load up, the last thing you want to do is stare at that wheel which seems to
be getting harder and harder to hold. Again, if you look up the road, holding the wheel
gets easier. Your pace will even out somewhat (see next paragraph) and yes, this one is a
psychological trick as well, but it works.
So, the advantages to this peripheral vision technique are:
- You will actually see where you are going.
- You won't have a tendency to over react to small changes in the momentum of the
riders in font of you.
- You will automatically counteract the accordion effect. As those around you stare at
the wheels in front of them, the accordion effect will begin to set in. As the front rider
slows slightly, there is a delayed reaction by each rider in the line which, because no
one is looking up, grows with each rider back. By the time that slight slowing reaches
the fifth rider, folks are using brakes and touching wheels. Not good. If you are the only
one looking up, you will be the one who anticipates the surges and slowing and you will
be able to save a lot of energy by not having to use your brakes. You will also receive
the silent blessings from those behind you who will have an easier time of it.
Experienced riders will absorb the accordion, coasting before the guy in front of him
slows down and accelerating only as quickly as they need to, to steadily close a gap.
18. Coaching during the ride:
Some group rides are specifically coaching rides, but most aren't. On coaching rides, it is
best to have only one or two coaches. In many cases, coaches need to move up and down
a pace line helping riders during the ride and too many coaches can make things
dangerous or distracting for young or inexperienced riders.
On group rides, you don't set out to coach, but if you are one of the experienced riders in
the group and you see someone doing something that you may be able to help them with,
give them a positive suggestion when it is safe to do so. If someone is making a real
mistake, something dangerous, or even if they could use a bit of gearing advice, don't
hammer on them for being an idiot. The positive approach ALWAYS works better. Explain
how their action could cause an accident or why riding into a head wind at 45 rpm isn't
going to help them improve. This is how the pros in our area do it. They coach gently and
by example.
Ask your elders and those more experienced. If you are having trouble riding in a group,
don't be afraid to ask for help. There is always someone who knows more than you do. By
asking, riders will be much more likely to offer help, to wait at the tops of hills and to give
you a hand when you get a flat. Who knows, they may even buy you a Latte at the end of
the ride. If they don't, offer them one - it works every time.
Old5ten
Mar 26, 2014, 7:43:07 PM3/26/14
to WMdeR, randon
a worthwhile read, thanks. after last saturday's 80+ rider group ride mayhem, i'll have to bring a copy for the next lite/med. hop ride ;-)
elmar
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